Re: [Rosegarden-user] beginners question : getting sound
If you're just looking to make examples of non-standard tunings, csound is probably your most direct route. While csound's learning curve is genarally alarmingly precipitous, in this instance it might be what you're looking for. On Tue, Feb 9, 2021, 10:18 AM Tom Peters wrote: > On 09-02-2021 05:46, Ted Felix wrote: > > On 2/8/21 10:19 PM, david wrote: > >> Also, what's a "sensible default" vs something that someone else might > >> consider a headache or bloatware? > > > >Heh. Yeah. VMPK just added a built-in synth. That caused me a > > bunch of head scratching since it broke my setup. Had to dig through > > the menus to get it working again. You can't keep the beginners and the > > pros happy. > > > >We've got documentation and lots of folks here willing to help. I > > think we're doing it right. > > I agree with Ted on the folks willing to help, but I do find the > documentation lacking. His page > (http://tedfelix.com/linux/linux-midi.html) appears to be what I was > looking for (it does look like some work, so I won't have time to dive > in until the weekend), but all this info appears lacking from the > Rosegarden site itself. A picture of the required software stack like > on Ted's page I think is most helpful (although oddly Rosegarden itself > is not in it). > > Also in this thread opinions differ on what is required or recommended: > JACK? Obsolete with DSSI? DSSI itself obsolete? > Maybe too many hardware combinations and choices to have a "sensible > default", but then an installation wizzard like someone suggested would > be a valuable addition. And I do maintain that since almost every > compter has a sound card and speakers, which are known to the kernel and > detectable, getting sound out of them should be automagic. > > Traditionally Unix has been a bag of components and a bag of tools and > users have had to build their own custom hotrod. But frankly, I've been > there, done that, got the T-shirt (really I do - from the trade shows in > the late 1990's): what I want these days is get things done. I want to > go from A to B and don't care about the colour of the car or think about > if I need spiked tyres along the way. That's why I asked whether > Rosegarden is the proper tool for what I am trying to make (sound > samples to illustrate music theory). Since I am looking for a program > that can generate notes in Pythagorean tuning which is hardly standard, > I suppose I need something fancy like Rosegarden so I will make the > effort. But I foresee that I will come back with questions on how to get > a non-standard tuning. > > Maybe if I figure things out I will see what I can contribute to the > documentation. > -- > Tom > > > ___ > Rosegarden-user mailing list > Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user > ___ Rosegarden-user mailing list Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user
Re: [Rosegarden-user] [OT]: quick and easy music making: a marketer's dream [WAS] Re: beginners question : getting sound
Technically speaking RG does make sound without any coaxing although this point likely won't be well taken by a first time user who just want to hear some sequenced sounds. Part of the problem is the sheer diversity of available instruments. Apart from the go to fluidsynth, most distros have packages for aeolus, bristol, hexter and plenty more. For only slightly more effort linuxsampler is just a compile away. As such there is no single clear path to making notes come out. >From a novice's point of view, it will not be immediately obvious that just hooking up RG to sytem out will be insufficient to hear the sounds they are looking for. To this end, it might be helpful to steer beginners toward using DSSI plugins. That way, at least, connecting RG to system output (which should happen automatically on startup) will make sound come out with a minimum of configging around. Users consulting the examples included with RG won't find a lot of help in this regard. I know my own contributions in this area still reference a SB128 sound card which wont get them very far in the right direction. Perhaps a little sprucing up here would be helpful. I haven't used RG in the fluidcentric way outlined in this thread for quite a while now. My current way of making the sounds come out is to use carla to connect RG to sfz files. Apart from the sfzs themselves, everything I use ships stock with UbuntuStudio. My workflow is as follows: 1) Open studio controls. Make sure the a2j bridge is selected and start jack. 2) Start carla. Drag and drop some sfzs From the file tree on the left onto the main canvas and connect them to system out. 3) Fire up RG. Go to the 'manage midi devices' pop up and add a new device for each sfz to be used, giving each a helpful name. 4) Back in carla, connect the RG instruments the their respective sfzs. 5) In RG, select the appropriate sfz instrument for each track rather than just accepting the default GM