Rich Teer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Sat, 27 Aug 2005, Mike Meyer wrote:
I think you're right - a web standard designed for writing real
applications probably wouldn't start life as a markup for text. The
only thing I can think of that even tries is Flash, but it's
What about Java?
Using
://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
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John Bokma [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Paul Rubin http://[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Another advantage is that evewry internet-enabled computer today
already comes with an HTML renderer (AKA browser)
No, they don't. Minimalist Unix distributions don't
is required. Some
of the things you list are a danger even without HTML; most modern
news/mail readers will follow links in flat ascii.
mike
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to web sites, just like it does to everything
else.
mike
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version, as well as making it
work on proprietary workstation OS's.
Of course, considering the state of most of the HTML on the web, I
have *no* idea why most of them are doing this.
mike
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available like xrn and xvnews.
It may be that the site you were at only offered a few readers. But
that's a different issue.
All of this is from memory, of course - and may well be wrong.
mike
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the problems and look for solutions,
because some problems can't be solved with async I/O. That's why I
posted the article titled Static vs. dynamic checking for support of
concurrent programming - I'm trying to find out if one potential
solution could be adapted for Python.
mike
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in your news and mail readers. JavaScript, Java, and any
form of object embedding. Oh yeah, and frames.
No problem.
mike
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separate variables as such?
Thanks,
mike
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Bryan Olson [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer wrote:
Bryan Olson writes:
Mike Meyer wrote:
The rule I follow in choosing my tools is Use the least complex tool
that will get the job done.
Even if a more complex tool could do the job better?
In that case, the simpler model
on. But given that most of the
people sending around formatted text are using point-n-click GUIs to
create the stuff, the main advantage of HTML - that it's easy to write
by hand - isn't needed.
mike
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Paul Rubin http://[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Even simpler to program in is the model used by Erlang. It's more CSP
than threading, though, as it doesn't have shared memory as part of
the model. But if you can use the simpler model to solve your problem
Dennis Lee Bieber [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Sat, 20 Aug 2005 22:30:43 -0400, Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] declaimed
the following in comp.lang.python:
with these issues. If I ever find myself having to have non-trivial
threads again, I'll check the state of the threading models in other
, that might be the time to look
into this.
mike
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Donn Cave [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Quoth Paul Rubin http://[EMAIL PROTECTED]:
| Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
| The real problem is that the concurrency models available in currently
| popular languages are still at the goto stage of language
| development. Better models exist, have
Bryan Olson [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer wrote:
The real problem is that the concurrency models available in currently
popular languages are still at the goto stage of language
development. Better models exist, have existed for decades, and are
available in a variety
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on almost the
same topic, lamenting that diagnostic tools in popular programming
languages pretty much sucked, being at best no better than they were
30 years ago. The two together seem to indicate that something is
fundamentally broken somewhere.
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the file in that
subdirectory. Easy to do programmatically, it's still easy to find
files by hand, and you can make it as fine-grained as you want.
mike
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htmlAnchor.transformString( inputHTML )
How well does it deal with other attributes in front of the href, like
A onClick=... href=...?
How about if my HTML has things that look like HTML in attributes,
like TAG ATTRIBUTE=stuffA HREF=stuff?
Thanks,
mike
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should use the timeit module, which chooses the correct timer to
use for the platform it's running on, as well as working around a
number of other things that trip up people trying to benchmark code.
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be true for anything claiming to be Unix. The results on
systems that break this aren't pretty.
mike
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isn't well-formed (which is probably true for most of the
stuff on the web), you need a more understanding parser. I'd look into
using BeatifulSoup for this, though Iv'e only used it to extract
information from web pages, not to modify them.
mike
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Peter Decker [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On 8/16/05, Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Well, they may have created a library class that does the job for
them. Figuring out which is which seemed to be the point of this
thread.
I guess my summary of the thread was that a library is built
which is which seemed to be the point of this
thread.
mike
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;
}
The other alternative is to translate the above into Python, and run
that code.
JavaScript lets you do some really cool effects. It pretty much sucks
for any program that wants to read the page, though - your parser,
search engines, etc.
mike
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a finished product. I use it
heavily on a daily basis.
mike
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configuration should transate whatever format you
feed it to something the printer can print.
mike
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the operators on lists and numbers is that the
symbols got overloaded for both types. The operators on lists aren't
commutative, aren't associative, and don't have inverses. Given that,
the surprising thing is that S + S is the same as S * 2 as often as it
is.
mike
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be:
Everything you can manipulate is an instance of a class or a
type.
mike
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, and the setuid man page.
mike
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. The LSP is more strict than that.
mike
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via introspection (see the help for the
inspect module for more details). I'm not sure if there's a similar
way to figure out what the globals were at the point that debug is
called.
mike
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is Eiffel's contracts.
Eiffel's DbC has been picked up by other languages. D and SPARK come
to mind.
