Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 On 2016-11-19 04:48, Achim Patzner wrote: > Am 19.11.2016 um 12:58 schrieb Andrew David Wong: >>> These requirements are probably the worst you can do for corporate >> users; they prefer "standard hardware"; even I would rather stop using >> Qubes than not being able to take any off-the-shelf Lenovo systems but >> having to use underperforming boxes from unknown sources. Keep in mind >> that the average company doesn't like hardware with broad maintenance >> contracts and won't buy outdated designs (and that's about every >> system supported by coreboot) either. >> >> Please note that these are the requirements for *certification*, not >> the requirements to *run* Qubes 4.x. > > You might rephrase that part and stress the fact that you are not left > on your own if problems arise with non-certified hardware (I guess you > lack the experience of having vendor-related problems being ignored with > a hint at "your hardware has not been certified by us running our > software" – just try a round of that with VMware 8-) ). Anything ewlse > will put off a lot of people... > > > Achim > > Yes, we'll be sure to point this out when we make the official announcement closer to Qubes 4.x. In the meantime, I've added a clarificatory note here: https://www.qubes-os.org/hardware-certification/#hardware-certification-requirements - -- Andrew David Wong (Axon) Community Manager, Qubes OS https://www.qubes-os.org -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJYME2ZAAoJENtN07w5UDAwNREP/ArFcBRcAU8nFerIFtlg76S6 CfDVs4LuKQWaz3vy8zGnnOQpLHNAg+1lseeSYbjD/MA/mdTMl8Kb1xpgzHP9N6gE EO7ttgxyuBI0b9IV6KwmW0gBo5E2L04fK3IxDNFAVVEh9qjZFcoGWSKYyCLGhsae MkO1Gd0DoqIi/Wra7TH16vzg6A7MhacJxLTXqctNa1BBDPF1B709ZulL06dnnUwm BEZXLQTL0DmhNhTgT/aqT0tpOdKA9pUfvaCJfJ/gsSKcDj2aiodq669k2GfaMOug nJYCem1Iycuodol+3o0YzkioISIo301U5caBzdjiMbM3U5X43I45YqaoBZ6rHMLU 9T6b5tWLN02sKqacK862y2iHTmzFAMMaavnYVztSmfyUp3oLQ4x6WKLmDVRMBK2+ wXK7HoliT7x4WDjIU1vkb3KpMPZf5PkJxF+T4EyczJZurHDRANS9T95KdbuqK1v/ NQ2TwZl4t6+bm6RZaIBlA4ImnZwjJWaIWVJp13bD0qrdg96many0vU6bYJMfiGg+ bvhciCR9cZhUeT3AOB8H9PZYTkdxjDVgFLgh0dmn1Pgoz5k6f1kT1j4XWNsDG0h2 z+ylO3ZgamHbsqApMa0sRmraAt3EnT21T21JPmUxlvoGveQMbj2UWvqzDi2G4wL2 gih9uT7NUwgIvykBogco =wGWQ -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/e0281a12-419b-f11c-dc43-bc05a33381c0%40qubes-os.org. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 On 2016-11-16 02:35, Achim Patzner wrote: > Am 15.11.2016 um 14:46 schrieb Andrew David Wong: >> If you plan to be using the same machines for Qubes 4.x, you should also >> take into consideration the updated requirements for Qubes-certified >> hardware, which will go into effect for 4.x: >> https://www.qubes-os.org/news/2016/07/21/new-hw-certification-for-q4/ > > These requirements are probably the worst you can do for corporate users; > they prefer "standard hardware"; even I would rather stop using Qubes than > not being able to take any off-the-shelf Lenovo systems but having to use > underperforming boxes from unknown sources. Keep in mind that the average > company doesn't like hardware with broad maintenance contracts and won't buy > outdated designs (and that's about every system supported by coreboot) either. > Please note that these are the requirements for *certification*, not the requirements to *run* Qubes 4.x. You (and I) should still be able to buy standard Lenovo business notebooks and run Qubes 4.x on them just fine. See the minimum requirements for 4.x here: https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/system-requirements/#qubes-release-4x - -- Andrew David Wong (Axon) Community Manager, Qubes OS https://www.qubes-os.org -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJYMD54AAoJENtN07w5UDAw+YcQAJQ3iTflDvu1pGrHXvIYM4wo c2EkFC+jfKV+zegu2EorwweFCNOHKQCQKo5vKOWdLq03xxyiSNREsa5l3/vxyTFo Diht2cLsKMuSLtozh+Jz/1DzWA73AycVSzDGnr7c75CUyipHXud+ZeM1BZNM9eG3 nOnL5NdJqsRKc4sX+2F0f39Ayy8AbpPk1LqELf+AMVoq8SFNwDrrrtenV0KDcsSM UVhoYN8HO1JQKbGm8i9DYobzz/MOJ+/YFI7QwM9muvw97VmIAJwxWJesH0Hn7ua0 C+Lc//xGWp3JE3TYbUzOZezj9JHHh0sz1bdJYc55WlQHY6vwJ5OYzb5RfTNgcFMG rKp6Q2mLhYVrYFKdznx5tFsr57HF0YEC4AJtfkSGVYM0H8rYBTxPKwbRTS4KE0pl F6GNzWgNwA041fUNzpeIcTZdv8DcV9MO07+7sSw4q7VtrdCMhcAEUs+RFgG7yMJG B8+SCz07Srj5YSVvBMr1+m5XAaFiXdFEqg+w3qjdJDByYQOqUTGod7wyn9bbS5Jq WlZvyaVOa2dCy3PVrdlxesc+5WZMf1T/Y+4oXTfiTk6hQA/LConenvWibn3AMqfE 6Cmwm5w735rdcyvjCE/7uo0ZacSnuWGQkUkQtOr981mSAwZZxtZAqx3qxI3KLp5W z/uVRyCjR3gxQNJOhgE/ =uZNq -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/7446be8f-9fd1-434a-0ef1-8ab48b497466%40qubes-os.org. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
