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You can reach the person managing the list at [EMAIL PROTECTED] When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of sanskrit digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Answers to Quiz # 6 (Vis Tekumalla) 2. Answers to Sanskrit Quiz # 6 (Vis Tekumalla) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 18:46:17 -0800 (PST) From: Vis Tekumalla <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [Sanskrit] Answers to Quiz # 6 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I posted my answers along with three others' answers arounf 5 P.M. My post bounced. Again, the issue appears to be the size of the post. May be I ought to post them separately in 4 separate e-mails. The following is the e-mail I got informing me of the problem. Your mail to 'sanskrit' with the subject Answers to Sanskrit Quiz # 6 Is being held until the list moderator can review it for approval. The reason it is being held: Message body is too big: 112440 bytes with a limit of 40 KB Either the message will get posted to the list, or you will receive notification of the moderator's decision. If you would like to cancel this posting, please visit the following URL: ...Vis Tekumalla [EMAIL PROTECTED] --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/private/sanskrit/attachments/20040129/a910c144/attachment-0001.htm ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 14:10:31 -0800 (PST) From: Vis Tekumalla <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [Sanskrit] Answers to Sanskrit Quiz # 6 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" My answers are followed by Mr. Ramakrishnan's, Mr. Sai Susarla's, and Mr. Sushil Sharma's. Please help me with my doubts on the usage of "ko" in question # 4. MY ANSWERS (Vis Tekumalla) 1. na vAriNa shudhyatichA.ntarAtmA ---- Washing your body clean (outside) doesn’t purify your soul (inside). 2. svatora.njayanti shrtRichitta.m sa svara uchyate; The sound which on its own/all by itself (svato) pleases (ra.njayati) is called svara. 3. naivAshriteshu guNadoSha vichAraNasyAt-------- Don’t be judgmental or condescending about someone seeks your help. 4. mArmikaH ko mara.ndAnAma.ntareNa madhuvrata.m “mArmikaH” is someone with a deep insight (could be an informal or Sanskrit colloquilism for “marma~Na). “mara.ndAnAm” is flowers, mashed flowers, “antareNa” is within, and “madhuvrata.m” is a bee. So I interpret the line as – Whoever is a bee inside mashed flowers (looking for the essence of the flowers in that mash, the honey) is a marmikaH. However, I am a little uncomfortable with getting the right meaning of that “ko” in the line. For example, when we say – “kAkaH kR^ishNaH pikaH kR^ishNaH ko bhedaH pikakAkayoH,” the “ko” in there seems to mean – they are both black, is there really a difference between the two? Or when we say – “upakArIshu yaH sAdhuH sAdhutve tasya ko guNaH,” the “ko” there seems to mean, what’s the big deal?/what’s the greatness?/what’s so special about helping someone who helped you before? If we parley such “dismissive - what” meaning of “ko” into this line, it’s meaning could well turn out to be – “what’s so special about a mArmikah? (the thing special about him is,) he is like a bee going only for the honey (even) in a mashed bunch (or paste) of flowers.” But then, in the vishNu-sahasranAmam prologue Yudhishtara asks: ko dharmaH sarva-dharmaNam bhavataH paramo mataH The “ko” here is a simple “what;” there is no dismissive shade at all. Now, I am throwing up my hands. Can someone enlighten us on the usage ko? By the way, I don’t think there is anything wrong with the line in the quiz. It’s used in a Sanskrit work. The name escapes me right now, but I can find it. 5. ajAyuddhe R^iShi shrAddhe prabhAte meghaDa.mbare da.mpatyoH kalahechaiva bahvAra.mbho laghukriyA The fight between (two) goats, shraddhakarma (pitR^ikarma) of sages, the thunder of the morning clouds, and the fight (argument) between a husband and a wife, start out big with loud noises but do not amount to much, they just fizzle out in no time. The fight between the goats starts with lot of posturing but ends with one head butt. The rishies being wellversed in the meaning of all the mantras are very meticulous about chanting them with loud voices, but in the end when it comes time to feed the bhoktas, they feed them the same food that they themselves eat, fruits/leaves/roots etc. No four vegetable preparations, four chutneys, ghee to drink, vadas, etc. Morning clouds and fights between a couple need no explanation. 6. Shadja.m mayUro vadati gAvo R^iShabhAShiNaH ajAvika.ntu gA.ndhAra.m krau.nchaH kvaNati madhyamam. puShpasAdhAraNakAle pikaH kUjati pa.nchamam dhaivata.m heShate vAjI niShAdam bR^i.mhate gajaH. A peacock’s call has ShaDja (sa) in it, an ox’s call has R^ishabha (Ri), a goat’s vocalization has gAndhAram (ga), a krauncha bird’s call has madhyamam (ma), the cuckoo sings panchamam (pa) in spring, a horse’s neigh has dhaivatam (da), and an elephant’s scream has nishAdam (ni) – like Nityasree hitting kAkali nishAdam in the third sthAyi (kAkali nisHadam is called - teevr ni - in Hindustani as opposed to kaikasi nishAdam which is called - komal ni). Our ancients fixed the ocatve (sa, ri, ga, ma, pa, da, ni) based on these sounds they found in the nature around them. 7. maNishshANollIDhaH samaravijayI hetidaLito madakShINo nAgaH sharadi saritaH shayAnapulinAH kaLAsheShashchandraH suratamR^iditA bAlavanitA tanimna shobhante gaLitavibhavAshchArthiShu narAH Author: Bhartrihari maNi = a gem; shaNa = a jewler’s touchstone, a rubbing/polishing coarse cloth; ullIDhaH = polished; samara = battle; vijayI = one who won (in that battle); heti = weapon; daLita = broken, split, bitten (da.nta daLana gaLitAmR^itadhAram – Geetagovindam); madakShINo = less aggressive; nAgaH = elephant; sharadi = autumnal; saritaH = river; shayAnapulinAH = dry with a sandy beach or sandy banks; kaLA = glow; sheSha = lessened, remaining; chandraH = moon; surata = delighful lovemaking; mR^idatA = squeezed, rubbed & pressed; bAlavanitA = young woman; tanimna = slimness, thinness, slenderness; shobhante = would shine, would acquire beauty/loveliness/glow; gaLita = lost, deprived, impaired; vibhava = wealth, power; cha = also; arthiShu = in those who ask, in charity; narAH = men Men who lose their wealth to charity (ending up being less wealthy) would shine as much as: (1) a gem - that loses some of its stock when polished; (2) a wounded war hero – who loses some of his physical strength after fighting; (3) a trained/controlled elephant – who loses much of his natural aggressive attitude; (4) a (meandering) river in the autumn with a sandy beach – that loses its water flow after the rains subside; (5) a crescent moon – beautiful in its own way even after losing some of the glow after being a full moon; and (6) a worn and woozy young woman – beautiful in her own way with a glow of satisfaction after an eventful romantic experience. Basically this is a verse in praise of charity. Bhartrihari compares losing some wealth to charity (ending up being less wealthy) with several things that acquire a different sort of beauty (or even become more beautiful) as they slim down or get weaker. Mr. RAMAKRISHNAN’S ANSWERS 1. na vAriNA shudhyatichA.ntarAtmA (5 pts.) = The inner soul does not get cleansed by water. 2. svatora.njayanti shrotR^ichitta.m sa svara uchyate (5 pts.) There appears to be a mstake here. It should be - svatora.njayati (singular). = A svara is one which pleases by itself a listener's mind. 3. naivAshriteShu guNadoSha vichAraNAsyAt (5 pts.) = One should not examine the good or bad aspects of those who depend on him. 4. mArmikaH ko mara.ndAnAma.ntareNa madhuvrata.m (5 pts.) = What is the secret of madhu being known by another name like mara.nda. (mara.ndA is not correct) 5. ajAyuddhe R^iShi shrAddhe prabhAte meghaDa.mbare da.mpatyoH kalahechaiva bahvAra.mbho laghukriyA (10 pts.) Note - I remember a different version of this sloka - ajAyuddham R^iShishrAddham prabhAte meghaDaMbharam da.mpatyoH kalahashchaiva pariNaame na kiMchana = The fight between two she-goats, the shraddha ceremoney conducted by Rishis, thunder in the morning, and the quarrel between husband and wife, end in nothing. 