On Sun, Mar 29, 2015 at 12:03 PM, Marko Rauhamaa wrote:
> BartC :
>
>> As Chris mentioned, when I say 'faster than C', I mean X running my
>> algorithm was faster then C running Marko's algoritim (on Ian's data).
>> This was just an illustration of algorithm being more important than
>> language.
Mark Lawrence writes:
> This has been marked for deprecation since at least 2.6 but is still
> in the 3.5 code base. Does anybody know if this is by accident or
> design? If the former I'll happily raise an issue to get it removed
> unless somebody beats me to it.
I am using "cgi.parse_qs" - an
Nagy László Zsolt writes:
> 2015.03.28. 7:43 keltezéssel, dieter írta:
>> Nagy László Zsolt writes:
>>
>>> When calling curl.perform() on a curl instance I get this:
>>>
>>> pycurl.error: (55, 'select/poll returned error')
>>>
> The same server is happily accepting files over 4GB from othe
On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 10:05:37 AM UTC+5:30, Paul Rubin wrote:
> 2b. John, thank you for describing your experience and making the
> community's picture of the current overall state of Python 3 more
> accurate. It was apparently a bit too rosy before, and we should avoid
> fostering unrealis
On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 3:35 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> 2b. John, thank you for describing your experience and making the
> community's picture of the current overall state of Python 3 more
> accurate. It was apparently a bit too rosy before, and we should avoid
> fostering unrealistic expectations
I agree with you.
Web programmers should use maintained libraries.
In web world, most common libraries maintained are support Python 3.
I (maintainer of PyMySQL and mysqlclient) uses Python 3 for daily job,
and use Python 2 only for test my libraries.
On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 12:50 PM, Carl Meye
Rustom Mody writes:
> On a more serious note you can (and IMHO should) orthogonalize:
> 1. John I dont appreciate your tone
> 2. John thank your for the bug-report
Fair enough, but I'd split #2 into
2a. John, thank you for the bug report describing specific problems we
can fix, bringing Python 3
On 03/29/2015 09:30 PM, Michael Torrie wrote:
> What does this have to do with Python itself? I'm not completely sure,
> but maybe it's about the Python community. What's the way forward? I
> have no idea. At the very least John is frustrated by the community's
> lack of apparent interest in fi
On 03/29/2015 04:58 PM, Ben Finney wrote:
> You have provided none for your assertion that an unmaintained
> third-party library is somehow a special failure of Python 3.
A language is only as good as its libraries, either the standard library
that ships with the language, or third-party libraries
On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 8:37:13 AM UTC+5:30, Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 1:51 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> > One way is take reports like John's seriously and receive them
> > with thanks, instead of attacking the messenger.
>
> If a messenger wants to be thanked, he should st
Chris Angelico writes:
> On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 1:51 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> > One way is take reports like John's seriously and receive them
> > with thanks, instead of attacking the messenger.
Please note that, where John Nagle has made supportible criticisms, I
have thanked him for them. Th
On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 1:51 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> One way is take reports like John's seriously and receive them
> with thanks, instead of attacking the messenger.
If a messenger wants to be thanked, he should start by not attacking
the recipients. Respect goes both ways. Make your post with a
Ben Finney writes:
> Then you're not in a position to defend the claim. I'm addressing my
> critical inquiry to the person who made the claim that they “get screwed
> by Python 3”.
I'd say that the screw was expecting the migration to be easier than it
actually was. This might result from there
Paul Rubin writes:
> I don't know that I'd say that the language or ecosystem is
> "responsible".
Then you're not in a position to defend the claim. I'm addressing my
critical inquiry to the person who made the claim that they “get screwed
by Python 3”.
--
\ “Fox News gives you both side
John Nagle writes:
> CPAN, the Perl module archive, has some curation and testing. PyPi
> lacks that, which is how we end up with situations like this, where
> there are 11 ways to do something, most of which don't work.
That is a valid criticism of PyPI, and more broadly of the Python
distribut
Ben Finney writes:
> Which doesn't address the assertion that this is somehow a special
> responsibility of “Python 3”, which I asked critical questions about.
