Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Iron Rider]

The fix was actually a multi-layered set up. Between the tube and the tire 
I used a Park Took tire patch. However, after an hour or so it began to 
bulge a bit so I wrapped the whole shebang in duct tape and unnattached the 
rim brake. The duct tape really seemed to  keep the bulge from growing and 
I rode a century on the MacGyvered repair.


On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 9:29:18 PM UTC-5, Metin Uz wrote:
>
> I don't see how the duct tape helps wrapped on the outside. I was 
> expecting to see a picture showing the tape INSIDE the tire, using the tire 
> pressure and effectively creating a tire boot.
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Metin Uz]

I don't see how the duct tape helps wrapped on the outside. I was expecting 
to see a picture showing the tape INSIDE the tire, using the tire pressure 
and effectively creating a tire boot.

--Metin

On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 9:36:11 AM UTC-8, Iron Rider wrote:
>
> Another rider gave me one of those and it worked initially. I added the 
> duct tape when I saw slight bulge develop and did not want to risk another 
> blowout because I did not have another boot and I have over one hundred 
> miles left to ride. 
>
> I now carry a couple just in case. 
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Kieran J]

Yeah, not sure what the heck I was on about there. Just take the keyboard 
away from me. Or maybe I need new glasses ..
 
KJ
 

On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 2:40:13 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:

> Kieran 
>  
> Iron Rider is specifically talking about the case where you have a 
> non-repairable tire sidewall blowout on 650B.  Since very few bike shops 
> and zero sporting goods stores sell 650B tires, Iron Rider is making the 
> point that you might be hosed in that situation.  
>
>  
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Bill Lindsay]

"On the point about spokes, I was pricing out components to build a 650b 
wheel set and it seems that there are no 650b spokes available? Which size 
spoke do you use for a 650b build? Maybe once I read the answer it'll be a 
duh moment. "

650B spokes are a little longer than spokes for 26" wheels and a little 
shorter than spokes for 700c wheels.  ;-)  

Many common patterns require spokes in the ~285mm range.  Shops have stuff 
in the 296-302 range for 700c, and stuff in the 260-270 range for 26". 
 Better shops have the Phil spoke cutter, and can make you one spoke. 
 Riders who like to "be prepared" often carry a driveside rear, since 
that's usually the one that breaks and is often only a mm or two short for 
everywhere else.  Or the emergency repair spokes can work for anything.  

When I've built my own 650B wheels, I bought spokes from Rich Lesnik.  For 
light rims, like the PL23, I leave it to a pro.  Rich or Mike Varley.  

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RE: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Allingham II, Thomas J]

I always use a spoke length calculator, Hugh, using the specific rim and hub 
I'm using.  Señor Tinker has a link to a good one on his page.  
http://www.biketinker.com/


From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Hugh Smitham
Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2014 2:55 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

Ha! That's funny Bill. I'll try to plan that out;-) It's a good point that 
Ironrider makes and I for one will start travelling with tire/boot patches and 
for long trips a fordable replacement. I imagine as the 650b size becomes more 
popular then bike stores will carry more selection.

On the point about spokes, I was pricing out components to build a 650b wheel 
set and it seems that there are no 650b spokes available? Which size spoke do 
you use for a 650b build? Maybe once I read the answer it'll be a duh moment.

~Hugh

"Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep moving." -- 
Albert Einstein

http://velocipedemusings.blogspot.com/


On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 11:40 AM, Bill Lindsay 
mailto:tapebu...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Kieran

Iron Rider is specifically talking about the case where you have a 
non-repairable tire sidewall blowout on 650B.  Since very few bike shops and 
zero sporting goods stores sell 650B tires, Iron Rider is making the point that 
you might be hosed in that situation.

It's partially true with spokes, too.  If you break a spoke on a 650B wheel, 
most bike shops don't have that length on the shelf.  Many shops can make a 
spoke, but they can't make a tire.

The clear advice is that all mechanical failures should be scheduled to occur 
within ~100ft of the front door of a bicycle shop that is open for business.  
You're welcome!  ;-)

On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 11:22:03 AM UTC-8, Kieran J wrote:
Many have noted that using a 26" tube for a 650b tire is pretty common and 
entirely functional. 650b-specific tubes are ideal, but certainly not necessary.

Since 26" tires are the most common of all, I would say it's quite possible to 
mitigate tire issues by either carrying a 26er with you or finding one en route.

KJ


On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 12:32:23 PM UTC-5, Iron Rider wrote:
On a related point, one concern with riding a 650 B tire is that it is not a 
standard size and is therefore hard if not impossible to replace on the road. 
If this were a 26" or 700C any bike shop or sporting good store could provide a 
(temporary) replacement but with 650B that is not an option. Since this 
occurred I swiched to SOMA B (with Kevlar) and carry a tire patch. No tire is 
slower than a tire with a blown sidewall.
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RE: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Allingham II, Thomas J]

Well, the Kevlar FiberFix emergency spoke -- 
http://harriscyclery.net/itemdetails.cfm?ID=707 -- should solve the 650B spoke 
problem.  Unless they don't work (I carry them, but have never had to use one). 
 But Sheldon says they work, so they must.

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Bill Lindsay
Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2014 2:40 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

Kieran

Iron Rider is specifically talking about the case where you have a 
non-repairable tire sidewall blowout on 650B.  Since very few bike shops and 
zero sporting goods stores sell 650B tires, Iron Rider is making the point that 
you might be hosed in that situation.

It's partially true with spokes, too.  If you break a spoke on a 650B wheel, 
most bike shops don't have that length on the shelf.  Many shops can make a 
spoke, but they can't make a tire.

The clear advice is that all mechanical failures should be scheduled to occur 
within ~100ft of the front door of a bicycle shop that is open for business.  
You're welcome!  ;-)

On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 11:22:03 AM UTC-8, Kieran J wrote:
Many have noted that using a 26" tube for a 650b tire is pretty common and 
entirely functional. 650b-specific tubes are ideal, but certainly not necessary.

Since 26" tires are the most common of all, I would say it's quite possible to 
mitigate tire issues by either carrying a 26er with you or finding one en route.

KJ


On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 12:32:23 PM UTC-5, Iron Rider wrote:
On a related point, one concern with riding a 650 B tire is that it is not a 
standard size and is therefore hard if not impossible to replace on the road. 
If this were a 26" or 700C any bike shop or sporting good store could provide a 
(temporary) replacement but with 650B that is not an option. Since this 
occurred I swiched to SOMA B (with Kevlar) and carry a tire patch. No tire is 
slower than a tire with a blown sidewall.
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Ha! That's funny Bill. I'll try to plan that out;-) It's a good point that
Ironrider makes and I for one will start travelling with tire/boot patches
and for long trips a fordable replacement. I imagine as the 650b size
becomes more popular then bike stores will carry more selection.

On the point about spokes, I was pricing out components to build a 650b
wheel set and it seems that there are no 650b spokes available? Which size
spoke do you use for a 650b build? Maybe once I read the answer it'll be a
duh moment.

~Hugh

"Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep
moving." -- Albert Einstein

http://velocipedemusings.blogspot.com/




On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 11:40 AM, Bill Lindsay  wrote:

> Kieran
>
> Iron Rider is specifically talking about the case where you have a
> non-repairable tire sidewall blowout on 650B.  Since very few bike shops
> and zero sporting goods stores sell 650B tires, Iron Rider is making the
> point that you might be hosed in that situation.
>
> It's partially true with spokes, too.  If you break a spoke on a 650B
> wheel, most bike shops don't have that length on the shelf.  Many shops can
> make a spoke, but they can't make a tire.
>
> The clear advice is that all mechanical failures should be scheduled to
> occur within ~100ft of the front door of a bicycle shop that is open for
> business.  You're welcome!  ;-)
>
> On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 11:22:03 AM UTC-8, Kieran J wrote:
>>
>> Many have noted that using a 26" tube for a 650b tire is pretty common
>> and entirely functional. 650b-specific tubes are ideal, but certainly not
>> necessary.
>>
>> Since 26" tires are the most common of all, I would say it's quite
>> possible to mitigate tire issues by either carrying a 26er with you or
>> finding one en route.
>>
>> KJ
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 12:32:23 PM UTC-5, Iron Rider wrote:
>>
>>> On a related point, one concern with riding a 650 B tire is that it is
>>> not a standard size and is therefore hard if not impossible to replace on
>>> the road. If this were a 26" or 700C any bike shop or sporting good store
>>> could provide a (temporary) replacement but with 650B that is not an
>>> option. Since this occurred I swiched to SOMA B (with Kevlar) and carry a
>>> tire patch. No tire is slower than a tire with a blown sidewall.
>>>
>>  --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Bruce Herbitter]

I've never had a blow out or a gash severe enough to warrant a tire 
boot. Regardless of what size tire you ride, the chances of encountering 
difficulty within 100 of an open bike shop are small, despite Bill's 
sage advice. I carry a cell phone for emergency extractions when the LZ 
gets too hot. Err, when I can't come up with some kind of hack or fix to 
limp home on. Having gone totally away from 700 to 650B, it's just never 
been a problem.




On 1/8/2014 1:40 PM, Bill Lindsay wrote:


clear advice is that all mechanical failures should be scheduled 
to occur within ~100ft of the front door of a bicycle shop that is 
open for business.


