bruno at modulix wrote:
> Neal Becker wrote:
> (snip)
>
>>I see various answers that Python doesn't need interfaces. OTOH, there are
>>responses that some large Python apps have implemented them (e.g., zope).
>>Does anyone have an explanation of why these large systems felt they needed
>>to impl
Carl Banks wrote:
> Only after a lot of effort, a lot
> of refactoring, and a large part of the problem space explored, will
> the interfaces be mature enough that writing interface definitions
> would be useful and not a burden. (And let's face it: there aren't
> many projects that get that far.
Oh I agree entirely. They are just equivalent ways of managing the
complexity of large projects.
I guess interfaces are "providing" specifications, and generics are
"receiving" specifications, so single dispatch methods can be identical
to interfaces only "inverted".
Therefore, as there is no int
Ben wrote:
> It seems to me that a lot of python projects reimplement interfaces or
> adaption of some kind once they reach a certain size (Zope, PEAK, eggs,
> TurboGears, etc), which implies that they really do have some benefits,
> particularly in documentation.
Yes. On my current largish proje
Rene Pijlman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Alex Martelli:
> >PEAK is an interesting counterexample, particularly since Philip Eby
> >tends to be "ahead of the curve":
>
> I never noticed PEAK before. Is it well worth studying?
Oh yes.
Alex
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Neal Becker wrote:
(snip)
> I see various answers that Python doesn't need interfaces. OTOH, there are
> responses that some large Python apps have implemented them (e.g., zope).
> Does anyone have an explanation of why these large systems felt they needed
> to implement interfaces?
These "inter
Neal Becker:
>I see various answers that Python doesn't need interfaces. OTOH, there are
>responses that some large Python apps have implemented them (e.g., zope).
>Does anyone have an explanation of why these large systems felt they needed
>to implement interfaces?
A programming language doesn'
Alex Martelli:
>PEAK is an interesting counterexample, particularly since Philip Eby
>tends to be "ahead of the curve":
I never noticed PEAK before. Is it well worth studying?
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Ben <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
...
> It seems to me that a lot of python projects reimplement interfaces or
> adaption of some kind once they reach a certain size (Zope, PEAK, eggs,
> TurboGears, etc), which implies that they really do have some benefits,
> particularly in documentation.
PEAK i
Alex Martelli <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Roy Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> ...
>> > A class asserting, e.g., "implements IPainter", doesn't thereby risk
>> > being accidentally misused where an IGunslinger is required (OTOH,
>> > implementing >1 of these IS a bother, but that's sort of inev
Roy Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
...
> > A class asserting, e.g., "implements IPainter", doesn't thereby risk
> > being accidentally misused where an IGunslinger is required (OTOH,
> > implementing >1 of these IS a bother, but that's sort of inevitable).
>
> I suppose, but all you've really
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I'm coming from a Java background, so please don't stone me...
>
> I see that Python is missing "interfaces". The concept of an interface
> is a key to good programming design in Java, but I've read that they
> aren't really necessary in Python. I am wondering what tech
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Alex Martelli) wrote:
> Roy Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Peter Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > He probably means that with interfaces one could test compliance
> > > with the interface as a whole instead of testing each member a
bruno at modulix wrote:
> Rene Pijlman wrote:
> > Kay Schluehr:
> >
> >>You won't find many deep class hierarchies and extensive frameworks.
> >
> >
> > Zope comes to mind.
> >
> >
> >>This has the advantage that a classification you have done once at
> >>the beginning of your project in the desig
Rene Pijlman wrote:
> Kay Schluehr:
>
>>You won't find many deep class hierarchies and extensive frameworks.
>
>
> Zope comes to mind.
>
>
>>This has the advantage that a classification you have done once at
>>the beginning of your project in the design phase is not considered
>>to be carve
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
(snip)
> Everyone is getting off track here.
Not that much...
> Java has interfaces because it doesn't support multiple inheritance.
Java as interfaces because it relies on type declaration for subtyping
*and* doesn't support MI.
> Python supports MI, so you don't need
Kay Schluehr:
>You won't find many deep class hierarchies and extensive frameworks.
