Re: [RE-wrenches] Assembly Protects Conductors?

2014-08-23 Thread Mark Frye
Ray, I can't follow you all the way down that path. Is an insulated wire conductor permitted to be use at 100% of it's rating under continuous operation? No. The ampacity is reduced and the conductor must be up-sized. Hence, for a defined load (Isc * 1.25), under continious operation, the

Re: [RE-wrenches] Assembly Protects Conductors?

2014-08-23 Thread jay peltz
HI Mark, Ive been having this discussion with some others. 690.9B I think means that the 2nd 125% is for breaker derating. I have looked and can't find anywhere in the code about conductors being derated for continuous use. Other deratings yes, temp, conduit etc etc. But there are many

Re: [RE-wrenches] Assembly Protects Conductors?

2014-08-23 Thread Ray Walters
The 100% exception is listed in 2 places: 690.8(B)(1) which sizes the conductor, and 690.9(B) which sizes the OCD. Article 210 doesn't apply, as that is for branch circuits, not PV source circuits. 690.8 basically walks you through conductor sizing. 690.8(B) requires 2 calculations one for

Re: [RE-wrenches] Assembly Protects Conductors?

2014-08-23 Thread Mark Frye
Wow. OK Ray. This issue of 100% rated under continious use is interesting. Thanks for helping me get my head around it. The exception in 210.19 is certainly explicit. Too bad, for this one man, the exception in 690.8 is less so. Mark On 8/23/2014 10:35 AM, Ray Walters wrote: The 100%

[RE-wrenches] Assembly Protects Conductors?

2014-08-22 Thread markf
Folks, In looking at a circuit breaker based re-combiner for the first time, I am now pondering the meaning of the Exception below: NEC 2014 690.8 (B) Conductor Ampacity. PV system currents shall be considered to be continuous. Circuit conductors shall be sized to carry not less than the larger

Re: [RE-wrenches] Assembly Protects Conductors?

2014-08-22 Thread markf
Thanks Chris, It's one of those great things about the solar industry that there is always more stuff going on than one man can keep track of: http://www.bentek.com/solar-products/recombiners/circuit-breaker/ Mark, The term recombiner to me is an electrical panel used on the AC output of

Re: [RE-wrenches] Assembly Protects Conductors?

2014-08-22 Thread Ray Walters
Most combiner boxes, DC rated breakers, and DC rated fuses and fuse holders we use today, qualify as assemblies for the 100% exception (Outback, Midnite, etc.) so you only have to size the OCP by 125% of short circuit current rating for edge of cloud effects. Since the conductor is sized

Re: [RE-wrenches] Assembly Protects Conductors?

2014-08-22 Thread Brian Teitelbaum
of the fuse rating or the fuse holder rating though. Brian Teitelbaum AEE Solar -Original Message- From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Ray Walters Sent: Friday, August 22, 2014 6:14 PM To: RE-wrenches Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Assembly Protects