Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[cyclotourist]

I've found I prefer higher (~68mm drop) BBs and shorter (430mm) stays. Just
seems to work better for me better than the long/low aesthetic. It may be
in my head of course, but definitely hasn't lead to doom and gloom on
rides! :-)

On Sat, Nov 7, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Kainalu  wrote:

> Yeah, I was just nervous after reading Mitch's post relating Steve's
> recollection of Jan's opinion regarding this golden mean. Then I relaxed my
> mind with thoughts of scraping pedals.
> The most relevant takeaway- "Whether this is arbitrary or really results
> in the most pleasant handling bike remains unknown."
> -Kai
>
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Cheers,
David

Member, Supreme Council of Cyberspace

"it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Kainalu]

Yeah, I was just nervous after reading Mitch's post relating Steve's 
recollection of Jan's opinion regarding this golden mean. Then I relaxed my 
mind with thoughts of scraping pedals.
The most relevant takeaway- "Whether this is arbitrary or really results in the 
most pleasant handling bike remains unknown." 
-Kai

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Bill Lindsay]

"that they say it has little to do with bike handling and stability is to 
say it has something to do with it, however slight. Right? "

Yes.  Bottom Bracket height had something to do with it, just not all that 
much.  I was disagreeing with your previous speculation that BB height "is 
as big a factor to this sweet spot as anything".  I don't thing BB height 
is the dominant thing, or even a very important thing.  It's something you 
can definitely screw up, and it's a minor contributor.  

Less fretting and more riding is almost always better




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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Kainalu]

Hmmm.. no more stable would be a bold statement, but that they say it has 
little to do with bike handling and stability is to say it has something to do 
with it, however slight. Right? So, maybe the importance of hitting that sweet 
spot in tire size is overblown about as much as the importance of bottom 
bracket height is underblown? 
Perhaps I won't allow myself to fret about either
-Kai

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[jandrews_nyc]

I just put the EX version on my S.H.  They don't seem any larger than the 
38mm Little Big Ben's that were on there.
Looking forward to the inaugural ride.




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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Bill Lindsay]

IMO, no.  Bottom Bracket height has been shown by some of the deepest 
thinkers about bikes to have very little to do with actual stability on the 
bike.  Grant likes low BB because it makes it far easier to get the bars 
up.  Low BBs get you the risk of pedal strike when you use small diameter 
tires, and the converse that you point out is true: low BBs give you 
permission to run large diameter tires.  

Jan Heine concluded that BB height on its own has very little to do with 
handling at all.  The general consensus is that BB height is very 
meaningful to fit the person on the bike comfortably, but has little to do 
with how the bike rides.  Objectors to that conventional wisdom will state 
anecdotes "I had a bike with a high BB and it rode like crap" etc.  That 
doesn't prove that BB height had anything to do with the bike riding like 
crap.  Correlation vs Causation.  

All of the above, IMHO, ATMO.  

On Friday, November 6, 2015 at 9:10:16 AM UTC-8, Kainalu wrote:
>
> Bottom bracket height is as big a factor to this sweet spot as anything, 
> yes? Presumably Rivendell bikes and similarly low bottomed machines give us 
> the tools to go extra puffed?
> -Kai
> Brooklyn NY 

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mitch Browne]

The Barlow Pass measurement should read 35mm @ 40 PSI

On Friday, November 6, 2015 at 9:50:45 AM UTC-8, Mitch Browne wrote:
>
> For comparison I mounted a 700c x 38 Barlow pass on a Mavic A719 rim 
> and added measurement to findings below: 
>
> Month old  Barlow Pass 35mm @ 50 PSI 
> New SL reads 37.4 mm @ 41.4 PSI 
> One week old EX reads 40 mm @ 41.2 PSI 
>
> I won't have a chance to ride around but 
>
> On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 3:44 PM, Daniel Jackson 
>  wrote: 
> > I've taken the EX version of this tire on the dirt and paved roads of 
> > northern VT over the last month. About 50 miles on class 4 road, 200 
> miles 
> > on maintained dirt/gravel, and 200 miles on pavement 
> > 
> > I'm 175 lbs. Ive settled on front at 35 PSI and rear at 45 PSI. 
> > 
> > Take following assessment with a grain of salt, as I switched out 
> Marathon 
> > Supremes when I put these on - so the difference is rather drastic. That 
> > said, I have ridden EL Barlows on the same bike about a year ago, so 
> > appreciate the supple tire revolution. 
> > 
> > Overall, they do what a supple tire should do, and I imagine the SLs do 
> so 
> > as well as EL Barlows for a fraction of the price. Much of the road 
> chatter 
> > and noise typical of the Supremes is significantly dampened by these 
> > beauties. I notice great grab while climbing through and cornering in 
> the 
> > loose stuff, i.e., performance subjectively akin to EL Barlows. 
> > 
> > I went with the EX because of where I ride and hope for longer life. A 
> > friend of mine has the SLs and I plan to swap out for comparison at some 
> > point - but I fear its time to put the Ice Spiker Pros back on for the 
> > coming snows. 
> > 
> > If you've never tried a supple tire, these are a great entry. If you've 
> worn 
> > out your beautiful EL Compass tires, these would make a good cheaper 
> > alternative. TIME WILL TELL whether or not they're durable. 
> > 
> > They measure 40mm on my Velocity 700c Chukkar rims. 
> > 
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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mitch Browne]

For comparison I mounted a 700c x 38 Barlow pass on a Mavic A719 rim
and added measurement to findings below:

Month old  Barlow Pass 35mm @ 50 PSI
New SL reads 37.4 mm @ 41.4 PSI
One week old EX reads 40 mm @ 41.2 PSI

I won't have a chance to ride around but

On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 3:44 PM, Daniel Jackson
 wrote:
> I've taken the EX version of this tire on the dirt and paved roads of
> northern VT over the last month. About 50 miles on class 4 road, 200 miles
> on maintained dirt/gravel, and 200 miles on pavement
>
> I'm 175 lbs. Ive settled on front at 35 PSI and rear at 45 PSI.
>
> Take following assessment with a grain of salt, as I switched out Marathon
> Supremes when I put these on - so the difference is rather drastic. That
> said, I have ridden EL Barlows on the same bike about a year ago, so
> appreciate the supple tire revolution.
>
> Overall, they do what a supple tire should do, and I imagine the SLs do so
> as well as EL Barlows for a fraction of the price. Much of the road chatter
> and noise typical of the Supremes is significantly dampened by these
> beauties. I notice great grab while climbing through and cornering in the
> loose stuff, i.e., performance subjectively akin to EL Barlows.
>
> I went with the EX because of where I ride and hope for longer life. A
> friend of mine has the SLs and I plan to swap out for comparison at some
> point - but I fear its time to put the Ice Spiker Pros back on for the
> coming snows.
>
> If you've never tried a supple tire, these are a great entry. If you've worn
> out your beautiful EL Compass tires, these would make a good cheaper
> alternative. TIME WILL TELL whether or not they're durable.
>
> They measure 40mm on my Velocity 700c Chukkar rims.
>
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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Kainalu]

