At 16:06 09/01/06, Gabor Grothendieck wrote:
[snip various earlier posts]
In addition to books, the various manuals, contributed documents and
mailing list archives, all of which one should review,
the key thing to do if you want to really learn R is to read source code
and lots of it. I think
At 20:12 08/01/06, Jack Tanner wrote:
Philippe's idea to start a wiki that grows out of the content on
http://zoonek2.free.fr/UNIX/48_R/all.html is really great. Here's why.
My hypothesis is that the basic reason that people ask questions on R-help
rather than first looking elsewhere is that
On Mon, 9 Jan 2006, Michael Dewey wrote:
Further to that I feel that (perhaps because they do not like to blow their
own trumpet too much) the authors of books on R do not stress how much most
questioners could gain by buying and reading at least one of the many books
on R. When I started I
On 1/9/06, Thomas Lumley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, 9 Jan 2006, Michael Dewey wrote:
Further to that I feel that (perhaps because they do not like to blow their
own trumpet too much) the authors of books on R do not stress how much most
questioners could gain by buying and reading
To avoid spam on the R wikis pages:
If we assume that anyone who we would want to be empowered to modify the R
wiki pages is an R-user, would it be possible to somehow incorporate a function
into the next R release which provides a user with a key/password?
A new R function would generate a
On Mon, 9 Jan 2006, Gabor Grothendieck wrote:
On 1/9/06, Thomas Lumley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, 9 Jan 2006, Michael Dewey wrote:
Further to that I feel that (perhaps because they do not like to blow
their
own trumpet too much) the authors of books on R do not stress how
Michael Dewey wrote:
At 20:12 08/01/06, Jack Tanner wrote:
My hypothesis is that the basic reason that people ask questions on R-help
rather than first looking elsewhere is that looking elsewhere doesn't get
them the info they need.
People think in terms of the tasks they have to do. The
On 1/9/06, Jack Tanner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Michael Dewey wrote:
At 20:12 08/01/06, Jack Tanner wrote:
My hypothesis is that the basic reason that people ask questions on R-help
rather than first looking elsewhere is that looking elsewhere doesn't get
them the info they need.
People
On Monday 09 January 2006 11:31, Gabor Grothendieck wrote:
. . .
I certainly was not disparaging books. I said _in addition to_ books,
not _insted of_. The reason I pointed this out is that I think
most people already read the books. What many people don't
do as far as can tell is read
On Sat, 7 Jan 2006 13:51:24 -0500
Jonathan Baron [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 01/07/06 12:25, Dirk Eddelbuettel wrote:
So my $0.02 would be to a) go for it, if possible but b) make it
visible, and closely tied to R Core / CRAN / R News / Which
poses the chicken/egg problem of people
Kris over at Wiki That! has a post today about what makes for a good
wiki: http://www.wikithat.com/wiki_that/2006/01/wiki_of_the_wee_1.html
Most wikis I’ve looked at are in danger of facing the same fate as
most websites and CMS - death by boredom. They are focused on
content that is
Hello all,
Sorry for not taking part of this discussion earlier, and for not
answering Detlef Steuer, Martin Maechler, and others that asked more
direct questions to me. I am away from my office and my computer until the
16th of January.
Just quick and partial answers:
1) I did not know about
Philippe's idea to start a wiki that grows out of the content on
http://zoonek2.free.fr/UNIX/48_R/all.html is really great. Here's why.
My hypothesis is that the basic reason that people ask questions on R-help
rather than first looking elsewhere is that looking elsewhere doesn't get
them the
On 1/6/2006 8:02 PM, paul sorenson wrote:
I am a fan of wiki's and I reckon it would really help with making R
more accessible. On one extreme you have this email list and on the
other extreme you have RNews and the PDF's on CRAN. A wiki might hit
the spot between them and reduce the
Several people have stated that one of the problems with the current Email help
model is that many questions are asked over, and over again and that people do
not search for past answers. Let me point out that the existence of past
answers and how to find and search is not known by many people,
On 01/07/06 10:51, John Sorkin wrote:
The situation
would be greatly helped if the mailing list would automatically add a header
or
footer to all Email messages giving the URL of the archived Email threads.
Don't
expect people to know that what are not told! Those people who, in their
Jon,
Thank you for the terse form of the URL. I hope the mailing list will
automatically include it in there Email messages.
John
John Sorkin M.D., Ph.D.
Chief, Biostatistics and Informatics
Baltimore VA Medical Center GRECC and
University of Maryland School of Medicine Claude Pepper OAIC
Jonathan Baron wrote:
On 01/07/06 10:51, John Sorkin wrote:
The situation
would be greatly helped if the mailing list would automatically add a header
or
footer to all Email messages giving the URL of the archived Email threads.
