Re: [Sugar-devel] [SoaS] The next Step: v2 Roadmap

2009-07-05 Thread Martin Dengler
On Sun, Jul 05, 2009 at 12:51:22AM +0200, Sebastian Dziallas wrote:
 Hi everybody,
 
 so here it is, the Sugar on a Stick v2 Roadmap:
 
 http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick/Roadmap#Roadmap
 
 Feedback is appreciated, and as we've just entered brainstorming phase, 
 please go ahead and shoot your ideas! :) More to come...

For F12 (not beyond), what is the advantage of using RPMs to
distribute Fructose[1], given OLPC is not[2]?

 --Sebastian

Martin

1. 
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick/Roadmap#Fructose_modules_.28F11.29

2. http://www.mail-archive.com/de...@lists.laptop.org/msg19673.html


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Re: [Sugar-devel] Jaunty up and running

2009-07-05 Thread Sascha Silbe

On Sat, Jul 04, 2009 at 05:43:38PM +0200, James Michael DuPont wrote:


The report is with jhbuild on debian jaunty. I built it from scratch.
Started with jhbuild run
I guess you mean Ubuntu Jaunty. How did you build? Can you give the 
exact commands you used to build and run, please? What does 
./sugar-jhbuild depscheck say?



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Re: [Sugar-devel] Jaunty up and running

2009-07-05 Thread James Michael DuPont
Sascha,
It build and installed all according to the instructions.
I dont have this all here at the moment as I said. If you have any
questions, you can see my build snapshot, that contains everything.
I have put 2 days of work and finally got it running on ubuntu, you can see
the patches.

You can find many bug reports of sugar on ubuntu and others. I dont know of
anyone who sugar works. Everyone who tried the packages complained of
problems.

How come this is so difficult? How come you guys dont test the packages
yourself?
Installing ubuntu takes about 30 minutes. You can run it it on a virtual
machine.

Can you tell me of sugar working on any distro out of the box?
are there any success stories?
I really cannot find anything on ubuntu except wiki pages that are out of
date.
Sorry, but this is very frustrating.
thanks
mike

On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 6:20 PM, Sascha Silbe 
sascha-ml-ui-sugar-de...@silbe.org wrote:

 On Sat, Jul 04, 2009 at 05:43:38PM +0200, James Michael DuPont wrote:

  The report is with jhbuild on debian jaunty. I built it from scratch.
 Started with jhbuild run

 I guess you mean Ubuntu Jaunty. How did you build? Can you give the exact
 commands you used to build and run, please? What does ./sugar-jhbuild
 depscheck say?



 CU Sascha

 --
 http://sascha.silbe.org/
 http://www.infra-silbe.de/

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Jaunty up and running

2009-07-05 Thread Sascha Silbe

On Sun, Jul 05, 2009 at 08:25:16PM +0200, James Michael DuPont wrote:


Sascha,
It build and installed all according to the instructions.

Which instructions specifically?


I dont have this all here at the moment as I said. If you have any
questions, you can see my build snapshot, that contains everything.
Unfortunately a build tree is a bit unwieldy to examine manually and 
also does not show the commands you used. I could at least verify you're 
using the right version of sugar-jhbuild, though.


I have put 2 days of work and finally got it running on ubuntu, you 
can see

the patches.
That is _way_ too much. sugar-jhbuild should work exactly as described 
on [2] for any of the supported distros (Debian squeeze/sid, Ubuntu 
Intrepid/Jaunty, Fedora 10/11/12). I regularly check this myself, in 
addition to the buildbots [1] doing automatic builds.
There's something seriously wrong with your installation, so please 
let's find the problem before you waste another day encountering bugs 
that are caused by the same root issue.
I'll try to be on IRC (#sugar on irc.freenode.net) tomorrow, so maybe we 
can figure it out interactively.


You can find many bug reports of sugar on ubuntu and others. I dont 
know of

anyone who sugar works. Everyone who tried the packages complained of
problems.
Sorry, I'm confused now. Are you talking about sugar-jhbuild or about 
the Sugar packages included in Ubuntu? Those are two entirely separate 
things (and shouldn't be mixed).
Is it possible you installed both in parallel? If you did that might 
very well be the reason for your problems.


How come this is so difficult? How come you guys dont test the 
packages

yourself?
Installing ubuntu takes about 30 minutes. You can run it it on a 
virtual

machine.
I do test sugar-jhbuild on all of the supported distros. I even use 
sugar-jhbuild on Debian squeeze regularly myself (as a user).
What I don't do is testing the distro-supplied packages as that's the 
respective distro maintainers job.



Can you tell me of sugar working on any distro out of the box?

You might want to try Sugar on a Stick [3].

