Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-28 Thread Armin Rigo
Hi Simon, On Wed, Jun 27, 2007 at 07:07:15PM -0700, Simon Burton wrote: Do you think we could extend rffi to be able to expose function calls to outside callers, so that eg. we can make nifty cpython extension modules ? It would be a simple matter to have a way to force genc to use specific

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-27 Thread Armin Rigo
Hi Richard, On Mon, Jun 25, 2007 at 01:01:35PM -0700, Richard Emslie wrote: Just a sidenote - rffi supports (and uses) macros. Not sure how this will look like in a ctypes-based solution. if you are talking c macros - this could be very problematic for the llvm backend. Anton (which I

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-27 Thread Simon Burton
Do you think we could extend rffi to be able to expose function calls to outside callers, so that eg. we can make nifty cpython extension modules ? (i think this is number 3 in my list) Simon. On Sat, 16 Jun 2007 13:03:16 +0200 Maciek Fijalkowski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Simon Burton wrote:

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-25 Thread Richard Emslie
On Jun 16, 2007, at 1:37 PM, Maciek Fijalkowski wrote: snip Just a sidenote - rffi supports (and uses) macros. Not sure how this will look like in a ctypes-based solution. if you are talking c macros - this could be very problematic for the llvm backend. cheers - Richard

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-20 Thread Martijn Faassen
Hey, On 6/20/07, Armin Rigo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [my questions] That's a very good list of questions. Indeed, we don't have clear answers for them yet, but just vague thoughts. I think it's fair to say that we'll discuss this at EuroPython and make some commitments then; for now we're

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-19 Thread Alexandre Fayolle
On Fri, Jun 15, 2007 at 01:16:06PM +0200, Alexander Kellett wrote: On 15 Jun 2007, at 13:04, Martijn Faassen wrote: You could tell me that I'd be more productive if I contributed to the JIT generator, but then I'd go away again and you'd lose a potential contributor. If I can speed up my

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-18 Thread Martijn Faassen
Hey, Christian Tismer wrote: Whatever way we choose, I think it would be best for PyPy if we try to be as user-friendly as possible, saying like we believe we must change this and that immediately, but we will not leave you in the rain, but actively help porting your stuff. This also

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-16 Thread Maciek Fijalkowski
Armin Rigo wrote: Hi Simon, (This is also a follow-up on concerns raised by Christian on #pypy today) On Fri, Jun 15, 2007 at 05:44:54PM -0700, Simon Burton wrote: I hope we can do all this with rffi, but there are two really cool things about rctypes: 1) it runs on cpython (our main

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-16 Thread Christian Tismer
Hi Armin, On 16.06.2007, at 19:10, Armin Rigo wrote: Hi Simon, (This is also a follow-up on concerns raised by Christian on #pypy today) Well, reacting a bit to it, here... The reason why this stuff kept me busy thinking since the meeting was the fact that we are about to trash exactly the

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-15 Thread Maciek Fijalkowski
I would be very, very careful about what people talk about. Even if they talk about RPython and speed, they really don't know what they're talking about. There are some reasons why they use python and not ocaml or haskell for their purposes. One of the reasons is that it's easy to write

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-15 Thread holger krekel
On Fri, Jun 15, 2007 at 11:11 +0200, Maciek Fijalkowski wrote: I would be very, very careful about what people talk about. quick question: your mail appears in my Mutt as a reply to my previous mail (Hi Anto, all) but your mail is not meant as relating to it specifically, right? holger

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-15 Thread Maciek Fijalkowski
holger krekel wrote: On Fri, Jun 15, 2007 at 11:11 +0200, Maciek Fijalkowski wrote: I would be very, very careful about what people talk about. quick question: your mail appears in my Mutt as a reply to my previous mail (Hi Anto, all) but your mail is not meant as relating to it

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-15 Thread Alexander Kellett
On 15 Jun 2007, at 13:04, Martijn Faassen wrote: You could tell me that I'd be more productive if I contributed to the JIT generator, but then I'd go away again and you'd lose a potential contributor. If I can speed up my templating language using RPython I might stick around. I realize that I

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-15 Thread Martijn Faassen
Maciek Fijalkowski wrote: I would be very, very careful about what people talk about. Even if they talk about RPython and speed, they really don't know what they're talking about. I understand that you need to be careful about not overselling RPython. I would also suggest you be careful

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-15 Thread Simon Burton
On Thu, 14 Jun 2007 18:45:54 +0200 Armin Rigo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Any comments or objections? Are there people that already make heavy use of rctypes, or the extension compiler? Indeed. Mainly rctypes. As well as an ever expanding use of libc, we recently have interfaced to libSDL

[pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-14 Thread Armin Rigo
Hi all, Here is a summary of what we discussed today on #pypy-sync. We tried to list the tasks that now lie ahead of us. There are a number of relatively independent tasks, but there is also a knot of dependent tasks that we'll have to untie bit by bit. RCtypes and the extension compiler are

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-14 Thread Maciek Fijalkowski
Armin Rigo wrote: * In RPython, fijal worked on a more basic replacement for rctypes, called rtti (almost finished already). It's a PyPy-specific interface to call external functions in RPython. Calls written in this interface can be compiled to good C code, but testing is a bit less

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-14 Thread Antonio Cuni
Maciek Fijalkowski wrote: * What we do with ootypesystem backends and external functions? Right now this is implemented by backends which tends to be a bit ugly implementation. My idea would be to have backend-sensitive implementations which access backend-specific RPython functions for

Re: [pypy-dev] Work plan for PyPy

2007-06-14 Thread Laura Creighton
In a message of Fri, 15 Jun 2007 01:01:17 +0200, Antonio Cuni writes: snip Finally, a note which is not related with the work plan but to a question that appeared in the logs; someone asked whether we want to sell RPython as a stand-alone product. Last sunday I gave a PyPy talk at Pycon italy