Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
If changing drivers fixes it, then it's NOT Protel's problem. Similarly, if changing printer settings fixes it, it's NOT Protel's problem. The problem may only appear in Protel because it might use unusual parameters or unusual series of calls to the printer driver. The application code in a Windows program that does the printing is very similar to the code that drives the display, and is basically independent of which printer (or printer driver) is selected. An application's code (e.g., Protel) will (typically) do the exact same series of calls (to the Window's print interface) whether it's printing to Acrobat, or a PCL printer, or a Postscript printer. It's up to the printer driver to generate the corresponding output (PDF, PCL, or Postscript). -Original Message- From: Jason Morgan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, September 06, 2002 1:22 AM snip Protel say its the printer drivers fault (but no other program produces such wierd output). I gave up a long time ago expecting Protel to fix 99se problems. It seems to happen more prevelenty in PCL6, though i've seen it with PCL5. The solution is to go to printer settings | print quality | Graphics Mode and set to to 'raster' also set halftone to 'Protographic Image'. If this does not work, try a different PCL5 driver for your printer, there is often more than one. * Tracking #: 0EB7116595666145B199E1FA86977D8E347A601D * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
Dwight, I'm sorry, but you are wrong, or at least you are making a huge oversight. You forget that text with an overbar has to be drawn after the text is pasted. Apart from strike-out there is no other feature in a printer driver for aligning a drawn line with a piece of text. The position, width and length of the line has to be calculated based on the font metrics for the current font with the given scale, resolution etc. So, after being given information about capabilities and metrics of the current printer from the driver, Protel is probably simply doing the sums wrong!! Perhaps this is a variable overflow or a miscalculation, who know what? It could be something stupid, like ignoring printers with odd resolutions/dpi or perhaps assuming page sizes. This explains why its only text size based lines that are wrong, others are just printer dpi based and come out right. This would also explain why print preview works. As the font information from the screen is probably correct. Its only variables being resolution and pixels/inch. Changing the settings of the printer driver will change the capabilities metrics and hence the way Protel prints. Its probably the assumption that 'if you can screen preview then print WILL work' that has made this simple error continue to exist. Jason. -Original Message- From: Dwight Harm [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: 06 September 2002 11:15 To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output If changing drivers fixes it, then it's NOT Protel's problem. Similarly, if changing printer settings fixes it, it's NOT Protel's problem. The problem may only appear in Protel because it might use unusual parameters or unusual series of calls to the printer driver. The application code in a Windows program that does the printing is very similar to the code that drives the display, and is basically independent of which printer (or printer driver) is selected. An application's code (e.g., Protel) will (typically) do the exact same series of calls (to the Window's print interface) whether it's printing to Acrobat, or a PCL printer, or a Postscript printer. It's up to the printer driver to generate the corresponding output (PDF, PCL, or Postscript). -Original Message- From: Jason Morgan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, September 06, 2002 1:22 AM snip Protel say its the printer drivers fault (but no other program produces such wierd output). I gave up a long time ago expecting Protel to fix 99se problems. It seems to happen more prevelenty in PCL6, though i've seen it with PCL5. The solution is to go to printer settings | print quality | Graphics Mode and set to to 'raster' also set halftone to 'Protographic Image'. If this does not work, try a different PCL5 driver for your printer, there is often more than one. * Tracking #: 0EB7116595666145B199E1FA86977D8E347A601D * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
Jason, don't jump on Dwight. You seem to forget that whatever Protel passes to the driver works just fine with 'most' printers print drivers. It has problems only with a few. So you are saying that Protel must pass different information to the print driver based upon performing some identification of the printer driver? I don't think so! Think about it. Who is making the huge oversight? I have not experienced these problems with Protel but I sure have with other CAD packages over the years and in every case they disappear with a print driver update, change of drivers (i.e. HPGL, PCL or Postscript) and sometimes they appear right after installing a new print driver. What is the common link between these statements? Others here have already stated that they had the same problem and fixed it with a print driver update, did those print driver updates modify the installed Protel code? Sincerely, Brad Velander. Lead PCB Designer Norsat International Inc. Microwave Products Tel (604) 292-9089 (direct line) Fax (604) 292-9010 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.norsat.com Norsat's Microwave Products Division has now achieved ISO 9001:2000 certification -Original Message- From: Jason Morgan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, September 06, 2002 8:36 AM To: 'Protel EDA Forum' Subject: Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output Dwight, I'm sorry, but you are wrong, or at least you are making a huge oversight. SNIP Jason. * Tracking #: E8090650BFC94F4AA9B9B36D9165E179B1F31090 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
