Python for Non-Programmers
==
Python is well suited as a programming languages for people who
haven't used any other programming language before. Since there
are fewer things to worry about compared to a languages like C,
C++ or Java, you get things done faster and
On Mar 5, 10:34 pm, Xah Lee xah...@gmail.com wrote:
On Mar 5, 9:26 pm, Tim Roberts t...@probo.com wrote:
Xah Lee xah...@gmail.com wrote:
some additional info i thought is relevant.
are int, float, long, double, side-effects of computer engineering?
Of course they are. Such concepts
On Mon, 05 Mar 2012 17:11:09 -0800, Xah Lee wrote:
Yes.
Why do you ask? Is this not obvious?
Was this a rhetorical question?
--
A girl with a future avoids the man with a past.
-- Evan Esar, The Humor of Humor
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On Mon, 05 Mar 2012 22:34:46 -0800, Xah Lee wrote:
while what you said is true, but the problem is that 99.99% of
programers do NOT know this. They do not know Mathematica. They've never
seen a
Could you please offer some evidence to support this claim? Most of the
programmers I've ever run
On Mar 6, 2:40 am, Bob Rossi b...@brasko.net wrote:
Darn it, this was reported in 2007
http://bugs.python.org/issue1180193
and it was mentioned the logging package was effected.
Yikes.
I will think about this, but don't expect any quick resolution :-( I
think the right fix would be not in
What happens if I pickle a class, and later unpickle it where the class now has
added some new attributes?
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here's a interesting problem that we are discussing at comp.lang.lisp.
〈Parallel Programing Problem: asciify-string〉
http://xahlee.org/comp/parallel_programing_exercise_asciify-string.html
here's the plain text. Code example is emacs lisp, but the problem is
general.
for a bit python relevancy…
On Tue, Mar 06, 2012 at 02:38:50AM -0800, Vinay Sajip wrote:
On Mar 6, 2:40 am, Bob Rossi b...@brasko.net wrote:
Darn it, this was reported in 2007
http://bugs.python.org/issue1180193
and it was mentioned the logging package was effected.
Yikes.
I will think about this, but
[intentionally violating the followup-to header]
In article 7ol5r.29957$zd5.14...@newsfe12.iad,
Chiron chiron613.no.sp...@no.spam.please.gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, 05 Mar 2012 22:34:46 -0800, Xah Lee wrote:
while what you said is true, but the problem is that 99.99% of
programers do NOT
Neal Becker wrote:
What happens if I pickle a class, and later unpickle it where the class
now has added some new attributes?
- If the added attributes' values are immutable, provide defaults as class
attributes.
- Implement an appropriate __setstate__() method. The easiest would be
#
On Tue, 06 Mar 2012 07:34:34 -0500, Neal Becker wrote:
What happens if I pickle a class, and later unpickle it where the class
now has added some new attributes?
Why don't you try it?
py import pickle
py class C:
... a = 23
...
py c = C()
py pickled = pickle.dumps(c)
py C.b = 42 # add a
Bob Rossi wrote:
On Tue, Mar 06, 2012 at 02:38:50AM -0800, Vinay Sajip wrote:
On Mar 6, 2:40 am, Bob Rossi b...@brasko.net wrote:
Darn it, this was reported in 2007
http://bugs.python.org/issue1180193
and it was mentioned the logging package was effected.
Yikes.
I will think
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
On Tue, 06 Mar 2012 07:34:34 -0500, Neal Becker wrote:
What happens if I pickle a class, and later unpickle it where the class
now has added some new attributes?
Why don't you try it?
py import pickle
py class C:
... a = 23
...
py c = C()
py pickled =
hello pythonist
i'm developing using the simple / basic http server
i got very bad performance regarding to request time .
