Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Sarah Carlson]

In my opinion goose poop is way worse! It's more sloppy and GREEN. Horse 
poop is more grassy and solid and less likely to splatter. (I am a nurse 
who deals with a lot of poop professionally, and I have opinions)!

On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 1:35:01 PM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:

> I'm curious now. Is goose poop worse than horse poop?
>
> On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 1:30:58 PM UTC-7 Ted Durant wrote:
>
>> On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 9:10:11 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I find a use for them nearly every ride - there is always some puddle or 
>> a bunch of goose poop that makes me thank my lucky stars for fenders. 
>>
>>
>> LOL, yeah, we've had no rain for a month here and the goose poop at the 
>> lakefront is epic right now. +1 for fenders.
>>
>> That said, I have yet to find any goose poop on a gravel road. Our 
>> Wisconsin network of crushed limestone rail-trails, on the other hand, can 
>> be full of stuff you don't want spraying on your legs and back. Last year I 
>> did a 300km loop around SE Wisconsin, 111km of which was on trails. It 
>> didn't rain on us, but it had rained the day before, and some of the trails 
>> were still pretty damp. I was very happy to have fenders, even though there 
>> was a fair amount of sand rattling around in them. The guy riding behind me 
>> was sure glad I had them.
>>
>> Ted Durant
>> Milwaukee, WI USA 
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Bicycle Belle Ding Ding!]

RivSister Joyce! It is *so* good to hear from you. I’m glad we seem to be 
on the same path - Platys for pavement and our Clems for the rough stuff. 
I’m going to try your Juniper Ridge tires after I wear out these Gravel 
Kings. They sound divine. Also, I could probably use your expertise about 
gravel riding as I’m getting into it. I shall keep your email address 
handy, ha!
RivSisters ♥️,
Leah

On Saturday, June 17, 2023 at 3:25:40 PM UTC-4 JAS wrote:

> Leah, 
> You are going to have so much fun!!  Your Clem looks stunning, as always, 
> but even more ready for gravel with the new tires.  I love those fenders 
> too.  I put Rene Herse Juniper Ridge 48s on my Clem over a year ago and 
> what a difference!  I now can ride the wet trails with confidence because 
> I'm not slipping through the muddy spots.  They're plenty wide for the dirt 
> and gravel trails I frequent and work fine on pavement which I have to ride 
> to get to the trails.  Enjoy that big blue Clem and be sure to give us a 
> review (and more photos, of course)!
>
> RivSisters,
> Joyce 
>
> On Friday, June 16, 2023 at 8:09:10 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> 
>> Well, today was the day. After verifying (thanks, friends) that my rims 
>> would take 48s, I went to the bike shop and asked for gravel tires. A 52 cm 
>> Clem will look like this in your rear backup camera:
>> [image: image5.jpeg]
>>
>> I had looked at the one thousand “embarrassment of riches” tire choices 
>> championed here and I was…overwhelmed. Maybe this tire didn’t come in 650b 
>> or it did, but not in 48. Or yes, this one does but it’s out of stock. I 
>> don’t know how much gravel riding I’m going to be doing; I just want wider 
>> tires that could be good on gravel and to keep my fenders (they’re pretty. 
>> They keep dust off my stuff.) so I decided to trust the bike shop. It took 
>> them all of 5 seconds to hand me a pair of Gravel King SS tires in 650b and 
>> in 48mm.
>>
>> I asked about the conditions of my old tires. How do you see wear on a 
>> slick? The old tires were Gravel Kings and there isn’t a good wear 
>> indicator. But, the tires had lots of cracking and they told me it was time 
>> for new tires. It feels good to know you wore something out. 
>>
>> I didn’t expect the bike for a few days but they had those tires on there 
>> lickety-split. Had I known, I would have stayed to watch them work on my 
>> bike. You know how there are always guys sitting on stools in bike shops, 
>> chatting with the mechanics as they work? I always want to be those guys 
>> but I feel like I will be underfoot and out of place like somebody’s 
>> tagalong sister, so I scurry out of there and wait for my summons. One day 
>> I will be brave…
>>
>> The text came through right as I was heading home from my Costco run. 
>> Leah Peterson, come get your bike! Here are the glamour shots.
>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>
>> I do not think these tires look much wider than the 42s previously on the 
>> rim, but they do feel better, more sure-footed. I did not have a LOT of 
>> time to try them out as I had a hot date tonight. We took a neighborhood 
>> trail (dirt) and a tiny stretch of gravel. I like the tread, don’t you? 
>> There’s a lot going on here. 
>> [image: image1.jpeg]
>>
>> And for those of you who will want to see the stats with your own eyes, I 
>> included the image below. Please ignore the missing orange ano valve stem 
>> cap. I cannot ever, EVER, leave a bike shop without some sort of calamity. 
>> Every time I pick my bike up from a bike shop, I will have to go back a 
>> second time. My personal record is 3 trips in one day. Could be anything. 
>> Something they forgot to do. Something they installed wrong. Today it was 
>> something they forgot to put back - this cap. And they also forgot to 
>> tighten up my brakes, but I didn’t mention that. This cap was specially 
>> anodized to go with this fun wheelset from Analog, so I had to have it 
>> back. 
>> [image: image2.jpeg]
>>
>> I have resolved that I am going to ride this bike more often. I love the 
>> Platys, maybe too much, but I also have great affection for the big blue 
>> Clem and it needs more miles. The tires are tubeless compatible, so I may 
>> switch it to tubeless if I find myself riding it a lot more.
>> [image: image3.jpeg]
>>
>> I’m really excited to have breathed some new life into this old friend. 
>> The bike is very dear to me, which is why I have never sold it, even though 
>> it got ridden the least out of my trio. Clems are having their moment in 
>> the bike world. Everywhere I look, people (mostly men) are raving about the 
>> Clem L. They are plastered all over Instagram. Featured in the cool kids’ 
>> magazine, Calling In Sick, the Clem had its own issue. It’s great to see 
>> the Clems held in high esteem because most men weren’t thrilled about this 
>> model in 2015. So, I feel fortunate to have one of my own, set up a little 
>> bit different from my pair of Platys, s

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[JAS]

Leah, 
You are going to have so much fun!!  Your Clem looks stunning, as always, 
but even more ready for gravel with the new tires.  I love those fenders 
too.  I put Rene Herse Juniper Ridge 48s on my Clem over a year ago and 
what a difference!  I now can ride the wet trails with confidence because 
I'm not slipping through the muddy spots.  They're plenty wide for the dirt 
and gravel trails I frequent and work fine on pavement which I have to ride 
to get to the trails.  Enjoy that big blue Clem and be sure to give us a 
review (and more photos, of course)!

RivSisters,
Joyce 

On Friday, June 16, 2023 at 8:09:10 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> 
> Well, today was the day. After verifying (thanks, friends) that my rims 
> would take 48s, I went to the bike shop and asked for gravel tires. A 52 cm 
> Clem will look like this in your rear backup camera:
> [image: image5.jpeg]
>
> I had looked at the one thousand “embarrassment of riches” tire choices 
> championed here and I was…overwhelmed. Maybe this tire didn’t come in 650b 
> or it did, but not in 48. Or yes, this one does but it’s out of stock. I 
> don’t know how much gravel riding I’m going to be doing; I just want wider 
> tires that could be good on gravel and to keep my fenders (they’re pretty. 
> They keep dust off my stuff.) so I decided to trust the bike shop. It took 
> them all of 5 seconds to hand me a pair of Gravel King SS tires in 650b and 
> in 48mm.
>
> I asked about the conditions of my old tires. How do you see wear on a 
> slick? The old tires were Gravel Kings and there isn’t a good wear 
> indicator. But, the tires had lots of cracking and they told me it was time 
> for new tires. It feels good to know you wore something out. 
>
> I didn’t expect the bike for a few days but they had those tires on there 
> lickety-split. Had I known, I would have stayed to watch them work on my 
> bike. You know how there are always guys sitting on stools in bike shops, 
> chatting with the mechanics as they work? I always want to be those guys 
> but I feel like I will be underfoot and out of place like somebody’s 
> tagalong sister, so I scurry out of there and wait for my summons. One day 
> I will be brave…
>
> The text came through right as I was heading home from my Costco run. Leah 
> Peterson, come get your bike! Here are the glamour shots.
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> I do not think these tires look much wider than the 42s previously on the 
> rim, but they do feel better, more sure-footed. I did not have a LOT of 
> time to try them out as I had a hot date tonight. We took a neighborhood 
> trail (dirt) and a tiny stretch of gravel. I like the tread, don’t you? 
> There’s a lot going on here. 
> [image: image1.jpeg]
>
> And for those of you who will want to see the stats with your own eyes, I 
> included the image below. Please ignore the missing orange ano valve stem 
> cap. I cannot ever, EVER, leave a bike shop without some sort of calamity. 
> Every time I pick my bike up from a bike shop, I will have to go back a 
> second time. My personal record is 3 trips in one day. Could be anything. 
> Something they forgot to do. Something they installed wrong. Today it was 
> something they forgot to put back - this cap. And they also forgot to 
> tighten up my brakes, but I didn’t mention that. This cap was specially 
> anodized to go with this fun wheelset from Analog, so I had to have it 
> back. 
> [image: image2.jpeg]
>
> I have resolved that I am going to ride this bike more often. I love the 
> Platys, maybe too much, but I also have great affection for the big blue 
> Clem and it needs more miles. The tires are tubeless compatible, so I may 
> switch it to tubeless if I find myself riding it a lot more.
> [image: image3.jpeg]
>
> I’m really excited to have breathed some new life into this old friend. 
> The bike is very dear to me, which is why I have never sold it, even though 
> it got ridden the least out of my trio. Clems are having their moment in 
> the bike world. Everywhere I look, people (mostly men) are raving about the 
> Clem L. They are plastered all over Instagram. Featured in the cool kids’ 
> magazine, Calling In Sick, the Clem had its own issue. It’s great to see 
> the Clems held in high esteem because most men weren’t thrilled about this 
> model in 2015. So, I feel fortunate to have one of my own, set up a little 
> bit different from my pair of Platys, so as to let me try some different 
> kinds of riding. 
>
> Thank you for all the help! I know much more now than when I first posted 
> the question.
> Leah
>
>
>
>
> On Jun 14, 2023, at 1:59 PM, Vincent Tamer  wrote:
>
> 
>
> I'll add my two cents now. I commute on my clem and ride gravel whenever I 
> can. I've had fenders on it nearly all the time I've had this bike and I've 
> taken it into some pretty rough spots that I would say are just outside of 
> gravel such as riding on old train track. If it's still called gravel, it's 
> the coarsest k

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Patrick Moore]

Very true; narrower rims require higher pressures. Still, you can go pretty
low. My 71 mm Rangers are mounted tubeless on 24 mm OW non-tubeless Alex
rims and there's no squirm or "wrinkle" in cornering or on bumps; the tires
feel very "solid" and not mushy. Me + Monocog about 200 lb.

On Tue, Jun 13, 2023 at 5:48 AM ascpgh  wrote:

>
> There is a realistic limit to how low to go with fat tires, the rim 's
> internal bead hook (or hookless) width will become the controller of that.
> The cross section of the installed tire on the rim makes a circle of mostly
> tire, bead to bead, closed by the rim. Narrow the rim and more of the
> circle is tire rather than aluminum, soft tire as you reduce inflation. You
> just want to stay above the point where you on the bike, doing what you do
> while riding (stop, start, steer, veer and hit bumps sticks rocks) doesn't
> cause the tire to wrinkle up instead of responding to your will.
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Johnny Alien]

I have a recent Clem and the hole is not offset.

On Monday, June 12, 2023 at 5:33:46 PM UTC-4 lconley wrote:

> I don't know about the later Clems, but an issue on my OG Clementine is 
> that wide tires interfere with the double kickstand. Not likely a problem 
> with 650b - 48s but starting at about 55 (2.15") width, the tires touch the 
> kickstand - had to oval the mounting hole. 2.4s rubbed the kickstand very 
> badly. I like how the Gus has an offset kickstand hole. Do the later Clems 
> have the offset kickstand hole also?
>
> Laing
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 4:09:14 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> All the happiness and all the joy!!! I can run what I want! I was getting 
>> ready to pitch the whole project when I thought I might have to build new 
>> wheels - quite the investment for something I’m only experimenting with, 
>> plus I had dyno in my old wheelset. I’m getting 48s because I absolutely 
>> CAN I’ll take it to the shop and report back later on what tires I end 
>> up with.
>>
>> On Jun 11, 2023, at 1:37 PM, Bob Ehrenbeck  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> 48s are absolutely fine on Pacenti Brevets.
>>
>> https://www.renehersecycles.com/gravel-myths-3-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
>>
>> https://www.renehersecycles.com/myth-18-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
>>
>> Bob E
>> Cranford, NJ
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 2:59:59 PM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>
>>> The internal width is 19mm. A 48 might benefit from a slightly wider 
>>> internal width but it should be just fine with the 19. I am not an expert 
>>> in such things though.
>>>
>>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:10:03 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 Can anyone here confirm that she can run 48s tubed on those Pacenti 
 Brevet rims? I checked their site and got nowhere, it shows a graph with 
 42 
 yes, 50 no. What about 48??

