[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
I know what you're talking about, Steve. These layers are very visible on Ruffy Tuffies. Never knew those extra (fabric?) layers were for snake bit protection. Anyway, that's not what this is. It's for sure the skinwall that's cracked and exposing the very visible threads underneath. On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 6:14 AM, Frederick, Steve wrote: > > I'm petty sure that's the snake bite protection strip turning loose. It's > a bit of fabric tape that they put just above the bead to help prevent pinch > flats. I've seen it dry up and turn loose on several tires--on one Ruffy > Tuffy it loosened to the point that it was rubbing the brake and bugging me > so I just peeled it off. Tire is still fine and in use. > > Check if the crack is actually a seperate outside layer that's coming loose > before giving up on the tire. > > Steve Frederick, East Lansing, MI > > -Original Message- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]]on Behalf Of Angus > Sent: Saturday, November 14, 2009 6:12 PM > To: RBW Owners Bunch > Subject: [RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires? > > > > Jim, David, > > For what it's worth (probably 2 cents), I believe the "cracking" is > not a crack, but the last layer of material that was wrapped over the > tire bead. It looks like it has started to peel off the sidewall. > I've had several tires do this over the years, specifically older/ > narrower Paselas. I have not had a tire fail due to this...yet. > > The tan sidewalls seemed to degrade faster in So Cal than they do in > East Texas (smog degrades rubber faster?). There is not a lot of smog > out here...heck there is not a lot of anything out here! (cept > trees). > > Everyone makes their own choices and lives with the > consequences...having a higher than normal risk tolerance (and > Scottish blood) I'm riding my tires into the ground. > > Angus "whose All-Rounder still wears the original, circa 1998, Ritchey > Tom Slick" > > On Nov 14, 3:57 pm, CycloFiend wrote: > > on 11/14/09 12:50 PM, R Gonet at [email protected] wrote: > > > > > I just checked my 2-year-old Jack Browns and they have that same split > > > all the way around, though not as bad looking as the much older Pasela > > > tan wall. The split appears to be in the outer gum wall, if that's > > > the correct term, and doesn't look like it's penetrated into the woven > > > layers below. I don't know if this is a safety issue or not. I've > > > never heard of a tire failing at that point before, but confess to > > > little knowledge on the subject. > > > > > By the way, it's very easy to check your tires without removing them. > > > Just deflate them all the way and push the tire bead away from the > > > rim, working your way around the tire to inspect the circumference > > > visually. > > > > > Is there anybody out there who has some knowledge in this area who has > > > an opinion on the safety issue? > > > > Hey. It's the internet. I'll hazard a guess... > > > > If you work from the outside in, the tire layers consist of "contact" > > material (the black part of a skinwall), The underlayer (the skinwall), > the > > thread/casing, and a thinner layer. > > > > AASHTA -http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html > > > > In the photo that David E shared - > http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ > > > > I notice two things - first, the cracking parrallel to the rim, second > the > > whitish "fold marks" from running at relatively low inflation. Overall, > the > > sidewall looks pretty dried out - certainly drier than my tires. > > > > David rides in an area which has consistently high ambient temps, which > I've > > always found to degrade tires quickly. My experience is that the > > skinwalls/sidewalls go first. > > > > If those were my tires (and lemme just say that I may have a higher > > tolerance for risk than others here, and if you base your actions on my > > opinions, I can't take liability for it) I'd run 'em until I start to > > see the beginning hints of threads fraying through. But, I'm also just > odd > > enough to want to see how they begin to fail. > > > > If the whole sidewall is cracking, I'd replace the tire. This is how you > > often find old tires on garage sale bikes - unused tread but brittle, > almost > > "varnished" looking sidewalls.
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
I'm petty sure that's the snake bite protection strip turning loose. It's a bit of fabric tape that they put just above the bead to help prevent pinch flats. I've seen it dry up and turn loose on several tires--on one Ruffy Tuffy it loosened to the point that it was rubbing the brake and bugging me so I just peeled it off. Tire is still fine and in use. Check if the crack is actually a seperate outside layer that's coming loose before giving up on the tire. Steve Frederick, East Lansing, MI -Original Message- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]on Behalf Of Angus Sent: Saturday, November 14, 2009 6:12 PM To: RBW Owners Bunch Subject: [RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires? Jim, David, For what it's worth (probably 2 cents), I believe the "cracking" is not a crack, but the last layer of material that was wrapped over the tire bead. It looks like it has started to peel off the sidewall. I've had several tires do this over the years, specifically older/ narrower Paselas. I have not had a tire fail due to this...yet. The tan sidewalls seemed to degrade faster in So Cal than they do in East Texas (smog degrades rubber faster?). There is not a lot of smog out here...heck there is not a lot of anything out here! (cept trees). Everyone makes their own choices and lives with the consequences...having a higher than normal risk tolerance (and Scottish blood) I'm riding my tires into the ground. Angus "whose All-Rounder still wears the original, circa 1998, Ritchey Tom Slick" On Nov 14, 3:57 pm, CycloFiend wrote: > on 11/14/09 12:50 PM, R Gonet at [email protected] wrote: > > > I just checked my 2-year-old Jack Browns and they have that same split > > all the way around, though not as bad looking as the much older Pasela > > tan wall. The split appears to be in the outer gum wall, if that's > > the correct term, and doesn't look like it's penetrated into the woven > > layers below. I don't know if this is a safety issue or not. I've > > never heard of a tire failing at that point before, but confess to > > little knowledge on the subject. > > > By the way, it's very easy to check your tires without removing them. > > Just deflate them all the way and push the tire bead away from the > > rim, working your way around the tire to inspect the circumference > > visually. > > > Is there anybody out there who has some knowledge in this area who has > > an opinion on the safety issue? > > Hey. It's the internet. I'll hazard a guess... > > If you work from the outside in, the tire layers consist of "contact" > material (the black part of a skinwall), The underlayer (the skinwall), the > thread/casing, and a thinner layer. > > AASHTA -http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html > > In the photo that David E shared > -http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ > > I notice two things - first, the cracking parrallel to the rim, second the > whitish "fold marks" from running at relatively low inflation. Overall, the > sidewall looks pretty dried out - certainly drier than my tires. > > David rides in an area which has consistently high ambient temps, which I've > always found to degrade tires quickly. My experience is that the > skinwalls/sidewalls go first. > > If those were my tires (and lemme just say that I may have a higher > tolerance for risk than others here, and if you base your actions on my > opinions, I can't take liability for it) I'd run 'em until I start to > see the beginning hints of threads fraying through. But, I'm also just odd > enough to want to see how they begin to fail. > > If the whole sidewall is cracking, I'd replace the tire. This is how you > often find old tires on garage sale bikes - unused tread but brittle, almost > "varnished" looking sidewalls. But, if the sidewall is still relatively > supple and elastic, I'd run them for a while yet. > > IF I could see through to black tube anywhere when they are inflated, I'd > pull 'em, cut the bead with a tin snip and not use them. > > Back to the photo - > The threads still have to fail, and the thread casing/underlayer in general > is probably a bit thicker than the skinwall. The threads are probably more > resistant to heat damage than the surrounding rubber composite. > > I think what may be happening is the combination of running larger volume > tires at low pressures, while the sidewall itself is drying out a bit > quicker than average. That big footprint of the tire tends to stay stuck, > while you and the bike can move quite a bit side-to-side
