... e então Raul disse: "Mas é que se agora Pra fazer sucesso, pra vender disco de protesto Todo mundo tem que reclamar..." Em resumo: "Talk is cheap show me the code" Linus (que fez um trocinho...)
Instrumentalista? Não teria se confundido com artista? :-p Hasta! Aurium - que gosta de convergir pq isso é "in" na contemporaneidade On 12/22/05, Felipe Lobo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Também são, mas posso opinar menos sobre esses (ou > > quase nada), o que esse pessoal aqui tá precisando é > > conhecer um pouco mais sobre outras formas de > > pensamento, que devem convergir em alguns pontos, > > não > > em todos. E talvez seja importante uma visão menos > > instrumentalista. > > > > Abraços, e vão ler outra coisa além de "man pages" > > (vê > > se não levam isso ao pé da letra). > > > > --- paduamelo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> escreveu: > > > > > Genial e denso mesmo é isso aqui, escrito mais de > > > 150 anos antes de qualquer debate sobre trabalho > > > imaterial, sobre conhecimento como mercadoria, > > sobre > > > ciência como força produtiva (Habermas). sobre > > > capitalismo informacional (e suas contradições > > > insolúveis!)... > > > > > > The exchange of living labour for objectified > > labour > > > – i.e. the positing of social labour in the form > > of > > > the contradiction of capital and wage labour – is > > > the ultimate development of the value-relation and > > > of production resting on value. Its presupposition > > > is – and remains – the mass of direct labour time, > > > the quantity of labour employed, as the > > determinant > > > factor in the production of wealth. But to the > > > degree that large industry develops, the creation > > of > > > real wealth comes to depend less on labour time > > and > > > on the amount of labour employed than on the power > > > of the agencies set in motion during labour time, > > > whose 'powerful effectiveness' is itself in turn > > > out of all proportion to the direct labour time > > > spent on their production, but depends rather on > > the > > > general state of science and on the progress of > > > technology, or the application of this science to > > > production. (The development of this science, > > > especially natural science, and all others with > > the > > > latter, is itself in turn related to the > > development > > > of material production.) Agriculture, e.g., > > becomes > > > merely the application of the science of material > > > metabolism, its regulation for the greatest > > > advantage of the entire body of society. Real > > wealth > > > manifests itself, rather – and large industry > > > reveals this – in the monstrous disproportion > > > between the labour time applied, and its product, > > as > > > well as in the qualitative imbalance between > > labour, > > > reduced to a pure abstraction, and the power of > > the > > > production process it superintends. Labour no > > longer > > > appears so much to be included within the > > production > > > process; rather, the human being comes to relate > > > more as watchman and regulator to the production > > > process itself. (What holds for machinery holds > > > likewise for the combination of human activities > > and > > > the development of human intercourse.) No longer > > > does the worker insert a modified natural thing > > > [Naturgegenstand] as middle link between the > > object > > > [Objekt] and himself; rather, he inserts the > > process > > > of nature, transformed into an industrial process, > > > as a means between himself and inorganic nature, > > > mastering it. He steps to the side of the > > production > > > process instead of being its chief actor. In this > > > transformation, it is neither the direct human > > > labour he himself performs, nor the time during > > > which he works, but rather the appropriation of > > his > > > own general productive power, his understanding of > > > nature and his mastery over it by virtue of his > > > presence as a social body – it is, in a word, the > > > development of the social individual which appears > > > as the great foundation-stone of production and of > > > wealth. The theft of alien labour time, on which > > the > > > present wealth is based, appears a miserable > > > foundation in face of this new one, created by > > > large-scale industry itself. As soon as labour in > > > the direct form has ceased to be the great > > > well-spring of wealth, labour time ceases and must > > > cease to be its measure, and hence exchange value > > > [must cease to be the measure] of use value. The > > > surplus labour of the mass has ceased to be the > > > condition for the development of general wealth, > > > just