Don't
expect people to know that what are not told! Those
Uwe,
I think you suggestion for giving the URL of the archives as,
cran-MIRROR/search.html (emphasis added) is not optimal, because the URL as
does not work. The URL given should work as given. Thus,
http://cran.us.r-project.org/search.html
http://www.stats.bris.ac.uk/R/search.html
or
The trouble with a fixed link is that either that server gets overloaded
or one has to post to a list of servers which is a nuisance. Perhaps
this could be included at the bottom of each post instead:
Before posting, search docs for xyz via R command: RSiteSearch(xyz)
and if you still need to
On 7 January 2006 at 10:15, Duncan Murdoch wrote:
| The difficulty is getting it going.
Right. Which goes along with 'needs official endorsement'. Debian recently
moved a more-or-less grassroots wiki to an official domain of the project,
and for the last few days I have been hitting
On 7 January 2006 at 17:14, Uwe Ligges wrote:
| Jonathan Baron wrote:
| Or, more tersely, http://cran.r-project.org/search.html.
|
| But then, everybody loads stuff from CRAN master and does not use an
Round-robin DNS to spread the load among several machines answering for
cran.r-project.org
On 01/07/06 12:25, Dirk Eddelbuettel wrote:
So my $0.02 would be to a) go for it, if possible but b) make it visible, and
closely tied to R Core / CRAN / R News / Which poses the chicken/egg
problem of people running out of spare time to setup, admin, monitor,
hand-hold the wiki, its
Frank E Harrell Jr wrote:
paul sorenson wrote:
I am a fan of wiki's and I reckon it would really help with making R
more accessible. On one extreme you have this email list and on the
other extreme you have RNews and the PDF's on CRAN. A wiki might hit
the spot between them and reduce
I agree.
In desperation at my inbox being swamped by messages I contacted the R-core team
to ask about other solutions. They recommended gmane.org who compile a
web-viewable archive of thousands of email lists - it even provides RSS feeds
for new topics.
Going back to the wiki issue, it might be
John Marsland writes:
Trac would have the advantage of pushing questions on the R list back towards
the actual source code and allowing all users to participate in the future
development of the software.
I see that this could be useful for R-devel, but considering the
volume of
On 01/06/06 13:40, John Marsland wrote:
Going back to the wiki issue, it might be wise to this about using Trac
http://projects.edgewall.com/trac/ which is an open source project that
integrates a wiki with the SVN code versioning system (used by R-project) and
a
replacement for bugzilla's
On 1/6/06, John Marsland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I see your point. Maybe the answer is to use the list for R-help style
questions, but encourage people who answer questions to point the the
answers in the wiki - which they might have enhanced if necessary.
On 1/6/06, Fernando Henrique Ferraz
It isn't so much that users modify the code as they would have to do
that in the usual way by checking out the project from the SVN.
Rather that extended documentation, features and enhancements etc. can
easily locate and quote from the code base and the differencing engine
as applied to the code
Jonathan Baron wrote:
And I was thinking of setting up a Wiki with one page per
function. (Given that there are now hundreds or thousands of
functions, setting this up would have to be automated.)
One page per R manual page file would probably suffice. You could do
something along the
On 1/6/2006 9:15 AM, Jonathan Baron wrote:
On 01/06/06 13:40, John Marsland wrote:
Going back to the wiki issue, it might be wise to this about using Trac
http://projects.edgewall.com/trac/ which is an open source project that
integrates a wiki with the SVN code versioning system (used by
Regarding systems for presenting documentation and allowing user
comments, I recently came across Commentary (see homepage
http://pythonpaste.org/commentary/).
Haven't used it, but my impression is that comments and the main doc
are both stored in svn (and auto-committed for comment changes).
I second Frank's comment! I wonder if questioners who receive a bunch
of useful replies could be encouraged to enter a summary of those on a
Wiki, in much the same way as users of S-news were expected to post a
summary of their answers as a way of giving something back.
An existing R Wiki is
I don't have any significant experience with wikis, but I have yet to
use any discussion board that was anywhere near as useful to me, or
as easy to use, as an email list.
Discussion boards have a web browser interface. Typically, they
display at most a dozen topics at a time. Scrolling to get
I am a fan of wiki's and I reckon it would really help with making R
more accessible. On one extreme you have this email list and on the
other extreme you have RNews and the PDF's on CRAN. A wiki might hit
the spot between them and reduce the traffic on the email list.
Frank E Harrell Jr
I feel that as long as people continue to provide help on r-help wikis
will not be successful. I think we need to move to a central wiki or
discussion board and to move away from e-mail. People are extremely
helpful but e-mail seems to be to always be memory-less and messages get
too long
Frank makes an intersting point. For those interested, A site I spend
quite a bit of time on for Linux related stuff is IMHO really well done.
There are fora for many different linux distrubtions. There is a wiki,
a collection of tutorials, etc. If you want to take a look, the url is
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