device. A similar approach works with sf2 files as well. On Wed, Feb 10, 2021, 8:52 AM Will Godfrey wrote: > On Wed, 10 Feb 2021 07:45:47 -0500 > "D. Michael McIntyre" wrote: > > >But whatever. I hate this topic, and I'm going to duck my head and > >concentrate my attention elsewhere. I just wanted to fire off this rant. > > FWIW, I feel your pain (as someone who fell into software development a > similar > way) > > What doesn't help, is the people who ask for special features to make > something > fit their unique way of working, then when it's supplied never actually > use it! > > -- > Will J Godfrey > http://www.musically.me.uk > http://yoshimi.github.io > Say you have a poem and I have a tune. > Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song. > > > ___ > Rosegarden-user mailing list > Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user > ___ Rosegarden-user mailing list Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user
Re: [Rosegarden-user] [OT]: quick and easy music making: a marketer's dream [WAS] Re: beginners question : getting sound
On Wed, 10 Feb 2021 07:45:47 -0500 "D. Michael McIntyre" wrote: >But whatever. I hate this topic, and I'm going to duck my head and >concentrate my attention elsewhere. I just wanted to fire off this rant. FWIW, I feel your pain (as someone who fell into software development a similar way) What doesn't help, is the people who ask for special features to make something fit their unique way of working, then when it's supplied never actually use it! -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk http://yoshimi.github.io Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song. ___ Rosegarden-user mailing list Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user
Re: [Rosegarden-user] Clear the MRU
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 11:31:56 -0500 Ted Felix wrote: >>> On 1/22/21 3:48 PM, Will Godfrey wrote: When Rosegarden scans the 'recent' list, can it please check the >>> existence of a file, and if it's not there remove it from its list? > > This is now implemented in [r16061]. There's a new preference called >"Clean recent files list" that enables it. > > As mentioned before, your recent files list will be clobbered by this >update. You can restore it by going into your Rosegarden.conf file and >renaming the [General] section to [RecentFiles]. > > Grab the latest svn and try it out. > >Ted. Sorry to be so slow getting back to this... been a bit busy :P Seems fine here. -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk http://yoshimi.github.io Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song. ___ Rosegarden-user mailing list Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user
Re: [Rosegarden-user] Even length staff bars?
On Wed, 10 Feb 2021 15:32:54 +0100 Lorenzo Sutton wrote: > On 10/02/21 14:08, krsg...@trixtar.org wrote: > > On Wed, 10 Feb 2021 11:02:07 +0100 > > Lorenzo Sutton wrote: > > > >> On 10/02/21 01:54, krsg...@trixtar.org wrote: > >>> > >>> Using linear layout the notation editor > >>> allows me to capture screens and to then > >>> reassemble a VERY wide image to scroll in > >>> an animated training/jamming video: > >>> > >>>https://tinyurl.com/y2saqhb6 > >>> > >>> This requires a lot of work to get the > >>> bars at even length, otherwise the timing > >>> gets screwed up except at the front and > >>> rear. > >> > >> If I understand correctly what you're after (all bars with the same > >> horizontal length), I don't think that's possible in Rosegarden. > >> > >> Musescore definitely has a 'minimum bar length' setting, so maybe it's > >> better for that kind of job? > > > > that's exactly what I mean. The example was > > easy on account of a very repetitive typical > > jam-track makeup but I'd actually want to > > do the same with real songs and running several > > staves in step. > > > > but I'm (a little) used to rosegarden and as > > I'll be 77 in a week I ain't prepared for yet > > another learning-curve > > > I get it. Maybe you could do all of the note input/editing in > Rosegarden, export just the final song to MusicXML and then just do the > video with that measure length using MuseScore. Up to now MusicXML > exported from Rosegarden and imported into musescore has worked pretty > well for me (mostly simple lead-sheets or bass parts, your mileage may > vary). thanks tried that but the musescore 'stretch' function doesn't apply uniformly. I select 'whole-staff' but bars with only rests or tied notes remain as short as graphically possible ..it doesn't seem to be the solution conceptually speaking what I would like to find is the equivalent of "export as a single linear PNG file with equal length bars" I could also attempt to keyframe each bar in kdenlive but that would require a precise timing pip for each bar line and would STILL be an enourmous task ___ Rosegarden-user mailing list Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user
Re: [Rosegarden-user] Even length staff bars?