"Python 3" in those sorts of contexts refers to the whole ecosystem
including the 3rd party libs. I don't know that I'd say that the
lan
On 3/29/2015 6:03 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> Those questions seem unfair to me. Nagle posted an experience report
> about a real-world project to migrate a Python 2 codebase to Python 3.
> He reported hitting more snags than some of us might expect purely from
> the Python 3 propaganda ("oh, just run
On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 12:08 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> Saran Ahluwalia writes:
>> cross-platform...
>> * Monitors a folder for files that are dropped throughout the day
>
> I don't see a cross-platform way to do that other than by waking up and
> scanning the folder every so often (once a minute,
On Sun, 29 Mar 2015 23:17:23 +0100, BartC wrote:
>On 29/03/2015 22:21, Mark Lawrence wrote:
>> On 28/03/2015 23:50, BartC wrote:
>>> On 28/03/2015 03:39, Sayth wrote:
Good test for pypy to see where it's speed sits between C and Python.
>
>>> Python 3.1: 1700 seconds (normal Python i
Paul Rubin writes:
> Ben Finney writes:
> > Why are you discussing it as though Python 3 is at fault? What do you
> > expect to change *about Python 3* that would address the perceived
> > problem? Whose responsibility is it to do that?
>
> Those questions seem unfair to me. Nagle posted an exp
Saran Ahluwalia writes:
> cross-platform...
> * Monitors a folder for files that are dropped throughout the day
I don't see a cross-platform way to do that other than by waking up and
scanning the folder every so often (once a minute, say). The Linux way
is with inotify and there's a Python modu
Ben Finney writes:
> Why are you discussing it as though Python 3 is at fault? What do you
> expect to change *about Python 3* that would address the perceived
> problem? Whose responsibility is it to do that?
Those questions seem unfair to me. Nagle posted an experience report
about a real-wor
On 2015-03-29, John Nagle wrote:
> The Python 2 module "fcgi" is gone in Python 3.
> The Python 3 documentation at
>
> https://docs.python.org/3/howto/webservers.html
>
> recommends "flup" and links here:
>
> https://pypi.python.org/pypi/flup/1.0
>
> That hasn't been updated since 2007, and the SV
On Wednesday, March 25, 2015 at 4:39:40 AM UTC-7, Marko Rauhamaa wrote:
> A lot of discussion was generated by the good, old fibonacci sequence. I
> have yet to find practical use for fibonacci numbers. However, the
> technique behind a sudoku solver come up every now and again in
> practical situa
John Nagle writes:
(for some reason quoting himself extensively without further comment)
> On 3/29/2015 1:19 PM, John Nagle wrote:
> > On 3/29/2015 12:11 PM, Ben Finney wrote:
> >> John Nagle writes:
> >>> The Python 3 documentation at
> >>> https://docs.python.org/3/howto/webservers.html
> >>>
Cameron Simpson writes:
>
> In xterm and I think several other X11 terminals, Shift-Insert
> pastes. I found that _way_ more convenient than middle click. The
> mouse is not your friend.
>
This information might prove as useful as your answer to my
original question. ;-)
Thanks for both!
--
A
On 3/29/2015 1:19 PM, John Nagle wrote:
> On 3/29/2015 12:11 PM, Ben Finney wrote:
>> John Nagle writes:
>>
>>> The Python 3 documentation at
>>> https://docs.python.org/3/howto/webservers.html
>>>
>>> recommends "flup"
>>
>> I disagree. In a section where it describes FastCGI, it presents a tiny
On 28Mar2015 20:57, Steven D'Aprano
wrote:
On Sat, 28 Mar 2015 08:19 pm, Ian Kelly wrote:
I've never been a fan of the primary selection style anyway. Copying
text is conceptually an action. Selecting text is how one indicates
the target of an action; conceptually it is not an action itself an
On 29/03/2015 22:21, Mark Lawrence wrote:
On 28/03/2015 23:50, BartC wrote:
On 28/03/2015 03:39, Sayth wrote:
Good test for pypy to see where it's speed sits between C and Python.