I really cannot find anything on ubuntu except wiki pages that are out 
of

date.
Where did you find those out of date pages? I tried to clean up all 
sugar-jhbuild related pages but have obviously overlooked some.



[1] http://buildbot.sugarlabs.org/
[2] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Jhbuild
[3] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/SoaS

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Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] Sugarcamp - November 7th-12th 2009 ?

2009-07-05 Thread Simon Schampijer
On 07/01/2009 05:38 PM, David Farning wrote:
 On Wed, Jul 1, 2009 at 6:41 AM, Simon Schampijersi...@schampijer.de  wrote:
 On 07/01/2009 12:49 AM, David Farning wrote:
 On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 5:45 PM, Simon Schampijersi...@schampijer.de
   wrote:
 On 06/29/2009 10:09 PM, David Farning wrote:
 On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 9:55 AM, Simon Schampijersi...@schampijer.de
   wrote:
 Hi,

 the SFScon 2009 will be held in Bolzano [1]. As part of that the TIS[2]
 would be willing host a Sugarcamp. The camp would be part of the free
 software week [3], where a GNOME Hackfest will happen as well.

 It fits quite well in our release cycle (0.88 planning/hacking) and
 having the GNOME Hackfest next door would create nice synergies. We
 would start on a weekend to have better chances on getting (students
 and
 people who have to work during the week) everyone a chance to attend.

 How does that sound?
 Sounds good.

 Any one in mind to champion the event?
 Do you have a point of contact with event organizers so we can start
 working on the admin?
 I'll help. But based on LinuxTag you seem to have event organization
 pretty much figured out.

 david
 The Sugarcamp will be a different event than Linuxtag. Linuxtag was a show
 where you have to setup gear and get promotion material together, the camp
 is more planning what you want to discuss during those days.

 Having participated in SugarCamp Paris and some FudCons.  How do you
 feel about the participant led format of the event?

 FWIW, SugarCamp Paris was intentional in it's lack of pre-organization
 to break from the 'Sage on Stage' broadcasting to the unwashed masses
 nature of previous Sugar Labs meetings.

I like how Fudcon handles it - that would be a good way to go for me. It 
is good to announce some topics - so interested people have the 
possibility to join. And - we should see what the GNOME people are up 
to, too.

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FUDCon/Organization

Regards,
Simon
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[Sugar-devel] Read Activity question (single page view)

2009-07-05 Thread Gary C Martin
Hi Sayamindu,

Saw some of your Read roadmap items today, and just wanted to ping and  
ask how viable you think it would be for Read to support a single page  
by page view for PDFs (rather than current continuous scrolling mode)?

I've been thinking it would be better for memory consumption  
(continuous scrolling has to have both pages rendered in memory as you  
scroll over page boundaries), and also would be better for page by  
page reading for many books, presentations (Sameer Verma mentioned  
this in an IAEP mail today), and I'm working on some pdf materials  
like the old adventure book stories, where you traverse different  
pages in a non-linear way (works a bit like a point and click  
adventure/escape-the-room type thing).

Does evince support single page render mode?

If you think it's viable, but don't have the time yourself, let me  
know and I'll see if I can get something working here (never used  
evince myself so wanted to check with you first before I head off down  
a blind alley).

Regards,
--Gary
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Jaunty up and running

2009-07-05 Thread James Michael DuPont
Ok,
I mean the ubunutu and fedora packages are broken.
Jhbuild, we will have to go through this together when I am online.
this latop cannot even begin to use jhbuild, it is an aspire one. 512 mb or
ram and no space left.

I am sorry to be so frustrated, but it is too much to ask normal users to
use jhbuild.
I hope to help clean up the packages and as soon as we figure out the
problems, I will help patch the errors.
It is just interesting that the errors with the icons are showing up on all
systems, the errors are not seriously wrong, it is a simple patch.
more tomorrow, I look forward to working with you to make sugar run out of
the box on ubuntu. that will help get more users and will help the project
in the long run.
thanks,
mike

On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 9:56 PM, Sascha Silbe 
sascha-ml-ui-sugar-de...@silbe.org wrote:

 On Sun, Jul 05, 2009 at 08:25:16PM +0200, James Michael DuPont wrote:

  Sascha,
 It build and installed all according to the instructions.

 Which instructions specifically?

  I dont have this all here at the moment as I said. If you have any
 questions, you can see my build snapshot, that contains everything.

 Unfortunately a build tree is a bit unwieldy to examine manually and also
 does not show the commands you used. I could at least verify you're using
 the right version of sugar-jhbuild, though.

  I have put 2 days of work and finally got it running on ubuntu, you can
 see
 the patches.