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
Mine are doing this at say a year and a half and maybe 750miles or so from new. I blame the high altitude sun, which is why I usually avoid skinwalls. Now they are not as bad as Cyclotourist, but given how few miles I have on them I am disappointed. My house is at 7300 feet or so and I ride them between 5800 and 9500 pretty regularly. On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 6:35 PM, cyclotourist wrote: > This is an excellent conversation! As I mentioned, I've noticed this a > while ago, but haven't been too concerned. I'm lazy and cheap, ya' know. > The split runs completely round the tire on one side, and is barely visible > as a hairline forming on the other side. The front tire is in better shape, > but I can see the beginning of a hairline forming on one side. As noted, > high and dry temps down here in inland SoCal. That must prematurely age the > sidewalls significantly as these are maybe three years old at the most > (Nashbar's blow out sale when they were selling them for $16). I guess this > is the downside of living in the desert. Bill, do you have any problems in > AZ? The threads are in fine condition, but very exposed. I'm inclined to > keep running them, but being on the look out problems. The rear tread is > pretty worn with all the "slits" being worn down to totally smooth in the > center. Brake pads are centered properly. > > If you look at the real big full-sized photo, you can just almost make out > the threads in the casing if you squint sideways: > http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/sizes/o/ > > Fun with bike parts! > > > > On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:40 PM, Bill Gibson wrote: >> >> My criteria for tire replacement is whether the carcass fabric is >> compromised or not; no bulges or cuts in the sidewall. Cork life will reglue >> the stray fabric edges, and seal exposed threads, but I hope to wear out the >> tread first, which is always a satisfying proof of much riding. Confidence >> in tires is important. >> >> On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:58 PM, EricP wrote: >>> >>> The last set of tan sidewall Pasela tires did the same thing. Like >>> Angus said, it seems to be where the glue line is. My opinion was the >>> glue was too strong and not letting the rest of the sidewall flex. >>> This set also had about 2,500 to 3,000 miles on them. So it was time >>> to change anyway. >>> >>> My own tires were/are 700x35 and run at about 60 pounds (front) and 70 >>> to 80 (rear). May still be underinflation for my weight at the >>> time. >>> >>> Still have a pair of blackwall Pasela tires that sit in reserve. If >>> the present Schwalbe Marathon Supreme tires get tiresome then will try >>> them. >>> >>> However, have to admit that since going to 40mm wide tires, even 35 >>> seem pretty skinny. >>> >>> Eric Platt >>> St. Paul, MN >>> >>> On Nov 14, 5:18�pm, R Gonet wrote: >>> > Nice analysis, Jim. �It would be interesting to ride the tires until >>> > they fray to see how long they would go, but I tend to replace tires >>> > on my cars and bikes before I need to. �I think the newer tires are >>> > safer, it gives me peace of mind, and it's a small luxury that I can >>> > indulge in. �Kind of like buying new sneakers before your old ones are >>> > worn out. �This also offsets other riskier, even dumber, behaviors >>> > that I engage in. >>> > >>> > Thanks for the post. >>> > >>> > Richard >>> > >>> > On Nov 14, 4:57�pm, CycloFiend wrote: >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > > on 11/14/09 12:50 PM, R Gonet at [email protected] wrote: >>> > >>> > > > I just checked my 2-year-old Jack Browns and they have that same >>> > > > split >>> > > > all the way around, though not as bad looking as the much older >>> > > > Pasela >>> > > > tan wall. �The split appears to be in the outer gum wall, if that's >>> > > > the correct term, and doesn't look like it's penetrated into the >>> > > > woven >>> > > > layers below. �I don't know if this is a safety issue or not. �I've >>> > > > never heard of a tire failing at that point before, but confess to >>> > > > little knowledge on the subject. >>> > >>> > > > By the way, it's very easy to check your tires without removing >>> > > > them. >>> > > > Just deflate them all the way and push the tire bead away from the >>> > > > rim, working your way around the tire to inspect the circumference >>> > > > visually. >>> > >>> > > > Is there anybody out there who has some knowledge in this area who >>> > > > has >>> > > > an opinion on the safety issue? >>> > >>> > > Hey. It's the internet. �I'll hazard a guess... >>> > >>> > > If you work from the outside in, the tire layers consist of "contact" >>> > > material (the black part of a skinwall), The underlayer (the >>> > > skinwall), the >>> > > thread/casing, and a thinner layer. >>> > >>> > > AASHTA -http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html >>> > >>> > > In the photo that David E shared >>> > > -http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ >>> > >>> > > I notice two things - first, the cracking parrall
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 8:35 PM, cyclotourist wrote: > This is an excellent conversation! As I mentioned, I've noticed this a > while ago, but haven't been too concerned. I'm lazy and cheap, ya' know. > The split runs completely round the tire on one side, and is barely visible > as a hairline forming on the other side. The front tire is in better shape, > but I can see the beginning of a hairline forming on one side. As noted, > high and dry temps down here in inland SoCal. That must prematurely age the > sidewalls significantly as these are maybe three years old at the most > (Nashbar's blow out sale when they were selling them for $16). I guess this > is the downside of living in the desert. Bill, do you have any problems in > AZ? The threads are in fine condition, but very exposed. I'm inclined to > keep running them, but being on the look out problems. The rear tread is > pretty worn with all the "slits" being worn down to totally smooth in the > center. Brake pads are centered properly. > I think if you're going to keep running them you should buy one extra folding bead pasela and stuff it in something you carry with you. -sv --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
