[RBW] Riv Rally midwest

[Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery]

I wrote down my loose plan for the Midwest Riv Rally. I'm not much for 
micromanaging herds of cats or groups of cyclists. My general approach to 
larger group rides is that it's an semi-cohesive association of 
self-responsible individuals. If you have to come or go at a different time 
or you can only eat certain types of food or can only stay at hotels that 
take Diner's Club or whatever, that's cool, but please make the necessary 
arrangements yourself. Also, be advised that a general fitness guideline is 
the ability to ride 50-ish somewhat hilly miles in a day, on two 
consecutive days. You don't have to be fast by any means, but you do have 
to cover the distance without being miserable and/or dying. Misery and/or 
death are the opposite of what we want. 

http://hiawathacyclery.blogspot.com/2012/02/rough-outline-of-rivendell-rally-im.html

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Mike S]

Worth emphasizing a huge factor is the clearances. My Trek 520 could
(barely) take 32's and then had to do a split fender workaround. Now
I'm gonna rock fat & happy 40's with ultranormal fendering on the
Sam.

On Feb 8, 1:57 am, Mike S  wrote:
> I was in a similar scenario two years ago, though I was way too broke
> to get the Sam Hillborne frame of my dreams and chose to parlay my
> bike budget into a 1986 Trek 520 frame. The frame was traded with a
> friend for a (nice, but too small) 80's Raleigh Grand Prix I bought
> for $150 on Ebay, and it was a Craigslist find my buddy scored for
> free, because I was desperate for the 64cm size.
>
> I couldn't live with the battered paint on it and went for a gorgeous
> $300 powdercoat in orange. Got all of the corrosion off and made it
> look factory fresh, a really handsome restore. All told, I spent $350
> (powdercoat + headset) of cash on the frame and attached all manner of
> fancy Rivvish parts to it. Nitto cockpit, lugged seatpost to make the
> too short top tube work, Tektro long-reach brakes, nice wheelset,
> hell, even a split fender setup to work with the too-tight clearances.
> Basically, I threw good money (nice parts) after bad (powdercoating an
> anonymous decades old frame) and rode it about 2000 miles.
>
> Then, in November, I began to notice the fork wobbling a bit for about
> a week. The problem gradually got worse until I eventually realized
> there was a crack running all around the headtube lug. The vintage
> Trek that I had planned to get 20,000 miles of sadly barely got warmed
> up, and now it will just be a flamboyant piece of garden art or some
> such. I think the take-home message from this verbosity has already
> been said in the thread: don't do this sort of thing unless you are
> the original owner because god knows what that frame has been
> through.
>
> The story does have a happy ending, as the Hillborne of my dreams is
> arriving at my LBS tomorrow and it's going to be united with all that
> bike finery I invested in. At long last I will have a frame that truly
> fits my crazy 96 PBH and will confidently truck through wherever I go
> with whatever I carry for hopefully 100,000 miles or so. Can't wait!
>
> TL;DR: Threw $350 at an unknown frame, it broke after not much
> mileage. Mourned it's loss and got funds together for a Sam, gonna be
> riding happy a long time to come.
>
> On Feb 7, 9:05 am, trek610  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Hi all,
>
> > I am at a cross roads and need some help deciding on how best to spend my
> > money...
>
> > I am looking to get a nice all around bike for commuting, perhaps a century
> > or two, 2 day bike overnight credit card, and light trail (crushed
> > limestone/dirt) type riding. In the summer I wind up with 50 - 150 miles
> > per week.   I am currently using a Surly LHT for this type of riding, and
> > really like it, but am longing for something a bit more .sprightly.
> >  Here is a picture of my current LHT to give you an idea of how I would
> > like to setup this new ride.
>
> > 
>
> > I am not the tallest guy and ride a 50 - 53cm frame depending on the setup.
> >  I would outfit his new bike in a similar fashion with fenders, racks,
> > rando bag etc...
>
> > Here is my problem.  I found a 531cs Trek 610 from 1984 that has (IMHO)
> > nice geometry for my needs.  Some specs - 430mm chain-stay, 52mm rake, 72mm
> > bottom bracket drop, and i think 72 for so seat and head tube angles.  Trek
> > does not publish the geometry for anything but 22.5" frames that year...
>
> > Trek Upgrade Path
>
> >    1. 700C or 650B wheel conversion - bigger tire, better ride, more fender
> >    clearance (I already have a nice set of velocity 700c wheels for this
> >    project)
> >    2. complete powder coat
> >    3. Canti brake studs added
> >    4. brazeons for various items
> >    5. cold set the rear end
> >    6. etc...
>
> > I guess in the end this will require many new parts, some of which I have,
> > but will be a considerable investment nonetheless.
>
> > Now here comes the San Marcos  It seems to be a nice solution as well
> > and may very well similar in price to the trek by the time I am done with
> > the frame parts.  The San Marcos may be a bit more, but may be a better
> > choice in the long run.  The San Marcos seems to have perfect geometry for
> > my kind of riding...
>
> > What would you do if you were me?  What bike will better serve me in the
> > long run.  I have to admit, since I live in Madison WI the Trek has some
> > sentimental value to me.  The San Marcos lugs look really nice however!  I
> > am torn with which direction to go, and since this is a big outlay of cash
> > for me I am looking for some advice before going one way or the other...
>
> > Thanks in a advance to any/all help.
>
> > Thanks

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Mike S]

I was in a similar scenario two years ago, though I was way too broke
to get the Sam Hillborne frame of my dreams and chose to parlay my
bike budget into a 1986 Trek 520 frame. The frame was traded with a
friend for a (nice, but too small) 80's Raleigh Grand Prix I bought
for $150 on Ebay, and it was a Craigslist find my buddy scored for
free, because I was desperate for the 64cm size.

I couldn't live with the battered paint on it and went for a gorgeous
$300 powdercoat in orange. Got all of the corrosion off and made it
look factory fresh, a really handsome restore. All told, I spent $350
(powdercoat + headset) of cash on the frame and attached all manner of
fancy Rivvish parts to it. Nitto cockpit, lugged seatpost to make the
too short top tube work, Tektro long-reach brakes, nice wheelset,
hell, even a split fender setup to work with the too-tight clearances.
Basically, I threw good money (nice parts) after bad (powdercoating an
anonymous decades old frame) and rode it about 2000 miles.

Then, in November, I began to notice the fork wobbling a bit for about
a week. The problem gradually got worse until I eventually realized
there was a crack running all around the headtube lug. The vintage
Trek that I had planned to get 20,000 miles of sadly barely got warmed
up, and now it will just be a flamboyant piece of garden art or some
such. I think the take-home message from this verbosity has already
been said in the thread: don't do this sort of thing unless you are
the original owner because god knows what that frame has been
through.

The story does have a happy ending, as the Hillborne of my dreams is
arriving at my LBS tomorrow and it's going to be united with all that
bike finery I invested in. At long last I will have a frame that truly
fits my crazy 96 PBH and will confidently truck through wherever I go
with whatever I carry for hopefully 100,000 miles or so. Can't wait!

TL;DR: Threw $350 at an unknown frame, it broke after not much
mileage. Mourned it's loss and got funds together for a Sam, gonna be
riding happy a long time to come.