 That is _way_ too much. sugar-jhbuild should work exactly as described on
 [2] for any of the supported distros (Debian squeeze/sid, Ubuntu
 Intrepid/Jaunty, Fedora 10/11/12). I regularly check this myself, in
 addition to the buildbots [1] doing automatic builds.
 There's something seriously wrong with your installation, so please let's
 find the problem before you waste another day encountering bugs that are
 caused by the same root issue.
 I'll try to be on IRC (#sugar on irc.freenode.net) tomorrow, so maybe we
 can figure it out interactively.

  You can find many bug reports of sugar on ubuntu and others. I dont know
 of
 anyone who sugar works. Everyone who tried the packages complained of
 problems.

 Sorry, I'm confused now. Are you talking about sugar-jhbuild or about the
 Sugar packages included in Ubuntu? Those are two entirely separate things
 (and shouldn't be mixed).
 Is it possible you installed both in parallel? If you did that might very
 well be the reason for your problems.

  How come this is so difficult? How come you guys dont test the packages
 yourself?
 Installing ubuntu takes about 30 minutes. You can run it it on a virtual
 machine.

 I do test sugar-jhbuild on all of the supported distros. I even use
 sugar-jhbuild on Debian squeeze regularly myself (as a user).
 What I don't do is testing the distro-supplied packages as that's the
 respective distro maintainers job.

  Can you tell me of sugar working on any distro out of the box?

 You might want to try Sugar on a Stick [3].

  I really cannot find anything on ubuntu except wiki pages that are out of
 date.

 Where did you find those out of date pages? I tried to clean up all
 sugar-jhbuild related pages but have obviously overlooked some.


 [1] http://buildbot.sugarlabs.org/
 [2] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Jhbuild
 [3] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/SoaS


 CU Sascha

 --
 http://sascha.silbe.org/
 http://www.infra-silbe.de/

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Free/Libre Open Source Software Kosova
FLOSSK
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Trimming down long wiki names

2009-07-05 Thread Frederick Grose
To continue trimming long wiki names, I propose to shift the Human Interface
Guidelines branch,
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Design_Team/Human_Interface_Guidelines, to the
wiki root,
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/index.php?title=Human_Interface_Guidelinesredirect=no
.

This will help to make the
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Design_Team#Subpagessection more usable.

I'll keep key redirect pages for external links.

 --Fred
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[Sugar-devel] Datastore redesign

2009-07-05 Thread Sascha Silbe

Hi!

After reading the recent threads about Journal / data store and the IDs 
used by them the big picture is much more clear now, thanks!
I've adjusted by datastore redesign proposal [1] accordingly and would 
like to submit it for review now.
It's not clear a full redesign is The Right Thing to do now, but I'd 
rather like to specify what it should look like, not what steps to take 
next towards it.


There's an important design decision that's still open:

Is the asynchronous API design useful enough to warrant more complex 
implementation?
  - DBus operations can be run asynchronously so UI responsiveness 
shouldn't be

an issue
  - For save() calls activity needs to wait for result (containing new
version_id) before it can invoke save() again for the same object
which can take quite some time if save() is sync - especially if 
other

activities are saving at the same time.

Making the API fully asynchronous is the cause for much of the 
complexity of my proposal, but if we eliminate the queueing the response 
times for write accesses and checkout() can be very long even for 
unrelated operations.



[1] 
http://git.sugarlabs.org/projects/versionsupport-project/repos/mainline/blobs/master/datastore-redesign.html


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Re: [Sugar-devel] Jaunty up and running

2009-07-05 Thread Sascha Silbe

On Sun, Jul 05, 2009 at 10:19:51PM +0200, James Michael DuPont wrote:


Ok,
I mean the ubunutu and fedora packages are broken.
OK, cannot say anything about that as I've stopped using distro packages 
quite some time ago. 0.82 never really worked for me and 0.84 wasn't 
available as distro packages back then. AFAIK SoaS uses the distro 
packages from Fedora 11 so those should be working fine, though.



Jhbuild, we will have to go through this together when I am online.
this latop cannot even begin to use jhbuild, it is an aspire one. 512 
mb or

ram and no space left.
None of the hosts I'm running sugar-jhbuild on has more than 512MB of 
RAM, whether physical (my non-XO Laptop) or simulated (for the virtual 
machines I use for testing). The XO (running sugar-jhbuild on Debian 
squeeze) even has only 256MB, a slow processor (AMD Geode) and is 
running from a 16GB SDHC card (the card itself is quite fast, but the SD 
interface in the XO is abysmally slow). The last rebuild that included 
xulrunner (we now use the distro package instead) took a full night.


I am sorry to be so frustrated, but it is too much to ask normal users 
to

use jhbuild.
Ideally normal users would use the distro packages. That these are 
outdated and/or don't work is something that needs to be and AFAICT is 
in the process of being fixed, e.g. Sugar 0.84 has now entered Debian 
squeeze thanks to Jonas. OpenSuSE should have recent, working packages 
as well (thanks to David van Assche).



more tomorrow, I look forward to working with you to make sugar run 
out of

the box on ubuntu.

