[scifinoir2] list of the 50 top socialist sf stories
_http://www.fantasticmetropolis.com/i/50socialist/full/_ (http://www.fantasticmetropolis.com/i/50socialist/full/) Carole McDonnell_Then said I: 'Here am I; send me. _ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GenreChristianWriters) www.geocities.com/scifiwritir/OreoBlues.html groups.yahoo.com/group/genrechristianwriters _groups.yahoo.com/group/Thecontestinganthologist_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Thecontestinganthologist) (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EthnicChristianWriters) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- font face=arial size=-1a href=http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12h7hp6s9/M=362335.6886444.7839734.2575449/D=groups/S=1705034827:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1123172242/A=2894362/R=0/SIG=138c78jl6/*http://www.networkforgood.org/topics/arts_culture/?source=YAHOOcmpgn=GRPRTP=http://groups.yahoo.com/;What would our lives be like without music, dance, and theater?Donate or volunteer in the arts today at Network for Good/a./font ~- Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/scifinoir2/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[scifinoir2] Re: What does Sci-Fi have against Black people?
--- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, DJ VIBE [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Battlestar Galactica: (New Series) Well, there's a COMMUNICATIONS officer. . . . Apparently all of the other Black people, with the exception of the religious leader, were killed in the bombing of Caprica. Same with Buck Rogers - I don't recall ever seeing a dark face on there, with the exception of the singers with three mouths - guess all the Black folks were killed off in the cataclysm while Buck was traveling through time. It seems that all the Black people live on Gemina (not Jemima, but too damn close) and are zealatous worshipers of the Kobol lords. Besides the communications officer, we've got the security guard who slips the president her meds, a priestess, and the leader from Gemina who was the first to bow before the Pres last episode. Wow, a race of magical negroes. You know Ron means well, but come on. Perhaps we'll have some strong characters when the Pegasus shows up. I think its that sci-fi in general doesn't have very many Black folks in it at all levels - writers, producers, directors, etc. I think that when none of the people who create something look like Wesley Snipes, chances are they will have issues, or at least some difficulty, seeing a Black face in that role - especially when that role has real power and possibilities for sexual attraction. In the new BSG, there's NO real reason why Adama couldn't have been Black, for example, unless the racial politics on Caprica also echo our civilization. In fact, the very concept of the series should lead to more color-blind casting as the Roman Empire, which this civilization is based on (or which perhaps was influenced by *this* civilization?) didn't do ethnic-based slavery. A good example of what the lack of Black folks behind the scenes does is the movie Pleasantville. This was an entire movie about people who lived in a Black and White world. The movie makes the point that the people there weren't alive until COLOR was introduced - yet there were NO Black people in the movie and only a few people of color in the beginning high school sequence in our world. To me, being Black and all, it seems obvious that the most shocking and obvious thing in this movie would have been the introduction of a Black person, or a whole *bunch* of Black people. Imagine finding out about the concept of color and then finding out that not only things can be different colors but PEOPLE as well! But I digress. . . . One of the things the original show *did* do well, IMHO, was show diversity - not just in the casting (having Asian and Black major characters) but the extras as well. Unlike Friends and other TV shows which seem to exist in some mythically White world (no Black or Hispanics in friggin NEW YORK!?!), there were people of color there - yes they were in the background, but there were THERE. Anyway, I've always said we'd be much better off if, instead of begging Whitey for inclusion, we would form companies and produce our own media. If we really want to see Sci-Fi and other media outlets change their views, or lack therof, of Black folk, we need to get up off our collective duff and make them or, if lacking the knowledge and ability to make them, make it a point to support those who are. If films like Sankofa and Rosewood got the support we give films like Scarface and Willie Wonka (I *think* I saw 1 Black person in the film not counting the Oompa Loompa guy), I don't think this would be an issue. Thoughts? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- font face=arial size=-1a href=http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12hau5g37/M=362335.6886444.7839734.2575449/D=groups/S=1705034827:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1123186127/A=2894362/R=0/SIG=138c78jl6/*http://www.networkforgood.org/topics/arts_culture/?source=YAHOOcmpgn=GRPRTP=http://groups.yahoo.com/;What would our lives be like without music, dance, and theater?Donate or volunteer in the arts today at Network for Good/a./font ~- Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/scifinoir2/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: What does Sci-Fi have against Black people?