This is an excellent conversation! As I mentioned, I've noticed this a while ago, but haven't been too concerned. I'm lazy and cheap, ya' know. The split runs completely round the tire on one side, and is barely visible as a hairline forming on the other side. The front tire is in better shape, but I can see the beginning of a hairline forming on one side. As noted, high and dry temps down here in inland SoCal. That must prematurely age the sidewalls significantly as these are maybe three years old at the most (Nashbar's blow out sale when they were selling them for $16). I guess this is the downside of living in the desert. Bill, do you have any problems in AZ? The threads are in fine condition, but very exposed. I'm inclined to keep running them, but being on the look out problems. The rear tread is pretty worn with all the "slits" being worn down to totally smooth in the center. Brake pads are centered properly. If you look at the real big full-sized photo, you can just almost make out the threads in the casing if you squint sideways: http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/sizes/o/ Fun with bike parts! On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:40 PM, Bill Gibson wrote: > My criteria for tire replacement is whether the carcass fabric is > compromised or not; no bulges or cuts in the sidewall. Cork life will reglue > the stray fabric edges, and seal exposed threads, but I hope to wear out the > tread first, which is always a satisfying proof of much riding. Confidence > in tires is important. > > > On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:58 PM, EricP wrote: > >> >> The last set of tan sidewall Pasela tires did the same thing. Like >> Angus said, it seems to be where the glue line is. My opinion was the >> glue was too strong and not letting the rest of the sidewall flex. >> This set also had about 2,500 to 3,000 miles on them. So it was time >> to change anyway. >> >> My own tires were/are 700x35 and run at about 60 pounds (front) and 70 >> to 80 (rear). May still be underinflation for my weight at the >> time. >> >> Still have a pair of blackwall Pasela tires that sit in reserve. If >> the present Schwalbe Marathon Supreme tires get tiresome then will try >> them. >> >> However, have to admit that since going to 40mm wide tires, even 35 >> seem pretty skinny. >> >> Eric Platt >> St. Paul, MN >> >> On Nov 14, 5:18�pm, R Gonet wrote: >> > Nice analysis, Jim. �It would be interesting to ride the tires until >> > they fray to see how long they would go, but I tend to replace tires >> > on my cars and bikes before I need to. �I think the newer tires are >> > safer, it gives me peace of mind, and it's a small luxury that I can >> > indulge in. �Kind of like buying new sneakers before your old ones are >> > worn out. �This also offsets other riskier, even dumber, behaviors >> > that I engage in. >> > >> > Thanks for the post. >> > >> > Richard >> > >> > On Nov 14, 4:57�pm, CycloFiend wrote: >> > >> > >> > >> > > on 11/14/09 12:50 PM, R Gonet at [email protected] wrote: >> > >> > > > I just checked my 2-year-old Jack Browns and they have that same >> split >> > > > all the way around, though not as bad looking as the much older >> Pasela >> > > > tan wall. �The split appears to be in the outer gum wall, if that's >> > > > the correct term, and doesn't look like it's penetrated into the >> woven >> > > > layers below. �I don't know if this is a safety issue or not. �I've >> > > > never heard of a tire failing at that point before, but confess to >> > > > little knowledge on the subject. >> > >> > > > By the way, it's very easy to check your tires without removing >> them. >> > > > Just deflate them all the way and push the tire bead away from the >> > > > rim, working your way around the tire to inspect the circumference >> > > > visually. >> > >> > > > Is there anybody out there who has some knowledge in this area who >> has >> > > > an opinion on the safety issue? >> > >> > > Hey. It's the internet. �I'll hazard a guess... >> > >> > > If you work from the outside in, the tire layers consist of "contact" >> > > material (the black part of a skinwall), The underlayer (the >> skinwall), the >> > > thread/casing, and a thinner layer. >> > >> > > AASHTA -http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html >> > >> > > In the photo that David E shared - >> http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ >> > >> > > I notice two things - first, the cracking parrallel to the rim, second >> the >> > > whitish "fold marks" from running at relatively low inflation. >> �Overall, the >> > > sidewall looks pretty dried out - certainly drier than my tires. >> > >> > > David rides in an area which has consistently high ambient temps, >> which I've >> > > always found to degrade tires quickly. My experience is that the >> > > skinwalls/sidewalls go first. >> > >> > > If those were my tires (and lemme just say that I may have a higher >> > > tolerance for risk than others here, and if you base your actions on >> my
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
My criteria for tire replacement is whether the carcass fabric is compromised or not; no bulges or cuts in the sidewall. Cork life will reglue the stray fabric edges, and seal exposed threads, but I hope to wear out the tread first, which is always a satisfying proof of much riding. Confidence in tires is important. On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 4:58 PM, EricP wrote: > > The last set of tan sidewall Pasela tires did the same thing. Like > Angus said, it seems to be where the glue line is. My opinion was the > glue was too strong and not letting the rest of the sidewall flex. > This set also had about 2,500 to 3,000 miles on them. So it was time > to change anyway. > > My own tires were/are 700x35 and run at about 60 pounds (front) and 70 > to 80 (rear). May still be underinflation for my weight at the > time. > > Still have a pair of blackwall Pasela tires that sit in reserve. If > the present Schwalbe Marathon Supreme tires get tiresome then will try > them. > > However, have to admit that since going to 40mm wide tires, even 35 > seem pretty skinny. > > Eric Platt > St. Paul, MN > > On Nov 14, 5:18�pm, R Gonet wrote: > > Nice analysis, Jim. �It would be interesting to ride the tires until > > they fray to see how long they would go, but I tend to replace tires > > on my cars and bikes before I need to. �I think the newer tires are > > safer, it gives me peace of mind, and it's a small luxury that I can > > indulge in. �Kind of like buying new sneakers before your old ones are > > worn out. �This also offsets other riskier, even dumber, behaviors > > that I engage in. > > > > Thanks for the post. > > > > Richard > > > > On Nov 14, 4:57�pm, CycloFiend wrote: > > > > > > > > > on 11/14/09 12:50 PM, R Gonet at [email protected] wrote: > > > > > > I just checked my 2-year-old Jack Browns and they have that same > split > > > > all the way around, though not as bad looking as the much older > Pasela > > > > tan wall. �The split appears to be in the outer gum wall, if that's > > > > the correct term, and doesn't look like it's penetrated into the > woven > > > > layers below. �I don't know if this is a safety issue or not. �I've > > > > never heard of a tire failing at that point before, but confess to > > > > little knowledge on the subject. > > > > > > By the way, it's very easy to check your tires without removing them. > > > > Just deflate them all the way and push the tire bead away from the > > > > rim, working your way around the tire to inspect the circumference > > > > visually. > > > > > > Is there anybody out there who has some knowledge in this area who > has > > > > an opinion on the safety issue? > > > > > Hey. It's the internet. �I'll hazard a guess... > > > > > If you work from the outside in, the tire layers consist of "contact" > > > material (the black part of a skinwall), The underlayer (the skinwall), > the > > > thread/casing, and a thinner layer. > > > > > AASHTA -http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html > > > > > In the photo that David E shared - > http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ > > > > > I notice two things - first, the cracking parrallel to the rim, second > the > > > whitish "fold marks" from running at relatively low inflation. > �Overall, the > > > sidewall looks pretty dried out - certainly drier than my tires. > > > > > David rides in an area which has consistently high ambient temps, which > I've > > > always found to degrade tires quickly. My experience is that the > > > skinwalls/sidewalls go first. > > > > > If those were my tires (and lemme just