Looking forward to that as well.

CU Sascha

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Datastore API changes

2009-07-05 Thread Sascha Silbe

On Sat, Jul 04, 2009 at 03:53:32PM +0200, Tomeu Vizoso wrote:


Another risk could be leaking inodes if we get a too complex hard-link
structure.
This should only happen on crashes as we're only keeping the VCS copy 
of the files, everything else is ephemeral.


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Re: [Sugar-devel] Trimming down ling wiki names

2009-07-05 Thread Simon Schampijer
On 07/04/2009 12:40 AM, Frederick Grose wrote:
 On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 9:06 AM, Frederick Grosefgr...@sugarlabs.orgwrote:

 On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 7:45 AM, Simon Schampijersi...@schampijer.dewrote:

 Hi Fred,

 it might makes sense to trim down our long wiki names. As we heavily use
 categories now - this might not be an issue. How about we do:

 http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.84 -
 http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/0.84/Roadmap

 and


 http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Releases/Sucrose/0.84-
 http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/0.84/Notes

 same for 0.82 and 0.86.

 What do you think? Can you do this without breaking current links?

 Regards,
Simon

 That should be possible and fits with the idea that DFarning reported of
 broadening the involvement in the platform development.

 I'll start with 0.82, http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/0.82, and leave wiki
 redirects to catch those linking from off-site links in blogs and other
 references.

   --Fred


 I've moved the Development Team/Releases branch to branches beginning with
 0.82, 0.84, 0.86,  0.88 (the stable branches).   See now that
 http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team#Platform_Release_Cycles and
 #/Subpages are a bit more readable.

 I seem to have lost
 http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.84 (notice
 that it redirects to 0.86/Roadmap).  Perhaps it was never saved, but only
 transformed into the 0.86 roadmap.

 --Fred

Hmmm, I think I have saved it :/ The history of the file does not show 
any sign of being overwritten. I guess we lost it.

The rest - does work all fine.

Thanks,
Simon

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar on a Stick - and OLPCsound/Csound

2009-07-05 Thread Art Hunkins
As mentioned by a member of the sugar-devel list, it seems that a csound (5.10) 
install (yum install csound), does not install several crucial site-specific 
and library packages (csnd, _csnd, libcsnd and perhaps libcsound).

Having to erase olpcsound before installing csound deletes these files and they 
don't get restored/reinstalled.

So, to the procedures described below, before erasing olpcsound, I saved the 
above-listed files (there were 5 or 6), and once csound was installed, added 
them back where they came from.

This crude procedure didn't work, and the following error log is quite like the 
one I started with:


/usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/sugar/util.py:25: DeprecationWarning: the sha 
module is deprecated; use the hashlib module instead

import sha

Traceback (most recent call last):

File /usr/bin/sugar-activity, line 21, in module

main.main()

File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/sugar/activity/main.py, line 105, in 
main

module = __import__(module_name) 

File /home/liveuser/Activities/OurMusic.activity/ourmusic.py, line 41, in 
module

import csndsugui

File /home/liveuser/Activities/OurMusic.activity/csndsugui.py, line 36, in 
module

import csnd

File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/csnd.py, line 7, in module

import _csnd

ImportError: /usr/lib/libcsnd.so.5.1: undefined symbol: csoundGetInputBuffer


I'd appreciate any suggestions as to how to get this all working. Thanks.

Art Hunkins
  - Original Message - 
  From: Art Hunkins 
  To: pbrobin...@gmail.com 
  Cc: cso...@lists.bath.ac.uk ; sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org 
  Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 7:57 PM
  Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] Sugar on a Stick - and OLPCsound


  I've just noted that the /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages folder does not 
include csnd.py. That folder also contains many fewer files that the 
corresponding one in python2.5.

  As a matter of fact, python2.5 seems about a third the size of 2.6. Is all 
this correct?

  Art Hunkins
- Original Message - 
From: Art Hunkins 
To: pbrobin...@gmail.com 
Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 6:13 PM
Subject: Fw: [Cs-dev] Sugar on a Stick - and OLPCsound


Hello, Peter,

Do you know what may be happening here? (Please see error log below.)

I've no idea why the module referenced (csd.py) is not found. Please also 
compare the log at the very bottom of this mail; this latter log was generated 
when running Csound*5.08*, also with python2.6.

Thanks for any insights.

Art Hunkins

- Original Message - 
From: Art Hunkins 
To: Developer discussions 
Cc: cso...@lists.bath.ac.uk 
Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 5:36 PM
Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] Sugar on a Stick - and OLPCsound


Here's the *next* chapter in the saga. Please note that this is not the 
*Windows* installation saga; it's the *Linux/Sugar* installation saga.

