Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Martin DeMello]

Yep. I was very surprised to find no scheme that compiled to native
code and had gtk bindings. Work is being done on the chicken-qt
bindings, at the least, but for the time being I've fallen back on
vala.

martin

On Sat, Sep 18, 2010 at 1:38 PM, Stephen De Gabrielle
 wrote:
> It worked ok, but I never used it to make apps.
> Ive not tried, but I suspect the real work is making a racket
> library/interface for the ui stuff.
>
> S
>
> On Saturday, September 18, 2010, Martin DeMello  
> wrote:
>> How well did it work? I've been playing with Chicken to write Maemo
>> code, which seems to work pretty well, but I figured Racket would be
>> pretty heavy for a mobile device.
>>
>> martin
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:40 PM, Stephen De Gabrielle
>>  wrote:
>>> FWIW
>>> I once used scratchbox to cross compile mzscheme to arm
>>>
>>> -wikipedia, from Maemo page ->
>>> The Maemo SDK is based around the Debian-oriented Scratchbox Cross
>>> Compilation Toolkit, which provides a sandbox environment in which
>>> development may take place. Scratchbox uses Qemu to emulate an ARM
>>> processor or sbrsh to remotely execute instructions.
>>> Scratchbox-compatible rootstraps are available for both x86 and ARM,
>>> so the majority of development and debugging takes place on x86, with
>>> final packaging being for ARM
>>> --
>>>
>>> On Thursday, September 16, 2010, Eli Barzilay  wrote:
 On Sep 15, Neil Van Dyke wrote:
> Regarding Racket building for ARM, when you need to build it often
> but ARM is relatively slow... I wonder how much work to get
> cross-compile of the Racket toolset working.

 Even if the C core part is cross compiled (there's more stuff in the
 collections), the main point is compiling and running the files on the
 machine, so cross compilation (if possible) will certainly speed
 things up, but will not make it a less-effective testing tool.

 --
           ((lambda (x) (x x)) (lambda (x) (x x)))          Eli Barzilay:
                     http://barzilay.org/                   Maze is Life!
 _
   For list-related administrative tasks:
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>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> --
>>> Stephen De Gabrielle
>>> stephen.degabrie...@acm.org
>>> Telephone +44 (0)20 85670911
>>> Mobile        +44 (0)79 85189045
>>> http://www.degabrielle.name/stephen
>>> _
>>>  For list-related administrative tasks:
>>>  http://lists.racket-lang.org/listinfo/users
>>
>
> --
>
> --
> Stephen De Gabrielle
> stephen.degabrie...@acm.org
> Telephone +44 (0)20 85670911
> Mobile        +44 (0)79 85189045
> http://www.degabrielle.name/stephen
>
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Stephen De Gabrielle]

It worked ok, but I never used it to make apps.
Ive not tried, but I suspect the real work is making a racket
library/interface for the ui stuff.

S

On Saturday, September 18, 2010, Martin DeMello  wrote:
> How well did it work? I've been playing with Chicken to write Maemo
> code, which seems to work pretty well, but I figured Racket would be
> pretty heavy for a mobile device.
>
> martin
>
> On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:40 PM, Stephen De Gabrielle
>  wrote:
>> FWIW
>> I once used scratchbox to cross compile mzscheme to arm
>>
>> -wikipedia, from Maemo page ->
>> The Maemo SDK is based around the Debian-oriented Scratchbox Cross
>> Compilation Toolkit, which provides a sandbox environment in which
>> development may take place. Scratchbox uses Qemu to emulate an ARM
>> processor or sbrsh to remotely execute instructions.
>> Scratchbox-compatible rootstraps are available for both x86 and ARM,
>> so the majority of development and debugging takes place on x86, with
>> final packaging being for ARM
>> --
>>
>> On Thursday, September 16, 2010, Eli Barzilay  wrote:
>>> On Sep 15, Neil Van Dyke wrote:
 Regarding Racket building for ARM, when you need to build it often
 but ARM is relatively slow... I wonder how much work to get
 cross-compile of the Racket toolset working.
>>>
>>> Even if the C core part is cross compiled (there's more stuff in the
>>> collections), the main point is compiling and running the files on the
>>> machine, so cross compilation (if possible) will certainly speed
>>> things up, but will not make it a less-effective testing tool.
>>>
>>> --
>>>           ((lambda (x) (x x)) (lambda (x) (x x)))          Eli Barzilay:
>>>                     http://barzilay.org/                   Maze is Life!
>>> _
>>>   For list-related administrative tasks:
>>>   http://lists.racket-lang.org/listinfo/users
>>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> --
>> Stephen De Gabrielle
>> stephen.degabrie...@acm.org
>> Telephone +44 (0)20 85670911
>> Mobile        +44 (0)79 85189045
>> http://www.degabrielle.name/stephen
>> _
>>  For list-related administrative tasks:
>>  http://lists.racket-lang.org/listinfo/users
>