the desktop mobo i bought was because it had txt and vt-d specified as enabled by default in the manual. So I didn't even need the picture lol. but imo thats what to look for. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/e458374c-e085-43e4-833f-d130a4ca5f54%40googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
You don't always have to buy the newest computer. I wouldn't recommend doing that for a linux system. I built an i5 desktop for qubes I expect it to last for years to come. I would say a i7 for laptop though, just check what people say about the model on linux forums. or what they have listed if they use it in their profiles. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/681fa5b8-427b-40fd-8c09-9e277408d4b4%40googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
On Wednesday, November 16, 2016 at 5:36:06 AM UTC-5, Achim Patzner wrote: > Am 15.11.2016 um 14:46 schrieb Andrew David Wong: > > If you plan to be using the same machines for Qubes 4.x, you should > > also take into consideration the updated requirements for > > Qubes-certified hardware, which will go into effect for 4.x: > > https://www.qubes-os.org/news/2016/07/21/new-hw-certification-for-q4/ > > These requirements are probably the worst you can do for corporate > users; they prefer "standard hardware"; even I would rather stop using > Qubes than not being able to take any off-the-shelf Lenovo systems but > having to use underperforming boxes from unknown sources. Keep in mind > that the average company doesn't like hardware with broad maintenance > contracts and won't buy outdated designs (and that's about every system > supported by coreboot) either. > > > Achim someone linked a laptop here the other day looked good for qubes. like yesterday or day before forget what it was. had a picture in the manual of vt-d enabled. seems the same board used in a couple diff brand laptops. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/1bd132ff-7b08-47a1-97b3-3d17d092eeaf%40googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
On Wednesday, November 16, 2016 at 5:02:36 AM UTC-5, tai...@gmx.com wrote: > I have purchased systems that had just that but the proprietary bios > still did not properly implement the iommu. > > This is considered a "pro" level technology and you are generally SOL if > you buy a consumer level laptop (even some "enterprise" ones) - If you > don't care about ME the best choice would be a dell business (latitude > or precision) laptop with ProSupport so you can get someone on the phone > who speaks english, isn't a moron and is able to escalate problems to > the engineering team in case you have any problems such as bad DMAR tables. > > FYI - "VT-d" is IOMMU with the AMD marketing name of AMD-Vi - it is not > an intel technology. > On 11/15/2016 10:45 PM, raahe...@gmail.com wrote: > > On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 7:44:53 PM UTC-5, pixel fairy wrote: > >> On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 8:46:51 AM UTC-5, Andrew David Wong wrote: > >>> As far as I'm aware, any laptop with VT-x should be able to handle a > >>> Windows VMs, and in general, most laptops comes with Windows. So, you're > >>> basically just looking for a laptop that has good Qubes compatibility. > >>> Take a look at the following: > >> a sad trend now is laptops that are bios locked to only run windows. > >> > >> id also like to find a vendor that will still give us support and coverage > >> on hardware issues, like ibm did before lenovo took over. > > what I always suggest is to buy one that has a manual to view all the > > specifications. Preferably where you can see bios pictures in the manual. > > And for Qubes I always suggest one where you can see VT-d is enabled in the > > picture. or if it says its enabled by default then you are good to go for > > sure. TO get the full security benefits. > > this is why you find the picture of it preferably "enabled" in the manual before you buy it. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/d3de969f-5f7c-464d-ac69-d1f80808b363%40googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
so far dell is the only company thats said yes to this, but no one ive talked to has actually tried qubes. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/2613ee8e-3f79-4f71-8a13-f9c0637afec3%40googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
