[PEDA] Re[2]: DXP - Crunch time?
Maybe I'd be happier if they just added a check box (or boxes) somewhere which would hide any not yet known stable and debugged code from user sight, (ie Alpha/Beta code). This way I don't accidently stumble into an unstable area, and cause problems for myself. On the other hand, if I want a look at some new Alpha/Beta feature, I can check the box and allow the new functions and features to be enabled, and explore them, proceeding with the appropriate caution. This way, the user knows what is (supposed to be) solid, and what isn't. The menus item should remain but be Grayed out. This would also let people know which features are new, and where to focus the beta testing efforts. This might also help in debugging problems. Having the ability to turn off large sections of the code, a problem will be isolated to a general area more quickly. ---Phil TK Fred, I wasn't defending the practice of people shipping buggy software. TK I was merely pointing out it happens a lot and I don't think it merits TK the talk about ...violates the ethic of... What, are you going to sue TK them? Read the EULA. Read any EULA. The most you'll get is your money TK back for the product, but you'd probably have a hard time with that if TK you've worked with it for years and have successfully churned out TK boards. . Only the PRE-RELEASE software is sold discounted to customers who are made fully aware of known bugs. The price increases as the product improves. The final proven package is sold at market price. Those who bear the burden of early financial exposure plus helping test and develop buggy software benefit by getting the proven package at no additional cost. The ethics issue becomes moot. Altium maintains a cash flow that increases as the product is improved. Those who wait for the final release and buy at market price get a proven package. I think Altium would be motivated and is up to delivering the goods. Win-win-win-win! * Tracking #: 73DD94360F06F840A4AB949B2AC23DAA54F69EC6 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture.
I know you do PCB layout, but do you design software also? Tony, I do PCB in Protel and the competition package. I also do mechanical stuff in Acad and Cadkey, soon adding Solidworks. I spent the last 6 years developing Controllers, touchscreens and customized software interfaces, so I do have some Ideas on what and how the memory is managed in windows. If you look at the file creation dates on many items you will see that they are there for the call. Inevitably a new engine can only do what it's available data and subroutines have to offer. Joe - Original Message - From: Tony Karavidas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Protel EDA Forum' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2002 12:57 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture. I wouldn't disagree with you much, but to add a few other thoughts: Did P98 KLUNK! back in 1998 on Win98? Maybe a service pack to windows, or win2k or winXP changed somehow and caused the KLUNK! to start. The reason I ask that is because I have a simple app I purchased and it was running fine one win98, then on win2k. At some point I tried it on winXP and the minimize button no longer worked! How could a simple, ubiquitous task as minimize stop working?? I have no idea, but I asked the vendor that supports the app and they say they are aware of it and will release a fix at some point. Does the lack of a date mean they aren't sure why it broke? I know you do PCB layout, but do you design software also? -Original Message- From: JaMi Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2002 1:41 AM To: Protel EDA Forum Cc: JaMi Smith Subject: Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture. - Original Message - From: Tony Karavidas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Protel EDA Forum' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 06, 2002 9:14 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture. Jami, Do you have the ability to install P99SE on a different machine? (I can't remember if you've indicated that before). I think your frequent crashes are pretty unusual. Tony, Over the past year, most of my problems have been on either a Dell Model 4100 1GHz Pentium III or once that was upgraded, on a Dell Model 535 2.3Ghz Pentium 4, at work. I then purchased my own license, and now have my own copy of Protel 99 SE SP6 installed on my own IBM Model 6648 NetVista 866 MHz Pentium III at home. I actually just think that the crashes are just a matter of usage, and the reason it has been so high in the past several weeks is that the total usage has been an average of about 12 hours a day, with occasions reaching up to 18 hours straight. When I push Protel, it crashes! When Protel crashes, I scream and yell! I don't think that I am having more crashes than some others out there, I just think that I may have a slightly higher usage, and be much much more vocal and much much less tolerant about the crashes. I really really think that is as simple as that. I think that far far too many people out there have become accustomed to their systems crashing on them from time to time for one reason or another, and actually think nothing of it. Many accept it as the cost of doing business as it were, and in some cases actually blame it on themselves thinking that it was something that they might have done wrong, or that for some reason the hardware or software combination that they have just does not live up to Protel's requirements and expectations. I have heard some people insist that their system is rock solid, and never crashes, and yet these are the very same people who admit that they have occasionally seen hidden processes or phantom copies of Protel still running when they go to shut their system down. This is not normal. This is not how software is supposed to run. Especially when that software is currently costing $8,000.00 a copy. It is not simply a fluke. It is not something that you did wrong. It is not that you have a flaky system. It is simply inexcusable blunders and oversights in programming. It really and truly is that Protel really and truly is flaky software. If nothing else, what we have learned today is that Protel can't even perform the simplest of functions of terminating its own program correctly and returning control and resources to the operating system, without making an error. This is fundamental. This is an obvious blunder. And this problem has been there all of the time. I know that there may be some in this forum who would take issue and try to say that this is not a big problem, and my answer to them is simply that we really do not know how big the problem is since we do not have the source code and can therefore not really understand what is or is not happening, and I don't think that that is really the
Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture.