-- 

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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Martin DeMello]

How well did it work? I've been playing with Chicken to write Maemo
code, which seems to work pretty well, but I figured Racket would be
pretty heavy for a mobile device.

martin

On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 10:40 PM, Stephen De Gabrielle
 wrote:
> FWIW
> I once used scratchbox to cross compile mzscheme to arm
>
> -wikipedia, from Maemo page ->
> The Maemo SDK is based around the Debian-oriented Scratchbox Cross
> Compilation Toolkit, which provides a sandbox environment in which
> development may take place. Scratchbox uses Qemu to emulate an ARM
> processor or sbrsh to remotely execute instructions.
> Scratchbox-compatible rootstraps are available for both x86 and ARM,
> so the majority of development and debugging takes place on x86, with
> final packaging being for ARM
> --
>
> On Thursday, September 16, 2010, Eli Barzilay  wrote:
>> On Sep 15, Neil Van Dyke wrote:
>>> Regarding Racket building for ARM, when you need to build it often
>>> but ARM is relatively slow... I wonder how much work to get
>>> cross-compile of the Racket toolset working.
>>
>> Even if the C core part is cross compiled (there's more stuff in the
>> collections), the main point is compiling and running the files on the
>> machine, so cross compilation (if possible) will certainly speed
>> things up, but will not make it a less-effective testing tool.
>>
>> --
>>           ((lambda (x) (x x)) (lambda (x) (x x)))          Eli Barzilay:
>>                     http://barzilay.org/                   Maze is Life!
>> _
>>   For list-related administrative tasks:
>>   http://lists.racket-lang.org/listinfo/users
>>
>
> --
>
> --
> Stephen De Gabrielle
> stephen.degabrie...@acm.org
> Telephone +44 (0)20 85670911
> Mobile        +44 (0)79 85189045
> http://www.degabrielle.name/stephen
> _
>  For list-related administrative tasks:
>  http://lists.racket-lang.org/listinfo/users
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[YC]

reading on scrtachbox it seems to cross compile for specifically for
embedded linux - is iOS based on linux?

On Thursday, September 16, 2010, Stephen De Gabrielle
 wrote:
> FWIW
> I once used scratchbox to cross compile mzscheme to arm
>
> -wikipedia, from Maemo page ->
> The Maemo SDK is based around the Debian-oriented Scratchbox Cross
> Compilation Toolkit, which provides a sandbox environment in which
> development may take place. Scratchbox uses Qemu to emulate an ARM
> processor or sbrsh to remotely execute instructions.
> Scratchbox-compatible rootstraps are available for both x86 and ARM,
> so the majority of development and debugging takes place on x86, with
> final packaging being for ARM


-- 
Cheers,
yc

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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Ramakrishnan Muthukrishnan]

On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 8:21 AM, Neil Van Dyke  wrote:
> Ah, makes sense that compilation of collections is part of the testing.
>
> There have been multicore ARMs in SMP configurations.  Maybe there's an
> option there, if someone wants to look into what's currently available and
> whether it's appropriate for the target platform.
>
> Then there's builds distributed across network hosts, if Racket were adapted
> to do that (I was thinking of something more like "parallel make", with a
> shared FS).  Hardware-wise, depending on the exact ARM target, you could
> have a big long power strip of GuruPlugs, or dev boards, or a 1U rack shelf
> with a row of target phones Velcro'd to it. :) Though that's then testing
> parallel builds rather than the normal way, unfortunately.
>
> Maybe someone can find a brilliant way that Nokia, Google, or Apple would
> fund students and equipment, that happens to include getting Racket runtime
> or DrRacket on a phone somehow.