In our last episode, we noted that Csound5.08 was (apparently?) 
incompatible with python2.6. At least this seemed a plausible explanation from 
the error log we saw.

So, now Csound5.10 is available on Fedora(11) for download to SoaS.

First, I try update csound; can't find any csound.
Second, install csound; it tries, but then says, can't because it 
interferes with olpcsound (OK, different name!)
Third, erase olpcsound; good
Fourth, install csound; good

Then I run my Activity; it now crashes with the similar, but not exact, 
error log below.

I thought perhaps I'd better start from scratch and did (reformat USB 
drive, etc). Thought probably the new SoaS iso incorporated Csound5.10. But no, 
I needed to essentially repeat the above steps, and ended with the same crash.

The log: (any new ideas please?)

/usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/sugar/util.py:25: DeprecationWarning: the 
sha module is deprecated; use the hashlib module instead

import sha

Traceback (most recent call last):

File /usr/bin/sugar-activity, line 21, in module

main.main()

File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/sugar/activity/main.py, line 105, 
in main

module = __import__(module_name) 

File /home/liveuser/Activities/OurMusic.activity/ourmusic.py, line 41, in 
module

import csndsugui

File /home/liveuser/Activities/OurMusic.activity/csndsugui.py, line 36, 
in module

import csnd

ImportError: No module named csnd



Art Hunkins

  - Original Message - 
  From: victor 
  To: Art Hunkins ; Developer discussions 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 1:36 PM
  Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] Sugar on a Stick - and OLPCsound


  Because the 5.10 rpm has a python2.6 dependency. But that might
  be the case for 5.08 too (I am not sure).
- Original Message - 
From: Art Hunkins 
To: Developer discussions 
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 2:22 AM
Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] Sugar on a Stick - and OLPCsound


I just noticed that the current OLPC build includes 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Trimming down ling wiki names

2009-07-05 Thread Frederick Grose
On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 5:17 PM, Simon Schampijer si...@schampijer.dewrote:

 ... I guess we lost it.


Reconstructed from the Google cache for 16 June 2009,
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/0.84/Roadmap.
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Journal feature request--more data in main display

2009-07-05 Thread Gary C Martin
On 4 Jul 2009, at 04:19, Eben Eliason wrote:
 I'll throw this idea back out there for fun, too. I don't  know if
 there's a way to do even this without adding too much complexity, but
 we did make some mockups of an advanced sort bar, which instead of
 sorting on columns allowed creation of hierarchical sorting by
 metadata. For example, I could use the what filter to select audio
 files, and then use the sort bar to say: sort by artist, then by
 album, then by track. Any Journal entries which had metadata keys for
 artist, album, and track would then appear sorted accordingly,
 and the section dividers would show the values for the various keys so
 that the hierarchy was logically browsable.

 It's a powerful idea, but so far we just haven't thought it to be
 worth the added complexity. Keeping the Journal as simple to use as
 possible is paramount.

I'll maybe try have a go at a simple mock-up. Could either be part of  
a row titling the current columns, as in a subtle little arrow button  
with several sort by options in it – sort by modified, sort by  
created, sort by size. Or perhaps as a regular button  palette in  
the toolbar (though toolbar is filling up fast with icons and is  
likely too 'featureitus' scary already in my mock-ups).

 Something I would like to explore,
 though, is exposing metadata within the detail pages of Journal
 entries. It would be neat, for instance, if photos taken in record
 actually had a photographer: kid's name label in the details, to
 make the detail view more useful and to enhance the detail view for
 specific kinds of objects. I have some neat mockups showing a possible
 UI for this. I'll try to dig them up.

+1, the details page is out of the way and could do with some more  
actual details (entry file size being the currently most useful I've  
seen go by so far).

 Perhaps we could somehow represent type by showing a stack of the  
 generic type
 documents. Maybe it would have the data icon on the front page, but
 visually have a few documents in the stack. I'll play with it.

Fab, thanks.

 These are still separate in the current mockups, right?

Yes.

 There's basically an icon for each key, where the possible keys  
 are who,
 what, and when, plus the generic search field. It's nice that all
 of these filtering options are lined up at the top, and that it's
 possible to add to the filter to narrow down on the search results by
 adjusting more of the filters.

Yep (though I'd like a quick way to clear a search rather than the  
current trawl through each filter).

 PS. Gary, the mockups are looking good so far. I'll give some thought
 to the icons, and try to dig up some of my past designs for bits and
 pieces of this.