9 sec for each request replay.
i tried to test this with this:
python -m SimpleHTTPServer 8080
but no better.
any sugestions ? that i can use ?
my final goal is to serv 5
Hi,
I'm trying to add a couple log handlers to a program. The end goal is
to log things at INFO or above to console, and if a -v option is set
to ALSO log everything at DEBUG or above to a file. However, while I
DO get the log file created, and log messages are appearing there,
Debug messages
On Mar 6, 4:09 pm, J dreadpiratej...@gmail.com wrote:
Any idea what I'm doing wrong?
Levels can be set on loggers as well as handlers, and you're only
setting levels on the handlers. The default level on the root logger
is WARNING. A logger checks its level first, and only if the event
passes
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Next Thursday, 8th March.
http://www.python-madrid.es/post/reunion-marzo-2012-python-madrid/
- --
Jesus Cea Avion _/_/ _/_/_/_/_/_/
j...@jcea.es - http://www.jcea.es/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/
jabber
Peter Otten wrote:
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
On Tue, 06 Mar 2012 07:34:34 -0500, Neal Becker wrote:
What happens if I pickle a class, and later unpickle it where the class
now has added some new attributes?
Why don't you try it?
py import pickle
py class C:
... a = 23
...
py c
On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 11:19, Vinay Sajip vinay_sa...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On Mar 6, 4:09 pm, J dreadpiratej...@gmail.com wrote:
Any idea what I'm doing wrong?
Levels can be set on loggers as well as handlers, and you're only
setting levels on the handlers. The default level on the root logger
Neal Becker wrote:
Peter Otten wrote:
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
On Tue, 06 Mar 2012 07:34:34 -0500, Neal Becker wrote:
What happens if I pickle a class, and later unpickle it where the class
now has added some new attributes?
Why don't you try it?
py import pickle
py class C:
...
On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 2:43 PM, John Salerno johnj...@gmail.com wrote:
I sort of have to work with what the website gives me (as you'll see below),
but today I encountered an exception to my RE. Let me just give all the
specific information first. The point of my script is to go to the
On Tuesday, March 6, 2012 4:52:10 PM UTC-6, Chris Rebert wrote:
On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 2:43 PM, John Salerno johnj...@gmail.com wrote:
I sort of have to work with what the website gives me (as you'll see
below), but today I encountered an exception to my RE. Let me just give all
the
Anything that allows me NOT to use REs is welcome news, so I look forward to
learning about something new! :)
I should ask though...are there alternatives already bundled with Python that I
could use? Now that you mention it, I remember something called HTMLParser (or
something like that)
On 03/06/2012 01:34 AM, Xah Lee wrote:
while what you said is true, but the problem is that 99.99% of
programers do NOT know this. They do not know Mathematica. They've
never seen a language with such feature. The concept is alien. This is
what i'd like to point out and spread awareness.
I can
On Tuesday, March 6, 2012 5:05:39 PM UTC-6, John Salerno wrote:
Anything that allows me NOT to use REs is welcome news, so I look forward
to learning about something new! :)
I should ask though...are there alternatives already bundled with Python that
I could use? Now that you mention
On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 4:05 PM, John Salerno johnj...@gmail.com wrote:
Anything that allows me NOT to use REs is welcome news, so I look forward to
learning about something new! :)
I should ask though...are there alternatives already bundled with Python that
I could use? Now that you
On Tuesday, March 6, 2012 5:05:39 PM UTC-6, John Salerno wrote:
Anything that allows me NOT to use REs is welcome news, so I look forward
to learning about something new! :)
I should ask though...are there alternatives already bundled with Python that
I could use? Now that you mention
Thanks. I'm thinking the choice might be between lxml and Beautiful
Soup, but since BS uses lxml as a parser, I'm trying to figure out the
difference between them. I don't necessarily need the simplest
(html.parser), but I want to choose one that is simple enough yet
powerful enough that I won't
On Tue, 06 Mar 2012 15:05:39 -0800, John Salerno wrote:
Anything that allows me NOT to use REs is welcome news, so I look
forward to learning about something new! :)
I should ask though...are there alternatives already bundled with Python
that I could use? Now that you mention it, I
Also, you're still double-posting.