 On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:57:50 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:

> OH! I see. I don't know enough about tubeless to understand the fine 
> details of size vs psi, etc. I have those rims on my ProtoGallop with 
> 42's 
> but I have tubes because it suits my brain better.
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:39:59 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and 
>> some on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 48s 
>> I 
>> have two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use 
>> tubes. Or thirdly, but new wheels.
>>
>> Did I misunderstand? 
>> L
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  
>> wrote:
>>
>> I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims 
>> are tubeless ready.
>>
>>
>>
>> https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1
>>
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding 
>> Ding! wrote:
>>
>>> What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All 
>>> those attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those 
>>> Platys 
>>> as of late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are 
>>> traveling 
>>> right now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see 
>>> about 
>>> putting 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. 
>>> Sounds 
>>> like if they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.
>>>
>>> On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:
>>>
>>> The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with 
>>> won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, 
>>> if 
>>> posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have 
>>> dissolved 
>>> years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the 
>>> fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to 
>>> do it 
>>> on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of 
>>> data 
>>> point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my 
>>> daughter 
>>> said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of 
>>> how 
>>> Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles 
>>> moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another 
>>> rider 
>>> smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that 
>>> to, 
>>> “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its 
>>> appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth 
>>> noting, 
>>> unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets 
>>> no 
>>> respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those 
>>> that 
>>> make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long whe

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[lconley]

I don't know about the later Clems, but an issue on my OG Clementine is 
that wide tires interfere with the double kickstand. Not likely a problem 
with 650b - 48s but starting at about 55 (2.15") width, the tires touch the 
kickstand - had to oval the mounting hole. 2.4s rubbed the kickstand very 
badly. I like how the Gus has an offset kickstand hole. Do the later Clems 
have the offset kickstand hole also?

Laing

On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 4:09:14 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> All the happiness and all the joy!!! I can run what I want! I was getting 
> ready to pitch the whole project when I thought I might have to build new 
> wheels - quite the investment for something I’m only experimenting with, 
> plus I had dyno in my old wheelset. I’m getting 48s because I absolutely 
> CAN I’ll take it to the shop and report back later on what tires I end 
> up with.
>
> On Jun 11, 2023, at 1:37 PM, Bob Ehrenbeck  wrote:
>
> 
>
> 48s are absolutely fine on Pacenti Brevets.
>
> https://www.renehersecycles.com/gravel-myths-3-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
>
> https://www.renehersecycles.com/myth-18-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
>
> Bob E
> Cranford, NJ
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 2:59:59 PM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:
>
>> The internal width is 19mm. A 48 might benefit from a slightly wider 
>> internal width but it should be just fine with the 19. I am not an expert 
>> in such things though.
>>
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:10:03 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Can anyone here confirm that she can run 48s tubed on those Pacenti 
>>> Brevet rims? I checked their site and got nowhere, it shows a graph with 42 
>>> yes, 50 no. What about 48??
>>>
>>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:57:50 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>>
 OH! I see. I don't know enough about tubeless to understand the fine 
 details of size vs psi, etc. I have those rims on my ProtoGallop with 42's 
 but I have tubes because it suits my brain better.

 On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:39:59 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
 wrote:

> They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and 
> some on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 48s 
> I 
> have two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use 
> tubes. Or thirdly, but new wheels.
>
> Did I misunderstand? 
> L
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  
> wrote:
>
> I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims 
> are tubeless ready.
>
>
>
> https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All 
>> those attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those 
>> Platys 
>> as of late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are 
>> traveling 
>> right now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see about 
>> putting 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. Sounds 
>> like if they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.
>>
>> On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:
>>
>> The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with 
>> won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, 
>> if 
>> posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have 
>> dissolved 
>> years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the 
>> fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do 
>> it 
>> on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data 
>> point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my 
>> daughter 
>> said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of 
>> how 
>> Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles 
>> moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider 
>> smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that 
>> to, 
>> “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its 
>> appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth 
>> noting, 
>> unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no 
>> respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those 
>> that 
>> make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable 
>> handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any 
>> business 
>> being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part 
>> of 
>> that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a 
>> swept 

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Patrick Moore]

Yes indeed, put tires as fat as fit, with pressures as low as safe on the
Clem and try it out.

And pace Jason, I gently urge that riding on surfaces other than smooth
asphalt has its own particular pleasure; even underbiking with 38s in sand
-- occasionally. But fat and soft is easier, and as long as the tires are
fat and soft any bike is fun off road, IMO.

Patrick Moore, who just did an early summer 12.82-mile ditchbank ride on
the drop-bar'd Monocog with new 7 cm, 25* stem and 71mm WTB Rangers at
12-13 psi.



On Mon, Jun 12, 2023 at 12:06 PM Jason Fuller  wrote:

> I am very late to this conversation, and everything has been covered
> already, but I wanted to say that even though you're not "into riding
> gravel" per se, I think a big ol' set of knobby tires on the Clem is an
> awesome idea (something you can take multiple steps towards, starting with
> 48's and no fenders on the Brevet rims) if it unlocks new paths and areas
> to explore. I'm not going to lie, riding on smooth pavement is nicer than
> riding on gravel, as trendy as gravel riding has become. The real reason to
> ride gravel to me, is to be able to go to quieter, more nature-filled
> spaces by bike. Having the right tool for the job will make it a much more
> enjoyable experience. And while you can totally under-bike slick 42's and
> fenders like many here do, it is MUCH more confidence inspiring to be on
> voluminous, knobby tires.
>
> My suggestion is to put some 48's with some tread on for now, explore your
> local options and walk if you need to, and if you find yourself really
> enjoying getting off pavement, then it's time to upgrade to some wider rims
> (ie Cliffhanger) and some really capable tires like knobby 2.4" Teravails.
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[George Schick]

One comment I'll have to make about gravel riding is that there's nothing 
worse than slogging along on a very dry and dusty road (such as we have in 
abundance during this drought stricken year) and being passed by a vehicle 
which leaves you covered by big clouds of dust.  It's bad enough riding on 
some of these limestone tailing paths and coming home with a dust covered 
frame, tires, drive train, etc.

On Monday, June 12, 2023 at 1:05:44 PM UTC-5 Jason Fuller wrote:

> I am very late to this conversation, and everything has been covered 
> already, but I wanted to say that even though you're not "into riding 
> gravel" per se, I think a big ol' set of knobby tires on the Clem is an 
> awesome idea (something you can take multiple steps towards, starting with 
> 48's and no fenders on the Brevet rims) if it unlocks new paths and areas 
> to explore. I'm not going to lie, riding on smooth pavement is nicer than 
> riding on gravel, as trendy as gravel riding has become. The real reason to 
> ride gravel to me, is to be able to go to quieter, more nature-filled 
> spaces by bike. Having the right tool for the job will make it a much more 
> enjoyable experience. And while you can totally under-bike slick 42's and 
> fenders like many here do, it is MUCH more confidence inspiring to be on 
> voluminous, knobby tires. 
>
> My suggestion is to put some 48's with some tread on for now, explore your 
> local options and walk if you need to, and if you find yourself really 
> enjoying getting off pavement, then it's time to upgrade to some wider rims 
> (ie Cliffhanger) and some really capable tires like knobby 2.4" Teravails. 
>
> On Sunday, 11 June 2023 at 13:45:07 UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> YAY! I tend to be the worrying sort and I'm very happy to hear that the 
>> rim/tire combo will work for you. Now go ride that gravel! 
>>
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:09:14 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> All the happiness and all the joy!!! I can run what I want! I was 
>>> getting ready to pitch the whole project when I thought I might have to 
>>> build new wheels - quite the investment for something I’m only 
>>> experimenting with, plus I had dyno in my old wheelset. I’m getting 48s 
>>> because I absolutely CAN I’ll take it to the shop and report back later 
>>> on what tires I end up with.
>>>
>>> On Jun 11, 2023, at 1:37 PM, Bob Ehrenbeck  wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> 48s are absolutely fine on Pacenti Brevets.
>>>
>>> https://www.renehersecycles.com/gravel-myths-3-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
>>>
>>> https://www.renehersecycles.com/myth-18-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
>>>
>>> Bob E
>>> Cranford, NJ
>>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 2:59:59 PM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>>
 The internal width is 19mm. A 48 might benefit from a slightly wider 
 internal width but it should be just fine with the 19. I am not an expert 
 in such things though.

 On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:10:03 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Can anyone here confirm that she can run 48s tubed on those Pacenti 
> Brevet rims? I checked their site and got nowhere, it shows a graph with 
> 42 
> yes, 50 no. What about 48??
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:57:50 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>
>> OH! I see. I don't know enough about tubeless to understand the fine 
>> details of size vs psi, etc. I have those rims on my ProtoGallop with 
>> 42's 
>> but I have tubes because it suits my brain better.
>>
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:39:59 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and 
>>> some on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 
>>> 48s I 
>>> have two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use 
>>> tubes. Or thirdly, but new wheels.
>>>
>>> Did I misunderstand? 
>>> L
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims 
>>> are tubeless ready.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1
>>>
>>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding 
>>> Ding! wrote:
>>>
 What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All 
 those attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those 
 Platys 
 as of late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are 
 traveling 
 right now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see 
 about 
 putting 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. 
 Sounds 
 like if they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.

 On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:

>

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Jason Fuller]

I am very late to this conversation, and everything has been covered 
already, but I wanted to say that even though you're not "into riding 
gravel" per se, I think a big ol' set of knobby tires on the Clem is an 
awesome idea (something you can take multiple steps towards, starting with 
48's and no fenders on the Brevet rims) if it unlocks new paths and areas 
to explore. I'm not going to lie, riding on smooth pavement is nicer than 
riding on gravel, as trendy as gravel riding has become. The real reason to 
ride gravel to me, is to be able to go to quieter, more nature-filled 
spaces by bike. Having the right tool for the job will make it a much more 
enjoyable experience. And while you can totally under-bike slick 42's and 
fenders like many here do, it is MUCH more confidence inspiring to be on 
voluminous, knobby tires. 

My suggestion is to put some 48's with some tread on for now, explore your 
local options and walk if you need to, and if you find yourself really 
enjoying getting off pavement, then it's time to upgrade to some wider rims 
(ie Cliffhanger) and some really capable tires like knobby 2.4" Teravails. 

On Sunday, 11 June 2023 at 13:45:07 UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> YAY! I tend to be the worrying sort and I'm very happy to hear that the 
> rim/tire combo will work for you. Now go ride that gravel! 
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:09:14 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> All the happiness and all the joy!!! I can run what I want! I was getting 
>> ready to pitch the whole project when I thought I might have to build new 
>> wheels - quite the investment for something I’m only experimenting with, 
>> plus I had dyno in my old wheelset. I’m getting 48s because I absolutely 
>> CAN I’ll take it to the shop and report back later on what tires I end 
>> up with.
>>
>> On Jun 11, 2023, at 1:37 PM, Bob Ehrenbeck  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> 48s are absolutely fine on Pacenti Brevets.
>>
>> https://www.renehersecycles.com/gravel-myths-3-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
>>
>> https://www.renehersecycles.com/myth-18-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
>>
>> Bob E
>> Cranford, NJ
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 2:59:59 PM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>
>>> The internal width is 19mm. A 48 might benefit from a slightly wider 
>>> internal width but it should be just fine with the 19. I am not an expert 
>>> in such things though.
>>>
>>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:10:03 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 Can anyone here confirm that she can run 48s tubed on those Pacenti 
 Brevet rims? I checked their site and got nowhere, it shows a graph with 
 42 
 yes, 50 no. What about 48??

 On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:57:50 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:

> OH! I see. I don't know enough about tubeless to understand the fine 
> details of size vs psi, etc. I have those rims on my ProtoGallop with 
> 42's 
> but I have tubes because it suits my brain better.
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:39:59 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and 
>> some on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 48s 
>> I 
>> have two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use 
>> tubes. Or thirdly, but new wheels.
>>
>> Did I misunderstand? 
>> L
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  
>> wrote:
>>
>> I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims 
>> are tubeless ready.
>>
>>
>>
>> https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1
>>
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding 
>> Ding! wrote:
>>
>>> What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All 
>>> those attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those 
>>> Platys 
>>> as of late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are 
>>> traveling 
>>> right now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see 
>>> about 
>>> putting 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. 
>>> Sounds 
>>> like if they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.
>>>
>>> On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:
>>>
>>> The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with 
>>> won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, 
>>> if 
>>> posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have 
>>> dissolved 
>>> years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the 
>>> fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to 
>>> do it 
>>> on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of 
>>> data 
>>> point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Joe Bernard]

YAY! I tend to be the worrying sort and I'm very happy to hear that the 
rim/tire combo will work for you. Now go ride that gravel! 