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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Bill Lindsay]

Kieran

Iron Rider is specifically talking about the case where you have a 
non-repairable tire sidewall blowout on 650B.  Since very few bike shops 
and zero sporting goods stores sell 650B tires, Iron Rider is making the 
point that you might be hosed in that situation.  

It's partially true with spokes, too.  If you break a spoke on a 650B 
wheel, most bike shops don't have that length on the shelf.  Many shops can 
make a spoke, but they can't make a tire.  

The clear advice is that all mechanical failures should be scheduled to 
occur within ~100ft of the front door of a bicycle shop that is open for 
business.  You're welcome!  ;-)

On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 11:22:03 AM UTC-8, Kieran J wrote:
>
> Many have noted that using a 26" tube for a 650b tire is pretty common and 
> entirely functional. 650b-specific tubes are ideal, but certainly not 
> necessary. 
>  
> Since 26" tires are the most common of all, I would say it's quite 
> possible to mitigate tire issues by either carrying a 26er with you or 
> finding one en route.
>  
> KJ
>  
>  
> On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 12:32:23 PM UTC-5, Iron Rider wrote:
>
>> On a related point, one concern with riding a 650 B tire is that it is 
>> not a standard size and is therefore hard if not impossible to replace on 
>> the road. If this were a 26" or 700C any bike shop or sporting good store 
>> could provide a (temporary) replacement but with 650B that is not an 
>> option. Since this occurred I swiched to SOMA B (with Kevlar) and carry a 
>> tire patch. No tire is slower than a tire with a blown sidewall. 
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Kieran J]

Many have noted that using a 26" tube for a 650b tire is pretty common and 
entirely functional. 650b-specific tubes are ideal, but certainly not 
necessary. 
 
Since 26" tires are the most common of all, I would say it's quite possible 
to mitigate tire issues by either carrying a 26er with you or finding one 
en route.
 
KJ
 
 
On Wednesday, January 8, 2014 12:32:23 PM UTC-5, Iron Rider wrote:

> On a related point, one concern with riding a 650 B tire is that it is not 
> a standard size and is therefore hard if not impossible to replace on the 
> road. If this were a 26" or 700C any bike shop or sporting good store could 
> provide a (temporary) replacement but with 650B that is not an option. 
> Since this occurred I swiched to SOMA B (with Kevlar) and carry a tire 
> patch. No tire is slower than a tire with a blown sidewall. 
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Iron Rider]

Another rider gave me one of those and it worked initially. I added the 
duct tape when I saw slight bulge develop and did not want to risk another 
blowout because I did not have another boot and I have over one hundred 
miles left to ride. 

I now carry a couple just in case. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Iron Rider]

In my opinion, the sidewall was not cut. It appears to have delaminated. 
The fibers are layered in cross hatch pattern and the layers separated 
allowing the blowout to occur. There was no brake contact with the side 
wall and no sign of any abrasion or cutting of the sidewall. The blowout 
was not preceded by any unusual impact and (in hindsight) the delamination 
occurred over several miles. (Speaking of which, the incident taught me 
that if a tire starts to develop a once a rotation thump. Stop immediately 
and find the cause.) 

On a related point, one concern with riding a 650 B tire is that it is not 
a standard size and is therefore hard if not impossible to replace on the 
road. If this were a 26" or 700C any bike shop or sporting good store could 
provide a (temporary) replacement but with 650B that is not an option. 
Since this occurred I swiched to SOMA B (with Kevlar) and carry a tire 
patch. No tire is slower than a tire with a blown sidewall. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[cyclotourist]

A boot ready for it!

Cheers,
David

"it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal





On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 9:20 PM, Hugh Smitham  wrote:

> Michael,
>
> That's a good idea. Though Cyclotourist asked for the tire to boot it I
> imagine and city ride it? I was still considering what to do with the tire
> and I really like your idea. We'll see.
>
> ~Hugh
>
> "Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep
> moving." -- Albert Einstein
>
> http://velocipedemusings.blogspot.com/
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 4, 2014 at 6:44 AM, Michael  wrote:
>
>> Hugh,
>>>
>>
>> If you are going to throw away the blown tire, could you use a packing
>> knife and cut a section off of it and post a pic here of it so we can see
>> the casing/tread head on?
>> I am trying to understand what Hetres have - an actual casing that wraps
>> around the beads, or just threads embedded into sidewall rubber that wrap
>> around the bead.
>>
>> --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Michael,

That's a good idea. Though Cyclotourist asked for the tire to boot it I
imagine and city ride it? I was still considering what to do with the tire
and I really like your idea. We'll see.

~Hugh

"Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep
moving." -- Albert Einstein

http://velocipedemusings.blogspot.com/




On Sat, Jan 4, 2014 at 6:44 AM, Michael  wrote:

> Hugh,
>>
>
> If you are going to throw away the blown tire, could you use a packing
> knife and cut a section off of it and post a pic here of it so we can see
> the casing/tread head on?
> I am trying to understand what Hetres have - an actual casing that wraps
> around the beads, or just threads embedded into sidewall rubber that wrap
> around the bead.
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Eric Norris]

Do you think this would have worked?

http://www.parktool.com/product/emergency-tire-boot-tb-2 

I carry one, but I’ve never used it.

--Eric Norris
Email: campyonly...@me.com
Web: www.campyonly.com
Blog: http://campyonlyguy.blogspot.com
Twitter: @CampyOnlyGuy
Flickr: www.flickr.com/photos/campyonlyguy

On Jan 7, 2014, at 10:56 AM, Iron Rider <1000...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I had a sidewall blowout on my Grand Bois Lierres. I won't be buying those 
> again.
> 
> http://eprider.blogspot.com/2013/06/images-from-catskill-600k.html
> 
> 
> 
> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 12:15:56 AM UTC-5, Michael wrote:
> Or, the GB Lierre. That looks like it has a thicker tread on it than the 
> Hetre.
> 
> -- 
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Steve Palincsar]

On 01/07/2014 01:56 PM, Iron Rider wrote:




I had a sidewall blowout on my Grand Bois Lierres. I won't be buying 
those again.


http://eprider.blogspot.com/2013/06/images-from-catskill-600k.html



What do you think cut that sidewall?


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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Ha!
On Dec 3, 2013 9:46 PM, "cyclotourist"  wrote:

> December is just starting... I'd like me one of those SOMA Grand Randos!
>
> On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> > In the case of the Bike of the Month Club it's yes often.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > ~Hugh
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:41 PM, cyclotourist 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Occasionally...
> >>
> >> --
> >> Cheers,
> >> David
> >>
> >> "it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal
> >>
> >> --
> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
> >> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit
> >>
> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/f2LAG6k5qAo/unsubscribe
> >> .
> >> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to
> >> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> >> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com.
> >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
> >>
> >
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
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> >
>
>
> --
> Cheers,
> David
>
> "it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal
>
> --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[cyclotourist]

December is just starting... I'd like me one of those SOMA Grand Randos!

On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> In the case of the Bike of the Month Club it's yes often.
>
> Best,
>
> ~Hugh
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:41 PM, cyclotourist 
> wrote:
>
>> Occasionally...
>>
>> --
>> Cheers,
>> David
>>
>> "it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/f2LAG6k5qAo/unsubscribe
>> .
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>>
>
> --
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-- 
Cheers,
David

"it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

In the case of the Bike of the Month Club it's yes often.

Best,

~Hugh


On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:41 PM, cyclotourist  wrote:

> Occasionally...
>
> --
> Cheers,
> David
>
> "it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal
>
> --
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> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> .
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[cyclotourist]

Occasionally...

-- 
Cheers,
David

"it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Wait a gosh darn second...aren't they one in the same.

Best,

~Hugh


On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:37 PM, cyclotourist  wrote:

> Do as I say, not as I do...
>
> On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> > Right Mr. Bike of the Month club Rat-a-tat!
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > ~Hugh
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 8:52 PM, cyclotourist 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Well, I suppose...
> >>
> >> On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> >> > But there's nothing wrong with having another bike right.
> >> >
> >> > Best,
> >> >
> >> > ~Hugh
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 8:20 PM, cyclotourist 
> >> > wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> +1 on having a second wheelset. Much less expensive than having a
> >> >> second
> >> >> bike!
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> >> >> > Bill,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I can't for certain say what caused the slash in my tire, if I were
> >> >> > to
> >> >> > surmise I'd say it was a sharp rock which exposed the tube that
> >> >> > later
> >> >> blew
> >> >> > out when I rolled over something that wouldn't necessarily slash
> the
> >> >> > tire
> >> >> > but easily punctured the tube or the original slash also slashed
> the
> >> >> > tube
> >> >> > but not all the way through so as I rode it finally gave up the
> >> >> > ghost.
> >> >> The
> >> >> > latter I feel is the most likely.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > At this time I am aware that I'm not aware of a tire that is supple
> >> >> > fast
> >> >> > and puncture or slash resistant for all circumstances... there is
> >> >> > always
> >> >> a
> >> >> > compromise. I knew that running the Hetres I was gambling when I
> >> >> > rode
> >> >> > on
> >> >> > MTB trails my mistake. Use the correct tool for the job!
> >> >> >
> >> >> > So on my 650b Hilsen if I want to go off, off road I run the "Force
> >> >> > Field
> >> >> > Rumpkins" which I have taken on arguably tough roads & single track
> >> >> > meant
> >> >> > for MTB knobby tires and they have held up excellent. That Bill is
> >> some
> >> >> > peace of mind I just need to have another wheel set to swap rough
> >> stuff
> >> >> > tires with supple fast roady tires... ah here we go adding to the
> >> >> > already
> >> >> > long list.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I'm looking for a everyday tire that will roll with less resistance
> >> but
> >> >> > with better slash and puncture resistance than the Hetres and can
> >> >> > handle
> >> >> > the occasional light off-road foray. I'm looking at the Soma Xpress
> >> and
> >> >> the
> >> >> > Nifty Swifty but leaning toward the Soma's as he Grant seems to
> like
> >> >> them.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I heard my buddy Evan had a worn set of original Rumpkins and they
> >> tore
> >> >> on
> >> >> > the side wall. All things are transient.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Hugh "the search continues "Smitham
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Best,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > ~Hugh
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:15 AM, Bill Lindsay 
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> It's always a bummer when you cut an expensive tire, especially
> >> >> >> when
> >> >> it's
> >> >> >> fairly new.  Maybe I'm reckless, but I think of tire cuts as
> >> EXTREMELY
> >> >> >> rare
> >> >> >> events.  Moreover, the things that I've run over to badly cut a
> >> >> >> tire
> >> >> >> in
> >> >> >> my
> >> >> >> ~35 years of cycling usually would have cut ANY tire (once, a
> thick
> >> >> >> nail
> >> >> >> poked a hole in the RIM).
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> My thing is, if it's going to happen about once every 5 years or
> >> >> >> so,
> >> >> >> and
> >> >> >> if it's going to ruin any tire, then I might as well spend those 5
> >> >> >> years
> >> >> >> riding on nice-riding tires.  If you, Hugh, can somehow be sure
> >> >> >> that
> >> >> >> the
> >> >> >> thing that cut your Hetre is going to happen really often and if
> >> >> >> you
> >> >> >> can
> >> >> >> know that there is a tire that won't be cut by that same thing,
> >> >> >> then
> >> >> >> you
> >> >> >> can sensibly argue that there's a cost-benefit trade off that
> makes
> >> >> >> more
> >> >> >> sense.  I just don't see how you could know either of those
> things.
> >> >> >> If
> >> >> >> that's the case, you are investing in peace of mind, which is
> fine,
> >> of
> >> >> >> course.  Me, I'd continue to invest in ride quality.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Bill
> >> >> >>
> "who-runs-force-field-fatty-rumpkins-on-his-heaviest-stiffest-bike"
> >> >> >> Lindsay
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> On Wednesday, November 27, 2013 8:01:12 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>> I had a little experience around dusk. Read about it
> >> >> >>> here
> >> >> >>> .
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> ~Hugh
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>  --
> >> >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in
> >> the
> >> >> >> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> >> >> >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit
> >> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/f2LAG6k

Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[cyclotourist]

Do as I say, not as I do...

On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> Right Mr. Bike of the Month club Rat-a-tat!
>
> Best,
>
> ~Hugh
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 8:52 PM, cyclotourist 
> wrote:
>
>> Well, I suppose...
>>
>> On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
>> > But there's nothing wrong with having another bike right.
>> >
>> > Best,
>> >
>> > ~Hugh
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 8:20 PM, cyclotourist 
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >> +1 on having a second wheelset. Much less expensive than having a
>> >> second
>> >> bike!
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
>> >> > Bill,
>> >> >
>> >> > I can't for certain say what caused the slash in my tire, if I were
>> >> > to
>> >> > surmise I'd say it was a sharp rock which exposed the tube that
>> >> > later
>> >> blew
>> >> > out when I rolled over something that wouldn't necessarily slash the
>> >> > tire
>> >> > but easily punctured the tube or the original slash also slashed the
>> >> > tube
>> >> > but not all the way through so as I rode it finally gave up the
>> >> > ghost.
>> >> The
>> >> > latter I feel is the most likely.
>> >> >
>> >> > At this time I am aware that I'm not aware of a tire that is supple
>> >> > fast
>> >> > and puncture or slash resistant for all circumstances... there is
>> >> > always
>> >> a
>> >> > compromise. I knew that running the Hetres I was gambling when I
>> >> > rode
>> >> > on
>> >> > MTB trails my mistake. Use the correct tool for the job!
>> >> >
>> >> > So on my 650b Hilsen if I want to go off, off road I run the "Force
>> >> > Field
>> >> > Rumpkins" which I have taken on arguably tough roads & single track
>> >> > meant
>> >> > for MTB knobby tires and they have held up excellent. That Bill is
>> some
>> >> > peace of mind I just need to have another wheel set to swap rough
>> stuff
>> >> > tires with supple fast roady tires... ah here we go adding to the
>> >> > already
>> >> > long list.
>> >> >
>> >> > I'm looking for a everyday tire that will roll with less resistance
>> but
>> >> > with better slash and puncture resistance than the Hetres and can
>> >> > handle
>> >> > the occasional light off-road foray. I'm looking at the Soma Xpress
>> and
>> >> the
>> >> > Nifty Swifty but leaning toward the Soma's as he Grant seems to like
>> >> them.
>> >> >
>> >> > I heard my buddy Evan had a worn set of original Rumpkins and they
>> tore
>> >> on
>> >> > the side wall. All things are transient.
>> >> >
>> >> > Hugh "the search continues "Smitham
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Best,
>> >> >
>> >> > ~Hugh
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:15 AM, Bill Lindsay 
>> >> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> It's always a bummer when you cut an expensive tire, especially
>> >> >> when
>> >> it's
>> >> >> fairly new.  Maybe I'm reckless, but I think of tire cuts as
>> EXTREMELY
>> >> >> rare
>> >> >> events.  Moreover, the things that I've run over to badly cut a
>> >> >> tire
>> >> >> in
>> >> >> my
>> >> >> ~35 years of cycling usually would have cut ANY tire (once, a thick
>> >> >> nail
>> >> >> poked a hole in the RIM).
>> >> >>
>> >> >> My thing is, if it's going to happen about once every 5 years or
>> >> >> so,
>> >> >> and
>> >> >> if it's going to ruin any tire, then I might as well spend those 5
>> >> >> years
>> >> >> riding on nice-riding tires.  If you, Hugh, can somehow be sure
>> >> >> that
>> >> >> the
>> >> >> thing that cut your Hetre is going to happen really often and if
>> >> >> you
>> >> >> can
>> >> >> know that there is a tire that won't be cut by that same thing,
>> >> >> then
>> >> >> you
>> >> >> can sensibly argue that there's a cost-benefit trade off that makes
>> >> >> more
>> >> >> sense.  I just don't see how you could know either of those things.
>> >> >> If
>> >> >> that's the case, you are investing in peace of mind, which is fine,
>> of
>> >> >> course.  Me, I'd continue to invest in ride quality.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Bill
>> >> >> "who-runs-force-field-fatty-rumpkins-on-his-heaviest-stiffest-bike"
>> >> >> Lindsay
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Wednesday, November 27, 2013 8:01:12 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >>> I had a little experience around dusk. Read about it
>> >> >>> here
>> >> >>> .
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> ~Hugh
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>  --
>> >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in
>> the
>> >> >> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> >> >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/f2LAG6k5qAo/unsubscribe
>> >> >> .
>> >> >> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to
>> >> >> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> >> >> To post to this group, send email to
>> >> >> rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com.
>> >> >> Visit this group at
>> >> >> http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
>> >> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > --
>> >> > You

Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Right Mr. Bike of the Month club Rat-a-tat!

Best,

~Hugh


On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 8:52 PM, cyclotourist  wrote:

> Well, I suppose...
>
> On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> > But there's nothing wrong with having another bike right.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > ~Hugh
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 8:20 PM, cyclotourist 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> +1 on having a second wheelset. Much less expensive than having a second
> >> bike!
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> >> > Bill,
> >> >
> >> > I can't for certain say what caused the slash in my tire, if I were to
> >> > surmise I'd say it was a sharp rock which exposed the tube that later
> >> blew
> >> > out when I rolled over something that wouldn't necessarily slash the
> >> > tire
> >> > but easily punctured the tube or the original slash also slashed the
> >> > tube
> >> > but not all the way through so as I rode it finally gave up the ghost.
> >> The
> >> > latter I feel is the most likely.
> >> >
> >> > At this time I am aware that I'm not aware of a tire that is supple
> >> > fast
> >> > and puncture or slash resistant for all circumstances... there is
> >> > always
> >> a
> >> > compromise. I knew that running the Hetres I was gambling when I rode
> >> > on
> >> > MTB trails my mistake. Use the correct tool for the job!
> >> >
> >> > So on my 650b Hilsen if I want to go off, off road I run the "Force
> >> > Field
> >> > Rumpkins" which I have taken on arguably tough roads & single track
> >> > meant
> >> > for MTB knobby tires and they have held up excellent. That Bill is
> some
> >> > peace of mind I just need to have another wheel set to swap rough
> stuff
> >> > tires with supple fast roady tires... ah here we go adding to the
> >> > already
> >> > long list.
> >> >
> >> > I'm looking for a everyday tire that will roll with less resistance
> but
> >> > with better slash and puncture resistance than the Hetres and can
> >> > handle
> >> > the occasional light off-road foray. I'm looking at the Soma Xpress
> and
> >> the
> >> > Nifty Swifty but leaning toward the Soma's as he Grant seems to like
> >> them.
> >> >
> >> > I heard my buddy Evan had a worn set of original Rumpkins and they
> tore
> >> on
> >> > the side wall. All things are transient.
> >> >
> >> > Hugh "the search continues "Smitham
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Best,
> >> >
> >> > ~Hugh
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:15 AM, Bill Lindsay 
> >> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> It's always a bummer when you cut an expensive tire, especially when
> >> it's
> >> >> fairly new.  Maybe I'm reckless, but I think of tire cuts as
> EXTREMELY
> >> >> rare
> >> >> events.  Moreover, the things that I've run over to badly cut a tire
> >> >> in
> >> >> my
> >> >> ~35 years of cycling usually would have cut ANY tire (once, a thick
> >> >> nail
> >> >> poked a hole in the RIM).
> >> >>
> >> >> My thing is, if it's going to happen about once every 5 years or so,
> >> >> and
> >> >> if it's going to ruin any tire, then I might as well spend those 5
> >> >> years
> >> >> riding on nice-riding tires.  If you, Hugh, can somehow be sure that
> >> >> the
> >> >> thing that cut your Hetre is going to happen really often and if you
> >> >> can
> >> >> know that there is a tire that won't be cut by that same thing, then
> >> >> you
> >> >> can sensibly argue that there's a cost-benefit trade off that makes
> >> >> more
> >> >> sense.  I just don't see how you could know either of those things.
> >> >> If
> >> >> that's the case, you are investing in peace of mind, which is fine,
> of
> >> >> course.  Me, I'd continue to invest in ride quality.
> >> >>
> >> >> Bill
> >> >> "who-runs-force-field-fatty-rumpkins-on-his-heaviest-stiffest-bike"
> >> >> Lindsay
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> On Wednesday, November 27, 2013 8:01:12 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>> I had a little experience around dusk. Read about it
> >> >>> here
> >> >>> .
> >> >>>
> >> >>> ~Hugh
> >> >>>
> >> >>  --
> >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in
> the
> >> >> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> >> >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit
> >> >>
> >>
> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/f2LAG6k5qAo/unsubscribe
> >> >> .
> >> >> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to
> >> >> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> >> >> To post to this group, send email to
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> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > --
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> rbw-owners-b

Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[cyclotourist]

Well, I suppose...

On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> But there's nothing wrong with having another bike right.
>
> Best,
>
> ~Hugh
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 8:20 PM, cyclotourist 
> wrote:
>
>> +1 on having a second wheelset. Much less expensive than having a second
>> bike!
>>
>>
>>
>> On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
>> > Bill,
>> >
>> > I can't for certain say what caused the slash in my tire, if I were to
>> > surmise I'd say it was a sharp rock which exposed the tube that later
>> blew
>> > out when I rolled over something that wouldn't necessarily slash the
>> > tire
>> > but easily punctured the tube or the original slash also slashed the
>> > tube
>> > but not all the way through so as I rode it finally gave up the ghost.
>> The
>> > latter I feel is the most likely.
>> >
>> > At this time I am aware that I'm not aware of a tire that is supple
>> > fast
>> > and puncture or slash resistant for all circumstances... there is
>> > always
>> a
>> > compromise. I knew that running the Hetres I was gambling when I rode
>> > on
>> > MTB trails my mistake. Use the correct tool for the job!
>> >
>> > So on my 650b Hilsen if I want to go off, off road I run the "Force
>> > Field
>> > Rumpkins" which I have taken on arguably tough roads & single track
>> > meant
>> > for MTB knobby tires and they have held up excellent. That Bill is some
>> > peace of mind I just need to have another wheel set to swap rough stuff
>> > tires with supple fast roady tires... ah here we go adding to the
>> > already
>> > long list.
>> >
>> > I'm looking for a everyday tire that will roll with less resistance but
>> > with better slash and puncture resistance than the Hetres and can
>> > handle
>> > the occasional light off-road foray. I'm looking at the Soma Xpress and
>> the
>> > Nifty Swifty but leaning toward the Soma's as he Grant seems to like
>> them.
>> >
>> > I heard my buddy Evan had a worn set of original Rumpkins and they tore
>> on
>> > the side wall. All things are transient.
>> >
>> > Hugh "the search continues "Smitham
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Best,
>> >
>> > ~Hugh
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:15 AM, Bill Lindsay 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> It's always a bummer when you cut an expensive tire, especially when
>> it's
>> >> fairly new.  Maybe I'm reckless, but I think of tire cuts as EXTREMELY
>> >> rare
>> >> events.  Moreover, the things that I've run over to badly cut a tire
>> >> in
>> >> my
>> >> ~35 years of cycling usually would have cut ANY tire (once, a thick
>> >> nail
>> >> poked a hole in the RIM).
>> >>
>> >> My thing is, if it's going to happen about once every 5 years or so,
>> >> and
>> >> if it's going to ruin any tire, then I might as well spend those 5
>> >> years
>> >> riding on nice-riding tires.  If you, Hugh, can somehow be sure that
>> >> the
>> >> thing that cut your Hetre is going to happen really often and if you
>> >> can
>> >> know that there is a tire that won't be cut by that same thing, then
>> >> you
>> >> can sensibly argue that there's a cost-benefit trade off that makes
>> >> more
>> >> sense.  I just don't see how you could know either of those things.
>> >> If
>> >> that's the case, you are investing in peace of mind, which is fine, of
>> >> course.  Me, I'd continue to invest in ride quality.
>> >>
>> >> Bill
>> >> "who-runs-force-field-fatty-rumpkins-on-his-heaviest-stiffest-bike"
>> >> Lindsay
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Wednesday, November 27, 2013 8:01:12 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> I had a little experience around dusk. Read about it
>> >>> here
>> >>> .
>> >>>
>> >>> ~Hugh
>> >>>
>> >>  --
>> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
>> >> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit
>> >>
>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/f2LAG6k5qAo/unsubscribe
>> >> .
>> >> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to
>> >> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> >> To post to this group, send email to
>> >> rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com.
>> >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
>> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>> >>
>> >
>> > --
>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> > Groups
>> > "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>> > an
>> > email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com.
>> > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
>> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cheers,
>> David
>>
>> "it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe 

Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

But there's nothing wrong with having another bike right.

Best,

~Hugh


On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 8:20 PM, cyclotourist  wrote:

> +1 on having a second wheelset. Much less expensive than having a second
> bike!
>
>
>
> On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> > Bill,
> >
> > I can't for certain say what caused the slash in my tire, if I were to
> > surmise I'd say it was a sharp rock which exposed the tube that later
> blew
> > out when I rolled over something that wouldn't necessarily slash the tire
> > but easily punctured the tube or the original slash also slashed the tube
> > but not all the way through so as I rode it finally gave up the ghost.
> The
> > latter I feel is the most likely.
> >
> > At this time I am aware that I'm not aware of a tire that is supple fast
> > and puncture or slash resistant for all circumstances... there is always
> a
> > compromise. I knew that running the Hetres I was gambling when I rode on
> > MTB trails my mistake. Use the correct tool for the job!
> >
> > So on my 650b Hilsen if I want to go off, off road I run the "Force Field
> > Rumpkins" which I have taken on arguably tough roads & single track meant
> > for MTB knobby tires and they have held up excellent. That Bill is some
> > peace of mind I just need to have another wheel set to swap rough stuff
> > tires with supple fast roady tires... ah here we go adding to the already
> > long list.
> >
> > I'm looking for a everyday tire that will roll with less resistance but
> > with better slash and puncture resistance than the Hetres and can handle
> > the occasional light off-road foray. I'm looking at the Soma Xpress and
> the
> > Nifty Swifty but leaning toward the Soma's as he Grant seems to like
> them.
> >
> > I heard my buddy Evan had a worn set of original Rumpkins and they tore
> on
> > the side wall. All things are transient.
> >
> > Hugh "the search continues "Smitham
> >
> >
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > ~Hugh
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:15 AM, Bill Lindsay 
> wrote:
> >
> >> It's always a bummer when you cut an expensive tire, especially when
> it's
> >> fairly new.  Maybe I'm reckless, but I think of tire cuts as EXTREMELY
> >> rare
> >> events.  Moreover, the things that I've run over to badly cut a tire in
> >> my
> >> ~35 years of cycling usually would have cut ANY tire (once, a thick nail
> >> poked a hole in the RIM).
> >>
> >> My thing is, if it's going to happen about once every 5 years or so, and
> >> if it's going to ruin any tire, then I might as well spend those 5 years
> >> riding on nice-riding tires.  If you, Hugh, can somehow be sure that the
> >> thing that cut your Hetre is going to happen really often and if you can
> >> know that there is a tire that won't be cut by that same thing, then you
> >> can sensibly argue that there's a cost-benefit trade off that makes more
> >> sense.  I just don't see how you could know either of those things.  If
> >> that's the case, you are investing in peace of mind, which is fine, of
> >> course.  Me, I'd continue to invest in ride quality.
> >>
> >> Bill "who-runs-force-field-fatty-rumpkins-on-his-heaviest-stiffest-bike"
> >> Lindsay
> >>
> >>
> >> On Wednesday, November 27, 2013 8:01:12 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
> >>
> >>> I had a little experience around dusk. Read about it
> >>> here
> >>> .
> >>>
> >>> ~Hugh
> >>>
> >>  --
> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
> >> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit
> >>
> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/f2LAG6k5qAo/unsubscribe
> >> .
> >> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to
> >> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> >> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com.
> >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
> >>
> >
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> > email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com.
> > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
> >
>
>
> --
> Cheers,
> David
>
> "it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> Visit th

Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[cyclotourist]

+1 on having a second wheelset. Much less expensive than having a second bike!