as the non-labour of the few, for the > > > development of the general powers of the human > > head. > > > With that, production based on exchange value > > breaks > > > down, and the direct, material production process > > is > > > stripped of the form of penury and antithesis. > > The > > > free development of individualities, and hence not > > > the reduction of necessary labour time so as to > > > posit surplus labour, but rather the general > > > reduction of the necessary labour of society to a > > > minimum, which then corresponds to the artistic, > > > scientific etc. development of the individuals in > > > the time set free, and with the means created, for > > > all of them. Capital itself is the moving > > > contradiction, [in] that it presses to reduce > > labour > > > time to a minimum, while it posits labour time, on > > > the other side, as sole measure and source of > > > wealth. Hence it diminishes labour time in the > > > necessary form so as to increase it in the > > > superfluous form; hence posits the superfluous in > > > growing measure as a condition – question of life > > or > > > death – for the necessary. On the one side, then, > > it > > > calls to life all the powers of science and of > > > nature, as of social combination and of social > > > intercourse, in order to make the creation of > > wealth > > > independent (relatively) of the labour time > > employed > > > on it. On the other side, it wants to use labour > > > time as the measuring rod for the giant social > > > forces thereby created, and to confine them within > > > the limits required to maintain the already > > created > > > value as value. Forces of production and social > > > relations – two different sides of the development > > > of the social individual – appear to capital as > > mere > > > means, and are merely means for it to produce on > > its > > > limited foundation. In fact, however, they are the > > > material conditions to blow this foundation > > > sky-high. 'Truly wealthy a nation, when the > > working > > > day is 6 rather than 12 hours. Wealth is not > > command > > > over surplus labour time' (real wealth), 'but > > > rather, disposable time outside that needed in > > > direct production, for every individual and the > > > whole society.' (The Source and Remedy etc. 1821, > > p. > > > 6.) > > > > > > Nature builds no machines, no locomotives, > > railways, > > > electric telegraphs, self-acting mules etc. These > > > are products of human industry; natural material > > > transformed into organs of the human will over > > > nature, or of human participation in nature. They > > > are organs of the human brain, created by the > > human > > > hand; the power of knowledge, objectified. The > > > development of fixed capital indicates to what > > > degree general social knowledge has become a > > direct > > > force of production, and to what degree, hence, > > the > > > conditions of the process of social life itself > > have > > > come under the control of the general intellect > > and > > > been transformed in accordance with it. To what > > > degree the powers of social production have been > > > produced, not only in the form of knowledge, but > > > also as immediate organs of social practice, of > > the > > > real life process. > > > > > > (Karl Marx, Grundrisse der Kritik der Politischen > > > Ökonomie, 1857-1861) > > > > > > > > > > > > > Velho, desculpe mas denso é Heidegger, > > Nietzsche, > > > > Merlau-Ponty, Michel Foucalt. Hélio Oiticia > > > (Artista > > > > Plástico), Drummond, Fernando Pessoa (todos os > > > > heterônimos que conheço), Sartre (em posição > > > > estratégica), Machado de Assis (por último para > > > ficar > > > > ecoando: DE ASSIS, DE ASSIs, DE ASSis, DE > > > ASsis)... Li > > > > a introdução e parte do cap. V e acho ótimas as > > > > conexões, mas não denso. > > > > > > > > Isso é denso: > > > > > > > > O mundo é grande > > > > > > > > O mundo é grande e cabe > > > > nesta janela sobre o mar. > > > > O mar é grande e cabe > > > > na cama e no colchão de amar. > > > > O amor é grande e cabe > > > > no breve espaço de beijar. > > > > > > > > (Carlos Drummond de Andrade in "Amar se Aprende > > > > Amando") > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do Jornal de Poesia > > > > > > > > > http://www.secrel.com.br/jpoesia/drumm3.html#omundo > > > > > > > > Humano cadê você humano... > > > > > > > > Sérgio Amadeu é um cara legal. > > > > > > > > P.S.: ... > > > > > > > > --- Aurélio A. Heckert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > escreveu: > > > > > > > > > Rapaz... > > > > > Isso é ****Denso****!!! > > > > > > > > > > Sergio Amadeu é gênio. > > > > > > > > > > Em 07/12/05, Vicente > > > Aguiar<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > escreveu: > > > > > > Rapaz... > > > > > > > > > > > > Para quem está pesquisando sobre Software > > > Livre ou > > > > > tem interesse no > > > > > > debate, esta tese de Doutotado da USP (de um > > > cara > > > > > que "ninguém" > > > > > > conhece) acobou de sair do forno, vejam: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://twiki.softwarelivre.org/bin/view/TeseSA/WebHome > > > > > > > > > > > > Boa Leitura!