Python 3.1: 1700 seconds (normal Python interpreter)
PyPy: 93 seconds
C unoptimised: 17 secon
On 29/03/2015 22:40, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
On Mon, 30 Mar 2015 05:57 am, John Nagle wrote:
https://pypi.python.org/pypi/flup/1.0
That hasn't been updated since 2007, and the SVN repository linked there
is gone. The recommended version is abandoned.
Welcome to the Internet. Links die and do
On 29/03/2015 22:19, Mark Lawrence wrote:
On 29/03/2015 21:59, BartC wrote:
On 29/03/2015 00:12, Chris Angelico wrote:
On Sun, Mar 29, 2015 at 10:50 AM, BartC wrote:
Using the OP's algorithm, and testing with the 'hard' puzzle posted
by Ian
Kelly, I got these approximate results:
Python 3.1:
On Mon, 30 Mar 2015 05:57 am, John Nagle wrote:
> https://pypi.python.org/pypi/flup/1.0
>
> That hasn't been updated since 2007, and the SVN repository linked there
> is gone. The recommended version is abandoned.
Welcome to the Internet. Links die and documentation gets outdated. If only
thin
This has been marked for deprecation since at least 2.6 but is still in
the 3.5 code base. Does anybody know if this is by accident or design?
If the former I'll happily raise an issue to get it removed unless
somebody beats me to it.
--
My fellow Pythonistas, ask not what our language can d
On 28/03/2015 23:50, BartC wrote:
On 28/03/2015 03:39, Sayth wrote:
Good test for pypy to see where it's speed sits between C and Python.
I've spent the last hour or so doing such tests.
Using the OP's algorithm, and testing with the 'hard' puzzle posted by
Ian Kelly, I got these approximate
On 29/03/2015 21:59, BartC wrote:
On 29/03/2015 00:12, Chris Angelico wrote:
On Sun, Mar 29, 2015 at 10:50 AM, BartC wrote:
Using the OP's algorithm, and testing with the 'hard' puzzle posted
by Ian
Kelly, I got these approximate results:
Python 3.1: 1700 seconds (normal Python interp
On 29/03/2015 19:03, Marko Rauhamaa wrote:
BartC :
As Chris mentioned, when I say 'faster than C', I mean X running my
algorithm was faster then C running Marko's algoritim (on Ian's data).
This was just an illustration of algorithm being more important than
language.
Be careful with the benc
On 29/03/2015 00:12, Chris Angelico wrote:
On Sun, Mar 29, 2015 at 10:50 AM, BartC wrote:
Using the OP's algorithm, and testing with the 'hard' puzzle posted by Ian
Kelly, I got these approximate results:
Python 3.1: 1700 seconds (normal Python interpreter)
PyPy: 93 seconds
C
On 29/03/2015 12:20, bobbdeep wrote:
How do I add a port to the list of open ports on my server ?
Ask the system administrator.
--
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
John Nagle :
> There's "wsgiref", which looks more promising, but has a different
> interface. That's not what the Python documentation recommends as the
> first choice, but it's a standard module.
>
> I keep thinking I'm almost done with Python 3 hell, but then I get
> screwed by Python 3 again.
John Nagle writes:
> The Python 3 documentation at
> https://docs.python.org/3/howto/webservers.html
>
> recommends "flup"
I disagree. In a section where it describes FastCGI, it presents a tiny
example as a way to test the packages installed. The example happens to
use ‘flup’.
That's quite dif
On 2015.03.29 13:57, John Nagle wrote:
> There's "wsgiref", which looks more promising, but has a different
> interface. That's not what the Python documentation recommends as
> the first choice, but it's a standard module.
Oh?
> These days, FastCGI is never used directly. Just like mod_python, i
The Python 2 module "fcgi" is gone in Python 3.
The Python 3 documentation at
https://docs.python.org/3/howto/webservers.html
recommends "flup" and links here:
https://pypi.python.org/pypi/flup/1.0
That hasn't been updated since 2007, and the SVN repository linked there
is gone. The recommend
Mark Lawrence :
> One thing I have come to rely on over the years is never, ever trust
> your gut instincts about Python performance, you're almost inevitably
> wrong. When I first came across the Norvig solver I made a change,
> purely for fun, to replace two calls to len() with a single call and
On 29/03/2015 19:03, Marko Rauhamaa wrote:
BartC :
As Chris mentioned, when I say 'faster than C', I mean X running my
algorithm was faster then C running Marko's algoritim (on Ian's data).