On Feb 7, 9:05 am, trek610  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I am at a cross roads and need some help deciding on how best to spend my
> money...
>
> I am looking to get a nice all around bike for commuting, perhaps a century
> or two, 2 day bike overnight credit card, and light trail (crushed
> limestone/dirt) type riding. In the summer I wind up with 50 - 150 miles
> per week.   I am currently using a Surly LHT for this type of riding, and
> really like it, but am longing for something a bit more .sprightly.
>  Here is a picture of my current LHT to give you an idea of how I would
> like to setup this new ride.
>
> 
>
> I am not the tallest guy and ride a 50 - 53cm frame depending on the setup.
>  I would outfit his new bike in a similar fashion with fenders, racks,
> rando bag etc...
>
> Here is my problem.  I found a 531cs Trek 610 from 1984 that has (IMHO)
> nice geometry for my needs.  Some specs - 430mm chain-stay, 52mm rake, 72mm
> bottom bracket drop, and i think 72 for so seat and head tube angles.  Trek
> does not publish the geometry for anything but 22.5" frames that year...
>
> Trek Upgrade Path
>
>    1. 700C or 650B wheel conversion - bigger tire, better ride, more fender
>    clearance (I already have a nice set of velocity 700c wheels for this
>    project)
>    2. complete powder coat
>    3. Canti brake studs added
>    4. brazeons for various items
>    5. cold set the rear end
>    6. etc...
>
> I guess in the end this will require many new parts, some of which I have,
> but will be a considerable investment nonetheless.
>
> Now here comes the San Marcos  It seems to be a nice solution as well
> and may very well similar in price to the trek by the time I am done with
> the frame parts.  The San Marcos may be a bit more, but may be a better
> choice in the long run.  The San Marcos seems to have perfect geometry for
> my kind of riding...
>
> What would you do if you were me?  What bike will better serve me in the
> long run.  I have to admit, since I live in Madison WI the Trek has some
> sentimental value to me.  The San Marcos lugs look really nice however!  I
> am torn with which direction to go, and since this is a big outlay of cash
> for me I am looking for some advice before going one way or the other...
>
> Thanks in a advance to any/all help.
>
> Thanks

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[trek610]

I mostly agree with your comments - I am friends with the manager who runs 
the store.  The sad thing is there is another warehouse behind the showroom 
that is stocked with more bikes.  I am not sure the owner really knows what 
he has.  There are no deals there to be sure.  Everything is really top 
dollar unless it has not been looked at in a while.  I found a few diamonds 
there - like a Gitane TDF, one of the nicer ones in nice shape for a couple 
hundred dollars.

I agree - if you come to Madison - you should stop and check this place 
out.  Just do not expect to find any deals.  The owner knows that he has 
some fine examples that are someones grail bike - and they will pay the 
asking price.  Even my buddy has to make a call to the owner if someone 
makes an offer on a bike.

I frequent the store to see what gems have be drug out of the back 
room. and drool.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[trek610]

No I will have to check that out - I am assuming they turned out nice?

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[trek610]

Thanks Liesl!

Same to you - if you are in my area let me know and we can talk bike.  I 
love to talk saddle bags, racks and such for smaller bikes.

I hear you on all the mods on this thing, I hope it does not morph it into 
an abomination.  I am luck I have a frame builder here (Banjo bicycles) who 
can do all these mods for me at a reasonable price.  I am really leaning 
toward 650B conversion on this if I can figure out the brakes.

Anyway - I will likely wind up with something like the San Marcos or AHH 
type ride and will likely wind up at that price.  I believe it will wind up 
being special to me and a keeper for the long haul.  I can see passing it 
along to my son at some point.

Thanks again for the kind words and advice.

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[trek610]

Thanks Will - maybe I will see you on the cap city trail at some point. 
 The Canti breaks not working on the fork was something I had not 
considered.  I understand the 531CS is somewhat lighter than regular 531 so 
you may be right.  Although there are many bikes with 531 Canti brakes...

I appreciate the good advice - and will consider it carefully.  I think 
brazen drop-outs -Cronometro's show was in January, and I missed it this 
year.  It is a great swap meet for sure.

Cheers 

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Frank Brose]

Between Will and Ryan It's pretty well spelled out. I'd take their
advice. Not to mention the fact Will lives in MadTown.

On Feb 7, 2:22 pm, rcnute  wrote:
> I like buying new bikes as much as the next guy but I'd just build up
> the Trek without all the mods.  Use it for your sprightlier adventures
> and keep the LHT (nice setup there by the way) for other times.  The
> Soma looks like it'd ride quite nicely but my guess is that it splits
> the difference between the Trek and the LHT in some ways.
>
> I had a heavily-modded (by others) 650b'ified Trek 520 frame, which
> was fine but I don't know that all the work that went into it
> necessarily made it a better ride (but it was a cool project).
>
> The Treks that took 27" wheels can fit 700c x 32s and fenders.
>
> Ryan
>
> On Feb 7, 6:05 am, trek610  wrote:
>
>
>
> > Hi all,
>
> > I am at a cross roads and need some help deciding on how best to spend my
> > money...
>
> > I am looking to get a nice all around bike for commuting, perhaps a century
> > or two, 2 day bike overnight credit card, and light trail (crushed
> > limestone/dirt) type riding. In the summer I wind up with 50 - 150 miles
> > per week.   I am currently using a Surly LHT for this type of riding, and
> > really like it, but am longing for something a bit more .sprightly.
> >  Here is a picture of my current LHT to give you an idea of how I would
> > like to setup this new ride.
>
> > 
>
> > I am not the tallest guy and ride a 50 - 53cm frame depending on the setup.
> >  I would outfit his new bike in a similar fashion with fenders, racks,
> > rando bag etc...
>
> > Here is my problem.  I found a 531cs Trek 610 from 1984 that has (IMHO)
> > nice geometry for my needs.  Some specs - 430mm chain-stay, 52mm rake, 72mm
> > bottom bracket drop, and i think 72 for so seat and head tube angles.  Trek
> > does not publish the geometry for anything but 22.5" frames that year...
>
> > Trek Upgrade Path
>
> >    1. 700C or 650B wheel conversion - bigger tire, better ride, more fender
> >    clearance (I already have a nice set of velocity 700c wheels for this
> >    project)
> >    2. complete powder coat
> >    3. Canti brake studs added
> >    4. brazeons for various items
> >    5. cold set the rear end
> >    6. etc...
>
> > I guess in the end this will require many new parts, some of which I have,
> > but will be a considerable investment nonetheless.
>
> > Now here comes the San Marcos  It seems to be a nice solution as well
> > and may very well similar in price to the trek by the time I am done with
> > the frame parts.  The San Marcos may be a bit more, but may be a better
> > choice in the long run.  The San Marcos seems to have perfect geometry for
> > my kind of riding...
>
> > What would you do if you were me?  What bike will better serve me in the
> > long run.  I have to admit, since I live in Madison WI the Trek has some
> > sentimental value to me.  The San Marcos lugs look really nice however!  I
> > am torn with which direction to go, and since this is a big outlay of cash
> > for me I am looking for some advice before going one way or the other...
>
> > Thanks in a advance to any/all help.
>
> > Thanks- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

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[RBW] Re: Atlantis vs. Sam

[C REINO]

I own a Rivendell custom (one of the first from 1995), a quickbeam,
Sam Hillborne, and as of last summer, an Atlantis (I also have an
X01).  If I had to choose just on bike, it would be the atlantis,
without a question.  It rides great loaded (better than my Sam).  It
is so versatile, depending on the tires you put on it, I run 26x1.5
pasella's for fast and comfortable road rides up to 26x2.0 schwalbe
marathon extremes for dirt and single track plus rough stuff touring.
It is rock solid and super comfortable!  If price is not an object,
have grant build you up an atlantis!

On Feb 4, 5:17 pm, murphyjrfk  wrote:
> i know it tends to be a different comparison, given the price and all.
> but let's assume the price is the same.  i can't decide. at all. and
> price is an issue but still wanna compare.
>
> this is where i'm stuck. i want a bike that can tour. but can mostly
> serve as fun and quick, spirited normal everyday bikes. i don't need a
> "fast" bike. i just want a quick bike. i like the atlantis better, but
> im nervous that it will be sluggish unloaded.  maybe dat ain't true-i
> dunno.
>
> anyways. horrible grammar aside, i am hoping some sam owners and
> atlantis owners would chime in. and if you own both. that'd be even
> betta!
>
> thanks.

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[RBW] Bicycle garage sale

[Gino Zahnd]

Hey RBW'ers, 

I'm having a local-to-SF bicycle garage sale. 

Lots of Riv-ish type stuff, some modern Campy, Crank Bros., Salsa, PAUL, Cane 
Creek stuff, several lots of women's jerseys and bibs.

The list of items and prices are here:
http://bit.ly/zfUFSW

The corresponding photos are here:
http://on.fb.me/zEVU7x

First round will be pickup only, either in SF near South Park, or in Mill 
Valley.

Thanks, and hopefully you find something useful!





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[RBW] Re: One for the fire chief - 56 Bombadil on the 'bay

[Aaron Thomas]

William,

What a wonderful and uplifting video! I don't even have kids, but it makes 
me want to have some so I can take them on an outing like yours.