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Vicente Aguiar :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > BanSol - Associação de Fomento À Economia > > > > > Solidária. > > > > > > www.bansol.ufba.br [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > Tel: (71) 3263 7369 > > > > > > ================================= > > > > > > Nós usamos Software Livre!!! > > > > > > www.EcoSol.SoftwareLivre.org > > > > > > Sistema Operacional: Debian Gnu/Linux 3.1 > > > > > > http://www.debian.org.br > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > PSL-BA mailing list > > > > > > PSL-BA@listas.im.ufba.br > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://listas.im.ufba.br/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/psl-ba > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -===================================================- > > > > > . . Aurélio A. Heckert [ > > > GNU/Linux ] > > > > > / \ http://www.aurium.cjb.net > > > > > ((__-^^-,-^^-__)) > > > > > `-_---" "---_-´ Web Colaborativa: > > > > > `--|o` ´o|--´ http://www.TWiki.org > > > > > \ ' / Projeto Software Livre - > > > Bahia: > > > > > ): :( > > > http://psl-ba.softwarelivre.org > > > > > (o_o) GNOSIS - Software Livre: > > > > > "-" http://www.gnosislivre.org > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > > > > > GNU/Linux User #312507 > > > http://counter.li.org > > > > > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > > - > > > - - > > > > > ( ( ( http://www.midiaindependente.org ) > > ) > > > ) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -===================================================- > > > > > > > > > > "Se conhecimento é poder, que país governado > > > > > por industriais dará a verdadeira educação? > > > > > Cuidado com o feedback da miséria!" Tet > > Ramon > > > > > "Eu temo pela minha espécie quando penso que > > > > > Deus é justo." Thomas Jefferson > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > PSL-BA mailing list > > > > > PSL-BA@listas.im.ufba.br > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://listas.im.ufba.br/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/psl-ba > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Felipe... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________________ > > > > Yahoo! doce lar. Faça do Yahoo! sua homepage. > > > > http://br.yahoo.com/homepageset.html > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > PSL-BA mailing list > > > > PSL-BA@listas.im.ufba.br > > > > > > > > > > https://listas.im.ufba.br/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/psl-ba > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > PSL-BA mailing list > > > PSL-BA@listas.im.ufba.br > > > > > > https://listas.im.ufba.br/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/psl-ba > > > > > > > > > Felipe... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________________ > > > > Yahoo! doce lar. Faça do Yahoo! sua homepage. > > http://br.yahoo.com/homepageset.html > > > > > > > Felipe... > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________________ > Yahoo! doce lar. Faça do Yahoo! sua homepage. > http://br.yahoo.com/homepageset.html > > _______________________________________________ > PSL-BA mailing list > PSL-BA@listas.im.ufba.br > https://listas.im.ufba.br/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/psl-ba > -- -===================================================- . . Aurélio A. Heckert [ GNU/Linux ] / \ http://www.aurium.cjb.net ((__-^^-,-^^-__)) `-_---" "---_-´ Web Colaborativa: `--|o` ´o|--´ http://www.TWiki.org \ ' / Projeto Software Livre - Bahia: ): :( http://psl-ba.softwarelivre.org (o_o) GNOSIS - Software Livre: "-" http://www.gnosislivre.org ------------------------------------------------- GNU/Linux User #312507 http://counter.li.org - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ( ( ( http://www.midiaindependente.org ) ) ) -===================================================- "Se conhecimento é poder, que país governado por industriais dará a verdadeira educação? Cuidado com o feedback da miséria!" Tet Ramon "Eu temo pela minha espécie quando penso que Deus é justo." Thomas Jefferson
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