Re: [Sugar-devel] Proxy Settings in Network Control Panel
2013/3/14 Ajay Garg a...@activitycentral.com:
Thanks a ton Manuel; I will test the patch on the weekend, and let you know
:)
On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 7:27 AM, Manuel Quiñones ma...@laptop.org wrote:
Hi Ajay and other devs,
Ajay, whlie reviewing your patch for the proxy feature, I decided to
step in and work on the issues I've found by myself. I did this to
speed up the process, instead of going through a long
review/patch/review loop. I hope you understand. A (rather long,
sorry) description of what I did follows. But first of all, I would
be glad if you can test my last patch:
https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/attachment/ticket/3070/0001-Add-proxy-configuration-support-to-Network-Control-P.patch
The first thing I've found is that your patch does both GConf and
GSettings. I decided to go just for GSettings because Browse and all
underlayng GTK use it.
Great !!
If we are sure that no application carries the legacy Gconf
proxy-settings/schema, we are done, (not to forget less lines of code to
carry :P)
In any case I think you should have added
another mixin class for GSettings instead of adding code to GConfMixin
class. Sasha's original patch had that quite separated to make adding
another backend an easy task.
So my first attempt was doing only GSettings and fixing the issues
I've found in yours:
https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/attachment/ticket/3070/proxy_gsettings.patch
(note this is not my final patch, let's call this my a) patch)
An issue with your patch: the UI does not always update when a setting
is changed. TestCase: change a setting, quickly close the network
section and open it again: you will see the original value. This is
because the timeout that calls _commit has not finished yet. Sasha's
patch had gconf client.notify_add() for this. In my a) patch I have
added a callback to the 'changed' event of gsettings that does the
same.
I had fixed this, in the patch I had floated :)
The self._section_view.perform_accept_actions() did the fix in my patch;
now substituted by self._section_view.apply() in your patch.
I had even mentioned that in point c) in the patch at
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-February/041779.html :)
Ah OK. It might have been anything else then, the bug was
reproduceable with the given testcase.
Anyways, the end result is that, we HAVE TAKEN care of the racy-behaviour,
as far as the persistence of values is concerned.
In the case of using callbacks, it is saner to do what Sasha did,
adding a timestamp. Otherwise you end writting the setting each time
a signal is sent. Each time a user presses a key for example. In the
case of using bind, GTK takes care of that. as the documentation say.
https://developer.gnome.org/gio/stable/GSettings.html#GSettings-changed
There are other differences between Sasha's patch and yours. For
example you seem to forgot the try/finally clause in the _commit
method that blocks the __changed_cb callback. I have added it back in
my a) patch.
I intentionally skipped $http_proxy environment variable (Sasha's patch
3/3):
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2012-August/038804.html
This could be added later if there is a reason. I don't see GNOME
doing it. Which activities or parts of Sugar need it? Indeed this
makes wget work with proxy by default but then why GNOME does not do
it? Am I missing any conversation?
Hmm.. One place where I know for confirmed it is used in webkitgtk3, thus
making its use in Browse.
But you said earlier that using ONLY GSettings (without setting the
http_poxy variable), propogates the proxy-settings in Browse. If that is
the case, I think setting http_proxy is not needed.
Yes, Browse gets the proxy settings from GSettings and does not need
$http_proxy .
For more details of the http_proxy interactions with GTK+, please see the
source-code of webkit, in particular
http://svn.webkit.org/repository/webkit/trunk/Tools/GtkLauncher/main.c
I guess $http_proxy is a fallback.
So, now for my final patch. After having my a) patch working, I took
another path using the convenient way GSettings provides to bind
widgets and settings:
https://developer.gnome.org/gio/stable/GSettings.html#g-settings-bind
The adventages can be seen in the ~100 lines removed. There is...
- no need for a mixin class,
- no need for connecting callbacks to signals between widgets and
settings in both directions
- no need to implement get_value_for_gsettings /
set_value_from_gsettings for each widget. Sasha's gconf
implementation needed a big hierarchy of classes to archive this.