Debian buildd builds packages for various architectures and according
to this page, ARM packages exist:

 

-- 
  Ramakrishnan
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Stephen De Gabrielle]

FWIW
I once used scratchbox to cross compile mzscheme to arm

-wikipedia, from Maemo page ->
The Maemo SDK is based around the Debian-oriented Scratchbox Cross
Compilation Toolkit, which provides a sandbox environment in which
development may take place. Scratchbox uses Qemu to emulate an ARM
processor or sbrsh to remotely execute instructions.
Scratchbox-compatible rootstraps are available for both x86 and ARM,
so the majority of development and debugging takes place on x86, with
final packaging being for ARM
--

On Thursday, September 16, 2010, Eli Barzilay  wrote:
> On Sep 15, Neil Van Dyke wrote:
>> Regarding Racket building for ARM, when you need to build it often
>> but ARM is relatively slow... I wonder how much work to get
>> cross-compile of the Racket toolset working.
>
> Even if the C core part is cross compiled (there's more stuff in the
> collections), the main point is compiling and running the files on the
> machine, so cross compilation (if possible) will certainly speed
> things up, but will not make it a less-effective testing tool.
>
> --
>           ((lambda (x) (x x)) (lambda (x) (x x)))          Eli Barzilay:
>                     http://barzilay.org/                   Maze is Life!
> _
>   For list-related administrative tasks:
>   http://lists.racket-lang.org/listinfo/users
>

-- 

--
Stephen De Gabrielle
stephen.degabrie...@acm.org
Telephone +44 (0)20 85670911
Mobile+44 (0)79 85189045
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Neil Van Dyke]

Ah, makes sense that compilation of collections is part of the testing.

There have been multicore ARMs in SMP configurations.  Maybe there's an 
option there, if someone wants to look into what's currently available 
and whether it's appropriate for the target platform.


Then there's builds distributed across network hosts, if Racket were 
adapted to do that (I was thinking of something more like "parallel 
make", with a shared FS).  Hardware-wise, depending on the exact ARM 
target, you could have a big long power strip of GuruPlugs, or dev 
boards, or a 1U rack shelf with a row of target phones Velcro'd to it. 
:) Though that's then testing parallel builds rather than the normal 
way, unfortunately.


Maybe someone can find a brilliant way that Nokia, Google, or Apple 
would fund students and equipment, that happens to include getting 
Racket runtime or DrRacket on a phone somehow.


--
http://www.neilvandyke.org/
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Eli Barzilay]

On Sep 15, Neil Van Dyke wrote:
> Regarding Racket building for ARM, when you need to build it often
> but ARM is relatively slow... I wonder how much work to get
> cross-compile of the Racket toolset working.

Even if the C core part is cross compiled (there's more stuff in the
collections), the main point is compiling and running the files on the
machine, so cross compilation (if possible) will certainly speed
things up, but will not make it a less-effective testing tool.

-- 
  ((lambda (x) (x x)) (lambda (x) (x x)))  Eli Barzilay:
http://barzilay.org/   Maze is Life!
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Neil Van Dyke]

Regarding Racket building for ARM, when you need to build it often but 
ARM is relatively slow... I wonder how much work to get cross-compile of 
the Racket toolset working.


--
http://www.neilvandyke.org/

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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Eli Barzilay]

On Sep 15, Jay McCarthy wrote:
> 
> I'm happy to try and support ARM in my DrDr build farm if someone
> wants to help and suggest a computer to buy.

There are some extremely cheap arm boxes that come with ubuntu
preinstalled -- IIRC, there was even some $100 server thing.  But last
time I tried a build on such a machine, it took a really long time --
probably more than 4 hours, so you'd need a bunch of them to have a
build on every push.

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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[YC]

Thanks Jens -

I agree with you reasonings and it seems what's left is to actually
try it out to see what obstacles will encounter.