Jami, I read this and I agree with some of it. Keeping in mind several reasons for the timing of an Immature release, or a late release I understand the sales and marketing side of the argument. As far as the user side It is unacceptable to consume time sorting out the problems in a new tool that is both expensive and allegedly an improvement of something already in place. The real question is where threshold of diminishing short and longterm returns are in each users individual organization. With regard to the klunk issue i recommend just giving the system a shutdown whenever you go to lunch or a meeting or whaever and that may help clear the memory and residuals therein. That is provided you can afford the reboot times with your particular conditions. Joe - Original Message - From: JaMi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: JaMi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2002 2:45 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture. Joe, Please see below, Thanks, JaMi - Original Message - From: Joe Sapienza [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2002 3:38 AM Subject: Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture. Jami, This problem only manifests itself after long usage for you. Then it may be related to the way it uses memory, i refer to it a memory leakage and does occur to some people. The problem was very obvious when the early Windows versions were release. I suspect that whatever the implemented fix was it was manily a bandaid or leak control as we used to call it. Personally I have not seen it as of late and my sessions never run that long, I haven't seen any of this especially in Win2K. Interesting point. I never thought of it as a question of how long a continuous session was, or the duration of time between boot and shutdown. This is scary. I know that in the past I have worked at big corporations where they have brought in job shoppers and worked people double shift and triple shift people on the same workstations (such Cadnetix, Mentor, CBDS, and CADAM) to keep the resources in use 16 or 24 hours a day to shorten the length of large project when things have really gotten into a crunch. If what you say is true, can you imagine what would happen in a design department with say 5 seats of Protel, if they tried to fully utilize their resources in the same manner today? All of my recent problems with 99 SE SP6 within the last year have been on three different platforms, all running Win2K, where I am generally running Protel all day, but the system is shut down every night. Several years ago however, I was running Protel 98 on both Win 95 ORS2 and NT4 SP3, and while using Protel was only a small part of my job there, it did crash on a regular basis. What used to get me there was that when Protel 98 crashed, It would loose all trace of the file. I mean lost, except for original backup which could have been several hours or even days or weeks old (if I remember correctly, it did not make a new backup until you saved the file you were currently working on , so that if you crashed, you lost the current copy). There may have been a way to recover it (similar to those brought up here by Dennis), but I didn't know how. That was where I learned that when it came to Protel, I needed to SAVE often, and also SAVE AS to multiple files every time I saved, which was easy with the old file structure since I just had to double click on each of the two different names I would use for primary and reserve files. Judging on the creation dates of many of the files in DXP I would surmise that the issue could still be there as the files are from the early versions and loaded into the new DXP front end GUI. This is what scares me. This is what I am afraid of. It is not that KLUNK! may or may not be a problem in DXP, since Tony already has said that it is not. My fear is that there are many other problems of a basic nature similar to KLUNK!, that have been programmed into existing modules, that are being incorporated bodily into DXP, Band-Aid and all, waiting to do their thing. I mean programmers as a lot are fairly consistent people. When you are good, you are good on a regular basis. When you are sloppy, you are sloppy on a regular basis. When you screw up, you don't just do it once. When you do a big and obvious KLUNK!, there are usually several more smaller ones hiding in the wings. You may have noticed how I am going out of my way not to mention other Protel problems that have discussed here in the past, and I will not bring them up here except to say that they are consistent with KLUNK!. I mean can you imagine if you cataloged each and every exception error that has occurred with Protel, just how many different ones there would be, and just how many of each you would have, and just how many
Re: [PEDA] DXP - Crunch time?
you said it all Igor -Original Message- From: Fabian Hartery [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Saturday, 7 September 2002 1:51 AM To: 'Protel EDA Forum' Subject: Re: [PEDA] DXP - Crunch time? Dennis, The only thing I could relate to with demolishing a DDB architecture is that there is alot of data management under this regime. Thus, there is associated software complexity and design risk. For the end user, the corruption of a DDB has the potential to destroy an entire project. To counter this complaint, I have personally not had any significant DDB problems. Within DXP, there seems to have been hell of a swerve in the direction of PCAD. Having an Accel/Tango/PCAD origin within this company, I have seen the forces of good and evil do battle. The thing about swerves is that there is often a chance for over recovery. Killing the DDB format and not using it as a 'Save As' feature is one of them. This does present the opportunity for 'a dark horse' to come out of the pack and steal Altium's entire user base. A company just needs to offer adequate import capabilties and service its clients basis. If I were an Altium product line manager, I would seriously consider gathering a small team of programmers together to offer ATS support to those that wish to continue on using 99SE. Call it legacy support, for that matter. Asking for service pack 7 for nothing is asking alot for a very mature product. To put it bluntly, there seems to be alot of pissed off people within this forum and alot of windows are opening up to go elsewhere. Fabian Hartery Research Engineer, B. Eng (Electrical) Guigne International Limited 63 Thorburn Road St. John's, Newfoundland, Canada A1B3M2 tel: 709-738-4070 fax: 709-738-4093 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] website: www.guigne.com This e-mail and any attachments may contain confidential and privileged information and is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, delete this e-mail and destroy any copies from your system; you should not copy the message or disclose its contents to anyone. Any dissemination, distribution or use of this information by a person other than the intended recipient is unauthorized and may be illegal. We cannot accept liability for any damage sustained as a result of software viruses and advise you to carry out your own virus checks before opening any attachment. * Tracking #: 55441536B6429B41AC330E61A9C1CC8AC038F4D9 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Whats wrong with this picture.
doesn't do it to me Igor -Original Message- From: JaMi Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Saturday, 7 September 2002 5:21 AM To: Protel EDA Forum Cc: JaMi Smith Subject: [PEDA] Whats wrong with this picture. OK . . . So I'll admit, I missed the Class on Protel 99 SE Basics . . . And I slept thru most of the Protel 99 SE 101 and 102 Classes . . . But gimmie a break . . . This one has got me baffled . . . So what are the two simplest functions that one can possibly perform in Protel 99 SE? I mean the absolute simplest, most bare bones, easiest things to do in Protel 99 SE. I mean like, are you ready for this one, START Protel 99 SE, and are you ready for this one, END Protel 99 SE. Not too complex here, just simple stuff. OK . . . I can think of 3 ways to START Protel 99 SE (without an open database): 1. Double click the ICON on the Desktop. 2. Place the cursor over the ICON in the Desktop and press ENTER. 3. Navigate the START MENU and go from there. Nothing too complicated, nothing major, and I do not have any problems here, I can handle everything so far. But now comes the problem. I can think of 6 ways to END Protel 99 SE (without an open database): 1. Click on the big X (Close) in the upper right hand corner of the Application. 2. From the File menu pulldown click on Exit. 3. From the Task Manager, select Protel and end it. 4. Shutdown the system. 5. Hit RESET, or turn off the power switch, or simply pull the plug out of the wall (believe it or not I have had to resort to this before when Protel 99 SE locks up). 6. Simply wait for it to CRASH, which it always seems to do all by itself sooner or later. Now I will admit that the last 4 are not normal ways of simply ENDING Protel 99 SE, so we can eliminate them right off the bat, and simply stick with the first 2. No Brainer . . . OK . . . So I simply START Protel 99 SE by any of the above methods, or maybe some that I haven't thought of, and go from there. Now comes the hard part, we have Protel 99 SE up and running, with no database open, in all of its glory, and we want to close it, so what do we do? 1. We hit the big X, and wala!, it closes. Simple enough, I can andle this. No problem here. 2 We go to the File menu pulldown, and click on Exit, and what happens now? Well first of all, it takes much much much much longer to END Protel 99 SE this way, but now comes the real problem, on it's final exit, we get, are you ready for it, a Microsoft KLUNK! sound, you know, the sour note that Microsoft gives off when you commit an error! Not the Happy little Bell that Microsoft uses to get your attention, but the KLUNK! that it uses to say ERROR!, or WRONG ANSWER. or You Blew It!. OK . . . One of the two simplest functions in Protel 99 SE, and it can't even do this without a KLUNK!. It can't even do this without an ERROR! What's wrong with this picture ??? What's wrong with this picture !!! OK . . . So maybe it's me. Does this happen to anyone else? JaMi * Tracking #: AA0194B7D0FB244F9AAF37BDBEBBB3C4F4AE1864 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture.