On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:09:14 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> All the happiness and all the joy!!! I can run what I want! I was getting 
> ready to pitch the whole project when I thought I might have to build new 
> wheels - quite the investment for something I’m only experimenting with, 
> plus I had dyno in my old wheelset. I’m getting 48s because I absolutely 
> CAN I’ll take it to the shop and report back later on what tires I end 
> up with.
>
> On Jun 11, 2023, at 1:37 PM, Bob Ehrenbeck  wrote:
>
> 
>
> 48s are absolutely fine on Pacenti Brevets.
>
> https://www.renehersecycles.com/gravel-myths-3-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
>
> https://www.renehersecycles.com/myth-18-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
>
> Bob E
> Cranford, NJ
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 2:59:59 PM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:
>
>> The internal width is 19mm. A 48 might benefit from a slightly wider 
>> internal width but it should be just fine with the 19. I am not an expert 
>> in such things though.
>>
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:10:03 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Can anyone here confirm that she can run 48s tubed on those Pacenti 
>>> Brevet rims? I checked their site and got nowhere, it shows a graph with 42 
>>> yes, 50 no. What about 48??
>>>
>>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:57:50 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>>
 OH! I see. I don't know enough about tubeless to understand the fine 
 details of size vs psi, etc. I have those rims on my ProtoGallop with 42's 
 but I have tubes because it suits my brain better.

 On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:39:59 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
 wrote:

> They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and 
> some on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 48s 
> I 
> have two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use 
> tubes. Or thirdly, but new wheels.
>
> Did I misunderstand? 
> L
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  
> wrote:
>
> I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims 
> are tubeless ready.
>
>
>
> https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All 
>> those attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those 
>> Platys 
>> as of late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are 
>> traveling 
>> right now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see about 
>> putting 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. Sounds 
>> like if they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.
>>
>> On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:
>>
>> The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with 
>> won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, 
>> if 
>> posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have 
>> dissolved 
>> years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the 
>> fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do 
>> it 
>> on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data 
>> point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my 
>> daughter 
>> said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of 
>> how 
>> Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles 
>> moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider 
>> smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that 
>> to, 
>> “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its 
>> appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth 
>> noting, 
>> unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no 
>> respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those 
>> that 
>> make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable 
>> handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any 
>> business 
>> being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part 
>> of 
>> that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a 
>> swept 
>> back pliant trail chatter sponge that doesn’t compromise control. So 
>> resist 
>> the temptation to immediately switch em out for off-road. Happy trails.
>>
>>
>> Gil
>> Gloucester
>> On Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 1:30:01 PM UTC-4 RichS wrote:
>>

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Kim Hetzel]

Leah,

I have own my Clem for about seven months now. I have ridden mostly on 
pavement. There has been a several times that I have gone off road, mostly 
dirt. I have found a completely different riding experience in handling of 
my Clem. By this, I mean, my bike handles and behaves very differently. It 
is sure-footed and solid with it long
wheelbase and tires (Schwalbe 29x2.25 Rapid Rob without fenders). I point 
the bike in the direction I want it to go and it goes there without 
hesitation nor slippage underneath me. This I find very exciting and 
quickly puts a smile on face. 

I encourage you to try riding off road as a new experience for you.

As for now, I do plan on buying some fenders in the near future, such as 
Honjo Smooth 74s'. However, I have been looking at Honjo Flat 80s', of 
which I could fit a wider tire; up to 2.5 inches. These are currently sold 
out at SIMWORKS. They are not a priority right now.

Kim Hetzel
in Yelm smelling the Scotch broom in full bloom. Yuck.

On Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 2:33:28 AM UTC-7 ascpgh wrote:

> Sorry, that one got out without signature and the last picture:
> [image: B0B8789D-EEA9-4520-B056-D9707E0B63E0.jpg]
> Andy Cheatham
> Pittsburgh
>
> On Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 5:32:24 AM UTC-4 ascpgh wrote:
>
>> Something I hadn't imagined until my riding included entires days on 
>> non-paved surfaces was that even on a clear beautiful day and dry 
>> conditions, the fenders and my long front one's flap kept the dust down, 
>> away from my drivetrain and feet. On multi-day trips it has protected and 
>> preserved it where in the fenderless past there was no doubt that I had to 
>> carry my chain lube and rags to carefully "field clean" and reapply. 
>> [image: B792C12F-776A-49DC-8E71-7BE13C4EFF65_1_105_c.jpeg]
>>
>> I am with Josiah's advice or ride what you've got until replacement time 
>> comes. I am also a convert to Rene Herse (nee Compass) tires. They made my 
>> Rambouillet remain suitable for ten more years of much wider scope of use 
>> than Grant envisioned when it was new. I have a custom bike now partly 
>> built around the tires, partly my Ram's fit and definitely fenders.
>>
>> On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 10:10:11 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I find a use for them nearly every ride - there is always some puddle or 
>>> a bunch of goose poop that makes me thank my lucky stars for fenders. I 
>>> rode a club ride last night and was sprayed by the woman riding in front of 
>>> me because of course she had no fenders. I envied the woman behind me, who 
>>> was surely spared by MY fenders.
>>>
>>> On Jun 7, 2023, at 8:17 AM, Johnny Alien  wrote:
>>>
>>> I used to always fender my bikes because I liked the looks but then 
>>> realized that I was never in any conditions where they were needed from a 
>>> practical sense so I changed my mind and now never use them.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 11:04:25 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I need to try the Clem out on gravel; in fact, I need to find some 
 gravel. Our bike club has a Ride Our Routes collection that I will look 
 into. But I also need new tires, regardless. These are pretty worn from 
 being my one and only bike that got tons of covid miles. 

 On Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 1:32:07 PM UTC-4 Slin wrote:

> @Leah - Have you tried taking the Clem out on gravel rides, as-is? 
> I've also got a Clem and Platy, so I'm curious to hear how you experience 
> them differently on the same trails. 
>
> S
>
>
>
> On Saturday, June 3, 2023 at 1:15:22 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
 I love pavement. But I’ve been on two gravel rides in the last month 
>> and I rode a Platy either time and it wasn’t my favorite for that bike. 
>> But, I have my old 2019 52 cm Clem L, and it doesn’t have a dedicated 
>> purpose right now and shouldn’t that be the bike for rough and tough 
>> stuff 
>> like gravel? Also, my Platys are prisses. 
>>
>> BUT. I’m not good at gravel. I have no idea what the kids are doing 
>> these days. I have questions, and you have answers.
>>
>> 1. Can I keep my VO wavy fenders on a gravel bike? Here’s what I 
>> have, and they say up to 50 mm tire will fit:[image: IMG_5029.jpeg]
>>
> 2. Slick or knobby? I can’t even get a straight answer on this. Which 
>> is better? If it matters about the rider, this will be for a rider with 
>> a 
>> healthy fear of crashing.
>>
>> 3. How wide? I have 42s on my bikes now and I don’t feel like they 
>> are wide enough. 
>>
>> 4. Tubeless or no? These wheels are tubeless-compatible but I put a 
>> tube in them because I wasn’t riding enough to keep the sealant 
>> circulating. But that can be changed right quick.
>>
>> Here is my Clem in its current configuration, and yes, I know the 
>> Backabikes gotta go. 
>>

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Leah Peterson]

All the happiness and all the joy!!! I can run what I want! I was getting ready to pitch the whole project when I thought I might have to build new wheels - quite the investment for something I’m only experimenting with, plus I had dyno in my old wheelset. I’m getting 48s because I absolutely CAN I’ll take it to the shop and report back later on what tires I end up with.On Jun 11, 2023, at 1:37 PM, Bob Ehrenbeck  wrote:48s are absolutely fine on Pacenti Brevets.https://www.renehersecycles.com/gravel-myths-3-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/https://www.renehersecycles.com/myth-18-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/Bob ECranford, NJOn Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 2:59:59 PM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:The internal width is 19mm. A 48 might benefit from a slightly wider internal width but it should be just fine with the 19. I am not an expert in such things though.On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:10:03 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:Can anyone here confirm that she can run 48s tubed on those Pacenti Brevet rims? I checked their site and got nowhere, it shows a graph with 42 yes, 50 no. What about 48??On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:57:50 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:OH! I see. I don't know enough about tubeless to understand the fine details of size vs psi, etc. I have those rims on my ProtoGallop with 42's but I have tubes because it suits my brain better.On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:39:59 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and some on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 48s I have two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use tubes. Or thirdly, but new wheels.Did I misunderstand? LSent from my iPhoneOn Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  wrote:I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims are tubeless ready.https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All those attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those Platys as of late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are traveling right now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see about putting 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. Sounds like if they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, if posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have dissolved years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do it on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my daughter said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of how Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that to, “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth noting, unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those that make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any business being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part of that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a swept back pliant trail chatter sponge that doesn’t compromise control. So resist the temptation to immediately switch em out for off-road. Happy trails.GilGloucesterOn Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 1:30:01 PM UTC-4 RichS wrote:Kai,My compliments on your Clem! Your portfolio of images really displays the Clems versatility, and I might add, your creativity. An ideal bike for NY/Brooklyn terrain.The adjustable bottom bracket is pretty cool too:-)Best,Rich in ATLOn Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 9:16:23 PM UTC-4 Kainalu V.  -Brooklyn NY wrote:Many photos of many states of Clem H, all gravel ready- https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7-KaiOn Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:06:54 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:This thread needs less opinions and more inpirational photos of Gravel Clems. Just my opinion. :P On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 12:02:41 PM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:I'm not going to provide specific tire recommendations, but I ride "gravel" and single-track quiet a bit on my Roadini. I still remember that time in the 1990s when I was riding with Bridgestone-sponsored cyclist Eric Ho

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Bob Ehrenbeck]

48s are absolutely fine on Pacenti Brevets.

https://www.renehersecycles.com/gravel-myths-3-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/

https://www.renehersecycles.com/myth-18-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/

Bob E
Cranford, NJ
On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 2:59:59 PM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:

> The internal width is 19mm. A 48 might benefit from a slightly wider 
> internal width but it should be just fine with the 19. I am not an expert 
> in such things though.
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:10:03 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Can anyone here confirm that she can run 48s tubed on those Pacenti 
>> Brevet rims? I checked their site and got nowhere, it shows a graph with 42 
>> yes, 50 no. What about 48??
>>
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:57:50 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>
>>> OH! I see. I don't know enough about tubeless to understand the fine 
>>> details of size vs psi, etc. I have those rims on my ProtoGallop with 42's 
>>> but I have tubes because it suits my brain better.
>>>
>>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:39:59 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and 
 some on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 48s I 
 have two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use 
 tubes. Or thirdly, but new wheels.

 Did I misunderstand? 
 L

 Sent from my iPhone

 On Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  wrote:

 I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims are 
 tubeless ready.



 https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1

 On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
 wrote:

> What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All those 
> attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those Platys as 
> of 
> late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are traveling 
> right 
> now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see about 
> putting 
> 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. Sounds like if 
> they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.
>
> On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:
>
> The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with 
> won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, if 
> posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have dissolved 
> years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the 
> fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do 
> it 
> on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data 
> point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my 
> daughter 
> said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of 
> how 
> Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles 
> moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider 
> smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that 
> to, 
> “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its 
> appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth noting, 
> unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no 
> respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those 
> that 
> make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable 
> handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any 
> business 
> being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part 
> of 
> that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a swept 
> back pliant trail chatter sponge that doesn’t compromise control. So 
> resist 
> the temptation to immediately switch em out for off-road. Happy trails.
>
>
> Gil
> Gloucester
> On Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 1:30:01 PM UTC-4 RichS wrote:
>
>> Kai,
>>
>> My compliments on your Clem! Your portfolio of images really displays 
>> the Clems versatility, and I might add, your creativity. An ideal bike 
>> for 
>> NY/Brooklyn terrain.
>> The adjustable bottom bracket is pretty cool too:-)
>>
>> Best,
>> Rich in ATL
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 9:16:23 PM UTC-4 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Many photos of many states of Clem H, all gravel ready- 
>>> https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7
>>> -Kai
>>> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:06:54 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:
>>>
 [image: PXL_20230606_164339003.jpg]

 This thread needs less opinions and more inpirational photos of 
 Gravel Clems. Just my opinion. 

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Johnny Alien]

The internal width is 19mm. A 48 might benefit from a slightly wider 
internal width but it should be just fine with the 19. I am not an expert 
in such things though.

