Why do people use pretty when we already have words that carry more
specific meaning? Because they are lazy! And laziness begets
stupidity.
No, that would be because they are not autistic. Most people like
having a repertoire of words with subtly different meanings in their
natural language,
On Tue, 03 Jan 2012 04:33:45 -0800, Eelco wrote:
Why do people use pretty when we already have words that carry more
specific meaning? Because they are lazy! And laziness begets stupidity.
No, that would be because they are not autistic. Most people like having
a repertoire of words with
On 2012-01-01, Alexander Kapps alex.ka...@web.de wrote:
On 01.01.2012 03:36, Grant Edwards wrote:
On 2011-12-31, Alexander Kappsalex.ka...@web.de wrote:
On 31.12.2011 19:23, Roy Smith wrote:
Why do I waste my time reading your pretentious self-important nonsense?
http://xkcd.com/386/
;)
On Dec 31 2011, 11:12 pm, Dominic Binks dbi...@codeaurora.org wrote:
I doubt you could validate or invalidate a word. A word is, there is no
validation necessary. You could potentially try to validate it's use
but again that's not in your power.
Usage begets validation. By using words in a
On 1/2/2012 9:27 PM, Rick Johnson wrote:
On Dec 31 2011, 11:12 pm, Dominic Binksdbi...@codeaurora.org wrote:
I doubt you could validate or invalidate a word. A word is, there is no
... taken off list
--
Dominic Binks: dbi...@codeaurora.org
Employee of Qualcomm Innovation Center, Inc.
On 1/3/2012 0:27, Rick Johnson wrote:
Yes, i used the word work improperly here. Just another example of
the corrupting influence of garage verbiage. Thanks for bring this to
my attention!
Diction would be a far better word than verbiage there.
Evan
signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP
On 2011-12-28, Steven D'Aprano steve+comp.lang.pyt...@pearwood.info wrote:
On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 18:42:05 -0800, Rick Johnson wrote:
I don't care what ANY dictionary says. Much less a world
dictionary. I don't validate or invalidate a word based on some phony
baloney group of pseudo
In article jdnd4v$6mg$1...@reader1.panix.com,
Grant Edwards invalid@invalid.invalid wrote:
On 2011-12-28, Steven D'Aprano steve+comp.lang.pyt...@pearwood.info wrote:
On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 18:42:05 -0800, Rick Johnson wrote:
I don't care what ANY dictionary says. Much less a world
On 31.12.2011 19:23, Roy Smith wrote:
Why do I waste my time reading your pretentious self-important nonsense?
http://xkcd.com/386/
;)
Why ROFLMAO when double-plus funny works just as well?
xkcd/386 has been the excuse for replying to RR for ages and I still
don't understand why he gets
On 2011-12-31, Alexander Kapps alex.ka...@web.de wrote:
On 31.12.2011 19:23, Roy Smith wrote:
Why do I waste my time reading your pretentious self-important nonsense?
http://xkcd.com/386/
;)
Why ROFLMAO when double-plus funny works just as well?
xkcd/386 has been the excuse for replying
On 01.01.2012 03:36, Grant Edwards wrote:
On 2011-12-31, Alexander Kappsalex.ka...@web.de wrote:
On 31.12.2011 19:23, Roy Smith wrote:
Why do I waste my time reading your pretentious self-important nonsense?
http://xkcd.com/386/
;)
Why ROFLMAO when double-plus funny works just as well?
On 12/27/2011 6:42 PM, Rick Johnson wrote:
On Dec 27, 8:21 pm, Tim Chasepython.l...@tim.thechases.com wrote:
I'm glad you're open to learning more about English as used to
is perfectly acceptable according to the World English Dictionary[1]
[...]
May you be found better for learning and come
On 12/31/2011 1:06 PM, Alexander Kapps wrote:
xkcd/386 has been the excuse for replying to RR for ages and I still
don't understand why he gets that much advertence. Charity? Sympathy
for the lone and broken?