Bottom bracket height is as big a factor to this sweet spot as anything, yes? 
Presumably Rivendell bikes and similarly low bottomed machines give us the 
tools to go extra puffed?
-Kai
Brooklyn NY 

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mitch Browne]

> Received Soma SL's this afternoon. I now have an SL on front and EX on 
> rear both mounted on Velocity Dyad rims.
>
> New SL reads 37.4 mm @ 41.4 PSI
> One week old EX reads 40 mm @ 41.2 PSI
>
> I won't have a chance to ride around but as expected the SL tread feels 
> similar to the Compass Barlow Pass EL I have unmounted. The side wall of SL 
> and EX are the same and have a sort of waxy feel compared to Compass but 
> they're pretty supple.
>
Steve Palincsar recollects Jan had a written opinion on 700c max tire size. 
Coincidentally I was reading VBQ Vol 2 number 3 from winter 2004 and found 
"Choosing Your Wheels: History, Comfort and Rolling Resistance."  He makes 
a case for a "golden mean"  that's achieved with 700c x 25 and 650b x 38. 
His escape comment in the conclusion is "Whether this is arbitrary or 
really results in the most pleasant handling bike remains unknown." 

I'd say in the intervening 10+ yrs he's softened his conclusion and 
accomodates wider tires in his supple equation. For me commuting in the 
dark to work and running errands around town over the years I've found 42mm 
Schwalbes worked well for cracks, roots, branches etc. For me 42+mm of any 
tire is preferred for the type of riding I do.

His article also mentioned the not as robust nature of supple tires which 
painfully I've found true. I now have Stan's in my tubes and tire wipes 
installed. I may add a rabitt's foot (or lucky charm) if all else fails.

My conclusion. Supple tires are comfortable and fun but can be painful with 
flats or replacement cost.

Mitch Browne
San Luis Obispo, CA

 

>  
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Daniel Jackson]

I've taken the EX version of this tire on the dirt and paved roads of 
northern VT over the last month. About 50 miles on class 4 road, 200 miles 
on maintained dirt/gravel, and 200 miles on pavement

I'm 175 lbs. Ive settled on front at 35 PSI and rear at 45 PSI. 

Take following assessment with a grain of salt, as I switched out Marathon 
Supremes when I put these on - so the difference is rather drastic. That 
said, I have ridden EL Barlows on the same bike about a year ago, so 
appreciate the supple tire revolution.

Overall, they do what a supple tire should do, and I imagine the SLs do so 
as well as EL Barlows for a fraction of the price. Much of the road chatter 
and noise typical of the Supremes is significantly dampened by these 
beauties. I notice great grab while climbing through and cornering in the 
loose stuff, i.e., performance subjectively akin to EL Barlows.

I went with the EX because of where I ride and hope for longer life. A 
friend of mine has the SLs and I plan to swap out for comparison at some 
point - but I fear its time to put the Ice Spiker Pros back on for the 
coming snows. 

If you've never tried a supple tire, these are a great entry. If you've 
worn out your beautiful EL Compass tires, these would make a good cheaper 
alternative. TIME WILL TELL whether or not they're durable. 

They measure 40mm on my Velocity 700c Chukkar rims. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Steve Palincsar]

On 11/05/2015 05:40 PM, ant ritchey wrote:
Just slapped a pair of the lighter versions (whatever they're called) 
on my Hilsen.


Pumped 'em to 80 (they are 75 max)


Why???



and picked up a pretty little shard of brown glass exactly 2.5 blocks 
from my house!


Will report back soon enough, hopefully.


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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[David Banzer]

And if you could report actual width as well I appreciate that. 
David
Chicago 

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mark Reimer]

80, holy smokes! If you would entertain a request, could you also report
back how they feel at 30 or 40 psi? These are the Supple Vitesse EX tires,
yes?

On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 4:40 PM, ant ritchey 
wrote:

> Just slapped a pair of the lighter versions (whatever they're called) on
> my Hilsen.
>
> Pumped 'em to 80 (they are 75 max) and picked up a pretty little shard of
> brown glass exactly 2.5 blocks from my house!
>
> Will report back soon enough, hopefully.
>
>
> On Monday, November 2, 2015 at 3:28:01 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>>
>> There was a lot of pleading and whining on the mailing lists asking for
>> wide 700Cs.  I think that pleading finally won Jan over.
>>
>> On 11/02/2015 06:18 PM, 'Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch wrote:
>>
>> I'm surprised Compass even went to 38, never mind 42. Jan's theory has
>> been that whatever the wheel size, there is an optimum sweet spot for
>> plushness, speed, handling, and it so happens that when you measure wheel
>> plus tire, the total circumference is almost equal. I think it is something
>> like 700C = 32mm, 650B = 42mm, 26" = 52mm. When you start going beyond a
>> 700 x 35, I think the handling starts to get a bit weird. Plus your bike
>> starts to get pretty jacked, unless it was designed for monster tires to
>> begin with. I rode a bike with 700 x 41C Nimbus tires for a few years in
>> the early 90s. I wasn't such a tire snob back then, and I've since heard
>> the Nimbus series were considered dogs(no doubt stiff sidewalls, they were
>> probably also belted), but it was about the only thing going in a wide road
>> tire back then. I found it just fine for city riding, but a bit sluggish in
>> the turns. The bike was built with those tires in mind, but there was
>> barely any clearance, never mind fenders.
>>
>> I realize he sells tires, and so the BQ Jan must accommodate the Compass
>> Jan, and Compass is already beyond his stated optimums in both 700C and
>> 650B with the latest tire offerings (and I may go for a pair of Switchbacks
>> at some point.) But anyway, at some point, how much is enough already? He
>> has even said the Rat Traps are occasionally a bit overly bouncy on the
>> road.
>>
>> On Monday, November 2, 2015 at 4:35:32 PM UTC-5, Amit Singh wrote:
>>>
>>> The last time Soma offered it's 700x38mm C-Line, Compass was not far
>>> behind to offer it's own 700x38mm.
>>>
>>> I hope the same thing will happen this time. ... and if not, it's worth
>>> asking again.
>>>
>>> Jan, could you please make a Compass 700x42mm tire for us to purchase? :)
>>>
>>
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[ant ritchey]

Just slapped a pair of the lighter versions (whatever they're called) on my 
Hilsen.

Pumped 'em to 80 (they are 75 max) and picked up a pretty little shard of 
brown glass exactly 2.5 blocks from my house!

Will report back soon enough, hopefully.