In my experience Protel versions 3.0, 98 and 99 were flaky. Protel 99SE with SP6 is stable. I aggree with you on SP7. There are things to be corrected. Igor -Original Message- From: JaMi Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Saturday, 7 September 2002 6:41 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Cc: JaMi Smith Subject: Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture. - Original Message - From: Tony Karavidas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Protel EDA Forum' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 06, 2002 9:14 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture. Jami, Do you have the ability to install P99SE on a different machine? (I can't remember if you've indicated that before). I think your frequent crashes are pretty unusual. Tony, Over the past year, most of my problems have been on either a Dell Model 4100 1GHz Pentium III or once that was upgraded, on a Dell Model 535 2.3Ghz Pentium 4, at work. I then purchased my own license, and now have my own copy of Protel 99 SE SP6 installed on my own IBM Model 6648 NetVista 866 MHz Pentium III at home. I actually just think that the crashes are just a matter of usage, and the reason it has been so high in the past several weeks is that the total usage has been an average of about 12 hours a day, with occasions reaching up to 18 hours straight. When I push Protel, it crashes! When Protel crashes, I scream and yell! I don't think that I am having more crashes than some others out there, I just think that I may have a slightly higher usage, and be much much more vocal and much much less tolerant about the crashes. I really really think that is as simple as that. I think that far far too many people out there have become accustomed to their systems crashing on them from time to time for one reason or another, and actually think nothing of it. Many accept it as the cost of doing business as it were, and in some cases actually blame it on themselves thinking that it was something that they might have done wrong, or that for some reason the hardware or software combination that they have just does not live up to Protel's requirements and expectations. I have heard some people insist that their system is rock solid, and never crashes, and yet these are the very same people who admit that they have occasionally seen hidden processes or phantom copies of Protel still running when they go to shut their system down. This is not normal. This is not how software is supposed to run. Especially when that software is currently costing $8,000.00 a copy. It is not simply a fluke. It is not something that you did wrong. It is not that you have a flaky system. It is simply inexcusable blunders and oversights in programming. It really and truly is that Protel really and truly is flaky software. If nothing else, what we have learned today is that Protel can't even perform the simplest of functions of terminating its own program correctly and returning control and resources to the operating system, without making an error. This is fundamental. This is an obvious blunder. And this problem has been there all of the time. I know that there may be some in this forum who would take issue and try to say that this is not a big problem, and my answer to them is simply that we really do not know how big the problem is since we do not have the source code and can therefore not really understand what is or is not happening, and I don't think that that is really the issue here anyway. I think the issue here is that this KLUNK! problem proves beyond any shadow of a doubt that there are in fact some very basic software bugs and problems in Protel 99 SE, and that Protel / Altium has really never looked at the software from a stability and reliability standpoint to see whether or not there really are problems there when people have complained of crashes. Do you realize the magnitude of this blunder! What we have found out here today is something as basic and fundamental as writing your very first hello world! program in C, and having it crash on exiting main. Whether or not it causes other problems is secondary to the fact that it is a programming blunder of monumental proportions, and the jury is not really in on whether or not it causes any other problems. These are the same people who are now trying to sell you another can of worms called DXP. I apologize for my little soap box oratory here, and it is certainly not my intention to offend anyone or start another battle of words, but this is Problem Number One in Introduction to Fundamental Programming 101, on How to Properly Terminate any Program, and Protel / Altium has flunked the course. I believe that this problem needs to be widely publicized, and Protel / Altium needs to be pressured into stepping up to the plate and taking responsibility for the problem, and promising to do something about it, for all current Protel 99 SE users and customers. There are many Protel 99 SE customers out
Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture.
