Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter
Hadley, Thanks and I know many such things exist. I simply found it interesting that what was mentioned seemed simpler as just being a converter of text to make a bitmap type image. Now if I want a simulated image of a cat riding a motorcycle while holding an Esperanto Flag, sure, I would not easily do it directly or even in a standard programming language. Of course I may have misunderstood "text" to mean the actual text, as compared to a somewhat natural language description using text. R does not easily do that. Then again, there are ways to connect your R program to the Wolfram Knowledge base to pass through natural language queries ... Avi -Original Message- From: Hadley Wickham Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2023 6:10 PM To: avi.e.gr...@gmail.com Cc: Jim Lemon ; Ebert,Timothy Aaron ; R-help Subject: Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter > I am not sure what your example means but text to image conversion can be > done quite easily in many programming environments and does not need an AI > unless you are using it to hunt for info. I mean you can open up many Paint > or Photo programs and look at the menus and often one allows you to write > using whatever font/size/color/background you want to add a layer on the > image. There are plenty of free resources on-line that I sometimes use to > write something in a large fiery font or whatever and when I get the result > I want, I save it as graphics. I would recommend you try out one of the many text-to-image AI services like https://www.midjourney.com/ or https://openai.com/dall-e-2. These services are much more sophisticated than you might imagine. Hadley -- http://hadley.nz __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter
> I am not sure what your example means but text to image conversion can be > done quite easily in many programming environments and does not need an AI > unless you are using it to hunt for info. I mean you can open up many Paint > or Photo programs and look at the menus and often one allows you to write > using whatever font/size/color/background you want to add a layer on the > image. There are plenty of free resources on-line that I sometimes use to > write something in a large fiery font or whatever and when I get the result > I want, I save it as graphics. I would recommend you try out one of the many text-to-image AI services like https://www.midjourney.com/ or https://openai.com/dall-e-2. These services are much more sophisticated than you might imagine. Hadley -- http://hadley.nz __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter
I was thinking that text-to-image conversion was something like NightCafe (https://creator.nightcafe.studio/) which is very much AI and not something I know how to do with Paint or Photoshop. -Original Message- From: avi.e.gr...@gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2023 2:34 PM To: 'Jim Lemon' ; Ebert,Timothy Aaron Cc: 'R-help' Subject: RE: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter [External Email] Jim, I am not sure what your example means but text to image conversion can be done quite easily in many programming environments and does not need an AI unless you are using it to hunt for info. I mean you can open up many Paint or Photo programs and look at the menus and often one allows you to write using whatever font/size/color/background you want to add a layer on the image. There are plenty of free resources on-line that I sometimes use to write something in a large fiery font or whatever and when I get the result I want, I save it as graphics. If you mean that you found something other than a human who would listen to you and maybe ask a few questions and then do it for you, good for you. Since most people are not programmers, there is plenty of room for that kind of thing. Although R is not particularly designed to do what you are saying, a quick search indicates plenty of packages using R for this kind of thing. What gets me is an AI can do one of several things. It may give you a result and you take it or leave it. Or, it can look around at the internet and knowledge bases and throw a program at you, perhaps in R, and you would then need to validate if it makes sense given your knowledge about R. If it gave you a program in a language you did not know, would you blindly try using it? To be fair, many years ago the barrier was higher. To figure out what a function did, or even find such a function, often meant reading through copious amounts of reference books, or lots of existing code looking for an example of such use, or ask someone who might have to do the same. Often you ended up writing code using other more primitive commands that did what you wanted. Obviously internet searches and other tools and the vast number of people who are sharing this kind of info, make this easier. In some ways, an AI can do much of the searching for you but with results that may be surprising. -Original Message- From: R-help On Behalf Of Jim Lemon Sent: Monday, July 17, 2023 7:24 PM To: Ebert,Timothy Aaron Cc: R-help Subject: Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter I haven't really focused on the statistical capabilities of AI, that marriage of massive memory and associative learning. I am impressed by its ability to perform text-to-image conversion, something I have recently needed. My artistic ability is that of the average three year old, yet I can employ AI to translate my mental images into realistic pictures. Perhaps we really are learning about how we think. As far as I am aware, it just does what we tell it to do. Like other tools, it is as good or bad as the user. Jim __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.r-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter
Jim, I am not sure what your example means but text to image conversion can be done quite easily in many programming environments and does not need an AI unless you are using it to hunt for info. I mean you can open up many Paint or Photo programs and look at the menus and often one allows you to write using whatever font/size/color/background you want to add a layer on the image. There are plenty of free resources on-line that I sometimes use to write something in a large fiery font or whatever and when I get the result I want, I save it as graphics. If you mean that you found something other than a human who would listen to you and maybe ask a few questions and then do it for you, good for you. Since most people are not programmers, there is plenty of room for that kind of thing. Although R is not particularly designed to do what you are saying, a quick search indicates plenty of packages using R for this kind of thing. What gets me is an AI can do one of several things. It may give you a result and you take it or leave it. Or, it can look around at the internet and knowledge bases and throw a program at you, perhaps in R, and you would then need to validate if it makes sense given your knowledge about R. If it gave you a program in a language you did not know, would you blindly try using it? To be fair, many years ago the barrier was higher. To figure out what a function did, or even find such a function, often meant reading through copious amounts of reference books, or lots of existing code looking for an example of such use, or ask someone who might have to do the same. Often you ended up writing code using other more primitive commands that did what you wanted. Obviously internet searches and other tools and the vast number of people who are sharing this kind of info, make this easier. In some ways, an AI can do much of the searching for you but with results that may be surprising. -Original Message- From: R-help On Behalf Of Jim Lemon Sent: Monday, July 17, 2023 7:24 PM To: Ebert,Timothy Aaron Cc: R-help Subject: Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter I haven't really focused on the statistical capabilities of AI, that marriage of massive memory and associative learning. I am impressed by its ability to perform text-to-image conversion, something I have recently needed. My artistic ability is that of the average three year old, yet I can employ AI to translate my mental images into realistic pictures. Perhaps we really are learning about how we think. As far as I am aware, it just does what we tell it to do. Like other tools, it is as good or bad as the user. Jim __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter
Just to bring it back to R, I want to point out that what many R programmers do is not that different. If you develop some skills at analyzing some kinds of data and have a sort of toolchest based on past work, then a new project along similar lines may move very quickly. After a while, you may put out a package that allows even novices to do a decent job as the code handles so many of the details or provides default options you can over-ride. So if an AI has the ability to use the same tools you provided, and applies them properly, is there much difference? I have seen EXPERTS do horribly when yanked just outside their field of expertise. They may use a tool outside the bounds it was designed for, as an example, or pick an unfamiliar model that is not applicable or optimal. The problem with AI is compounded as some kinds of peer feedback may be missing while other things have not yet been programmed well that allow some selectivity and so on. But if a simple regression often works well enough, why can't an AI use it too? I will say a lot of what people do in R is cleaning the data and getting it into the right form. Sometimes humans struggle to detect if say two names are the same and someone made a spelling mistake. And humans will still get things like that wrong unless they can go back and consult external resources to see if say the school has two teachers with similar names or whether all the students named should be combined under the same teacher for some purposes. I will point out there is no good reason to think an Ai would necessarily use R or use base R rather than some of the functions in the tidyverse. I am studying Wolfram and an amazing amount of work can be done in one liners that rely on many thousands of built-in functionality. So why would you want an AI to write assembly code or do it in a language like C but rather pick a language well suited for whatever task. -Original Message- From: R-help On Behalf Of Spencer Graves Sent: Monday, July 17, 2023 3:13 PM To: Bert Gunter ; R-help Subject: Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter I don't know about ChatGPT, but Daniel Kahneman won the 2002 Nobel Memorial Prize in Economics,[1] even though he's not an economist, for his leadership in creating a new subfield in the intersection of human psychology and economics now called "behavioral economics".