say that I may have a higher > > > tolerance for risk than others here, and if you base your actions on my > > > opinions, I can't take liability for it) I'd run 'em until I start > to > > > see the beginning hints of threads fraying through. But, I'm also just > odd > > > enough to want to see how they begin to fail. > > > > > If the whole sidewall is cracking, I'd replace the tire. �This is how > you > > > often find old tires on garage sale bikes - unused tread but brittle, > almost > > > "varnished" looking sidewalls. But, if the sidewall is still relatively > > > supple and elastic, I'd run them for a while yet. > > > > > IF I could see through to black tube anywhere when they are inflated, > I'd > > > pull 'em, cut the bead with a tin snip and not use them. > > > > > Back to the photo - > > > The threads still have to fail, and the thread casing/underlayer in > general > > > is probably a bit thicker than the skinwall. �The threads are probably > more > > > resistant to heat damage than the surrounding rubber composite. > > > > > I think what may be happening is the combination of running larger > volume > > > tires at low pressures, while the sidewall itself is drying out a bit > > > quicker than average. That big footprint of the tire tends to stay > stuck, > > > while you and the bike can move quite a bit side-to-side. I would tend > to > > > think that's why you are seeing cracking lik
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
The last set of tan sidewall Pasela tires did the same thing. Like Angus said, it seems to be where the glue line is. My opinion was the glue was too strong and not letting the rest of the sidewall flex. This set also had about 2,500 to 3,000 miles on them. So it was time to change anyway. My own tires were/are 700x35 and run at about 60 pounds (front) and 70 to 80 (rear). May still be underinflation for my weight at the time. Still have a pair of blackwall Pasela tires that sit in reserve. If the present Schwalbe Marathon Supreme tires get tiresome then will try them. However, have to admit that since going to 40mm wide tires, even 35 seem pretty skinny. Eric Platt St. Paul, MN On Nov 14, 5:18�pm, R Gonet wrote: > Nice analysis, Jim. �It would be interesting to ride the tires until > they fray to see how long they would go, but I tend to replace tires > on my cars and bikes before I need to. �I think the newer tires are > safer, it gives me peace of mind, and it's a small luxury that I can > indulge in. �Kind of like buying new sneakers before your old ones are > worn out. �This also offsets other riskier, even dumber, behaviors > that I engage in. > > Thanks for the post. > > Richard > > On Nov 14, 4:57�pm, CycloFiend wrote: > > > > > on 11/14/09 12:50 PM, R Gonet at [email protected] wrote: > > > > I just checked my 2-year-old Jack Browns and they have that same split > > > all the way around, though not as bad looking as the much older Pasela > > > tan wall. �The split appears to be in the outer gum wall, if that's > > > the correct term, and doesn't look like it's penetrated into the woven > > > layers below. �I don't know if this is a safety issue or not. �I've > > > never heard of a tire failing at that point before, but confess to > > > little knowledge on the subject. > > > > By the way, it's very easy to check your tires without removing them. > > > Just deflate them all the way and push the tire bead away from the > > > rim, working your way around the tire to inspect the circumference > > > visually. > > > > Is there anybody out there who has some knowledge in this area who has > > > an opinion on the safety issue? > > > Hey. It's the internet. �I'll hazard a guess... > > > If you work from the outside in, the tire layers consist of "contact" > > material (the black part of a skinwall), The underlayer (the skinwall), the > > thread/casing, and a thinner layer. > > > AASHTA -http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html > > > In the photo that David E shared > > -http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ > > > I notice two things - first, the cracking parrallel to the rim, second the > > whitish "fold marks" from running at relatively low inflation. �Overall, the > > sidewall looks pretty dried out - certainly drier than my tires. > > > David rides in an area which has consistently high ambient temps, which I've > > always found to degrade tires quickly. My experience is that the > > skinwalls/sidewalls go first. > > > If those were my tires (and lemme just say that I may have a higher > > tolerance for risk than others here, and if you base your actions on my > > opinions, I can't take liability for it) I'd run 'em until I start to > > see the beginning hints of threads fraying through. But, I'm also just odd > > enough to want to see how they begin to fail. > > > If the whole sidewall is cracking, I'd replace the tire. �This is how you > > often find old tires on garage sale bikes - unused tread but brittle, almost > > "varnished" looking sidewalls. But, if the sidewall is still relatively > > supple and elastic, I'd run them for a while yet. > > > IF I could see through to black tube anywhere when they are inflated, I'd > > pull 'em, cut the bead with a tin snip and not use them. > > > Back to the photo - > > The threads still have to fail, and the thread casing/underlayer in general > > is probably a bit thicker than the skinwall. �The threads are probably more > > resistant to heat damage than the surrounding rubber composite. > > > I think what may be happening is the combination of running larger volume > > tires at low pressures, while the sidewall itself is drying out a bit > > quicker than average. That big footprint of the tire tends to stay stuck, > > while you and the bike can move quite a bit side-to-side. I would tend to > > think that's why you are seeing cracking like that. > > > Just one other semi-unrelated data point - > > Riding with a canti brake pad out of alignment, I cooked through a brand new > > WTB Velociraptor rear tire in under an hour, and the first half was > > climbing. There's not a lot of material there. �You might check to make sure > > the edge of the pad isn't off the edge of the rim, though David's doesn't > > appear to have done so. > > > One more thought - > > If the underlayer is really dried out, there is a possibility of the black > > layer delaminating. �(Kinda like a retread auto tire failure). �I've > > experienced t
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
Nice analysis, Jim. It would be interesting to ride the tires until they fray to see how long they would go, but I tend to replace tires on my cars and bikes before I need to. I think the newer tires are safer, it gives me peace of mind, and it's a small luxury that I can indulge in. Kind of like buying new sneakers before your old ones are worn out. This also offsets other riskier, even dumber, behaviors that I engage in. Thanks for the post. Richard On Nov 14, 4:57 pm, CycloFiend wrote: > on 11/14/09 12:50 PM, R Gonet at [email protected] wrote: > > > I just checked my 2-year-old Jack Browns and they have that same split > > all the way around, though not as bad looking as the much older Pasela > > tan wall. The split appears to be in the outer gum wall, if that's > > the correct term, and doesn't look like it's penetrated into the woven > > layers below. I don't know if this is a safety issue or not. I've > > never heard of a tire failing at that point before, but confess to > > little knowledge on the subject. > > > By the way, it's very easy to check your tires without removing them. > > Just deflate them all the way and push the tire bead away from the > > rim, working your way around the tire to inspect the circumference > > visually. > > > Is there anybody out there who has some knowledge in this area who has > > an opinion on the safety issue? > > Hey. It's the internet. I'll hazard a guess... > > If you work from the outside in, the tire layers consist of "contact" > material (the black