On 12/3/13, Hugh Smitham  wrote:
> Bill,
>
> I can't for certain say what caused the slash in my tire, if I were to
> surmise I'd say it was a sharp rock which exposed the tube that later blew
> out when I rolled over something that wouldn't necessarily slash the tire
> but easily punctured the tube or the original slash also slashed the tube
> but not all the way through so as I rode it finally gave up the ghost. The
> latter I feel is the most likely.
>
> At this time I am aware that I'm not aware of a tire that is supple fast
> and puncture or slash resistant for all circumstances... there is always a
> compromise. I knew that running the Hetres I was gambling when I rode on
> MTB trails my mistake. Use the correct tool for the job!
>
> So on my 650b Hilsen if I want to go off, off road I run the "Force Field
> Rumpkins" which I have taken on arguably tough roads & single track meant
> for MTB knobby tires and they have held up excellent. That Bill is some
> peace of mind I just need to have another wheel set to swap rough stuff
> tires with supple fast roady tires... ah here we go adding to the already
> long list.
>
> I'm looking for a everyday tire that will roll with less resistance but
> with better slash and puncture resistance than the Hetres and can handle
> the occasional light off-road foray. I'm looking at the Soma Xpress and the
> Nifty Swifty but leaning toward the Soma's as he Grant seems to like them.
>
> I heard my buddy Evan had a worn set of original Rumpkins and they tore on
> the side wall. All things are transient.
>
> Hugh "the search continues "Smitham
>
>
>
> Best,
>
> ~Hugh
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:15 AM, Bill Lindsay  wrote:
>
>> It's always a bummer when you cut an expensive tire, especially when it's
>> fairly new.  Maybe I'm reckless, but I think of tire cuts as EXTREMELY
>> rare
>> events.  Moreover, the things that I've run over to badly cut a tire in
>> my
>> ~35 years of cycling usually would have cut ANY tire (once, a thick nail
>> poked a hole in the RIM).
>>
>> My thing is, if it's going to happen about once every 5 years or so, and
>> if it's going to ruin any tire, then I might as well spend those 5 years
>> riding on nice-riding tires.  If you, Hugh, can somehow be sure that the
>> thing that cut your Hetre is going to happen really often and if you can
>> know that there is a tire that won't be cut by that same thing, then you
>> can sensibly argue that there's a cost-benefit trade off that makes more
>> sense.  I just don't see how you could know either of those things.  If
>> that's the case, you are investing in peace of mind, which is fine, of
>> course.  Me, I'd continue to invest in ride quality.
>>
>> Bill "who-runs-force-field-fatty-rumpkins-on-his-heaviest-stiffest-bike"
>> Lindsay
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 27, 2013 8:01:12 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
>>
>>> I had a little experience around dusk. Read about it
>>> here
>>> .
>>>
>>> ~Hugh
>>>
>>  --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/f2LAG6k5qAo/unsubscribe
>> .
>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to
>> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>>
>
> --
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> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>


-- 
Cheers,
David

"it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Great field repair! I gotta remember that for the future.

Best,

~Hugh


On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 6:06 PM, Iron Rider <1000...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I had major sidewall blowout with the GB lierre:
> http://eprider.blogspot.com/2013/06/images-from-catskill-600k.html  I
> won't be buying that tire again.
>
>
>  --
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> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> .
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Bill,

I can't for certain say what caused the slash in my tire, if I were to
surmise I'd say it was a sharp rock which exposed the tube that later blew
out when I rolled over something that wouldn't necessarily slash the tire
but easily punctured the tube or the original slash also slashed the tube
but not all the way through so as I rode it finally gave up the ghost. The
latter I feel is the most likely.

At this time I am aware that I'm not aware of a tire that is supple fast
and puncture or slash resistant for all circumstances... there is always a
compromise. I knew that running the Hetres I was gambling when I rode on
MTB trails my mistake. Use the correct tool for the job!

So on my 650b Hilsen if I want to go off, off road I run the "Force Field
Rumpkins" which I have taken on arguably tough roads & single track meant
for MTB knobby tires and they have held up excellent. That Bill is some
peace of mind I just need to have another wheel set to swap rough stuff
tires with supple fast roady tires... ah here we go adding to the already
long list.

I'm looking for a everyday tire that will roll with less resistance but
with better slash and puncture resistance than the Hetres and can handle
the occasional light off-road foray. I'm looking at the Soma Xpress and the
Nifty Swifty but leaning toward the Soma's as he Grant seems to like them.

I heard my buddy Evan had a worn set of original Rumpkins and they tore on
the side wall. All things are transient.

Hugh "the search continues "Smitham



Best,

~Hugh


On Tue, Dec 3, 2013 at 9:15 AM, Bill Lindsay  wrote:

> It's always a bummer when you cut an expensive tire, especially when it's
> fairly new.  Maybe I'm reckless, but I think of tire cuts as EXTREMELY rare
> events.  Moreover, the things that I've run over to badly cut a tire in my
> ~35 years of cycling usually would have cut ANY tire (once, a thick nail
> poked a hole in the RIM).
>
> My thing is, if it's going to happen about once every 5 years or so, and
> if it's going to ruin any tire, then I might as well spend those 5 years
> riding on nice-riding tires.  If you, Hugh, can somehow be sure that the
> thing that cut your Hetre is going to happen really often and if you can
> know that there is a tire that won't be cut by that same thing, then you
> can sensibly argue that there's a cost-benefit trade off that makes more
> sense.  I just don't see how you could know either of those things.  If
> that's the case, you are investing in peace of mind, which is fine, of
> course.  Me, I'd continue to invest in ride quality.
>
> Bill "who-runs-force-field-fatty-rumpkins-on-his-heaviest-stiffest-bike"
> Lindsay
>
>
> On Wednesday, November 27, 2013 8:01:12 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
>
>> I had a little experience around dusk. Read about it 
>> here
>> .
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>  --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/f2LAG6k5qAo/unsubscribe
> .
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Jim Bronson]

11 miles to Suffern'

LOL.  Great picture.


On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 8:06 PM, Iron Rider <1000...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I had major sidewall blowout with the GB lierre:
> http://eprider.blogspot.com/2013/06/images-from-catskill-600k.html  I
> won't be buying that tire again.
>
>
>  --
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> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>



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Keep the metal side up and the rubber side down!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Jim Bronson]

Yes, they do make Nifty Swifties in 650b, I have a set on my bike now...

http://www.ebikestop.com/panaracer_nifty_swifty_650b_x_328mm_blacktan_steel-TR2322.php


On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 2:00 AM, Hugh Smitham  wrote:

> Bruce do they make Nifty-Swifties in 650b? I don't think so.
>
> Best,
>
> ~Hugh
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 2:49 AM, Bruce Herbitter <
> bruce.herbit...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> RBW Nifty-Swifties are reliable, if not quite "light."
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 27, 2013 at 11:12 PM, Michael  wrote:
>>
>>> Glad you are not hurt (your are ok?).

>>>
>>> I have Hetres on my Bleriot but haven't really done any commuting on
>>> them. I was gonna put them on my Sam (full time bike now).
>>> But I mentally just can't get past having only rubber and a liner
>>> between the tube and the road.
>>> And I definitely would not want to be fixing a flat in the 35 degree
>>> temps we have in MD now.
>>> So maybe I will try them next spring and see how they do.
>>> Though I have heard Jan say that his Hetres do really well commuting. I
>>> am sure others have a good track record with theirs, too.
>>>
>>> I am still looking out for some lightweight, fast, puncture protected,
>>> 650b tires.
>>> For now I am enjoying my stock build Marathons on my Sam.
>>> They don't feel any slower on the Sam than when I had Rumpkins and
>>> Swiftys on the Bleriot.
>>>
>>> Seen any reviews on the new puncture protected Rumpkins? Maybe they
>>> would do better for you.
>>>
>>> --
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>>
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Keep the metal side up and the rubber side down!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Toshi Takeuchi]

I commute on Soma Xpress 650b tires.  They have a puncture resistant
belt that makes them tougher, but I like the ride on them.  They are
not Pari Moto tires, but much more durable!

Toshi


On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 6:18 PM, Andy Smitty Schmidt <54ca...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Nice blog… bummer about the tires. Good luck in the search.--Smitty
>
>
> On Wednesday, November 27, 2013 8:01:12 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
>>
>> I had a little experience around dusk. Read about it here.
>>
>> ~Hugh
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Jim]

Those rules are great. I will have to keep a copy in my hat until I have 
them memorized.   Jim D.   Massachusetts

On Friday, November 29, 2013 7:52:03 PM UTC-5, Mike wrote:
>
> Did someone say rules?
>  
> http://www.velominati.com/the-rules/
>  
> --mike
>
> On Friday, November 29, 2013 4:33:17 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
>
>> Exactly;-)
>>
>>  Best,
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:
>>
>>> Rules? 
>>>
>>> With abandon,
>>> Patrick 
>>>
>>>
>>> On Friday, November 29, 2013 5:09:57 PM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>>>
  Deacon of the Hinterlands...I love quiche and haven't run flat 
 prevention yet but were in a new millennium so all those old rules just 
 don't apply. 