If you really do belong to some massive enterprise I am sure your dell/hpe/whatever rep will be able to give you a yes/no answer on what laptops support IOMMU. There is no "uncertainty", if it supports linux plus IOMMU and SLAT or RVI (any recent cpu) it supports qubes. Ask your rep and get it writing then buy one and test it. Having coreboot with FSP is pointless, you shouldn't bother with that. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/18cb5414-a6c1-733f-da4b-be79af45f2e1%40gmx.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
Am 16.11.2016 um 11:53 schrieb taii...@gmx.com: The "certified" program is stupid in its current form I agree but what is stopping you from buying a dell business or hpe machine with iommu/TPM and using that? The uncertainty whether it will work with Qubes 4.0 at all as it is very improbable that it will support coreboot. And many companies require hardware fulfilling all requirements of the software they are planning to use so this will kill Qubes for them. If you want a new open source firmware machine that supports adv. virtualization go hit up IBM, they'll happily sell you a high performance OpenPOWER8 system with just that, complete with a nice fat enterprise grade extended support maintenance contract. Can I carry it around with me? I once had a SparcBook... Nice thing, that. Coreboot is hobbyist/embedded pretty much, That's the problem. Requiring it will exclude many from using Qubes. And a disclaimer "Qubes 4.0 might also work on EFI or even legacy firmware" isn nor enough reassurance. the reason that only "outdated" designs are supported is because intel (and now AMD) actively tries to stop free firmware and people are mostly doing this on their spare time - it boils down to an issue of funding. I don't care for the reason. There is no applicable "serious" hardware fulfilling the requirement so I cannot seriously try to move Qubes into corporate environments. Which will in the end severely restrictspreading of Qubes. Achim -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/9f84a708-565a-bbd3-516f-988560059d5e%40noses.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
The "certified" program is stupid in its current form I agree but what is stopping you from buying a dell business or hpe machine with iommu/TPM and using that? Nobody says you have to buy stuff from whatever company gives kickbacks. (purism "coreboot" with FSP is just a shimboot loader, FSP does all the work so it is far from secure or open source and it still has ME - dishonest) If you want a new open source firmware machine that supports adv. virtualization go hit up IBM, they'll happily sell you a high performance OpenPOWER8 system with just that, complete with a nice fat enterprise grade extended support maintenance contract. Coreboot is hobbyist/embedded pretty much, the reason that only "outdated" designs are supported is because intel (and now AMD) actively tries to stop free firmware and people are mostly doing this on their spare time - it boils down to an issue of funding. If there were wealthy backers there'd be TALOS type machines on store shelves complete with a "coreboot + linux" sticker on the front Just remember that lenovo is not exactly trustworthy, 4x bios rootkits in the past few years and they're owned by the PRC - the us government no longer buys them for classified operations computing. On 11/16/2016 05:35 AM, Achim Patzner wrote: Am 15.11.2016 um 14:46 schrieb Andrew David Wong: If you plan to be using the same machines for Qubes 4.x, you should also take into consideration the updated requirements for Qubes-certified hardware, which will go into effect for 4.x: https://www.qubes-os.org/news/2016/07/21/new-hw-certification-for-q4/ These requirements are probably the worst you can do for corporate users; they prefer "standard hardware"; even I would rather stop using Qubes than not being able to take any off-the-shelf Lenovo systems but having to use underperforming boxes from unknown sources. Keep in mind that the average company doesn't like hardware with broad maintenance contracts and won't buy outdated designs (and that's about every system supported by coreboot) either. Achim -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/28553b7b-0df0-f879-2acf-c7f670ff6324%40gmx.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