The calculations you mention are typically performed by Windows/driver code -- the app issues Windows API calls such as GetTextExtent, passing a printer device context handle, and gets back the value it needs. (At least that's the way we code apps here!) -Original Message- From: Jason Morgan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, September 06, 2002 8:36 AM The position, width and length of the line has to be calculated based on the font metrics for the current font with the given scale, resolution etc. So, after being given information about capabilities and metrics of the current printer from the driver, Protel is probably simply doing the sums wrong!! * Tracking #: 263432991AA67F418C37A71F7B0C5A65C3A87342 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
These things are so much more complicated than you are depiciting it. With your argument, how do you explain the overbar printing correctly on MY system I even have the same printer (in the same network mode) that someone else on this list has, and they are having printing problems, whereas I'm not. Compute that. ;) -Original Message- From: Jason Morgan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, September 06, 2002 8:36 AM To: 'Protel EDA Forum' Subject: Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output Dwight, I'm sorry, but you are wrong, or at least you are making a huge oversight. You forget that text with an overbar has to be drawn after the text is pasted. Apart from strike-out there is no other feature in a printer driver for aligning a drawn line with a piece of text. The position, width and length of the line has to be calculated based on the font metrics for the current font with the given scale, resolution etc. So, after being given information about capabilities and metrics of the current printer from the driver, Protel is probably simply doing the sums wrong!! Perhaps this is a variable overflow or a miscalculation, who know what? It could be something stupid, like ignoring printers with odd resolutions/dpi or perhaps assuming page sizes. This explains why its only text size based lines that are wrong, others are just printer dpi based and come out right. This would also explain why print preview works. As the font information from the screen is probably correct. Its only variables being resolution and pixels/inch. Changing the settings of the printer driver will change the capabilities metrics and hence the way Protel prints. Its probably the assumption that 'if you can screen preview then print WILL work' that has made this simple error continue to exist. Jason. -Original Message- From: Dwight Harm [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: 06 September 2002 11:15 To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output If changing drivers fixes it, then it's NOT Protel's problem. Similarly, if changing printer settings fixes it, it's NOT Protel's problem. The problem may only appear in Protel because it might use unusual parameters or unusual series of calls to the printer driver. The application code in a Windows program that does the printing is very similar to the code that drives the display, and is basically independent of which printer (or printer driver) is selected. An application's code (e.g., Protel) will (typically) do the exact same series of calls (to the Window's print interface) whether it's printing to Acrobat, or a PCL printer, or a Postscript printer. It's up to the printer driver to generate the corresponding output (PDF, PCL, or Postscript). -Original Message- From: Jason Morgan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, September 06, 2002 1:22 AM snip Protel say its the printer drivers fault (but no other program produces such wierd output). I gave up a long time ago expecting Protel to fix 99se problems. It seems to happen more prevelenty in PCL6, though i've seen it with PCL5. The solution is to go to printer settings | print quality | Graphics Mode and set to to 'raster' also set halftone to 'Protographic Image'. If this does not work, try a different PCL5 driver for your printer, there is often more than one. ** ** * Tracking #: 0EB7116595666145B199E1FA86977D8E347A601D * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