 Grin.

  Best,

 ~Hugh
  

 On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:

> You realize, of course, Hugh, that real men don't eat quiche or run 
> tires with flat prevention. Since I love the Duremes, you know what that 
> makes me. Grin. 
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick 
>
>
> On Friday, November 29, 2013 10:39:18 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>
>>  Chris, for your purpose I think they're fine. For me I think 
>> they're a bit limited as I like the freedom of running off road on a 
>> whim. 
>> But glad they work for you.
>>
>>  Best,
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>>
>>  On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Chris Cullum 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>  I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB 
>>> tires are just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for 
>>> example. I have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on a 
>>> set 
>>> on all manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats too. 
>>> This 
>>> is definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed 
>>> terrain however.
>>>
>>> Chris Cullum
>>> Vancouver, BC 
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman wrote: 

 my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and 
 The Katy Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in 
 over 
 500 milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider 

 mike goldman 
 warwick,r.i. 
  
 Do THIS before eating carbs (every time) 
 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease 
 fat storage 
 http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772
 best01duc 

>>>   -- 
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>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

You know it.

Best,

~Hugh


On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 5:38 PM, David Yu Greenblatt <
david.yu.greenbl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> RBW Outlaw Bicycle Club One-Percenter For Life!
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 4:56 PM, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>
>> No way dude. I'm a frigging outlaw!
>> On Nov 29, 2013 4:52 PM, "Mike"  wrote:
>>
>>>  Did someone say rules?
>>>
>>> http://www.velominati.com/the-rules/
>>>
>>> --mike
>>>
>>> On Friday, November 29, 2013 4:33:17 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
>>>
 Exactly;-)

  Best,

 ~Hugh


 On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:

> Rules?
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
>
> On Friday, November 29, 2013 5:09:57 PM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>
>>  Deacon of the Hinterlands...I love quiche and haven't run flat
>> prevention yet but were in a new millennium so all those old rules just
>> don't apply.
>>
>> Grin.
>>
>>  Best,
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>>
>>> You realize, of course, Hugh, that real men don't eat quiche or run
>>> tires with flat prevention. Since I love the Duremes, you know what that
>>> makes me. Grin.
>>>
>>> With abandon,
>>> Patrick
>>>
>>>
>>> On Friday, November 29, 2013 10:39:18 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>>>
  Chris, for your purpose I think they're fine. For me I think
 they're a bit limited as I like the freedom of running off road on a 
 whim.
 But glad they work for you.

  Best,

 ~Hugh


  On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Chris Cullum >>> > wrote:

>  I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB
> tires are just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for
> example. I have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on 
> a set
> on all manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats 
> too. This
> is definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed
> terrain however.
>
> Chris Cullum
> Vancouver, BC
>
>
> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman
> wrote:
>>
>> my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and
>> The Katy Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in 
>> over
>> 500 milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider
>>
>> mike goldman
>> warwick,r.i.
>> 
>> Do THIS before eating carbs (every time)
>> 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease
>> fat storage
>> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772
>> best01duc
>>
>   --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[David Yu Greenblatt]

RBW Outlaw Bicycle Club One-Percenter For Life!


On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 4:56 PM, Hugh Smitham  wrote:

> No way dude. I'm a frigging outlaw!
> On Nov 29, 2013 4:52 PM, "Mike"  wrote:
>
>> Did someone say rules?
>>
>> http://www.velominati.com/the-rules/
>>
>> --mike
>>
>> On Friday, November 29, 2013 4:33:17 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
>>
>>> Exactly;-)
>>>
>>>  Best,
>>>
>>> ~Hugh
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>>>
 Rules?

 With abandon,
 Patrick


 On Friday, November 29, 2013 5:09:57 PM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:

>  Deacon of the Hinterlands...I love quiche and haven't run flat
> prevention yet but were in a new millennium so all those old rules just
> don't apply.
>
> Grin.
>
>  Best,
>
> ~Hugh
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>
>> You realize, of course, Hugh, that real men don't eat quiche or run
>> tires with flat prevention. Since I love the Duremes, you know what that
>> makes me. Grin.
>>
>> With abandon,
>> Patrick
>>
>>
>> On Friday, November 29, 2013 10:39:18 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>>
>>>  Chris, for your purpose I think they're fine. For me I think
>>> they're a bit limited as I like the freedom of running off road on a 
>>> whim.
>>> But glad they work for you.
>>>
>>>  Best,
>>>
>>> ~Hugh
>>>
>>>
>>>  On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Chris Cullum 
>>> wrote:
>>>
  I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB
 tires are just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for
 example. I have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on a 
 set
 on all manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats too. 
 This
 is definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed
 terrain however.

 Chris Cullum
 Vancouver, BC


 On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman
 wrote:
>
> my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and
> The Katy Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in 
> over
> 500 milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider
>
> mike goldman
> warwick,r.i.
> 
> Do THIS before eating carbs (every time)
> 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease
> fat storage
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772
> best01duc
>
   --
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>>>
>>>  --
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>>
>
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>>>
>>>  --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

No way dude. I'm a frigging outlaw!
On Nov 29, 2013 4:52 PM, "Mike"  wrote:

> Did someone say rules?
>
> http://www.velominati.com/the-rules/
>
> --mike
>
> On Friday, November 29, 2013 4:33:17 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:
>
>> Exactly;-)
>>
>>  Best,
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:
>>
>>> Rules?
>>>
>>> With abandon,
>>> Patrick
>>>
>>>
>>> On Friday, November 29, 2013 5:09:57 PM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>>>
  Deacon of the Hinterlands...I love quiche and haven't run flat
 prevention yet but were in a new millennium so all those old rules just
 don't apply.

 Grin.

  Best,

 ~Hugh


 On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:

> You realize, of course, Hugh, that real men don't eat quiche or run
> tires with flat prevention. Since I love the Duremes, you know what that
> makes me. Grin.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
>
> On Friday, November 29, 2013 10:39:18 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>
>>  Chris, for your purpose I think they're fine. For me I think
>> they're a bit limited as I like the freedom of running off road on a 
>> whim.
>> But glad they work for you.
>>
>>  Best,
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>>
>>  On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Chris Cullum 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>  I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB
>>> tires are just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for
>>> example. I have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on a 
>>> set
>>> on all manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats too. 
>>> This
>>> is definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed
>>> terrain however.
>>>
>>> Chris Cullum
>>> Vancouver, BC
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman wrote:

 my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and
 The Katy Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in 
 over
 500 milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider

 mike goldman
 warwick,r.i.
 
 Do THIS before eating carbs (every time)
 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease
 fat storage
 http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772
 best01duc

>>>   --
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>>
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>>
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You received this

Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Mike]

Did someone say rules?
 
http://www.velominati.com/the-rules/
 
--mike

On Friday, November 29, 2013 4:33:17 PM UTC-8, hsmitham wrote:

> Exactly;-)
>
>  Best,
>
> ~Hugh
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Deacon Patrick 
> > wrote:
>
>> Rules? 
>>
>> With abandon,
>> Patrick 
>>
>>
>> On Friday, November 29, 2013 5:09:57 PM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>>
>>>  Deacon of the Hinterlands...I love quiche and haven't run flat 
>>> prevention yet but were in a new millennium so all those old rules just 
>>> don't apply. 
>>>
>>> Grin.
>>>
>>>  Best,
>>>
>>> ~Hugh
>>>  
>>>
>>> On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>>>
 You realize, of course, Hugh, that real men don't eat quiche or run 
 tires with flat prevention. Since I love the Duremes, you know what that 
 makes me. Grin. 

 With abandon,
 Patrick 


 On Friday, November 29, 2013 10:39:18 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:

>  Chris, for your purpose I think they're fine. For me I think they're 
> a bit limited as I like the freedom of running off road on a whim. But 
> glad 
> they work for you.
>
>  Best,
>
> ~Hugh
>
>
>  On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Chris Cullum wrote:
>
>>  I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB 
>> tires are just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for 
>> example. I have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on a 
>> set 
>> on all manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats too. 
>> This 
>> is definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed 
>> terrain however.
>>
>> Chris Cullum
>> Vancouver, BC 
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman wrote: 
>>>
>>> my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and The 
>>> Katy Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in over 
>>> 500 
>>> milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider 
>>>
>>> mike goldman 
>>> warwick,r.i. 
>>>  
>>> Do THIS before eating carbs (every time) 
>>> 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease fat 
>>> storage 
>>> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772
>>> best01duc 
>>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Exactly;-)

Best,

~Hugh


On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:

> Rules?
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
>
> On Friday, November 29, 2013 5:09:57 PM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>
>> Deacon of the Hinterlands...I love quiche and haven't run flat prevention
>> yet but were in a new millennium so all those old rules just don't apply.
>>
>> Grin.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>>
>>> You realize, of course, Hugh, that real men don't eat quiche or run
>>> tires with flat prevention. Since I love the Duremes, you know what that
>>> makes me. Grin.
>>>
>>> With abandon,
>>> Patrick
>>>
>>>
>>> On Friday, November 29, 2013 10:39:18 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>>>
 Chris, for your purpose I think they're fine. For me I think they're a
 bit limited as I like the freedom of running off road on a whim. But glad
 they work for you.