Grr. I just reported it to Google, but I think if I start to frequent the
newsgroup again I'll have to switch to Thunderbird, or perhaps I'll just try
switching back to the old Google Groups interface. I think the issue is the new
interface.
Sorry.
--
Also, you're still double-posting.
Grr. I just reported it to Google, but I think if I start to frequent the
newsgroup again I'll have to switch to Thunderbird, or perhaps I'll just
try switching back to the old Google Groups interface. I think the issue is
the new interface.
Sorry.
Hi Peter,
A related question.
Is there anyhing like a built in signature which would help to detect,
that one tries to unpickle an object whose byte code has changed?
The idea is to distinguish old and new pickled data and start some
'migration code' fi required
The only thing, that I
On Tue, Mar 06, 2012 at 04:29:10PM -0500, Calvin Kim wrote:
On 03/06/2012 01:34 AM, Xah Lee wrote:
while what you said is true, but the problem is that 99.99% of
programers do NOT know this. They do not know Mathematica. They've
never seen a language with such feature. The concept is alien.
On 3/6/2012 6:05 PM, John Salerno wrote:
Anything that allows me NOT to use REs is welcome news, so I look
forward to learning about something new! :)
I should ask though...are there alternatives already bundled with
Python that I could use?
lxml is +- upward compatible with xml.etree in the
On 3/6/2012 6:57 PM, John Salerno wrote:
Also, you're still double-posting.
Grr. I just reported it to Google, but I think if I start to frequent
the newsgroup again I'll have to switch to Thunderbird, or perhaps
I'll just try switching back to the old Google Groups interface. I
think the
In article
12783654.1174.1331073814011.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@yner4,
John Salerno johnj...@gmail.com wrote:
I sort of have to work with what the website gives me (as you'll see below),
but today I encountered an exception to my RE. Let me just give all the
specific information
I have 4 py files like below. Two __init__.py is empty file.
$ find foo -name *.py
foo/lib/lib.py
foo/lib/__init__.py
foo/__init__.py
foo/foo.py
$ cat foo/lib/lib.py
from __future__ import absolute_import
print('lib.py', __name__)
from .. import foo
#import foo.foo
$ cat foo/foo.py
from
I am looking for an automated tool for refactoring/obfuscation.
Something that changes names of functions, variables, or which would
merge all the functions of various modules in a single module.
The closest I have seen is http://bicyclerepair.sourceforge.net/
Does somebody know of something that
On Mar 6, 6:11 am, Xah Lee xah...@gmail.com wrote:
some additional info i thought is relevant.
are int, float, long, double, side-effects of computer engineering?
It is a bit naive for computer scientists to club integers and reals
as mathematicians do given that for real numbers, even
How can I get something from tkinter gui to another program ?
tkinter on python 3.2 on kde4
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Hi,
I am confused between plain python, numpy, scipy, pylab, matplotlib.
I have high familiarity with matlab, but the computer I use does not
have it. So moving to python.
What should I use? and the best way to use it. I will be running
matlab-like scripts sometimes on the shell prompt and
On Tue, 06 Mar 2012 20:06:37 -0800, amar Singh wrote:
Hi,
I am confused between plain python, numpy, scipy, pylab, matplotlib.
Python is a programming language. It comes standard with many libraries
for doing basic mathematics, web access, email, etc.
Numpy is a library for doing
After a bit of reading, I've decided to use Beautiful Soup 4, with
lxml as the parser. I considered simply using lxml to do all the work,
but I just got lost in the documentation and tutorials. I couldn't
find a clear explanation of how to parse an HTML file and then
navigate its structure.
The
Steven Bethard steven.beth...@gmail.com added the comment:
This behavior is intentional - positional arguments must be sequential, not
broken up with optional (flag) arguments between. So this is a documentation
bug.