On 10/02/21 14:08, krsg...@trixtar.org wrote: On Wed, 10 Feb 2021 11:02:07 +0100 Lorenzo Sutton wrote: On 10/02/21 01:54, krsg...@trixtar.org wrote: Using linear layout the notation editor allows me to capture screens and to then reassemble a VERY wide image to scroll in an animated training/jamming video: https://tinyurl.com/y2saqhb6 This requires a lot of work to get the bars at even length, otherwise the timing gets screwed up except at the front and rear. If I understand correctly what you're after (all bars with the same horizontal length), I don't think that's possible in Rosegarden. Musescore definitely has a 'minimum bar length' setting, so maybe it's better for that kind of job? that's exactly what I mean. The example was easy on account of a very repetitive typical jam-track makeup but I'd actually want to do the same with real songs and running several staves in step. but I'm (a little) used to rosegarden and as I'll be 77 in a week I ain't prepared for yet another learning-curve I get it. Maybe you could do all of the note input/editing in Rosegarden, export just the final song to MusicXML and then just do the video with that measure length using MuseScore. Up to now MusicXML exported from Rosegarden and imported into musescore has worked pretty well for me (mostly simple lead-sheets or bass parts, your mileage may vary). Lorenzo. ___ Rosegarden-user mailing list Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user
Re: [Rosegarden-user] Even length staff bars?
On Wed, 10 Feb 2021 11:02:07 +0100 Lorenzo Sutton wrote: > On 10/02/21 01:54, krsg...@trixtar.org wrote: > > > > Using linear layout the notation editor > > allows me to capture screens and to then > > reassemble a VERY wide image to scroll in > > an animated training/jamming video: > > > > https://tinyurl.com/y2saqhb6 > > > > This requires a lot of work to get the > > bars at even length, otherwise the timing > > gets screwed up except at the front and > > rear. > > If I understand correctly what you're after (all bars with the same > horizontal length), I don't think that's possible in Rosegarden. > > Musescore definitely has a 'minimum bar length' setting, so maybe it's > better for that kind of job? that's exactly what I mean. The example was easy on account of a very repetitive typical jam-track makeup but I'd actually want to do the same with real songs and running several staves in step. but I'm (a little) used to rosegarden and as I'll be 77 in a week I ain't prepared for yet another learning-curve -- War, is the school of peace ___ Rosegarden-user mailing list Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user
Re: [Rosegarden-user] [OT]: quick and easy music making: a marketer's dream [WAS] Re: beginners question : getting sound
In all this ranting about how much Rosegarden sucks, I think everybody is forgetting about the classic use case. Plug in an ALSA-supported MIDI adapter. Plug a hardware synth into the MIDI adapter. Start Rosegarden. If it doesn't make noise, diddle the Manage MIDI Devices dialog until you find where your synth is. Depending on the synth, maybe diddle channels too. This doesn't require JACK, it doesn't require a soundfont, it doesn't require a soft synth, it will work with any kernel, and this process isn't dramatically different from any MIDI sequencer I used in the '80s or '90s. As far as the history of the age-old "Rosegarden doesn't make sound" problem, it all started going to hell when hardware MIDI fell out of fashion. This is a combination of Windows making everybody think their new soundcard still had MIDI capability when it really didn't, and then the general movement toward recorded audio, which meant most end users didn't know a MIDI if it bit them on the ass, or care one iota about any of that crap. As far as that goes, how easy is it, really, to get sound out of a comparable Windows app? First I have to download the proprietary control client for my audio interface, then I have to figure out some combination of controls that routes sound to the speakers. Now I have to configure the software to use the ASIO driver. Then I have to slot a VSTi plugin, and set it up to make the noise I want. None of that is plug and play either. But whatever. I hate this topic, and I'm going to duck my head and concentrate my attention elsewhere. I just wanted to fire off this rant. -- D. Michael McIntyre ___ Rosegarden-user mailing list Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user
Re: [Rosegarden-user] Even length staff bars?