 Best,

 ~Hugh


 On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Chris Cullum wrote:

>  I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB tires
> are just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for example. 
> I
> have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on a set on all
> manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats too. This is
> definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed terrain
> however.
>
> Chris Cullum
> Vancouver, BC
>
>
> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman wrote:
>>
>> my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and The
>> Katy Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in over 500
>> milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider
>>
>> mike goldman
>> warwick,r.i.
>> 
>> Do THIS before eating carbs (every time)
>> 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease fat
>> storage
>> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772best01duc
>>
>  --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Deacon Patrick]

Rules?

With abandon,
Patrick

On Friday, November 29, 2013 5:09:57 PM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>
> Deacon of the Hinterlands...I love quiche and haven't run flat prevention 
> yet but were in a new millennium so all those old rules just don't apply.
>
> Grin.
>
> Best,
>
> ~Hugh
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Deacon Patrick 
> 
> > wrote:
>
>> You realize, of course, Hugh, that real men don't eat quiche or run tires 
>> with flat prevention. Since I love the Duremes, you know what that makes 
>> me. Grin.
>>
>> With abandon,
>> Patrick
>>
>>
>> On Friday, November 29, 2013 10:39:18 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>>
>>> Chris, for your purpose I think they're fine. For me I think they're a 
>>> bit limited as I like the freedom of running off road on a whim. But glad 
>>> they work for you.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> ~Hugh
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Chris Cullum wrote:
>>>
  I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB tires 
 are just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for example. 
 I 
 have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on a set on all 
 manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats too. This is 
 definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed terrain 
 however.

 Chris Cullum
 Vancouver, BC


 On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman wrote:
>
> my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and The 
> Katy Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in over 500 
> milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider 
>
> mike goldman 
> warwick,r.i. 
>  
> Do THIS before eating carbs (every time) 
> 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease fat 
> storage 
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772best01duc 
>
  -- 
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>>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Deacon of the Hinterlands...I love quiche and haven't run flat prevention
yet but were in a new millennium so all those old rules just don't apply.

Grin.

Best,

~Hugh


On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:

> You realize, of course, Hugh, that real men don't eat quiche or run tires
> with flat prevention. Since I love the Duremes, you know what that makes
> me. Grin.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
>
> On Friday, November 29, 2013 10:39:18 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>
>> Chris, for your purpose I think they're fine. For me I think they're a
>> bit limited as I like the freedom of running off road on a whim. But glad
>> they work for you.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Chris Cullum wrote:
>>
>>> I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB tires are
>>> just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for example. I
>>> have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on a set on all
>>> manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats too. This is
>>> definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed terrain
>>> however.
>>>
>>> Chris Cullum
>>> Vancouver, BC
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman wrote:

 my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and The
 Katy Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in over 500
 milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider

 mike goldman
 warwick,r.i.
 
 Do THIS before eating carbs (every time)
 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease fat
 storage
 http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772best01duc

>>>  --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Deacon Patrick]

You realize, of course, Hugh, that real men don't eat quiche or run tires 
with flat prevention. Since I love the Duremes, you know what that makes 
me. Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Friday, November 29, 2013 10:39:18 AM UTC-7, hsmitham wrote:
>
> Chris, for your purpose I think they're fine. For me I think they're a bit 
> limited as I like the freedom of running off road on a whim. But glad they 
> work for you.
>
> Best,
>
> ~Hugh
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Chris Cullum 
> 
> > wrote:
>
>> I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB tires are 
>> just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for example. I 
>> have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on a set on all 
>> manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats too. This is 
>> definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed terrain 
>> however.
>>
>> Chris Cullum
>> Vancouver, BC
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman wrote:
>>>
>>> my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and The 
>>> Katy Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in over 500 
>>> milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider 
>>>
>>> mike goldman 
>>> warwick,r.i. 
>>>  
>>> Do THIS before eating carbs (every time) 
>>> 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease fat 
>>> storage 
>>> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772best01duc 
>>>
>>  -- 
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>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Leslie]

Hugh, the Nifty Swifty is a 650b tire...
http://www.rivbike.com/product-p/t102-10082.htm

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Chris, for your purpose I think they're fine. For me I think they're a bit
limited as I like the freedom of running off road on a whim. But glad they
work for you.

Best,

~Hugh


On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Chris Cullum wrote:

> I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB tires are
> just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for example. I
> have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on a set on all
> manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats too. This is
> definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed terrain
> however.
>
> Chris Cullum
> Vancouver, BC
>
>
> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman wrote:
>>
>> my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and The Katy
>> Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in over 500
>> milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider
>>
>> mike goldman
>> warwick,r.i.
>> 
>> Do THIS before eating carbs (every time)
>> 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease fat
>> storage
>> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772best01duc
>>
>  --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Chris Cullum]

I think it really depends on the terrain. Jan mentions that GB tires are 
just not appropriate for jagged rocky terrain like shale for example. I 
have been really happy with mine. I'm at over 10,000km on a set on all 
manner of rough terrain, wet commuting etc. Very few flats too. This is 
definitely a YMMV. I am a bit leery of the GB EL version for mixed terrain 
however.

Chris Cullum
Vancouver, BC

On Thursday, November 28, 2013 4:02:59 AM UTC-8, mike goldman wrote:
>
> my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and The Katy 
> Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in over 500 
> milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider 
>
> mike goldman 
> warwick,r.i. 
>  
> Do THIS before eating carbs (every time) 
> 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease fat 
> storage 
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772best01duc 
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Can someone tell me if the Lierre have a beefier casing than the Hetres?
Maybe shoot a pic?

Chris H. I don't think the Soma's are going to anymore slash resistant than
the Hetres. I plan on looking at some more Schwalbe tires perhaps the Marathon
Pluses?

 Tires are the Holy Grail in the bike community.

Best,

~Hugh


On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 7:52 AM, Matthew J  wrote:

> I've had and liked Kojaks.  The ride does not compare to Grand Bois Extra
> Legers or Challenge Paris-Roubaix.
>
>
> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 9:05:36 AM UTC-6, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> Generally but not always true. Schwalbe models somehow are comfortable
>> while being sturdy; I am thinking of the Big Apple (60 mm) and the Kojak
>> (~35 mm). Perhaps they design even belted tires with supple sidewalls.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 7:49 AM, Matthew J  wrote:
>>
>>> The sturdier tires get, the less comfortable they are.  Quite the
>>> dilemma, and one to which there is yet any easy solution.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>> *RESUMES THAT GET YOU NOTICED!*
>> Certified Resume Writer
>> http://resumespecialties.com/index.html
>> patric...@resumespecialties.com
>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
>>
>> Albuquerque, NM
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Patrick I have a set of BA's ready to go for the Atlantis can't wait to
give em a go...heard lots of good things about them. Also going to
experiment with the Stan's though that won't help with slashes.

Best,

~Hugh


On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 7:05 AM, Patrick Moore  wrote:

> Generally but not always true. Schwalbe models somehow are comfortable
> while being sturdy; I am thinking of the Big Apple (60 mm) and the Kojak
> (~35 mm). Perhaps they design even belted tires with supple sidewalls.
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 7:49 AM, Matthew J  wrote:
>
>> The sturdier tires get, the less comfortable they are.  Quite the
>> dilemma, and one to which there is yet any easy solution.
>>
>>
>> --
> *RESUMES THAT GET YOU NOTICED!*
> Certified Resume Writer
> http://resumespecialties.com/index.html
> patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
>
> Albuquerque, NM
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Mike I think gravel is different then sharp granitic rocks, I toured on
them with the same weight down the California coast no problem. Have your
friend come out here and run them on some of our trails no extra weight
needed. YMMV.

Best,

~Hugh


On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 4:02 AM, mikel66...@juno.com wrote:

> my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and The Katy
> Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in over 500
> milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider
>
> mike goldman
> warwick,r.i.
> 
> Do THIS before eating carbs (every time)
> 1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease fat
> storage
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772best01duc
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Bruce do they make Nifty-Swifties in 650b? I don't think so.

Best,

~Hugh


On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 2:49 AM, Bruce Herbitter
wrote:

> RBW Nifty-Swifties are reliable, if not quite "light."
>
>
> On Wed, Nov 27, 2013 at 11:12 PM, Michael  wrote:
>
>> Glad you are not hurt (your are ok?).
>>>
>>
>> I have Hetres on my Bleriot but haven't really done any commuting on
>> them. I was gonna put them on my Sam (full time bike now).
>> But I mentally just can't get past having only rubber and a liner between
>> the tube and the road.
>> And I definitely would not want to be fixing a flat in the 35 degree
>> temps we have in MD now.
>> So maybe I will try them next spring and see how they do.
>> Though I have heard Jan say that his Hetres do really well commuting. I
>> am sure others have a good track record with theirs, too.
>>
>> I am still looking out for some lightweight, fast, puncture protected,
>> 650b tires.
>> For now I am enjoying my stock build Marathons on my Sam.
>> They don't feel any slower on the Sam than when I had Rumpkins and
>> Swiftys on the Bleriot.
>>
>> Seen any reviews on the new puncture protected Rumpkins? Maybe they would
>> do better for you.
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Michael,

I'm fine thanks, just a little pocket book injury those tires are $68 +
shipping. I've run the Marathons and had a flat but never a slash...the
Rumpkins have a super thick casing and decent side wall, IIRC they rolled
fairly well. I'll get a better feel tomorrow as I'll have a post
thanksgiving ride...gotta burn those calories.

