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You can reach the person managing the list at [EMAIL PROTECTED] When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of sanskrit digest..." Today's Topics: 1. sambodhana for the word "sarva" (Jay Vaidya) 2. The rUpasiddhi of agastya (Jay Vaidya) 3. Re: English stay sthA (Ambujam Raman) 4. agasti tree (peekayar) 5. Re: agasti tree (Vis Tekumalla) 6. Re: agasti tree (peekayar) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 12:33:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Jay Vaidya <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [Sanskrit] sambodhana for the word "sarva" To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii pR^ichchhati sma hareshaH: > namaste, we do not associate the > vocative/sambodhanaartha/ashhTamii > vibhakti with pronouns. > Please refer to bhagvad-giitaa 11.40. > Here, in the second quarter you will > find "sarva" to mean > "O All". > Have you come across such exceptions? nanu nAstyayamapavAdaH iti bhavadIxaNArtham samarpayAmi haresha | This is not an exception. It follows the usual rule. All words that take the prathamA vibhakti can be used to call out to someone -- sambodhana. What would a sa.nskR^ita speaker say in a situation when, in English we say "Hey, you!"? I doubt she would keep quiet -- a language is after all used to communicate. She would certainly use the prathamA of "yushhmad" in the sambodhana sense. "ayi tvam!", or, "ayi atrabhavati!" depending on the degree of respect. A few issues to consider: (1) The concept of pronoun is not considered worth defining in sa.nskR^ita grammar. The term "sarvanAma" is used in some modern Indian languages to correspond to the English grammatical term "pronoun". This usage is not related to the sa.nskR^ita term "sarvanAma", which is a list of words that are conjugated somewhat differently than the others. For example "prathama" meaning "first" and "antara" meaning "underclothes" are sarvanAma words but it is hard to think of them as "pronoun"s in the English meaning. The closest that one gets to the concept of "pronoun" in sa.nskR^ita is the "tyadAdi" list. Its only importance is the way the words in the tyadAdi list (includes tyad, tad, etad, etc) can be used to summarize all other words "sa cha rAmashcha = tau". (using "tyadAdIni sarvairnityam | pA. sU. 1.2.72). Incidentally, the tyadAdi words are all sarvanAmas, but the word "sarva" is not in the tyadAdi list. (2) To decide how many vibhaktis it takes, we need to know -- what type of word is "sarva"? Before it is conjugated, it is a "prAtipadika". All words that are meaningful, not verb roots, and do not already have pratyaya endings are prAtipAdika s. Allowed pratyaya endings are kR^it, taddhita and samAsAnta. All prAtipadikas and their feminine forms if any can take "sup" vibhakti endings. Those prAtipadikas that do not take these endings are enumerated under the lists of avyayas or under avyayIbhAva samAsa. (Note that "avyaya"s are not adverbs and conjunctions and prepositions etc. from English grammar. They are just "avyaya"s.) (2)vocative/sambodhanArtha/ashhTamI is not defined as a vibhakti in sa.nskR^ita. Though it is in some modern Indian languages. The verb endings "tiN^" and the prAtipadika endings "sup" are called vibhakti in sa.nskR^ita. Usually many people think only of the prAtipadika endings "sup" when they think of vibhakti. There are only seven sets of three listed under "sup" (pA. sU. 4.1.2). (3) What vibhakti do you use to call out to people? Answer: prathamA. pA sU 2.3.49 says: "sambodhane cha ... prathamA |" There are further modifications to this prathama in the singular, sometimes. e.g., sarvaH -> (sambodhane) -> sarva bhavadIyo dhana.njayaH __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 17:20:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Jay Vaidya <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [Sanskrit] The rUpasiddhi of agastya To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii uvaacha rAmakR^ishhNaH: > Let us now deal only with agastya. Has it come from > agastha and > how? Here is the etymology by bhAnuji dIxita, in his "rAmAshramI" commentary on the amarakoshha. QUOTED: ...agastyaH kumbhasambhavaH | ... amarakoshha 1.3.20 TIkA: agaM vindhyaM styAyati stabhnoti | 'Ato.anupasarge kaH (pA sU 3.2.3)' | 'agastyaH syAtkumbhayonau va.ngasenatarAvapi' || agam asyati ityapi agastiH | 'vasestiH' (u 4.180) bAhulakAdasyaterapi -- iti mukuTaH | vastutastu 'ktich-ktau cha (pA sU 3.3.174)' iti ktijuchitaH | bAhulakAshrayasya agatikagatitvAt | shakandhvAdi (vA 6.1.94)| TRANSLATION OF COMMENTARY: agam (to the vindhya) styAyati (he who stops [stabhnAti means rodhanam means stop -- note by dhana.njaya])| Based on pANini sUtra 3.2.3. Elsewhere it has been said that agastya is the name for the sage born in the pot, and also that of a Bengali (?general, tree? [I am not clear, note by dha.]). (This is for agastya) (Now agasti) agam asyati (he who throws the mountain) can also be agasti. 