Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-05-27 Thread Kalpa Welivitigoda
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 11:24 PM, Kalpa Welivitigoda callka...@gmail.comwrote:




 On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 8:36 PM, Bastien b...@laptop.org wrote:

 Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org writes:

  FYI, I will convert the update of the sugar manual in the olpc wiki
  [1] to rst to generate new content for the Help activity.
 
  I will be working on this today and tomorrow probably.

 Great -- don't hesitate to use my repository, I can give you write
 access if that's easier than pull requests.


 Just before the deadline, I've finished compiling my proposal [1].
 Your comments are highly appreciated

 [1] -
 http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/proposal/review/google/gsoc2013/callkalpa/24005#


Hi all, I am happy to announce that I have been selected for GSoC 2013 to
work on this project. My sincere thanks to you all for the input in terms
of ideas, guidance and help rendered in fine tuning the project proposal. I
also thank those who vote for the project idea as well. With that I ensure
to deliver the expected outcome of the at the end of the summer, and I
strongly believe that you all will support me in the implementation as well.

Thanks




 --
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 --
 Best Regards,

 Kalpa Welivitigoda
 Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
 Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
 University of Moratuwa
 Sri Lanka
 http://about.me/callkalpa




-- 
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Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
University of Moratuwa
Sri Lanka
http://about.me/callkalpa
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-05-27 Thread Gonzalo Odiard
Great Kalpa. I am interested in work with you to integrate this proposal
with the work I am doing on the Help activity.

Gonzalo


On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 4:28 PM, Kalpa Welivitigoda callka...@gmail.comwrote:




 On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 11:24 PM, Kalpa Welivitigoda 
 callka...@gmail.comwrote:




 On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 8:36 PM, Bastien b...@laptop.org wrote:

 Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org writes:

  FYI, I will convert the update of the sugar manual in the olpc wiki
  [1] to rst to generate new content for the Help activity.
 
  I will be working on this today and tomorrow probably.

 Great -- don't hesitate to use my repository, I can give you write
 access if that's easier than pull requests.


 Just before the deadline, I've finished compiling my proposal [1].
 Your comments are highly appreciated

 [1] -
 http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/proposal/review/google/gsoc2013/callkalpa/24005#


 Hi all, I am happy to announce that I have been selected for GSoC 2013 to
 work on this project. My sincere thanks to you all for the input in terms
 of ideas, guidance and help rendered in fine tuning the project proposal. I
 also thank those who vote for the project idea as well. With that I ensure
 to deliver the expected outcome of the at the end of the summer, and I
 strongly believe that you all will support me in the implementation as well.

 Thanks




 --
  Bastien
 ___
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 --
 Best Regards,

 Kalpa Welivitigoda
 Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
 Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
 University of Moratuwa
 Sri Lanka
 http://about.me/callkalpa




 --
 Best Regards,

 Kalpa Welivitigoda
 Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
 Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
 University of Moratuwa
 Sri Lanka
 http://about.me/callkalpa

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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-05-03 Thread Kalpa Welivitigoda
On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 8:36 PM, Bastien b...@laptop.org wrote:

 Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org writes:

  FYI, I will convert the update of the sugar manual in the olpc wiki
  [1] to rst to generate new content for the Help activity.
 
  I will be working on this today and tomorrow probably.

 Great -- don't hesitate to use my repository, I can give you write
 access if that's easier than pull requests.


Just before the deadline, I've finished compiling my proposal [1].
Your comments are highly appreciated

[1] -
http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/proposal/review/google/gsoc2013/callkalpa/24005#


 --
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-- 
Best Regards,

Kalpa Welivitigoda
Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
University of Moratuwa
Sri Lanka
http://about.me/callkalpa
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-15 Thread Kalpa Welivitigoda
On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 8:37 PM, Kalpa Welivitigoda callka...@gmail.comwrote:




 On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 2:00 PM, Bastien b...@laptop.org wrote:

 Walter Bender walter.ben...@gmail.com writes:

  Coming up with a decent framework which we can populate from these
  sources would take us a long ways.

 Indeed.  I created this repo:
   https://github.com/bzg/aslodocs

 I will try to populate with docs when I find time for this.
 I welcome merge requests of course, if others find it useful.


 Great !
 So the idea is collect current help sources and mean time develop a decent
 frame as the project through which we can present the collected sources of
 help files and new help files. The new framework should be easy to use with
 the developers so that over the time the help document writing process and
 presenting them becomes uniform with the help of the framework.



Just to update you, today I heard from Buddhika, it's about the wysiwyg
editor for Mallard. Foiefras [1] is archived and no longer in development.
According to Buddhika only phase 1 of the editor is completed. I just
tested it installed, it supports only the basic Mallard syntax.


  --
  Bastien




 --
 Best Regards,

 Kalpa Welivitigoda
 Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
 Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
 University of Moratuwa
 Sri Lanka
 http://about.me/callkalpa




-- 
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Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
University of Moratuwa
Sri Lanka
http://about.me/callkalpa
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-15 Thread Gonzalo Odiard
FYI, I will convert the update of the sugar manual in the olpc wiki [1] to
rst
to generate new content for the Help activity.