Zope comes to mind.
>This has the advantage that a classification you have done once at
>the beginning of your project in the design phase is not considered
>to be carved in stone.
Zope 3 comes to mind.
--
ht
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I'm coming from a Java background, so please don't stone me...
>
> I see that Python is missing "interfaces". The concept of an interface
> is a key to good programming design in Java, but I've read that they
> aren't really necessary in Python. I am wondering what techn
Roy Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Peter Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > He probably means that with interfaces one could test compliance
> > with the interface as a whole instead of testing each member and
> > each signature as a single piece.
>
> All interfaces (as implemented by Java)
# All interfaces (as implemented by Java) prove is that your class has
# a bunch of methods with the right names and signatures. It doesn't
# prove that those methods do the right things.
I don't think anyone is suggesting that interfaces do (or should)
prove that the implemented methods actually
Peter Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> He probably means that with interfaces one could test compliance
> with the interface as a whole instead of testing each member and
> each signature as a single piece.
All interfaces (as implemented by Java) prove is that your class has a
bunch of methods w
Rene Pijlman wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
> >If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then for all practical
> >purposes it supports the 'duck' interface.
>
> The problem with that of course, is that there's much more to being a duck
> than being called 'duck'.
>
> public interface JarFile
Roy Smith schrieb:
> Python is a very dynamic language. Java is a very static language.
What is the difference between "static" and "very static"? Is Java
more static than Fortran I? ;)
Peter Maas, Aachen
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Fredrik Lundh schrieb:
> Jonathan Daugherty wrote_
>
>> # In Python, you would simply call the functions you need. No need to
>> # make things that rigidly defined.
>>
>> Except when you need to handle exceptions when those methods don't
>> exist. I think interfaces can definitely be useful.
>
>
This is quite possibly one of the funniest examples of how Duck Typing can break down that I have ever seen!On 4/18/06, Rene Pijlman <
[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:>If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then for all practical>purposes it supports the 'duck' interface.The p
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:
>If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then for all practical
>purposes it supports the 'duck' interface.
The problem with that of course, is that there's much more to being a duck
than being called 'duck'.
public interface JarFile {
void explode();
}
public inte
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I'm coming from a Java background, so please don't stone me...
>
> I see that Python is missing "interfaces". The concept of an interface
> is a key to good programming design in Java, but I've read that they
> aren't really necessary in Python. I am wondering what techni
I am currently working in C# after I spent about 3 years almost only in
python, The way I see thinks is that for me we need interfaces in C# to
allow for flexibility in using OOP because we must only pass defined
and known types at all times so for us to have the flexibility of
passing either a Car
I V wrote:
> To use interfaces in python, just what you would do in Java, except
> don't use interfaces.
+1 QOTW
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This article in Guido van Rossum's blog might be interesting for this
thread
http://www.artima.com/weblogs/viewpost.jsp?thread=92662
--
Pablo
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
# My real-world experience with Java is very dated -- nowadays, I'm
# told, the NEED to cast is vastly reduced by Java 1.5's "generics" (I
# haven't yet written one line of Java 1.5, not even for "play"
# purposes, much less "real world" ones;-).
Interesting; thanks.
# So much for "compiler enfor
Jonathan Daugherty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> # "parser"...?! If you have an 'Object o', say one just received as an
> # argument, and cast it to IBlahble, a la
> #
> # IBlahble blah = (IBlahble) o;
> #
> # ...what can the parser ever say about it?
>
> Maybe you didn't read the "I think"
# "parser"...?! If you have an 'Object o', say one just received as an
# argument, and cast it to IBlahble, a la
#
# IBlahble blah = (IBlahble) o;
#
# ...what can the parser ever say about it?
Maybe you didn't read the "I think" in my OP. Anyway, you clearly
know more about (or have more r
Jonathan Daugherty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> # enforced by whom, at what point ?
>
> In the case of Java, I think the JVM enforces interface implementation
> (probably at the parser level).