Cheers,
yc

On Wednesday, September 15, 2010, Jens Axel Søgaard
 wrote:
> 2010/9/15 YC :
>> On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 2:14 PM, Jens Axel Søgaard 
>> wrote:
>
>>> > limited memory usage
>>>
>>> This is a biggie, but memory size will grow fast enough
>>> that if it is a problem, it will disappear with time.
>>
>> This is true in the grand scheme of things, however, would that mean racket
>> is out for consideration until mobile environments catch up to the memory
>> usage?  That might mean limited adoptions.
>
> There is 256 ram in iphone 3g, which I believe is enough to
> run quite a few programs.
>
>>> > Compilation to a "single" exe (zipped structure appears to be fine) - or
>>> > at
>>> > least compile all planet packages along with the exe so it can be
>>> > shipped
>>> > together without going through planet
>>>
>>> The PLaneT dance might be impractical, but hardly a show stopper?
>>
>> Since I've invested a ton of time in creating reusable planet packages it's
>> a pretty big deal to me ;)
>
> I can relate to that :-)
> My reasoning was that since the racket caches the PLaneT libraries
> locally, then it must be possible to add support for locally
> stored PLaneT libraries without too much work.
>
>>> However there is something to think about regarding shared and static
>>> C libraries.
>>
>> What types of issues are you seeing here?
>
> I am unsure whether an app can load its own set of dynamic libraries
> without any problems. I know that two different app can't share
> the same dynamic library.
>
> In lack of a better reference:
> http://www.clintharris.net/2009/iphone-app-shared-libraries/
>
> --
> Jens Axel Søgaard
>

-- 
Cheers,
yc

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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[YC]

Great!

On Wednesday, September 15, 2010, Robby Findler
 wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 4:46 PM, YC  wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 2:34 PM, Robby Findler 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Not into local dlls, but planet should not stand in the way of
>>> creating stand alone executables. That is, planet was designed from
>>> the beginning to support that kind of thing by being integrated into
>>> the 'require' mechanism.
>>
>> For iPhone native apps the agreement is no downloading code over network -
>> so the packages would have to be compiled as local dlls and distributed
>> along with the exe (or possibly compiled into the exe), rather than being
>> loaded from the central planet repo when the user load the app the first
>> time.
>> Would it work as above with planet code if it is compiled into a standalone
>> exe?
>
> Yes.
>
> Robby
>

-- 
Cheers,
yc

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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Robby Findler]

On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 4:46 PM, YC  wrote:
>
> On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 2:34 PM, Robby Findler 
> wrote:
>>
>> Not into local dlls, but planet should not stand in the way of
>> creating stand alone executables. That is, planet was designed from
>> the beginning to support that kind of thing by being integrated into
>> the 'require' mechanism.
>
> For iPhone native apps the agreement is no downloading code over network -
> so the packages would have to be compiled as local dlls and distributed
> along with the exe (or possibly compiled into the exe), rather than being
> loaded from the central planet repo when the user load the app the first
> time.
> Would it work as above with planet code if it is compiled into a standalone
> exe?

Yes.

Robby
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Jens Axel Søgaard]

2010/9/15 YC :
> On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 2:14 PM, Jens Axel Søgaard 
> wrote:

>> > limited memory usage
>>
>> This is a biggie, but memory size will grow fast enough
>> that if it is a problem, it will disappear with time.
>
> This is true in the grand scheme of things, however, would that mean racket
> is out for consideration until mobile environments catch up to the memory
> usage?  That might mean limited adoptions.

There is 256 ram in iphone 3g, which I believe is enough to
run quite a few programs.

>> > Compilation to a "single" exe (zipped structure appears to be fine) - or
>> > at
>> > least compile all planet packages along with the exe so it can be
>> > shipped
>> > together without going through planet
>>
>> The PLaneT dance might be impractical, but hardly a show stopper?
>
> Since I've invested a ton of time in creating reusable planet packages it's
> a pretty big deal to me ;)

I can relate to that :-)
My reasoning was that since the racket caches the PLaneT libraries
locally, then it must be possible to add support for locally
stored PLaneT libraries without too much work.

>> However there is something to think about regarding shared and static
>> C libraries.
>
> What types of issues are you seeing here?

I am unsure whether an app can load its own set of dynamic libraries
without any problems. I know that two different app can't share
the same dynamic library.