On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 1:10:03 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Can anyone here confirm that she can run 48s tubed on those Pacenti Brevet 
> rims? I checked their site and got nowhere, it shows a graph with 42 yes, 
> 50 no. What about 48??
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:57:50 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>
>> OH! I see. I don't know enough about tubeless to understand the fine 
>> details of size vs psi, etc. I have those rims on my ProtoGallop with 42's 
>> but I have tubes because it suits my brain better.
>>
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:39:59 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and some 
>>> on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 48s I have 
>>> two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use tubes. Or 
>>> thirdly, but new wheels.
>>>
>>> Did I misunderstand? 
>>> L
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  wrote:
>>>
>>> I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims are 
>>> tubeless ready.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1
>>>
>>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All those 
 attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those Platys as 
 of 
 late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are traveling 
 right 
 now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see about putting 
 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. Sounds like if 
 they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.

 On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:

 The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with 
 won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, if 
 posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have dissolved 
 years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the 
 fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do 
 it 
 on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data 
 point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my daughter 
 said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of how 
 Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles 
 moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider 
 smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that 
 to, 
 “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its 
 appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth noting, 
 unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no 
 respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those 
 that 
 make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable 
 handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any 
 business 
 being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part 
 of 
 that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a swept 
 back pliant trail chatter sponge that doesn’t compromise control. So 
 resist 
 the temptation to immediately switch em out for off-road. Happy trails.


 Gil
 Gloucester
 On Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 1:30:01 PM UTC-4 RichS wrote:

> Kai,
>
> My compliments on your Clem! Your portfolio of images really displays 
> the Clems versatility, and I might add, your creativity. An ideal bike 
> for 
> NY/Brooklyn terrain.
> The adjustable bottom bracket is pretty cool too:-)
>
> Best,
> Rich in ATL
>
> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 9:16:23 PM UTC-4 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY 
> wrote:
>
>>
>> Many photos of many states of Clem H, all gravel ready- 
>> https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7
>> -Kai
>> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:06:54 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:
>>
>>> [image: PXL_20230606_164339003.jpg]
>>>
>>> This thread needs less opinions and more inpirational photos of 
>>> Gravel Clems. Just my opinion. :P 
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 12:02:41 PM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
 I'm not going to provide specific tire recommendations, but I ride 
 "gravel" and single-track quiet a bit on my Roadini. I still remember 
 that 
 time in the 1990s when I was riding with Bridgestone-sponsored cyclist 
 Eric 
 House, and we all showed up in th

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Joe Bernard]

Can anyone here confirm that she can run 48s tubed on those Pacenti Brevet 
rims? I checked their site and got nowhere, it shows a graph with 42 yes, 
50 no. What about 48??

On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:57:50 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:

> OH! I see. I don't know enough about tubeless to understand the fine 
> details of size vs psi, etc. I have those rims on my ProtoGallop with 42's 
> but I have tubes because it suits my brain better.
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:39:59 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and some 
>> on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 48s I have 
>> two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use tubes. Or 
>> thirdly, but new wheels.
>>
>> Did I misunderstand? 
>> L
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  wrote:
>>
>> I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims are 
>> tubeless ready.
>>
>>
>>
>> https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1
>>
>> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All those 
>>> attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those Platys as of 
>>> late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are traveling right 
>>> now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see about putting 
>>> 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. Sounds like if 
>>> they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.
>>>
>>> On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:
>>>
>>> The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with 
>>> won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, if 
>>> posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have dissolved 
>>> years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the 
>>> fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do it 
>>> on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data 
>>> point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my daughter 
>>> said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of how 
>>> Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles 
>>> moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider 
>>> smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that to, 
>>> “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its 
>>> appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth noting, 
>>> unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no 
>>> respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those that 
>>> make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable 
>>> handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any business 
>>> being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part of 
>>> that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a swept 
>>> back pliant trail chatter sponge that doesn’t compromise control. So resist 
>>> the temptation to immediately switch em out for off-road. Happy trails.
>>>
>>>
>>> Gil
>>> Gloucester
>>> On Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 1:30:01 PM UTC-4 RichS wrote:
>>>
 Kai,

 My compliments on your Clem! Your portfolio of images really displays 
 the Clems versatility, and I might add, your creativity. An ideal bike for 
 NY/Brooklyn terrain.
 The adjustable bottom bracket is pretty cool too:-)

 Best,
 Rich in ATL

 On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 9:16:23 PM UTC-4 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY 
 wrote:

>
> Many photos of many states of Clem H, all gravel ready- 
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7
> -Kai
> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:06:54 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:
>
>> [image: PXL_20230606_164339003.jpg]
>>
>> This thread needs less opinions and more inpirational photos of 
>> Gravel Clems. Just my opinion. :P 
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 12:02:41 PM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> I'm not going to provide specific tire recommendations, but I ride 
>>> "gravel" and single-track quiet a bit on my Roadini. I still remember 
>>> that 
>>> time in the 1990s when I was riding with Bridgestone-sponsored cyclist 
>>> Eric 
>>> House, and we all showed up in the East Bay proud of ourselves for 
>>> riding 
>>> road bikes on a Grant ride. Grant showed up on a fixie with 35mm tires 
>>> and 
>>> proceeded to outride us all on and off road. 
>>>
>>> A few principles:
>>>
>>>- The lighter the rider, the smaller the tire you can get away 
>>>with. At 140 pounds, I can ride fire roads with 25mm tires (or even 
>

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Johnny Alien]

OH! I see. I don't know enough about tubeless to understand the fine 
details of size vs psi, etc. I have those rims on my ProtoGallop with 42's 
but I have tubes because it suits my brain better.

On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:39:59 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and some 
> on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 48s I have 
> two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use tubes. Or 
> thirdly, but new wheels.
>
> Did I misunderstand? 
> L
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  wrote:
>
> I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims are 
> tubeless ready.
>
>
>
> https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1
>
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All those 
>> attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those Platys as of 
>> late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are traveling right 
>> now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see about putting 
>> 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. Sounds like if 
>> they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.
>>
>> On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:
>>
>> The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with 
>> won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, if 
>> posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have dissolved 
>> years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the 
>> fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do it 
>> on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data 
>> point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my daughter 
>> said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of how 
>> Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles 
>> moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider 
>> smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that to, 
>> “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its 
>> appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth noting, 
>> unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no 
>> respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those that 
>> make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable 
>> handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any business 
>> being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part of 
>> that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a swept 
>> back pliant trail chatter sponge that doesn’t compromise control. So resist 
>> the temptation to immediately switch em out for off-road. Happy trails.
>>
>>
>> Gil
>> Gloucester
>> On Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 1:30:01 PM UTC-4 RichS wrote:
>>
>>> Kai,
>>>
>>> My compliments on your Clem! Your portfolio of images really displays 
>>> the Clems versatility, and I might add, your creativity. An ideal bike for 
>>> NY/Brooklyn terrain.
>>> The adjustable bottom bracket is pretty cool too:-)
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Rich in ATL
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 9:16:23 PM UTC-4 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY 
>>> wrote:
>>>

 Many photos of many states of Clem H, all gravel ready- 
 https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7
 -Kai
 On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:06:54 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:

> [image: PXL_20230606_164339003.jpg]
>
> This thread needs less opinions and more inpirational photos of Gravel 
> Clems. Just my opinion. :P 
>
> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 12:02:41 PM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I'm not going to provide specific tire recommendations, but I ride 
>> "gravel" and single-track quiet a bit on my Roadini. I still remember 
>> that 
>> time in the 1990s when I was riding with Bridgestone-sponsored cyclist 
>> Eric 
>> House, and we all showed up in the East Bay proud of ourselves for 
>> riding 
>> road bikes on a Grant ride. Grant showed up on a fixie with 35mm tires 
>> and 
>> proceeded to outride us all on and off road. 
>>
>> A few principles:
>>
>>- The lighter the rider, the smaller the tire you can get away 
>>with. At 140 pounds, I can ride fire roads with 25mm tires (or even 
>> 23, 
>>back when Michelin 23s were $10/pop!)
>>- Tread or no tread doesn't matter as much as rider skill and 
>>speed.
>>- Rider skill cannot be disentangled from bike fit. If the bike 
>>doesn't fit, you will find stuff scary that you can actually ride if 
>> the 
>>bike fit. I once accidental

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Leah Peterson]

They are, and in the myriad responses I’ve gotten (many private and some on Instagram) it has been explained to me that if I want to run 48s I have two options: 1. Run tubeless but never more than 30 psi. Or, use tubes. Or thirdly, but new wheels.Did I misunderstand? LSent from my iPhoneOn Jun 11, 2023, at 6:22 AM, Johnny Alien  wrote:I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims are tubeless ready.https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All those attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those Platys as of late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are traveling right now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see about putting 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. Sounds like if they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, if posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have dissolved years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do it on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my daughter said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of how Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that to, “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth noting, unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those that make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any business being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part of that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a swept back pliant trail chatter sponge that doesn’t compromise control. So resist the temptation to immediately switch em out for off-road. Happy trails.GilGloucesterOn Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 1:30:01 PM UTC-4 RichS wrote:Kai,My compliments on your Clem! Your portfolio of images really displays the Clems versatility, and I might add, your creativity. An ideal bike for NY/Brooklyn terrain.The adjustable bottom bracket is pretty cool too:-)Best,Rich in ATLOn Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 9:16:23 PM UTC-4 Kainalu V.  -Brooklyn NY wrote:Many photos of many states of Clem H, all gravel ready- https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7-KaiOn Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:06:54 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:This thread needs less opinions and more inpirational photos of Gravel Clems. Just my opinion. :P On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 12:02:41 PM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:I'm not going to provide specific tire recommendations, but I ride "gravel" and single-track quiet a bit on my Roadini. I still remember that time in the 1990s when I was riding with Bridgestone-sponsored cyclist Eric House, and we all showed up in the East Bay proud of ourselves for riding road bikes on a Grant ride. Grant showed up on a fixie with 35mm tires and proceeded to outride us all on and off road. A few principles:The lighter the rider, the smaller the tire you can get away with. At 140 pounds, I can ride fire roads with 25mm tires (or even 23, back when Michelin 23s were $10/pop!)Tread or no tread doesn't matter as much as rider skill and speed.Rider skill cannot be disentangled from bike fit. If the bike doesn't fit, you will find stuff scary that you can actually ride if the bike fit. I once accidentally raised my seat too high and discovered that stuff I could easily ride suddenly became hard!The longer the ride and the steeper the climb, the more important weight becomes. I can ride big heavy tires if I'm only going to go downhill because a car did most of the work. But if I have to do a lot of climbing (some of which turns into hiking inevitably if you ride in mountainous areas), the lighter the bike the better off you are.You can drop tire pressure far more than most tire pressure calculators will tell you to. I can run 700x40 tires measuring 38mm at 25psi (the Rene Herse calculator will recommend 33psi) when I'm riding off pavement. On the pavement that same pressure will feel inefficient. I go so far as to carry a pressure gauge to drop tire pressure at the trail head and pump up the tires when I transition off a dirt 

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Johnny Alien]

I was under the understanding that the current Pacenti Brevet rims are 
tubeless ready.

https://pacenticycledesign.com/collections/aluminium-rims-gravel-cross/products/brevet-rim-650b-1

On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 12:38:32 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All those 
> attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those Platys as of 
> late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are traveling right 
> now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see about putting 
> 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. Sounds like if 
> they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.
>
> On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:
>
> The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with won’t 
> dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, if posters 
> were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have dissolved years 
> ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the fourth 
> most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do it on a 
> Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data point. 
> Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my daughter said I 
> needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of how Clem 
> compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles moving 
> at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider smiled 
> and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that to, “turns 
> out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its 
> appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth noting, 
> unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no 
> respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those that 
> make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable 
> handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any business 
> being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part of 
> that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a swept 
> back pliant trail chatter sponge that doesn’t compromise control. So resist 
> the temptation to immediately switch em out for off-road. Happy trails.
>
>
> Gil
> Gloucester
> On Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 1:30:01 PM UTC-4 RichS wrote:
>
>> Kai,
>>
>> My compliments on your Clem! Your portfolio of images really displays the 
>> Clems versatility, and I might add, your creativity. An ideal bike for 
>> NY/Brooklyn terrain.
>> The adjustable bottom bracket is pretty cool too:-)
>>
>> Best,
>> Rich in ATL
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 9:16:23 PM UTC-4 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Many photos of many states of Clem H, all gravel ready- 
>>> https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7
>>> -Kai
>>> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:06:54 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:
>>>
 [image: PXL_20230606_164339003.jpg]

 This thread needs less opinions and more inpirational photos of Gravel 
 Clems. Just my opinion. :P 

 On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 12:02:41 PM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:

> I'm not going to provide specific tire recommendations, but I ride 
> "gravel" and single-track quiet a bit on my Roadini. I still remember 
> that 
> time in the 1990s when I was riding with Bridgestone-sponsored cyclist 
> Eric 
> House, and we all showed up in the East Bay proud of ourselves for riding 
> road bikes on a Grant ride. Grant showed up on a fixie with 35mm tires 
> and 
> proceeded to outride us all on and off road. 
>
> A few principles:
>
>- The lighter the rider, the smaller the tire you can get away 
>with. At 140 pounds, I can ride fire roads with 25mm tires (or even 
> 23, 
>back when Michelin 23s were $10/pop!)
>- Tread or no tread doesn't matter as much as rider skill and 
>speed.
>- Rider skill cannot be disentangled from bike fit. If the bike 
>doesn't fit, you will find stuff scary that you can actually ride if 
> the 
>bike fit. I once accidentally raised my seat too high and discovered 
> that 
>stuff I could easily ride suddenly became hard!
>- The longer the ride and the steeper the climb, the more 
>important weight becomes. I can ride big heavy tires if I'm only going 
> to 
>go downhill because a car did most of the work. But if I have to do a 
> lot 
>of climbing (some of which turns into hiking inevitably if you ride in 
>mountainous areas), the lighter the bike the better off you are.
>- You can drop tire pressure far more than most tire pressure 
>calculators will tell you to. I can run 700x40 tires measuring 38mm at 
>25psi (the Rene Herse calculator will recommend 33psi) when I'm riding 

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Leah Peterson]

What Gil says resonates with me. I love how you love a Clem! All those attributes truly do make the Clem a gem.  I have favored those Platys as of late, but I am going back to Clem-loving again soon. We are traveling right now, but when I get back I’m heading to the bike shop to see about putting 48s on my Clem if the Pacenti Brevet rims will take them. Sounds like if they aren’t tubeless, it’s ok. We’ll see.On Jun 9, 2023, at 3:15 PM, Gill  wrote:The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, if posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have dissolved years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do it on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my daughter said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of how Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that to, “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth noting, unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those that make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any business being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part of that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a swept back pliant trail chatter sponge that doesn’t compromise control. So resist the temptation to immediately switch em out for off-road. Happy trails.GilGloucesterOn Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 1:30:01 PM UTC-4 RichS wrote:Kai,My compliments on your Clem! Your portfolio of images really displays the Clems versatility, and I might add, your creativity. An ideal bike for NY/Brooklyn terrain.The adjustable bottom bracket is pretty cool too:-)Best,Rich in ATLOn Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 9:16:23 PM UTC-4 Kainalu V.  -Brooklyn NY wrote:Many photos of many states of Clem H, all gravel ready- https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7-KaiOn Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:06:54 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:This thread needs less opinions and more inpirational photos of Gravel Clems. Just my opinion. :P On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 12:02:41 PM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:I'm not going to provide specific tire recommendations, but I ride "gravel" and single-track quiet a bit on my Roadini. I still remember that time in the 1990s when I was riding with Bridgestone-sponsored cyclist Eric House, and we all showed up in the East Bay proud of ourselves for riding road bikes on a Grant ride. Grant showed up on a fixie with 35mm tires and proceeded to outride us all on and off road. A few principles:The lighter the rider, the smaller the tire you can get away with. At 140 pounds, I can ride fire roads with 25mm tires (or even 23, back when Michelin 23s were $10/pop!)Tread or no tread doesn't matter as much as rider skill and speed.Rider skill cannot be disentangled from bike fit. If the bike doesn't fit, you will find stuff scary that you can actually ride if the bike fit. I once accidentally raised my seat too high and discovered that stuff I could easily ride suddenly became hard!The longer the ride and the steeper the climb, the more important weight becomes. I can ride big heavy tires if I'm only going to go downhill because a car did most of the work. But if I have to do a lot of climbing (some of which turns into hiking inevitably if you ride in mountainous areas), the lighter the bike the better off you are.You can drop tire pressure far more than most tire pressure calculators will tell you to. I can run 700x40 tires measuring 38mm at 25psi (the Rene Herse calculator will recommend 33psi) when I'm riding off pavement. On the pavement that same pressure will feel inefficient. I go so far as to carry a pressure gauge to drop tire pressure at the trail head and pump up the tires when I transition off a dirt descent onto pavement for the ride home.Bigger tires affect handling - one reason I don't ride with as big a tire as I can get away with is that you lose some agility. Frequently I find that being able to steer precisely and quickly offsets the inability to plow through some obstacle head on.What I do notice is that most people don't like to underbike. They will make comments that I won't be able to do a ride on my 25mm tires and then be all surprised when I show up and do the ride. But when I'm touring I'm not going to bring 3 different bikes, so I just push the limits and go slower and occasionally depend on

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Richard Rose]

Brilliant! And, I concur. Similar data points.:)Sent from my iPhoneOn Jun 9, 2023, at 5:15 PM, Gill  wrote:The fact that the OP’s query has already been thoroughly dealt with won’t dissuade me from chiming in on a subject near and dear (besides, if posters were not able to beat dead horses this forum would have dissolved years ago). I own a Clem and ride off road, gravel/trail riding is the fourth most favorite thing I do in life. I highly encourage others to do it on a Clem. Opinion, highly subjective, yes, but I do have a kind of data point. Usually I’m solo but last summer I joined a group ride (my daughter said I needed to make new friends). This served as a good barometer of how Clem compared with other “gravel” bikes. My inaugural ride was 19 miles moving at a good clip, mostly off-road at the end of which another rider smiled and said “You just ride that thing don’t you“. I translated that to, “turns out that’s a nice bicycle and my unspoken questioning of its appropriateness for this ride was unfounded, my apologies“. Worth noting, unlike Kai’s tough looking Clem mine is a Riv blue step thru and gets no respect. The qualities that make the Clem a good gravel bike are those that make it a good bike period: bulletproof frame, long wheel base, stable handling, gearing that gets you over/through anything you have any business being on, fits most any tire and uber comfortable. I might add that part of that comfort comes from the bosco bars – Clems suspension system –a swept back pliant trail chatter sponge that doesn’t compromise control. So resist the temptation to immediately switch em out for off-road. Happy trails.GilGloucesterOn Thursday, June 8, 2023 at 1:30:01 PM UTC-4 RichS wrote:Kai,My compliments on your Clem! Your portfolio of images really displays the Clems versatility, and I might add, your creativity. An ideal bike for NY/Brooklyn terrain.The adjustable bottom bracket is pretty cool too:-)Best,Rich in ATLOn Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 9:16:23 PM UTC-4 Kainalu V.  -Brooklyn NY wrote:Many photos of many states of Clem H, all gravel ready- https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7-KaiOn Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:06:54 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:This thread needs less opinions and more inpirational photos of Gravel Clems. Just my opinion. :P On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 12:02:41 PM UTC-7 pi...@gmail.com wrote:I'm not going to provide specific tire recommendations, but I ride "gravel" and single-track quiet a bit on my Roadini. I still remember that time in the 1990s when I was riding with Bridgestone-sponsored cyclist Eric House, and we all showed up in the East Bay proud of ourselves for riding road bikes on a Grant ride. Grant showed up on a fixie with 35mm tires and proceeded to outride us all on and off road. A few principles:The lighter the rider, the smaller the tire you can get away with. At 140 pounds, I can ride fire roads with 25mm tires (or even 23, back when Michelin 23s were $10/pop!)Tread or no tread doesn't matter as much as rider skill and speed.Rider skill cannot be disentangled from bike fit. If the bike doesn't fit, you will find stuff scary that you can actually ride if the bike fit. I once accidentally raised my seat too high and discovered that stuff I could easily ride suddenly became hard!The longer the ride and the steeper the climb, the more important weight becomes. I can ride big heavy tires if I'm only going to go downhill because a car did most of the work. But if I have to do a lot of climbing (some of which turns into hiking inevitably if you ride in mountainous areas), the lighter the bike the better off you are.You can drop tire pressure far more than most tire pressure calculators will tell you to. I can run 700x40 tires measuring 38mm at 25psi (the Rene Herse calculator will recommend 33psi) when I'm riding off pavement. On the pavement that same pressure will feel inefficient. I go so far as to carry a pressure gauge to drop tire pressure at the trail head and pump up the tires when I transition off a dirt descent onto pavement for the ride home.Bigger tires affect handling - one reason I don't ride with as big a tire as I can get away with is that you lose some agility. Frequently I find that being able to steer precisely and quickly offsets the inability to plow through some obstacle head on.What I do notice is that most people don't like to underbike. They will make comments that I won't be able to do a ride on my 25mm tires and then be all surprised when I show up and do the ride. But when I'm touring I'm not going to bring 3 different bikes, so I just push the limits and go slower and occasionally depend on pulling a spare tire out of my saddle bag if a tire were to shred during a tour (which can happen even if you're not riding off pavement).



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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Patrick Moore]

Even in high desert ABQ, NM with a citywide average of 9.5", fenders are
useful and not merely ornamental; 3 of my 4 bikes have them. Our monsoon
has been coyly making an early appearance with brief (<10 minute) showers
(here they record 0.05" amounts); I put off a very short ride to
Albertson's just now because of cars splashing thru road puddles, even tho'
I have fenders.

Wildlife: We have plenty of horses and geese, but while I see plenty of
horse shit -- for which I *am* glad to have fenders -- I don't recall
seeing any from geese along the right of way, pavement or dirt, despite
riding through many family hangouts.

On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 3:11 PM Mackenzy Albright <
mackenzy.albri...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I've really learned to love fenders (honjo/VO) even outside of rainy
> season. Keeps a lot of dust and dirt off the drive train if placed
> correctly, reducing wear and maintenance. Sometimes there are unavoidable
> puddles or wet spots. Animal waste. Human waste. (City riding) keep bags
> and strapped things from rubbing. They look COOL.
>
> I'd like to have an bike without fenders. But I really just love fenders...
>
> On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 1:39:52 PM UTC-7 Ted Durant wrote:
>
>> On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 3:35:01 PM UTC-5 pi...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> I'm curious now. Is goose poop worse than horse poop?
>>
>> Well, at the risk of seriously derailing the thread, ... that depends.
>> Fresh horse poop is pretty bad but it dries out quickly and then isn't a
>> problem. Goose poop stays an icky, gooey, smelly mess for a long time and
>> is a putrid green color. To try to keep this on topic ... I don't mind
>> riding without fenders where there will be horse poop. I'll do anything to
>> avoid riding without fenders through goose poop.
>>
>> It probably matters that I've owned a horse and so I'm kind of fond of
>> the smell of horse poop.
>>
>> Ted Durant
>> Milwaukee, WI USA
>>
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---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Steve]

Piaw, , goose poop is definitely worse. 

Zoology 101; geese (as do all birds) excrete their urine through the same 
orifice as their stool. So, for the record, goose poop is an acidic mix of 
piss and $H!T. 

Use FENDERS and just say NO to bird poo! 

On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 4:35:01 PM UTC-4 pi...@gmail.com wrote:

> I'm curious now. Is goose poop worse than horse poop?
>
> On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 1:30:58 PM UTC-7 Ted Durant wrote:
>
>> On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 9:10:11 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I find a use for them nearly every ride - there is always some puddle or 
>> a bunch of goose poop that makes me thank my lucky stars for fenders. 
>>
>>
>> LOL, yeah, we've had no rain for a month here and the goose poop at the 
>> lakefront is epic right now. +1 for fenders.
>>
>> That said, I have yet to find any goose poop on a gravel road. Our 
>> Wisconsin network of crushed limestone rail-trails, on the other hand, can 
>> be full of stuff you don't want spraying on your legs and back. Last year I 
>> did a 300km loop around SE Wisconsin, 111km of which was on trails. It 
>> didn't rain on us, but it had rained the day before, and some of the trails 
>> were still pretty damp. I was very happy to have fenders, even though there 
>> was a fair amount of sand rattling around in them. The guy riding behind me 
>> was sure glad I had them.
>>
>> Ted Durant
>> Milwaukee, WI USA 
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Steve]

Ted, goose poop is definitely worse. 
Zoology 101; geese (as do all birds) excrete their urine through the same 
orifice as their stool. So, for the record, goose poop is an acidic mix of 
piss and $H!T. 

Use FENDERS and just say NO to bird poo! 
On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 4:39:52 PM UTC-4 Ted Durant wrote:

> On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 3:35:01 PM UTC-5 pi...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> I'm curious now. Is goose poop worse than horse poop?
>
> Well, at the risk of seriously derailing the thread, ... that depends. 
> Fresh horse poop is pretty bad but it dries out quickly and then isn't a 
> problem. Goose poop stays an icky, gooey, smelly mess for a long time and 
> is a putrid green color. To try to keep this on topic ... I don't mind 
> riding without fenders where there will be horse poop. I'll do anything to 
> avoid riding without fenders through goose poop.
>
> It probably matters that I've owned a horse and so I'm kind of fond of the 
> smell of horse poop.
>
> Ted Durant
> Milwaukee, WI USA
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Mackenzy Albright]

I've really learned to love fenders (honjo/VO) even outside of rainy 
season. Keeps a lot of dust and dirt off the drive train if placed 
correctly, reducing wear and maintenance. Sometimes there are unavoidable 
puddles or wet spots. Animal waste. Human waste. (City riding) keep bags 
and strapped things from rubbing. They look COOL. 

