Re: CVS commit: src/bin/dd
David Holland dholland-sourcechan...@netbsd.org writes: Adding weird special case remote access hacks to dd (of all random tools) is also poor design. Why not for the next round add support for dd ifurl=http://www.netbsd.org/index.html of=mycopy or dd ifurl=http://www.netbsd.org/ recurse=true of=mytree/ After all, all you have to do to implement this is open a pipe to ftp or wget. Actually, neat idea (at least the first one)... -- Jim Wise jw...@draga.com pgpTopM5vOIzq.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: CVS commit: src/bin/dd
On Tue Nov 23 2010 at 12:28:48 +, Matthias Scheler wrote: On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 09:04:28PM +, Antti Kantee wrote: Module Name:src Committed By: pooka Date: Mon Nov 22 21:04:28 UTC 2010 Modified Files: src/bin/dd: Makefile args.c dd.c dd.h extern.h position.c Log Message: Add two new operands: rif and rof. They operate exactly like if and of with the exception that the communicate with a rump kernel instead of the host kernel. This makes dd unusable if only / but not /usr is mounted because it now depends on /usr/lib/librumpclient.so.0. Utilities in /bin and /sbin are supposed to work without /usr mounted. Good catch. Fixed. Sorry 'bout that oversight. (on a slight tangent, wasn't getting rid of /usr vs. / on the roadmap?)
Re: CVS commit: src/bin/dd
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 02:42:04PM +0200, Antti Kantee wrote: (on a slight tangent, wasn't getting rid of /usr vs. / on the roadmap?) I don't know that. I personally don't create /usr partitions on my NetBSD systems anymore. But they usually have hard disks with multiple gigabytes of storage space. /usr over NFS is useful for a system with a shortage of local disk space. Kind regards -- Matthias Scheler http://zhadum.org.uk/
Re: CVS commit: src/bin/dd
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 02:42:04PM +0200, Antti Kantee wrote: On Tue Nov 23 2010 at 12:28:48 +, Matthias Scheler wrote: On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 09:04:28PM +, Antti Kantee wrote: Module Name: src Committed By: pooka Date: Mon Nov 22 21:04:28 UTC 2010 Modified Files: src/bin/dd: Makefile args.c dd.c dd.h extern.h position.c Log Message: Add two new operands: rif and rof. They operate exactly like if and of with the exception that the communicate with a rump kernel instead of the host kernel. This makes dd unusable if only / but not /usr is mounted because it now depends on /usr/lib/librumpclient.so.0. Utilities in /bin and /sbin are supposed to work without /usr mounted. Good catch. Fixed. Sorry 'bout that oversight. That doesn't resolve the concerns why this non standard options were added to dd. Can we go back to the previous versions for the moment and discuss it and then do further changes? Bernd
Re: CVS commit: src/bin/dd
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 12:19:36AM +0200, Antti Kantee wrote: Surely it would be more appropriate to make thye rump kernel directly forward some paths to the real kernel? Can you explain how that could work? First thoughts are something like the way /../ is used to 'escape' from the emulation root. But maybe just mount the real filesystem within the rump kernel? Making something work well enough to copy files is probably not that hard! David -- David Laight: da...@l8s.co.uk
Re: CVS commit: src/bin/dd
On Tue Nov 23 2010 at 18:41:21 +, David Laight wrote: On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 12:19:36AM +0200, Antti Kantee wrote: Surely it would be more appropriate to make thye rump kernel directly forward some paths to the real kernel? Can you explain how that could work? First thoughts are something like the way /../ is used to 'escape' from the emulation root. But maybe just mount the real filesystem within the rump kernel? The client may be on a different machine, so you'd have to, if not invent a completely new protocol, at least include server side functionality on the client and add some weird pingpong/adjust logic into the server. Making something work well enough to copy files is probably not that hard! Adding a ton of special case code to copy files is extremely poor design! Doubly so since the only reason is because you don't happen to like some flags which bring 0 cost when not used. If you don't like them, don't use them. Unless someone can actually name a *problem*, move along.
Re: CVS commit: src/bin/dd
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 02:42:04PM +0200, Antti Kantee wrote: (on a slight tangent, wasn't getting rid of /usr vs. / on the roadmap?) No. -- David A. Holland dholl...@netbsd.org
Re: CVS commit: src/bin/dd
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 08:50:54PM +0200, Antti Kantee wrote: Surely it would be more appropriate to make thye rump kernel directly forward some paths to the real kernel? Can you explain how that could work? First thoughts are something like the way /../ is used to 'escape' from the emulation root. But maybe just mount the real filesystem within the rump kernel? The client may be on a different machine, so you'd have to, if not invent a completely new protocol, at least include server side functionality on the client and add some weird pingpong/adjust logic into the server. But you must already have this protocol in order to be able to reach the client, no? But if not, we already have nfs, there's no need to reinvent it. Making something work well enough to copy files is probably not that hard! Adding a ton of special case code to copy files is extremely poor design! Adding weird special case remote access hacks to dd (of all random tools) is also poor design. Why not for the next round add support for dd ifurl=http://www.netbsd.org/index.html of=mycopy or dd ifurl=http://www.netbsd.org/ recurse=true of=mytree/ After all, all you have to do to implement this is open a pipe to ftp or wget. Doubly so since the only reason is because you don't happen to like some flags which bring 0 cost when not used. If you don't like them, don't use them. Poorly thought-out features cause a lot of long-term overhead. Unless someone can actually name a *problem*, move along. I'd say the first problem is that this wasn't discussed anywhere. -- David A. Holland dholl...@netbsd.org
Re: CVS commit: src/bin/dd
On Mon Nov 22 2010 at 22:09:24 +, David Laight wrote: On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 09:04:28PM +, Antti Kantee wrote: Module Name:src Committed By: pooka Date: Mon Nov 22 21:04:28 UTC 2010 Modified Files: src/bin/dd: Makefile args.c dd.c dd.h extern.h position.c Log Message: Add two new operands: rif and rof. They operate exactly like if and of with the exception that the communicate with a rump kernel instead of the host kernel. H this seems like polluting a standard utility to support a very specific use. Surely it would be more appropriate to make thye rump kernel directly forward some paths to the real kernel? Can you explain how that could work?
Re: CVS commit: src/bin/dd
On Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 10:09:24PM +, David Laight wrote: Add two new operands: rif and rof. They operate exactly like if and of with the exception that the communicate with a rump kernel instead of the host kernel. H this seems like polluting a standard utility to support a very specific use. (Was this discussed anywhere?) Surely it would be more appropriate to make thye rump kernel directly forward some paths to the real kernel? Yeah, that... -- David A. Holland dholl...@netbsd.org