i posted about this during Season one of Galactica and did a count of Blacks. I counted about three or four, incuding the comm officer and some nameless pilots (I assume) used in the background. I then found a lot of Blacks existed afterall: on the prison barge! When Apollo was sent over there to quell the riots, the place was lousy with Big Black Man, most of them dark-skinned as hell and bald... -- Original message -- --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, DJ VIBE [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Battlestar Galactica: (New Series) Well, there's a COMMUNICATIONS officer. . . . Apparently all of the other Black people, with the exception of the religious leader, were killed in the bombing of Caprica. Same with Buck Rogers - I don't recall ever seeing a dark face on there, with the exception of the singers with three mouths - guess all the Black folks were killed off in the cataclysm while Buck was traveling through time. It seems that all the Black people live on Gemina (not Jemima, but too damn close) and are zealatous worshipers of the Kobol lords. Besides the communications officer, we've got the security guard who slips the president her meds, a priestess, and the leader from Gemina who was the first to bow before the Pres last episode. Wow, a race of magical negroes. You know Ron means well, but come on. Perhaps we'll have some strong characters when the Pegasus shows up. I think its that sci-fi in general doesn't have very many Black folks in it at all levels - writers, producers, directors, etc. I think that when none of the people who create something look like Wesley Snipes, chances are they will have issues, or at least some difficulty, seeing a Black face in that role - especially when that role has real power and possibilities for sexual attraction. In the new BSG, there's NO real reason why Adama couldn't have been Black, for example, unless the racial politics on Caprica also echo our civilization. In fact, the very concept of the series should lead to more color-blind casting as the Roman Empire, which this civilization is based on (or which perhaps was influenced by *this* civilization?) didn't do ethnic-based slavery. A good example of what the lack of Black folks behind the scenes does is the movie Pleasantville. This was an entire movie about people who lived in a Black and White world. The movie makes the point that the people there weren't alive until COLOR was introduced - yet there were NO Black people in the movie and only a few people of color in the beginning high school sequence in our world. To me, being Black and all, it seems obvious that the most shocking and obvious thing in this movie would have been the introduction of a Black person, or a whole *bunch* of Black people. Imagine finding out about the concept of color and then finding out that not only things can be different colors but PEOPLE as well! But I digress. . . . One of the things the original show *did* do well, IMHO, was show diversity - not just in the casting (having Asian and Black major characters) but the extras as well. Unlike Friends and other TV shows which seem to exist in some mythically White world (no Black or Hispanics in friggin NEW YORK!?!), there were people of color there - yes they were in the background, but there were THERE. Anyway, I've always said we'd be much better off if, instead of begging Whitey for inclusion, we would form companies and produce our own media. If we really want to see Sci-Fi and other media outlets change their views, or lack therof, of Black folk, we need to get up off our collective duff and make them or, if lacking the knowledge and ability to make them, make it a point to support those who are. If films like Sankofa and Rosewood got the support we give films like Scarface and Willie Wonka (I *think* I saw 1 Black person in the film not counting the Oompa Loompa guy), I don't think this would be an issue. Thoughts? YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group scifinoir2 on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- font face=arial size=-1a href=http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12hf5viuo/M=362335.6886444.7839734.2575449/D=groups/S=1705034827:TM/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1123194436/A=2894362/R=0/SIG=138c78jl6/*http://www.networkforgood.org/topics/arts_culture/?source=YAHOOcmpgn=GRPRTP=http://groups.yahoo.com/;What would our lives be like without music, dance, and theater?Donate or volunteer in the arts today at Network for Good/a./font ~- Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to:
Re: [scifinoir2] Why the future of sci-fi could be British