part of a skinwall), The underlayer (the skinwall), the > thread/casing, and a thinner layer. > > AASHTA -http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html > > In the photo that David E shared > -http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ > > I notice two things - first, the cracking parrallel to the rim, second the > whitish "fold marks" from running at relatively low inflation. Overall, the > sidewall looks pretty dried out - certainly drier than my tires. > > David rides in an area which has consistently high ambient temps, which I've > always found to degrade tires quickly. My experience is that the > skinwalls/sidewalls go first. > > If those were my tires (and lemme just say that I may have a higher > tolerance for risk than others here, and if you base your actions on my > opinions, I can't take liability for it) I'd run 'em until I start to > see the beginning hints of threads fraying through. But, I'm also just odd > enough to want to see how they begin to fail. > > If the whole sidewall is cracking, I'd replace the tire. This is how you > often find old tires on garage sale bikes - unused tread but brittle, almost > "varnished" looking sidewalls. But, if the sidewall is still relatively > supple and elastic, I'd run them for a while yet. > > IF I could see through to black tube anywhere when they are inflated, I'd > pull 'em, cut the bead with a tin snip and not use them. > > Back to the photo - > The threads still have to fail, and the thread casing/underlayer in general > is probably a bit thicker than the skinwall. The threads are probably more > resistant to heat damage than the surrounding rubber composite. > > I think what may be happening is the combination of running larger volume > tires at low pressures, while the sidewall itself is drying out a bit > quicker than average. That big footprint of the tire tends to stay stuck, > while you and the bike can move quite a bit side-to-side. I would tend to > think that's why you are seeing cracking like that. > > Just one other semi-unrelated data point - > Riding with a canti brake pad out of alignment, I cooked through a brand new > WTB Velociraptor rear tire in under an hour, and the first half was > climbing. There's not a lot of material there. You might check to make sure > the edge of the pad isn't off the edge of the rim, though David's doesn't > appear to have done so. > > One more thought - > If the underlayer is really dried out, there is a possibility of the black > layer delaminating. (Kinda like a retread auto tire failure). I've > experienced this with a Specialized road tire (can't remember the name - > back in the later 90's) that used a dual durometer compound. But, even that > was happening slowly enough that I noticed it between rides. > > Hope that helps. > > - Jim "who just took his Pasela 32's outside and looke at them under strong > light and cleaned glasses..." > > -- > Jim Edgar > [email protected] > > "One Cog - Zero Excuses" L/S T-shirt - Now > availablehttp://www.cyclofiend.com/stuff > > Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries -http://www.cyclofiend.com > Current Classics - Cross Bikes > Singlespeed - Working Bikes > > Send In Your Photos! - Here's how:http://www.cyclofiend.com/guidelines --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
Jim, David, For what it's worth (probably 2 cents), I believe the "cracking" is not a crack, but the last layer of material that was wrapped over the tire bead. It looks like it has started to peel off the sidewall. I've had several tires do this over the years, specifically older/ narrower Paselas. I have not had a tire fail due to this...yet. The tan sidewalls seemed to degrade faster in So Cal than they do in East Texas (smog degrades rubber faster?). There is not a lot of smog out here...heck there is not a lot of anything out here! (cept trees). Everyone makes their own choices and lives with the consequences...having a higher than normal risk tolerance (and Scottish blood) I'm riding my tires into the ground. Angus "whose All-Rounder still wears the original, circa 1998, Ritchey Tom Slick" On Nov 14, 3:57 pm, CycloFiend wrote: > on 11/14/09 12:50 PM, R Gonet at [email protected] wrote: > > > I just checked my 2-year-old Jack Browns and they have that same split > > all the way around, though not as bad looking as the much older Pasela > > tan wall. The split appears to be in the outer gum wall, if that's > > the correct term, and doesn't look like it's penetrated into the woven > > layers below. I don't know if this is a safety issue or not. I've > > never heard of a tire failing at that point before, but confess to > > little knowledge on the subject. > > > By the way, it's very easy to check your tires without removing them. > > Just deflate them all the way and push the tire bead away from the > > rim, working your way around the tire to inspect the circumference > > visually. > > > Is there anybody out there who has some knowledge in this area who has > > an opinion on the safety issue? > > Hey. It's the internet. I'll hazard a guess... > > If you work from the outside in, the tire layers consist of "contact" > material (the black part of a skinwall), The underlayer (the skinwall), the > thread/casing, and a thinner layer. > > AASHTA -http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html > > In the photo that David E shared > -http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ > > I notice two things - first, the cracking parrallel to the rim, second the > whitish "fold marks" from running at relatively low inflation. Overall, the > sidewall looks pretty dried out - certainly drier than my tires. > > David rides in an area which has consistently high ambient temps, which I've > always found to degrade tires quickly. My experience is that the > skinwalls/sidewalls go first. > > If those were my tires (and lemme just say that I may have a higher > tolerance for risk than others here, and if you base your actions on my > opinions, I can't take liability for it) I'd run 'em until I start to > see the beginning hints of threads fraying through. But, I'm also just odd > enough to want to see how they begin to fail. > > If the whole sidewall is cracking, I'd replace the tire. This is how you > often find old tires on garage sale bikes - unused tread but brittle, almost > "varnished" looking sidewalls. But, if the sidewall is still relatively > supple and elastic, I'd run them for a while yet. > > IF I could see through to black tube anywhere when they are inflated, I'd > pull 'em, cut the bead with a tin snip and not use them. > > Back to the photo - > The threads still have to fail, and the thread casing/underlayer in general > is probably a bit thicker than the skinwall. The threads are probably more > resistant to heat damage than the surrounding rubber composite. > > I think what may be happening is the combination of running larger volume > tires at low pressures, while the sidewall itself is drying out a bit > quicker than average. That big footprint of the tire tends to stay stuck, > while you and the bike can move quite a bit side-to-side. I would tend to > think that's why you are seeing cracking like that. > > Just one other semi-unrelated data point - > Riding with a canti brake pad out of alignment, I cooked through a brand new > WTB Velociraptor rear tire in under an hour, and the first half was > climbing. There's not a lot of material there. You might check to make sure > the edge of the pad isn't off the edge of the rim, though David's doesn't > appear to have done so. > > One more thought - > If the underlayer is really dried out, there is a possibility of the black > layer delaminating. (Kinda like a retread auto tire failure). I've > experienced this with a Specialized road tire (can't remember the name - > back in the later 90's) that used a dual durometer compound. But, even that > was happening slowly enough that I noticed it between rides. > > Hope that helps. > > - Jim "who just took his Pasela 32's outside and looke at them under strong > light and cleaned glasses..." > > -- > Jim Edgar > [email protected] > > "One Cog - Zero Excuses" L/S T-shirt - Now > availablehttp://www.cyclofiend.com/stuff > > Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries -http://www.cy