In lack of a better reference:
http://www.clintharris.net/2009/iphone-app-shared-libraries/

-- 
Jens Axel Søgaard
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[YC]

On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 2:34 PM, Robby Findler
wrote:

>
> Not into local dlls, but planet should not stand in the way of
> creating stand alone executables. That is, planet was designed from
> the beginning to support that kind of thing by being integrated into
> the 'require' mechanism.
>

For iPhone native apps the agreement is no downloading code over network -
so the packages would have to be compiled as local dlls and distributed
along with the exe (or possibly compiled into the exe), rather than being
loaded from the central planet repo when the user load the app the first
time.

Would it work as above with planet code if it is compiled into a standalone
exe?

Cheers,
yc
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Robby Findler]

On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 4:30 PM, YC  wrote:
>> > Compilation to a "single" exe (zipped structure appears to be fine) - or
>> > at
>> > least compile all planet packages along with the exe so it can be
>> > shipped
>> > together without going through planet
>>
>> The PLaneT dance might be impractical, but hardly a show stopper?
>
> Since I've invested a ton of time in creating reusable planet packages it's
> a pretty big deal to me ;)  Does mzc/racket manage translating planet
> packages into local dlls?

Not into local dlls, but planet should not stand in the way of
creating stand alone executables. That is, planet was designed from
the beginning to support that kind of thing by being integrated into
the 'require' mechanism.

Robby
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[YC]

On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 2:14 PM, Jens Axel Søgaard wrote:

> 2010/9/15 YC :
>
> > ARM processor support
>
> This ought to be supported:
>http://groups.google.com/group/plt-scheme/msg/8b51211f8a6a88ca


Great!


> > limited memory usage
>
> This is a biggie, but memory size will grow fast enough
> that if it is a problem, it will disappear with time.
>

This is true in the grand scheme of things, however, would that mean racket
is out for consideration *until* mobile environments catch up to the memory
usage?  That might mean limited adoptions.


> > Objective-C/Cocoa interface
>
> There is a FFI ready:
>
> http://docs.racket-lang.org/foreign/Objective-C_FFI.html


Excellent!

> Compilation to a "single" exe (zipped structure appears to be fine) - or
> at
> > least compile all planet packages along with the exe so it can be shipped
> > together without going through planet
>
> The PLaneT dance might be impractical, but hardly a show stopper?
>

Since I've invested a ton of time in creating reusable planet packages it's
a pretty big deal to me ;)  Does mzc/racket manage translating planet
packages into local dlls?


> However there is something to think about regarding shared and static
> C libraries.
>

What types of issues are you seeing here?

Cheers,
yc
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Jay McCarthy]

On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 3:14 PM, Jens Axel Søgaard
 wrote:
> 2010/9/15 YC :
>
>> But is racket a good choice to run in an restricted environment such as
>> iPhone?  It seems like if one were to choose racket as a development
>> platform for native iPhone app, there are a few questions (ones that I don't
>> know about - others might know) on whether it is currently viable:
>>
>> ARM processor support
>
> This ought to be supported:
>    http://groups.google.com/group/plt-scheme/msg/8b51211f8a6a88ca

I'm happy to try and support ARM in my DrDr build farm if someone
wants to help and suggest a computer to buy.

Jay

>
>> limited memory usage
>
> This is a biggie, but memory size will grow fast enough
> that if it is a problem, it will disappear with time.
>
>> Objective-C/Cocoa interface
>
> There is a FFI ready:
>
> http://docs.racket-lang.org/foreign/Objective-C_FFI.html
>
>
>> Compilation to a "single" exe (zipped structure appears to be fine) - or at
>> least compile all planet packages along with the exe so it can be shipped
>> together without going through planet
>
> The PLaneT dance might be impractical, but hardly a show stopper?
>
> However there is something to think about regarding shared and static
> C libraries.
>
> --
> Jens Axel Søgaard
> _
>  For list-related administrative tasks:
>  http://lists.racket-lang.org/listinfo/users



-- 
Jay McCarthy 
Assistant Professor / Brigham Young University
http://teammccarthy.org/jay

"The glory of God is Intelligence" - D&C 93
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Jens Axel Søgaard]

2010/9/15 YC :

> But is racket a good choice to run in an restricted environment such as
> iPhone?  It seems like if one were to choose racket as a development
> platform for native iPhone app, there are a few questions (ones that I don't
> know about - others might know) on whether it is currently viable:
>
> ARM processor support

This ought to be supported:
http://groups.google.com/group/plt-scheme/msg/8b51211f8a6a88ca

> limited memory usage

This is a biggie, but memory size will grow fast enough
that if it is a problem, it will disappear with time.