There are many factors in the same equation, but as I see it, they had to come up with something completely new so they could introduce the ATS. That, to me, is the most important factor in all this. They are fighting for revenue, as any other busines does. That they might lose in the end is a law of (business) nature. Igor -Original Message- From: mariusrf [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Sunday, 8 September 2002 4:06 AM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture. - Original Message - From: Tony Karavidas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Protel EDA Forum' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2002 1:07 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] KLUNK! - Whats wrong with this picture. Hi Joe, I looked at the dates because your comment sparked interest. The older dates look to me like development tool DLLs, PLD stuff (the files from 1996), icons, pretty benign and uncontrollable stuff. If you look at the meat of the code, the file are dated 2002. I would disagree with you just because there are so many new problems with DXP. Even some core functions that we were familiar with have changed. I'm just guessing, but maybe the code base of P99SE was getting very difficult to maintain, and they opted for a 'fresh start' in many ways. In this article: http://www.embedded.com/story/OEG20020819S0056 the author states: To achieve the best long-term results, it is often necessary to have the courage to discard bad code and rewrite it. Maybe that is where P99 ended up. Like I said, I'm just guessing. discarding bad code is one thing, changing top level GUI specs is another . They decided to incorporate new features and discard old features based on management perception rather than user feedback. Starting from scratch new code doesn't mean discarding the old menus or feature set . All it needed was some corrections and some additions to be a better EDa tool than 99se or the competition . Then with the brand new enhanced spec software engineers could've written code in any language of their choice and on any platform . Altium should have correlated the feature set with the market segment they're addressing. They should've made an effort to keep the familiar menus regardless of the underlying code whenever possible. IT looks a lot like the not invented here syndrome , new development team is brought in, old people let go, new people badmouth old ones and then change everything including what was good. This was terribly foolish because Altium was somewhere up there on the learning curve in designing EDA tools . 99se was the nth iteration with lots of incremental improvements over previous versions. Giving up their functionality and replacing them with different options/menus/features threw them years back on the evolution scale. They could've rewritten the whole program from scratch but still maintain a top level GUI familiar interface , instead I bet they rewrote the GUI and probably patched the old underlying code. I'm sure it's still that Delphi code BTW . An example of how not to develop software, or what happens to shareholders money when management doesn't have a clue. They are currently reinventing the wheel , unfortunately it's still square or octagonal at best . Matt Tudor , MSEE http://gigahertzelectronics.com p.s. in this day and age the PLD tool makes no sense whatsoever , Xilinx, Actel, Atmel, Altera offer free tools with better funcionality , which have the added advantage that they actually _work_ for a change . * Tracking #: B583A16F9F0D87409C1CC56EB92C8E2B42E82B54 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
All, I have got some messages this morning, stating I am sending spam. They came as answers to messages posted to this forum. If someone is trying to unsubscribe and have difficulties, they better look somewhere else for a solution. Could a group administrator have a look into who this might be? A copy of the message is included below: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 9:08 AM To: Igor Gmitrovic Subject: CEASE THE SPAM If this waste of our resources does not cease immediately, please be advised that we may activate the Revenge(tm) program for this user. Revenge would automatically sign this user up for almost 300 mailing lists to provide a graphic illustration of what it's like to receive unwanted junk e-mail. Igor * Tracking #: B8561439C013FB4F911F22ADC9AD494F2302D7F2 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Whats wrong with this picture.
Igor, It does NOT go KLUNK! when you exit Protel 99 SE from the Exit selection of the File menu pulldown? Is your sound turned on? What type of machine and what OS are you using? Thanks, JaMi - Original Message - From: Igor Gmitrovic [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Whats wrong with this picture. doesn't do it to me Igor * Tracking #: 3A60D0F455E8514DAF671C21E2E5338BC40A5B43 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
Igor and the group, I have been getting the same Cease the Spam messages in response to my posts also, and this has been happening since to me ever since Friday at about 6 PM Pacific Coast Time. It only happens when I post to this forum, and then only after the post is redistributed to the forum. My first inclination is to think that someone has gone on vacation (effective Friday evening) and they have left us a very unique (to say the least) out of office memo. I wonder if this is happening to anyone else? There is always the possibility that it is selective, and I can understand someone singling me out, but others too? If this is happening to yet still others, then we may have to contact the forum manager and have him do a bubble sort on the forum list, since it is unquestionably an fairly immediate automatic reply, which you can tell from the time stamp, which is within a minute of the distribution. If it has to go that far, the list manager can incrementally shutdown half of the forum list and then someone can send a post and see if there is a Cease the Spam reply after the distribution, and based on that, determine which half of the remaining forum list it came from, and repeat the process using that part of the list until there is only one person left. Anyone else seeing this message? JaMi - Original Message - From: Igor Gmitrovic [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 5:45 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam All, I have got some messages this morning, stating I am sending spam. They came as answers to messages posted to this forum. If someone is trying to unsubscribe and have difficulties, they better look somewhere else for a solution. Could a group administrator have a look into who this might be? A copy of the message is included below: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 9:08 AM To: Igor Gmitrovic Subject: CEASE THE SPAM If this waste of our resources does not cease immediately, please be advised that we may activate the Revenge(tm) program for this user. Revenge would automatically sign this user up for almost 300 mailing lists to provide a graphic illustration of what it's like to receive unwanted junk e-mail. Igor * Tracking #: 5DBF4EB25B21054997C5B49C7CDC5A782A83F60D * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