Allowing positional arguments to be broken up with optional (flag) arguments
Vlastimil Brom vlastimil.b...@gmail.com added the comment:
Sorry for mixing the different problems, these were somehow things I noticed
at once in the new python version, but I should have noticed the different
domains myself.
I still might not understand the term crash properly - I just meant
Changes by Tshepang Lekhonkhobe tshep...@gmail.com:
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Changes by Lars Gustäbel l...@gustaebel.de:
--
resolution: - invalid
stage: - committed/rejected
status: open - closed
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http://bugs.python.org/issue10369
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Nadeem Vawda nadeem.va...@gmail.com added the comment:
I had intended to wait until the code had been tested on all of the
buildbots before closing it. However, it's taking a while to get xz-utils
installed on the last few bots, so it doesn't make sense to keep the
issue open for this.
Changes by Nadeem Vawda nadeem.va...@gmail.com:
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status: open - closed
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sbt shibt...@gmail.com added the comment:
What you were told on IRC was wrong. By default the queue *does* have infinite
size.
When a process puts an item on the queue for the first time, a background
thread is started which is responsible for writing items to the underlying
pipe. This
Stefan Krah stefan-use...@bytereef.org added the comment:
Then I'm abusing this ticket to say: thanks for verifying this.
I would still like to sweep this fact under the rug. :)
Could you have a look at the documentation patch and see if it's clearer?
--
keywords: +patch
Added file:
Eli Bendersky eli...@gmail.com added the comment:
BTW, the issue 6488 is still opened. I did not check if there's something
left to do before to close it.
The fundamental problem issue #6488 was opened for still exists - the docs use
the term path without defining it. This should be
Roundup Robot devn...@psf.upfronthosting.co.za added the comment:
New changeset da2aaced21bd by Stefan Krah in branch 'default':
Issue #14181: Improve clarity in the documentation for the multi-purpose
http://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/da2aaced21bd
--
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Stefan Krah stefan-use...@bytereef.org added the comment:
OK, for me the view-obj issues are done. The new tests indicate
that we can silently keep backwards compatibility for view-obj==NULL,
but I suppressed that fact in the documentation because it's already
complicated enough.
Perhaps we
Changes by Éric Araujo mer...@netwok.org:
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Éric Araujo mer...@netwok.org added the comment:
I’m working on this.
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New submission from James Pickering jamespi...@googlemail.com:
If you run pkgutil.iter_zipimport_modules with a prefix parameter, and the
module in question is a package, then the prefix parameter is ignored.
The most visible symptom of this is when running pkgutil.walk_packages for a
guilherme-pg guilherme.p.g...@gmail.com added the comment:
I uploaded an incomplete patch that might address the issue so it can be
discussed.
This patch introduces 'greedy_star', a new constructor parameter to
ArgumentParser that makes * positional arguments behave as expected in the
test
New submission from Tshepang Lekhonkhobe tshep...@gmail.com:
This would be extra nice because I would not have to fill in the entire path
manually when I'm setting a b(reak).
--
components: Library (Lib)
messages: 155020
nosy: tshepang
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
Jim Jewett jimjjew...@gmail.com added the comment:
Can't this be triggered by non-malicious code that just happened to have a
python comparison and get hit with a thread switch?
I'm not sure how often it happens, but today it would not be visible to the
user; after the patch, users will see a
Changes by Stefan Krah stefan-use...@bytereef.org:
--
dependencies: -bytearray_getbuffer: unnecessary code
resolution: - duplicate
stage: - committed/rejected
status: open - closed
superseder: - adapt sphinx-quickstart for windows
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Python
Changes by Stefan Krah stefan-use...@bytereef.org:
--
superseder: adapt sphinx-quickstart for windows - bytearray_getbuffer:
unnecessary code
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STINNER Victor victor.stin...@gmail.com added the comment:
Can't this be triggered by non-malicious code that just happened to have a
python comparison and get hit with a thread switch?