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
on 11/14/09 12:50 PM, R Gonet at [email protected] wrote: > I just checked my 2-year-old Jack Browns and they have that same split > all the way around, though not as bad looking as the much older Pasela > tan wall. The split appears to be in the outer gum wall, if that's > the correct term, and doesn't look like it's penetrated into the woven > layers below. I don't know if this is a safety issue or not. I've > never heard of a tire failing at that point before, but confess to > little knowledge on the subject. > > By the way, it's very easy to check your tires without removing them. > Just deflate them all the way and push the tire bead away from the > rim, working your way around the tire to inspect the circumference > visually. > > Is there anybody out there who has some knowledge in this area who has > an opinion on the safety issue? Hey. It's the internet. I'll hazard a guess... If you work from the outside in, the tire layers consist of "contact" material (the black part of a skinwall), The underlayer (the skinwall), the thread/casing, and a thinner layer. AASHTA - http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html In the photo that David E shared - http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ I notice two things - first, the cracking parrallel to the rim, second the whitish "fold marks" from running at relatively low inflation. Overall, the sidewall looks pretty dried out - certainly drier than my tires. David rides in an area which has consistently high ambient temps, which I've always found to degrade tires quickly. My experience is that the skinwalls/sidewalls go first. If those were my tires (and lemme just say that I may have a higher tolerance for risk than others here, and if you base your actions on my opinions, I can't take liability for it) I'd run 'em until I start to see the beginning hints of threads fraying through. But, I'm also just odd enough to want to see how they begin to fail. If the whole sidewall is cracking, I'd replace the tire. This is how you often find old tires on garage sale bikes - unused tread but brittle, almost "varnished" looking sidewalls. But, if the sidewall is still relatively supple and elastic, I'd run them for a while yet. IF I could see through to black tube anywhere when they are inflated, I'd pull 'em, cut the bead with a tin snip and not use them. Back to the photo - The threads still have to fail, and the thread casing/underlayer in general is probably a bit thicker than the skinwall. The threads are probably more resistant to heat damage than the surrounding rubber composite. I think what may be happening is the combination of running larger volume tires at low pressures, while the sidewall itself is drying out a bit quicker than average. That big footprint of the tire tends to stay stuck, while you and the bike can move quite a bit side-to-side. I would tend to think that's why you are seeing cracking like that. Just one other semi-unrelated data point - Riding with a canti brake pad out of alignment, I cooked through a brand new WTB Velociraptor rear tire in under an hour, and the first half was climbing. There's not a lot of material there. You might check to make sure the edge of the pad isn't off the edge of the rim, though David's doesn't appear to have done so. One more thought - If the underlayer is really dried out, there is a possibility of the black layer delaminating. (Kinda like a retread auto tire failure). I've experienced this with a Specialized road tire (can't remember the name - back in the later 90's) that used a dual durometer compound. But, even that was happening slowly enough that I noticed it between rides. Hope that helps. - Jim "who just took his Pasela 32's outside and looke at them under strong light and cleaned glasses..." -- Jim Edgar [email protected] "One Cog - Zero Excuses" L/S T-shirt - Now available http://www.cyclofiend.com/stuff Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries - http://www.cyclofiend.com Current Classics - Cross Bikes Singlespeed - Working Bikes Send In Your Photos! - Here's how: http://www.cyclofiend.com/guidelines --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
I just checked my 2-year-old Jack Browns and they have that same split all the way around, though not as bad looking as the much older Pasela tan wall. The split appears to be in the outer gum wall, if that's the correct term, and doesn't look like it's penetrated into the woven layers below. I don't know if this is a safety issue or not. I've never heard of a tire failing at that point before, but confess to little knowledge on the subject. By the way, it's very easy to check your tires without removing them. Just deflate them all the way and push the tire bead away from the rim, working your way around the tire to inspect the circumference visually. Is there anybody out there who has some knowledge in this area who has an opinion on the safety issue? On Nov 14, 2:11 pm, cyclotourist wrote: > You know, I noticed that before on mine, but didn't think much about it... > now took a second look and yeah, it runs around the entire circumference, > maybe 3 or 4 mm above the rim. Top layer of the weave is totally split. > > Replace immediately??? Tread is still ok... > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ > > On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 7:53 AM, R Gonet wrote: > > > > > > > > > I demounted some older Pasela's and found a crack in the sidewall that > > ran around the entire sidewall at the point where the sidewall touches > > the rim, maybe a mm. or two from the edge of the bead. I never would > > have detected it if I had not taken the tires off. The black tread > > was still in excellent condition, but I had to throw them away. My > > suspicion is that the deterioration of the sidewall is not due to > > usage or wear but to degradation from ultraviolet rays and/or ozone. > > I'm going to inspect my Jack Browns today for the same problem. > > > > FWIW, I have a few nicks in my tan Pasela sidewalls from rocks or such, > > but > > > not cracking or deterioration on them. I'm keeping my on those few areas > > as > > > the top weave is cut, but the second layer is still fine. Hope it stays > > > that way as I have a bit of tread still (but going fast!). They do seem > > > really "dry" though, almost brittle. > > -- > Cheers, > David > Redlands, CA > > "Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is something > wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a gym." ~Bill Nye, > scientist guy --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
You know, I noticed that before on mine, but didn't think much about it... now took a second look and yeah, it runs around the entire circumference, maybe 3 or 4 mm above the rim. Top layer of the weave is totally split. Replace immediately??? Tread is still ok... http://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4103817724/ On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 7:53 AM, R Gonet wrote: > > I demounted some older Pasela's and found a crack in the sidewall that > ran around the entire sidewall at the point where the sidewall touches > the rim, maybe a mm. or two from the edge of the bead. I never would > have detected it if I had not taken the tires off. The black tread > was still in excellent condition, but I had to throw them away. My > suspicion is that the deterioration of the sidewall is not due to > usage or wear but to degradation from ultraviolet rays and/or ozone. > I'm going to inspect my Jack Browns today for the same problem. > > > > FWIW, I have a few nicks in my tan Pasela sidewalls from rocks or such, > but > > not cracking or deterioration on them. I'm keeping my on those few areas > as > > the top weave is cut, but the second layer is still fine. Hope it stays > > that way as I have a bit of tread still (but going fast!). They do seem > > really "dry" though, almost brittle. > > > > > > -- Cheers, David Redlands, CA "Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is something wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a gym." ~Bill Nye, scientist guy --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