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: FYI... Interesting analysis. If reality TV is a guide, some empty suits at the TV studios will adapt/change/steal sci-fi show ideas from British TV and cinema for a US audience; rather than look at home for creative sources. George Captain The USS Ronald E. McNair (Boston) - - - - - - - - - - - - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4742177.stm Last Updated: Thursday, 4 August 2005, 12:06 GMT 13:06 UK Why the future could be British By Mark Ward Technology Correspondent, BBC News website Science-fiction and fantasy are hard to escape at the moment and it's the British writers winning the plaudits. Why? Might it be because of this: The future perfect Famed Scottish novelist Iain Banks talks about how science fiction has turned anti-American, and why there'll be no WMD in outer space. - - - - - - - - - - - - By Andrew Leonard When Scottish writer Iain Banks learned that Prime Minister Tony Blair was supporting President Bush in the war on Iraq, he ripped up his passport and mailed the pieces to No. 10, Downing Street. The bestselling author of both mainstream novels and (under the semi-pseudonym Iain M. Banks) science fiction clearly isn't afraid of the grand gesture. And why should he be? By all accounts the annual royalties earned on his prodigious output - 20 or so books in as many years - have left him flush enough to live the life he pleases, writing only three months a year and devoting the rest to fast cars and whatever else he feels like. And even if Banks is a short-term pessimist, his science fiction has a more hopeful tint. Where other science fiction writers seem magnetically drawn to dystopian futures full of biotech horrors and cyberpunk darkness, Banks gives us instead the Culture, a civilization of the far future full of abundance and possibility and extremely fetching sentient starships. Racism, sexism, class warfare - the Culture has edited all that junk out of the future, and wouldn't you just love to live there? Labeled the most imaginative British novelist of his generation by the London Times, Banks has been a big name in the U.K. ever since the publication of his first novel, The Wasp Factory, in 1984. He's also well known on both sides of the Atlantic in the science fiction world, dating back at least as far as the publication of Consider Phlebas in 1987. But his mainstream novels, which often deal quite directly with politics, such as the attack on Margaret Thatcher's rule in 1993's Complicity, have not been popular in the United States. Banks made news again recently with his decision to choose a small independent publishing house, San Francisco's Night Shade Books, for his newest, non-Culture sci-fi novel, The Algebraist, due out in the United States in September. Banks' decision is something of a coup for Night Shade, an essentially three-man operation that has grown slowly but steadily for a decade and a half. To anyone who has been paying attention to the brilliant crop of science fiction and fantasy writers who have emerged from Britain in the last decade or so, it shouldn't come as any surprise that Banks takes his politics seriously. Some of his most sparkling U.K. colleagues - Ken MacLeod, China Mieville, Richard Morgan - infuse their work with a passion that, no matter how fantastical the stories, is rooted in discontent with the real world. We talked with Banks, via telephone from his home in Scotland, to get a fix on this new dissident sci-fi invasion. What prompted this switch to Night Shade? You were with Bantam Spectra [a division of Random House] before, weren't you? [Chuckles ruefully.] I think I've kind of played the field with the U.S., all the main contenders over time. Bless them - they've all tried. And I think through no fault of their own, they've all failed to make me big in the States. The conclusion I've come to is that I just don't write for an American audience as far as the mainstream is concerned. The science fiction has done reasonably well. I've had some quite reasonable deals out of them, but they have never earned out or made any royalties. And usually after a few months a very large packet of books comes back and ends up in my garage gathering dust. I think with Night Shade it is a bit different because they are a smaller concern. I'm kind of a bigger fish in a smaller pond, and there's real enthusiasm over there. With the larger corporate concerns it's harder to maintain that enthusiastic edge. These guys are so enthusiastic, I thought it was worth a try. Do you have any theories as to why the mainstream novels might not be working over here? Are they too U.K.? I guess they must be. I think if I'd only had one publisher, or if I had only had one very small handful of novels, I could still delude myself that it was the publisher or publicity people or whatever. But I think given that so many different concerns or different companies have tried, I think you have to face facts that the common
[scifinoir2] What will the future hold?