I will be working on this today and tomorrow probably.

Gonzalo


[1] http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Help_Activity_refresh/TOC


On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 5:30 AM, Bastien b...@laptop.org wrote:

 Walter Bender walter.ben...@gmail.com writes:

  Coming up with a decent framework which we can populate from these
  sources would take us a long ways.

 Indeed.  I created this repo:
   https://github.com/bzg/aslodocs

 I will try to populate with docs when I find time for this.
 I welcome merge requests of course, if others find it useful.

 --
  Bastien

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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-15 Thread Bastien
Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org writes:

 FYI, I will convert the update of the sugar manual in the olpc wiki
 [1] to rst to generate new content for the Help activity.

 I will be working on this today and tomorrow probably.

Great -- don't hesitate to use my repository, I can give you write
access if that's easier than pull requests.

-- 
 Bastien
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-12 Thread Walter Bender
On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 11:39 PM, Kalpa Welivitigoda callka...@gmail.comwrote:




 On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 1:53 AM, Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.orgwrote:

 +10


 Many thanks to Bastein for focusing us all on the topic again.



 We need use the easier possible way to write (and translate) the docs.
 I don't know if there are wysiwyg tools to write the XML files for
 Mallard,
 if not, is a big step backward.


 There is FoieGras [1] which wa also a GSoC project from GNOME in 2008. I
 have mailed Buddhika [2] who was the GSoC student for that project and he
 is also from the same university as mine, University of Moratuwa. I'll
 update with the status of FoieGras once Buddhika replies.

 If I may summaries up to now,

 Although the project idea says to implement a help system using Mallard,
 we can extend it, write help files in plain text and convert them to
 desired forms (Mallard, html etc) so that we can present them in several
 possible ways.

 Should we output only in Mallard format? I don't see any advantage right
 now, since we have the capability to expand.

 Since it is plain text, I think it's better to use MarkDown as the markup
 language. Anyway once I hear from Buddhika, I'll drop a mail to sugar-devel
 asking developers for their preference in markup language to be used.

 [1] https://live.gnome.org/ProjectMallard/FoieGras
 [2] http://mytechgossips.com/2007/08/24/end-of-a-great-three-months/

 Gonzalo


 On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 5:19 PM, Bastien b...@laptop.org wrote:

 Hi all,

 translation comes after the docs have been written.

 The main barrier is not dependancies for translation tools,
 it's about *writing* documentation.

 Hence the idea of using a plain text light markup language.

 Maybe we could run an informal poll about this in the Sugar
 community to get a sense of what current devs are comfortable
 with?  If they are comfortable with using MarkDown, I'd favor
 using this.

 Such feedback would be interesting anyway.

 --
  Bastien
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 --
 Best Regards,

 Kalpa Welivitigoda
 Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
 Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
 University of Moratuwa
 Sri Lanka
 http://about.me/callkalpa

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There is perhaps more documentation already written than is generally known
about. For example, there are many activities with pages in the wiki [1]
and efforts such as [2] done by OLPC deployments. Spanish-language versions
abound as well. Coming up with a decent framework which we can populate
from these sources would take us a long ways.

[1] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities#Sugar_Activities
[2] http://academy.one-education.org/mod/book/view.php?id=130

regards.

-walter

-- 
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-12 Thread Bastien
Kalpa Welivitigoda callka...@gmail.com writes:

 Although the project idea says to implement a help system using
 Mallard, we can extend it, write help files in plain text and convert
 them to desired forms (Mallard, html etc) so that we can present them
 in several possible ways.

Yep, that makes sense.

-- 
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-12 Thread Bastien
Walter Bender walter.ben...@gmail.com writes:

 Coming up with a decent framework which we can populate from these
 sources would take us a long ways.

Indeed.  I created this repo:
  https://github.com/bzg/aslodocs

I will try to populate with docs when I find time for this.
I welcome merge requests of course, if others find it useful.

-- 
 Bastien
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-12 Thread Kalpa Welivitigoda
On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 2:00 PM, Bastien b...@laptop.org wrote:

 Walter Bender walter.ben...@gmail.com writes:

  Coming up with a decent framework which we can populate from these
  sources would take us a long ways.

 Indeed.  I created this repo:
   https://github.com/bzg/aslodocs

 I will try to populate with docs when I find time for this.
 I welcome merge requests of course, if others find it useful.


Great !
So the idea is collect current help sources and mean time develop a decent
frame as the project through which we can present the collected sources of
help files and new help files. The new framework should be easy to use with
the developers so that over the time the help document writing process and
presenting them becomes uniform with the help of the framework.


 --
  Bastien




-- 
Best Regards,

Kalpa Welivitigoda
Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
University of Moratuwa
Sri Lanka
http://about.me/callkalpa
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Kalpa Welivitigoda
On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 1:06 PM, Bastien b...@laptop.org wrote:

 Hi Kalpa,

 this is a very nice and much needed project.