Aaron

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery]

I have had a table at the chronometro swap since 2006, but decided to skip it 
this year. Maybe because I'm not local, I always felt it was difficult 
convincing people there that I wasn't trying to scam them. And there were a lot 
of gawkers who pawed through my stuff and offered lots of critiques (same guys 
every year) but never spent a nickel. From the perspective of a shopper, it is 
probably more favorable.

One favorite story from that swap: I had a new-in-box 70s vintage campy BB on 
my table. A very rotund, sloppy-looking dude with a fanny-pack and a satin 
jacket with some tavern name embroidered on it got visibly excited when he saw 
it and asked my permission to open the box. No problem. After removing the BB 
spindle and cups and gazing longingly at them for about 10 long seconds, he 
carefully lifted the unit to his nose, and inhaled deeply, as if he was a wine 
connoisseur or something. Not knowing what to make of the situation, I quipped 
"it still has that new bottom bracket smell" with what I hoped was a disarming 
smile. He then got upset with me, and loudly and emphatically said "NO! IT'S A 
CAMPY SMELL!" He then put the BB back in the table, gave me a dirty look, and 
stomped away. I don't get a lot of sniffers in my line of work, but when they 
do sniff, I know they mean business.

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Seth]

Hi,

As an owner of a Sam Hil. And a 82' Trek 613, I'd recommend the San
Marco, primarily because the Trek will run a maximum tire size of 28mm
with fenders (700c conversion).  Further, the Riv has a very nice feel
that is quite distinct from the Trek, more stability, better down hill
handling.  Not only would the Sam Marco give you the chance to run BIG
tires, you would know the history of the frame and be better able to
control rust.

Best,

Seth Ely

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery]

Yes, I agree that the people at BBC are helpful and courteous. It just seemed 
like selling bikes was not part of the plan. I seem to recall that the JT 
tandem we looked at had a price tag of $1799 or so, but it wasn't actually for 
sale. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery]

Yes, I agree that the people at BBC are helpful and courteous. It just seemed 
like selling bikes was not part of the plan. I seem to recall that the JT 
tandem we looked at had a price tag of $1799 or so, but it wasn't actually for 
sale. 

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[RBW] Re: Riv Rally East 2012

[Montclair BobbyB]

The Paddlers Lane Guest House has 3 queen beds, 8 singles, a sofabed
and a sofa, so it will (arguably) sleep 12 comfortably, or 13 with one
on the sofa. Below is the list of the first 13 responses (Rusty, I'm
trying to keep your group together, I'm happy to take the couch)... we
can shift people around if they'd rather move to a B&B, but in general
any additional folks will need to reserve with one of the several
other B&Bs and Inns available in Confluence. Apologies, you should
have no problem finding a suitable place.  If you have any unconfirmed
friends joining us later and you need to opt out for a different B&B,
please let me know.  And there's camping available at Paddlers Lane
for about $7 per person.

Riv Rallyer  Paddler's LaneShuttle
Falling Water Tour  Deposit Needed

Bob Birmingham Y
Y Y  $75
Tom Allingham   Y
Y Y  $75
Hank Allingham  Y
Y Y  $75
Sam Allingham   Y
Y Y  $75
Steve Palincsar  Y
Y Y  $75
Norm Rosenbloom  Y
Y Y  $75
Bruce Oppenheim   Y
Y Y  $75
John Philip Y
N Y  $55
Andy Philip Y
Y Y  $75
Tom NezovichY
N Y  $55
Rusty ClickY
N N  $75
Rusty Guest 1Y
N N  $50
Rusty Guest 2Y
N N  $75
Mark Irwin  N
Y Y  $25

Total Confirmed 13
9 11

Any others who care to join us, please confirm when you can.

Would you kindly drop me a check in the mail at your convenience.
Thanks!

Bobby Birmingham
94 Matthews Farm Road
Belle Mead, NJ 08502

Peace,
BB


On Feb 7, 11:58 am, Montclair BobbyB 
wrote:
> Thanks, Marc.
>
> We're just about at capacity at the Paddler's Lane, but there are
> other B&Bs in town that hopefully will be suitable (see my previous
> post with links).
> Something else to consider:  CAMPING (by the way) IS an option at
> Paddler's Lane, if any of you are so inclined.  It's inexpensive, they
> have open lawn to pitch tents, use of the house facilities, and
> they've built a brand new bath house that they are very proud of (with
> nice showers and toilets).  If the weather cooperates, this could be a
> nice option.
>
> We also are approaching capacity on our first shuttle van (we're at
> 10, with a capacity of 12).  Some riders won't need shuttle service,
> and instead will be doing the extended out-and-back.  But before I
> commit to a second van, we will need to have at least another 6 riders
> (for it to be cost-effective).  We'll find a way to accommodate
> everyones' lodging and shuttle needs.
>
> I've also booked a van for the Falling Water Tour.  That will last
> approx 2 hours.  Those who prefer to opt out of the tour, of course
> you'll be free to spend the time in Ohiopyle (or to just continue on
> to Connellsville).
>
> So if you're considering joining us forRivRallyEast, PLEASE try to
> firm up your plans and let me know ASAP.
>
> For those who have committed so far, thank you; I'll send out the list
> of names that I have (this evening), and I will be asking for a
> deposit.  Stay tuned.
>
> THANKS
>
> BB
>
> On Feb 6, 10:03 pm, Marc Irwin  wrote:
>
>
>
> > I intend to be there and will stay with the masses at the Paddlers.  I
> > have no preferencefor the starting point.  You know the terrain better
> > than I.  I have no preference about the falling waters ( I've seen a
> > lot of FLW, but one more won't hurt either.).  Let me know the what
> > when and where of the deposits and I'll make the rest of my plans.
>
> > Marc
>
> > On Jan 26, 10:27 am, "Allingham II, Thomas J"
>
> >  wrote:
> > > - As soon as possible, a verbal commitment to attend (and I may request a 
> > > deposit for the shuttle and lodging (if I book the Paddlers Guest House). 
> > >  Sam Allingham and Tom Allingham are in; one additional rider is a 
> > > distinct possibility.
>
> > > - A lodging preference, either:  A. I would like to stay with the masses 
> > > in the Paddlers Lane Guest House (if avail), and although I am guaranteed 
> > > a bed, it may not be a queen bed, we'll draw straws...  or B. I would 
> > > like to make my own lodging arrangement

[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Will]

Jim, 

It's true that the Budget Bike owner has changed the tenor of the business 
recently. It used to be a real budget bike store. I bought 3 used bikes 
there: Trek 620, 610, and 613 from the early 80s. They were all very 
reasonable. 

Budget's old business model was about recycling decent older bikes, keeping 
good rides on the road, so to speak. I heard the owner saw what was 
happening on eBay and decided he was in the collectibles business instead 
of the used bike business. Since then I have continued to buy used fenders 
and used parts, and in winter when it's really slow, good deals continue to 
be available. Used fenders in as-new condition can be had for $20. 

The real deal is the annual bike swap sponsored by ChronoMetro. 

The 600 series Treks from the early 1980s are nice bikes. They are a bit 
tight on tire clearance as practically everything from that time period is. 
On the other hand, it is really nice to ride 531 steel with slender tubes 
and stays. The bikes are lively in a way that OS tubes and beefier stays 
cannot match. The 610 is a great winter project bike.  

Will



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Re: [RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Seth Vidal]

On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 8:25 PM, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery
 wrote:
> As an aside related to the poster who mentioned Budget Bikes on Regent in
> Madison. Anybody who visits Madison should take a gander at this place, as
> it is the most stupefying spectacle I've seen in cycling. There are
> actually, I think, four or five Budget Bike locations on Regent within a
> 2-block stretch, but the one of interest is the used bike warehouse.
> Thousands of used bikes, many of which are pieces of undeniable cycling
> historical interest, occupy every square inch of this large,
> minimally-heated warehouse. The prices are nothing short of outrageous, like
> $500+ for an old Schwinn Varsity or an unremarkable ladies Raleigh Sports
> from the 1970s, and the price for anything even remotely more desirable will
> generally be $2000+. The rumor is that if you show interest in one of the
> bikes, the price will suddenly be significantly greater if you return to buy
> it the following day. My friend tried to buy a Jack Taylor tandem there
> once, and the price seemed about right. The employee said, sorry, not for
> sale. But there's a price tag on it, right? Turns out the price tag was for
> "insurance purposes". One current and one former employee there told me,
> when I asked about this curious business model, that the shop's owner
> focused on the "acquisition side" of the business, and that he made his
> living in real estate. The multiple bike shops are apparently some sort of
> hobby, or maybe a tax-avoidance scheme. In any case, I don't suggest buying
> anything there, but it sure is fun to wander around and look.