I'm not getting it here. Tom. -Original Message- From: JaMi Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 11:39 To: Protel EDA Forum Cc: JaMi Smith Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam Igor and the group, I have been getting the same Cease the Spam messages in response to my posts also, and this has been happening since to me ever since Friday at about 6 PM Pacific Coast Time. It only happens when I post to this forum, and then only after the post is redistributed to the forum. My first inclination is to think that someone has gone on vacation (effective Friday evening) and they have left us a very unique (to say the least) out of office memo. I wonder if this is happening to anyone else? There is always the possibility that it is selective, and I can understand someone singling me out, but others too? If this is happening to yet still others, then we may have to contact the forum manager and have him do a bubble sort on the forum list, since it is unquestionably an fairly immediate automatic reply, which you can tell from the time stamp, which is within a minute of the distribution. If it has to go that far, the list manager can incrementally shutdown half of the forum list and then someone can send a post and see if there is a Cease the Spam reply after the distribution, and based on that, determine which half of the remaining forum list it came from, and repeat the process using that part of the list until there is only one person left. Anyone else seeing this message? JaMi - Original Message - From: Igor Gmitrovic [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 5:45 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam All, I have got some messages this morning, stating I am sending spam. They came as answers to messages posted to this forum. If someone is trying to unsubscribe and have difficulties, they better look somewhere else for a solution. Could a group administrator have a look into who this might be? A copy of the message is included below: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 9:08 AM To: Igor Gmitrovic Subject: CEASE THE SPAM If this waste of our resources does not cease immediately, please be advised that we may activate the Revenge(tm) program for this user. Revenge would automatically sign this user up for almost 300 mailing lists to provide a graphic illustration of what it's like to receive unwanted junk e-mail. Igor ** ** * Tracking #: 5DBF4EB25B21054997C5B49C7CDC5A782A83F60D * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
[PEDA] off topic supply SOS
Having not placed enough power supply decoupling caps on a beta PCB, I'm looking for a temporary overpriced decoupling solution until the next beta boards are printed. I'm looking for the lowest ESR possible caps. I found this company WIMA. http://www.wima.de/smd2220.htm 1.0uf, 0.1uf, 0.01uf. - 0.07 Ohm thru ~0.15 http://www.wima.de/mks2.htm 10uf. - 0.007 Ohm Before I buy, has anyone seen even lower ESRs? Where? Brian Guralnick [EMAIL PROTECTED] Voice (514) 624-4003 Fax (514) 624-3631 * Tracking #: C6B1582544A9A54E86F065BC0ECCD4523A783153 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
I've been getting them too. Rob - Original Message - From: JaMi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: JaMi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 9:39 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam Igor and the group, I have been getting the same Cease the Spam messages in response to my posts also, and this has been happening since to me ever since Friday at about 6 PM Pacific Coast Time. It only happens when I post to this forum, and then only after the post is redistributed to the forum. My first inclination is to think that someone has gone on vacation (effective Friday evening) and they have left us a very unique (to say the least) out of office memo. I wonder if this is happening to anyone else? There is always the possibility that it is selective, and I can understand someone singling me out, but others too? If this is happening to yet still others, then we may have to contact the forum manager and have him do a bubble sort on the forum list, since it is unquestionably an fairly immediate automatic reply, which you can tell from the time stamp, which is within a minute of the distribution. If it has to go that far, the list manager can incrementally shutdown half of the forum list and then someone can send a post and see if there is a Cease the Spam reply after the distribution, and based on that, determine which half of the remaining forum list it came from, and repeat the process using that part of the list until there is only one person left. Anyone else seeing this message? JaMi - Original Message - From: Igor Gmitrovic [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 5:45 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam All, I have got some messages this morning, stating I am sending spam. They came as answers to messages posted to this forum. If someone is trying to unsubscribe and have difficulties, they better look somewhere else for a solution. Could a group administrator have a look into who this might be? A copy of the message is included below: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 9:08 AM To: Igor Gmitrovic Subject: CEASE THE SPAM If this waste of our resources does not cease immediately, please be advised that we may activate the Revenge(tm) program for this user. Revenge would automatically sign this user up for almost 300 mailing lists to provide a graphic illustration of what it's like to receive unwanted junk e-mail. Igor * Tracking #: 5DBF4EB25B21054997C5B49C7CDC5A782A83F60D * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
Tony, I have checked out the Kollmorgen web site, and it is a defense manufacturer on the east coast, and it looks like they could actually have someone in their MA office that actually uses Protel, and hence is a member of the forum. While even that can be spoofed, I have compared the Message ID numbers and they seem to sequential and pretty reasonable (compared 2 from early Saturday morning and they were only off by a few numbers). It is quite possible that that part of the header is valid. I was planning on calling Altium in San Diego tomorrow to see if I could actually find out whether or not they have any Protel seats, and from there go to one of the three phone numbers listed on their whois contact list, or even directly from the website, and then contact the head of security for the company and let heads roll from there. This is not a pleasent joke, and the mere threat deserves to have someone loose all of their computing privledges for life, and the head of security for any defense manufacturer in the US would probably do just that. It may just be easier on the guy if we just have the forum manager look at the list and see if there is anyone from Kollmorgen on it, and if so, and he can temporarily delete him from the list with a nasty warning, then maybe we can give the guy a break this way. Kind of like giving him a one time only get out of jail free card, rather then letting his company send him there. I actually have saved all of mine, and the related posts and research, just in case. You never know who is gonna play games. JaMi - Original Message - From: Tony Karavidas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Protel EDA Forum' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 6:25 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam Hey I'm getting the same bloody emails. I've had 3 or 4 of them in the past few days. Here is the header as I see it: Return-Path: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Received: from neatmail.neat.com (neat.kollmorgen.com [12.30.32.198]) by addr32.addr.com (8.11.6/8.9.1) with ESMTP id g871Dt532935 for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Fri, 6 Sep 2002 18:13:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from [EMAIL PROTECTED]) Received: by neat.kollmorgen.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id SMBTZ2TW; Fri, 6 Sep 2002 21:13:53 -0400 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: CEASE THE SPAM Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2002 21:13:53 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain X-UIDL: b71!l)*#!?hc!A=H! -Original Message- From: Igor Gmitrovic [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 5:46 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam All, I have got some messages this morning, stating I am sending spam. They came as answers to messages posted to this forum. If someone is trying to unsubscribe and have difficulties, they better look somewhere else for a solution. Could a group administrator have a look into who this might be? A copy of the message is included below: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 9:08 AM To: Igor Gmitrovic Subject: CEASE THE SPAM If this waste of our resources does not cease immediately, please be advised that we may activate the Revenge(tm) program for this user. Revenge would automatically sign this user up for almost 300 mailing lists to provide a graphic illustration of what it's like to receive unwanted junk e-mail. Igor ** ** * Tracking #: B8561439C013FB4F911F22ADC9AD494F2302D7F2 * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