Hi Ray, The long overbars used to be a problem (for me) quite a while ago. I'm not sure when it was fixed, but I'm looking at several examples of 11x17 prints I did with my HP4MV and there are no problems. Possibly the printer driver??? I have my 4MV setup on ethernet, so I have to print to an IP address using HP's oddball driver. I used to have more problems with Win2K and the older jetadmin s/w, but now I'm running XPPro and for some reason the new jetadmin for XP seems to be much smarter. (I'm sure I could have installed the new jetadmin on W2K but I didn't for unknown reasons) There are a zillion parameters to the printer driver. You might want to mess around with them. Font substitution table, output protocol, etc. I don't know if any have an effect on what you're seeing. Tony -Original Message- From: Ray Mitchell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 11:09 AM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output Hello, I'm using Protel 99SE w/SP6 on Windows 2000. Many of my schematic symbols (from the Protel Libraries) have overbars on the low-true signal names. When viewed on my monitor they look fine but when I print the page all of the overbars become several inches long, extending out of the entire symbol itself in many cases. This totally destroys and confuses the look of the printed schematic. I'm using an HP 4MV in landscape mode for all printing. I imagine this must have something to do with a printer font problem, although everything else I print other than Protel schematics comes out fine. Any ideas or specifics on how to remedy this? How about if someone invents something, maybe we should call it WYSIWYG, so that what you see is what you get:-) Thanks, Ray Mitchell [EMAIL PROTECTED] ** ** * Tracking #: BAB253005421794DB82EBAD5B2886258B8073B1B * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
Tony, My printer is configured as a simple Ethernet IP printer. Several users here tried the HP Jet Admin stuff but it never worked properly. I'm not clear on the printer driver business, though. If a printer is networked does each user still need to fool with printer drivers on their individual machines or is the printer driver somehow now attached to the printer itself? Actually, the long overbar problem just started. I'm not sure when, however. I'm beginning to wonder if Win2K SP3 might not have caused the problem, or possibly one of the other multitudinous periodic updates that Microsoft comes up with. Ray At 11:38 AM 9/5/2002 -0700, you wrote: Hi Ray, The long overbars used to be a problem (for me) quite a while ago. I'm not sure when it was fixed, but I'm looking at several examples of 11x17 prints I did with my HP4MV and there are no problems. Possibly the printer driver??? I have my 4MV setup on ethernet, so I have to print to an IP address using HP's oddball driver. I used to have more problems with Win2K and the older jetadmin s/w, but now I'm running XPPro and for some reason the new jetadmin for XP seems to be much smarter. (I'm sure I could have installed the new jetadmin on W2K but I didn't for unknown reasons) There are a zillion parameters to the printer driver. You might want to mess around with them. Font substitution table, output protocol, etc. I don't know if any have an effect on what you're seeing. Tony -Original Message- From: Ray Mitchell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 11:09 AM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output Hello, I'm using Protel 99SE w/SP6 on Windows 2000. Many of my schematic symbols (from the Protel Libraries) have overbars on the low-true signal names. When viewed on my monitor they look fine but when I print the page all of the overbars become several inches long, extending out of the entire symbol itself in many cases. This totally destroys and confuses the look of the printed schematic. I'm using an HP 4MV in landscape mode for all printing. I imagine this must have something to do with a printer font problem, although everything else I print other than Protel schematics comes out fine. Any ideas or specifics on how to remedy this? How about if someone invents something, maybe we should call it WYSIWYG, so that what you see is what you get:-) Thanks, Ray Mitchell [EMAIL PROTECTED] ** ** * Tracking #: BAB253005421794DB82EBAD5B2886258B8073B1B * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
I saw this problem when printing multi-sheet schematics with only one of the sheets open. The problem would disappear if I opened all the sheets associated with the schematic before printing. Madhu I'm using Protel 99SE w/SP6 on Windows 2000. Many of my schematic symbols (from the Protel Libraries) have overbars on the low-true signal names. When viewed on my monitor they look fine but when I print the page all of the overbars become several inches long, extending out of the entire symbol itself in many cases. This totally destroys and confuses the look of the printed schematic. I'm using an HP 4MV in landscape mode for all printing. I imagine this must have something to do with a printer font problem, although everything else I print other than Protel schematics comes out fine. Any ideas or specifics on how to remedy this? How about if someone invents something, maybe we should call it WYSIWYG, so that what you see is what you get:-) * Tracking #: FE1E3D62D152F64E8857395349EF6331AC6BF878 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
