Re: [Python-Dev] Possible language summit topic: buildbots

2009-10-27 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Martin v. Löwis martin at v.loewis.de writes: It's not really reproducible. I think it sometimes happens when I restart the master; sometimes, some clients fail to reconnect (properly). Another common problem is that some buildbot fails in the middle of the test suite, with the following

Re: [Python-Dev] Possible language summit topic: buildbots

2009-10-27 Thread Zooko O'Whielacronx
Right, how do developers benefit from a buildbot? From my experience (five large buildbots with many developers plus two with only a couple of developers), a buildbot does little good unless the tests are reliable and not too noisy. Reliable is best achieved by having tests be deterministic and

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set without removing it

2009-10-27 Thread Georg Brandl
Chris Bergstresser schrieb: I like the proposed set.get() method, personally. list.get(index) gets the item at that index, dict.get(key) gets the item associated with that key, set.get() gets an item, but doesn't place any guarantees on which item is returned. Sorry to nitpick, but there

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set without removing it

2009-10-27 Thread Chris Bergstresser
On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 11:06 AM, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: Sorry to nitpick, but there is no list.get(). No? How ... odd. I guess it wouldn't have come up, but I was sure there was a .get method which took an optional default parameter if the index didn't exist, mirroring the

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set without removing it

2009-10-27 Thread Georg Brandl
Chris Bergstresser schrieb: On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 11:06 AM, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: Sorry to nitpick, but there is no list.get(). No? How ... odd. I guess it wouldn't have come up, but I was sure there was a .get method which took an optional default parameter if the

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread Raymond Hettinger
[Chris Bergstresser] Still, I think my point stands--it's a clear extrapolation from the existing dict.get(). Not really. One looks-up a key and supplies a default value if not found. The other, set.get(), doesn't have a key to lookup. A dict.get() can be meaningfully used in a loop

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set without removing it

2009-10-27 Thread Alexander Belopolsky
On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 1:33 PM, Chris Bergstresser ch...@subtlety.com wrote: On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 11:06 AM, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: Sorry to nitpick, but there is no list.get().   No?  How ... odd. Odd indeed. My first reaction was: it is not needed because lists support

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Raymond Hettinger python at rcn.com writes: [Chris Bergstresser] Still, I think my point stands--it's a clear extrapolation from the existing dict.get(). Not really. One looks-up a key and supplies a default value if not found. The other, set.get(), doesn't have a key to lookup.

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread geremy condra
On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 1:59 PM, Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net wrote: Raymond Hettinger python at rcn.com writes: [Chris Bergstresser]   Still, I think my point stands--it's a clear extrapolation from the existing dict.get(). Not really.  One looks-up a key and supplies a default

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread Oleg Broytman
On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 02:20:04PM -0400, geremy condra wrote: On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 1:59 PM, Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net wrote: Raymond Hettinger python at rcn.com writes: set.getone() then ? ugh- other spellings much preferred. set[] ? (Just kidding, really.) Oleg. --

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread Terry Reedy
Raymond Hettinger wrote: A dict.get() can be meaningfully used in a loop (because the key can vary). A set.get() returns the same value over and over again (because there is no key). There are two ideas of set.get floating about: 1) get an arbitrary object 2) get the object in the set with

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread Chris Bergstresser
On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 12:47 PM, Raymond Hettinger pyt...@rcn.com wrote: [Chris Bergstresser]  Still, I think my point stands--it's a clear extrapolation from the existing dict.get(). Not really.  One looks-up a key and supplies a default value if not found. The other, set.get(), doesn't

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread sstein...@gmail.com
On Oct 27, 2009, at 2:50 PM, Terry Reedy wrote more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more: This topic needs its own flippin' newsgroup. S ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org

Re: [Python-Dev] RELEASED Python 2.6.4

2009-10-27 Thread Tres Seaver
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Barry Warsaw wrote: On behalf of the Python community, I'm happy to announce the availability of Python 2.6.4. This is the latest production-ready version in the Python 2.6 series. We had a little trouble with the Python 2.6.3 release; a

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread Jesse Noller
On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 3:06 PM, sstein...@gmail.com sstein...@gmail.com wrote: On Oct 27, 2009, at 2:50 PM, Terry Reedy wrote more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more: This topic needs its own flippin' newsgroup. S Don't like it? Mute the conversation

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread Guido van Rossum
On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 11:50 AM, Terry Reedy tjre...@udel.edu wrote: There are two ideas of set.get floating about: 1) get an arbitrary object 2) get the object in the set with the same 'value'(hash+eq) as an input arg (the intern case). In this case, there is a 'key', even if it is somewhat

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread geremy condra
On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 3:13 PM, Guido van Rossum gu...@python.org wrote: On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 11:50 AM, Terry Reedy tjre...@udel.edu wrote: There are two ideas of set.get floating about: 1) get an arbitrary object 2) get the object in the set with the same 'value'(hash+eq) as an input arg

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a setwithoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread Raymond Hettinger
[geremy condra] Was it ever decided whether this would fall under the moratorium? Decided isn't the right word: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2009-October/093373.html FWIW, I'm a strong -1 on both proposals. Just add a short get_one() function and a get_equivalent() recipe to

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread Terry Reedy
sstein...@gmail.com wrote: On Oct 27, 2009, at 2:50 PM, Terry Reedy wrote more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more and more: Actually, I wrote 7 succinct lines that summarized and made a proposal. In general, I snip when quoting and write concisely as possible.

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a set withoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread sstein...@gmail.com
On Oct 27, 2009, at 11:02 PM, Terry Reedy wrote: sstein...@gmail.com wrote: This topic needs its own flippin' newsgroup. You could have said just that, appropriate or not, without dumping on anyone in particular. I was not trying to dump on you in particular, I picked a random message

Re: [Python-Dev] Retrieve an arbitrary element from a setwithoutremoving it

2009-10-27 Thread geremy condra
On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 3:49 PM, Raymond Hettinger pyt...@rcn.com wrote: [geremy condra] Was it ever decided whether this would fall under the moratorium? Decided isn't the right word: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2009-October/093373.html snip I'm unclear- does that imply

Re: [Python-Dev] Python Package Management Roadmap in Python Releases

2009-10-27 Thread David Lyon
On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 10:20:03 + (UTC), Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net wrote: (*) Remember, however, that Tarek and work on Distribute, and also on bringing pieces of setuptools/Distribute functionality into distutils. But if that's the case then why not work on any third party tool..?