This was just an illustration of algorithm being more important than
language.
Be careful with the benc
BartC :
> As Chris mentioned, when I say 'faster than C', I mean X running my
> algorithm was faster then C running Marko's algoritim (on Ian's data).
> This was just an illustration of algorithm being more important than
> language.
Be careful with the benchmark comparisons. Ian's example can be
On Sun, Mar 29, 2015 at 1:20 PM, Robert Kern wrote:
> Please consider using a recognized open source license. Your project looks
> interesting, but I won't touch it with the current license.
>
> http://opensource.org/licenses
>
I agree about the licensing. Many devs won't even evaluate the code
f
On 03/29/2015 04:20 AM, Robert Kern wrote:
> On 2015-03-25 15:45, π wrote:
>> Hello Python people,
>>
>> I've made a C++ wrapper for Python.
>> I've called it PiCxx and put it up here: https://github.com/p-i-/PiCxx
>
> Please consider using a recognized open source license. Your project looks
> i
On 29/03/2015 13:01, BartC wrote:
On 29/03/2015 11:35, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
Anyway, we don't really know where the confusion lies. Perhaps the
description is misleading, or I'm just confused, or Bart's idea of brute
force is not the same as my idea of brute force, or perhaps he really
is a
s
On 03/29/2015 07:37 AM, Saran Ahluwalia wrote:
On Sunday, March 29, 2015 at 7:33:04 AM UTC-4, Saran Ahluwalia wrote:
Below are the function's requirements. I am torn between using the OS module or some
other quick and dirty module. In addition, my ideal assumption that this could be
cross-plat
Thank you for the feedback - I have only been programming for 8 months now and
am fairly new to best practice and what is considered acceptable in public
forums. I appreciate the feedback on how to best address this problem.
On Sunday, March 29, 2015 at 8:33:43 AM UTC-4, Peter Otten wrote:
> Sa
Saran Ahluwalia wrote:
> On Sunday, March 29, 2015 at 7:33:04 AM UTC-4, Saran Ahluwalia wrote:
>> Below are the function's requirements. I am torn between using the OS
>> module or some other quick and dirty module. In addition, my ideal
>> assumption that this could be cross-platform. "Records" r
On 29/03/2015 11:35, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
That's why I can't help but feel that, *given the description we've seen*,
perhaps Bart's brute force code doesn't actually solve the problem, and
that's why it is so fast. I'm reminded of the recent thread where somebody
claimed to have a significant
On Sun, 29 Mar 2015 06:36 am, Mario Figueiredo wrote:
> On Sat, 28 Mar 2015 21:32:31 +1100, Steven D'Aprano
> wrote:
>
>>The famous Perl coder Allison Randal writes about why Perl is not dead
>>(it's just pining for the fjords *wink* ) and contrasts the Perl 5/6 split
>>to Python 2/3:
>
> A sha
* Ian Kelly (Sun, 29 Mar 2015 03:13:31 -0600)
>
> On Sun, Mar 29, 2015 at 2:11 AM, Thorsten Kampe
> wrote:
> >
> > I'd like to run two processes concurrently (either through a builtin
> > module or a third-party). One is a "background" task and the other is
> > displaying a spinner (for which I a
On Sunday, March 29, 2015 at 7:33:04 AM UTC-4, Saran Ahluwalia wrote:
> Below are the function's requirements. I am torn between using the OS module
> or some other quick and dirty module. In addition, my ideal assumption that
> this could be cross-platform. "Records" refers to contents in a file
Below are the function's requirements. I am torn between using the OS module or
some other quick and dirty module. In addition, my ideal assumption that this
could be cross-platform. "Records" refers to contents in a file. What are some
suggestions from the Pythonistas?