Jim,

 Very curious. This was the exact opposite of the experience I
received when I visited Madison. We went by yellow jersey to see about
renting a tandem for the week we were there. The attitude and contempt
we received was unbelievable. We were told it was impossible to ride a
tandem in the city and they would not rent one to us if we were
planning to do that. When I asked if there was other bike shops that
did not share that belief I was told that they didn't shop at other
bike shops and didn't know of any.

 We left and went to budget bicycles - both their facility with
hundreds upon hundreds of bikes:

 http://www.flickr.com/photos/ejchang/5005545281/

 and then their folder/tandem/recumbent-specific location. At the
location with the many older bikes we talked with a couple of
employees who said that they stockpile a lot of bikes and many of the
turnover for the massive influx of students to U-W. I asked about
tandems and they pointed me to the other location a few blocks down
the street.

At the tandem location we were shown their rental tandems and allowed
to try them out before determining which one to take for the week.
They were helpful and relaxed. We got a reasonable burley duet tandem
and were treated quite well. We also got to try out a brompton while
we were there. I asked about a map of the city paths. They didn't have
one on hand at that location so they suggested we go across the street
to one of their other locations. We went over there where we were
given a map and then the map was highlighted by one of the folks there
to tell us which paths were not in good shape right now. It was kinda
fantastic service.

I bought some tires and gloves from them before we left madison b/c of
how well we were treated. I'd recommend them to others.

Oh and I did see the two jack taylor tandems:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/ejchang/5005556695/
and
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ejchang/5005554239/

The price tags on them online are $.99 - which I suspect is the
MAX for their system.

They are also hung up 10 feet above the ground and angled so they can
be seen but not touched.


-sv

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Re: [RBW] One for the fire chief - 56 Bombadil on the 'bay

[jimD]

This is great!

reminded me of this:

My brother and I used to take the last chair ride at the end of Saturday skiing 
at White Pass (Wa.) and then set up our tent, roll out
our sleeping bags and pretend we were winter mountaineering. Our parents 
thought we were nuts but had no problem with
out mini adventure - great fun. We got first tracks in the morning on our way 
down to breakfast.
Wonder if you could do that today.

-JimD
On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:00 AM, William wrote:

> The other micro-camping adventure we've done that you might try is we loaded 
> up our backpacks for an overnighter, and did the 2.5 mile hike (walk) to a 
> friend's house and made camp in their backyard.  They left the back door 
> unlocked in case anybody wanted to use the bathroom.  We made noodles for 
> dinner on the camp stove, oatmeal and hot beverages for breakfast, broke camp 
> and walked back home.  

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery]

As an aside related to the poster who mentioned Budget Bikes on Regent in 
Madison. Anybody who visits Madison should take a gander at this place, as 
it is the most stupefying spectacle I've seen in cycling. There are 
actually, I think, four or five Budget Bike locations on Regent within a 
2-block stretch, but the one of interest is the used bike warehouse. 
Thousands of used bikes, many of which are pieces of undeniable cycling 
historical interest, occupy every square inch of this large, 
minimally-heated warehouse. The prices are nothing short of outrageous, 
like $500+ for an old Schwinn Varsity or an unremarkable ladies Raleigh 
Sports from the 1970s, and the price for anything even remotely more 
desirable will generally be $2000+. The rumor is that if you show interest 
in one of the bikes, the price will suddenly be significantly greater if 
you return to buy it the following day. My friend tried to buy a Jack 
Taylor tandem there once, and the price seemed about right. The employee 
said, sorry, not for sale. But there's a price tag on it, right? Turns out 
the price tag was for "insurance purposes". One current and one former 
employee there told me, when I asked about this curious business model, 
that the shop's owner focused on the "acquisition side" of the business, 
and that he made his living in real estate. The multiple bike shops are 
apparently some sort of hobby, or maybe a tax-avoidance scheme. In any 
case, I don't suggest buying anything there, but it sure is fun to wander 
around and look.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Steve Palincsar]

On Tue, 2012-02-07 at 15:51 -0800, Liesl wrote:
> It seems to me like the amount of work
> you're wanting to do changes the bike quite a bit so that it's no
> longer a Wisconsin Vintage Trek '82 610, but something that's morphed
> into a different bike.

Have you ever seen the "creatively restored" Raleighs Peter Weigle has
done in the past couple of years?



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[RBW] Re: Best barcons ever?

[William]

Yes, they are 3TTT Morphe.  I have those bars on the front of my tandem as 
well.  

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[RBW] Re: Best barcons ever?

[Greg J]

Are those 3ttt morphe bars on your Davidson?

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Liesl]

This is an interesting question!  I have a 50 protobleriot, a
51saluki, and a little '86 Trek 620, plus my partner has a Surly LHT,
*and* I grew up in Madison! (I'm just up 94 in Minneapolis now.)  I've
looked into doing a lot of work on my 620 (similar in many ways to
what you've described) and have decided it's not the bike I want to
put the investment into–but then I don't have the skill to build
wheels or do welding, etc.  It seems to me like the amount of work
you're wanting to do changes the bike quite a bit so that it's no
longer a Wisconsin Vintage Trek '82 610, but something that's morphed
into a different bike.  This may not be important to you.  And you
would love the Soma. On a different note, the small Soma frame takes a
650B wheel.  I have two little bikes with this wheel size and love
them, and love the ride.  However, rims and tires are limited, and
that's just a fact-of-the-matter is.  Bottom line?  Go with your
heart.

If you find yourself in Minneapolis and want to see my bikes, drop me
an email.  Little bikes, and their own quirks of space for saddle
bags, etc, aren't discussed on the forum as much as big-bike things
like double top-tubes and so forth.

Best of luck on this caper!  Keep us posted.

-Liesl

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Re: [RBW] Re: Nuance of the RBW birthday program

[Seth Vidal]

On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 5:23 PM, John Bennett  wrote:
> Yep, sorry. We really had to crack down. Customers were transferring
> the birthday credits not only to their valets, but to their footmen,
> butlers, porters, grooms, chauffeurs, and scullery maids, as well.
>
> Fine  for Boxing Day, I suppose, but golly.
>

I'm glad I';m not the only one here watching downton abbey.

-sv

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[RBW] Re: Nuance of the RBW birthday program

[John Bennett]

Yep, sorry. We really had to crack down. Customers were transferring
the birthday credits not only to their valets, but to their footmen,
butlers, porters, grooms, chauffeurs, and scullery maids, as well.

Fine  for Boxing Day, I suppose, but golly.

Cheers,

John





On Feb 7, 10:47 am, William  wrote:
> I just got my Happy Birthday email, with a 10% discount coupon for one
> item.  I was shocked and offended that it contains disclaimer language that
> I am not permitted to transfer the coupon code to my valet.  It's an
> outrage, I tell you, an OUTRAGE!  My valet, Alistair, is beside himself in
> anguish.
>
> Perhaps it's merely another software bug, but the damage is done.

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[RBW] Polishing update

[William]

My Rawland (sacrilege!) sports a used Nitto S-83 seatpost that I got on 
uber-cheap because it was really badly scratched.  I have built up a fair 
bit of confidence sanding and polishing aluminum parts.  I put this part 
off to the last because it was by far the most scratched.  I finally 
decided I was done working on it.  The very deepest scratches are still 
visible, but only barely.  I'm pleased with the results.  The laser etched 
Nitto S-83 logo part is gone now, but honestly I think that's a good thing. 
 