In a broader sense, a couple of Python frameworks support interfaces,
which basically guarantee subtyping at the same level as Liskov's CLU
language does.
mike
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software, with excellent support, from people who really understand
both software development and the open source software movement.
mike
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is a *dangerous* function. Don't use
it on data that you aren't 100% sure of the origin of. Better yet,
avoid it if at all possible.
If you'll tell us why you think you need to do this, possibly we can
help you avoid using exec.
mike
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mike
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.
The wikipedia was really abusing the phrase LSP. I've corrected the
wikipedia.
mike
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In [EMAIL PROTECTED], François Pinard [EMAIL PROTECTED] typed:
[Mike Meyer]
[...] I generally wind up cursing at [subversion] at least once a day.
Would you accept elaborating a bit on the motivations of the cursing?
Your message says Perforce does nice things, one might fuzzily imply
reasonably fast code for.
mike
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Dennis Lee Bieber [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On 06 Aug 2005 17:27:33 -0700, Paul Rubin http://[EMAIL PROTECTED]
declaimed the following in comp.lang.python:
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Is there a free language you consider successful? I can't think of any
that are a lot more (i.e
Dennis Lee Bieber [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Sat, 06 Aug 2005 21:37:54 -0400, Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] declaimed
the following in comp.lang.python:
The concensus of this group is a *long* way from the debate has
moved on. I agree that it's the concensus of this group
reduce vanish.
These have probably been proposed before, but under other names. If
so, I'd appreciate pointers to the discussion.
mike
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John Roth [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message
What I want to see in Python 3000 is an AST based language
that lets the editors do the pretty printing. Do you want automatic
indenting or would you prefer end statements? It's an editor formatting
option
Peter Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer wrote:
John Roth [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
The world is moving on, in ways that I think you're not seeing.
And Python is standing still in many of those same ways.
I find it hilarious that this arrived at my news server the same day
that Peter
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Hallöchen!
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes
ISPs will find out that Python is popular is if potential
customers tell them they need it. So if they say no, be *sure* and
tell them you won't be using them because of that.
mike
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that would be much worse than global. For one
thing, most variables would be local whether or not they are
declared. Second, having an indication that you need to check module
globals in the function is a better than not having that clue there.
mike
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In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Cliff Wells [EMAIL PROTECTED] typed:
On Thu, 2005-08-04 at 01:04 -0400, Mike Meyer wrote:
Right. Let's go back to the original question: What's the app I use on
Unix that acts like py2exe on Windows and py2app on Unix?
Here's where I ask *you* to stop being an ass
commands, it has a chance of working.
mike
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at compile time (well, some of the time,
anyway), the jython code will have to do a method search at run time.
Chance are, if you're supposed to be wwriting in Java, your
application isn't sensitive enough to the performance of the code for
this to matter.
mike
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Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Hallöchen!
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
[...]
You didn't answer the question about how you define agile
project
Cliff Wells [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Tue, 2005-08-02 at 20:17 -0400, Mike Meyer wrote:
Um - you're not answering the question I asked. I asked What app do I
use to bundle my applications for Unix, ala py2exe (or whatever it is)
for Windows? You're telling me how to install wxPython
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Hallöchen!
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Because such projects attract the greatest number of developers,
many of them being amongst the most diligent developers, too. I
expect this to have
Cliff Wells [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Wed, 2005-08-03 at 09:47 -0400, Mike Meyer wrote:
Cliff Wells [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Tue, 2005-08-02 at 20:17 -0400, Mike Meyer wrote:
Um - you're not answering the question I asked. I asked What app do I
use to bundle my applications for Unix
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I think you'll find that wxPython installs perfectly on Tiger using
the package provided. Indeed, the only really painful platform to
install wxPython on is Linux, where you pretty much need to build from
source if you want the latest and greatest.
FWIW
is that this GOOD THING must propogate into other areas
like GUI and the Web Toolkits.
Good idea. Are you willing to write the standard, and at least one GUI
toolkit implementation to show that it's workable?
mike
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to build an
application bundle for all those Unix systems for a Python app I use
that includes wxPython - or any other third party libraries I may be
using.
mike
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Jorge Godoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer wrote:
In fact this sounds more like a joke I've heard a while ago: standards,
if you don't like the ones out there, create your own.
Works for me.
What works for you? You believe that chaos is better than having standards?
I believe
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (phil hunt) writes:
On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 00:42:53 -0400, Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (phil hunt) writes:
In practise any Python GUI is going to contain code from otyher
languages since if it was coded all the way down in python it would
be too slow
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Hallöchen!
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
[...]
I'm interested in a language with a big community. This is my
definition of success. [...]
GUI applications seem to be the most attractive
probably copy THE over to my FreeBSD box and try
it there.
thanks,
mike
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Cliff Wells [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Sun, 2005-07-31 at 14:58 -0400, Mike Meyer wrote:
And what do I use to bundle my application for Unix? Most of the
things I build get installed on Unix servers.
You install GUI apps on Unix *servers*?
Yup. Thanks to the wonders of X, I can run GUI
Jorge Godoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer wrote:
We already have multiple distributions of Python: CPython, IronPython,
and Jython (and there's at least one more). We even have multiple
distributions of CPython, what with Active State doing their own and
the MacPython distribution
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Hallöchen!