From a recent conversation. Which scenario seems most likely to you may reflect your current feelings about society, humanity, and the country in which you live: What will the world be like one hundred years from now? Hmmm...let's consult the ol' crystal ball... Scenario one: Utopia. Leaving behind the destructive depencies on fossil fuels and mechanisms, we have returned to Eden. We are one with the Earth, using holistic medicine, eating organic food (much of which is produced from giant kelp farms on the ocean). Solar and wind power provide most of our energy, along with safe, clean fusion. Travel across the world is possible via underground supersonic tubes; cars when used are electric, and use vast intelligent networks to drive you to your destination and avoid accidents. Cities are built with a mind to blend with the environment, rather than disrupt it. The rainforests, coral reefs, plankton, and the ozone layer are all on the rebound. Racism and religious intolerance have been replaced with an embrace of diversity. Worldwide cooperation in the life sciences has cured most disease and yielded phenomenal methods to heal injuries. The average human lives to be 110 years old. Luna and Mars have been colonized and are yielding valuable materials which can only be produced in low-G environments. Humanity is exploring the rest of the Solar System in ships which ride the solar winds. Wal-Mart is no more. American Idol has been outlawed. Examples: Can't think of a single bloody movie or book at the moment--at least, not one that doesn't end with Satan crawling back into Paradise and ruining things Likelihood: Not sure how likely this future is. I'll ask the Easter Bunny and Santa what they think next time I see them... Scenario two: Status quo. The world goes on much the way it always has. Some good times, some bad. Good leaders, crooked leaders. Rogue states, and cooperative alliances. Lots of wars still being fought, just no world wars, no nuclear exchanges. Terrorism still a problem but the dreaded nuking of a city by fanatics never took place. (Okay, maybe one). Some people prosper, some starve. Some countries are rich, others are still poor. Technological improvements abound in terms of DNA research, AI, curing disease, etc. For many the world's a better place, but it's not Utopia. We go to work, to school, to the movies--which are now holographic--the same as previous decades. Kids learn more thanks to neural hookups that tie their brains directly into their computer ports, and phone calls are made and answered with circuitry implanted in the bones of the skull. None of it is any more out of the ordinary than iPods or PDAs are now. In short, it's more of the same, with humanity crawling slowly forward, with times of regression. It'll be a world much like ours, just with cooler stuff. Examples: Minority Report (minus the telepathy angle), Star Trek, Century City Likelihood: Highly probable. If we don't kill ourselves I think humanity will just muddle along... Scenario three: Big Brother as God. Technologically and materially we'll be much like Scenario two above. But socially, politically--ah, there's the rub! A world in which religious and philosphical views dictate our personal lives even more than now. Separation of Church and State is gone, replaced by virtual theocracies in which state views on religion and morality shape everything you do. Need a job? Worship the right god (or in some countries, none at all). Call yourself a Christian? Better be the right kind if you want to avoid harassment. Better watch the right TV shows, read the right books, surf the right Web sites, as the Patriot Act will have expanded to give the government the right to monitor anything you do, anytime they feel like it. School prayer is mandatory, Bible studies enforced as part of the curriculum, evolution not only not taught, but a criminal offense to discuss. Newspapers run by the state, reporters little more than hand-picked stooges to filter what info the public receives. In America the two-party system has died off, as only the Constitutional Conservative Christian Party is allowed to field candidates. Behaviour is closely monitored, from the type (and gender) of partner you pick, to the number of kids you can have, how they're raised, and where they go to school. The draft is back, needed to back aggressive policies that often lead to conflict with other countries who don't yet see the Light. Europe in a type of tailspin since the US has broken most ties with it and put unacceptable conditions on the alliances it makes. The loss of US power and support, coupled with the rise of China, threatens the stability of the EU. Other countries, both upset and galvanized by the increasing factionilism and theocratic leaning of the West, see it as an excuse to become even more totalitarian than before. Some become increasingly fanatic about their own religious beliefs, others become more agnostic. Life
Re: [scifinoir2] What will the future hold?