Best,

~Hugh


On Wed, Nov 27, 2013 at 9:12 PM, Michael  wrote:

> Glad you are not hurt (your are ok?).
>>
>
> I have Hetres on my Bleriot but haven't really done any commuting on them.
> I was gonna put them on my Sam (full time bike now).
> But I mentally just can't get past having only rubber and a liner between
> the tube and the road.
> And I definitely would not want to be fixing a flat in the 35 degree temps
> we have in MD now.
> So maybe I will try them next spring and see how they do.
> Though I have heard Jan say that his Hetres do really well commuting. I am
> sure others have a good track record with theirs, too.
>
> I am still looking out for some lightweight, fast, puncture protected,
> 650b tires.
> For now I am enjoying my stock build Marathons on my Sam.
> They don't feel any slower on the Sam than when I had Rumpkins and Swiftys
> on the Bleriot.
>
> Seen any reviews on the new puncture protected Rumpkins? Maybe they would
> do better for you.
>
> --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Michael]

> @ StevePalincsar:
>

Hetres are not puncture protected tires, like Marathons, Swiftys, 
Gatorskins, etc, are.
So, being a usual rider of puncture protected tires, I feel a little 
insecure on tires like Hetres that are just rubber with no puncture 
protection on them.
I like having puncture protection between the road and the tube. That is 
what I meant.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Patrick Moore]

Agreed, to a point. But I was just remarking to myself the other day how
nicely the Kojaks (559X1.35") felt compared to the 622X29 Parigi Roubaix on
the Ram. Sure, the PR feel better; what surprises me is how *close* the
Kojaks are. I can't speak about the GB ELs.



On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Matthew J  wrote:

> I've had and liked Kojaks.  The ride does not compare to Grand Bois Extra
> Legers or Challenge Paris-Roubaix.
>
>
> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 9:05:36 AM UTC-6, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> Generally but not always true. Schwalbe models somehow are comfortable
>> while being sturdy; I am thinking of the Big Apple (60 mm) and the Kojak
>> (~35 mm). Perhaps they design even belted tires with supple sidewalls.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 7:49 AM, Matthew J  wrote:
>>
>>> The sturdier tires get, the less comfortable they are.  Quite the
>>> dilemma, and one to which there is yet any easy solution.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>> *RESUMES THAT GET YOU NOTICED!*
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>>
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>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[James Warren]

I am a Big Ben evangelist now. Maybe I am lucky to not be sensitive enough to 
notice if a tire is slow. I say this, because the Big Ben is surprisingly huge 
while to me it feels efficient on pavement. Maybe I'm blinded to all details, 
because I like my Hunq so much.

-Jim

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 28, 2013, at 7:05 AM, Patrick Moore  wrote:

> Generally but not always true. Schwalbe models somehow are comfortable while 
> being sturdy; I am thinking of the Big Apple (60 mm) and the Kojak (~35 mm). 
> Perhaps they design even belted tires with supple sidewalls. 
> 
> 
> On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 7:49 AM, Matthew J  wrote:
> The sturdier tires get, the less comfortable they are.  Quite the dilemma, 
> and one to which there is yet any easy solution.  
> 
> 
> -- 
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> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Chris Halasz]

In my search for 650b tires, I had read that the Lierres have a habit of 
picking up gravel between the tread -- more so than Col de la Vies. 
 
Have you tried the Soma tires? 
 
I abandoned a well worn ('supple') set of CdVs for some reflective and 
sturdy (reliable) Marathons. It is a trade space. I now ride Schwalbes on 
all of my bikes. 
 
FWIW, I actually prefer the ride of the Marathon Pluses on my Brompton over 
its previous non-belted tires. One Brompton owner posted how he had loathed 
the 'dead' feel of the Marathon Plus, but after checking his commute time, 
realized there was no measurable (i.e. Monte Carlo friendly) change. I 
wonder how much of it is in folks' heads, like nice labels on wine 
bottles. Not to minimize what's in our heads, of course. I'm sure some 
recall the wreck.bikes discussions on steel vs aluminum frames. 
 
Cheers, 
 
Chris
Tucson, AZ 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Matthew J]

I've had and liked Kojaks.  The ride does not compare to Grand Bois Extra 
Legers or Challenge Paris-Roubaix. 

On Thursday, November 28, 2013 9:05:36 AM UTC-6, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Generally but not always true. Schwalbe models somehow are comfortable 
> while being sturdy; I am thinking of the Big Apple (60 mm) and the Kojak 
> (~35 mm). Perhaps they design even belted tires with supple sidewalls. 
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 7:49 AM, Matthew J 
> > wrote:
>
>> The sturdier tires get, the less comfortable they are.  Quite the 
>> dilemma, and one to which there is yet any easy solution.  
>>
>>
>> -- 
> *RESUMES THAT GET YOU NOTICED!*
> Certified Resume Writer
> http://resumespecialties.com/index.html
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> http://www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
>
> Albuquerque, NM
>  

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Patrick Moore]

Generally but not always true. Schwalbe models somehow are comfortable
while being sturdy; I am thinking of the Big Apple (60 mm) and the Kojak
(~35 mm). Perhaps they design even belted tires with supple sidewalls.


On Thu, Nov 28, 2013 at 7:49 AM, Matthew J  wrote:

> The sturdier tires get, the less comfortable they are.  Quite the dilemma,
> and one to which there is yet any easy solution.
>
>
> --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Matthew J]

Left out the 'not' between 'yet' and 'any'.

On Thursday, November 28, 2013 8:49:46 AM UTC-6, Matthew J wrote:
>
> The sturdier tires get, the less comfortable they are.  Quite the dilemma, 
> and one to which there is yet any easy solution.  
>
> On Thursday, November 28, 2013 7:10:22 AM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>>
>> On 11/28/2013 12:12 AM, Michael wrote: 
>> > I have Hetres on my Bleriot but haven't really done any commuting on 
>> > them. I was gonna put them on my Sam (full time bike now). 
>> > But I mentally just can't get past having only rubber and a liner 
>> > between the tube and the road. 
>>
>> What else would you expect?  Steel belts? 
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Matthew J]

The sturdier tires get, the less comfortable they are.  Quite the dilemma, 
and one to which there is yet any easy solution.  

On Thursday, November 28, 2013 7:10:22 AM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
> On 11/28/2013 12:12 AM, Michael wrote: 
> > I have Hetres on my Bleriot but haven't really done any commuting on 
> > them. I was gonna put them on my Sam (full time bike now). 
> > But I mentally just can't get past having only rubber and a liner 
> > between the tube and the road. 
>
> What else would you expect?  Steel belts? 
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Steve Palincsar]

On 11/28/2013 12:12 AM, Michael wrote:
I have Hetres on my Bleriot but haven't really done any commuting on 
them. I was gonna put them on my Sam (full time bike now).
But I mentally just can't get past having only rubber and a liner 
between the tube and the road.


What else would you expect?  Steel belts?

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[mikel66...@juno.com]

my friends' Saluki with Hertres has toured the C & O towpath and The Katy 
Trail, both gravel roads, and has experienced zero flats in over 500 
milesand thats with about 50 pounds of gear plus rider

mike goldman
warwick,r.i.

Do THIS before eating carbs (every time)
1 EASY tip to increase fat-burning, lower blood sugar & decrease fat storage
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/52973107ec020310772best01duc

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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Bruce Herbitter]

RBW Nifty-Swifties are reliable, if not quite "light."


On Wed, Nov 27, 2013 at 11:12 PM, Michael  wrote:

> Glad you are not hurt (your are ok?).
>>
>
> I have Hetres on my Bleriot but haven't really done any commuting on them.
> I was gonna put them on my Sam (full time bike now).
> But I mentally just can't get past having only rubber and a liner between
> the tube and the road.
> And I definitely would not want to be fixing a flat in the 35 degree temps
> we have in MD now.
> So maybe I will try them next spring and see how they do.
> Though I have heard Jan say that his Hetres do really well commuting. I am
> sure others have a good track record with theirs, too.
>
> I am still looking out for some lightweight, fast, puncture protected,
> 650b tires.
> For now I am enjoying my stock build Marathons on my Sam.
> They don't feel any slower on the Sam than when I had Rumpkins and Swiftys
> on the Bleriot.
>
> Seen any reviews on the new puncture protected Rumpkins? Maybe they would
> do better for you.
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Hetres are done.The search continues.

[Hugh Smitham]

Michael,

I have a set of the "Force Field Rumpkin's" and are now on the Hilsen :-) I
ran them for a while then went back to the Hetres and loved how fast they
were, but here in the foothills of the San Gabriel Mountains they're truly
under-biking...I've heard folks say they're great for gravel so I figure
they'd be fine for commuting.

I'll look into the Lierre.

Best,

~Hugh


On Wed, Nov 27, 2013 at 9:15 PM, Michael  wrote:

> Or, the GB Lierre. That looks like it has a thicker tread on it than the
>> Hetre.
>>
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