[2] Then in 2009 Kahneman and Gary Klein published an article on, "Conditions for intuitive expertise: a failure to disagree", which concluded that expert intuition is learned from frequent, rapid, high-quality feedback. People you do not learn from frequent, rapid, high-quality feedback can be beaten by simple heuristics developed by intelligent lay people.[3] That includes most professions, which Kahneman Sibony and Sunstein call "respect-experts". Kahneman Sibony and Sunstein further report that with a little data, a regression model can outperform a simple heuristic, and with massive amounts of data, artificial intelligence can outperform regression models.[4] An extreme but real example of current reality was describe in an article on "Asylum roulette": With asylum judges in the same jurisdiction with cases assigned at random, one judge approved 5 percent of cases while another approved 88 percent.[5] However, virtually all "respect-experts" are influenced in their judgements by time of day and whether their favorite sports team won or lost the previous day. That level of noise can be reduced dramatically by use of appropriate artificial intelligence. Comments? Spencer Graves [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Kahneman [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_economics [3] https://www.researchgate.net/publication/26798603_Conditions_for_Intuitive_Expertise_A_Failure_to_Disagree [4] Daniel Kahneman; Olivier Sibony; Cass Sunstein (2021). Noise: A Flaw in Human Judgment (Little, Brown and Company). [5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugee_roulette On 7/17/23 1:46 PM, Bert Gunter wrote: > This is an **off-topic** post about the subject line, that I thought > might be of interest to the R Community. I hope this does not offend > anyone. > > The widely known ChatGPT software now offers what is called a "Code > Interpreter," that, among other things, purports to do "data > analysis." (Search for articles with details.) One quote, from the > (online) NY Times, is: > > "Arvind Narayanan, a professor of computer science at Princeton > University, cautioned that people should not become overly reliant on > code interpreter for data analysis as A.I. still produces inaccurate > results and misinformation. > > 'Appropriate data analysis requires just a lot of critical thinking > about the data,” he said.' " > &
Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter
The near year as Metropolis, 1927. On Tue, Jul 18, 2023, 1:27 AM Rui Barradas wrote: > Às 00:23 de 18/07/2023, Jim Lemon escreveu: > > I haven't really focused on the statistical capabilities of AI, that > > marriage of massive memory and associative learning. I am impressed by > > its ability to perform text-to-image conversion, something I have > > recently needed. My artistic ability is that of the average three year > > old, yet I can employ AI to translate my mental images into realistic > > pictures. Perhaps we really are learning about how we think. As far as > > I am aware, it just does what we tell it to do. Like other tools, it > > is as good or bad as the user. > > > > Jim > > > > __ > > R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see > > https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help > > PLEASE do read the posting guide > http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html > > and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. > Hello, > > Also off-topic but the date is fun: > > > A system is not a head. > Furniture is not people. > All processes and all devices, > will be useless for organizations, > if the heads of the individuals who employ them, > are not properly organized. > And these heads will be organized, > if the same part of the boss's body that directs them > is properly organized. > Just like you can write nonsense > with a latest model typewriter, > nonsense can also be done > with the most perfect systems and devices > meant to help you not to. > Systems, processes, furniture, machines, > are purely auxiliary elements. > The real process is to think. > The fundamental machine is intelligence. > > Fernando Pessoa, 1926 > > Revista de Comércio e Contabilidade, nº 4. Lisboa, 25-4-1926. > (Magazine of Commerce and Accounting, nº 4. Lisbon, 25-4-1926) > > > Rui Barradas > > __ > R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see > https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help > PLEASE do read the posting guide > http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html > and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. > [[alternative HTML version deleted]] __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter
Às 00:23 de 18/07/2023, Jim Lemon escreveu: I haven't really focused on the statistical capabilities of AI, that marriage of massive memory and associative learning. I am impressed by its ability to perform text-to-image conversion, something I have recently needed. My artistic ability is that of the average three year old, yet I can employ AI to translate my mental images into realistic pictures. Perhaps we really are learning about how we think. As far as I am aware, it just does what we tell it to do. Like other tools, it is as good or bad as the user. Jim __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. Hello, Also off-topic but the date is fun: A system is not a head. Furniture is not people. All processes and all devices, will be useless for organizations, if the heads of the individuals who employ them, are not properly organized. And these heads will be organized, if the same part of the boss's body that directs them is properly organized. Just like you can write nonsense with a latest model typewriter, nonsense can also be done with the most perfect systems and devices meant to help you not to. Systems, processes, furniture, machines, are purely auxiliary elements. The real process is to think. The fundamental machine is intelligence. Fernando Pessoa, 1926 Revista de Comércio e Contabilidade, nº 4. Lisboa, 25-4-1926. (Magazine of Commerce and Accounting, nº 4. Lisbon, 25-4-1926) Rui Barradas __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter
I haven't really focused on the statistical capabilities of AI, that marriage of massive memory and associative learning. I am impressed by its ability to perform text-to-image conversion, something I have recently needed. My artistic ability is that of the average three year old, yet I can employ AI to translate my mental images into realistic pictures. Perhaps we really are learning about how we think. As far as I am aware, it just does what we tell it to do. Like other tools, it is as good or bad as the user. Jim __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter
This seems spot on, given that Paul Bernal just posted a request to fit all possible models and compare them using r-squared. The all models approach does not promote understanding about what your model is saying about the data and how the system works. Nor does it facilitate fitting the methods to best address the research goals. Tim -Original Message- From: R-help On Behalf Of Bert Gunter Sent: Monday, July 17, 2023 2:46 PM To: R-help Subject: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter [External Email] This is an **off-topic** post about the subject line, that I thought might be of interest to the R Community. I hope this does not offend anyone. The widely known ChatGPT software now offers what is called a "Code Interpreter," that, among other things, purports to do "data analysis." (Search for articles with details.) One quote, from the (online) NY Times, is: "Arvind Narayanan, a professor of computer science at Princeton University, cautioned that people should not become overly reliant on code interpreter for data analysis as A.I. still produces inaccurate results and misinformation. 'Appropriate data analysis requires just a lot of critical thinking about the data," he said.' " Amen. ... Maybe. (As this is off-topic, if you wish to reply to me, probably better to do so privately). Cheers to all, Bert __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.r-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
Re: [R] Off-topic: ChatGPT Code Interpreter
I don't know about ChatGPT, but Daniel Kahneman won the 2002 Nobel Memorial Prize in Economics,[1] even though he's not an economist, for his leadership in creating a new subfield in the intersection of human psychology and economics now called "behavioral economics".[2] Then in 2009 Kahneman and Gary Klein published an article on, "Conditions for intuitive expertise: a failure to disagree", which concluded that expert intuition is learned from frequent, rapid, high-quality feedback. People you do not learn from frequent, rapid, high-quality feedback can be beaten by simple heuristics developed by intelligent lay people.[3] That includes most professions, which Kahneman Sibony and Sunstein call "respect-experts". Kahneman Sibony and Sunstein further report that with a little data, a regression model can outperform a simple heuristic, and with massive amounts of data, artificial intelligence can outperform regression models.[4] An extreme but real example of current reality was describe in an article on "Asylum roulette": With asylum judges in the same jurisdiction with cases assigned at random, one judge approved 5 percent of cases while another approved 88 percent.[5] However, virtually all "respect-experts" are influenced in their judgements by time of day and whether their favorite sports team won or lost the previous day. That level of noise can be reduced dramatically by use of appropriate artificial intelligence. Comments? Spencer Graves [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Kahneman [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_economics [3] https://www.researchgate.net/publication/26798603_Conditions_for_Intuitive_Expertise_A_Failure_to_Disagree [4] Daniel Kahneman; Olivier Sibony; Cass Sunstein (2021). Noise: A Flaw in Human Judgment (Little, Brown and Company). [5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugee_roulette On 7/17/23 1:46 PM, Bert Gunter wrote: This is an **off-topic** post about the subject line, that I thought might be of interest to the R Community. I hope this does not offend anyone. The widely known ChatGPT software now offers what is called a "Code Interpreter," that, among other things, purports to do "data analysis." (Search for articles with details.) One quote, from the (online) NY Times, is: "Arvind Narayanan, a professor of computer science at Princeton University, cautioned that people should not become overly reliant on code interpreter for data analysis as A.I. still produces inaccurate results and misinformation. 'Appropriate data analysis requires just a lot of critical thinking about the data,” he said.' " Amen. ... Maybe. (As this is off-topic, if you wish to reply to me, probably better to do so privately). Cheers to all, Bert __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. __ R-help@r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