FWIW, it undermines all my attempts to block him. Sigh.
Do what I do: laugh at
On Sun, Jan 1, 2012 at 4:12 PM, Dominic Binks dbi...@codeaurora.org wrote:
While I agree 'right' can be annoying it's usage as in 'you are correct' can
be traced back to 1588, I think we're going to have to allow for it's usage
in 2011 (very nearly 2012 for me and definitely 2012 for anyone
On Dec 28, 2:56 am, Rick Johnson rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com wrote:
On Dec 27, 3:44 pm, Eelco hoogendoorn.ee...@gmail.com wrote:
Despite the fact that you mis-attributed that quote to me, im going to
be a little bit offended in the name of its actual author anyway.
Thats a lot of words to
On Dec 27, 6:59 am, Carl Smith carl.in...@gmail.com wrote:
On Dec 20, 10:58 am, Andrea Crotti andrea.crott...@gmail.com wrote:
On 12/20/2011 03:51 AM, Raymond Hettinger wrote:
Do you use IDLE when teaching Python?
If not, what is the tool of choice?
Students may not be
On Dec 27, 12:14 am, Carl Smith carl.in...@gmail.com wrote:
Do people seriously use IDLE? I thought it was just there for
scratchers, like turtle.
I know for a fact that many folks use IDLE, even some rather well
known folks around here. The fact is, more people use IDLE than admit
to using
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
On 12/28/2011 03:37 AM, Rick Johnson wrote:
My logic is this:
Including an IDE in the stdlib may have been a bad idea (although
i understand and support Guido's original vision for IDLE). But since
we do have it, we need to either MAINTAIN the package or REMOVE it. We
cannot just stick our
On 12/19/11 19:51 , Raymond Hettinger wrote:
Do you use IDLE when teaching Python?
If not, what is the tool of choice?
If your goal is to quickly get new users up and running in Python,
what IDE or editor do you recommend?
I would:
a) let the students pick their own editor.
b) encourage
On 12/27/2011 10:41 PM, Eelco wrote:
*Your suggestion of VIM is especially objectionable. Though I am sure
it is a great tool to you, the subject here is beginner education.
Just because it is a good tool for you, does not make it a good tool
for a beginner.
Before using VIM, I used to use
On Dec 27, 11:50 am, Lie Ryan lie.1...@gmail.com wrote:
In case you haven't realised it, it is pretty
much impossible for a large open source project to die; even if Guido
decided to remove IDLE from the standard library
I don't remember stating that Python would die if IDLE was removed
(not
On 12/27/2011 11:59 AM, K Richard Pixley wrote:
You'd do better to encourage eclipse, but setting that up isn't
trivial either.
IIRC, all I had to do to set up PyDev was copy a URL to Eclipse's
Install New Software wizard, and have Eclipse download and install it.
Extra steps are needed if a
On Dec 27, 11:59 am, K Richard Pixley r...@noir.com wrote:
The problem is that IDLE is hard to set up. (I've never managed it and
I'm a well seasoned veteran).
Can you qualify that statement? Do you mean difficult to set up on
certain OS's? Because for windows there is no difficulty.
And
On Dec 27, 6:53 pm, Lie Ryan lie.1...@gmail.com wrote:
On 12/27/2011 10:41 PM, Eelco wrote:
*Your suggestion of VIM is especially objectionable. Though I am sure
it is a great tool to you, the subject here is beginner education.
Just because it is a good tool for you, does not make it a
On Dec 27, 1:45 pm, Eelco hoogendoorn.ee...@gmail.com wrote:
On Dec 27, 6:53 pm, Lie Ryan lie.1...@gmail.com wrote:
On 12/27/2011 10:41 PM, Eelco wrote:
Before using VIM, I used to use gedit
Eelco, please don't get offended, but can you (and everyone else) stop
using silly verbage like used
On 12/27/11 10:21 , Rick Johnson wrote:
On Dec 27, 11:59 am, K Richard Pixleyr...@noir.com wrote:
The problem is that IDLE is hard to set up. (I've never managed it and
I'm a well seasoned veteran).