On Sun, 8 Sep 2002 18:25:14 -0700, you wrote: Hey I'm getting the same bloody emails. I've had 3 or 4 of them in the past few days. I got one also. Probably get another one from this post sigh. Here is the header as I see it: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The only postings to this list from that server were from Jackson, Ken [EMAIL PROTECTED] Last post here in April 2001 Cheers, Terry. * Tracking #: CB9A3DE1A180E1448D4E7A81269158212DF4B761 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
Tom, Then that means you must be the spammer! Just kidding, just kidding :: ) JaMi PS. Do you know what this is === ::) It's a smiley wearing his glasses . . . - Original Message - From: Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Protel EDA Forum' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 6:49 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam I'm not getting it here. Tom. * Tracking #: 9A576BEF9246334CB5116EC3B43D10D6287DEC65 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
Somehow I thought this might happen: Received: from neatmail.neat.com (neat.kollmorgen.com [12.30.32.198]) by ntserver.novaris.com.au with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id P4R9QAVG; Mon, 9 Sep 2002 11:51:36 +1000 Received: by neat.kollmorgen.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id SQ0WNWMC; Sun, 8 Sep 2002 21:51:52 -0400 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: CEASE THE SPAM Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2002 21:51:51 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain -Original Message- From: Thomas Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 11:49 To: 'Protel EDA Forum' Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam I'm not getting it here. Tom. -Original Message- From: JaMi Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 11:39 To: Protel EDA Forum Cc: JaMi Smith Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam Igor and the group, I have been getting the same Cease the Spam messages in response to my posts also, and this has been happening since to me ever since Friday at about 6 PM Pacific Coast Time. It only happens when I post to this forum, and then only after the post is redistributed to the forum. My first inclination is to think that someone has gone on vacation (effective Friday evening) and they have left us a very unique (to say the least) out of office memo. I wonder if this is happening to anyone else? There is always the possibility that it is selective, and I can understand someone singling me out, but others too? If this is happening to yet still others, then we may have to contact the forum manager and have him do a bubble sort on the forum list, since it is unquestionably an fairly immediate automatic reply, which you can tell from the time stamp, which is within a minute of the distribution. If it has to go that far, the list manager can incrementally shutdown half of the forum list and then someone can send a post and see if there is a Cease the Spam reply after the distribution, and based on that, determine which half of the remaining forum list it came from, and repeat the process using that part of the list until there is only one person left. Anyone else seeing this message? JaMi - Original Message - From: Igor Gmitrovic [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 5:45 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam All, I have got some messages this morning, stating I am sending spam. They came as answers to messages posted to this forum. If someone is trying to unsubscribe and have difficulties, they better look somewhere else for a solution. Could a group administrator have a look into who this might be? A copy of the message is included below: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 9:08 AM To: Igor Gmitrovic Subject: CEASE THE SPAM If this waste of our resources does not cease immediately, please be advised that we may activate the Revenge(tm) program for this user. Revenge would automatically sign this user up for almost 300 mailing lists to provide a graphic illustration of what it's like to receive unwanted junk e-mail. Igor ** ** * Tracking #: 5DBF4EB25B21054997C5B49C7CDC5A782A83F60D * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] off topic supply SOS
Brian, What are you looking for? Tantalems? Ceramics? What is the frequency you are having problems with? Can you piggy back different values such as a 0.1uF and 100pF ceramic? JaMi - Original Message - From: Brian Guralnick [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 6:45 PM Subject: [PEDA] off topic supply SOS Having not placed enough power supply decoupling caps on a beta PCB, I'm looking for a temporary overpriced decoupling solution until the next beta boards are printed. I'm looking for the lowest ESR possible caps. I found this company WIMA. http://www.wima.de/smd2220.htm 1.0uf, 0.1uf, 0.01uf. - 0.07 Ohm thru ~0.15 http://www.wima.de/mks2.htm 10uf. - 0.007 Ohm Before I buy, has anyone seen even lower ESRs? Where? Brian Guralnick [EMAIL PROTECTED] Voice (514) 624-4003 Fax (514) 624-3631 * Tracking #: C00C1E9A5BECCA42BABBDAA58FD36811E1462A4B * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] off topic supply SOS
Brian, Panasonic also makes an extremely low ESR Cap(radial), I used them in a switching PWR, supply. Usually off shore only availability I was able to get them years ago with a 20 Wk Lead. Pink Body, very distinctive. Joe - Original Message - From: JaMi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: JaMi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 10:10 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] off topic supply SOS Brian, What are you looking for? Tantalems? Ceramics? What is the frequency you are having problems with? Can you piggy back different values such as a 0.1uF and 100pF ceramic? JaMi - Original Message - From: Brian Guralnick [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 6:45 PM Subject: [PEDA] off topic supply SOS Having not placed enough power supply decoupling caps on a beta PCB, I'm looking for a temporary overpriced decoupling solution until the next beta boards are printed. I'm looking for the lowest ESR possible caps. I found this company WIMA. http://www.wima.de/smd2220.htm 1.0uf, 0.1uf, 0.01uf. - 0.07 Ohm thru ~0.15 http://www.wima.de/mks2.htm 10uf. - 0.007 Ohm Before I buy, has anyone seen even lower ESRs? Where? Brian Guralnick [EMAIL PROTECTED] Voice (514) 624-4003 Fax (514) 624-3631 * Tracking #: C00C1E9A5BECCA42BABBDAA58FD36811E1462A4B * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] off topic supply SOS
it's not exactly off topic, the board and the planes play a big role what makes you say you have not placed enough? Dennis Saputelli Brian Guralnick wrote: Having not placed enough power supply decoupling caps on a beta PCB, I'm looking for a temporary overpriced decoupling solution until the next beta boards are printed. I'm looking for the lowest ESR possible caps. I found this company WIMA. http://www.wima.de/smd2220.htm 1.0uf, 0.1uf, 0.01uf. - 0.07 Ohm thru ~0.15 http://www.wima.de/mks2.htm 10uf. - 0.007 Ohm Before I buy, has anyone seen even lower ESRs? Where? Brian Guralnick [EMAIL PROTECTED] Voice (514) 624-4003 Fax (514) 624-3631 * Tracking #: C6B1582544A9A54E86F065BC0ECCD4523A783153 * -- ___ www.integratedcontrolsinc.comIntegrated Controls, Inc. tel: 415-647-04802851 21st Street fax: 415-647-3003San Francisco, CA 94110 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