Before:  
http://www.flickr.com/photos/45758191@N04/6774581859/in/photostream/

After:  http://www.flickr.com/photos/45758191@N04/6837661145/in/photostream/

The process was:

tape off below insertion line
disassemble everything and set aside clamp jaws and bolts
easy-off the post for ~3 min
handfile deep gouges
sand with 400 wet-dry until the file marks and deep scratches are gone
sand with 600 until the 400 scratches are gone
sand with 1000 until the 600 scratches are gone
sand with 1200 until the 1000 scratches are gone
simichrome polish with a t-shirt
remove tape, reassemble and install

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[RBW] Re: Intro from new Riv rider

[islaysteve]

PBH 100!?  My god man, I could do chinups on the top tube!  LOL  (and yes, 
I know what kind of comments I'd get if I posted this on Bikesnob.  But 
we're more civilized, no?)

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[RBW] Re: Best barcons ever?

[William]

I got them installed on the bike.  I don't have a meaningful ride report, 
but they felt good in the repair stand, and I love the way they look on the 
bike.  

http://www.flickr.com/photos/45758191@N04/6837658411/in/photostream 


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[RBW] Trade?: Nitto S83 for Crystal Fellow or 626

[cpkane]

I've got a Nitto S83 that's 27.2, that I'd like to trade for a Crystal
Fellow or 626, also in 27.2. Scratched up is OK, rust is not. Let me
know if interested, I'll send pics of mine.

Thanks!
Chris
Greenfield, MA

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Re: [RBW] 1up bike rack for sale

[Larry Schellhase]

The posted link does not work, is this the correct link
http://www.1upusa.com/1upusarackhome.htm

On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 1:35 PM, Lola  wrote:

> Having been really successful in selling our two Rambouillets  through
> this group,  ( thanks Jason and Dan!) we need to sell our bike carrier.
> This is the fastest hitch mounting and bike loading rack ever and works
> like a dream.  We searched for a long time to find a rack as good as this
> one.This rack is for two bikes, but of course you can carry one easily. It
> folds up well and stores easily in the trunk or a cupboard or shelf.
> We live in the SF Bay Area and would rather not ship it.
> Have a look at the webpage as it really describes it well. We didn't get
> to use it much unfortunately, so it is pristine. $250
>
> www.1upusa.com/Big Quik-Rack.htm
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?

[William]

kerning!  Exceptionally well played, sir.  

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[rcnute]

I like buying new bikes as much as the next guy but I'd just build up
the Trek without all the mods.  Use it for your sprightlier adventures
and keep the LHT (nice setup there by the way) for other times.  The
Soma looks like it'd ride quite nicely but my guess is that it splits
the difference between the Trek and the LHT in some ways.

I had a heavily-modded (by others) 650b'ified Trek 520 frame, which
was fine but I don't know that all the work that went into it
necessarily made it a better ride (but it was a cool project).

The Treks that took 27" wheels can fit 700c x 32s and fenders.

Ryan

On Feb 7, 6:05 am, trek610  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I am at a cross roads and need some help deciding on how best to spend my
> money...
>
> I am looking to get a nice all around bike for commuting, perhaps a century
> or two, 2 day bike overnight credit card, and light trail (crushed
> limestone/dirt) type riding. In the summer I wind up with 50 - 150 miles
> per week.   I am currently using a Surly LHT for this type of riding, and
> really like it, but am longing for something a bit more .sprightly.
>  Here is a picture of my current LHT to give you an idea of how I would
> like to setup this new ride.
>
> 
>
> I am not the tallest guy and ride a 50 - 53cm frame depending on the setup.
>  I would outfit his new bike in a similar fashion with fenders, racks,
> rando bag etc...
>
> Here is my problem.  I found a 531cs Trek 610 from 1984 that has (IMHO)
> nice geometry for my needs.  Some specs - 430mm chain-stay, 52mm rake, 72mm
> bottom bracket drop, and i think 72 for so seat and head tube angles.  Trek
> does not publish the geometry for anything but 22.5" frames that year...
>
> Trek Upgrade Path
>
>    1. 700C or 650B wheel conversion - bigger tire, better ride, more fender
>    clearance (I already have a nice set of velocity 700c wheels for this
>    project)
>    2. complete powder coat
>    3. Canti brake studs added
>    4. brazeons for various items
>    5. cold set the rear end
>    6. etc...
>
> I guess in the end this will require many new parts, some of which I have,
> but will be a considerable investment nonetheless.
>
> Now here comes the San Marcos  It seems to be a nice solution as well
> and may very well similar in price to the trek by the time I am done with
> the frame parts.  The San Marcos may be a bit more, but may be a better
> choice in the long run.  The San Marcos seems to have perfect geometry for
> my kind of riding...
>
> What would you do if you were me?  What bike will better serve me in the
> long run.  I have to admit, since I live in Madison WI the Trek has some
> sentimental value to me.  The San Marcos lugs look really nice however!  I
> am torn with which direction to go, and since this is a big outlay of cash
> for me I am looking for some advice before going one way or the other...
>
> Thanks in a advance to any/all help.
>
> Thanks

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[RBW] Re: Intro from new Riv rider

[Jim]

That is an excellent question, and I will measure it once I get back
to town (Sunday) and get the wheels back on it (being serviced as we
speak, trip was a good time to take them off line).   My PBH is 100,
and this bike is definitely not too small!

Jim

On Jan 29, 10:51 pm, JL  wrote:
> Jim,
>
> What is the standover height on your bike?  Is it 96.5 as listed in
> the most recent geometry chart?  (tires would effect that, just
> curious what you are working with)  It must be the up-sloping top tube
> on the Bombadil that put it higher.
>
> JL
>
> On Jan 29, 9:01 pm, Jim  wrote:
>
>
>
> > That is absolutely correct.  I was seriously thinking about a custom,
> > probably a Gunnar Grand Tour, but when you see the Riv frames, and you know
> > they are "right", and they are beautiful, it felt like the right decision
> > from the get-go.
>
> > Jim- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

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Re: [RBW] Re: Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?

[Horace]

Yes, but after taking kerning into account, the difference is much less.

On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 10:36 AM, William  wrote:
> The much longer name : Rambouillet, means a much heavier decal, negating a
> significant part of the weight savings.
>
> Don't even get me started on headbadges!
>
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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[William]

Both!  San Marcos immediately and take your time with the Trek.  Do the 
builds to complement each other in your stable.  After you are done with 
both, if you decide there is too much overlap and you can't stand owning 
two bikes, sell the one you don't like.  

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[RBW] Nuance of the RBW birthday program

[William]

I just got my Happy Birthday email, with a 10% discount coupon for one 
item.  I was shocked and offended that it contains disclaimer language that 
I am not permitted to transfer the coupon code to my valet.  It's an 
outrage, I tell you, an OUTRAGE!  My valet, Alistair, is beside himself in 
anguish.  

Perhaps it's merely another software bug, but the damage is done.  

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Will]

Greetings. 

I also live in Madison, ride a 610 from 1984. It's a 54 cm... I am 5'6". 
Nice bike, good geometry, vertical compliance is very nice. A bit of spring 
to it. 

Some thoughts. 

Start with a trip to Budget Bikes on Regent, the used store location. I've 
always found used fenders: in winter they'll sell you used Planet Bikes for 
$20. Get the biggest you can fit. Then find a tire that works with the 
fenders. You might, I say: might, get to 32s on a 700c rim, I did. though 
it's a challenge.  

Don't put cantis on the bike. The fork blades are softer than you suspect. 
I had my blades restored at Yellow Jersey after I picked up a stick that 
jammed in the fork crown. Which is to say... when you get the fenders, get 
the ones that have release capability. I learned that the hard way. But 
know... the fork blades are designed to deform before the top and down 
tubes, they aren't suitable for posts. 

Don't paint the bike. The enamel it has is good, it might need some Testor 
model paint spot-work, but that's easily done and if the bike looks less 
spiffy, so much the better when it's parked at Trader Joe's or Willy co-op. 
It rides the same. 

Consider an upright bar and Riv's SOS thumbshifters, if you're ride the 
Isthmus/campus/downtown a lot. I have the old Suntour Command thumbies and 
they are wonderful. I'd also look into Velo-Orange's Dia-Comp centerpulls. 
My 610 came with Shimano 600s, which are OK, but I think the centerpulls 
would be better. I had them on an old Raleigh Comp. and liked them a lot. 

As for braise-ons, you can do anything you want with p-clamps, and they are 
more flexible, should you change racks. 

Finally, call CronoMetro and see when the swap event is scheduled this 
spring. You can get everything you want, really cheap, at the swap. Great 
advice as well. 

