Re: Mutation events replacement

2011-07-21 Thread Dave Raggett
On 20/07/11 18:23, Boris Zbarsky wrote: It's pretty common to have situations where lots (10-20) of properties are set in inline style, especially in cases where the inline style is being changed via CSS2Properties from script (think animations and the like, where the objects being animated

Re: Mutation events replacement

2011-07-21 Thread Olli Pettay
On 07/21/2011 01:56 AM, Jonas Sicking wrote: On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 10:30 AM, Olli Pettayolli.pet...@helsinki.fi wrote: On 07/20/2011 06:46 PM, Jonas Sicking wrote: Hence I'm leaning towards using the almost-asynchronous proposal for now. If we end up getting the feedback from people that

Re: [websockets] Getting WebSockets API to Last Call

2011-07-21 Thread Arthur Barstow
Regarding the bugs Adrian identified in the e-mail below, here is my take on the status: * Resolved: NeedsInfo: 9973, 12180, 13104; WontFix: 12816, 13178 * Moved to another component: 10213 * Open and considered Editorial (thus will not block LC): 12510, 13162, 13180 and 13172 (not in Adrian's

Re: Mutation events replacement

2011-07-21 Thread Boris Zbarsky
On 7/21/11 5:08 AM, Dave Raggett wrote: Thanks for the explanation. Apps would need a way to disable notifications during such animation sequences, and would be able to find another means to serialize the animation (at a higher level). I'm not sure I trust apps to do that, which is why I think

Re: Mutation events replacement

2011-07-21 Thread Olli Pettay
On 07/21/2011 06:01 PM, Boris Zbarsky wrote: On 7/21/11 5:08 AM, Dave Raggett wrote: Thanks for the explanation. Apps would need a way to disable notifications during such animation sequences, and would be able to find another means to serialize the animation (at a higher level). I'm not sure

Re: [websockets] Making optional extensions mandatory in the API (was RE: Getting WebSockets API to Last Call)

2011-07-21 Thread Arthur Barstow
Bug 12917 [1] has been discussed in at least bugzilla as well as e-mail including this thread started by Adrian (Hixie's follow-up is [2]) and Adrian's general Web Sockets LC thread [3]. This bug is currently resolved as WontFix and this resolution is supported by at least Hixie and Jonas.

Re: [websockets] Making optional extensions mandatory in the API (was RE: Getting WebSockets API to Last Call)

2011-07-21 Thread Anne van Kesteren
On Thu, 21 Jul 2011 17:26:21 +0200, Arthur Barstow art.bars...@nokia.com wrote: What do others (Anne?, Maciej?, ...) think about this issue? I don't know enough about the WebSocket protocol, but optional web platform features suck. They will become mandatory following the typical dominant

Re: [websockets] Making optional extensions mandatory in the API (was RE: Getting WebSockets API to Last Call)

2011-07-21 Thread Ian Hickson
On Thu, 21 Jul 2011, Arthur Barstow wrote: Given the Protocol is now in LC review, it seems relatively important to align the API and Protocol. The API and the protocal _are_ aligned. The protocol asks for the consumer to provide a list of extensions. Nothing in the protocol requires that

RE: [websockets] Making optional extensions mandatory in the API (was RE: Getting WebSockets API to Last Call)

2011-07-21 Thread Adrian Bateman
On Thursday, July 21, 2011 8:31 AM, Anne van Kesteren wrote: On Thu, 21 Jul 2011 17:26:21 +0200, Arthur Barstow art.bars...@nokia.com wrote: What do others (Anne?, Maciej?, ...) think about this issue? I don't know enough about the WebSocket protocol, but optional web platform features

Re: [websockets] Making optional extensions mandatory in the API (was RE: Getting WebSockets API to Last Call)

2011-07-21 Thread Anne van Kesteren
On Thu, 21 Jul 2011 19:02:31 +0200, Adrian Bateman adria...@microsoft.com wrote: For platform features that directly affect web developers' pages that might sometimes be true. However, compression is also optional in HTTP and it doesn't appear to have caused problems or made some sites work

[Bug 13321] New: This is amazing! Awesome for multiplayer games!