On Monday, November 2, 2015 at 3:28:01 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
> There was a lot of pleading and whining on the mailing lists asking for 
> wide 700Cs.  I think that pleading finally won Jan over.
>
> On 11/02/2015 06:18 PM, 'Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch wrote:
>
> I'm surprised Compass even went to 38, never mind 42. Jan's theory has 
> been that whatever the wheel size, there is an optimum sweet spot for 
> plushness, speed, handling, and it so happens that when you measure wheel 
> plus tire, the total circumference is almost equal. I think it is something 
> like 700C = 32mm, 650B = 42mm, 26" = 52mm. When you start going beyond a 
> 700 x 35, I think the handling starts to get a bit weird. Plus your bike 
> starts to get pretty jacked, unless it was designed for monster tires to 
> begin with. I rode a bike with 700 x 41C Nimbus tires for a few years in 
> the early 90s. I wasn't such a tire snob back then, and I've since heard 
> the Nimbus series were considered dogs(no doubt stiff sidewalls, they were 
> probably also belted), but it was about the only thing going in a wide road 
> tire back then. I found it just fine for city riding, but a bit sluggish in 
> the turns. The bike was built with those tires in mind, but there was 
> barely any clearance, never mind fenders.
>
> I realize he sells tires, and so the BQ Jan must accommodate the Compass 
> Jan, and Compass is already beyond his stated optimums in both 700C and 
> 650B with the latest tire offerings (and I may go for a pair of Switchbacks 
> at some point.) But anyway, at some point, how much is enough already? He 
> has even said the Rat Traps are occasionally a bit overly bouncy on the 
> road. 
>
> On Monday, November 2, 2015 at 4:35:32 PM UTC-5, Amit Singh wrote: 
>>
>> The last time Soma offered it's 700x38mm C-Line, Compass was not far 
>> behind to offer it's own 700x38mm. 
>>
>> I hope the same thing will happen this time. ... and if not, it's worth 
>> asking again. 
>>
>> Jan, could you please make a Compass 700x42mm tire for us to purchase? :)
>>
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Steve Palincsar]

There was a lot of pleading and whining on the mailing lists asking for 
wide 700Cs.  I think that pleading finally won Jan over.


On 11/02/2015 06:18 PM, 'Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch wrote:
I'm surprised Compass even went to 38, never mind 42. Jan's theory has 
been that whatever the wheel size, there is an optimum sweet spot for 
plushness, speed, handling, and it so happens that when you measure 
wheel plus tire, the total circumference is almost equal. I think it 
is something like 700C = 32mm, 650B = 42mm, 26" = 52mm. When you start 
going beyond a 700 x 35, I think the handling starts to get a bit 
weird. Plus your bike starts to get pretty jacked, unless it was 
designed for monster tires to begin with. I rode a bike with 700 x 41C 
Nimbus tires for a few years in the early 90s. I wasn't such a tire 
snob back then, and I've since heard the Nimbus series were considered 
dogs(no doubt stiff sidewalls, they were probably also belted), but it 
was about the only thing going in a wide road tire back then. I found 
it just fine for city riding, but a bit sluggish in the turns. The 
bike was built with those tires in mind, but there was barely any 
clearance, never mind fenders.


I realize he sells tires, and so the BQ Jan must accommodate the 
Compass Jan, and Compass is already beyond his stated optimums in both 
700C and 650B with the latest tire offerings (and I may go for a pair 
of Switchbacks at some point.) But anyway, at some point, how much is 
enough already? He has even said the Rat Traps are occasionally a bit 
overly bouncy on the road.


On Monday, November 2, 2015 at 4:35:32 PM UTC-5, Amit Singh wrote:

The last time Soma offered it's 700x38mm C-Line, Compass was not
far behind to offer it's own 700x38mm.

I hope the same thing will happen this time. ... and if not, it's
worth asking again.

Jan, could you please make a Compass 700x42mm tire for us to
purchase? :)




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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

['Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch]

I'm surprised Compass even went to 38, never mind 42. Jan's theory has been 
that whatever the wheel size, there is an optimum sweet spot for plushness, 
speed, handling, and it so happens that when you measure wheel plus tire, 
the total circumference is almost equal. I think it is something like 700C 
= 32mm, 650B = 42mm, 26" = 52mm. When you start going beyond a 700 x 35, I 
think the handling starts to get a bit weird. Plus your bike starts to get 
pretty jacked, unless it was designed for monster tires to begin with. I 
rode a bike with 700 x 41C Nimbus tires for a few years in the early 90s. I 
wasn't such a tire snob back then, and I've since heard the Nimbus series 
were considered dogs(no doubt stiff sidewalls, they were probably also 
belted), but it was about the only thing going in a wide road tire back 
then. I found it just fine for city riding, but a bit sluggish in the 
turns. The bike was built with those tires in mind, but there was barely 
any clearance, never mind fenders.

I realize he sells tires, and so the BQ Jan must accommodate the Compass 
Jan, and Compass is already beyond his stated optimums in both 700C and 
650B with the latest tire offerings (and I may go for a pair of Switchbacks 
at some point.) But anyway, at some point, how much is enough already? He 
has even said the Rat Traps are occasionally a bit overly bouncy on the 
road. 

On Monday, November 2, 2015 at 4:35:32 PM UTC-5, Amit Singh wrote:
>
> The last time Soma offered it's 700x38mm C-Line, Compass was not far 
> behind to offer it's own 700x38mm.
>
> I hope the same thing will happen this time. ... and if not, it's worth 
> asking again. 
>
> Jan, could you please make a Compass 700x42mm tire for us to purchase? :)
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Amit Singh]

The last time Soma offered it's 700x38mm C-Line, Compass was not far behind to 
offer it's own 700x38mm.

I hope the same thing will happen this time. ... and if not, it's worth asking 
again. 

Jan, could you please make a Compass 700x42mm tire for us to purchase? :)

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[John Phillips]

Thanks Mitch, 

I have the Compass Barlow Pass EL tires on my Hunq at home, and was 
curious how these would differ. 

John 

On Monday, November 2, 2015 at 10:31:38 AM UTC-8, Mitch Browne wrote:
>
> I have tried both Compass EL and Soma EX 700c tires in recent weeks 
> and find the Compass feels much more plush. I believe the difference 
> between casings between the two have been discussed in recent threads. 
> I do find the Soma sidewalls to be a little more stiff. 
>
> I have a set of Soma SL tires (insanity thrives) coming in a day or 
> two for fair SL to EL comparison. 
>
> If Compass made 700c x 42 I'd go for those without a doubt. Each rider 
> knows their limits in terms of wear, use, budget so EL's won't work 
> for everyone. I am at my limit ;) 
>
> Compass tires have no minimum air pressure or direction on sidewall. 
> Soma says minimum of 40 psi. In my opinion they can go a few pounds 
> lower but due to stiffer tread (by design for wear) they start to feel 
> squirrely at 35 in the rear. 
>
> Mitch Browne 
> San Luis Obispo, CA 
>
> On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 10:19 AM, John Phillips  > wrote: 
> > Has anyone tried these yet? My pair of Soma Vitesse extra wear tread 
> just 
> > arrived at my office. 
> > 
> > John 
> > 
> > On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:26:25 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote: 
> >> 
> >> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/ 
> >> 
> >> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what 
> I've 
> >> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire 
> but 
> >> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version 
> >> 
> >> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mitch Browne]

I have tried both Compass EL and Soma EX 700c tires in recent weeks
and find the Compass feels much more plush. I believe the difference
between casings between the two have been discussed in recent threads.
I do find the Soma sidewalls to be a little more stiff.