- no need to test the key type to map the corresponding getter ('s' to
use get_string(), for example, compare with my a) patch)
These look good !!!
So, I welcome testing in different proxy scenarios for my patch.
Thanks a lot Ajay for your contributed work, which I took as basement.
--
.. manuq ..
--
Regards,
Ajay
Re: [Sugar-devel] Proxy Settings in Network Control Panel
On Wed, Mar 13, 2013 at 10:43 PM, Ajay Garg a...@activitycentral.com wrote: For more details of the http_proxy interactions with GTK+, please see the source-code of webkit, in particular http://svn.webkit.org/repository/webkit/trunk/Tools/GtkLauncher/main.c GtkLauncher is not a part of WebKit (the library, as used by Sugar). It is a standalone test app. So unless you have another place truly inside webkit where $http_proxy is used, I am doubtful that webkit is using this. Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
On Mon, Nov 21, 2011 at 2:27 PM, Anish Mangal an...@activitycentral.org wrote: I'd like to propose Network proxy configuration in Sugar http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Proxy_configuration I would say that this feature does not fit particularly nicely with some items of our guidelines: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Policy#Things_you_should_consider_when_proposing_a_feature In other words, I can't imagine every 6-12 year old student in a school going into the control panel and typing (without error) a load of proxy details. In my experience things like this are incredibly challenging especially because the users cannot relate to the task at hand (unless you want to teach them about computer networks first). A more sensible model would be that this is somehow automated by the deployer or by the school infrastructure, such that the user is not distracted and does not have to care. I'm aware that such generalizations can't be applied to all cases and that this feature is probably driven by some users where this indeed can't be applied. So I'm not in opposition to this feature (even though it would be nice to have the more automated approach designed as well), but I think we need to consider the implications on our more regular target userbase. For example, what happens if a user who is on a proxy-free network types hello into the proxy configuration textbox? Does that break all networking? One problem that I have seen in various places, children untick the Radio enable checkbox in Sugar's control panel and then return their laptop for repair because they can't get online. I fear that proxy configuration could become support headache like this. Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
Daniel, Your concerns are valid. All I can say that probably using an automated transparent proxy client-server setup is the answer, for getting the requirements met without bothering the kids. * The automatic mode can be set in the XO-images, via simple OOB scripts. * The automatic mode puts the responsibility on the network-administrator's shoulders, instead of the kids. * Having the proxy transparent, means that kids do not need to enter the credentials again and again while navigating a whitelisted network URL. So, even in current scenario, I think the above particular setup can be easily done, thus relieving the kids altogether from doing any configurations. On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 9:17 PM, Daniel Drake d...@laptop.org wrote: On Mon, Nov 21, 2011 at 2:27 PM, Anish Mangal an...@activitycentral.org wrote: I'd like to propose Network proxy configuration in Sugar http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Proxy_configuration I would say that this feature does not fit particularly nicely with some items of our guidelines: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Policy#Things_you_should_consider_when_proposing_a_feature In other words, I can't imagine every 6-12 year old student in a school going into the control panel and typing (without error) a load of proxy details. In my experience things like this are incredibly challenging especially because the users cannot relate to the task at hand (unless you want to teach them about computer networks first). A more sensible model would be that this is somehow automated by the deployer or by the school infrastructure, such that the user is not distracted and does not have to care. I'm aware that such generalizations can't be applied to all cases and that this feature is probably driven by some users where this indeed can't be applied. So I'm not in opposition to this feature (even though it would be nice to have the more automated approach designed as well), but I think we need to consider the implications on our more regular target userbase. For example, what happens if a user who is on a proxy-free network types hello into the proxy configuration textbox? Does that break all networking? One problem that I have seen in various places, children untick the Radio enable checkbox in Sugar's control panel and then return their laptop for repair because they can't get online. I fear that proxy configuration could become support headache like this. Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- Regards, Ajay Garg Dextrose Developer Activity Central: http://activitycentral.com ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