I demounted some older Pasela's and found a crack in the sidewall that ran around the entire sidewall at the point where the sidewall touches the rim, maybe a mm. or two from the edge of the bead. I never would have detected it if I had not taken the tires off. The black tread was still in excellent condition, but I had to throw them away. My suspicion is that the deterioration of the sidewall is not due to usage or wear but to degradation from ultraviolet rays and/or ozone. I'm going to inspect my Jack Browns today for the same problem. > > FWIW, I have a few nicks in my tan Pasela sidewalls from rocks or such, but > not cracking or deterioration on them. I'm keeping my on those few areas as > the top weave is cut, but the second layer is still fine. Hope it stays > that way as I have a bit of tread still (but going fast!). They do seem > really "dry" though, almost brittle. > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 7:02 PM, Seth Vidal wrote: > > On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 8:12 PM, cyclotourist > wrote: > > What is the difference between a black-walled Pasela and a T-Serve? > > > > The t-serves are a little rounder. Have 'Tourguard" by default and > the ones I have also have a reflective strip. > > in terms of ride quality not a lot different. > > tserves run $32each, blackwall pasela's cost me $18 each > > -sv > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ > So $14 is the difference!!! FWIW, I have a few nicks in my tan Pasela sidewalls from rocks or such, but not cracking or deterioration on them. I'm keeping my on those few areas as the top weave is cut, but the second layer is still fine. Hope it stays that way as I have a bit of tread still (but going fast!). They do seem really "dry" though, almost brittle. -- Cheers, David Redlands, CA "Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is something wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a gym." ~Bill Nye, scientist guy --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
Are people actually reporting premature sidewall deterioration with the Jack Browns? I've had sidewall problems with tan Paselas like others have reported, but the sidewalls of the Jack Brown I'm using now look fine after thousands of sometimes harsh miles have worn off most of the black rubber. While Paselas and Jack Browns are similar designs made by the same company, I suppose the Jack Brown construction may be different enough not to suffer the problem, or perhaps the Pasela problems were mostly just a bad batch or two. > What is a skinwall made out of, anyway? The tan color is just the natural color of rubber. Black and other colors result from additives to the rubber compound, which can also change the tire's wear, traction, and stiffness. The natural tan rubber is supposed to be more flexible or "subtle". --Brian Hefferan On Nov 12, 11:54 pm, Earl Grey wrote: > Inspired by a comment of Paselas wearing out prematurely because of > skinwall deterioration and my recent purchase of 2 Jack Browns, is > there a way to keep skinwalls from disintegrating prematurely? Has > anyone tried ArmorAll or some such (being very careful to not get it > on the tread, of course) :) > > Anyone know what the reason is for sidewalls going threadbare? UV, > ozone, both? What is a skinwall made out of, anyway? > > Cheers, > > Gernot --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 8:12 PM, cyclotourist wrote: > What is the difference between a black-walled Pasela and a T-Serve? > The t-serves are a little rounder. Have 'Tourguard" by default and the ones I have also have a reflective strip. in terms of ride quality not a lot different. tserves run $32each, blackwall pasela's cost me $18 each -sv --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
Oh, say it ain't so! I *really* want the tan sidewalls! So far what I'm hearing is that no one knows of *any* reasonably tough, 700c >=35mm black-and-tan tire *for any price* other than the Pasela TGs. Makes me want to stock up! Well, perhaps they will remain available or something else will emerge. On Nov 13, 10:16 am, beth h wrote: > Well, there's always switching to blackwall tires. The Paselas are now > available in an all-black version in several sizes. > > Beth > > On Nov 12, 8:54 pm, Earl Grey wrote: > > > > > Inspired by a comment of Paselas wearing out prematurely because of > > skinwall deterioration... --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
On Nov 12, 10:57 pm, Nicholas Grieco wrote: > > Has anybody tried this on their > sidewalls?http://www.303products.com/shop303/index.cfm/category/65/303-aerospac... I've not used any 303 protectant on my Jack Browns. However, I drive a convertible and I've used this particular brand as it is recommended far above Armor All to protect the synthetic soft top and dashboard, or any rubber/plastic that gets a lot of exposure to the sun. So far, after eight years, my soft top is in almost-pristine condition, and the only plastic fabric that is cracked is part of my seat where I don't use this stuff. Figures! :) A tip on application of these protectant: spray on a small sponge/ cloth and use that to wipe down the areas of interest. -B --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
What is the difference between a black-walled Pasela and a T-Serve? DE On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 8:18 AM, Seth Vidal wrote: > > On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:16 AM, beth h wrote: > > > > Well, there's always switching to blackwall tires. The Paselas are now > > available in an all-black version in several sizes. > > > > the owner of my lbs has said that the non-tg, wirebead paselas are > ONLY blackwall now. > > The tan walls are only available in tg/kevlar. > > Can anyone else confirm that? > > -sv > > > > -- Cheers, David Redlands, CA "Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is something wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a gym." ~Bill Nye, scientist guy --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
Ditto for me. I have gotten good life out of the Tserves. Some claim the ride isn't as good, but for everyday commuting, I can't tell the difference. Michael Westford, Vt On Nov 13, 3:02 pm, Seth Vidal wrote: > On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 3:00 PM, Tim McNamara wrote: > > > My understanding is that this is due to QBP only stocking the > > blackwalls now, but the tan walls are available from other > > wholesalers. Bummer, I hate blackwall tires. > > I like tanwalls, too. However the Pasela T-serves with the reflective > strip have gotten my attention. I have a pair on our tandem and they > not only look good but they also feel good. > > Might be worth a look. > > -sv --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 3:00 PM, Tim McNamara wrote: > > My understanding is that this is due to QBP only stocking the > blackwalls now, but the tan walls are available from other > wholesalers. Bummer, I hate blackwall tires. > I like tanwalls, too. However the Pasela T-serves with the reflective strip have gotten my attention. I have a pair on our tandem and they not only look good but they also feel good. Might be worth a look. -sv --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
