Send sanskrit mailing list submissions to
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
You can reach the person managing the list at
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of sanskrit digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: agasti tree (Ambujam Raman)
2. Change in saptarshis (A. R. Srikrishnan)
3. Re: Change in saptarshis (peekayar)
4. Re: saptarshi (Devadas Menon)
5. Re: Re: saptarshi (Sai)
6. some grammatical terms (Jay Vaidya)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 00:05:48 -0400
From: "Ambujam Raman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] agasti tree
To: "Sai" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: sanskrit digest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID:
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
I assume agasti to be ?napumsaka lingam (neutre) and not strI lingam and
hence agastyapi
> > sanskrit mailing list
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 09:50:53 +0530
From: "A. R. Srikrishnan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [Sanskrit] Change in saptarshis
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Regarding different "listings" of saptarShis: The explanation for this
is that, each manwantara (-the course of one manu) has a set of
saptarShi's associated with its period. R^iShis who constitute the
group _may_ vary from manwantara -to- manwantara. (The present
manwantara is the 7th one (name of manu of this one is "vivaswaan")).
This explanation is based on Bhaagavatam.
Thanks
Srikrishnan
2. Re: saptarshi (Vis Tekumalla)
>
>From: Vis Tekumalla <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>It seems there are 3 schools on who the saptarishies are.
>
>School 1: kaSyapa, atri, bharadwaaja, kauSika, gautama, jamadagni, and vasiShTa
>
>School 2: mariichi, atri, a~Ngirasa, pulastya, pulahu, kratu, and vasiShTa
>
>School 3: kaSyapa, atri, a~Ngirasa, kauSika, vasiShTa, bhR^igu, agastya
>
>I don't know why the differences or the rationale behind the differences.
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 22:07:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] Change in saptarshis
To: "A. R. Srikrishnan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, sanskrit digest
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
BhoH ShrikrishnamahashayaaH!
Sayi Mahashyasya nideshamanusrtya aham
devavaanyaameva prichchaami.
bhoH shriikR^iiSNamahashayaaH!
saaayi mahaashayasya nideshamanusR^itya ahaM devavaaNyaameva pR^icChaami.
bhaagavate kasmin skandhe kasmin sarge katame shloke idaM uktamiti j~naatumicChaami.
iti
bhavadiiyaH raamakR^iSNaH
"A. R. Srikrishnan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Regarding different "listings" of saptarShis: The explanation for this
is that, each manwantara (-the course of one manu) has a set of
saptarShi's associated with its period. R^iShis who constitute the
group _may_ vary from manwantara -to- manwantara. (The present
manwantara is the 7th one (name of manu of this one is "vivaswaan")).
This explanation is based on Bhaagavatam.
Thanks
Srikrishnan
2. Re: saptarshi (Vis Tekumalla)
>
>From: Vis Tekumalla
>
>It seems there are 3 schools on who the saptarishies are.
>
>School 1: kaSyapa, atri, bharadwaaja, kauSika, gautama, jamadagni, and vasiShTa
>
>School 2: mariichi, atri, a~Ngirasa, pulastya, pulahu, kratu, and vasiShTa
>
>School 3: kaSyapa, atri, a~Ngirasa, kauSika, vasiShTa, bhR^igu, agastya
>
>I don't know why the differences or the rationale behind the differences.
>
>
_______________________________________________
sanskrit mailing list
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage!
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL:
http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/private/sanskrit/attachments/20040812/18a866cd/attachment-0001.htm
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 11:44:00 +0530
From: Devadas Menon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [Sanskrit] Re: saptarshi
To: "sanskrit digest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Agastya is considered to be the first among the 18 Tamil Yoga Siddhas.
According to this tradition, Agastya migrated to the North in his later
years. Might explain why he is not in texts that has primarily a Sanskrit
origin.
regds....devadas
At 11:03 PM 8/12/04 -0400, Ambujam Raman wrote:
>According to shatapatha brahmana the sapta rishis are:
>Gautama, BharadvAja, VishvAmitra, Jamadagni, VashiShTa, KAshyapa and Atri.