"parser"...?! If you have an 'Object o', say one just received as an
argument, and cast it to IBlahble
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> I'm coming from a Java background, so please don't stone me...
Most of us came to Python from some other language background ;-)
> I see that Python is missing "interfaces".
As someone else noted, Python objectively does not have 'i
Jonathan Daugherty wrote:
> # so with interfaces, missing methods will suddenly appear out of thin
> # air ?
>
> With interfaces, the idea is that they're enforced; so, they'll appear
> because someone implements them.
But if you're writing tests you will check method signatures anyway, so
why bo
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I see that Python is missing "interfaces". The concept of an interface
> is a key to good programming design in Java, but I've read that they
> aren't really necessary in Python. I am wondering what technique I can
> use in Python to get the same benefits to a program d
Jonathan Daugherty wrote:
> Except when you need to handle exceptions when those methods don't
> exist. I think interfaces can definitely be useful.
I think I see what you mean, but that's an odd way to put it.
Typically, you aren't going to handle the exceptions produced by type
errors. Of cours
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I'm coming from a Java background, so please don't stone me...
>
> I see that Python is missing "interfaces". The concept of an interface
> is a key to good programming design in Java, but I've read that they
> aren't really necessary in Python. I am wondering what techn
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I see that Python is missing "interfaces". The concept of an interface
> is a key to good programming design in Java, but I've read that they
> aren't really necessary in Python. I am wondering what technique I can
> use in Python to get the same benefits to a program de
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Have a look at Zope 3.
(http://www.zope.org/DevHome/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/FrontPage).
It has an interface implementation. You can use this implementation with
the apllication server Zope 3 or alone.
Regards,
Egon
[EMAIL PROTECT
Jonathan Daugherty wrote:
> # Thanks for the responses...Looks like I might have opened Pandora's
> # box here. Could I accomplish the above with an abstract class?
>
> Zope 3 has an interface system which is good. I recommend you look at
> that.
Zope 3's interface system is quite good, but it's
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> If the mechanic class had a "fixIt()" method defined, could I pass it
> any object I wanted
absolutely.
> and then just call the method that I expect to find there
yes.
> or do I need to strictly define the type, or class, of an object that is
> passed to a method.
# Thanks for the responses...Looks like I might have opened Pandora's
# box here. Could I accomplish the above with an abstract class?
Zope 3 has an interface system which is good. I recommend you look at
that.
--
Jonathan Daugherty
http://www.parsed.org
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/l
# enforced by whom, at what point ?
In the case of Java, I think the JVM enforces interface implementation
(probably at the parser level).
--
Jonathan Daugherty
http://www.parsed.org
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Thanks for the responses...Looks like I might have opened Pandora's box
here. Could I accomplish the above with an abstract class?
If the mechanic class had a "fixIt()" method defined, could I pass it
any object I wanted, and then just call the method that I expect to
find there, or do I need to s
Jonathan Daugherty wrote:
> # so with interfaces, missing methods will suddenly appear out of thin
> # air ?
>
> With interfaces, the idea is that they're enforced; so, they'll appear
> because someone implements them.
enforced by whom, at what point ?
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/list
# so with interfaces, missing methods will suddenly appear out of thin
# air ?
With interfaces, the idea is that they're enforced; so, they'll appear
because someone implements them.
--
Jonathan Daugherty
http://www.parsed.org
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Jonathan Daugherty wrote_
> # In Python, you would simply call the functions you need. No need to
> # make things that rigidly defined.
>
> Except when you need to handle exceptions when those methods don't
> exist. I think interfaces can definitely be useful.
so with interfaces, missing methods
# In Python, you would simply call the functions you need. No need to
# make things that rigidly defined.
Except when you need to handle exceptions when those methods don't
exist. I think interfaces can definitely be useful.
--
Jonathan Daugherty
http://www.parsed.org
--
http://mail.python
[EMAIL PROTECTED] enlightened us with:
> I see that Python is missing "interfaces".
No it isn't. It just hasn't got them.
> The concept of an interface is a key to good programming design in
> Java, but I've read that they aren't really necessary in Python.
> In Java I would accomplish this by
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