Am 15.11.2016 um 14:46 schrieb Andrew David Wong: If you plan to be using the same machines for Qubes 4.x, you should also take into consideration the updated requirements for Qubes-certified hardware, which will go into effect for 4.x: https://www.qubes-os.org/news/2016/07/21/new-hw-certification-for-q4/ These requirements are probably the worst you can do for corporate users; they prefer "standard hardware"; even I would rather stop using Qubes than not being able to take any off-the-shelf Lenovo systems but having to use underperforming boxes from unknown sources. Keep in mind that the average company doesn't like hardware with broad maintenance contracts and won't buy outdated designs (and that's about every system supported by coreboot) either. Achim -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/db901ce2-ac2b-69e7-5204-52b978500373%40noses.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
I have purchased systems that had just that but the proprietary bios still did not properly implement the iommu. This is considered a "pro" level technology and you are generally SOL if you buy a consumer level laptop (even some "enterprise" ones) - If you don't care about ME the best choice would be a dell business (latitude or precision) laptop with ProSupport so you can get someone on the phone who speaks english, isn't a moron and is able to escalate problems to the engineering team in case you have any problems such as bad DMAR tables. FYI - "VT-d" is IOMMU with the AMD marketing name of AMD-Vi - it is not an intel technology. On 11/15/2016 10:45 PM, raahe...@gmail.com wrote: On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 7:44:53 PM UTC-5, pixel fairy wrote: On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 8:46:51 AM UTC-5, Andrew David Wong wrote: As far as I'm aware, any laptop with VT-x should be able to handle a Windows VMs, and in general, most laptops comes with Windows. So, you're basically just looking for a laptop that has good Qubes compatibility. Take a look at the following: a sad trend now is laptops that are bios locked to only run windows. id also like to find a vendor that will still give us support and coverage on hardware issues, like ibm did before lenovo took over. what I always suggest is to buy one that has a manual to view all the specifications. Preferably where you can see bios pictures in the manual. And for Qubes I always suggest one where you can see VT-d is enabled in the picture. or if it says its enabled by default then you are good to go for sure. TO get the full security benefits. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/45781e23-4ae6-4654-5b0e-53c841bcd320%40gmx.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 2:46:51 PM UTC+1, Andrew David Wong wrote: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA512 > > On 2016-11-15 03:52, pixel fairy wrote: > > management is interested in qubes, but still need windows for some tasks. > > this means buying a laptop that comes with windows, but still can run qubes > > well. any recommendations? any license issues to be aware of? > > > > As far as I'm aware, any laptop with VT-x should be able to handle a Windows > VMs, and in general, most laptops comes with Windows. So, you're basically > just looking for a laptop that has good Qubes compatibility. Take a look at > the following: > > System Requirements: https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/system-requirements/ > Hardware Compatibility List (HCL): https://www.qubes-os.org/hcl/ > > If you plan to be using the same machines for Qubes 4.x, you should also take > into consideration the updated requirements for Qubes-certified hardware, > which will go into effect for 4.x: > > https://www.qubes-os.org/news/2016/07/21/new-hw-certification-for-q4/ > > Licensing is a tricky issue. I'm not sure whether the Windows license allows > you to clone Windows VMs or to run multiple Windows AppVMs from a single > Windows TemplateHVM. That's a question for the lawyers. Maybe others around > here have information about it. > > - -- > Andrew David Wong (Axon) > Community Manager, Qubes OS > https://www.qubes-os.org Just to throw it out there. Lenovo has recently tried to lock down their laptops and prevent you from installing any Linux on them. You may run into significantly more problems if you take one of these Microsoft Signature PCs. https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/53ri0m/warning_microsoft_signature_pc_program_now/ https://mspoweruser.com/lenovo-denies-blocking-linux-windows-10-pcs/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/b740a380-a8f4-4e52-9b35-a2d2ec10f78c%40googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 10:45:06 PM UTC-5, raah...