I have a set of Soma SL tires (insanity thrives) coming in a day or
two for fair SL to EL comparison.

If Compass made 700c x 42 I'd go for those without a doubt. Each rider
knows their limits in terms of wear, use, budget so EL's won't work
for everyone. I am at my limit ;)

Compass tires have no minimum air pressure or direction on sidewall.
Soma says minimum of 40 psi. In my opinion they can go a few pounds
lower but due to stiffer tread (by design for wear) they start to feel
squirrely at 35 in the rear.

Mitch Browne
San Luis Obispo, CA

On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 10:19 AM, John Phillips  wrote:
> Has anyone tried these yet? My pair of Soma Vitesse extra wear tread just
> arrived at my office.
>
> John
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:26:25 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>
>> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>>
>> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've
>> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but
>> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>>
>>
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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[John Phillips]

Has anyone tried these yet? My pair of Soma Vitesse extra wear tread just 
arrived at my office.

John 

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:26:25 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>
> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>
> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Daniel Jackson]

Posted the following on the iBOB thread:

Took the EX version of this tire on the dirt roads of northern VT today. 
About 7 miles on class 4 road and 10 miles on maintained dirt/gravel. 

I'm 175 lbs. After about 5 miles settled on Front at 35 PSI and rear at 45 
PSI. I'll take some photos of the tires, but don't have a scale.

Tread is smooth like Jack Browns. 

Take following assessment with a grain of salt, as I switched out Marathon 
Supremes when I put these on - so the difference is rather drastic. That 
said, I have ridden EL Barlows on the same bike about a year ago, so 
appreciate the supple tire revolution.

Overall, they do what a supple tire should do, and do so as well as EL 
Barlows for a fraction of the price. Much of the road chatter and noise 
typical of the Supremes is significantly dampened by these beauties. And I 
also noticed great grab while climbing through and cornering in the loose 
stuff, i.e., performance subjectively akin to EL Barlows.

I went with the EX because of where I ride and hope for longer life. A 
friend of mine has the SLs and I plan to swap out for comparison sometime 
in the next month when its convenient. His SLs are on a bike used on 
predominantly pavement; my EXs are on a bike used on predominantly dirt 
roads. 

If you've never tried a supple tire, these are a great entry. If you've 
worn out your beautiful Compass tires, these would make a good cheaper 
alternative. TIME WILL TELL whether or not they're durable. 

On Wednesday, October 14, 2015 at 12:22:52 PM UTC-4, hsmitham wrote:
>
> Thanks for the feedback Luke. Beautiful build. Great to see you did the PR.
>
> Tail Winds,
>
> ~Hugh
> On Oct 14, 2015 9:06 AM, "lukeheller" > 
> wrote:
>
>> Oh yeah, it shimmys with or without the saddle bag by the way. But I put 
>> a lot of effort into front loading that bike to reduce shimmy. I only use a 
>> saddle bag on it for 1200's or unsupported 600kms.
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 14, 2015 at 12:04:20 PM UTC-4, lukeheller wrote:
>>>
>>> This custom 700c NFE shimmys.
>>> It's about a 60x60.
>>> Seat tube angle is 71.5.
>>> Fork rake is ~75
>>>
>>> The shimmy isn't a problem unless i let go of the bars *AND* lean 
>>> backwards. But then, it is a problem.
>>>
>>> I use a TOKEN needle bearing headset. That helped but didn't fully 
>>> remove the issue.
>>>
>>> Different tire sizes/suppleness affects shimmy. I run 700x35 kojacks. 
>>> Shimmys with no hands on bars leaning back.
>>> If I run it with 700x28 marathon plus, shimmy is significantly reduced. 
>>> But those tires feel dead so I don't ride them.
>>> I'd be curious to see what those fat supple beasts would do to my shimmy 
>>> problem. Probably not help! Yet I'd like to try them.
>>>
>>> On Saturday, October 10, 2015 at 6:53:59 PM UTC-4, Mike Schiller wrote:

 Shimmy on an NFE?... I'd like to see that bike and how it's 
 loaded/built.  My Matthews uses  similar tubing ( 8/5/8 OS) and geometry 
 as 
 the NFE and I don't get any shimmy at all. The NFE has a similar tubeset 
 to 
  a Hilsen BTW.   So either they have too much weight up high or something 
 else is going on.

 back to original  subject... I'd love to try those tires on my Bantam. 
 It was designed around 44 mm tires and fenders. Wonder it they are 
 tubeless 
 compatible? 

 ~mike
 Carlsbad Ca

 On Saturday, October 10, 2015 at 11:22:41 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>
> So yes!! I've been thinking on these same lines. I like the Elephant 
> NFE but have heard even with the low trail fork there's some shimmy. 
> Never 
> ridden one myself. I love the idea of a bike with a light tube set 
> capable 
> of running 42mm+  CX & slick tires. I suppose some are calling it a 
> monster 
> cross. Just thinking about my ultimate adventure bike.
>
> ~Hugh 
>
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Hugh Smitham]

Thanks for the feedback Luke. Beautiful build. Great to see you did the PR.

Tail Winds,

~Hugh
On Oct 14, 2015 9:06 AM, "lukeheller"  wrote:

> Oh yeah, it shimmys with or without the saddle bag by the way. But I put a
> lot of effort into front loading that bike to reduce shimmy. I only use a
> saddle bag on it for 1200's or unsupported 600kms.
>
> On Wednesday, October 14, 2015 at 12:04:20 PM UTC-4, lukeheller wrote:
>>
>> This custom 700c NFE shimmys.
>> It's about a 60x60.
>> Seat tube angle is 71.5.
>> Fork rake is ~75
>>
>> The shimmy isn't a problem unless i let go of the bars *AND* lean
>> backwards. But then, it is a problem.
>>
>> I use a TOKEN needle bearing headset. That helped but didn't fully remove
>> the issue.
>>
>> Different tire sizes/suppleness affects shimmy. I run 700x35 kojacks.
>> Shimmys with no hands on bars leaning back.
>> If I run it with 700x28 marathon plus, shimmy is significantly reduced.
>> But those tires feel dead so I don't ride them.
>> I'd be curious to see what those fat supple beasts would do to my shimmy
>> problem. Probably not help! Yet I'd like to try them.
>>
>> On Saturday, October 10, 2015 at 6:53:59 PM UTC-4, Mike Schiller wrote:
>>>
>>> Shimmy on an NFE?... I'd like to see that bike and how it's
>>> loaded/built.  My Matthews uses  similar tubing ( 8/5/8 OS) and geometry as
>>> the NFE and I don't get any shimmy at all. The NFE has a similar tubeset to
>>>  a Hilsen BTW.   So either they have too much weight up high or something
>>> else is going on.
>>>
>>> back to original  subject... I'd love to try those tires on my Bantam.
>>> It was designed around 44 mm tires and fenders. Wonder it they are tubeless
>>> compatible?
>>>
>>> ~mike
>>> Carlsbad Ca
>>>
>>> On Saturday, October 10, 2015 at 11:22:41 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:

 So yes!! I've been thinking on these same lines. I like the Elephant
 NFE but have heard even with the low trail fork there's some shimmy. Never
 ridden one myself. I love the idea of a bike with a light tube set capable
 of running 42mm+  CX & slick tires. I suppose some are calling it a monster
 cross. Just thinking about my ultimate adventure bike.