Can you qualify that statement? Do you mean difficult to set up on
certain OS's? Because
On 12/28/2011 05:11 AM, Rick Johnson wrote:
On Dec 27, 11:50 am, Lie Ryanlie.1...@gmail.com wrote:
In case you haven't realised it, it is pretty
much impossible for a large open source project to die; even if Guido
decided to remove IDLE from the standard library
I don't remember stating
On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 2:13 PM, Lie Ryan lie.1...@gmail.com wrote:
In any case, removing IDLE without a much better replacement is pretty much
out of the question. If people installed Python in vanilla Windows install,
they would only have Notepad to edit their code.
No no, Wordpad is much
On 12/27/11 10:26 , Andrew Berg wrote:
On 12/27/2011 11:59 AM, K Richard Pixley wrote:
You'd do better to encourage eclipse, but setting that up isn't
trivial either.
IIRC, all I had to do to set up PyDev was copy a URL to Eclipse's
Install New Software wizard, and have Eclipse download and
On Dec 27, 9:04 pm, Rick Johnson rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com wrote:
On Dec 27, 1:45 pm, Eelco hoogendoorn.ee...@gmail.com wrote:
On Dec 27, 6:53 pm, Lie Ryan lie.1...@gmail.com wrote:
On 12/27/2011 10:41 PM, Eelco wrote:
Before using VIM, I used to use gedit
Eelco, please don't get
On 12/27/2011 4:04 PM, K Richard Pixley wrote:
You still need to match versions of PyDev to versions of Eclipse to
versions of operating system to versions of other eclipse plugins. I
spent a few days trying to get it together once and came to the
conclusion that it was a much bigger effort
There are Dr.Python, Pycrust and Notepadplus to support writing python
programs.
IDLE is OK, but if a program failed inside IDLE, then I might have
to kill the old IDLE and restart IDLE again.
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
On Dec 27, 3:44 pm, Eelco hoogendoorn.ee...@gmail.com wrote:
Despite the fact that you mis-attributed that quote to me, im going to
be a little bit offended in the name of its actual author anyway.
Thats a lot of words to waste on your linguistic preferences.
Personally, I reserve the right
On Dec 27, 7:21 pm, 8 Dihedral dihedral88...@googlemail.com
wrote:
There are Dr.Python, Pycrust and Notepadplus to support writing python
programs.
I really like Pycrust. It's written in Python, it's code base is
structured in a professional manner (IDLE you should be jealous!), and
it
On 12/27/11 19:56, Rick Johnson wrote:
On Dec 27, 3:44 pm, Eelcohoogendoorn.ee...@gmail.com
wrote:
Despite the fact that you mis-attributed that quote to me,
im going to be a little bit offended in the name of its
actual author anyway. Thats a lot of words to waste on your
linguistic
On Dec 27, 8:21 pm, Tim Chase python.l...@tim.thechases.com wrote:
I'm glad you're open to learning more about English as used to
is perfectly acceptable according to the World English Dictionary[1]
[...]
May you be found better for learning and come to give others the
benefit of the doubt.
On Wed, Dec 28, 2011 at 1:42 PM, Rick Johnson
rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com wrote:
I don't care what ANY dictionary says. Much less a world dictionary.
I don't validate or invalidate a word based on some phony baloney
group of pseudo intellectuals who decided one to day that writing a
On Dec 27, 11:26 pm, Andrew Berg bahamutzero8...@gmail.com wrote:
On 12/27/2011 11:59 AM, K Richard Pixley wrote: You'd do better to encourage
eclipse, but setting that up isn't
trivial either.