I think storieswe see usually end or start the way they do because...well, it seems the human tendency is to try to bring order to a universe that tends toward disorder rather than to harmonize with it...Why try to force it into your idea of perfection intead of embracing and working with its uniqueness? Also, all of humanity resists, though unsuccessfully, change. Even the most open-minded of us tend to resist change in some form or another...But for story writers, that's ok...It is conflict that makes the stories interesting. Any one of the scenarios are great to me although Utopia seems the most unrealistic to me...No matter how perfect a world, someone's idea of Utopia will be someone else's idea of Hell, i.e. 'Logan's Run' and 'A Brave New World'...However, I'd love to see a universe where reality shows are outlawed under penalty of death! LOL Keith Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:From a recent conversation. Which scenario seems most likely to you may reflect your current feelings about society, humanity, and the country in which you live: What will the world be like one hundred years from now? Hmmm...let's consult the ol' crystal ball... Scenario one: Utopia. Leaving behind the destructive depencies on fossil fuels and mechanisms, we have returned to Eden. We are one with the Earth, using holistic medicine, eating organic food (much of which is produced from giant kelp farms on the ocean). Solar and wind power provide most of our energy, along with safe, clean fusion. Travel across the world is possible via underground supersonic tubes; cars when used are electric, and use vast intelligent networks to drive you to your destination and avoid accidents. Cities are built with a mind to blend with the environment, rather than disrupt it. The rainforests, coral reefs, plankton, and the ozone layer are all on the rebound. Racism and religious intolerance have been replaced with an embrace of diversity. Worldwide cooperation in the life sciences has cured most disease and yielded phenomenal methods to heal injuries. The average human lives to be 110 years old. Luna and Mars have been colonized and are yielding valuable materials which can only be produced in low-G environments. Humanity is exploring the rest of the Solar System in ships which ride the solar winds. Wal-Mart is no more. American Idol has been outlawed. Examples: Can't think of a single bloody movie or book at the moment--at least, not one that doesn't end with Satan crawling back into Paradise and ruining things Likelihood: Not sure how likely this future is. I'll ask the Easter Bunny and Santa what they think next time I see them... Scenario two: Status quo. The world goes on much the way it always has. Some good times, some bad. Good leaders, crooked leaders. Rogue states, and cooperative alliances. Lots of wars still being fought, just no world wars, no nuclear exchanges. Terrorism still a problem but the dreaded nuking of a city by fanatics never took place. (Okay, maybe one). Some people prosper, some starve. Some countries are rich, others are still poor. Technological improvements abound in terms of DNA research, AI, curing disease, etc. For many the world's a better place, but it's not Utopia. We go to work, to school, to the movies--which are now holographic--the same as previous decades. Kids learn more thanks to neural hookups that tie their brains directly into their computer ports, and phone calls are made and answered with circuitry implanted in the bones of the skull. None of it is any more out of the ordinary than iPods or PDAs are now. In short, it's more of the same, with humanity crawling slowly forward, with times of regression. It'll be a world much like ours, just with cooler stuff. Examples: Minority Report (minus the telepathy angle), Star Trek, Century City Likelihood: Highly probable. If we don't kill ourselves I think humanity will just muddle along... Scenario three: Big Brother as God. Technologically and materially we'll be much like Scenario two above. But socially, politically--ah, there's the rub! A world in which religious and philosphical views dictate our personal lives even more than now. Separation of Church and State is gone, replaced by virtual theocracies in which state views on religion and morality shape everything you do. Need a job? Worship the right god (or in some countries, none at all). Call yourself a Christian? Better be the right kind if you want to avoid harassment. Better watch the right TV shows, read the right books, surf the right Web sites, as the Patriot Act will have expanded to give the government the right to monitor anything you do, anytime they feel like it. School prayer is mandatory, Bible studies enforced as part of the curriculum, evolution not only not taught, but a criminal offense to discuss. Newspapers run by the state, reporters little more than hand-picked stooges to filter what info the public receives. In America the two-party system