I'd like to have an bike without fenders. But I really just love fenders...

On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 1:39:52 PM UTC-7 Ted Durant wrote:

> On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 3:35:01 PM UTC-5 pi...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> I'm curious now. Is goose poop worse than horse poop?
>
> Well, at the risk of seriously derailing the thread, ... that depends. 
> Fresh horse poop is pretty bad but it dries out quickly and then isn't a 
> problem. Goose poop stays an icky, gooey, smelly mess for a long time and 
> is a putrid green color. To try to keep this on topic ... I don't mind 
> riding without fenders where there will be horse poop. I'll do anything to 
> avoid riding without fenders through goose poop.
>
> It probably matters that I've owned a horse and so I'm kind of fond of the 
> smell of horse poop.
>
> Ted Durant
> Milwaukee, WI USA
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Ted Durant]

On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 3:35:01 PM UTC-5 pi...@gmail.com wrote:

I'm curious now. Is goose poop worse than horse poop?

Well, at the risk of seriously derailing the thread, ... that depends. 
Fresh horse poop is pretty bad but it dries out quickly and then isn't a 
problem. Goose poop stays an icky, gooey, smelly mess for a long time and 
is a putrid green color. To try to keep this on topic ... I don't mind 
riding without fenders where there will be horse poop. I'll do anything to 
avoid riding without fenders through goose poop.

It probably matters that I've owned a horse and so I'm kind of fond of the 
smell of horse poop.

Ted Durant
Milwaukee, WI USA

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Piaw Na]

I'm curious now. Is goose poop worse than horse poop?

On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 1:30:58 PM UTC-7 Ted Durant wrote:

> On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 9:10:11 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
> I find a use for them nearly every ride - there is always some puddle or a 
> bunch of goose poop that makes me thank my lucky stars for fenders. 
>
>
> LOL, yeah, we've had no rain for a month here and the goose poop at the 
> lakefront is epic right now. +1 for fenders.
>
> That said, I have yet to find any goose poop on a gravel road. Our 
> Wisconsin network of crushed limestone rail-trails, on the other hand, can 
> be full of stuff you don't want spraying on your legs and back. Last year I 
> did a 300km loop around SE Wisconsin, 111km of which was on trails. It 
> didn't rain on us, but it had rained the day before, and some of the trails 
> were still pretty damp. I was very happy to have fenders, even though there 
> was a fair amount of sand rattling around in them. The guy riding behind me 
> was sure glad I had them.
>
> Ted Durant
> Milwaukee, WI USA 
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Ted Durant]

On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 9:10:11 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

I find a use for them nearly every ride - there is always some puddle or a 
bunch of goose poop that makes me thank my lucky stars for fenders. 


LOL, yeah, we've had no rain for a month here and the goose poop at the 
lakefront is epic right now. +1 for fenders.

That said, I have yet to find any goose poop on a gravel road. Our 
Wisconsin network of crushed limestone rail-trails, on the other hand, can 
be full of stuff you don't want spraying on your legs and back. Last year I 
did a 300km loop around SE Wisconsin, 111km of which was on trails. It 
didn't rain on us, but it had rained the day before, and some of the trails 
were still pretty damp. I was very happy to have fenders, even though there 
was a fair amount of sand rattling around in them. The guy riding behind me 
was sure glad I had them.

Ted Durant
Milwaukee, WI USA 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Johnny Alien]

I mean...if I had to deal with goose poop I would bring the fenders back 
quickly.

On Wednesday, June 7, 2023 at 10:10:11 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> I find a use for them nearly every ride - there is always some puddle or a 
> bunch of goose poop that makes me thank my lucky stars for fenders. I rode 
> a club ride last night and was sprayed by the woman riding in front of me 
> because of course she had no fenders. I envied the woman behind me, who was 
> surely spared by MY fenders.
>
> On Jun 7, 2023, at 8:17 AM, Johnny Alien  wrote:
>
> I used to always fender my bikes because I liked the looks but then 
> realized that I was never in any conditions where they were needed from a 
> practical sense so I changed my mind and now never use them.
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 11:04:25 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> I need to try the Clem out on gravel; in fact, I need to find some 
>> gravel. Our bike club has a Ride Our Routes collection that I will look 
>> into. But I also need new tires, regardless. These are pretty worn from 
>> being my one and only bike that got tons of covid miles. 
>>
>> On Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 1:32:07 PM UTC-4 Slin wrote:
>>
>>> @Leah - Have you tried taking the Clem out on gravel rides, as-is? I've 
>>> also got a Clem and Platy, so I'm curious to hear how you experience them 
>>> differently on the same trails. 
>>>
>>> S
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Saturday, June 3, 2023 at 1:15:22 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>> I love pavement. But I’ve been on two gravel rides in the last month and 
 I rode a Platy either time and it wasn’t my favorite for that bike. But, I 
 have my old 2019 52 cm Clem L, and it doesn’t have a dedicated purpose 
 right now and shouldn’t that be the bike for rough and tough stuff like 
 gravel? Also, my Platys are prisses. 

 BUT. I’m not good at gravel. I have no idea what the kids are doing 
 these days. I have questions, and you have answers.

 1. Can I keep my VO wavy fenders on a gravel bike? Here’s what I have, 
 and they say up to 50 mm tire will fit:[image: IMG_5029.jpeg]

>>> 2. Slick or knobby? I can’t even get a straight answer on this. Which is 
 better? If it matters about the rider, this will be for a rider with a 
 healthy fear of crashing.

 3. How wide? I have 42s on my bikes now and I don’t feel like they are 
 wide enough. 

 4. Tubeless or no? These wheels are tubeless-compatible but I put a 
 tube in them because I wasn’t riding enough to keep the sealant 
 circulating. But that can be changed right quick.

 Here is my Clem in its current configuration, and yes, I know the 
 Backabikes gotta go. 

 [image: IMG_1812.jpeg]
 Thanks for your help!
 Leah 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Leah Peterson]

I find a use for them nearly every ride - there is always some puddle or a bunch of goose poop that makes me thank my lucky stars for fenders. I rode a club ride last night and was sprayed by the woman riding in front of me because of course she had no fenders. I envied the woman behind me, who was surely spared by MY fenders.On Jun 7, 2023, at 8:17 AM, Johnny Alien  wrote:I used to always fender my bikes because I liked the looks but then realized that I was never in any conditions where they were needed from a practical sense so I changed my mind and now never use them.On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 11:04:25 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:I need to try the Clem out on gravel; in fact, I need to find some gravel. Our bike club has a Ride Our Routes collection that I will look into. But I also need new tires, regardless. These are pretty worn from being my one and only bike that got tons of covid miles. On Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 1:32:07 PM UTC-4 Slin wrote:@Leah - Have you tried taking the Clem out on gravel rides, as-is?  I've also got a Clem and Platy, so I'm curious to hear how you experience them differently on the same trails. SOn Saturday, June 3, 2023 at 1:15:22 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:I love pavement. But I’ve been on two gravel rides in the last month and I rode a Platy either time and it wasn’t my favorite for that bike. But, I have my old 2019 52 cm Clem L, and it doesn’t have a dedicated purpose right now and shouldn’t that be the bike for rough and tough stuff like gravel? Also, my Platys are prisses. BUT. I’m not good at gravel. I have no idea what the kids are doing these days. I have questions, and you have answers.1. Can I keep my VO wavy fenders on a gravel bike? Here’s what I have, and they say up to 50 mm tire will fit:2. Slick or knobby? I can’t even get a straight answer on this. Which is better? If it matters about the rider, this will be for a rider with a healthy fear of crashing.3. How wide? I have 42s on my bikes now and I don’t feel like they are wide enough. 4. Tubeless or no? These wheels are tubeless-compatible but I put a tube in them because I wasn’t riding enough to keep the sealant circulating. But that can be changed right quick.Here is my Clem in its current configuration, and yes, I know the Backabikes gotta go. Thanks for your help!Leah 



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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Steve]

Words of Wisdom:
 "...don't overthink it too much. Just start riding and call it good!"

Well said Josiah!

On Monday, June 5, 2023 at 1:16:28 PM UTC-4 Josiah Anderson wrote:

> As a counterpoint to Jim and Brendon, I think supple tires are well worth 
> the money (and that's coming from a usually-broke college student), and you 
> do NOT need super heavy duty tires for gravel roads. I've run René Herse 
> tires for years and years, and Grand Bois before that, which were very 
> similar. I have almost always worn out the tread before they die of 
> sidewall cuts, and back when I logged mileage it would take 5-6k miles to 
> wear out a Babyshoe Pass Extralight (42-584).
>
> Despite the quoted claim from the Riv website, there is a very significant 
> difference in ride quality and speed between René Herse tires and heavier 
> belted ones. If you are running the heavier tires at high enough pressure 
> that it doesn't feel like you're riding through molasses (which is because 
> of the friction losses in the thick tire flexing), then they will be a 
> harsher ride. More supple tires don't lose speed at lower pressures, 
> because it takes almost no energy to flex the casing, so they are both more 
> comfortable and faster. 
>
> My tire recommendation would be to run whatever tires you have until they 
> wear out, and then get the widest René Herse tires that will fit your Clem. 
> Yes they are very expensive, but if you can afford them it's absolutely 
> worth trying them at least once. I don't think they're essential for 
> "gravel" riding, although they're certainly very nice. I'm mostly writing 
> this to say that you don't need to go out and buy super heavy duty 
> mainstream "gravel" or "touring" tires.
>
> I hope the gravel riding goes well! It's something I've enjoyed for a long 
> time, and to echo others' comments, don't overthink it too much. Just start 
> riding and call it good!
>
> Josiah Anderson
> usually in Missoula, MT
>
> Le lun. 5 juin 2023 à 09:38, J J  a écrit :
>
>> Leah, I believe that unless you anticipate doing a ton of competitive 
>> riding in super wet and super muddy conditions, your tire choice doesn't 
>> matter too much. 
>>
>> It's impossible to objectively assess real or perceived benefits of one 
>> tire over another, or one manufacturer over another, in real-world 
>> conditions. There are too many other variables. 
>>
>> Our subjective impressions are important, but preferences, comfort level, 
>> and riding style are very personal. You should take my suggestions about 
>> what works for me with a grain of salt. 
>>
>> Also, "gravel" means different things in different contexts.
>>
>> My take: 
>>
>>- If you intend to ride *frequently and aggressively* in super muddy 
>>and wet conditions, get big aggressive knobbies. The specific tire or 
>>manufacturer does not matter all that much, other than price and 
>>appearances, both of which can vary tremendously. 
>>- If the riding will be *mostly dry gravel* and on pavement, get 
>>tires with smaller, less aggressive knobs, or simply stick with wide 
>>"touring" tires, or whatever you might already have handy. 
>>- For the most comfort, get the biggest tires you can fit.
>>
>> I ride slicks or touring tires on gravel all the time. When I've 
>> occasionally encountered muddy segments, I very cautiously ride through. If 
>> the tires spin or slide, or if it looks or starts to feel too sketchy, I 
>> dismount, walk, and push the bike through. No biggie. 
>>
>> I have SKS plastic fenders (with quick releases that have saved my butt) 
>> on all my bikes. I haven't noticed any excessive clanking. I figure it's 
>> better for rocks to hit my fenders than it is for them to slam into my 
>> frames, anyway.
>>
>> As Brendon mentioned, Panaracer manufactures tires for multiple brands. For 
>> a given category of tire, the various treads, compounds, and casing 
>> structures are similar no matter the brand.
>>
>> Branding and marketing are powerful, though, as Grant/Rivendell has been 
>> inculcating forever. Every company claims their tires are the best for this 
>> or that purpose and will give you a competitive edge. I'm skeptical about 
>> such claims *for most riding*. (Tires for extreme situations or 
>> competitive riding or racing are another matter.) 
>>
>> I attached here a section from Riv's website 
>>  about tire ride 
>> quality fyi.
>>
>> I ran tires from various boutique brands (as Brendon called them) for a 
>> couple of years. I'm done with that expensive, longterm experiment. Too 
>> many sidewall cuts, blowouts, and problems. I'm back to trusty, robust 
>> Schwalbe Marathons. Incidentally, these days Schwalbe is producing some 
>> great looking "transparent skin" (tan) tires with reflective strips across 
>> their numerous lines.
>>
>> Finally, I ride with tubes. I like to minimize hassles and keep things 
>> simple wherever I

Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Tom Palmer]