6. Shadja.m mayUro vadati gAvo R^iShabhAShiNaH ajAvika.ntu gA.ndhAra.m krau.nchaH kvaNati madhyamam. puShpasAdhAraNakAle pikaH kUjati pa.nchamam dhaivata.m heShate vAjI niShAdam bR^i.mhate gajaH..-----(20 pts.) Remark -(1) R^iShabhAShiNaH should be R^iShabha-bhAshiNah (2) puShpasAdhAraNakAle should be puShpasAdhAraNe kAle = There are seven notes in Indian music - sa - ri - ga - ma- pa -dh - ni. All these represent the sounds produced by various birds and animals. shadjam (sa) is the peacock's voice, cows produce the rishabha sound (ri), gAndhAra (ga) is produced by sheep and goat, madhyamam (ma) is the sound by the krouncha bird, during the season of flowers (i.e.spring) what pika (the Indian cuckoo) sings is panchama (pa), the horse's neighing is dhavaitha (dha), and the elephant produces the brimming sound of nishAda (ni). 7. maNishshANollIDhaH samaravijayI hetidaLito madakShINo nAgaH sharadi saritaH shyAnapulinAH kaLAsheShashchandraH suratamR^iditA bAlavanitA tanimna shobhante gaLitavibhavAshchArthiShu narAH (30 pts. for word for word meanings, and 20 pts. for the general meaning of the verse. Bonus 5 points if you guess the author) Word meaning - MaNih = a gem, shANollIDhaH = polished by a polishing stone. samaravijayI = winner in a battle, hetidaLito (hetiDalitah) = who has lost his weapon, madakshINo = weakened by the rut, nAgaH = elephant, sharadi = during the autumn (rainless season), saritaH = rivers, shyAnapulinAh = ( with) dry sandbeds, kalAsheShaH = with a digit left, chandraH = moon, suratamR^iditA = pressed at intercourse, bAlavanitA = young woman, tanimna = (in) thinness, shobhante = shine, gaLitavibhavaH cha = and those with depleted wealth, arthiShu = on those who seek their wealth, narAh = men. General meaning. The following shine even when they get thinner (depleted),a gem after polishing, a winning warrior even if he loses hisarmour, an elephant though week after rut, rivers with dry sandbeds, the moon with only one digit left, an emaciated young woman after intercourse, a person losing wealth because of his gifting away. Author - Bhartruhari SAI SUSARLA’S ANSWERS 1. na vAriNA shudhyatichA.ntarAtmA------------------------------ 5 The soul cannot be cleansed by water. 2. svatora.njayanti shrotR^ichitta.m sa svara uchyate---------------- 5 That which by itself pleases the listener's heart is called a svara 3. naivAshriteShu guNadoSha vichAraNAsyAt------------------------ 5 An asylum seeker's blemishes should not at all be analysed. 4. mArmikaH ko mara.ndAnAma.ntareNa madhuvrata.m----------- 5 mArmikaH = versed in, familiar or acquainted with mara.nda = the nectar from flowers antareNa = by the difference Is this a partial sentence? I guess that it means something like, who is more well-versed than the bee in differentiating the nectar of various flowers? But can't see how that can come about from the sanskrit piece given. 5. ajAyuddhe R^iShi shrAddhe prabhAte meghaDa.mbare da.mpatyoH kalahechaiva bahvAra.mbho laghukriyA---------------------------------------------10 In sheep's fight, seer's death anniversary ritual, dawn's thunder and couple's quarrel as well, there is a lot of display/commotion, but little effect. 