On Nov 13, 2009, at 10:18 AM, Seth Vidal wrote: > > On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:16 AM, beth h > wrote: >> >> Well, there's always switching to blackwall tires. The Paselas are >> now >> available in an all-black version in several sizes. >> > > the owner of my lbs has said that the non-tg, wirebead paselas are > ONLY blackwall now. > > The tan walls are only available in tg/kevlar. > > Can anyone else confirm that? My understanding is that this is due to QBP only stocking the blackwalls now, but the tan walls are available from other wholesalers. Bummer, I hate blackwall tires. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:16 AM, beth h wrote: > > Well, there's always switching to blackwall tires. The Paselas are now > available in an all-black version in several sizes. > the owner of my lbs has said that the non-tg, wirebead paselas are ONLY blackwall now. The tan walls are only available in tg/kevlar. Can anyone else confirm that? -sv --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
Well, there's always switching to blackwall tires. The Paselas are now available in an all-black version in several sizes. Beth On Nov 12, 8:54 pm, Earl Grey wrote: > Inspired by a comment of Paselas wearing out prematurely because of > skinwall deterioration... --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
Correction: that name is Jevelot. On Nov 13, 2009, at 12:20 AM, cyclotourist wrote: > I wouldn't use ArmorAll. It's silcone based and not sure what it > would do the the sidewalls (I don't use it on anything for that > reason). > > I'd guess a latex based product like Cork LIfe would be better: > http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___91642 > > > > On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 8:54 PM, Earl Grey wrote: > > Inspired by a comment of Paselas wearing out prematurely because of > skinwall deterioration and my recent purchase of 2 Jack Browns, is > there a way to keep skinwalls from disintegrating prematurely? Has > anyone tried ArmorAll or some such (being very careful to not get it > on the tread, of course) :) > > Anyone know what the reason is for sidewalls going threadbare? UV, > ozone, both? What is a skinwall made out of, anyway? > > Cheers, > > Gernot > > > > > > -- > Cheers, > David > Redlands, CA > > "Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is > something wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a > gym." ~Bill Nye, scientist guy > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
A bicycle related product would be Jevolet Tire Life liquid latex. It's available from online sellers including World Class Cycles. On Nov 13, 2009, at 12:20 AM, cyclotourist wrote: > I wouldn't use ArmorAll. It's silcone based and not sure what it > would do the the sidewalls (I don't use it on anything for that > reason). > > I'd guess a latex based product like Cork LIfe would be better: > http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___91642 > > > > On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 8:54 PM, Earl Grey wrote: > > Inspired by a comment of Paselas wearing out prematurely because of > skinwall deterioration and my recent purchase of 2 Jack Browns, is > there a way to keep skinwalls from disintegrating prematurely? Has > anyone tried ArmorAll or some such (being very careful to not get it > on the tread, of course) :) > > Anyone know what the reason is for sidewalls going threadbare? UV, > ozone, both? What is a skinwall made out of, anyway? > > Cheers, > > Gernot > > > > > > -- > Cheers, > David > Redlands, CA > > "Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is > something wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a > gym." ~Bill Nye, scientist guy > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
I've used it on my car's tires. Works great and lasts longer than ArmorAll. --Eric www.wheelsnorth.org www.campyonly.com On Nov 12, 2009, at 10:57 PM, Nicholas Grieco wrote: > > On Nov 12, 8:54 pm, Earl Grey wrote: >> Inspired by a comment of Paselas wearing out prematurely because of >> skinwall deterioration and my recent purchase of 2 Jack Browns, is >> there a way to keep skinwalls from disintegrating prematurely? Has >> anyone tried ArmorAll or some such (being very careful to not get it >> on the tread, of course) :) >> >> Anyone know what the reason is for sidewalls going threadbare? UV, >> ozone, both? What is a skinwall made out of, anyway? >> >> Cheers, >> >> Gernot > > Has anybody tried this on their sidewalls? > http://www.303products.com/shop303/index.cfm/category/65/303-aerospace-protectant.cfm > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
On Nov 12, 8:54 pm, Earl Grey wrote: > Inspired by a comment of Paselas wearing out prematurely because of > skinwall deterioration and my recent purchase of 2 Jack Browns, is > there a way to keep skinwalls from disintegrating prematurely? Has > anyone tried ArmorAll or some such (being very careful to not get it > on the tread, of course) :) > > Anyone know what the reason is for sidewalls going threadbare? UV, > ozone, both? What is a skinwall made out of, anyway? > > Cheers, > > Gernot Has anybody tried this on their sidewalls? http://www.303products.com/shop303/index.cfm/category/65/303-aerospace-protectant.cfm --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
Branford Bike used to sell sidewalk dressing. Not sure if they still do: www.branfordbike.com ―Eric Norris Sent via iPhone On Nov 12, 2009, at 9:08 PM, "[email protected]" wrote: > > > I saw some stuff at a shop that came in a little bottle and was > supposed to preserve sew-up tires. > I don't recall what it was called, but I wonder if it would be > beneficial to keep my stash of Trimlines nice and supple? > > Ryan > > > > On Nov 12, 2009, at 21:54, Earl Grey wrote: > >> >> Inspired by a comment of Paselas wearing out prematurely because of >> skinwall deterioration and my recent purchase of 2 Jack Browns, is >> there a way to keep skinwalls from disintegrating prematurely? Has >> anyone tried ArmorAll or some such (being very careful to not get it >> on the tread, of course) :) >> >> Anyone know what the reason is for sidewalls going threadbare? UV, >> ozone, both? What is a skinwall made out of, anyway? >> >> Cheers, >> >> Gernot >> >>> > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
I wouldn't use ArmorAll. It's silcone based and not sure what it would do the the sidewalls (I don't use it on anything for that reason). I'd guess a latex based product like Cork LIfe would be better: http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___91642 On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 8:54 PM, Earl Grey wrote: > > Inspired by a comment of Paselas wearing out prematurely because of > skinwall deterioration and my recent purchase of 2 Jack Browns, is > there a way to keep skinwalls from disintegrating prematurely? Has > anyone tried ArmorAll or some such (being very careful to not get it > on the tread, of course) :) > > Anyone know what the reason is for sidewalls going threadbare? UV, > ozone, both? What is a skinwall made out of, anyway? > > Cheers, > > Gernot > > > > -- Cheers, David Redlands, CA "Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is something wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a gym." ~Bill Nye, scientist guy --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[RBW] Re: increasing longevity of skinwall tires?
I saw some stuff at a shop that came in a little bottle and was supposed to preserve sew-up tires. I don't recall what it was called, but I wonder if it would be beneficial to keep my stash of Trimlines nice and supple? Ryan On Nov 12, 2009, at 21:54, Earl Grey wrote: > > Inspired by a comment of Paselas wearing out prematurely because of > skinwall deterioration and my recent purchase of 2 Jack Browns, is > there a way to keep skinwalls from disintegrating prematurely? Has > anyone tried ArmorAll or some such (being very careful to not get it > on the tread, of course) :) > > Anyone know what the reason is for sidewalls going threadbare? UV, > ozone, both? What is a skinwall made out of, anyway? > > Cheers, > > Gernot > > > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