Thanks. Having a bit of trouble with the when/anytime palette. If we  
want each toolbar icon to visually represent the filter, it means we  
need a series of icons for today, since yesterday, past week, past  
month, past year (have a few misc. icon ideas but not a sensible set  
to cover all).


http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Design_Team/Proposals/Journal#When.2FAnytime_palette

FWIW: There's also another shot at a possible tag cloud treatment:


http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Design_Team/Proposals/Journal#Show_frequency_as_proportional_size

Regards,
--Gary

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Journal feature request--more data in main display

2009-07-05 Thread Gary C Martin
On 1 Jul 2009, at 11:36, Tomeu Vizoso wrote:
 On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 19:02, Gary C Marting...@garycmartin.com  
 wrote:
 Being Mr ActivityTeam at the moment, I do really worry about the
 amount of work this is going to be to get Activities updated and
 complying to a large toolbar redesign. Supporting both toolbar API
 styles will help, but I think we'll end up with multiple toolbar
 styles in different Activities for perhaps 6 months to a year or  
 more.
 That's a bad backward step for usability. Just look at the amount of
 time/effort it is taking to migrate Activities over to SL
 infrastructure, let alone making anything but minor maintenance code
 changes to them.

 True, so what do you suggest here?


No magic answers I'm afraid. I'm just saying... One thing we could do  
to try to move forward on the new toolbar concept is to build svg  
icons for as many of the tabs that are already in use. We need to come  
up with clear and identifiable icon for each **before** moving forward  
(not just the few obvious common cases view/edit/image/text/format/ 
colour/etc).

Here's a quick trawl, not a full list. If we can't manage these, it  
would be unfair to expect Activity Authors to have any more success.  
Note: that some of these may need Activity specific variants, though  
we may be able to drop some if we are willing to redesign some  
Activities current UI:

Algebra
Audio
Books
Boolean
Browse
Chat
Collaboration
Comment
Create
Edit
Effects
Face
Format
Game
Graph
Help
Image
Learn
Lessons
Library
Miscellaneous
Montage
Video
Paint
Photo
Plain
Play
Project
Read
Robot
Save/Load
Shapes
Slides
Sort
Tab
Table
Text
Tools
Trigonometry
View
Voice
Watch

I'm thinking the toolbar design as specced does not seem viable for  
the 0.86 time scale. Leaving us with the nasty issue trying to solve  
what I see as a current worst toolbar usability offender, Stop button  
must be visible at all times. Perhaps a stop gap measure of placing  
the Activity stop button permanently in the sacrosanct top right  
corner? Can't believe I suggest that, but it's the best suggestion I  
have...

Regards,
--Gary
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[Sugar-devel] DNS Mischief

2009-07-05 Thread Michael Stone

As many of you know, I've been fascinated for some time by Scott's Network
Principles [1]. 


Several weeks ago, I outlined in a lightly-circulated patch how one might hack
up libc's getaddrinfo() implementation to do the DNS resolution work described
in Scott's paper.

Here is a second copy of that patch, which I have improved to the point where I
am willing to recommend it for further testing, adaptation, and exploration.

(This new version uses libcrypt's MD5 implementation in favor of pulling in
chunks of libtomcrypt and it includes the minimum knowledge of gaih_service
structs necessary to work with ssh, wget, etc.)

To build it, grab your distro's libc6 packaging, apply the patch to
sysdeps/posix/getaddrinfo.c, and make sure that you define 

  crypt-in-libc = yes 
  
in an appropriate configuration file. Then build normally. Some tests for

getaddrinfo() will fail but you should wind up with a fully functional
libc.so.6 which you may install or use via LD_PRELOAD like so:

  # calculate an address for sonipes
  LD_PRELOAD=/path/to/libc.so.6 python -c 'import socket; print 
socket.getaddrinfo(sonipes, None)'

  # suppose we get fe80::b3da:e0e7:3bd7:278d%eth0

  # on sonipes:
  sudo ip addr add fe80::b3da:e0e7:3bd7:278d%eth0 dev eth0

  # elsewhere, on another computer on the same link as sonipes
  sudo env LD_PRELOAD=/path/to/libc.so.6 ping6 sonipes
  LD_PRELOAD=/path/to/libc.so.6 ssh sonipes
  (rsync, wget, nc6, ...)