2011-07-21 Thread bugzilla
http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13321 Summary: This is amazing! Awesome for multiplayer games! Product: WebAppsWG Version: unspecified Platform: Other URL: http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/#top

RE: [websockets] Making optional extensions mandatory in the API (was RE: Getting WebSockets API to Last Call)

2011-07-21 Thread Ian Hickson
On Thu, 21 Jul 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote: For platform features that directly affect web developers' pages that might sometimes be true. However, compression is also optional in HTTP and it doesn't appear to have caused problems or made some sites work and others not based on some

[Bug 13322] New: Add UDP! Quake uses UDP, I can't continue development of WebQuake because it uses UDP.

2011-07-21 Thread bugzilla
http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13322 Summary: Add UDP! Quake uses UDP, I can't continue development of WebQuake because it uses UDP. Product: WebAppsWG Version: unspecified Platform: Other URL:

RE: [websockets] Making optional extensions mandatory in the API (was RE: Getting WebSockets API to Last Call)

2011-07-21 Thread Adrian Bateman
On Thursday, July 21, 2011 12:33 PM, Ian Hickson wrote: On Thu, 21 Jul 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote: For platform features that directly affect web developers' pages that might sometimes be true. However, compression is also optional in HTTP and it doesn't appear to have caused problems

Re: Mutation events replacement

2011-07-21 Thread Aryeh Gregor
On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 3:11 PM, Ryosuke Niwa rn...@webkit.org wrote: But internally, a node movement is a removal then an insertion.  There's always possibility that a node gets removed then inserted again after mutation observers are invoked.  Also, what happens if a function removed a bunch

Re: [websockets] Making optional extensions mandatory in the API (was RE: Getting WebSockets API to Last Call)

2011-07-21 Thread イアンフェッティ
Ian, I understand this point of view. That said, there is a lot of disagreement in the IETF WG about deflate-stream. The extension basically breaks all other extensions, framing, etc. It's a bit of a mess and a lot of us want to just yank it out entirely. There was a much better proposal by

Re: Mutation events replacement

2011-07-21 Thread Boris Zbarsky
On 7/21/11 4:15 PM, Aryeh Gregor wrote: I can say that it's very common and critical for editors. I'd really like numbers. Having looked at the Gecko editor code in the past, I don't share your assurance that this is how it works That said, if you point to a workload, I (or anyone

Re: [websockets] Making optional extensions mandatory in the API (was RE: Getting WebSockets API to Last Call)

2011-07-21 Thread Ian Hickson
On Thu, 21 Jul 2011, Ian Fette (�~B��~B��~C��~C~U�~B��~C~C�~C~F�~B�) wrote: I understand this point of view. That said, there is a lot of disagreement in the IETF WG about deflate-stream. The extension basically breaks all other extensions, framing, etc. It's a bit of a mess and a lot of

RE: [websockets] Making optional extensions mandatory in the API (was RE: Getting WebSockets API to Last Call)

2011-07-21 Thread Ian Hickson
On Thu, 21 Jul 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote: On Thursday, July 21, 2011 12:33 PM, Ian Hickson wrote: On Thu, 21 Jul 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote: For platform features that directly affect web developers' pages that might sometimes be true. However, compression is also optional in

Re: Mutation events replacement

2011-07-21 Thread Jonas Sicking
On Thu, Jul 21, 2011 at 8:19 AM, Olli Pettay olli.pet...@helsinki.fi wrote: On 07/21/2011 06:01 PM, Boris Zbarsky wrote: On 7/21/11 5:08 AM, Dave Raggett wrote: Thanks for the explanation. Apps would need a way to disable notifications during such animation sequences, and would be able to

Re: Mutation events replacement

2011-07-21 Thread Adam Klein
On Thu, Jul 21, 2011 at 4:30 PM, Jonas Sicking jo...@sicking.cc wrote: On Thu, Jul 21, 2011 at 8:19 AM, Olli Pettay olli.pet...@helsinki.fi wrote: On 07/21/2011 06:01 PM, Boris Zbarsky wrote: On 7/21/11 5:08 AM, Dave Raggett wrote: Thanks for the explanation. Apps would need a way to disable