One problem that I have seen in various places, children untick theRadio enable checkbox in Sugar's control panel and then return theirlaptop for repair because they can't get online. I fear that proxyconfiguration could become support headache like this. Thinking in the same way, we must block the command rm from theterminal because the childrens can remove important files. Or thecommand mv because generates that an activity no works The problem behind all is the education! If a teacher knows uncheck theradio enable before send a XO to the repair, the problem is solved! ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 2:08 PM, Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn alan...@hotmail.com wrote: One problem that I have seen in various places, children untick the Radio enable checkbox in Sugar's control panel and then return their laptop for repair because they can't get online. I fear that proxy configuration could become support headache like this. Thinking in the same way, we must block the command rm from the terminal because the childrens can remove important files. Or the command mv because generates that an activity no works I can see why you might think that way. However, I have never experienced this being a problem, and I don't recall seeing other reports of this, so I would not argue for any blocking of terminal commands. The radio checkbox is a real headache that *actually happens* though. Taking a guess as to why we see the radio problem but not the terminal one in our field experiences, I would imagine the crucial difference is that the radio checkbox is presented in a way that it is easily accessible but commonly uncomprehendable to our regular user base. In comparison, those dangerous commands in the terminal are in their own world of inaccessibility... Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
While I understand your point about the radio checkbox, this show a few bugs or fails in design in Sugar too. Trying right now I see: * The text is confusing: Turn off the wireless radio to save battery life [] Radio Checked is on or off? What means Radio? Is not clear * After uncheck the checkbox, go to the neightborview, the ap are not visible but the ad-hoc are. If there are not network, the ad-hoc is not working, right? * May be we can show a message in the neighborview. The radio/wireless interface is down, go to the control panel to use it or similar. The same in the device icon in the frame. All these issues probably help to make worst the situation. About the network proxy configuration, I agree is better have a automatic configuration _if_possible_, but there are times when is not possible, then we should provide a solution. Has been a request for a long time, and the development is already 90% done Gonzalo On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 5:15 PM, Daniel Drake d...@laptop.org wrote: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 2:08 PM, Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn alan...@hotmail.com wrote: One problem that I have seen in various places, children untick the Radio enable checkbox in Sugar's control panel and then return their laptop for repair because they can't get online. I fear that proxy configuration could become support headache like this. Thinking in the same way, we must block the command rm from the terminal because the childrens can remove important files. Or the command mv because generates that an activity no works I can see why you might think that way. However, I have never experienced this being a problem, and I don't recall seeing other reports of this, so I would not argue for any blocking of terminal commands. The radio checkbox is a real headache that *actually happens* though. Taking a guess as to why we see the radio problem but not the terminal one in our field experiences, I would imagine the crucial difference is that the radio checkbox is presented in a way that it is easily accessible but commonly uncomprehendable to our regular user base. In comparison, those dangerous commands in the terminal are in their own world of inaccessibility... Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 2:31 PM, Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org wrote: About the network proxy configuration, I agree is better have a automatic configuration _if_possible_, but there are times when is not possible, then we should provide a solution. Has been a request for a long time, and the development is already 90% done I would still appreciate the answer to this question: For example, what happens if a user who is on a proxy-free network types hello into the proxy configuration textbox? Does that break all networking? Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 14:35:26 -0600 From: d...@laptop.org To: gonz...@laptop.org CC: alan...@hotmail.com; sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org; an...@activitycentral.com; alsr...@activitycentral.com Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 2:31 PM, Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org wrote: About the network proxy configuration, I agree is better have a automatic configuration _if_possible_, but there are times when is not possible, then we should provide a solution. Has been a request for a long time, and the development is already 90% done I would still appreciate the answer to this question: For example, what happens if a user who is on a proxy-free network types hello into the proxy configuration textbox? Does that break all networking? The option for manual proxy can be put in advanced options. The problem of hello: if the system try to make a ping to the proxyto check it? Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 5:35 PM, Daniel Drake d...@laptop.org wrote: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 2:31 PM, Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org wrote: About the network proxy configuration, I agree is better have a automatic configuration _if_possible_, but there are times when is not possible, then we should provide a solution. Has been a request for a long time, and the development is already 90% done I would still appreciate the answer to this question: For example, what happens if a user who is on a proxy-free network types hello into the proxy configuration textbox? Does that break all networking? Daniel Probably yes. May be we can add a test before the configuration is saved and warning to the user? Something like trying to access wiki.laptop.org? Gonzalo ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Network proxy, configuration