Enjoy,

Michael

[1]: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Network_principles

P.S. - Improvements are definitely welcome -- I found the code very satisfying
to use on a local wireless network.

  a) provide a cute one-liner for assigning appropriate addresses to interfaces
 based on the machine's desired hostnames

  b) check the code for endian-neutrality

  c) figure out how to fully build and package the result for easier testing

  d) rewrite as an NSS module?

  e) rewrite in an external DNS resolver?
diff -u eglibc-2.9/debian/changelog eglibc-2.9/debian/changelog
--- eglibc-2.9/debian/changelog
+++ eglibc-2.9/debian/changelog
@@ -1,3 +1,11 @@
+eglibc (2.9-13.1) unstable; urgency=low
+
+  * Non-maintainer upload.
+  * debian/rules.d/build.mk: build libcrypt into libc
+  * debian/patches/any/hack-up-getaddrinfo.diff: install getaddrinfo hack.
+
+ -- Michael Stone mich...@laptop.org  Sat, 04 Jul 2009 19:06:59 -0400
+
 eglibc (2.9-13) unstable; urgency=low
 
   * debian/debhelper.in/nscd.init: fix return code when querying status
diff -u eglibc-2.9/debian/rules.d/build.mk eglibc-2.9/debian/rules.d/build.mk
--- eglibc-2.9/debian/rules.d/build.mk
+++ eglibc-2.9/debian/rules.d/build.mk
@@ -52,6 +52,7 @@
 	rtlddir=$(call xx,rtlddir) ; if test -n $$rtlddir ; then \
 		echo rtlddir = $$rtlddir  $(DEB_BUILDDIR)/configparms ; \
 	fi
+	echo crypt-in-libc = yes  $(DEB_BUILDDIR)/configparms
 
 	# Prevent autoconf from running unexpectedly by setting it to false.
 	# Also explicitly pass CC down - this is needed to get -m64 on
diff -u eglibc-2.9/debian/patches/series eglibc-2.9/debian/patches/series
--- eglibc-2.9/debian/patches/series
+++ eglibc-2.9/debian/patches/series
@@ -210,0 +211 @@
+any/hack-up-getaddrinfo.diff
only in patch2:
unchanged:
--- eglibc-2.9.orig/debian/patches/any/hack-up-getaddrinfo.diff
+++ eglibc-2.9/debian/patches/any/hack-up-getaddrinfo.diff
@@ -0,0 +1,111 @@
+From 55208c43bbd9ce5e21b7c9b77db6526e688ce612 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
+From: Michael Stone mich...@laptop.org
+Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:04:18 -0400
+Subject: [PATCH] Hack up getaddrinfo().
+
+---
+ sysdeps/posix/getaddrinfo.c |   74 ++
+ 1 files changed, 74 insertions(+), 0 deletions(-)
+
+Index: eglibc-2.9/sysdeps/posix/getaddrinfo.c
+===
+--- eglibc-2.9.orig/sysdeps/posix/getaddrinfo.c	2009-07-04 19:14:10.0 -0400
 eglibc-2.9/sysdeps/posix/getaddrinfo.c	2009-07-05 13:52:29.0 -0400
+@@ -62,6 +62,7 @@
+ #include nscd/nscd-client.h
+ #include nscd/nscd_proto.h
+ #include resolv/res_hconf.h
++#include crypt/md5.h
+ 
+ #ifdef HAVE_LIBIDN
+ extern int __idna_to_ascii_lz (const char *input, char **output, int flags);
+@@ -251,6 +252,81 @@
+ }	  \
+  }
+ 
++static void
++hack_dns  (const char *name, const struct gaih_service *service,
++	   const struct addrinfo *req, struct addrinfo **pai,
++	   unsigned int *naddrs, int *ret)
++{
++  /* XXX: Service processing! MS */
++  if (name == NULL
++   || (service != NULL  service-num  0)
++   || ( req-ai_family != AF_INET6
++  req-ai_family != AF_UNSPEC))
++  return;
++
++  char buf[16];
++
++  __md5_buffer(name, strlen(name), buf);
++
++  struct ifaddrs *ifaddr, *ifa;
++
++  if (getifaddrs(ifaddr) == -1)
++return; /* Should we set *ret? MS */
++
++  unsigned int old_naddrs = *naddrs;
++
++  for (ifa = ifaddr; ifa != NULL; ifa = ifa-ifa_next)
++{
++  if (ifa-ifa_addr-sa_family != AF_INET6)
++continue;
++
++  struct 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Journal feature request--more data in main display

2009-07-05 Thread Gary C Martin
Hi James,

On 3 Jul 2009, at 19:29, James Zaki wrote:

 Perhaps this is a late reply, (I am yet to read the last 6 or so  
 digests of to 20+ that were in my inbox)

No not late at all! :-)

 But I am always sensitive of little incremental additions that seem  
 like it would be useful.

 I always try to think about the first time I used sugar. In  
 particular, what helped by being very simple. We see sugar evolving,  
 and perhaps forget what it was like that first time. Perhaps we  
 should harass some friends and families' kids who've not seen it,  
 and get their feedback.

+1

 If a child new to the sugar interface (XO or otherwise) feels  
 bombarded with options, it could make things harder.

+1

 In particular to the pictures, there are lots of activities in that  
 dropdown. Has that always been so big? To me that would be  
 intimidating for the first user experience.