'Add -ti to vas (uNAdi sUtra 4.180)' Due to irregularity, also the verb asyati -- so says mukuTa. In fact, based on pANini sUtra 3.3.174, the ending -ktich was appropriate ([that would make it not asti, but asiti -- note from dhana.njayaH]). The irregularity is imputed because we have to take that choice having no choice at all. Also aga+astiH = agastiH, an irregular sandhi due to the word belonging to the shakandhu-etc. list. (as in vArtika 6.1.94) Obviously, bhAnujidIxita does not really like the etymology of agasti, but is satisfied with the etymology of agastya. Indeed, pANini (agastyakau.nDinyayoragastiku.nDinach 2.4.70) makes 'agasti' a just-so (nipAtita) derivative from agastya, meaning the 'descendants of agastya gotra'. This suggests that, meaning the sage agastya, the word 'agasti' may be a retroderivative (imagined origin word, which then gains official status). In that case, we need not try to seriously find the origin for the word 'agasti'. svasti, dhana.njayaH __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 23:56:55 -0400 From: "Ambujam Raman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] English stay sthA To: "peekayar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Sai" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: sanskrit digest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Stet is the standard instruction in notes to indicate "Let it stand". According to OED it is derived from Latin stare meaning stand. That is closer to sanskrit 'sthA'. Raman ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sai" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "peekayar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: "sanskrit digest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 12:41 PM Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] English stay sthA > According to M-W, > It is derived from > agasti (not agastha = one who stays in/on mountain, which doesn't make sense given what he did to a > mountain) > > <E> agasti > <M> m. (according to Un2. iv , 179 fr. 2. %{a-ga} , a mountain , and %{asti} , > thrower , 2. %{as}). N. of a R2ishi (author of several Vedic hymns ; said to > have been the son of both Mitra and Varun2a by Urvas3i1 ; to have been born in > a water-jar ; to have been of short stature ; to have swallowed the ocean , and > compelled the Vindhya mountains to prostrate themselves before him ; to have > conquered and civilized the South ; > > Now regarding -asti, > <E> astR > <M> mfn. (fut. p.) one who is about or intends to throw RV. i , 61 , 7 ; x , 133 , 3 ; (%{tA}) m. a thrower , shooter RV. AV. ; (with %{a-pa4d}) S3Br. > > <E> asta > <M> 1 mfn. (perf. Pass. p. 2. %{as}) , thrown , cast Ragh. xii , 91 ; (%{a4n-} neg.) S3Br. iii ; (only in comp.) thrown off , left off , set aside , given up (as grief. anger , a vow , &c.) VP. Katha1s. &c. ; (%{A4}) f. a missile , an arrow AV. > <E> astakopa > <M> mfn. one whose anger is laid aside , Comm on Megh. > - Sai. > > > peekayar uvaacha: > > Let us now deal only with agastya. Has it come from > > agastha and > > how? > > > > Desiraju Hanumanta Rao <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > the sa.nskR^ita "sthA" (rather than "styaa") and the English "stay" --> > > > > This is the account for stay derived from stand: > > >> Oxford<< Prob. a. OF. (e)stai-, (e)stei-, flexional stem of ester (:L. stre) to stand. Cf. the earlier RESTAY v. In AF. the regular form of the pres. sing. indic. was estais, estait; an inf. *esteier, *estaier may have existed in colloquial use, but has not been found; the gerund esteaunt (three-syllables) occurs in Boeve de Haumtone (ed. Stimming) 2244. Eastern and North-eastern dialects of OF. have an inf. form esteir. << and >> Anglo-French estai-, stem of Old French ester, from Latin stare 'stand' << This is under their theaory of pobability, not affirmed. > > > > So also is - go - ga, gaml, gamana > Old English gaan, from Germanic: went originally the past tense of wend << > > > > But, how to prove to the acceptance of Eng. etymologists like - shampoo - >> Oxford : Hindustani chhampo, imperative of chhampna 'to press' << and Laksmhi for Lakme [cosmetics] etc - is to be exmined. > > > > dhr > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now._______________________________________________ > > sanskrit mailing list > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. > > _______________________________________________ > > sanskrit mailing list > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit > > _______________________________________________ > sanskrit mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit > ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 21:31:09 -0700 (PDT) From: peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [Sanskrit] agasti tree To: sanskrit digest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I am thankful to those who are participating in this topic. Here I am straying away from the main topic. Regarding the meaning of a tree named agasti. (MW-Agasti Grandiflora, agasti-dru} This is a tree of small height grown on the dividing mud boundaries of rice fields. Nowadays it is grown along with sugarcane also. It is used mainly as fodder for cattle. The green leaves are also used for cooking. In Tamil Nad it is called aathi-keerai, obviously from agasti>agathi>aathi. I am told that it has properties to cure mouth ulcer and therefore eaten with pulses. In olden days taking it once in fifteen days was religiously followed. I remember that when the Sankaracharya of Sringeri was camping at Kalady for several months, the Mutt employees were hunting for aathi-keerai for the Acharya"s dwaadashi paarayanam. It is not generally cultivated in Kerala. I do not know how it got the adjective Bengali. When I was living in Calcutta for many years, I have seen this being sold in large quantities in the vegetable market. Probably it is grown largely in Bengal. It must have got the name agasti because just like agasti (agastya) it has a short stature compared