Good luck.

Will




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Re: [RBW] Re: Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?

[William]

The much longer name : Rambouillet, means a much heavier decal, negating a 
significant part of the weight savings.  

Don't even get me started on headbadges!

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Re: [RBW] Atlantis vs. Sam

[Steven Frederick]

Atlantis seems to be the consensus.  I would agree with the qualifier
that, if you ride small enough a frame to be on a 650b Sam or 26"
Atlantis, I'd at least consider the Sam.  Just because I like 650b
wheels.

Steve

On Sat, Feb 4, 2012 at 7:17 PM, murphyjrfk  wrote:
> i know it tends to be a different comparison, given the price and all.
> but let's assume the price is the same.  i can't decide. at all. and
> price is an issue but still wanna compare.
>
> this is where i'm stuck. i want a bike that can tour. but can mostly
> serve as fun and quick, spirited normal everyday bikes. i don't need a
> "fast" bike. i just want a quick bike. i like the atlantis better, but
> im nervous that it will be sluggish unloaded.  maybe dat ain't true-i
> dunno.
>
> anyways. horrible grammar aside, i am hoping some sam owners and
> atlantis owners would chime in. and if you own both. that'd be even
> betta!
>
> thanks.
>
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[RBW] Re: One for the fire chief - 56 Bombadil on the 'bay

[William]

MBB,

I had the kids come watch the video I did of that trip and told them we 
should pick our destinations for this summer so I can get on top of 
campsite reservations and everything.  They are pretty fired up about it.  

The other micro-camping adventure we've done that you might try is we 
loaded up our backpacks for an overnighter, and did the 2.5 mile hike 
(walk) to a friend's house and made camp in their backyard.  They left the 
back door unlocked in case anybody wanted to use the bathroom.  We made 
noodles for dinner on the camp stove, oatmeal and hot beverages for 
breakfast, broke camp and walked back home.  

The point is it doesn't have to be the least bit complicated.  Even if it's 
a campout in your own yard, it's unforgettable.  Get it done before your 
kids don't want to share a tent with you.  :)




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Re: [RBW] Re: Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?

[Cyclofiend Jim]

There were some minor differences in joinery and dropouts, but they were 
pretty much the same frame with some simpler paint.

http://www.cyclofiend.com/rbw/romulus


- Jim / Cyclofiend.com

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[RBW] Re: Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[Cyclofiend Jim]

I've said before that it's always an honorable thing to revitalize an 
older, worthy frame.  It seemed like it might be a push until you got to 
"add canti posts" - .  It's also been a while since I looked seriously at 
650B conversion candidates, and while I suspect that 610 is among them, I'm 
not sure. (Ride buddy JimG has been riding a converted Trek - 
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimg/6808560813/in/photostream - though he's a 
bit lankier than you.)  And conversions generally have a way of going over 
budget.

I'd also be more inclined if you were the original owner of the frame.  To 
put it bluntly, you are taking a frame which you don't really know the 
history of, making significant changes to it, and hoping it comes out like 
the bike you think is perfect (geometrically speaking).   I've been lucky 
enough to ride the prototype San Marcos and it was a wonderfully responsive 
setup, and comes from the factory for the kind of clearances which make 
sense for your purposes. 

If you are going to keep the LHT, I'd also give some thought to the amount 
of overlap which might be helpful between the two setups. They probably 
meet in the "two day credit card tour" vicinity.  The San Marcos can 
certainly do that, but would be my go-to for centuries, longer rambles and 
certainly trail work.

Hope that helps,

- Jim / Cyclofiend.com

  

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[RBW] Re: Riv Rally East 2012

[Montclair BobbyB]

Thanks, Marc.

We're just about at capacity at the Paddler's Lane, but there are
other B&Bs in town that hopefully will be suitable (see my previous
post with links).
Something else to consider:  CAMPING (by the way) IS an option at
Paddler's Lane, if any of you are so inclined.  It's inexpensive, they
have open lawn to pitch tents, use of the house facilities, and
they've built a brand new bath house that they are very proud of (with
nice showers and toilets).  If the weather cooperates, this could be a
nice option.

We also are approaching capacity on our first shuttle van (we're at
10, with a capacity of 12).  Some riders won't need shuttle service,
and instead will be doing the extended out-and-back.  But before I
commit to a second van, we will need to have at least another 6 riders
(for it to be cost-effective).  We'll find a way to accommodate
everyones' lodging and shuttle needs.

I've also booked a van for the Falling Water Tour.  That will last
approx 2 hours.  Those who prefer to opt out of the tour, of course
you'll be free to spend the time in Ohiopyle (or to just continue on
to Connellsville).

So if you're considering joining us for Riv Rally East, PLEASE try to
firm up your plans and let me know ASAP.

For those who have committed so far, thank you; I'll send out the list
of names that I have (this evening), and I will be asking for a
deposit.  Stay tuned.

THANKS

BB

On Feb 6, 10:03 pm, Marc Irwin  wrote:
> I intend to be there and will stay with the masses at the Paddlers.  I
> have no preferencefor the starting point.  You know the terrain better
> than I.  I have no preference about the falling waters ( I've seen a
> lot of FLW, but one more won't hurt either.).  Let me know the what
> when and where of the deposits and I'll make the rest of my plans.
>
> Marc
>
> On Jan 26, 10:27 am, "Allingham II, Thomas J"
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  wrote:
> > - As soon as possible, a verbal commitment to attend (and I may request a 
> > deposit for the shuttle and lodging (if I book the Paddlers Guest House).  
> > Sam Allingham and Tom Allingham are in; one additional rider is a distinct 
> > possibility.
>
> > - A lodging preference, either:  A. I would like to stay with the masses in 
> > the Paddlers Lane Guest House (if avail), and although I am guaranteed a 
> > bed, it may not be a queen bed, we'll draw straws...  or B. I would like to 
> > make my own lodging arrangements.  Option A preferable for us.
>
> > - A starting point; Cumberland, MD (62 miles to Confluence on Day 1, approx 
> > the first 25 miles are gradual uphill) vs Frostburg, MD  We'd prefer 
> > Cumberland.
> > (47 miles to Confluence on Day 1, approx the first 10 miles are gradual 
> > uphill).  And for those preferring Frostburg, do you need to A. Park in 
> > Frostburg or B. Park in Cumberland and ride to Frostburg ahead of the Rally.
>
> > - A (Yes/No) vote on a Fallingwater tour - Assuming we shuttle via bus, and 
> > take a Noon tour... Figure 1-2 hours total, and will cost approx $20 per 
> > person.  We'd love to do the Fallingwater side trip
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
> > [mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Montclair BobbyB
> > Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2012 6:58 PM
> > To: RBW Owners Bunch
> > Subject: [RBW] Re: Riv Rally East 2012
>
> > Shuttle Update:  Good news... Wilderness Voyageurs (WV) provided me with 
> > what I consider a very reasonable rate for 2 vans (to shuttle approx 25 
> > passengers plus bikes and gear).  They have a large rack on top of one van, 
> > and a box trailer for the balance of the bikes and gear.  The price quote 
> > is $415, which translates to roughly $17 per person (if we have 25), or $28 
> > per person (if we have 15), etc... you get the idea.  We pay for the vans 
> > and trailer, regardless of the number of people.  Either way I think that's 
> > a very reasonable price (compared to other quotes for large buses).  I 
> > would like to propose leaving our cars in Cumberland (or optionally 
> > Frostburg) and getting shuttled back on Sunday (I will explain why in a 
> > moment).
>
> > WV is located in Ohiopyle. PA just off the trail.  As we pass through 
> > Ohiopyle on Sunday (Apr 22), we CAN opt to use WV to shuttle us up to 
> > Fallingwater, IF folks would like to take a tour.  The cost would be
> > $25 per van (from WV HQ), which adds only $2 per person.  I have sent in an 
> > inquiry to the Fallingwater people requesting a group tour rate (normally 
> > $22 individually).  We'll see if they can accommodate a group of 25 for the 
> > Noon time slot; THEN it's up to us to decide whether we'd like to include 
> > this tour or not.  Another option would be to have a nice, relaxing lunch 
> > in Ohiopyle.  I'd like your thoughts, please.
>
> > Next up will be a decision on lodging and shuttle options.  The WV folks 
> > made a pretty good case for leaving our cars in Cumberland MD, citing 
> > better parking optio

[RBW] Need help deciding... Soma San Marcos or Revamp an 84 Trek 610...