> Objective-C/Cocoa interface

There is a FFI ready:

http://docs.racket-lang.org/foreign/Objective-C_FFI.html


> Compilation to a "single" exe (zipped structure appears to be fine) - or at
> least compile all planet packages along with the exe so it can be shipped
> together without going through planet

The PLaneT dance might be impractical, but hardly a show stopper?

However there is something to think about regarding shared and static
C libraries.

-- 
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[YC]

On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Neil Van Dyke  wrote:

> Brent Fulgham wrote at 09/14/2010 03:55 PM:
>
>  has provided each student with a personal iPad, think that DrScheme on the
>> iPad would be a wonderful thing.
>>
>>
>
> Does the current Apple text prohibit PLaneT?


It would appears so as you should not "side load" code into your application
via network.

But is racket a good choice to run in an restricted environment such as
iPhone?  It seems like if one were to choose racket as a development
platform for native iPhone app, there are a few questions (ones that I don't
know about - others might know) on whether it is currently viable:

   - ARM processor support
   - limited memory usage
   - Objective-C/Cocoa interface
   - Compilation to a "single" exe (zipped structure appears to be fine) -
   or at least compile all planet packages along with the exe so it can be
   shipped together without going through planet

There might be other questions but those are on top of my head.

Cheers,
yc
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Shriram Krishnamurthi]

> Just curious, does wescheme support "universe" programs?

Not yet.

As you have anticipated, the problem is with server-side support (ie,
where to host things).

It should, in principle, be possible for a school to run a server on
some DrRacket instance (say on a desktop), and have the WeScheme
clients speak to one another through that server.  We haven't invested
effort into this because we don't think many people are likely to have
the resources to maintain this.

We do, of course, know how to make a WeScheme site that hosts servers.
The problem is that this requires us to change our current Web-hosting
infrastructure.  Right now we get to rely on the free limits of
AppEngine, which also gives us storage and authentication.  In this
alternate universe, we'd have to run our own server farm (not
feasible), or find a way to pay for (say) Amazon EC2 rack space.

I would love to find a solution to this problem, so suggestions
welcome!  (I mean concrete ones grounded in facts, not of the "Why
don't you contact Engine Yard and tell them you're virtuous and ask
them to give you cycles?" ilk.)

Shriram
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Mark Engelberg]

Just curious, does wescheme support "universe" programs?  If so, what
does that support entail?  Do you run both the server and client on
the wescheme website, or can you run the universe server on wescheme
and connect to it via desktop Racket running a universe client?
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Shriram Krishnamurthi]

Hosting on AppEngine. We don't get much choice in server technology.

On Sep 14, 2010 9:53 PM, "namekuseijin"  wrote:
> On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 5:04 PM, Shriram Krishnamurthi 
wrote:
>> Can't they already run WeScheme (www.wescheme.org)? Soon with #lang
modules,
>> etc. Save to the Web, access anywhere, etc. What am I missing?
>
> curious...
>
> well, for once, you're missing named lets... ;)
>
> I wonder what's the deal with using jsp for the website as it's pretty
> much all static pages and also doesn't seem to do much to sell moby as
> a scheme compiler... :p
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Danny Yoo]

> well, for once, you're missing named lets... ;)

Ok; named lets will be there very very soon.  (The new backend does
support it; I'm in the process of integrating the new backend with
WeScheme.org.)
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[namekuseijin]

On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 5:04 PM, Shriram Krishnamurthi  
wrote:
> Can't they already run WeScheme (www.wescheme.org)? Soon with #lang modules,
> etc. Save to the Web, access anywhere, etc. What am I missing?

curious...

well, for once, you're missing named lets... ;)

I wonder what's the deal with using jsp for the website as it's pretty
much all static pages and also doesn't seem to do much to sell moby as
a scheme compiler... :p
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[David G. Kay]

>
> Can't they already run WeScheme (www.wescheme.org)? Soon with #lang
> modules, etc. Save to the Web, access anywhere, etc. What am I missing?