to other trees. PKRamakrishnan --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/private/sanskrit/attachments/20040811/cce47986/attachment-0001.htm ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 05:35:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Vis Tekumalla <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] agasti tree To: peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, sanskrit digest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" raavaNa is also known as paulastya (a descendent of pulasta, his grandfather). Wonder if the "pulasta" name has some meaning/significance. Also, wrt Mr. Ramakrishnan's mail on Agasti tree/Shankaraacharya/Kaladi: I know there was a Sanskrit movie produced on Adi Shankaracharya's life several years ago. Does anyone know if you can get a video cassette/DVD of that movie from somewhere? I wonder if that was the only Sanskrit movie ever produced! peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I am thankful to those who are participating in this topic. Here I am straying away from the main topic. Regarding the meaning of a tree named agasti. (MW-Agasti Grandiflora, agasti-dru} This is a tree of small height grown on the dividing mud boundaries of rice fields. Nowadays it is grown along with sugarcane also. It is used mainly as fodder for cattle. The green leaves are also used for cooking. In Tamil Nad it is called aathi-keerai, obviously from agasti>agathi>aathi. I am told that it has properties to cure mouth ulcer and therefore eaten with pulses. In olden days taking it once in fifteen days was religiously followed. I remember that when the Sankaracharya of Sringeri was camping at Kalady for several months, the Mutt employees were hunting for aathi-keerai for the Acharya"s dwaadashi paarayanam. It is not generally cultivated in Kerala. I do not know how it got the adjective Bengali. When I was living in Calcutta for many years, I have seen this being sold in large quantities in the vegetable market. Probably it is grown largely in Bengal. It must have got the name agasti because just like agasti (agastya) it has a short stature compared to other trees. PKRamakrishnan --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers!_______________________________________________ sanskrit mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit ...Vis Tekumalla [EMAIL PROTECTED] --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/private/sanskrit/attachments/20040812/4c95ef48/attachment-0001.htm ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 06:48:47 -0700 (PDT) From: peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] agasti tree To: Vis Tekumalla <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, sanskrit digest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" We are straying still farther away from the main topic. The movie on Adi Sankaracharya was the first and perhaps the only one in Sanskrit. It was produced by late K.V.Iyer of Bangalore. I shall enquire if any DVD is available in Bangalore. I am not sure whether he produced a second Sanskrit Movie on Bhagavat Gita. Vis Tekumalla <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: raavaNa is also known as paulastya (a descendent of pulasta, his grandfather). Wonder if the "pulasta" name has some meaning/significance. Also, wrt Mr. Ramakrishnan's mail on Agasti tree/Shankaraacharya/Kaladi: I know there was a Sanskrit movie produced on Adi Shankaracharya's life several years ago. Does anyone know if you can get a video cassette/DVD of that movie from somewhere? I wonder if that was the only Sanskrit movie ever produced! peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I am thankful to those who are participating in this topic. Here I am straying away from the main topic. Regarding the meaning of a tree named agasti. (MW-Agasti Grandiflora, agasti-dru} This is a tree of small height grown on the dividing mud boundaries of rice fields. Nowadays it is grown along with sugarcane also. It is used mainly as fodder for cattle. The green leaves are also used for cooking. In Tamil Nad it is called aathi-keerai, obviously from agasti>agathi>aathi. I am told that it has properties to cure mouth ulcer and therefore eaten with pulses. In olden days taking it once in fifteen days was religiously followed. I remember that when the Sankaracharya of Sringeri was camping at Kalady for several months, the Mutt employees were hunting for aathi-keerai for the Acharya"s dwaadashi paarayanam. It is not generally cultivated in Kerala. I do not know how it got the adjective Bengali. When I was living in Calcutta for many years, I have seen this being sold in large quantities in the vegetable market. Probably it is grown largely in Bengal. It must have got the name agasti because just like agasti (agastya) it has a short stature compared to other trees. PKRamakrishnan --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers!_______________________________________________ sanskrit mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit ...Vis Tekumalla [EMAIL PROTECTED] --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out! --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/private/sanskrit/attachments/20040812/4218ceba/attachment.htm ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ sanskrit mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.cs.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/sanskrit End of sanskrit Digest, Vol 17, Issue 7 ***************************************