[trek610]

Hi all,

I am at a cross roads and need some help deciding on how best to spend my 
money...

I am looking to get a nice all around bike for commuting, perhaps a century 
or two, 2 day bike overnight credit card, and light trail (crushed 
limestone/dirt) type riding. In the summer I wind up with 50 - 150 miles 
per week.   I am currently using a Surly LHT for this type of riding, and 
really like it, but am longing for something a bit more .sprightly. 
 Here is a picture of my current LHT to give you an idea of how I would 
like to setup this new ride.



I am not the tallest guy and ride a 50 - 53cm frame depending on the setup. 
 I would outfit his new bike in a similar fashion with fenders, racks, 
rando bag etc...

Here is my problem.  I found a 531cs Trek 610 from 1984 that has (IMHO) 
nice geometry for my needs.  Some specs - 430mm chain-stay, 52mm rake, 72mm 
bottom bracket drop, and i think 72 for so seat and head tube angles.  Trek 
does not publish the geometry for anything but 22.5" frames that year...

Trek Upgrade Path

   1. 700C or 650B wheel conversion - bigger tire, better ride, more fender 
   clearance (I already have a nice set of velocity 700c wheels for this 
   project)
   2. complete powder coat
   3. Canti brake studs added
   4. brazeons for various items
   5. cold set the rear end
   6. etc... 

I guess in the end this will require many new parts, some of which I have, 
but will be a considerable investment nonetheless.  

Now here comes the San Marcos  It seems to be a nice solution as well 
and may very well similar in price to the trek by the time I am done with 
the frame parts.  The San Marcos may be a bit more, but may be a better 
choice in the long run.  The San Marcos seems to have perfect geometry for 
my kind of riding...  

What would you do if you were me?  What bike will better serve me in the 
long run.  I have to admit, since I live in Madison WI the Trek has some 
sentimental value to me.  The San Marcos lugs look really nice however!  I 
am torn with which direction to go, and since this is a big outlay of cash 
for me I am looking for some advice before going one way or the other...  

Thanks in a advance to any/all help.

Thanks

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[RBW] Re: One for the fire chief - 56 Bombadil on the 'bay

[Montclair BobbyB]

Awesome stuff, Smitty!!!  Thanks,
BB

On Feb 7, 3:44 am, Smitty-A-Go-Go <54ca...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Love the family style s24o! And excellent video.
>
> Me and mine did a multi-family s72o last 
> year.
> Looking forward to the kids riding a bit more on their own in the coming
> years.

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[RBW] Re: VO polished rims, performance issues

[Bill Lucas]

Brain,

Try maroon scotch-brite, 7447.  This is the normal stuff.  I use it to
clean rims.

Regards,
Bill

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[RBW] Re: Riv Rally East 2012

[Marc Irwin]

I intend to be there and will stay with the masses at the Paddlers.  I
have no preferencefor the starting point.  You know the terrain better
than I.  I have no preference about the falling waters ( I've seen a
lot of FLW, but one more won't hurt either.).  Let me know the what
when and where of the deposits and I'll make the rest of my plans.

Marc

On Jan 26, 10:27 am, "Allingham II, Thomas J"
 wrote:
> - As soon as possible, a verbal commitment to attend (and I may request a 
> deposit for the shuttle and lodging (if I book the Paddlers Guest House).  
> Sam Allingham and Tom Allingham are in; one additional rider is a distinct 
> possibility.
>
> - A lodging preference, either:  A. I would like to stay with the masses in 
> the Paddlers Lane Guest House (if avail), and although I am guaranteed a bed, 
> it may not be a queen bed, we'll draw straws...  or B. I would like to make 
> my own lodging arrangements.  Option A preferable for us.
>
> - A starting point; Cumberland, MD (62 miles to Confluence on Day 1, approx 
> the first 25 miles are gradual uphill) vs Frostburg, MD  We'd prefer 
> Cumberland.
> (47 miles to Confluence on Day 1, approx the first 10 miles are gradual 
> uphill).  And for those preferring Frostburg, do you need to A. Park in 
> Frostburg or B. Park in Cumberland and ride to Frostburg ahead of the Rally.
>
> - A (Yes/No) vote on a Fallingwater tour - Assuming we shuttle via bus, and 
> take a Noon tour... Figure 1-2 hours total, and will cost approx $20 per 
> person.  We'd love to do the Fallingwater side trip
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Montclair BobbyB
> Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2012 6:58 PM
> To: RBW Owners Bunch
> Subject: [RBW] Re: Riv Rally East 2012
>
> Shuttle Update:  Good news... Wilderness Voyageurs (WV) provided me with what 
> I consider a very reasonable rate for 2 vans (to shuttle approx 25 passengers 
> plus bikes and gear).  They have a large rack on top of one van, and a box 
> trailer for the balance of the bikes and gear.  The price quote is $415, 
> which translates to roughly $17 per person (if we have 25), or $28 per person 
> (if we have 15), etc... you get the idea.  We pay for the vans and trailer, 
> regardless of the number of people.  Either way I think that's a very 
> reasonable price (compared to other quotes for large buses).  I would like to 
> propose leaving our cars in Cumberland (or optionally Frostburg) and getting 
> shuttled back on Sunday (I will explain why in a moment).
>
> WV is located in Ohiopyle. PA just off the trail.  As we pass through 
> Ohiopyle on Sunday (Apr 22), we CAN opt to use WV to shuttle us up to 
> Fallingwater, IF folks would like to take a tour.  The cost would be
> $25 per van (from WV HQ), which adds only $2 per person.  I have sent in an 
> inquiry to the Fallingwater people requesting a group tour rate (normally $22 
> individually).  We'll see if they can accommodate a group of 25 for the Noon 
> time slot; THEN it's up to us to decide whether we'd like to include this 
> tour or not.  Another option would be to have a nice, relaxing lunch in 
> Ohiopyle.  I'd like your thoughts, please.
>
> Next up will be a decision on lodging and shuttle options.  The WV folks made 
> a pretty good case for leaving our cars in Cumberland MD, citing better 
> parking options, and actually by leaving cars in Cumberland, another 
> advantage would be to allow late arrivals on Friday night (or even Saturday 
> morning), by not having to pre-shuttle at a predetermined time.  Moreover, we 
> can check in with WV at Ohiopyle on Sunday, and provide a pretty accurate 
> time estimate for when we'll need pickup in Connellsville, which is 17 miles 
> down river.  The disadvantage to this is that it tacks on additional time and 
> distance for our friends coming from the North.  But Sunday will be a shorter 
> day, and I'd anticipate arriving in Connellsville around 3, putting us back 
> in Cumberland by around 5 PM.
>
> For those who would prefer to start in Frostburg (which is 16 miles up trail 
> from Cumberland), this would give you a later start on Sat AM (while you wait 
> for the rally to catch up) and it would spare you 16 miles of additional 
> climbing (albeit at a gradual 1% grade or less).
> I'm sure we can convince the WV crew to drop people in Frostburg on the way 
> back into Cumberland on Sunday, but they may tack on a small surcharge.  
> Another option for those wishing to start from Frostburg on Saturday would be 
> to arrive in Cumberland during the day on Friday, leaving your car in 
> Cumberland, then riding 16 miles to Frostburg "up the climb" to a hotel in 
> Frostburg... then you can "sleep in" on Sat while the rest of us huff and 
> puff our way up to meet you.
>
> Finally, for lodging options in Confluence, I would strongly recommend 
> reserving the Paddlers Lane Retreat guest house, which can accom

[RBW] Re: Continuing Maintenace Queries - Phil Woob BB Bearings?

[ascpgh]

Jim:

The Phil BB in my 2001 Ram is still there and still going after a
Trans Am ride and everything since . The one in my new in 2007
commuter died last spring. I put in a cheap UN-71 I had and never got
around to sending the crunchy Phil in for service.

I guess extreme conditions can mitigate one's experience with
longevity. That makes the seals sound suspect and the SKF BB unit
worth calling Compass Cycles to order.