>Mahabharata gives them as:
>mariichi, atri, a~Ngirasa, pulastya, pulahu, kratu, and vasiShTa
>Vayu purANA adds Bhrigu to the list without dropping any!
>Vishnu purANA adds Bhrigu and Daksha, but calls them nava brahma.RShi.
>What is your reference for School 3 ?
>
>There is no reference to Agastya being part of the group. The seven sapta
>rishis form the seven stars of Ursa Major (the Great Bear). Agastya
>does'nt belong there. He is a separate star Canopus in the southern hemisphere!
>
>Raman
>sanskrit mailing list
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit
>
>_______________________________________________
>sanskrit mailing list
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 08:42:36 -0600
From: Sai <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] Re: saptarshi
To: Devadas Menon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: sanskrit digest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Might explain why he is not in texts that has primarily a Sanskrit
> origin.
aho devadAsasya tarkaM!
evam chet rAmAyaNaM prAthamikatayA saMskR^ita vA~NgmayaM naiva khalu??
(In that case, ramayana is not primarily sanskrit literature isn't it?)
(kR^ipayA gIrvANyA charchAm anuvaratana yatnam kurvantu)
- Sai.
Devadas Menon uvaacha:
> Agastya is considered to be the first among the 18 Tamil Yoga Siddhas.
> According to this tradition, Agastya migrated to the North in his later
> years. Might explain why he is not in texts that has primarily a Sanskrit
> origin.
>
> regds....devadas
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 08:27:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jay Vaidya <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [Sanskrit] some grammatical terms
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
uktaH sAyyA
>
> ... (ko.api etAn) padAn sulabhatayA
> ... dhArAvAhika rUpeNa bodhayitum Saknoti
> vA?
>
> udAharaNAya:
> ti~NgantaH,
> sup pratyayaH
> avyayI bhAvaH
__________________________________________________
nanu A.nglasaMGYAH pANinIyasaMGYAbhiH saha samAntarA
na | tathApi Ishhat sAmAntaryam atra darshayAmi, tat
tathaiva GYAtavyaM bhavadbhiH | lAghavArtham
pANinIyasaMGYA A.nglAstu (an)arthavivR^itAH |
The grammatical terms in English and Sanskrit are not
really parallel. However, I will be indicating their
approximate parallelism here; please understand it
that way. pANini's terms are for making his work
compact. So useless terms are not defined if they do
not help form words and sentences. The terms in
English grammar try to cram the meaning of the concept
(and this sometimes leads to wrong meanings).
This is rather long, but I promise, there are no sUtra
quotations. I hope all concepts have been simply
stated without making them incorrect.
___________________________________________________
tiN^-anta:
These are words ending with the "tiN^" terminations.
Approximately in English = "finite verbs". In a finite
verb the action is incorporated with the meaning -- it
is not merely referred to.
"He 'talks' ". The action is within the word 'talks'.
Therefore it is "finite".
"He likes 'to talk'. " The action is in 'likes', there
is only reference to action in 'to talk'. This is an
"infinitive" = not finite.
"He is 'talkative'. He gave a long 'talk'." The action
is only referred to. Though they are derived from the
same root, 'talkative' and 'talk' are not finite here.
The actual finite verbs in these examples are 'is' and
'gave'.
There are 18 tiN^ endings in sa.nskR^ita, but they are
used in sets of nine, i.e., nine at a time. Nine in
each tense/mood/Atmane-parasmai-pada.
In sa.nskR^ita, you may have learnt tables where verbs
are modified in nine different ways (3 rows, three
columns). Those forms are all tin^-antas. All other
verb forms are not tiN^-anta.
e.g. (1a-b-c) vadatu-vadatAm-vadantu (2a-b-c)
vada-vadatam-vadata (3a-b-c) vadAni-vadAva-vadAma
(total 9 forms). All of these words are tiN^antas.