Bingo! I think you hit the nail on the head Terry! I tried to search my archive here on Friday night, but I only go back to 9/13/01 on this machine here at home, and I came up with a blank (didn't go back far enough). Thanks! I fired off a couple of test messages to that email address just now, just to see if anything happens. GUESS WHAT ! ! ! I've been sitting here just kinda quiet like, for a long time now, waiting, because I didn't want to jump the gun, so to speak, but I think that it is OK to speak now, without putting my foot too far in my mouth. Interesting thing seems to have happened here. The Cease the Spam messages appear to have ceased! That means that whoever it is, is actually monitoring the emails right now this minute, and we have struck a nerve. The last one I got was just after I responded to Igor, which is just about the time that Tony would have posted his post with the header information. I have a sneaking suspicion that there is someone is actually sitting at Kollmorgen right now, which would not be out of line for a defense manufacturer, and among other things, monitoring the email, which can easily be programmed to alert the operator when an access is made to an unaithorized address. In other words, when they programmed the automatic response, they also set a bell (the old cntl-G). They must have seen the header in Tony's email, and freaked, and pulled the plug! Pardon my speculation here, and I know the minute that I send this a whole bunch of Cease the Spam messages will come in and I will have to eat my words . . . OK, anyway, back to the speculation . . . Poor guy at Kollmorgen gets layed off, and the Network Administrator guy deletes his email account, but email keeps comming in, and he gets tired of seeing them, so he sets up a little nasty gram and also sets an alert to sound every time the offending emails come in and a nasty gram goes out, and the alert has been going off, so he has been reading tthe messages, and then all of a sudden he sees the header, and says oh s___! and realizes he's been found out, and he kills the nasty gram generator . . . OK, so now I will send this email and have to eat my words. By the way, if I am even close to right, then I think that that Network Administrator guy better post an apology to this forum, or I really will call the head of security at Kollmorgen tomorrow. Anyway, hopefully we may be back to normal now. I am not sure if I mentioned it before, but since the listserver distributes everything with the return address of the person who submitted the original post, and that is why whoever has been doing this is sending the Cease the Spam message in response to recieving a post from the listserver, and sending it to the from address on the post. JaMi - Original Message - From: Terry Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 7:04 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam On Sun, 8 Sep 2002 18:25:14 -0700, you wrote: Hey I'm getting the same bloody emails. I've had 3 or 4 of them in the past few days. I got one also. Probably get another one from this post sigh. Here is the header as I see it: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The only postings to this list from that server were from Jackson, Ken [EMAIL PROTECTED] Last post here in April 2001 Cheers, Terry. * Tracking #: 9DF368019661234C9BE6777F70C4C85057C7722C * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
well too late as his ass is toast I took my own header reading, forwarded it to one of my best friends who happens to the VP of marketing in one of their divisions close by, I specifically requested he forward the info to MIS. I'm sure by tomorrow noon something will . - Original Message - From: JaMi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: JaMi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 11:26 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam Bingo! I think you hit the nail on the head Terry! I tried to search my archive here on Friday night, but I only go back to 9/13/01 on this machine here at home, and I came up with a blank (didn't go back far enough). Thanks! I fired off a couple of test messages to that email address just now, just to see if anything happens. GUESS WHAT ! ! ! I've been sitting here just kinda quiet like, for a long time now, waiting, because I didn't want to jump the gun, so to speak, but I think that it is OK to speak now, without putting my foot too far in my mouth. Interesting thing seems to have happened here. The Cease the Spam messages appear to have ceased! That means that whoever it is, is actually monitoring the emails right now this minute, and we have struck a nerve. The last one I got was just after I responded to Igor, which is just about the time that Tony would have posted his post with the header information. I have a sneaking suspicion that there is someone is actually sitting at Kollmorgen right now, which would not be out of line for a defense manufacturer, and among other things, monitoring the email, which can easily be programmed to alert the operator when an access is made to an unaithorized address. In other words, when they programmed the automatic response, they also set a bell (the old cntl-G). They must have seen the header in Tony's email, and freaked, and pulled the plug! Pardon my speculation here, and I know the minute that I send this a whole bunch of Cease the Spam messages will come in and I will have to eat my words . . . OK, anyway, back to the speculation . . . Poor guy at Kollmorgen gets layed off, and the Network Administrator guy deletes his email account, but email keeps comming in, and he gets tired of seeing them, so he sets up a little nasty gram and also sets an alert to sound every time the offending emails come in and a nasty gram goes out, and the alert has been going off, so he has been reading tthe messages, and then all of a sudden he sees the header, and says oh s___! and realizes he's been found out, and he kills the nasty gram generator . . . OK, so now I will send this email and have to eat my words. By the way, if I am even close to right, then I think that that Network Administrator guy better post an apology to this forum, or I really will call the head of security at Kollmorgen tomorrow. Anyway, hopefully we may be back to normal now. I am not sure if I mentioned it before, but since the listserver distributes everything with the return address of the person who submitted the original post, and that is why whoever has been doing this is sending the Cease the Spam message in response to recieving a post from the listserver, and sending it to the from address on the post. JaMi - Original Message - From: Terry Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 7:04 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam On Sun, 8 Sep 2002 18:25:14 -0700, you wrote: Hey I'm getting the same bloody emails. I've had 3 or 4 of them in the past few days. I got one also. Probably get another one from this post sigh. Here is the header as I see it: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The only postings to this list from that server were from Jackson, Ken [EMAIL PROTECTED] Last post here in April 2001 Cheers, Terry. * Tracking #: 9DF368019661234C9BE6777F70C4C85057C7722C * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Whats wrong with this picture.
Igor, OK, well it just keeps getting more and more bizarre! But what can you expect with Protel. You are the first person to respond that has said that KLUNK! does not actually go KLUNK! on your machine. I wonder what makes your system different from all of the others that have responded? Is it possible that in your volume control panel you have something muted. Is it possible that under Sounds and Multimedia in the Control Panel you have KLUNK! turned off? Under the Sounds tab in that dialog box, the setting for Critical Stop should be set to something besides (None) to be on. That appears to be the sound that is being executed. I believe that the default is chord, but anything besides (None) will work. Mine is set to chord which is the sound that I call KLUNK!. When I change Critical Stop to something else, say chimes, then KLUNK! changes. Maybe KLUNK! just doesn't KLUNK! in all cases on all machines, although I will admit that I thought that we were heading for a unanimous consensus on this one. Thanks for responding. At least we are building a database of sorts. JaMi PS. Maybe we need to have someone make a Sound Bite that says Ah s___! Protel crashed again! and set it up for the Critical Stop sound. - Original Message - From: Igor Gmitrovic [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 7:22 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Whats wrong with this picture. JaMi, No, it doesn't. The sound is turned on. Dell, PIII, 700, 256, W2K, P99SE SP6. Regards, Igor * Tracking #: B027ED339C331643962B565BFD142DD85CC90D19 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] You can't get there from here (I think)...