ANDY
Pittsburgh

On Feb 5, 9:49 pm, jimD  wrote:
> … and  yet more maintenance questions;
> How often do PW BB bracket bearing go between servicing?
> Everything on the custom is nearing the 15 k mark - working fine but wonder 
> what I should be doing.
> -JImD

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[RBW] 1up bike rack for sale

[Lola]

Having been really successful in selling our two Rambouillets  through this 
group,  ( thanks Jason and Dan!) we need to sell our bike carrier. 
This is the fastest hitch mounting and bike loading rack ever and works 
like a dream.  We searched for a long time to find a rack as good as this 
one.This rack is for two bikes, but of course you can carry one easily. It 
folds up well and stores easily in the trunk or a cupboard or shelf.
We live in the SF Bay Area and would rather not ship it.
Have a look at the webpage as it really describes it well. We didn't get to 
use it much unfortunately, so it is pristine. $250

www.1upusa.com/Big Quik-Rack.htm

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[RBW] Re: One for the fire chief - 56 Bombadil on the 'bay

[Montclair BobbyB]

Bill:

What a great trip!!  Big points for the BART/Ferry Combo. Thanks for
sharing that... I've vowed to do a few S24Os this year...involving
multi-modes of transportation. I only wish my kids (who prefer to
travel by car) had an interest in joining me... I'm holding out hope
that once they have kids they'll want Grandpa to lead them all on a
nice family adventure.

Peace,
BB



On Feb 6, 10:39 pm, William  wrote:
> MBB
>
> Yes, mine is orange.  Darker than an XO-1, but definitely orange.
> I ride the Bombadil a bit.  Nowhere near the mileage of my brevet bikes.
> It has served as my daily commuter and will probably do more of that duty
> now that I have a Slickersack.  I did a more recent youtube on my family
> Angel Island S24O, a trip where I rode the Bombadil:
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqgpPRaV6qo
>
> Iggy Pop For the Win!
>
> Other Bombadil related infrastructure investment included buying Nitto Big
> Front and Big Rear Racks from Riv.  So it's for sure my loaded touring
> bike, even though I'm not going on a loaded tour for a couple years at
> least.  I also have a thumbies shifter project that's going to happen soon
> on the Bomba.

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[RBW] Re: Good quality fixed/free ss rear hubs with QR?

[EricP]

Been using an All City hub.  Didn't have a problem with it last year
and about 500 or so miles.  (The bike it is on switches between single
speed and 1x8 or 9).  Jim Thill at Hiawatha suggested it as a more
reliable model than the Surly.  And the price is about the same.
Comes as a bolt on, but with hollow axle for quick release conversion
(which I did on mine.)

Eric Platt
St. Paul, MN

On Feb 7, 9:46 am, "Jim M."  wrote:
> The QB and SO are both 120 spaced at the rear. The original QB hub
> with quick release was made for Riv by Suzue. It was a free/free flip
> flop, though I fixed mine with a BB lock ring and some loctite. I
> think the SO hub might be a free/fix but it is 120. I've also used
> White Industries hubs. They don't have quick release but they bolt on
> with an allen wrench. In field testing, I haven't found bolt-on hubs
> to be that significantly slower than quick release.
>
> On Feb 6, 10:17 am, PATRICK MOORE  wrote:
>
>
>
> > I've got a Surley on the Riv commuter and adjusting bearing tension
> > has always been problematical; better since I re-swapped the QR axle
> > for a solid one, but still hard to find that elusive spot between play
> > and binding. I've not had this problem with any other rear hub, QR or
> > solid.
>
> > Beside Phil, can anyone recommend a QR compatible (or adaptable) rear
> > fixed/free hub in either 126 or 130 OL? You Quickbeam and SimpleOne
> > owners ought to have some ideas, no?
>
> > Thanks.
>
> > --
> > Patrick Moore
> > Albuquerque, NM
> > For professional resumes, contact
> > Patrick Moore, ACRWhttp://resumespecialties.com/index.html- Hide quoted 
> > text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

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[RBW] Re: Good quality fixed/free ss rear hubs with QR?

[Jim M.]

The QB and SO are both 120 spaced at the rear. The original QB hub
with quick release was made for Riv by Suzue. It was a free/free flip
flop, though I fixed mine with a BB lock ring and some loctite. I
think the SO hub might be a free/fix but it is 120. I've also used
White Industries hubs. They don't have quick release but they bolt on
with an allen wrench. In field testing, I haven't found bolt-on hubs
to be that significantly slower than quick release.

On Feb 6, 10:17 am, PATRICK MOORE  wrote:
> I've got a Surley on the Riv commuter and adjusting bearing tension
> has always been problematical; better since I re-swapped the QR axle
> for a solid one, but still hard to find that elusive spot between play
> and binding. I've not had this problem with any other rear hub, QR or
> solid.
>
> Beside Phil, can anyone recommend a QR compatible (or adaptable) rear
> fixed/free hub in either 126 or 130 OL? You Quickbeam and SimpleOne
> owners ought to have some ideas, no?
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
> Patrick Moore
> Albuquerque, NM
> For professional resumes, contact
> Patrick Moore, ACRWhttp://resumespecialties.com/index.html

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[RBW] New Bicycle Quarterly Web Site

[Jan Heine]

The new Bicycle Quarterly web site is up and running: New layout, new
contents and some new sample articles from the pages of Bicycle
Quarterly. These include the famous "Collecting Roads" article, the
inspirational report from the "Raid Pyreneen" and Jada Van Vliet's
"Touring in India" on a locally-made 3-speed. Start exploring the site
at http://www.bikequarterly.com/

Jan Heine
Editor
Bicycle Quarterly
http://www.bikequarterly.com

Follow our blog at http://janheine.wordpress.com/

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[RBW] Re: PDX Saturday Ride?

[Ron MH]

I'd be up for a ride, except I work on Saturday mornings. I'm not
done until 1:00. That wouldn't' leave much time for a ride. :(
Thanks for the invitation.

On Feb 2, 9:30 am, Smitty-A-Go-Go <54ca...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Putting out the feelers to see if any PDX Rivsters are interested to get
> out for a ride this Saturday. I'm available until about 3pm. I have a few
> rides/destinations on my short list but am willing to go just about
> anywhere. I'm leaning toward something in the 25-40 mile neighborhood but
> that's flexible. I mostly just want to get out on a nice ride with good
> folk and see something new.
>
> --Smitty

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Re: [RBW] Re: Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?

[Steven Frederick]

On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 8:32 AM, Steve Palincsar  wrote:
> On Tue, 2012-02-07 at 05:25 -0800, Michael Hechmer wrote:
>> I would expect that the Romulus used more rigid seat stays and front
>> fork to support the canti brakes.  Maybe a couple of oz.
>
> The original Romulus did not have canti brakes.
>


Yeah, the Canti-Rom was an accident--miscommunication between Riv and
the builder.

Going by memory, the Rom was intended as a less expensive version of
the Rambouillet.  One color paint, slightly cheaper stays.  (not heat
treated?  single-butted? Not tapered?  Some small difference like
that)  I can't recall if maybe it had a slightly cheaper tubeset, too,
but it was a very similar frame and only weighed a tiny bit more than
the Rambouillet...

Steve F.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?

[Steve Palincsar]

On Tue, 2012-02-07 at 05:25 -0800, Michael Hechmer wrote:
> I would expect that the Romulus used more rigid seat stays and front
> fork to support the canti brakes.  Maybe a couple of oz.

The original Romulus did not have canti brakes.



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[RBW] Re: Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?

[Michael Hechmer]

I would expect that the Romulus used more rigid seat stays and front fork 
to support the canti brakes.  Maybe a couple of oz.

Michael

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Re: [RBW] Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?

[Steven Frederick]

A handful of grams at most--I think the Romulus used slightly beefier stays.

Steve

On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 8:11 AM, Eric  wrote:
> Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?
>
> Just curious, not trying to be a weight weenie!
>
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[RBW] Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?

[Eric]

Any weight difference in Romulus/Rambouillet?

Just curious, not trying to be a weight weenie!

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[RBW] Re: One for the fire chief - 56 Bombadil on the 'bay

[Smitty-A-Go-Go]

Love the family style s24o! And excellent video.

Me and mine did a multi-family s72o last 
year. 
Looking forward to the kids riding a bit more on their own in the coming 
years.

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