However, words like vAdaH, vaktA, uditaH, vAk (meaning
speech, speaker, spoken, speech) are not modified as
groups-of-nine (see below, with "sup"). So, they are
not tiN^-anta.
I hope you understand the concept. Please do not point
out that (2a) 'vada' has an alternative form
'vadatAt'-- more than 9 forms, gotcha! I will then be
forced to be more exact and legalistic. That will make
it hard to read :-). Of course, please tell me if the
concept is not actually clear.
______________________________________________
sup pratyayAH
These are certain endings=suffixes. They only relate
to non-finite-verbs and other words, never to finite
verbs (see meaning of "finite" above). In English,
these are "morphological case markers". They change
the shape/sound of the word; change in meaning happens
most of the time, but is irrelevant. Please do not mix
these with the meaning-related cases, which are the
"kAraka"s. They are not the same.
"Word-shape-changes" in English are as follows:
Certain English words have six forms, most have four
forms. (6 forms) he-they, him-them, his-their. (4
forms) girl-girls, girl's-girls'.
There are 21 sup endings in sa.nskR^ita.
In sa.nskR^ita you may have learned word-tables that
took 21 forms (note: I didn't say 21 DIFFERENT forms.
7 rows, 3 columns -- forget that colonial-foisted
eighth row). Each of those 21 words is a subanta
(=sup-anta). Usually dictionaries list words before
attaching the endings. These dictionary entries are
not subanta. Words that are not tiN^anta are always
subanta when used in sentences. That includes the
"avyaya"s, I will explain below.
For example,
(1) 'vadatu' is a tiN^anta (from a set of 9 forms,
described above). It is not one of a set of 21 forms,
so it is not a subanta.
(2) 'kavi' is the dictionary entry, meaning "poet". It
can never be used by itself without one of the 21
modifications. It is not a subanta.
(3) 'kaviH' has been modified in one of the 21 ways.
Therefore it is a subanta.
(4) vAdaH, vaktA, uditaH, vAk are, each one of them,
from within their lists of 21 forms. They are all
subanta words.
(5) As I said, the 21 forms need not be all distinct.
For example 'rAmau' is the sound of two of the 21
forms of 'rAma'. They are both (rAmau, rAmau) subanta.
(6) An extreme example of similar forms is when all 21
forms are the same. 'svaH' meaning "heaven" is the
same in all 21 forms. The term used to describe such
words is "avyaya", meaning "non-changing-word". The
list of "avyaya"s, can be found in dictionaries or
grammar books. They are subanta. Careless
schoolteachers sometimes say that these words do not
have 21 forms. Careful teachers say that while making
21 forms, all forms come out to be the same.
NOTE: This is different from English. In English,
adverbs, adjectives, conjunctions, prepositions, and
interjections do not take "morphological case
endings". The concept adverb, adjective, etc., are of
no use in word-formation or the understanding of
sa.nskR^ita meaning. They are not used in pANinIya
grammar. The sa.nskR^ita versions of all of these
words take sup endings. They are avyayas for the most
part, so all 21 forms come out looking the same.
_____________________________________________
avyayIbhAvaH
Means "though it are not 'avyaya', it becomes 'avyaya'
". There is no English analogy.
These words are not in the avyaya-list. They are
certain samAsa = compound words. Grammar books tell
you which samAsa compounds behave like "avyaya"s.
For example: 'yathAshakti' meaning "as possible". The
word 'shakti' is not in the list of avyayas. However,
if you follow samAsa rules, you will see that the
compound 'yathA+shakti' is listed under avyayIbhAva.
So it behaves like an "avyaya" and all 21 forms come
out looking the same ('yathAshakti', 21 times).
_____________________________________________
If you find these explanations clear and simple
enough, I can explain the other terms you were
interested in. (yathAshakti, if I can.)
bhavadIyo dhana.njayaH
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
sanskrit mailing list
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit
End of sanskrit Digest, Vol 17, Issue 11
****************************************