IIRC, all I had to do to set up PyDev was copy a URL to Eclipse's
Install New Software wizard,
On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 18:42:05 -0800, Rick Johnson wrote:
On Dec 27, 8:21 pm, Tim Chase python.l...@tim.thechases.com wrote:
I'm glad you're open to learning more about English as used to is
perfectly acceptable according to the World English Dictionary[1] [...]
May you be found better for
On Dec 25, 9:27 pm, Chris Angelico ros...@gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 4:44 AM, Rick Johnson
[...]
Conversely, why write an IDE into IDLE when perfectly-good IDEs
already exist? I don't use IDLE for development per se; it's for
interactive Python execution, but not editing of
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 9:52 AM, Rick Johnson
rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com wrote:
On Dec 25, 9:27 pm, Chris Angelico ros...@gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 4:44 AM, Rick Johnson
[...]
Conversely, why write an IDE into IDLE when perfectly-good IDEs
already exist? I don't use IDLE for
On Dec 26, 10:11 am, Nathan Rice nathan.alexander.r...@gmail.com
wrote:
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 9:52 AM, Rick Johnson
rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com wrote:
On Dec 25, 9:27 pm, Chris Angelico ros...@gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 4:44 AM, Rick Johnson
[...]
Conversely,
On Mon, 26 Dec 2011 06:52:03 -0800, Rick Johnson wrote:
If Guido would just say something (or at least some of the top
Pythionistas (Hettinger i am looking at you!)) this community might work
together to fix this problem.
The sheer cluelessness displayed here about open source is painful.
If
On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 5:32 AM, Rick Johnson
rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com wrote:
Why has Guido not, at the very least, contacted me
privately? He could remain anonymous.
And how would you know if he did contact you anonymously?
As to your demand that one of the top Pythionistas [sic] say
On Dec 20, 10:58 am, Andrea Crotti andrea.crott...@gmail.com wrote:
On 12/20/2011 03:51 AM, Raymond Hettinger wrote:
Do you use IDLE when teaching Python?
If not, what is the tool of choice?
Students may not be experienced with the command-line and may be
running Windows, Linux,
On Dec 25, 5:44 pm, Rick Johnson rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com wrote:
On Dec 19, 9:51 pm, Raymond Hettinger raymond.hettin...@gmail.com
wrote:
Do you use IDLE when teaching Python?
If not, what is the tool of choice?
I believe IDLE has the potential to be a very useful teaching tool and
On Dec 19, 9:51 pm, Raymond Hettinger raymond.hettin...@gmail.com
wrote:
Do you use IDLE when teaching Python?
If not, what is the tool of choice?
I believe IDLE has the potential to be a very useful teaching tool and
even in it's current abysmal state, i find it to be quite useful.
Students
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 4:44 AM, Rick Johnson
rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com wrote:
Why install an IDE when IDLE is already there? Oh, yes, IDLE SUCKS. I
know that already. But this revelation begs the question... Why has
this community allowed IDLE to rot? Why has guido NOT started a public
Not a teacher here, but I'm curious why Komodo Edit never seems to get
any love in the IDE debates... a free version for personal/non-profit
use, pro versions for those that need the extra features, seems to work
fairly well but then again I'm probably not the best judge...
Thanks,
Monte
On Dec 21, 9:57 am, Nathan Rice nathan.alexander.r...@gmail.com
wrote:
+1 for IPython/%edit using the simplest editor that supports syntax
highlighting and line numbers. I have found that
Exploring/Prototyping in the interpreter has the highest ROI of
anything I teach people.
Thank you
On Dec 21, 9:57 pm, Nathan Rice nathan.alexander.r...@gmail.com
wrote:
+1 for IPython/%edit using the simplest editor that supports syntax
highlighting and line numbers. I have found that
Exploring/Prototyping in the interpreter has the highest ROI of
anything I teach people.