 ~Hugh


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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[lukeheller]

Oh yeah, it shimmys with or without the saddle bag by the way. But I put a 
lot of effort into front loading that bike to reduce shimmy. I only use a 
saddle bag on it for 1200's or unsupported 600kms.

On Wednesday, October 14, 2015 at 12:04:20 PM UTC-4, lukeheller wrote:
>
> This custom 700c NFE shimmys.
> It's about a 60x60.
> Seat tube angle is 71.5.
> Fork rake is ~75
>
> The shimmy isn't a problem unless i let go of the bars *AND* lean 
> backwards. But then, it is a problem.
>
> I use a TOKEN needle bearing headset. That helped but didn't fully remove 
> the issue.
>
> Different tire sizes/suppleness affects shimmy. I run 700x35 kojacks. 
> Shimmys with no hands on bars leaning back.
> If I run it with 700x28 marathon plus, shimmy is significantly reduced. 
> But those tires feel dead so I don't ride them.
> I'd be curious to see what those fat supple beasts would do to my shimmy 
> problem. Probably not help! Yet I'd like to try them.
>
> On Saturday, October 10, 2015 at 6:53:59 PM UTC-4, Mike Schiller wrote:
>>
>> Shimmy on an NFE?... I'd like to see that bike and how it's loaded/built. 
>>  My Matthews uses  similar tubing ( 8/5/8 OS) and geometry as the NFE and I 
>> don't get any shimmy at all. The NFE has a similar tubeset to  a Hilsen 
>> BTW.   So either they have too much weight up high or something else is 
>> going on.
>>
>> back to original  subject... I'd love to try those tires on my Bantam. It 
>> was designed around 44 mm tires and fenders. Wonder it they are tubeless 
>> compatible? 
>>
>> ~mike
>> Carlsbad Ca
>>
>> On Saturday, October 10, 2015 at 11:22:41 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>>>
>>> So yes!! I've been thinking on these same lines. I like the Elephant NFE 
>>> but have heard even with the low trail fork there's some shimmy. Never 
>>> ridden one myself. I love the idea of a bike with a light tube set capable 
>>> of running 42mm+  CX & slick tires. I suppose some are calling it a monster 
>>> cross. Just thinking about my ultimate adventure bike.
>>>
>>> ~Hugh 
>>>
>>>


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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Paul Brodek]

Further derailment and all that...  I've ridden Parigi-Roubaix for as long 
as Will, as well as Eroica/Strada Bianca the past 3-4yrs. Not nearly as 
many miles as Will, but I also never had even a whiff of tread 
delamination. However, my first/only pair of Alamanzo started getting edge 
peels after only a few trail rides. The same trails that never bothered the 
PR/SB/Eroica, BTW, it's not like I suddenly started doing endos and epic 
hucking (did I get that terminology right?) due to the presence of 
quasi-knobby tread. Too small a sample for me to conjecture the Alamanzo 
are more problematical than the smooth-tread tires, but it does put me in 
the camp that has first-hand experience with Challenge tire tread 
delamination. That I seem to hear about it more in a CX context, likely on 
Alamanzo tires, makes me go h

Back on topic, these new super-duper Soma tires haven't appeared on Soma's 
website yet, at least as far as I can browse. Are my pitiful browsing 
skills letting me down again, or are we still waiting? Anywhere I can find 
actual specs and stuff?

Paul Brodek
Hillsdale, NJ USA  

On Sunday, October 11, 2015 at 4:04:14 PM UTC-4, William deRosset wrote:
>
> Dear Ron,
>
> veering off-topic, but I've gone through thirty-five Parigi-Roubaix, 
> Strada Blanca, and Eroica tires since 2008. None have delaminated. Their 
> older (tubulars) had problems occasionally, as did Clement, FMB, and 
> (rarely) Vittoria tubulars.
>
> Best,
>
> Will
> William M. deRosset
> Fort Collins, CO
>
>
> On Saturday, October 10, 2015 at 6:19:38 AM UTC-6, Ron Mc wrote:
>>
>> Don't want to derail the thread, and I've heard the Challenge complaints 
>> in 3 forums, but have never experienced the problem with Challenge tires on 
>> (and off) 5 bikes for up to 7 years and well over 10,000 miles.  Also 
>> Vittoria hand-glued tires, which are great, but have short rubber life.  
>>
>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:37:55 PM UTC-5, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>>
>>> I'd be wary of hand glued. I"ve had at least 10 pairs of challenge CX 
>>> tires and most of them had the tread peel off the casing in short order. 
>>> Being active in the CX scene here, I've seen MANY other challenge tires 
>>> fail from the tread coming off. Some times on the first ride. That might be 
>>> a Challenge QC issue more so than the notion of hand-glued, but either way 
>>> makes me nervous. I've never had any other tire do that. 
>>>
>>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:33:34 PM UTC-5, Ron Mc wrote:

 the Challenge are also hand-glued tires.  I'm thinking the Somas will 
 be vulcanized tires with fine casings.  If they're hand-glued, they would 
 be pretty amazing tires, IMO.  


>>>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[dougP]

Tempting.  I really liked the Sea Lions but they recently wore out.  Back 
on Schwalbe for a while now but have zero tire inventory for the first time 
in a long time.  H..

dougP

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:26:25 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>
> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>
> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Peter Adler]

Just by chance, I was stripping the tread off a dead Parigi-Roubaix 
yesterday, to recycle as sidewall patches/boots for other tires. Another 
rider on a group ride flatted out, and I shocked the crowd by producing not 
just a spare, but a *nice* spare (GB Cerf), so the rider could finish the 
route. A chunk of tread had come out of the contact point; the rider said 
he'd gotten about 1200 miles out of it.

One thing I noticed was the gluing method. The tread is glued at the edges, 
but not in the center. If you got the sort of de-lam we've seen in the 
photos, along the edge, a fair amount of tread could peel off. 
Theoretically.

That said, I've put about 1000 miles on the only set of P-Rs I've veer 
owned, and the tread's still glued where it's supposed to be. BTW, aren't 
most better-quality tubulars traditionally hand-glued?

Peter "gotta get that Hetre fixed" Adler
Berkeley, CA/USA

On Sunday, October 11, 2015 at 1:04:14 PM UTC-7, William deRosset wrote:
>
> veering off-topic, but I've gone through thirty-five Parigi-Roubaix, 
> Strada Blanca, and Eroica tires since 2008. None have delaminated. Their 
> older (tubulars) had problems occasionally, as did Clement, FMB, and 
> (rarely) Vittoria tubulars.
>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[William deRosset]

Dear Ron,

veering off-topic, but I've gone through thirty-five Parigi-Roubaix, Strada 
Blanca, and Eroica tires since 2008. None have delaminated. Their older 
(tubulars) had problems occasionally, as did Clement, FMB, and (rarely) 
Vittoria tubulars.

