[issue17609] IDLE: Remove config option 'editor on startup' and utilize command line options only

[Todd Rovito]

Changes by Todd Rovito :


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resolution:  -> rejected
status: open -> closed

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[issue17609] IDLE: Remove config option 'editor on startup' and utilize command line options only

[Roger Serwy]

Roger Serwy added the comment:

Todd, thank you for opening this issue. Given the feedback, it looks like we 
should keep the configuration. Feel free to close the issue.

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[issue17609] IDLE: Remove config option 'editor on startup' and utilize command line options only

[Todd Rovito]

Todd Rovito added the comment:

Thanks for the feedback I am good with closing but want to check with Roger 
because he suggested that we open a new issue to discuss.

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[issue17609] IDLE: Remove config option 'editor on startup' and utilize command line options only

[Sean Wolfe]

Sean Wolfe added the comment:

fwiw, I like the configuration option. I tend to set idle to editor only, but 
the configuration option is useful to me.

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nosy: +seanfelipewolfe

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[issue17609] IDLE: Remove config option 'editor on startup' and utilize command line options only

[Terry J. Reedy]

Terry J. Reedy added the comment:

A corollary of what I said is that if something is a bad idea for 3.3, it is 
probably a bad idea for 3.4.

On idle-dev thread "Feedback requested on issue 17609: ...", Bruce Sherwood 
says "For the thousands of students in our intro physics curriculum who use 
VIDLE (which I hope eventually can be replaced by using an updated IDLE), it is 
extremely important that starting IDLE (by clicking on an icon) display only an 
edit window at startup".

Idle is both a shell with editor and an editor with shell. The latter is a 
legitimate use case and I do not think we should remove the feature of making 
it a configuration option. So I think this issue should be closed as rejected 
(and see below).

On Windows, I believe one could accomplish Bruce's purpose with a customized 
Window's shortcut. Even is something similar is true on *nix and Mac, the 
details would probably be different on both. Learning all three systems is too 
much to expect of anyone.

I am sympathetic with the idea of making option processing easier (but not as 
the cost of making things harder for users). I believe using the newer argparse 
instead of the ancient getopt in PyShell.main might do that. It seems to me 
that the flow should be dict of builtin default updated by user configuration 
file updated by command line or function args. 'Function' refers to a possible 
new idlelib.idle.main for starting Idle from Python by passing options directly 
as arguments rather than by manipulating sys.argv.

I do not see 'remove a config option' as a goal.

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[issue17609] IDLE: Remove config option 'editor on startup' and utilize command line options only

[Terry J. Reedy]

Terry J. Reedy added the comment:

I think whatever we do should be done on all versions. This is not a 'major 
rewrite'.

As I remember, installing Python on Windows adds 'edit with IDLE' to the 
right-click context menu. I cannot check at the moment because my substitute 
machine only has repository builds. I do not know what happens with multiple 
installs. Perhaps there should be 'Edit with Idle x.y' for each. 'Run with 
Idle' might be nice,

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[issue17609] IDLE: Remove config option 'editor on startup' and utilize command line options only

[Guilherme Simões]

Guilherme Simões added the comment:

IDLE is widely used by students and should have its most relevant settings 
available in the GUI also.

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nosy: +Guilherme.Simões

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[issue17609] IDLE: Remove config option 'editor on startup' and utilize command line options only

[Ronald Oussoren]

Ronald Oussoren added the comment:

I agree with the change, but keep in mind that at least on OSX a lot of users 
start IDLE by double clicking on the IDLE application in the Finder (or 
double-clicking a .py file) and as such don't have an easy way to specify the 
-e or -i options.

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nosy: +ronaldoussoren

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[issue17609] IDLE: Remove config option 'editor on startup' and utilize command line options only

[Todd Rovito]

New submission from Todd Rovito:

Based on enhancements from this issue:
http://bugs.python.org/issue6698

Comments from Tal Einat

The "editor-on-startup" config option should be removed. Running IDLE without 
arguments should open a shell. If IDLE is asked to open any files for editing, 
it should open just editor windows. IDLE should open both a shell window and 
one or more editor windows only when explicitly asked to do so on the command 
line.

If this is done, the -e option ("open an editor") would tell IDLE to open an 
empty editor window if no files are asked to be opened for editing. If no other 
arguments are given, IDLE will open just an editor window (no shell window). 
The -i option ("open a shell") would tell IDLE to open a shell window even if 
asked to open files for editing.

I think this is more obvious and easier to work with. It will also make the 
command line argument processing code simpler. And as a bonus we remove a 
config option :)

I will also post on idle-dev for discussion as Terry Reedy requested.

--
components: IDLE
messages: 185731
nosy: Todd.Rovito, roger.serwy, taleinat, terry.reedy
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title: IDLE: Remove config option 'editor on startup' and utilize command line 
options only
type: enhancement
versions: Python 3.4

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