Hi, This discussion is making me nervous. The standard model of the XO has been that they are connected to the internet via the school server. Is it proposed to set up this proxy-server as a requirement for all XOs and for the user (primary school children) to have to manage this even when no access to the internet is available or even when that access is provided by the school server? Tony On 03/14/2013 04:35 PM, sugar-devel-requ...@lists.sugarlabs.org wrote: In other words, I can't imagine every 6-12 year old student in a school going into the control panel and typing (without error) a load of proxy details. In my experience things like this are incredibly challenging especially because the users cannot relate to the task at hand (unless you want to teach them about computer networks first). ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 1:31 PM, Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org wrote: While I understand your point about the radio checkbox, this show a few bugs or fails in design in Sugar too. Trying right now I see: * The text is confusing: Turn off the wireless radio to save battery life [] Radio Checked is on or off? What means Radio? Is not clear Should be a radio button. Wi-Fi on/off. http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.education.sugar.devel/34909 Sameer * After uncheck the checkbox, go to the neightborview, the ap are not visible but the ad-hoc are. If there are not network, the ad-hoc is not working, right? * May be we can show a message in the neighborview. The radio/wireless interface is down, go to the control panel to use it or similar. The same in the device icon in the frame. All these issues probably help to make worst the situation. About the network proxy configuration, I agree is better have a automatic configuration _if_possible_, but there are times when is not possible, then we should provide a solution. Has been a request for a long time, and the development is already 90% done Gonzalo On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 5:15 PM, Daniel Drake d...@laptop.org wrote: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 2:08 PM, Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn alan...@hotmail.com wrote: One problem that I have seen in various places, children untick the Radio enable checkbox in Sugar's control panel and then return their laptop for repair because they can't get online. I fear that proxy configuration could become support headache like this. Thinking in the same way, we must block the command rm from the terminal because the childrens can remove important files. Or the command mv because generates that an activity no works I can see why you might think that way. However, I have never experienced this being a problem, and I don't recall seeing other reports of this, so I would not argue for any blocking of terminal commands. The radio checkbox is a real headache that *actually happens* though. Taking a guess as to why we see the radio problem but not the terminal one in our field experiences, I would imagine the crucial difference is that the radio checkbox is presented in a way that it is easily accessible but commonly uncomprehendable to our regular user base. In comparison, those dangerous commands in the terminal are in their own world of inaccessibility... Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
I think this feature (proxy-config) is useful, just as the modem-config is, which is included now. dsd's brings a valid questioning of whether this kind of technical features should be included or not. I think this particular matter requires a broader discussion about how we could conciliate sugar's education objectives and its interface responsibilities. Until we can do that, the Network CP UI seems a good place. Just my opinion. On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 9:01 PM, Sameer Verma sve...@sfsu.edu wrote: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 1:31 PM, Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org wrote: While I understand your point about the radio checkbox, this show a few bugs or fails in design in Sugar too. Trying right now I see: * The text is confusing: Turn off the wireless radio to save battery life [] Radio Checked is on or off? What means Radio? Is not clear Should be a radio button. Wi-Fi on/off. http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.education.sugar.devel/34909 Sameer * After uncheck the checkbox, go to the neightborview, the ap are not visible but the ad-hoc are. If there are not network, the ad-hoc is not working, right? * May be we can show a message in the neighborview. The radio/wireless interface is down, go to the control panel to use it or similar. The same in the device icon in the frame. All these issues probably help to make worst the situation. About the network proxy configuration, I agree is better have a automatic configuration _if_possible_, but there are times when is not possible, then we should provide a solution. Has been a request for a long time, and the development is already 90% done Gonzalo On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 5:15 PM, Daniel Drake d...@laptop.org wrote: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 2:08 PM, Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn alan...