On my iPhone, no keyboard comes up when
I'm in the editor window.

--DGK

David G. Kay
k...@uci.edu


On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 1:04 PM, Shriram Krishnamurthi wrote:

> Can't they already run WeScheme (www.wescheme.org)? Soon with #lang
> modules, etc. Save to the Web, access anywhere, etc. What am I missing?
>
> On Sep 14, 2010 3:56 PM, "Brent Fulgham"  wrote:
> > Considering that the private Scottish Ceders School
> > (http://cedars.inverclyde.sch.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page) has
> > provided each student with a personal iPad, think that DrScheme on the
> > iPad would be a wonderful thing.
> >
> > Imagine students being able to create and test applications using such
> > a tool, without having to think about file systems, GUIs, and so
> > forth.
> >
> > -Brent
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Neil Van Dyke]

Brent Fulgham wrote at 09/14/2010 03:55 PM:

has provided each student with a personal iPad, think that DrScheme on the iPad 
would be a wonderful thing.
  


Does the current Apple text prohibit PLaneT?

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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Shriram Krishnamurthi]

Can't they already run WeScheme (www.wescheme.org)? Soon with #lang modules,
etc. Save to the Web, access anywhere, etc. What am I missing?

On Sep 14, 2010 3:56 PM, "Brent Fulgham"  wrote:
> Considering that the private Scottish Ceders School
> (http://cedars.inverclyde.sch.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page) has
> provided each student with a personal iPad, think that DrScheme on the
> iPad would be a wonderful thing.
>
> Imagine students being able to create and test applications using such
> a tool, without having to think about file systems, GUIs, and so
> forth.
>
> -Brent
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Brent Fulgham]

Considering that the private Scottish Ceders School
(http://cedars.inverclyde.sch.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page) has
provided each student with a personal iPad, think that DrScheme on the
iPad would be a wonderful thing.

Imagine students being able to create and test applications using such
a tool, without having to think about file systems, GUIs, and so
forth.

-Brent
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Grant Rettke]

On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 7:37 AM, Stephen De Gabrielle
 wrote:
>> create and use their own interpreted languages within apps, as long as they 
>>aren't downloaded,
>
> DrScheme on the iPad?

Racket apps on the iPad/iPhone/iPodTouch would be a "killer dev tool".

>From a research side of things there really isn't much meat there,
though, is there?
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Stephen De Gabrielle]

> create and use their own interpreted languages within apps, as long as they 
>aren't downloaded,

DrScheme on the iPad?

I'm joking.

:)

On Tuesday, September 14, 2010, Neil Van Dyke  wrote:
> John Clements wrote at 09/13/2010 11:44 PM:
>
> Again, this change would seem to be designed to allow developers to create 
> and use their own interpreted languages within apps, as long as they aren't 
> downloaded, which would open up a gaping security hole.
>
>
> I think that is not so much about security, and more about Apple keeping a 
> stranglehold on the platform.  Which means ongoing antitrust abuses in what 
> does and does not get on the platform, as well as getting a cut of any 
> layered software business (because they can force you to give them a cut).
>
> IMHO, the iPhone is still a platform to avoid developing for, unless you 
> really must be on it.
>
> I am speaking of software development in general here.  Some Racket-related 
> project might well have a pragmatic reason to lend aid and comfort to the 
> iPhone (e.g., a desire to run on *all* the platforms that students use).
>
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Re: [racket] News flash! Racket once again a legal choice for developing iPhone apps!

[Neil Van Dyke]

John Clements wrote at 09/13/2010 11:44 PM:

Again, this change would seem to be designed to allow developers to create and 
use their own interpreted languages within apps, as long as they aren't 
downloaded, which would open up a gaping security hole.


I think that is not so much about security, and more about Apple keeping 
a stranglehold on the platform.  Which means ongoing antitrust abuses in 
what does and does not get on the platform, as well as getting a cut of 
any layered software business (because they can force you to give them a 
cut).


IMHO, the iPhone is still a platform to avoid developing for, unless you 
really must be on it.


I am speaking of software development in general here.  Some 
Racket-related project might well have a pragmatic reason to lend aid 
and comfort to the iPhone (e.g., a desire to run on *all* the platforms 
that students use).


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