Hello Richard, We regularly produce good assembly drawings from Protel. What we do is as follows; We have a sheet border on one of the Mechanical layers, and use this layer for all of the assembly notes, item balloons etc. Company graphics are just lines and arcs, created initially from a .dxf file (in our case from AutoCAD.). We create a print .ppc file using this layer, the board outline and component overlay. We print hardcopy direct from this and use a .pdf distiller to create a .pdf version that everyone else can view on our network. We actually have another mechanical layer with a mirror image version of our company sheet border to allow printing of a right-reading assembly drawing for the other side of the board if required. We use a third mechanical layer to produce the sheet border for the master (fab) drawing. It took a while initially and involved a bit of fine tuning, but once it was all done we made that .ddb essentially a template for any new designs. I hope this is of some help to you. regards, Phil Dutton. Tenix Defence Adelaide, South Australia. -Original Message- From: Richard Stevense [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Saturday, 7 September 2002 8:02 AM To: Protel EDA Users Group Subject: [PEDA] You can't get there from here (I think)... Hello all, I am vainly attempting to create assembly drawings for my current project. I have found two methods for creating these drawings but with unsatisfactory results. Method 1: Within Print Preview export the drawing (Top or Bottom Overlay/Mech 1 on) without Font Substitution and Non-Enhanced WMF. Open a new blank schematic sheet and place WMF graphic. Result: Weird looking part designators. Method 2: Same as Method 1 but use Font Substitution (Verdana looks best in my opinion). Result: Beautiful looking part designators but some designators (not all) are in weird/rotated positions (not in the same places or orientation as original Print Preview document). Anybody out there have a better method or found some way around this? Start of gripe... Also, I find it odd that you can export in Enhanced WMF from Print Preview but you cannot place this file format in a schematic sheet. End of gripe... Thanks in advance, Richard Stevense Calgary, Alberta. * Tracking #: E4A620CE6DF7394E9806222E6D7A0FE51170734C * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Whats wrong with this picture.
Re: [PEDA] Whats wrong with this picture.
Jami, My setting for the Critical Stop shows chord.wav as well. Igor -Original Message- From: JaMi Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 2:16 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Cc: JaMi Smith Subject: Re: [PEDA] Whats wrong with this picture. Igor, OK, well it just keeps getting more and more bizarre! But what can you expect with Protel. You are the first person to respond that has said that KLUNK! does not actually go KLUNK! on your machine. I wonder what makes your system different from all of the others that have responded? Is it possible that in your volume control panel you have something muted. Is it possible that under Sounds and Multimedia in the Control Panel you have KLUNK! turned off? Under the Sounds tab in that dialog box, the setting for Critical Stop should be set to something besides (None) to be on. That appears to be the sound that is being executed. I believe that the default is chord, but anything besides (None) will work. Mine is set to chord which is the sound that I call KLUNK!. When I change Critical Stop to something else, say chimes, then KLUNK! changes. Maybe KLUNK! just doesn't KLUNK! in all cases on all machines, although I will admit that I thought that we were heading for a unanimous consensus on this one. Thanks for responding. At least we are building a database of sorts. JaMi PS. Maybe we need to have someone make a Sound Bite that says Ah s___! Protel crashed again! and set it up for the Critical Stop sound. - Original Message - From: Igor Gmitrovic [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 7:22 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Whats wrong with this picture. JaMi, No, it doesn't. The sound is turned on. Dell, PIII, 700, 256, W2K, P99SE SP6. Regards, Igor * Tracking #: B027ED339C331643962B565BFD142DD85CC90D19 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam
That's called action. The nastygrams are not coming anymore. Igor -Original Message- From: JaMi Smith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Monday, 9 September 2002 1:26 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Cc: JaMi Smith Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam Bingo! I think you hit the nail on the head Terry! I tried to search my archive here on Friday night, but I only go back to 9/13/01 on this machine here at home, and I came up with a blank (didn't go back far enough). Thanks! I fired off a couple of test messages to that email address just now, just to see if anything happens. GUESS WHAT ! ! ! I've been sitting here just kinda quiet like, for a long time now, waiting, because I didn't want to jump the gun, so to speak, but I think that it is OK to speak now, without putting my foot too far in my mouth. Interesting thing seems to have happened here. The Cease the Spam messages appear to have ceased! That means that whoever it is, is actually monitoring the emails right now this minute, and we have struck a nerve. The last one I got was just after I responded to Igor, which is just about the time that Tony would have posted his post with the header information. I have a sneaking suspicion that there is someone is actually sitting at Kollmorgen right now, which would not be out of line for a defense manufacturer, and among other things, monitoring the email, which can easily be programmed to alert the operator when an access is made to an unaithorized address. In other words, when they programmed the automatic response, they also set a bell (the old cntl-G). They must have seen the header in Tony's email, and freaked, and pulled the plug! Pardon my speculation here, and I know the minute that I send this a whole bunch of Cease the Spam messages will come in and I will have to eat my words . . . OK, anyway, back to the speculation . . . Poor guy at Kollmorgen gets layed off, and the Network Administrator guy deletes his email account, but email keeps comming in, and he gets tired of seeing them, so he sets up a little nasty gram and also sets an alert to sound every time the offending emails come in and a nasty gram goes out, and the alert has been going off, so he has been reading tthe messages, and then all of a sudden he sees the header, and says oh s___! and realizes he's been found out, and he kills the nasty gram generator . . . OK, so now I will send this email and have to eat my words. By the way, if I am even close to right, then I think that that Network Administrator guy better post an apology to this forum, or I really will call the head of security at Kollmorgen tomorrow. Anyway, hopefully we may be back to normal now. I am not sure if I mentioned it before, but since the listserver distributes everything with the return address of the person who submitted the original post, and that is why whoever has been doing this is sending the Cease the Spam message in response to recieving a post from the listserver, and sending it to the from address on the post. JaMi - Original Message - From: Terry Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2002 7:04 PM Subject: Re: [PEDA] Cease the spam On Sun, 8 Sep 2002 18:25:14 -0700, you wrote: Hey I'm getting the same bloody emails. I've had 3 or 4 of them in the past few days. I got one also. Probably get another one from this post sigh. Here is the header as I see it: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The only postings to this list from that server were from Jackson, Ken [EMAIL PROTECTED] Last post here in April 2001 Cheers, Terry. * Tracking #: 9DF368019661234C9BE6777F70C4C85057C7722C * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