Best,

Will
William M. deRosset
Fort Collins, CO


On Saturday, October 10, 2015 at 6:19:38 AM UTC-6, Ron Mc wrote:
>
> Don't want to derail the thread, and I've heard the Challenge complaints 
> in 3 forums, but have never experienced the problem with Challenge tires on 
> (and off) 5 bikes for up to 7 years and well over 10,000 miles.  Also 
> Vittoria hand-glued tires, which are great, but have short rubber life.  
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:37:55 PM UTC-5, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>
>> I'd be wary of hand glued. I"ve had at least 10 pairs of challenge CX 
>> tires and most of them had the tread peel off the casing in short order. 
>> Being active in the CX scene here, I've seen MANY other challenge tires 
>> fail from the tread coming off. Some times on the first ride. That might be 
>> a Challenge QC issue more so than the notion of hand-glued, but either way 
>> makes me nervous. I've never had any other tire do that. 
>>
>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:33:34 PM UTC-5, Ron Mc wrote:
>>>
>>> the Challenge are also hand-glued tires.  I'm thinking the Somas will be 
>>> vulcanized tires with fine casings.  If they're hand-glued, they would be 
>>> pretty amazing tires, IMO.  
>>>
>>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Hugh Smitham]

Mike,

This was relayed to me second hand. But loaded in front too high I'll get
shimmy on my Hilsen. I had some disbelief regarding the NFE and shimmy
considering it has a low trail fork. Some more feedback is obviously
required by other NFE owners.

~Hugh

“Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep
moving.” ― Albert Einstein

http://velocipeedemusings.com/



On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 3:53 PM, Mike Schiller 
wrote:

> Shimmy on an NFE?... I'd like to see that bike and how it's loaded/built.
> My Matthews uses  similar tubing ( 8/5/8 OS) and geometry as the NFE and I
> don't get any shimmy at all. The NFE has a similar tubeset to  a Hilsen
> BTW.   So either they have too much weight up high or something else is
> going on.
>
> back to original  subject... I'd love to try those tires on my Bantam. It
> was designed around 44 mm tires and fenders. Wonder it they are tubeless
> compatible?
>
> ~mike
> Carlsbad Ca
>
> On Saturday, October 10, 2015 at 11:22:41 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>>
>> So yes!! I've been thinking on these same lines. I like the Elephant NFE
>> but have heard even with the low trail fork there's some shimmy. Never
>> ridden one myself. I love the idea of a bike with a light tube set capable
>> of running 42mm+  CX & slick tires. I suppose some are calling it a monster
>> cross. Just thinking about my ultimate adventure bike.
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>>
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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mike Schiller]

Shimmy on an NFE?... I'd like to see that bike and how it's loaded/built. 
 My Matthews uses  similar tubing ( 8/5/8 OS) and geometry as the NFE and I 
don't get any shimmy at all. The NFE has a similar tubeset to  a Hilsen 
BTW.   So either they have too much weight up high or something else is 
going on.

back to original  subject... I'd love to try those tires on my Bantam. It 
was designed around 44 mm tires and fenders. Wonder it they are tubeless 
compatible? 

~mike
Carlsbad Ca

On Saturday, October 10, 2015 at 11:22:41 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>
> So yes!! I've been thinking on these same lines. I like the Elephant NFE 
> but have heard even with the low trail fork there's some shimmy. Never 
> ridden one myself. I love the idea of a bike with a light tube set capable 
> of running 42mm+  CX & slick tires. I suppose some are calling it a monster 
> cross. Just thinking about my ultimate adventure bike.
>
> ~Hugh 
>
>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[hsmitham]

So yes!! I've been thinking on these same lines. I like the Elephant NFE 
but have heard even with the low trail fork there's some shimmy. Never 
ridden one myself. I love the idea of a bike with a light tube set capable 
of running 42mm+  CX & slick tires. I suppose some are calling it a monster 
cross. Just thinking about my ultimate adventure bike.

~Hugh 

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:15:51 AM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> If you forced me to order a Custom Rivendell today, I would order a 
> roadish Riv with Roadeo tubing (the lightest GP is comfortable with using 
> for me).  It would have a geometry almost identical to my 56cm Hillborne 
> (135mm rear, cantilever brakes, single TT, sloping TT).  It would have Riv 
> "batwing" fork tips and mid fork braze ons for an HAR or other lowrider 
> front rack.  It would have clearances for these tires (700x42) plus 
> fenders.  
>
> It would be like a canti-Roadeo for fat tires.  Or a roadish Legolas.
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 9:57:30 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>
>> "They're in stock as of this morning. They'll pop up on the store in a 
>> day or two, but savvy purchasers can call ahead and reserve some before the 
>> rabble cotton on." - distributed via Merry Sales exclusively for the time 
>> being. So visit your LBS and get them to call their Merry rep and you 
>> shoiuld be able to order them now. 
>>
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Bill Lindsay]

I think the Elephant NFE looks like a fabulous bike that I would enjoy 
riding but not with this particular 700x42 tire.  The custom Rivendell I 
was describing was a road bike wrapped perfectly around this particular 
700x42 tire that you introduced in your OP.  It wouldn't be the first time 
I bought a bike to fit a tire.   

If I bought an Elephant NFE, there are several nice tires I'd consider 
running on it.  

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:50:48 PM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>
> So basically the Elephant NFE frame, unless you were partial to 700c and 
> canti brakes I guess. Pretty much what you're describing though, isn't it? 
> But I guess with that trademark Riv-ish flair :)
>
> On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 2:47 PM, Will > 
> wrote:
>
>> I think that is the missing bike in Riv's lineup. Something roady with a 
>> reasonably compliant tubeset, spec'd for 50s plus fenders. The thing I'd 
>> add to your wish-list is wire guides on the right fork blade for a dynamo. 
>>
>> Speaking of dynamos... it'd be nice if Riv would develop a best-value 
>> light setup, like they've done for their build kits. Lights are so good now 
>> that it simply doesn't make sense to build a bike wthout them. 
>>
>>
>>
>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:15:51 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
>>> If you forced me to order a Custom Rivendell today, I would order a 
>>> roadish Riv with Roadeo tubing (the lightest GP is comfortable with using 
>>> for me).  It would have a geometry almost identical to my 56cm Hillborne 
>>> (135mm rear, cantilever brakes, single TT, sloping TT).  It would have Riv 
>>> "batwing" fork tips and mid fork braze ons for an HAR or other lowrider 
>>> front rack.  It would have clearances for these tires (700x42) plus 
>>> fenders.  
>>>
>>> It would be like a canti-Roadeo for fat tires.  Or a roadish Legolas.
>>>
>>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 9:57:30 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:

 "They're in stock as of this morning. They'll pop up on the store in a 
 day or two, but savvy purchasers can call ahead and reserve some before 
 the 
 rabble cotton on." - distributed via Merry Sales exclusively for the time 
 being. So visit your LBS and get them to call their Merry rep and you 
 shoiuld be able to order them now. 