@gmail.com wrote: > On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 7:44:53 PM UTC-5, pixel fairy wrote: > > On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 8:46:51 AM UTC-5, Andrew David Wong wrote: > > > > > > As far as I'm aware, any laptop with VT-x should be able to handle a > > > Windows VMs, and in general, most laptops comes with Windows. So, you're > > > basically just looking for a laptop that has good Qubes compatibility. > > > Take a look at the following: > > > > a sad trend now is laptops that are bios locked to only run windows. > > > > id also like to find a vendor that will still give us support and coverage > > on hardware issues, like ibm did before lenovo took over. > > what I always suggest is to buy one that has a manual to view all the > specifications. Preferably where you can see bios pictures in the manual. > And for Qubes I always suggest one where you can see VT-d is enabled in the > picture. or if it says its enabled by default then you are good to go for > sure. TO get the full security benefits. do see how it performs, you can search the model on linux forums, see if linux users use it, then you are good to go. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/bd6b02ea-24ee-43cc-9075-73b804a13d68%40googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 7:44:53 PM UTC-5, pixel fairy wrote: > On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 8:46:51 AM UTC-5, Andrew David Wong wrote: > > > > As far as I'm aware, any laptop with VT-x should be able to handle a > > Windows VMs, and in general, most laptops comes with Windows. So, you're > > basically just looking for a laptop that has good Qubes compatibility. Take > > a look at the following: > > a sad trend now is laptops that are bios locked to only run windows. > > id also like to find a vendor that will still give us support and coverage on > hardware issues, like ibm did before lenovo took over. what I always suggest is to buy one that has a manual to view all the specifications. Preferably where you can see bios pictures in the manual. And for Qubes I always suggest one where you can see VT-d is enabled in the picture. or if it says its enabled by default then you are good to go for sure. TO get the full security benefits. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/d27e840c-a922-4580-818b-0ed56d4d5658%40googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 at 8:46:51 AM UTC-5, Andrew David Wong wrote: > > As far as I'm aware, any laptop with VT-x should be able to handle a Windows > VMs, and in general, most laptops comes with Windows. So, you're basically > just looking for a laptop that has good Qubes compatibility. Take a look at > the following: a sad trend now is laptops that are bios locked to only run windows. id also like to find a vendor that will still give us support and coverage on hardware issues, like ibm did before lenovo took over. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/0e98ab87-ba5f-4e1b-9530-2e25c1ab390d%40googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
On Tue, Nov 15, 2016 at 03:39:15PM +0100, Zrubi wrote: > On 11/15/2016 02:46 PM, Andrew David Wong wrote: > > > Licensing is a tricky issue. I'm not sure whether the Windows license > > allows you to clone Windows VMs or to run multiple Windows AppVMs from a > > single Windows TemplateHVM. That's a question for the lawyers. Maybe others > > around here have information about it. > > If we are talking about a normal (OEM) desktop license you are allowed > to RUN a SINGLE instance of windows VM. > > This means you are fine with running a single HVM instance. > > > Because of windows OS licencing is bound to the hardware. In case of > qubes, the hardware is a virtual one. Moreover if you are try to run a > template based windows you will face a technical issue You can't > activate your windows permanently, because: > > - activate the template itself > One may think that this should be ok. and it is. Your template will be > activated - but You only use the template for OS updates. Once you start > an AppVM based on this template, that's gonna be a NEW virtual hardware > which will break the activation. > > - activate the AppVM > You can do it for sure. However you have to do it on EVERY startup. Not > sure how many activation will be tolerated by Microsoft. > > > Conclusion: > Windows is not designed to be run as a template based VM. > > > > -- > Zrubi This is true for oem licenses. It would be possible to acquire an add-on under Software Assurance and run up to 4VMs, and that is probably the best route to follow for template based Windows qubes. In a business environment this might already be available. N.B, if you want to connect to MS server products from multiple VMs that could open a separate can of worms. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/20161115151758.GB21534%40thirdeyesecurity.org. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