6. Shadja.m mayUro vadati gAvo R^iShabhAShiNaH ^R^iShabha-bhAShiNaH ajAvika.ntu gA.ndhAra.m krau.nchaH kvaNati madhyamam. puShpasAdhAraNakAle pikaH kUjati pa.nchamam dhaivata.m heShate vAjI niShAdam bR^i.mhate gajaH.. ---------20 Peacock utters 'ShaDjaM' (sa); cows talk 'riShabhaM' (ri); a goat's sound is 'gAndhAraM' (ga); stork makes the sound of 'madhyamam' (ma). During the spring time, the cuckoo coos 'pa.nchamam' (pa) The horse neighs 'daivatam' (da); The elephant roars (<- for lack of a Better word) 'niShAdam' (ni) 7. maNishshANollIDhaH samaravijayI hetidaLito madakShINo nAgaH sharadi saritaH shyAnapulinAH kaLAsheShashchandraH suratamR^iditA bAlavanitA tanimna shobhante gaLitavibhavAshchArthiShu narAH ---- 20 + 30 + 5 Saradi = In Sarat kAlam (oct - nov.) maNiH shAna+ullIDhaH maNiH = gem shAnaH = whetstone, touchstone ullIDhaH = ground , polished heti = (missile) weapon, stroke, wound, impact daLitaH = pierced, torn asunder saritaH = river shyAna = frozen, cold pulinAH = beaches, surata = sporting, playful, delight in sexual intercourse mR^idita = pressed, squeezed, crushed, broken bAla-vanitA = young lady mada-kShINaH = low on virility (venom?) kalA-sheShaH chandraH = moon is only partially bright galita = dropped, oozed, trickling, waning (as the moon) vibhava = power, might, greatness, fame nimna = lowered shobhante = grandeur, shine During the winter season (specifically, Sarat kAlam) The gem is polished by being rubbed against the touchstone, (maybe because gems are usually polished and cut into ornaments during winter season?) the victor is struct by weapon(???) The serpent is low on virility (venom?), The sandy beaches of the river are freezing cold The young lady is exhausted by engaging in lots of amorous sports The fame of some men has waned and their grandeur lowered by having to depend on others. The first and last pAdas didn't make much sense to me. - Sai. SAI’S COMMENTS ON THE LAST QUESTION Regarding this Sloka, after your explanation, I kind of get it. Still I can't understand how the Sloka can be made to mean this. I am trying to prosify the Sloka to get this meaning... "tanimna" - I don't know how to fit it into the following gadya rUpam: Maybe it is "te nimna". In that case, te nimna shobhante: ^^^^^ it should be nimnAH shobhante, or nimnAshshobhante (they all shine low): 1. shAnOllIDhaH maNiH, 2. heti-gaLitaH samaravijayI 3. madakShINaH nAgaH, 4. shyAnapulinaH saritaH, 5. suratamR^iditA bAlavanitA, ^-------^ both should be aH or AH together 6. arthiShu gaLita-vibhavAH narAH cha ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ If the above corrections are made, then it makes sense. The under-current throughout is "so what?". Beautiful, beautiful! The saptamI (arthiShu) in the last usage is why I love sanskrit so much. It is a beautiful way of expressing the thought. It literally means, "Those men who have their prosperity/wealth diminished in alm-seekers" ^^ (by ending up into the hands of) Excellent Sloka selection! - Sai. SUSHIL SHARMA’S ANSWERS Hi Vis, I had typed my answers to your Sanskrit Quiz#6 last night, but my Yahoo session got timed out and I lost the entire mail just before sending it. Here is my attempt once again. 1. na vAriNA shudhyatichA.ntarAtmA (5 pts.) ... and conscience or inner-soul (a.ntaraatmaa) is not cleansed by (bathing in or rinsing with) water. 2. svatora.njayanti shrotR^ichitta.m sa svara uchyate (5 pts.) What delights/entertains the listener's mind on its own (by itself or automatically), is called the musical note (svara). IMHO, the first word should have been "svatora.njayati" svara being singular. 3. naivAshriteShu guNadoSha vichAraNAsyAt (5 pts.) Not sure about this one. Here are two feeble attempts: Virtue or vice of dependents must not be deliberated upon (i.e. one should not discriminate or withdraw support once offered to a dependent on discovering virtue or vice later). or Virtue or vice (of any matter) must not be discussed with/among (one's) dependents (as their opinions are bound to be biased). Also, shouldn't the last word be vichAraNIyAt? > 4. mArmikaH ko mara.ndAnAma.ntareNa madhuvrata.m (5 pts.) Who amongst the honeybees are qualified to discern the minute differences (maarmikaH) in nectars of various flowers? [madhuvrata means a honeybee but it also means one who does not consume madhu (vrata= fasting); bees are said to collect the honey without themselves partaking any of it; if they do not consume any madhu, how can they discern the qualities of nectar from various flowers?] Again, should the last word not be madhuvratA.m to denote the plural? 