>>> -- 
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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Ron Mc]

Don't want to derail the thread, and I've heard the Challenge complaints in 
3 forums, but have never experienced the problem with Challenge tires on 
(and off) 5 bikes for up to 7 years and well over 10,000 miles.  Also 
Vittoria hand-glued tires, which are great, but have short rubber life.  

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:37:55 PM UTC-5, Mark Reimer wrote:
>
> I'd be wary of hand glued. I"ve had at least 10 pairs of challenge CX 
> tires and most of them had the tread peel off the casing in short order. 
> Being active in the CX scene here, I've seen MANY other challenge tires 
> fail from the tread coming off. Some times on the first ride. That might be 
> a Challenge QC issue more so than the notion of hand-glued, but either way 
> makes me nervous. I've never had any other tire do that. 
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:33:34 PM UTC-5, Ron Mc wrote:
>>
>> the Challenge are also hand-glued tires.  I'm thinking the Somas will be 
>> vulcanized tires with fine casings.  If they're hand-glued, they would be 
>> pretty amazing tires, IMO.  
>>
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Evan Baird]

How bout that there directional tread pattern eh?

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Rod Holland]

If you do that, order one for me, too...

rod

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 1:15:51 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> If you forced me to order a Custom Rivendell today, I would order a 
> roadish Riv with Roadeo tubing (the lightest GP is comfortable with using 
> for me).  It would have a geometry almost identical to my 56cm Hillborne 
> (135mm rear, cantilever brakes, single TT, sloping TT).  It would have Riv 
> "batwing" fork tips and mid fork braze ons for an HAR or other lowrider 
> front rack.  It would have clearances for these tires (700x42) plus 
> fenders.  
>
> It would be like a canti-Roadeo for fat tires.  Or a roadish Legolas.
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 9:57:30 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>
>> "They're in stock as of this morning. They'll pop up on the store in a 
>> day or two, but savvy purchasers can call ahead and reserve some before the 
>> rabble cotton on." - distributed via Merry Sales exclusively for the time 
>> being. So visit your LBS and get them to call their Merry rep and you 
>> shoiuld be able to order them now. 
>>
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Rod Holland]

They did try with the C-Lines, but the Barlows showed up almost immediately 
thereafter. I ended up with a pair of each, along with a pair of Resist 
Nomads and a pair of Vittoria Randonneur Hypers. I'm not sure what came 
over me... Mounted the Barlows, and never looked back.

rod

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:35:10 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> That's a smart move by Soma to jump into the gap that is currently not 
> covered by Compass.  
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:26:25 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>
>> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>>
>> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
>> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
>> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mark Reimer]

So basically the Elephant NFE frame, unless you were partial to 700c and
canti brakes I guess. Pretty much what you're describing though, isn't it?
But I guess with that trademark Riv-ish flair :)

On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 2:47 PM, Will  wrote:

> I think that is the missing bike in Riv's lineup. Something roady with a
> reasonably compliant tubeset, spec'd for 50s plus fenders. The thing I'd
> add to your wish-list is wire guides on the right fork blade for a dynamo.
>
> Speaking of dynamos... it'd be nice if Riv would develop a best-value
> light setup, like they've done for their build kits. Lights are so good now
> that it simply doesn't make sense to build a bike wthout them.
>
>
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:15:51 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>> If you forced me to order a Custom Rivendell today, I would order a
>> roadish Riv with Roadeo tubing (the lightest GP is comfortable with using
>> for me).  It would have a geometry almost identical to my 56cm Hillborne
>> (135mm rear, cantilever brakes, single TT, sloping TT).  It would have Riv
>> "batwing" fork tips and mid fork braze ons for an HAR or other lowrider
>> front rack.  It would have clearances for these tires (700x42) plus
>> fenders.
>>
>> It would be like a canti-Roadeo for fat tires.  Or a roadish Legolas.
>>
>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 9:57:30 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>>
>>> "They're in stock as of this morning. They'll pop up on the store in a
>>> day or two, but savvy purchasers can call ahead and reserve some before the
>>> rabble cotton on." - distributed via Merry Sales exclusively for the time
>>> being. So visit your LBS and get them to call their Merry rep and you
>>> shoiuld be able to order them now.
>>>
>>>
>> --
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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Will]

I think that is the missing bike in Riv's lineup. Something roady with a 
reasonably compliant tubeset, spec'd for 50s plus fenders. The thing I'd 
add to your wish-list is wire guides on the right fork blade for a dynamo. 

Speaking of dynamos... it'd be nice if Riv would develop a best-value light 
setup, like they've done for their build kits. Lights are so good now that 
it simply doesn't make sense to build a bike wthout them. 



On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:15:51 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> If you forced me to order a Custom Rivendell today, I would order a 
> roadish Riv with Roadeo tubing (the lightest GP is comfortable with using 
> for me).  It would have a geometry almost identical to my 56cm Hillborne 
> (135mm rear, cantilever brakes, single TT, sloping TT).  It would have Riv 
> "batwing" fork tips and mid fork braze ons for an HAR or other lowrider 
> front rack.  It would have clearances for these tires (700x42) plus 
> fenders.  
>
> It would be like a canti-Roadeo for fat tires.  Or a roadish Legolas.
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 9:57:30 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>
>> "They're in stock as of this morning. They'll pop up on the store in a 
>> day or two, but savvy purchasers can call ahead and reserve some before the 
>> rabble cotton on." - distributed via Merry Sales exclusively for the time 
>> being. So visit your LBS and get them to call their Merry rep and you 
>> shoiuld be able to order them now. 
>>
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mark Reimer]

I'd be wary of hand glued. I"ve had at least 10 pairs of challenge CX tires 
and most of them had the tread peel off the casing in short order. Being 
active in the CX scene here, I've seen MANY other challenge tires fail from 
the tread coming off. Some times on the first ride. That might be a 
Challenge QC issue more so than the notion of hand-glued, but either way 
makes me nervous. I've never had any other tire do that. 

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 12:33:34 PM UTC-5, Ron Mc wrote:
>
> the Challenge are also hand-glued tires.  I'm thinking the Somas will be 
> vulcanized tires with fine casings.  If they're hand-glued, they would be 
> pretty amazing tires, IMO.  
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 11:57:04 AM UTC-5, cyclot...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>>
>> With Challenge, the open tubular means the tires are super flat. They're 
>> great when mounted, but a bit of a bear to get mounted!
>>
>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:44:13 AM UTC-7, Kieran J wrote:
>>>
>>> These look great! Hopefully they won't be $80 a piece ..
>>>
>>> What does "tubular casing" mean? Like, 'open tubular' aka clincher?
>>>
>>> KJ
>>>
>>>
>>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:26:25 AM UTC-4, Mark Reimer wrote:

 https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/

 Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what 
 I've been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass 
 tire but in 700. They've also got a 38mm version




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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Ron Mc]

the Challenge are also hand-glued tires.  I'm thinking the Somas will be 
vulcanized tires with fine casings.  If they're hand-glued, they would be 
pretty amazing tires, IMO.  