Hi Leah,
Just to pile on a little more- I agree on removing the racks and extra 
weight and getting the biggest tires that fit. Schwalbe Thunder Burts are 
my go to for dirt roads and they ride well on the road too. I already 
shared  with you privately that I think the Platypus is a tremendous dirt 
road bike if you can let it get dirty. 
The big tires will help you overcome the gravel/dirt anxiety if you still 
have it.
Tom Palmer
Twin Lake, MI 
On Monday, June 5, 2023 at 8:00:54 AM UTC-4 Garth wrote:

> All I can add is take along a spare tube or preferably two so "if" a tube 
> goes wonky it's a relatively quick swap out of tubes. Fold up the former 
> tube, squeezing the air out of it, put it in your bag and fix it at home at 
> a leisurely pace. I buy rubber cement in the reusable cans sold at 
> WallyWorld and/or any auto parts store. The can have an applicator built-in 
> to the lid and the can lasts indefinitely given the lid is screwed back on. 
> I used to repair tubes in the field but after running into some patches 
> that had were stuck to the plastic, not to mention countless silly little 
> tubes of glue that dry out unless used relatively quickly, I decided to 
> just take 2 tubes with me and a patch kit as a last resort and run over a 
> mine field or something, which of course the tires would be last thing to 
> worry about ! I've never needed any of it though, as successful no-drama 
> riding is normal.
>
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Garth]

All I can add is take along a spare tube or preferably two so "if" a tube 
goes wonky it's a relatively quick swap out of tubes. Fold up the former 
tube, squeezing the air out of it, put it in your bag and fix it at home at 
a leisurely pace. I buy rubber cement in the reusable cans sold at 
WallyWorld and/or any auto parts store. The can have an applicator built-in 
to the lid and the can lasts indefinitely given the lid is screwed back on. 
I used to repair tubes in the field but after running into some patches 
that had were stuck to the plastic, not to mention countless silly little 
tubes of glue that dry out unless used relatively quickly, I decided to 
just take 2 tubes with me and a patch kit as a last resort and run over a 
mine field or something, which of course the tires would be last thing to 
worry about ! I've never needed any of it though, as successful no-drama 
riding is normal.



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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[brendonoid]

Things have been covered in great detail really not much to add other than 
a +1 vote for Soma Cazaderos. Bit of a knob, solid centre line and rolls a 
bit nicer than gravelkings. All the boutique tyre brands are made by 
Panaracer anyway so let healthy scepticism lead your decision making.
Fenders keep the rocks off your paintwork but can lead to serious life 
changing accidents off-road if you don't have quick release stays.

CONTROVERSIAL TAKE: Unless you get a puncture every other ride tubeless is 
a scam.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Patrick Moore]

On Sun, Jun 4, 2023 at 12:50 PM Ted Durant  wrote:

> 1. Can I keep my VO wavy fenders on a gravel bike?
>
>
>  Yes,  but do you really want to? They'll limit your tire choice and it'll
> sound like you're shaking a soda (pop) can (let's please not pollute the
> thread with that discussion) full of rocks all ride long. As others have
> graphically shown, if it's muddy, you'll just pack the mudguards full of
> mud. That said, I run fenders on my Breadwinner, because most of my riding
> is on pavement and, until recently, the roads were frequently wet. If was
> planning a longer off-road ride, I'd ditch the fenders.
>

I keep fenders on my dirt road bikes, full on the Matthews, clip-on on the
Monocog, since the fenders do help (greatly for the fulls, at least
slightly for the clip-ons) keep the dust off me and the bike; our local
very fine sand is thrown up in clouds of very fine dust. Hardly any mud
here in the high desert, of course, and slick tires on the Matthews and
very high clearances on the Monocog. (Actually, one reason I got the
Monocog was to have a "snow bike" for the 1 day every 2 years with
sufficient snow accumulation to allow a bosque snow ride. Yes, the last
time the snow did pack up the Monocog wheels -- and rd and cassette and
chain.)


> 2. Slick or knobby? I can’t even get a straight answer on this. Which is
> better? If it matters about the rider, this will be for a rider with a
> healthy fear of crashing.
>
>
> Part of this comes down to what you mean by "gravel". Tread only starts to
> make a difference when you're in soft stuff, where the edges of the knobs
> can bite into something to provide more acceleration/deceleration/cornering
> force. When you take a turn on gravel you're going to have much less
> traction than on pavement, regardless of the tires. Those pesky little
> gravel bits are easy to shove aside, and hooking the edge of a knob on them
> just shoves them harder.
>

Jan goes into this often and deeply to prove that knobs don't really help
in gravel. They do in sand, but I prefer treadless for fast pavement riding
and I'll slow in offroad corners.


> 3. How wide? I have 42s on my bikes now and I don’t feel like they are
> wide enough.
>
>
> Again, this may be a function of what type of "gravel" you're on. For the
> crushed limestone trails of Wisconsin at reasonable speeds, 42 is plenty.
> If you get into softer, sandy trails, though, or you love to fly through
> hairpin turns, bigger is always better. I ride 48s on my Breadwinner and
> never feel like I have "too much tire" under me.  Unlike knobs, wider tires
> provide a genuine cornering advantage on loose surfaces, as they spread the
> force across lots more of those pesky little gravel bits, putting less
> force on each bit.
>

This does indeed depend on the type and depth of sand. I've found that for
deep and silty sand, 50 mm is *my* minimum for relatively easy pedaling in
the deeper bits (up to 3" with some work or low gears), but 60 mm is very
noticeably better, and 72 mm just floats compared even to 60 mm. ~22/18/13
psi for each width. But for firm dirt and gravel, I'd be happy with 44s,
but I'm bigger than Leah.


> 4. Tubeless or no? These wheels are tubeless-compatible but I put a tube
> in them because I wasn’t riding enough to keep the sealant circulating. But
> that can be changed right quick.
>
>
> I don't think gravel vs pavement enters into that decision, unless by
> "gravel" you mean bouncing over baby heads at high speed. One of the big
> benefits is eliminating pinch flats, which generally result from hitting
> fairly large chunks of something at low pressure. But you can do that in a
> Wisconsin pot hole on pavement, too. I'm running tubeless on my
> Breadwinner, but I'm not convinced it's an improvement, especially if
> you're not riding the bike frequently. I'm careful about storing my bike,
> but I still get sealant drying in the valve stems, which makes it very hard
> to put in air.
>

IMO, sealant isn't worth the hassle and mess unless you contend with
goatheads or other very common puncture agents, or if you suffer from pinch
flats with tubes. Me, if I had to patch no more than 1 flat per ~75 miles
I'd just buy more Remas.


> Tires: what an embarrassment of riches we have today, compared to even 10
> years ago.
>

Amen.

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[J. Laing Conley, PE, LEED AP]

1. Remove bags and fenders.
2. Install Rene Herse 27.5 x 2.2 Umtanum Ridge tires with Endurance casings 
with tubes.
3. Ride.

Fenders and off-pavement do not play well together in my way of thinking. If 
you insist on fenders, use non-knobby tires (27.5 x 48 Switchback Hills with 
Endurance casing or 650B x 50 Big Bens) instead of knobbies.

Laing
Who drank the “Compass” Kool Aid before it became Rene Herse Kool Aid, but 
never tried the tubeless stuff.


Sent from my iPhone

J. Laing Conley, PE, LEED AP
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
E lcon...@brph.com | 
T 561-226-8873 | 
C 321-205-7420
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33432 | 
AR95381
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On Jun 4, 2023, at 1:32 PM, Slin  wrote:


@Leah - Have you tried taking the Clem out on gravel rides, as-is? I've also 
got a Clem and Platy, so I'm curious to hear how you experience them 
differently on the same trails.

S



On Saturday, June 3, 2023 at 1:15:22 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:
I love pavement. But I’ve been on two gravel rides in the last month and I rode 
a Platy either time and it wasn’t my favorite for that bike. But, I have my old 
2019 52 cm Clem L, and it doesn’t have a dedicated purpose right now and 
shouldn’t that be the bike for rough and tough stuff like gravel? Also, my 
Platys are prisses.

BUT. I’m not good at gravel. I have no idea what the kids are doing these days. 
I have questions, and you have answers.

1. Can I keep my VO wavy fenders on a gravel bike? Here’s what I have, and they 
say up to 50 mm tire will fit:[IMG_5029.jpeg]
2. Slick or knobby? I can’t even get a straight answer on this. Which is 
better? If it matters about the rider, this will be for a rider with a healthy 
fear of crashing.

3. How wide? I have 42s on my bikes now and I don’t feel like they are wide 
enough.

4. Tubeless or no? These wheels are tubeless-compatible but I put a tube in 
them because I wasn’t riding enough to keep the sealant circulating. But that 
can be changed right quick.

Here is my Clem in its current configuration, and yes, I know the Backabikes 
gotta go.

[IMG_1812.jpeg]
Thanks for your help!
Leah

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Richard Rose]

I was thinking the exact same thing. Story; I was running Gravelking SS  27.5 x 1.9” on the Clem set up tubeless. I did not realize these were considered “supple” tires - not unlike Ultradynamico tires. I experienced a tire rupture - the casing kind of “blew up” from the inside, resulting in a huge bubble on the outside. So I was talking to Ultradynamico about this and their tires. Surprisingly they steered me away from their tires, suggesting my riding might not be suited to their very supple tires. BTW, I weigh 170lbs. In any event I chose to replace the GK tires with the Simworks Homage & used tubes. I find these tires to still be very supple & so far very durable with tubes. They are as quiet on pavement as RH knobbies I had on another bike. My gravel riding is not on really chunky stuff. On the smallish gravel and smooth dirt roads I ride almost daily the subtle tread pattern on the Homage has been perfect. I guess my suggestion here is that ultra supple tires might not be the most durable?Sent from my iPhoneOn Jun 4, 2023, at 9:58 AM, Brian Turner  wrote:Leah, have you enjoyed your Ultradynamico Cava tires on your Platy? They just released a 27.5 x 2.2 version of the Cava that might be worth looking into for your Clem. Should give you much of the same ride quality but in a fatter, cushier package for gravel.On Jun 4, 2023, at 7:55 AM, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding!  wrote:Wow, I have read these responses 3 times through. Lots of suggestions and information here, and I thank you. I had initially thought gravel riding required knobbies but it appears that is untrue - you can run slicks. I don’t like the idea of knobbies throwing rocks, so I’m heading away from that option. I think I will look for 48 or 50 mm tires, since that’s what the fenders can handle. I will never ride through mud. I’m not going all hard-core over here! Undecided on tubeless, still. The Clem doesn’t get a lot of miles, but I also have never fixed a flat and would like to avoid that…I have to figure out which brand of tire to actually order. Which is going to be quite the task, I think. I had no idea there was this much variety. I was rather hoping it would be “Oh, you want to ride some gravel? These tires are the gold standard. Everyone loves these.”If you have more to say, I’m still listening over here!LeahOn Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 7:30:36 AM UTC-4 brok...@gmail.com wrote:Gravel is my favorite surface to ride on, and I would probably be content to ride exclusively on it, if I lived in an area with an extensive network of gravel roads. This is also one reason why I love riding rail trails so much, because so many of them consist of sone type of crushed gravel.My current favorite gravel tires are the RH knobbies, and I like fatter tires, so I’m running Juniper Ridge 48s. The amount of grip and low rolling resistance are a perfect combo for me. I am getting ready to experiment with some RH gravel slicks I picked up from a fellow RBWOB user. I would probably only run fenders in combination with smoother gravel tires due to the tendency for knobbies to pick up more debris and potentially suck stuff up into the fenders.As a matter of personal aesthetics, I think the hillibikes and long chainstay models look best with fatter tires to help fill in those big gaps in the frame. I think you could do really well with some 48s + fenders on your Clem, or go with some even bigger gravel knobbies in a 2” or 2.3”. Lots of great fat tire gravel options out there.On Jun 4, 2023, at 3:23 AM, Joe Bernard  wrote:I'm Team Knobbies but I don't know anything, including what y'all mean when you say a surface is gravel. I put something called Compass (Rene Herse) Pumpkin Ridges on recently and went riding on dirt and small rocks, it was fun. I didn't even crash! On Saturday, June 3, 2023 at 1:15:22 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:I love pavement. But I’ve been on two gravel rides in the last month and I rode a Platy either time and it wasn’t my favorite for that bike. But, I have my old 2019 52 cm Clem L, and it doesn’t have a dedicated purpose right now and shouldn’t that be the bike for rough and tough stuff like gravel? Also, my Platys are prisses. BUT. I’m not good at gravel. I have no idea what the kids are doing these days. I have questions, and you have answers.1. Can I keep my VO wavy fenders on a gravel bike? Here’s what I have, and they say up to 50 mm tire will fit:2. Slick or knobby? I can’t even get a straight answer on this. Which is better? If it matters about the rider, this will be for a rider with a healthy fear of crashing.3. How wide? I have 42s on my bikes now and I don’t feel like they are wide enough. 4. Tubeless or no? These wheels are tubeless-compatible but I put a tube in them because I wasn’t riding enough to keep the sealant circulating. But that can be changed right quick.Here is my Clem in its current configuration, and yes, I know the Backabikes gotta go. Thanks for your help!Leah 