5. ajAyuddhe R^iShi shrAddhe prabhAte meghaDa.mbare da.mpatyoH kalahechaiva bahvAra.mbho laghukriyA (10 pts.) There is a lot of fuss at start/setting-up and little real action, in goat fights (a lot of heavy breathing, loud noises, little real action), in the shraddha ceremony of R^ishis/munis (a lot of chanting and ceremony, very little or only symbolic real offerings), in thundering noises of morning cluds (they seldom bring rain despite all the thunder) and in the petty domestic quarrels of married couples (a lot of verbal exchanges, not much more). This is the Sanskrit equivalent of saying "much ado about nothing". 6. Shadja.m mayUro vadati gAvo R^iShabhAShiNaH ajAvika.ntu gA.ndhAra.m krau.nchaH kvaNati madhyamam. puShpasAdhAraNakAle pikaH kUjati pa.nchamam dhaivata.m heShate vAjI niShAdam bR^i.mhate gajaH..-----(20 pts.) The peacock speaks in Shadaj (sa), the cows moo in R^iShabh (re), goats bleat in ga.ndhAr (ga), the krau.ncha birds croon in madhyam (ma), in spring season when there are flowers blossoming everywhere, the pika bird sings in pa.ncham (pa), the horse neighs in dhaivat (dha) and the elephant trumpets in niShAda (ni) musical note. The beauty of this verse lies in use of a distinct (and proper) word for the name of the sounds of each of these animals, in Sanksrit, and in somewhat logical comparison of their sounds to the notes of the Indian classical music scale. 7. maNishshANollIDhaH samaravijayI hetidaLito madakShINo nAgaH sharadi saritaH shyAnapulinAH kaLAsheShashchandraH suratamR^iditA bAlavanitA tanimna shobhante gaLitavibhavAshchArthiShu narAH (30 pts. for word for word meanings, and 20 pts. for the general meaning of the verse. Bonus 5 points if you guess the author This verse is from niitishataka of Bhartrihari. Here are word meanings: mani = precious gem, shANaH = jeweller's apparatus to grind or polish the raw gems, ullIdhah = ground or polished, samaravijayi = battle winner, heti = weapon/missile, dalitaH = injured/cut/torn, madakShINah = weakened/intoxicated after discharging the mada/dana.m secretions, nAgaH = elephant, sharadi = winter, saritA = river, shyAnapulinAH = whose banks are shallow for lack of water, kaLAsheShashchandraH = moon waned to the extent that only one one sixteenth part of it is bright and rest is dark, suratamR^iditA = tired/wearied after love-making, bAlavanitA = young bride, tanimna = by virtue of slenderness, shobhante = are beautiful, are adorned, gaLitavibhavAH = whose wealth is gone (plural), ArthiShu = among seekers of monetary help (yaachakaaH), narAH = men Here is my interpretation of this verse: The precious gem that has been polished on the shANa, the winner of a battle after sustaining injuries, with cuts and wounds on his body, the elephant in an intoxicated or dizzi state after discharging the mada/daana secretions (it does not eat anything in that state, so is weakened), a river whose banks are shallow in winter for lack of water, the moon waned to a sliver of brightness in the last days of the dark fortnight, a young bride weary and tired after love-making, and men whose wealth is given away in charity to alms seekers, these all appear adorned or more beautiful in their slenderness! [The slenderness may otherwise be considered a blemish, but in these special circumstances, it is a virtue that adorns them. The Sanksrit quiz series is a good idea. Please keep it going. Thanks and regards, ...Vis Tekumalla [EMAIL PROTECTED] --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/private/sanskrit/attachments/20040129/e3f3e069/attachment.htm ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ sanskrit mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit End of sanskrit Digest, Vol 10, Issue 25 ****************************************