Nathan
It
+1 for IPython/%edit using the simplest editor that supports syntax
highlighting and line numbers. I have found that
Exploring/Prototyping in the interpreter has the highest ROI of
anything I teach people.
Nathan
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Devin Jeanpierre, 20.12.2011 08:32:
Truthfully I'm not sure why it's great for teaching, though. And there
were some discussions I overheard about perhaps switching to PyCharm,
which at least one professor thought was much better.
I recently started using PyCharm personally, but not for my
On 12/20/2011 03:51 AM, Raymond Hettinger wrote:
Do you use IDLE when teaching Python?
If not, what is the tool of choice?
Students may not be experienced with the command-line and may be
running Windows, Linux, or Macs. Ideally, the tool or IDE will be
easy to install and configure (startup
I taught a Python class just recently, and thought long and hard about
this problem. I settled on PyCharm and was happy with that.
My reasons:
- available on all main platoforms
- not entirely broken code completion (ive tried literally every
python editor, and pycharm is the only one that
On Dec 20, 2:14 am, Stefan Behnel stefan...@behnel.de wrote:
For teaching, I think it's better to come around with something simpler
than a full-blown IDE, so that you can show off interactive development,
help() and other introspection features. IMHO much better than hiding all
that behind
On Wed, Dec 21, 2011 at 1:45 AM, Rick Johnson
rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com wrote:
Heck for most things,
considering you have at least basic programming experience, the help
function is all you need to learn the language.
I know I shouldn't feed the troll, but this is more general.
You cannot
I've tried several things. So far vim (with line numbers) to show the code and
then ipython to run it works great.
Another option I tried once was Aptana, since most people in my company know
eclipse this was good for them. It has most (all?) of the features you
mentioned above.
--
On Mon, 19 Dec 2011 19:51:00 -0800, Raymond Hettinger wrote:
Do you use IDLE when teaching Python? If not, what is the tool of
choice?
I'm obviously biased (I started IPython years ago), but I've done a lot
of teaching and I still do like the combination of IPython plus an
editor. Sometimes
On 20 December 2011 13:51, Raymond Hettinger
raymond.hettin...@gmail.com wrote:
Students may not be experienced with the command-line and may be
running Windows, Linux, or Macs. Ideally, the tool or IDE will be
easy to install and configure (startup directory, path, associated
with a
In article mailman.3895.1324433216.27778.python-l...@python.org,
Ashton Fagg ash...@fagg.id.au wrote:
As long as the text editor has line numbers and syntax highlighting
it's sufficient in my book.
I agree with the syntax highlighting. I resisted for many years, then
somebody turned me on
On Wed, Dec 21, 2011 at 1:34 PM, Roy Smith r...@panix.com wrote:
As for line numbers, for working alone, I don't see much point. But for
any kind of interaction with other people, it's essential. It's just SO
much easier to say, line 417 as opposed to OK, scroll up a couple
more lines, no,
Do you use IDLE when teaching Python?
If not, what is the tool of choice?
Students may not be experienced with the command-line and may be
running Windows, Linux, or Macs. Ideally, the tool or IDE will be
easy to install and configure (startup directory, path, associated
with a particular
Two suggestions:
- Editra (free): Requires a little bit of fiddling around and enabling
Shelf, installing plugins but then it is great
- Recently I was introduced to Sublime Text 2 which has an über
streamlined layout.
On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 2:51 PM, Raymond Hettinger
On Tuesday, December 20, 2011 4:51:00 AM UTC+1, Raymond Hettinger wrote:
Do you use IDLE when teaching Python?
If not, what is the tool of choice?
Students may not be experienced with the command-line and may be
running Windows, Linux, or Macs. Ideally, the tool or IDE will be
easy to
My university (University of Toronto) helped design Wing 101, and uses
it exclusively in introductory courses.
Overall, the only major sticking points that I saw (as a TA who helped
with the code labs and setup) were installation issues on OS X
(relating to X11) and some confusion on when the
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