@hotmail.com wrote: One problem that I have seen in various places, children untick the Radio enable checkbox in Sugar's control panel and then return their laptop for repair because they can't get online. I fear that proxy configuration could become support headache like this. Thinking in the same way, we must block the command rm from the terminal because the childrens can remove important files. Or the command mv because generates that an activity no works I can see why you might think that way. However, I have never experienced this being a problem, and I don't recall seeing other reports of this, so I would not argue for any blocking of terminal commands. The radio checkbox is a real headache that *actually happens* though. Taking a guess as to why we see the radio problem but not the terminal one in our field experiences, I would imagine the crucial difference is that the radio checkbox is presented in a way that it is easily accessible but commonly uncomprehendable to our regular user base. In comparison, those dangerous commands in the terminal are in their own world of inaccessibility... Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
But with modem-config a child cannot stop normal operation. With proxy, the child can stop normal operation, in that no Browse will work with wrong proxy. I think proxy configuration should be an optional extension that is disabled by default, allowing a deployment to enable it. On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 10:23:53PM -0400, Martin Abente wrote: I think this feature (proxy-config) is useful, just as the modem-config is, which is included now. dsd's brings a valid questioning of whether this kind of technical features should be included or not. I think this particular matter requires a broader discussion about how we could conciliate sugar's education objectives and its interface responsibilities. Until we can do that, the Network CP UI seems a good place. Just my opinion. On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 9:01 PM, Sameer Verma sve...@sfsu.edu wrote: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 1:31 PM, Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org wrote: While I understand your point about the radio checkbox, this show a few bugs or fails in design in Sugar too. Trying right now I see: * The text is confusing: Turn off the wireless radio to save battery life [] Radio Checked is on or off? What means Radio? Is not clear Should be a radio button. Wi-Fi on/off. http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.education.sugar.devel/34909 Sameer * After uncheck the checkbox, go to the neightborview, the ap are not visible but the ad-hoc are. If there are not network, the ad-hoc is not working, right? * May be we can show a message in the neighborview. The radio/wireless interface is down, go to the control panel to use it or similar. The same in the device icon in the frame. All these issues probably help to make worst the situation. About the network proxy configuration, I agree is better have a automatic configuration _if_possible_, but there are times when is not possible, then we should provide a solution. Has been a request for a long time, and the development is already 90% done Gonzalo On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 5:15 PM, Daniel Drake d...@laptop.org wrote: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 2:08 PM, Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn alan...@hotmail.com wrote: One problem that I have seen in various places, children untick the Radio enable checkbox in Sugar's control panel and then return their laptop for repair because they can't get online. I fear that proxy configuration could become support headache like this. Thinking in the same way, we must block the command rm from the terminal because the childrens can remove important files. Or the command mv because generates that an activity no works I can see why you might think that way. However, I have never experienced this being a problem, and I don't recall seeing other reports of this, so I would not argue for any blocking of terminal commands. The radio checkbox is a real headache that *actually happens* though. Taking a guess as to why we see the radio problem but not the terminal one in our field experiences, I would imagine the crucial difference is that the radio checkbox is presented in a way that it is easily accessible but commonly uncomprehendable to our regular user base. In comparison, those dangerous commands in the terminal are in their own world of inaccessibility... Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
Is it different from relying on a modem and having a wrong modem-config? I think there are scenarios where normal includes the proper proxy-config, otherwise browse won't work either. On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 10:33 PM, James Cameron qu...@laptop.org wrote: But with modem-config a child cannot stop normal operation. With proxy, the child can stop normal operation, in that no Browse will work with wrong proxy. I think proxy configuration should be an optional extension that is disabled by default, allowing a deployment to enable it. On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 10:23:53PM -0400, Martin Abente wrote: I think this feature (proxy-config) is useful, just as the modem-config is, which is included now. dsd's brings a valid questioning of whether this kind of technical features should be included or not. I think this particular matter requires a broader discussion about how we could conciliate sugar's education objectives and its interface responsibilities. Until we can do that, the Network CP UI seems a good place. Just my opinion. On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 9:01 PM, Sameer Verma sve...