* Monitors a folder for
I would appreciate feedback on whether I correctly exported my DataFrame and
wrote into XML. I used the ElementTree library. My DataFrame has 11 rows and 8
columns (excluding the index column)
For your convenience here it is:
#My schema assumption:
#
#[
#Some number row
#Sa
On 29/03/2015 04:06, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
On Sun, 29 Mar 2015 10:50 am, BartC wrote:
But using X *and* my own brute-force algorithm, the same puzzle took 2
seconds to solve - faster than C!
But, when you tell me that your very own personal interpreted language,
which I assume nobody else
On Sunday, March 29, 2015 at 3:44:43 PM UTC+5:30, mm0fmf wrote:
> On 29/03/2015 09:57, bobbydeep wrote:
>
> From the error (10060) it looks like Windows but it would be nice if
> you could say which Python and OS you were using.
>
> I haven't looked at your code but just taking at face value th
On Sun, Mar 29, 2015 at 9:35 PM, Steven D'Aprano
wrote:
> Anyway, we don't really know where the confusion lies. Perhaps the
> description is misleading, or I'm just confused, or Bart's idea of brute
> force is not the same as my idea of brute force, or perhaps he really is a
> super-genius who ha
Ian Kelly wrote:
> […] Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn […] wrote:
>> Ian Kelly wrote:
>>> […] Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn […] wrote:
Ian Kelly wrote:
> What I mean is that if you construct a parse tree of "foo" "bar" using
> that grammar, it looks like this:
>
> expr
>
On Sun, 29 Mar 2015 03:10 pm, Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Sun, Mar 29, 2015 at 2:06 PM, Steven D'Aprano
> wrote:
>> On Sun, 29 Mar 2015 10:50 am, BartC wrote:
>>
>>> (X is my own interpreted language, which is where my interest in this
>>> is. This had been generally faster than Python until PyPy
On 2015-03-25 15:45, π wrote:
Hello Python people,
I've made a C++ wrapper for Python.
I've called it PiCxx and put it up here: https://github.com/p-i-/PiCxx
Please consider using a recognized open source license. Your project looks
interesting, but I won't touch it with the current license.
On 29/03/2015 09:57, bobbydeep wrote:
From the error (10060) it looks like Windows but it would be nice if
you could say which Python and OS you were using.
I haven't looked at your code but just taking at face value that it does
work internally.
server_address = ('my-server-ipadress', 199
Changed server code to the following,
from socket import *
HOST = ''
PORT = 8080
serversocket = socket(AF_INET,SOCK_STREAM)
serversocket.bind((HOST,PORT))
serversocket.listen(5)
while True:
(clientsocket, address) = serversocket.accept()
print ("Got client request from",address)
clien
On Sun, Mar 29, 2015 at 2:11 AM, Thorsten Kampe
wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I'd like to run two processes concurrently (either through a builtin
> module or a third-party). One is a "background" task and the other is
> displaying a spinner (for which I already found good packages).
>
> The two processes do n
I am trying to communicate between a server and client using TCP sockets.
Server code:
import socket
import sys
# Create a TCP/IP socket
sock = socket.socket(socket.AF_INET, socket.SOCK_STREAM)
# Bind the socket to the port
server_address = ('my-server-ipadress', 1999)
print
Hi,
I'd like to run two processes concurrently (either through a builtin
module or a third-party). One is a "background" task and the other is
displaying a spinner (for which I already found good packages).
The two processes do not have to communicate with each other; only
the second should be
Am 29.03.15 um 05:06 schrieb Steven D'Aprano:
I'm not one of those people who think that C is by definition the fastest
language conceivable. (People who believe this sometimes make an exception
for hand-crafted assembly, which is ironic since these days the best C
optimizing compilers can genera
On Sat, Mar 28, 2015 at 12:20 PM, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn
wrote:
> Ian Kelly wrote:
>
>> […] Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn […] wrote:
>>> Ian Kelly wrote:
What I mean is that if you construct a parse tree of "foo" "bar" using
that grammar, it looks like this:
expr
2015.03.28. 7:43 keltezéssel, dieter írta:
Nagy László Zsolt writes:
When calling curl.perform() on a curl instance I get this:
pycurl.error: (55, 'select/poll returned error')
This error happens only if the file to be POST-ed is big enough. Last
week files were under 1GB and everythi
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