On 11/15/2016 02:46 PM, Andrew David Wong wrote: > Licensing is a tricky issue. I'm not sure whether the Windows license allows > you to clone Windows VMs or to run multiple Windows AppVMs from a single > Windows TemplateHVM. That's a question for the lawyers. Maybe others around > here have information about it. If we are talking about a normal (OEM) desktop license you are allowed to RUN a SINGLE instance of windows VM. This means you are fine with running a single HVM instance. Because of windows OS licencing is bound to the hardware. In case of qubes, the hardware is a virtual one. Moreover if you are try to run a template based windows you will face a technical issue You can't activate your windows permanently, because: - activate the template itself One may think that this should be ok. and it is. Your template will be activated - but You only use the template for OS updates. Once you start an AppVM based on this template, that's gonna be a NEW virtual hardware which will break the activation. - activate the AppVM You can do it for sure. However you have to do it on EVERY startup. Not sure how many activation will be tolerated by Microsoft. Conclusion: Windows is not designed to be run as a template based VM. -- Zrubi -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/cd40817b-6a1b-06dd-4ea8-4939b13616c9%40zrubi.hu. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: [qubes-users] recommendation for a laptop to use windows in qubes?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 On 2016-11-15 03:52, pixel fairy wrote: > management is interested in qubes, but still need windows for some tasks. > this means buying a laptop that comes with windows, but still can run qubes > well. any recommendations? any license issues to be aware of? > As far as I'm aware, any laptop with VT-x should be able to handle a Windows VMs, and in general, most laptops comes with Windows. So, you're basically just looking for a laptop that has good Qubes compatibility. Take a look at the following: System Requirements: https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/system-requirements/ Hardware Compatibility List (HCL): https://www.qubes-os.org/hcl/ If you plan to be using the same machines for Qubes 4.x, you should also take into consideration the updated requirements for Qubes-certified hardware, which will go into effect for 4.x: https://www.qubes-os.org/news/2016/07/21/new-hw-certification-for-q4/ Licensing is a tricky issue. I'm not sure whether the Windows license allows you to clone Windows VMs or to run multiple Windows AppVMs from a single Windows TemplateHVM. That's a question for the lawyers. Maybe others around here have information about it. - -- Andrew David Wong (Axon) Community Manager, Qubes OS https://www.qubes-os.org -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJYKxG1AAoJENtN07w5UDAw0K8QAL6Be8uc70CalsVbMGR1A49y rbf12cEp9kcaQdJl0zaGJhoD+UEGA3PbiSWDb2BwryMOyHPHdNLPysmVPDiE4NSh gtFJbxxeXI9EoR1gm2TQewrkEMSYhQWPkGoRLZ5otWQuAmCLEtBcT7nrKKQXkENP ZmmnjIjtYHXNAPL9Pcs5UMwBkuipQFEYQluXyn/cW7248qKupq4fgcNnU7R1kaKi vIWHBHlZUvYtZwjM+dYrcn5tSAN56iioIcdFngl6UtzHIObKXX3olENtVQHPSEvu cjkOic9EyHs+n9RiKLqyRzGH5E++OJBvW+doju1oURGbqSCugXWOa7ApdwqTZqeO Z4E/FCLExuL+sUEWBDIvAAH2fT7IclOoXPtEoTiLbi76isKO38F7YiC+RyoraJZM RaHTSPsZzYoEOwkzS1gqiw83kSFiKsRJO6ko/H7feGshDmHht1fW/D7JfJ9qrZ7a /oc63EmcqIYr5dAl3LIEebcJaG+QZsbVKNB+oVqAwN1uq2BKHRfVnNmEzbUyByCV AYv65IoPYYV5N3RcTKfLCc8/wPWXZw445K4kPg5SXUNjTr2UGp6WX7bYhnQpWJre vvs8jn9UNDtOEXwiK/5B0gx6PKpGoW8Q75n771Ti5yOMPbPzvCK7mWB/nr4lMp20 VhLBMNEItM8JRIC9taq+ =lTFN -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "qubes-users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to qubes-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to qubes-users@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/4cdc9b09-77c3-a924-8c3d-fe26e28a71e8%40qubes-os.org. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