@sfsu.edu wrote: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 1:31 PM, Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org wrote: While I understand your point about the radio checkbox, this show a few bugs or fails in design in Sugar too. Trying right now I see: * The text is confusing: Turn off the wireless radio to save battery life [] Radio Checked is on or off? What means Radio? Is not clear Should be a radio button. Wi-Fi on/off. http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.education.sugar.devel/34909 Sameer * After uncheck the checkbox, go to the neightborview, the ap are not visible but the ad-hoc are. If there are not network, the ad-hoc is not working, right? * May be we can show a message in the neighborview. The radio/wireless interface is down, go to the control panel to use it or similar. The same in the device icon in the frame. All these issues probably help to make worst the situation. About the network proxy configuration, I agree is better have a automatic configuration _if_possible_, but there are times when is not possible, then we should provide a solution. Has been a request for a long time, and the development is already 90% done Gonzalo On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 5:15 PM, Daniel Drake d...@laptop.org wrote: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 2:08 PM, Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn alan...@hotmail.com wrote: One problem that I have seen in various places, children untick the Radio enable checkbox in Sugar's control panel and then return their laptop for repair because they can't get online. I fear that proxy configuration could become support headache like this. Thinking in the same way, we must block the command rm from the terminal because the childrens can remove important files. Or the command mv because generates that an activity no works I can see why you might think that way. However, I have never experienced this being a problem, and I don't recall seeing other reports of this, so I would not argue for any blocking of terminal commands. The radio checkbox is a real headache that *actually happens* though. Taking a guess as to why we see the radio problem but not the terminal one in our field experiences, I would imagine the crucial difference is that the radio checkbox is presented in a way that it is easily accessible but commonly uncomprehendable to our regular user base. In comparison, those dangerous commands in the terminal are in their own world of inaccessibility... Daniel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Network proxy, configuration
On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 6:19 PM, Tony Anderson tony_ander...@usa.netwrote: Hi, This discussion is making me nervous. The standard model of the XO has been that they are connected to the internet via the school server. Is it proposed to set up this proxy-server as a requirement for all XOs and for the user (primary school children) to have to manage this even when no access to the internet is available or even when that access is provided by the school server? No. This configuration is only needed in environments where there are not school server, and is not possible a automatic configuration. Gonzalo Tony On 03/14/2013 04:35 PM, sugar-devel-request@lists.**sugarlabs.orgsugar-devel-requ...@lists.sugarlabs.orgwrote: In other words, I can't imagine every 6-12 year old student in a school going into the control panel and typing (without error) a load of proxy details. In my experience things like this are incredibly challenging especially because the users cannot relate to the task at hand (unless you want to teach them about computer networks first). __**_ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.**org Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/**listinfo/sugar-develhttp://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [FEATURES][DESIGN] Network proxy configuration
I think proxy configuration should be an optional extension that is disabled by default, allowing a deployment to enable it. We can add a configuration to allow deployments to disable it. Gonzalo ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Network proxy, configuration
Hi, Does this mean we will need two signed images, one for the schoolserver and one for the stand-alone XO? Until now, the default configuration has assumed that proxy is provided by the schoolserver. Tony On 03/14/2013 11:17 PM, Gonzalo Odiard wrote: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 6:19 PM, Tony Anderson tony_ander...@usa.net mailto:tony_ander...@usa.net wrote: Hi, This discussion is making me nervous. The standard model of the XO has been that they are connected to the internet via the school server. Is it proposed to set up this proxy-server as a requirement for all XOs and for the user (primary school children) to have to manage this even when no access to the internet is available or even when that access is provided by the school server? No. This configuration is only needed in environments where there are not school server, and is not possible a automatic configuration. Gonzalo Tony On 03/14/2013 04:35 PM, sugar-devel-request@lists.__sugarlabs.org mailto:sugar-devel-requ...@lists.sugarlabs.org wrote: In other words, I can't imagine every 6-12 year old student in a school going into the control panel and typing (without error) a load of proxy details. In my experience things like this are incredibly challenging especially because the users cannot relate to the task at hand (unless you want to teach them about computer networks first). _ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.__org mailto:Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/__listinfo/sugar-devel http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