I just tried that, and it works ok for me. -Original Message- From: Madhu Annapragada [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 12:22 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output I saw this problem when printing multi-sheet schematics with only one of the sheets open. The problem would disappear if I opened all the sheets associated with the schematic before printing. Madhu I'm using Protel 99SE w/SP6 on Windows 2000. Many of my schematic symbols (from the Protel Libraries) have overbars on the low-true signal names. When viewed on my monitor they look fine but when I print the page all of the overbars become several inches long, extending out of the entire symbol itself in many cases. This totally destroys and confuses the look of the printed schematic. I'm using an HP 4MV in landscape mode for all printing. I imagine this must have something to do with a printer font problem, although everything else I print other than Protel schematics comes out fine. Any ideas or specifics on how to remedy this? How about if someone invents something, maybe we should call it WYSIWYG, so that what you see is what you get:-) ** ** * Tracking #: FE1E3D62D152F64E8857395349EF6331AC6BF878 * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
Ray Mitchell wrote: Tony, My printer is configured as a simple Ethernet IP printer. Several users here tried the HP Jet Admin stuff but it never worked properly. I'm not clear on the printer driver business, though. If a printer is networked does each user still need to fool with printer drivers on their individual machines or is the printer driver somehow now attached to the printer itself? The driver is part of Windows (sort of), and is associated with the icon you can select under control panel/printers. When problems showed up, I often downloaded a printer driver from HP's web site (for HP printers, of course) and installed it. This often fixed odd problems with the Windows default drivers. So, yes, you still need the RIGHT driver on your machine, and a generic Windows HP driver may not get all possible graphical possibilities to print exactly right. Actually, the long overbar problem just started. I'm not sure when, however. I'm beginning to wonder if Win2K SP3 might not have caused the problem, or possibly one of the other multitudinous periodic updates that Microsoft comes up with. Yes, that is possible. You may want to add an additional driver from HP and try it. Jon * Tracking #: B41BF3B030570C4797FC61D3355F2590993FD856 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
Yes, that's how I printed the bad ones. I just tried it again but opened them all first and it worked correctly. Should Protel classify this as a feature and charge more for it, or as a bug and fix it (or maybe just punt)? Thanks to everyone for your help. Ray Mitchell At 12:36 PM 9/5/2002 -0700, you wrote: I just tried that, and it works ok for me. -Original Message- From: Madhu Annapragada [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 12:22 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output I saw this problem when printing multi-sheet schematics with only one of the sheets open. The problem would disappear if I opened all the sheets associated with the schematic before printing. Madhu I'm using Protel 99SE w/SP6 on Windows 2000. Many of my schematic symbols (from the Protel Libraries) have overbars on the low-true signal names. When viewed on my monitor they look fine but when I print the page all of the overbars become several inches long, extending out of the entire symbol itself in many cases. This totally destroys and confuses the look of the printed schematic. I'm using an HP 4MV in landscape mode for all printing. I imagine this must have something to do with a printer font problem, although everything else I print other than Protel schematics comes out fine. Any ideas or specifics on how to remedy this? How about if someone invents something, maybe we should call it WYSIWYG, so that what you see is what you get:-) ** ** * Tracking #: FE1E3D62D152F64E8857395349EF6331AC6BF878 * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output
I believe there are two parts to the driver. The windows part assumes the printer is connected to the parallel port (or another local port) The stuff I HAD to download from HP was the stuff that found the printer on my network, not associated with a server, but as an IP address. Maybe there is a way to talk to it without this piece from HP, but I couldn't figure it out. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Jon Elson Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 2:07 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] Long overbars on printed output Ray Mitchell wrote: Tony, My printer is configured as a simple Ethernet IP printer. Several users here tried the HP Jet Admin stuff but it never worked properly. I'm not clear on the printer driver business, though. If a printer is networked does each user still need to fool with printer drivers on their individual machines or is the printer driver somehow now attached to the printer itself? The driver is part of Windows (sort of), and is associated with the icon you can select under control panel/printers. When problems showed up, I often downloaded a printer driver from HP's web site (for HP printers, of course) and installed it. This often fixed odd problems with the Windows default drivers. So, yes, you still need the RIGHT driver on your machine, and a generic Windows HP driver may not get all possible graphical possibilities to print exactly right. Actually, the long overbar problem just started. I'm not sure when, however. I'm beginning to wonder if Win2K SP3 might not have caused the problem, or possibly one of the other multitudinous periodic updates that Microsoft comes up with. Yes, that is possible. You may want to add an additional driver from HP and try it. Jon ** ** * Tracking #: B41BF3B030570C4797FC61D3355F2590993FD856 * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