On 10/02/21 01:54, krsg...@trixtar.org wrote: Using linear layout the notation editor allows me to capture screens and to then reassemble a VERY wide image to scroll in an animated training/jamming video: https://tinyurl.com/y2saqhb6 This requires a lot of work to get the bars at even length, otherwise the timing gets screwed up except at the front and rear. If I understand correctly what you're after (all bars with the same horizontal length), I don't think that's possible in Rosegarden. Musescore definitely has a 'minimum bar length' setting, so maybe it's better for that kind of job? Hope this helps. Lorenzo. fo/rosegarden-user ___ Rosegarden-user mailing list Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user
Re: [Rosegarden-user] [OT]: quick and easy music making: a marketer's dream [WAS] Re: beginners question : getting sound
On 10/02/21 05:24, david wrote: > On 2/8/21 10:21 PM, Lorenzo Sutton wrote: >> On 09/02/21 00:00, krsg...@trixtar.org wrote: [...] > [snipped a great personal tale of learning an instrument] glad I put the [OT] flag on this one :-) > I don't think the original poster's request was to "make music" quickly > and easily, it was to "make a sound" quickly and easily. IOW, fire up > > Rosegarden, maybe open one of the demo files, hit play, and hear sounds. I see your point. But it's not _that_ complicated _if_ you have the right packages installed (which is more about Linux distributions and package management and was also one of the problems of the OP): 0. Start Jack (actually optional if, like in this example you are using an 'external synth') 1. Start Qsynth 2. Load Soundfont 3. Start Rosegarden 4. Connect to Qsynth 5. Add notes in Rosegarden 6. Play 1. and 2. could be optimized by starting qsynth from the command-line... Even in a more 'self-contained' programme, imagining it supplies fluidsynth (or a synth player) and a soundfont, and auto-magically sets-up audio for you, you probably have to at least: 1. create a (MIDI) track 2 ,tell the programme you want the track to play through the synth with the soundfont 3. Add notes 4. Play LMMS comes to mind as a software where getting sound is _really_ quick (assuming audio backend is configured correctly and working): 1. Drag a synth (a track will automatically be created) 2. Add notes 3. Play OK Rosegarden has double the steps... in my case I have a script(s) which starts Fluidsynth + selected (GM/GS) soundfont(s) and connects it to jack which takes care of 1. 2. and 3. (because rosegarden auto-connects to Fluid its General MIDI output). I also have a rosegarden template I made which opens at startup instead of the default one where I removed the audio tracks and instead has 16 MIDI tracks (with different colours). I'm happy to share it if anyone is interested. On the bonus side you get all of the great sequencer, notation, jack transport etc. features in Rosegarden... It really depends on your music making scenario. Anyway, the rosegarden steps above could be embedded maybe in a 'wizard'. Probably it could even be hacked with yad (a zenity fork, or something scripted) Actually, in this setting you could theoretically skip jack audio. And, really, I think jack audio is there only to either use synth plugins (mostly dead due to DSSI these days), or audio recording. > Hope DSSI isn't dead. I use it DSSI's regularly. I hope so too. the fluidsynth DSSI plugin and hexter are two of my favourite ones. I'm not sure how many DSSI plugins are actively developed and maintained (package-wise in distros). > Although I do have wishes re Rosegarden and how it interacts with softsynths such as Yoshimi... Are you thinking, uhm, LV2...? :-) Lorenzo. ___ Rosegarden-user mailing list Rosegarden-user@lists.sourceforge.net - use the link below to unsubscribe https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/rosegarden-user