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 11:57:04 AM UTC-5, cyclot...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> With Challenge, the open tubular means the tires are super flat. They're 
> great when mounted, but a bit of a bear to get mounted!
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:44:13 AM UTC-7, Kieran J wrote:
>>
>> These look great! Hopefully they won't be $80 a piece ..
>>
>> What does "tubular casing" mean? Like, 'open tubular' aka clincher?
>>
>> KJ
>>
>>
>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:26:25 AM UTC-4, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>>
>>> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>>>
>>> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
>>> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
>>> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>>>
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Bill Lindsay]

If you forced me to order a Custom Rivendell today, I would order a roadish 
Riv with Roadeo tubing (the lightest GP is comfortable with using for me). 
 It would have a geometry almost identical to my 56cm Hillborne (135mm 
rear, cantilever brakes, single TT, sloping TT).  It would have Riv 
"batwing" fork tips and mid fork braze ons for an HAR or other lowrider 
front rack.  It would have clearances for these tires (700x42) plus 
fenders.  

It would be like a canti-Roadeo for fat tires.  Or a roadish Legolas.

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 9:57:30 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>
> "They're in stock as of this morning. They'll pop up on the store in a 
> day or two, but savvy purchasers can call ahead and reserve some before the 
> rabble cotton on." - distributed via Merry Sales exclusively for the time 
> being. So visit your LBS and get them to call their Merry rep and you 
> shoiuld be able to order them now. 
>
>


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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[cyclotour...@gmail.com]

With Challenge, the open tubular means the tires are super flat. They're 
great when mounted, but a bit of a bear to get mounted!

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:44:13 AM UTC-7, Kieran J wrote:
>
> These look great! Hopefully they won't be $80 a piece ..
>
> What does "tubular casing" mean? Like, 'open tubular' aka clincher?
>
> KJ
>
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:26:25 AM UTC-4, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>
>> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>>
>> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
>> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
>> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mark Reimer]

"They're in stock as of this morning. They'll pop up on the store in a day 
or two, but savvy purchasers can call ahead and reserve some before the 
rabble cotton on." - distributed via Merry Sales exclusively for the time 
being. So visit your LBS and get them to call their Merry rep and you 
shoiuld be able to order them now. 

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 11:56:12 AM UTC-5, Mark Reimer wrote:
>
> On the Instagram post I think it mentioned that they'll be in the 
> catalogue for ordering today
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 11:52:56 AM UTC-5, John Phillips wrote:
>>
>> Has there been any mention yet about when these will be available for 
>> purchase?
>>
>> John
>>
>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:26:25 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>>
>>> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>>>
>>> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
>>> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
>>> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>>>
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mark Reimer]

On the Instagram post I think it mentioned that they'll be in the catalogue 
for ordering today

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 11:52:56 AM UTC-5, John Phillips wrote:
>
> Has there been any mention yet about when these will be available for 
> purchase?
>
> John
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:26:25 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>
>> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>>
>> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
>> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
>> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[John Phillips]

Has there been any mention yet about when these will be available for 
purchase?

John

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:26:25 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>
> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>
> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Ron Mc]

I think it's smart for the whole industry to move in that direction. 
 Yesterday I met a roadie rolling 35mm tires.  

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 11:35:10 AM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> That's a smart move by Soma to jump into the gap that is currently not 
> covered by Compass.  
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Bill Lindsay]

That's a smart move by Soma to jump into the gap that is currently not 
covered by Compass.  

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 7:26:25 AM UTC-7, Mark Reimer wrote:
>
> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>
> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Clayton.sf]

This is awesome! Now make a 45 or 48 too

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mark Reimer]

Yeah me too. I have the 38's with less than 50km on them at this point but
really wanted something closer to the rock n' road width, but light and
slick. Snow is around the corner here anyway, I guess I can wait...

On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 10:46 AM, Mitch Browne 
wrote:

> I'd guess $79.99 in the prevailing tire cartel price.
>
> Rats, recently installed the Compass 700c x 38 Barlow Pass on my Atlantis.
> I like them but 42 is what I prefer.
>
>
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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mitch Browne]

I'd guess $79.99 in the prevailing tire cartel price.

Rats, recently installed the Compass 700c x 38 Barlow Pass on my Atlantis. 
I like them but 42 is what I prefer.


>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mark Reimer]

Here's a close look at the treat pattern:

http://www.therubbishbin.net/post/130782119403

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:28:27 AM UTC-5, Kieran J wrote:
>
> I enjoy the little Japanese flag on the sidewall. Cute!
>
> KJ
>
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:45:57 AM UTC-4, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>
>> Yes, they are clinchers. Challenge uses the same terminology, which is a 
>> bit confusing at first. It typically means it's the same casing as used on 
>> their tubulars, which tends to be very supple and light
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 9:44 AM, Kieran J  wrote:
>>
>>> These look great! Hopefully they won't be $80 a piece ..
>>>
>>> What does "tubular casing" mean? Like, 'open tubular' aka clincher?
>>>
>>> KJ
>>>
>>>
>>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:26:25 AM UTC-4, Mark Reimer wrote:

 https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/

 Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what 
 I've been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass 
 tire but in 700. They've also got a 38mm version


 -- 
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>>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Kieran J]

I enjoy the little Japanese flag on the sidewall. Cute!

KJ


On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:45:57 AM UTC-4, Mark Reimer wrote:
>
> Yes, they are clinchers. Challenge uses the same terminology, which is a 
> bit confusing at first. It typically means it's the same casing as used on 
> their tubulars, which tends to be very supple and light
>
> On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 9:44 AM, Kieran J > 
> wrote:
>
>> These look great! Hopefully they won't be $80 a piece ..
>>
>> What does "tubular casing" mean? Like, 'open tubular' aka clincher?
>>
>> KJ
>>
>>
>> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:26:25 AM UTC-4, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>>
>>> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>>>
>>> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
>>> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
>>> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the 
>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/aEYyD3bnppc/unsubscribe
>> .
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>> .
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>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Mark Reimer]

Yes, they are clinchers. Challenge uses the same terminology, which is a
bit confusing at first. It typically means it's the same casing as used on
their tubulars, which tends to be very supple and light

On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 9:44 AM, Kieran J  wrote:

> These look great! Hopefully they won't be $80 a piece ..
>
> What does "tubular casing" mean? Like, 'open tubular' aka clincher?
>
> KJ
>
>
> On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:26:25 AM UTC-4, Mark Reimer wrote:
>>
>> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>>
>> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've
>> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but
>> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>>
>>
>> --
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[RBW] Re: New fat 700 tires! 700x42 ultra light

[Kieran J]

These look great! Hopefully they won't be $80 a piece ..

What does "tubular casing" mean? Like, 'open tubular' aka clincher?

KJ


On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 10:26:25 AM UTC-4, Mark Reimer wrote:
>
> https://instagram.com/p/8mMR3jotbY/
>
> Check out these new tires that just dropped from Soma! This is what I've 
> been waiting for on my Atlantis, something like the 650x42 Compass tire but 
> in 700. They've also got a 38mm version
>
>
>

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