The issue was triggered without threads.If the __eq__ method of the
objects used for keys use C functions
Mark Shannon m...@hotpy.org added the comment:
Jim Jewett wrote:
Jim Jewett jimjjew...@gmail.com added the comment:
Can't this be triggered by non-malicious code that just happened to have a
python comparison and get hit with a thread switch?
So, they are writing to a dict in one thread
STINNER Victor victor.stin...@gmail.com added the comment:
If the __eq__ method of the
objects used for keys use C functions releasing the GIL, you may
trigger the issue.
Oh, I mean: trigger the issue with threads. I hope that your objects
don't call C functions like open() in their __eq__()
New submission from STINNER Victor victor.stin...@gmail.com:
PyObject_GenericSetAttr() doesn't keep a reference to the descriptor: Python
does crash if the descriptor is destroyed while the attribute is set. Attached
patch keeps a reference to the desriptor to avoid the crash.
A smililar was
Changes by STINNER Victor victor.stin...@gmail.com:
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type: - crash
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Changes by STINNER Victor victor.stin...@gmail.com:
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versions: +Python 3.3
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Guido van Rossum gu...@python.org added the comment:
On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 8:56 AM, Mark Shannon rep...@bugs.python.org wrote:
Mark Shannon m...@hotpy.org added the comment:
Jim Jewett wrote:
Jim Jewett jimjjew...@gmail.com added the comment:
Can't this be triggered by non-malicious code
Changes by STINNER Victor victor.stin...@gmail.com:
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resolution: fixed -
status: closed - open
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Jim Jewett jimjjew...@gmail.com added the comment:
On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 11:56 AM, Mark Shannon wrote:
Jim Jewett:
Can't this be triggered by non-malicious code that just happened
to have a python comparison and get hit with a thread switch?
So, they are writing to a dict in one thread
New submission from Maciej Fijalkowski fij...@gmail.com:
Example to get a segfault attached. Crashes under python3 as well.
--
files: x.py
messages: 155028
nosy: fijall
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title: Segfault when using re.finditer over mmap
type: crash
versions:
Guido van Rossum gu...@python.org added the comment:
On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 9:43 AM, Jim Jewett rep...@bugs.python.org wrote:
Jim Jewett jimjjew...@gmail.com added the comment:
On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 11:56 AM, Mark Shannon wrote:
Jim Jewett:
Can't this be triggered by non-malicious code
New submission from Vinay Sajip vinay_sa...@yahoo.co.uk:
I built an MSI for Python 3.3 on Windows 7 and installed from it - the
resulting installation seems to work OK in that it passes all tests except
test_tcl (intermittent failure). However, when I uninstall, python33.dll is
left behind in
Jim Jewett jimjjew...@gmail.com added the comment:
(1) I think this module would benefit greatly from a map explaining what each
file does, and perhaps from some reorganization.
As best I can yet tell, there are about ~130 files, over a dozen directories,
but the only ones that directly
Changes by Brian Curtin br...@python.org:
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Martin v. Löwis mar...@v.loewis.de added the comment:
That pythonw suddenly closes is a separate issue: if pythonw attempts to write
to stderr, it crashes. To get your example to run in pythonw.exe,
try
pythonw.exe Lib\idlelib\idle.py 2 out.txt
I think the behavior of pythonw terminating when
Matthew Barnett pyt...@mrabarnett.plus.com added the comment:
It segfaults because it attempts to access the buffer of an mmap that has been
closed. It would be certainly be more friendly if it checked whether the mmap
was still open and, if not, raised an exception instead.
--
nosy:
Stefan Krah stefan-use...@bytereef.org added the comment:
Jim, thanks for taking a look at this.
Jim Jewett rep...@bugs.python.org wrote:
(1) I think this module would benefit greatly from a map explaining
what each file does, and perhaps from some reorganization.