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
[...]
None of us has talked about changing syntax. However, the
standard library is part of the language unless you're really
very petty.
Or you use
- and is plenty fast.
Of course, it doesn't do a lot of graphics work, even for a window
manager.
mike
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to
work very hard on it. If the dependencies will build out of the box -
cool. If not - I have lots of other things to do.
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all
taken a crack at implementing it. The latter is slowly happening in
the Python community. But it's a slow process.
mike
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Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Hallöchen!
Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Torsten Bronger [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Calvin Spealman [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
The choice is GUI toolkits is largely seperate from
Python. Consider that they are just bindings to libraries
Cliff Wells [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Sun, 2005-07-31 at 00:59 -0400, Mike Meyer wrote:
I don't particularly like Tkinter, but it seems to me that it's pretty
much won. It seems to be installed on every desktop platform along
with Python. That means that if I want to distribute GUI apps
Jorge Godoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer wrote:
[ Having GUI stuff included on a standard installation of Python ]
However, you can get compilers for both that come bundled with a good
GUI library. Could it be that that's what you really want - someone to
distribute Python bundled
nothing about batteries.
Nah, using Tkinter is pythonic because practicality beats purity.
mike
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Michele Simionato [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mike Meyer:
I think you're replying to me, but you didn't include any indication
so I can't be sure.
Oops, sorry, yes, I was replying to you.
These two are cases of what I was talking about when I referred to the
Church-Turing thesis.
Well, let
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bengt Richter) writes:
On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 18:07:31 -0400, Mike Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I know, lambda bashing (and defending) in the group is one of the most
popular ways to avoid writing code. However, while staring at some Oz
code, I noticed a feature that would seem
that if I want to distribute GUI apps, I'm
going to cause the least headache for my end users by writing them in
Tkinter.
mike
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Python.
I wouldn't bet on it happening. They seem to violate explicit is
better than implicit.
mike
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string. Done
return ''.join(get_contents(x) for x in ele)
mike
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the
implementation of the child - that's simply ugly. Also, it creates an
apparent relationship between all the most abstract classes that
doesn't really exist.
Do you have a proposed solution that doesn't have these problems?
mike
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, but the the others can't.
Giving clases the same functionality seems to be the reasonable thing
to do. It's symmetric. And if anonymous function objects are good,
then anonymous class objects ought to be good as well.
mike
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thing. The question is whether having to turn your scope into a
function to do this is more trouble than it's worth.
I'd certainly be interested in seeing the implementation.
mike
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assume
you're on Windows - and I can't help you with this one.
mike
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://fuhm.org/super-harmful/
. It's got some good practical advice on using super in your code.
mike
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. The
exact command will depend on your distro. It's probably one of rpm or
apt-get, but might be emerge, or maybe even port.
mike
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to get it into a
mail merge. That depends on your platform and the software you're
using to send the mail. Shouldn't be all that hard.
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how much of that
functionality you get out of the box.
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it into a function:
import sys, os.path
def fixpath(*new):
sys.path.extend(os.path.join(sys.path[0], x) for x in new)
This requires 2.4. Change it to ([os.path ... new]) for earlier versions.
Of course, I note that sys.path[0] is '', so the join doesn't do anything.
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, some file
manager routines would work and some would not.
Are. But I think they're a lot longer now.
bhuda% grep PATH_MAX /usr/include/sys/syslimits.h
#define PATH_MAX 1024 /* max bytes in pathname */
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from
leftover data in the python program. Of course, one way of doing that
is relaunching the python program.
not_time_to_exit depends on your environment. Proper signal handling
is usually the way to deal with this.
mike
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- are they
syncing to different external sources? Have you checked the drift file
on the two machines?
mike
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):
return self.obj.__getattribute__(key)
I don't think this is particularly useful behaviour. How do you use it?
def __str__(self):
return self._format % self
mike
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. */
I think - but I'm not positive, and don't have a Linux box handy to
check on - that this comment is false if your Unix is really Linux.
mike
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, resulting in exceptions from bugs in the variant as well
as bugs in the loop.
mike
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in and create a bitmapped font file, or scan
them in in multipe sizes and cons up a competing font.
mike
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for all variants?). However,
#!/usr/bin/env mypythonscript
works like a charm.
mike
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. BeautifulSoup URL:
http://www.crummy.com/software/BeautifulSoup/ for extracting data
from the pages.
mike
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Peter Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Sybren Stuvel wrote:
Mike Meyer enlightened us with:
I dislike gotos because it is too easy to inadvertently create
infinite loops. 10 WINK; 20 GOTO 10
And it's impossible without them? while True: pass
I thought the same thing, but then I read it again
Thomas Bartkus [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 19:56:24 -0400, Mike Meyer wrote:
Thomas Bartkus [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Re-train on a new platform,
and re-write from scratch?
What do you do when an open source project you were using gets
abandoned?
cvs import -m
10
And it's impossible without them? while True: pass
mike
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