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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Brian Turner]

Leah, have you enjoyed your Ultradynamico Cava tires on your Platy? They just released a 27.5 x 2.2 version of the Cava that might be worth looking into for your Clem. Should give you much of the same ride quality but in a fatter, cushier package for gravel.On Jun 4, 2023, at 7:55 AM, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding!  wrote:Wow, I have read these responses 3 times through. Lots of suggestions and information here, and I thank you. I had initially thought gravel riding required knobbies but it appears that is untrue - you can run slicks. I don’t like the idea of knobbies throwing rocks, so I’m heading away from that option. I think I will look for 48 or 50 mm tires, since that’s what the fenders can handle. I will never ride through mud. I’m not going all hard-core over here! Undecided on tubeless, still. The Clem doesn’t get a lot of miles, but I also have never fixed a flat and would like to avoid that…I have to figure out which brand of tire to actually order. Which is going to be quite the task, I think. I had no idea there was this much variety. I was rather hoping it would be “Oh, you want to ride some gravel? These tires are the gold standard. Everyone loves these.”If you have more to say, I’m still listening over here!LeahOn Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 7:30:36 AM UTC-4 brok...@gmail.com wrote:Gravel is my favorite surface to ride on, and I would probably be content to ride exclusively on it, if I lived in an area with an extensive network of gravel roads. This is also one reason why I love riding rail trails so much, because so many of them consist of sone type of crushed gravel.My current favorite gravel tires are the RH knobbies, and I like fatter tires, so I’m running Juniper Ridge 48s. The amount of grip and low rolling resistance are a perfect combo for me. I am getting ready to experiment with some RH gravel slicks I picked up from a fellow RBWOB user. I would probably only run fenders in combination with smoother gravel tires due to the tendency for knobbies to pick up more debris and potentially suck stuff up into the fenders.As a matter of personal aesthetics, I think the hillibikes and long chainstay models look best with fatter tires to help fill in those big gaps in the frame. I think you could do really well with some 48s + fenders on your Clem, or go with some even bigger gravel knobbies in a 2” or 2.3”. Lots of great fat tire gravel options out there.On Jun 4, 2023, at 3:23 AM, Joe Bernard  wrote:I'm Team Knobbies but I don't know anything, including what y'all mean when you say a surface is gravel. I put something called Compass (Rene Herse) Pumpkin Ridges on recently and went riding on dirt and small rocks, it was fun. I didn't even crash! On Saturday, June 3, 2023 at 1:15:22 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:I love pavement. But I’ve been on two gravel rides in the last month and I rode a Platy either time and it wasn’t my favorite for that bike. But, I have my old 2019 52 cm Clem L, and it doesn’t have a dedicated purpose right now and shouldn’t that be the bike for rough and tough stuff like gravel? Also, my Platys are prisses. BUT. I’m not good at gravel. I have no idea what the kids are doing these days. I have questions, and you have answers.1. Can I keep my VO wavy fenders on a gravel bike? Here’s what I have, and they say up to 50 mm tire will fit:2. Slick or knobby? I can’t even get a straight answer on this. Which is better? If it matters about the rider, this will be for a rider with a healthy fear of crashing.3. How wide? I have 42s on my bikes now and I don’t feel like they are wide enough. 4. Tubeless or no? These wheels are tubeless-compatible but I put a tube in them because I wasn’t riding enough to keep the sealant circulating. But that can be changed right quick.Here is my Clem in its current configuration, and yes, I know the Backabikes gotta go. Thanks for your help!Leah 



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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Bicycle Belle Ding Ding!]

Wow, I have read these responses 3 times through. Lots of suggestions and 
information here, and I thank you. I had initially thought gravel riding 
required knobbies but it appears that is untrue - you can run slicks. I 
don’t like the idea of knobbies throwing rocks, so I’m heading away from 
that option. I think I will look for 48 or 50 mm tires, since that’s what 
the fenders can handle. I will never ride through mud. I’m not going all 
hard-core over here! Undecided on tubeless, still. The Clem doesn’t get a 
lot of miles, but I also have never fixed a flat and would like to avoid 
that…

I have to figure out which brand of tire to actually order. Which is going 
to be quite the task, I think. I had no idea there was this much variety. I 
was rather hoping it would be “Oh, you want to ride some gravel? These 
tires are the gold standard. Everyone loves these.”

If you have more to say, I’m still listening over here!
Leah

On Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 7:30:36 AM UTC-4 brok...@gmail.com wrote:

> Gravel is my favorite surface to ride on, and I would probably be content 
> to ride exclusively on it, if I lived in an area with an extensive network 
> of gravel roads. This is also one reason why I love riding rail trails so 
> much, because so many of them consist of sone type of crushed gravel.
>
> My current favorite gravel tires are the RH knobbies, and I like fatter 
> tires, so I’m running Juniper Ridge 48s. The amount of grip and low rolling 
> resistance are a perfect combo for me. I am getting ready to experiment 
> with some RH gravel slicks I picked up from a fellow RBWOB user. I would 
> probably only run fenders in combination with smoother gravel tires due to 
> the tendency for knobbies to pick up more debris and potentially suck stuff 
> up into the fenders.
>
> As a matter of personal aesthetics, I think the hillibikes and long 
> chainstay models look best with fatter tires to help fill in those big gaps 
> in the frame. I think you could do really well with some 48s + fenders on 
> your Clem, or go with some even bigger gravel knobbies in a 2” or 2.3”. 
> Lots of great fat tire gravel options out there.
>
> On Jun 4, 2023, at 3:23 AM, Joe Bernard  wrote:
>
> I'm Team Knobbies but I don't know anything, including what y'all mean 
> when you say a surface is gravel. I put something called Compass (Rene 
> Herse) Pumpkin Ridges on recently and went riding on dirt and small rocks, 
> it was fun. I didn't even crash! 
>
>
>
> On Saturday, June 3, 2023 at 1:15:22 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> I love pavement. But I’ve been on two gravel rides in the last month and 
>> I rode a Platy either time and it wasn’t my favorite for that bike. But, I 
>> have my old 2019 52 cm Clem L, and it doesn’t have a dedicated purpose 
>> right now and shouldn’t that be the bike for rough and tough stuff like 
>> gravel? Also, my Platys are prisses. 
>>
>> BUT. I’m not good at gravel. I have no idea what the kids are doing these 
>> days. I have questions, and you have answers.
>>
>> 1. Can I keep my VO wavy fenders on a gravel bike? Here’s what I have, 
>> and they say up to 50 mm tire will fit:[image: IMG_5029.jpeg]
>> 2. Slick or knobby? I can’t even get a straight answer on this. Which is 
>> better? If it matters about the rider, this will be for a rider with a 
>> healthy fear of crashing.
>>
>> 3. How wide? I have 42s on my bikes now and I don’t feel like they are 
>> wide enough. 
>>
>> 4. Tubeless or no? These wheels are tubeless-compatible but I put a tube 
>> in them because I wasn’t riding enough to keep the sealant circulating. But 
>> that can be changed right quick.
>>
>> Here is my Clem in its current configuration, and yes, I know the 
>> Backabikes gotta go. 
>>
>> [image: IMG_1812.jpeg]
>> Thanks for your help!
>> Leah 
>>
> -- 
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> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Brian Turner]

Gravel is my favorite surface to ride on, and I would probably be content to ride exclusively on it, if I lived in an area with an extensive network of gravel roads. This is also one reason why I love riding rail trails so much, because so many of them consist of sone type of crushed gravel.My current favorite gravel tires are the RH knobbies, and I like fatter tires, so I’m running Juniper Ridge 48s. The amount of grip and low rolling resistance are a perfect combo for me. I am getting ready to experiment with some RH gravel slicks I picked up from a fellow RBWOB user. I would probably only run fenders in combination with smoother gravel tires due to the tendency for knobbies to pick up more debris and potentially suck stuff up into the fenders.As a matter of personal aesthetics, I think the hillibikes and long chainstay models look best with fatter tires to help fill in those big gaps in the frame. I think you could do really well with some 48s + fenders on your Clem, or go with some even bigger gravel knobbies in a 2” or 2.3”. Lots of great fat tire gravel options out there.On Jun 4, 2023, at 3:23 AM, Joe Bernard  wrote:I'm Team Knobbies but I don't know anything, including what y'all mean when you say a surface is gravel. I put something called Compass (Rene Herse) Pumpkin Ridges on recently and went riding on dirt and small rocks, it was fun. I didn't even crash! On Saturday, June 3, 2023 at 1:15:22 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:I love pavement. But I’ve been on two gravel rides in the last month and I rode a Platy either time and it wasn’t my favorite for that bike. But, I have my old 2019 52 cm Clem L, and it doesn’t have a dedicated purpose right now and shouldn’t that be the bike for rough and tough stuff like gravel? Also, my Platys are prisses. BUT. I’m not good at gravel. I have no idea what the kids are doing these days. I have questions, and you have answers.1. Can I keep my VO wavy fenders on a gravel bike? Here’s what I have, and they say up to 50 mm tire will fit:2. Slick or knobby? I can’t even get a straight answer on this. Which is better? If it matters about the rider, this will be for a rider with a healthy fear of crashing.3. How wide? I have 42s on my bikes now and I don’t feel like they are wide enough. 4. Tubeless or no? These wheels are tubeless-compatible but I put a tube in them because I wasn’t riding enough to keep the sealant circulating. But that can be changed right quick.Here is my Clem in its current configuration, and yes, I know the Backabikes gotta go. Thanks for your help!Leah 



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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Max Faingezicht]

I highly recommend Thunderburts for gravel - I use them (2.1”) on my hunqa tubeless and with tubes on the Atlantis.Great tire, fast and quiet on the road, knobby for the trails. Best of both worldsMaxOn Jun 3, 2023, at 9:17 PM, Richard Rose  wrote:I love my Clem L 52 on gravel! My favorite tire so far has been the Simworks Homage in 27.5” x 55. I had and liked Gravelking SS which were very nice set up tubeless but were too fragile resulting in a large percentage of the bike being covered in the muck. I am quite happy now running tubes with the Homage tires. It’s a great all around tire, reasonably quiet on pavement & grippy enough for mild singletrack. It’s a true 55mm tire on Cliffhangers so not sure about the fenders. I sure there are faster options but comfort is outstanding & more important to me than speed.Sent from my iPhoneOn Jun 3, 2023, at 8:51 PM, Nick A.  wrote:I ran the Soma Cazadero 700c/50mm last winter/spring and loved them. I see Soma also makes 650x50. Might be worth looking into, especially if you're concerned about the cornering. As for the fenders, I'd just see if they can fit the tires you want, and bail on 'em if they won't fit. On Saturday, June 3, 2023 at 7:45:36 PM UTC-4 Nick Payne wrote:Mudguards are OK until you encounter mud :-), and then they jam up. On this ride I was having to stop every five or ten minutes to clear the mud out from between the tyre and mudguard, as it was making forward motion more and more difficult. OTOH, I stayed relatively clean, whereas the friend I was riding with, who wasn't running mudguards, wound up with about an inch thickness of mud caked over his legs and back.Nick Payne



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Re: [RBW] Re: Let’s say I made my Clem into a “gravel bike”

[Richard Rose]

I love my Clem L 52 on gravel! My favorite tire so far has been the Simworks Homage in 27.5” x 55. I had and liked Gravelking SS which were very nice set up tubeless but were too fragile resulting in a large percentage of the bike being covered in the muck. I am quite happy now running tubes with the Homage tires. It’s a great all around tire, reasonably quiet on pavement & grippy enough for mild singletrack. It’s a true 55mm tire on Cliffhangers so not sure about the fenders. I sure there are faster options but comfort is outstanding & more important to me than speed.Sent from my iPhoneOn Jun 3, 2023, at 8:51 PM, Nick A.  wrote:I ran the Soma Cazadero 700c/50mm last winter/spring and loved them. I see Soma also makes 650x50. Might be worth looking into, especially if you're concerned about the cornering. As for the fenders, I'd just see if they can fit the tires you want, and bail on 'em if they won't fit. On Saturday, June 3, 2023 at 7:45:36 PM UTC-4 Nick Payne wrote:Mudguards are OK until you encounter mud :-), and then they jam up. On this ride I was having to stop every five or ten minutes to clear the mud out from between the tyre and mudguard, as it was making forward motion more and more difficult. OTOH, I stayed relatively clean, whereas the friend I was riding with, who wasn't running mudguards, wound up with about an inch thickness of mud caked over his legs and back.Nick Payne



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