Just MAP.txt in the
Roundup Robot devn...@psf.upfronthosting.co.za added the comment:
New changeset 1112c2f602b3 by Vinay Sajip in branch '2.7':
Closes #14158: We now track test_support.TESTFN cleanup, and test_mailbox uses
shutil.rmtree for simpler code.
http://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/1112c2f602b3
--
Stefan Krah stefan-use...@bytereef.org added the comment:
STINNER Victor rep...@bugs.python.org wrote:
How can I help to integrate this module into CPython?
It would be fantastic if you could take a look at _decimal.c, for example
to find some incompatibilities between _decimal.c and
Jim Jewett jimjjew...@gmail.com added the comment:
On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 1:05 PM, Guido van Rossum
Jim Jewett:
... If they're just adding new keys, or even deleting other
(== NOT the one being looked up) keys, why should that
keep them from finding the existing, unchanged keys?
... The
Martin v. Löwis mar...@v.loewis.de added the comment:
I guess this is a misconfiguration for your system. This DLL is
reference-counted, and you must have arranged the reference count to be 1
somehow. Inspect the MSI log for details.
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Python
Glenn Linderman v+pyt...@g.nevcal.com added the comment:
Interesting that the behavior is intentional, yet it accepts positional
parameters either before, or after, or between optional (flag) parameters.
This seems to me to be a case where proper documentation of the intention would
have led
Vinay Sajip vinay_sa...@yahoo.co.uk added the comment:
Yes, the refcount was 1 after uninstallation - possibly it's been like that for
a long time. I'll close the issue, but one thing occurs to me - isn't the DLL's
version resource updated when you rebuild? Why wouldn't the newer version in an
Martin v. Löwis mar...@v.loewis.de added the comment:
The version number is not changed on every rebuild, only when patchlevel.h
changes.
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Florian M florian.mladit...@googlemail.com added the comment:
I wrote some documentation with the information I found on
http://wiki.python.org/moin/PullDom and some custom examples.
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Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file24750/xml.dom.pulldom.rst
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New submission from Miki Tebeka miki.teb...@gmail.com:
Running make test on 3.3a source tree on Ubuntu 11.10 (64bit) hangs at
test_concurrent_futures
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components: Tests
messages: 155043
nosy: tebeka
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title: test_concurrent_futures hangs
Nick Coghlan ncogh...@gmail.com added the comment:
This is closely related to PEP 395, since multiprocessing currently hits the
same issue in trying to figure out the correct setting for sys.argv0.
I quite like the sys.__argv__ idea for preserving the *exact* underlying
command line (Alex
Benjamin Peterson benja...@python.org added the comment:
The scripts for generating code would preferably go in a Tools/decimal
directory.
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Jim Jewett jimjjew...@gmail.com added the comment:
On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 3:07 PM, Stefan Krah
Jim Jewett rep...@bugs.python.org wrote:
(1) I think this module would benefit greatly from a map explaining
what each file does, and perhaps from some reorganization.
Just MAP.txt in the
Benjamin Peterson benja...@python.org added the comment:
Speaking of inline, the inline keyword will have to go because it's not C89.
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Eli Bendersky eli...@gmail.com added the comment:
Thanks, Florian - I will review the patch. At first sight it looks much better
than what exists.
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Jim Jewett jimjjew...@gmail.com added the comment:
I think the latest patch is indeed cleaner.
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nosy: +Jim.Jewett
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Python tracker rep...@bugs.python.org
http://bugs.python.org/issue13897
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Ramchandra Apte maniandra...@gmail.com added the comment:
But we could check if the compiler supports the inline keyword and use it if
available.
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nosy: +ramchandra.apte
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Python tracker rep...@bugs.python.org
http://bugs.python.org/issue7652
New submission from Ramchandra Apte maniandra...@gmail.com:
The http://www.python.org/dev/peps browser title is python.org
I suggest it should be changed to PEP Index.
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messages: 155051
nosy: ramchandra.apte
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title:
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