Just to check you're referring to:


http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Design_Team/Proposals/Journal#What.2FAnything_palette

Yes this mock-up is currently showing the 33 Activities as shipped in  
the Sugar on a Stick Strawberry release from week or two ago. There's  
lots of discussion about what Activities a distribution should ship  
pre-installed, but this is something a school deployment, or parents  
group would want to be involved in. If I was introducing this to a  
child for the first time, I'd only install a small number of  
Activities to let them get comfortable. FWIW: I think the original  
G1G1 image installs about 27 Activities.

With the currently shipping Journal, there is a text menu called  
Anything, when you click on it, it drops down a single vertical  
column list of everything you see in the above mock-up. The list is  
much larger than the height of screen, so you only see the first 14 or  
so items. To see the others, you have to scroll the menu using a small  
arrow at the bottom of the screen. When you want to undo your filter,  
you have to open the menu again and scroll it all the way back up  
again to find the Anything entry to click on. It's quite a fuss once  
you have many more than 9 Activities installed (the menu also holds 5  
generic file type filters for text/image/audio/video/link).

The multi-column approach is an attempt to reduce the need to scroll  
through tall menus.

If the Uruguay deployment has shown us anything, it's that kids love  
installing lots and lots of Activities :-) At http://activities.sugarlabs.org/ 
  there is already over 150 available for them!

Regards,
--Gary

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Journal feature request--more data in main display

2009-07-05 Thread Gary C Martin
On 4 Jul 2009, at 03:36, Eben Eliason wrote:
 That said, I'm actually thinking that the tag
 dropdown should be an extension of the search field itself. Perhaps
 it's just to the right, and only needs to be a little down arrow that
 reveals the tags (or perhaps we even modify the search entry to have
 this button).

Yes, if the toolbar tag button is deemed another scary button too  
many, and we still want the functionality, it could be placed in the  
search field magnifying-glass with minimum impact for a novice user  
(they just wouldn't find it until shown, or curious). See the Safari  
browser search field for reference. Apple use a magnifying-glass with  
a very small disclosure triangle that reveals the search history, we  
could have the same in Journal reveal a sorted tag list/cloud.

 Previous mockups I'd worked on were based on the idea
 that a tag suggestion window would popup beneath the search field
 while typing to show possible tags.

I guess you could have the same sorted tag list/cloud palette appear  
for either a click of the magnifying-glass, or when typing, as you  
typed you'd get the auto-complete suggestion, and the tag list would  
visually filter the matches shown. That would really be quite some  
serious coding effort though!

 The thought for the explicit
 dropdown arrow would be to choose tags without having to start typing.

Yes, browsing/navigation of existing tags without typing will go a  
long way to getting folks to actually use them, especially out target  
demographic. Though this feature can initially be left off and, added  
at a later date.

Regards,
--Gary

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Journal feature request--more data in main display

2009-07-05 Thread Frederick Grose
On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 8:33 PM, Gary C Martin g...@garycmartin.com wrote:

 ... One thing we could do
 to try to move forward on the new toolbar concept is to build svg
 icons for as many of the tabs that are already in use. We need to come
 up with clear and identifiable icon for each **before** moving forward
 (not just the few obvious common cases view/edit/image/text/format/
 colour/etc).

 Here's a quick trawl, not a full list. If we can't manage these, it
 would be unfair to expect Activity Authors to have any more success.
 Note: that some of these may need Activity specific variants, though
 we may be able to drop some if we are willing to redesign some
 Activities current UI:

 Algebra
 Audio
 Books
 Boolean
 Browse
 Chat
 Collaboration
 Comment
 Create
 Edit
 Effects
 Face
 Format
 Game
 Graph
 Help
 Image
 Learn
 Lessons
 Library
 Miscellaneous
 Montage
 Video
 Paint
 Photo
 Plain
 Play
 Project
 Read
 Robot
 Save/Load
 Shapes
 Slides
 Sort
 Tab
 Table
 Text
 Tools
 Trigonometry
 View
 Voice
 Watch


Perhaps Gaurav Bhushan could help with icons. He seems to have a knack for
expressing abstractions in icons, see
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/File:Social_Communication_System.png.

--Fred
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[Sugar-devel] Background Screen Color for SoaS Activity

2009-07-05 Thread Art Hunkins
The default color for the Sugar Activity screen seems to be set to light 
gray. I'd like mine to be white.

Is there any way to change this in my activity script?

I tried:

import gtk

win = csndsugui.CsoundGUI(self)
ibox = win.box(False)
ibox.modify_bg(gtk.STATE_NORMAL, gtk.gdk.Color(0x, 0x, 0x))

where ibox = the entire screen.

However this changed nothing.

Anything fairly straightforward I could try?

Art Hunkins 

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