 Let's wait for Chris to chim in.  My take on this is that help files
 should be stored using a plain text format like MarkDown or Org-mode.
 It's easier to hack directly, it's easier to read diffs against such
 files, it's easier to feed a translator with them, and it can then be
 converted into Mallard (for internal browsing), or HTML (for online
 documentation) or... anything else.


Thanks for the comments Bastien. Yes it is better to have help in plain
text and develop tools to convert them to desired formats. Let's wait for
Chris.


 Storing directly in Mallard would be a mistake IMHO.

 2 cents,

 --
  Bastien




-- 
Best Regards,

Kalpa Welivitigoda
Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
University of Moratuwa
Sri Lanka
http://about.me/callkalpa
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Manuel Quiñones
2013/4/11 Bastien b...@laptop.org:
 Hi Kalpa,

 this is a very nice and much needed project.

 Let's wait for Chris to chim in.  My take on this is that help files
 should be stored using a plain text format like MarkDown or Org-mode.
 It's easier to hack directly, it's easier to read diffs against such
 files, it's easier to feed a translator with them, and it can then be
 converted into Mallard (for internal browsing), or HTML (for online
 documentation) or... anything else.

 Storing directly in Mallard would be a mistake IMHO.

+1


 2 cents,

 --
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Chris Leonard
On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 10:34 AM, Manuel Quiñones ma...@laptop.org wrote:
 2013/4/11 Bastien b...@laptop.org:
 Hi Kalpa,

 this is a very nice and much needed project.

 Let's wait for Chris to chim in.  My take on this is that help files
 should be stored using a plain text format like MarkDown or Org-mode.
 It's easier to hack directly, it's easier to read diffs against such
 files, it's easier to feed a translator with them, and it can then be
 converted into Mallard (for internal browsing), or HTML (for online
 documentation) or... anything else.

 Storing directly in Mallard would be a mistake IMHO.



I know tha Gnome projects use mallard.  I don't really know the string
extraction workflow that results in them being posted to the Damned
Lies server.
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Chris Leonard
On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 10:59 AM, Chris Leonard
cjlhomeaddr...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 10:34 AM, Manuel Quiñones ma...@laptop.org wrote:
 2013/4/11 Bastien b...@laptop.org:
 Hi Kalpa,

 this is a very nice and much needed project.

 Let's wait for Chris to chim in.  My take on this is that help files
 should be stored using a plain text format like MarkDown or Org-mode.
 It's easier to hack directly, it's easier to read diffs against such
 files, it's easier to feed a translator with them, and it can then be
 converted into Mallard (for internal browsing), or HTML (for online
 documentation) or... anything else.

 Storing directly in Mallard would be a mistake IMHO.



I know that Gnome projects use Mallard.  I don't really know the string
extraction workflow that results in them being posted to the Damned
Lies server.  I would guess that the gnome-18n mailing list or Shaun
McCance would be the people who would know more about that.

cjl
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Kalpa Welivitigoda
On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 8:31 PM, Chris Leonard cjlhomeaddr...@gmail.comwrote:

 On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 10:59 AM, Chris Leonard
 cjlhomeaddr...@gmail.com wrote:
  On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 10:34 AM, Manuel Quiñones ma...@laptop.org
 wrote:
  2013/4/11 Bastien b...@laptop.org:
  Hi Kalpa,
 
  this is a very nice and much needed project.
 
  Let's wait for Chris to chim in.  My take on this is that help files
  should be stored using a plain text format like MarkDown or Org-mode.
  It's easier to hack directly, it's easier to read diffs against such
  files, it's easier to feed a translator with them, and it can then be
  converted into Mallard (for internal browsing), or HTML (for online
  documentation) or... anything else.
 
  Storing directly in Mallard would be a mistake IMHO.
 


 I know that Gnome projects use Mallard.  I don't really know the string
 extraction workflow that results in them being posted to the Damned
 Lies server.  I would guess that the gnome-18n mailing list or Shaun
 McCance would be the people who would know more about that.


Since the initial form of the help file is in plain text, we can simply
extract the strings from there. btw, I've mailed Shaun so that we can have
his inputs to this discussion as well.


 cjl




-- 
Best Regards,

Kalpa Welivitigoda
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Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
University of Moratuwa
Sri Lanka
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Chris Leonard
On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 11:30 AM, Kalpa Welivitigoda
callka...@gmail.com wrote:

 Since the initial form of the help file is in plain text, we can simply
 extract the strings from there. btw, I've mailed Shaun so that we can have
 his inputs to this discussion as well.

I think most of our builds use fairly plain vanilla gettext tools.  I
have a sense that Mallard would introduce a dependency on intltool,
which I have not used.  Hopefully Shaun can give us an idea of what is
involved.

cjl
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Daniel Narvaez
On 11 April 2013 19:02, Chris Leonard cjlhomeaddr...@gmail.com wrote:

 On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 11:30 AM, Kalpa Welivitigoda
 callka...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  Since the initial form of the help file is in plain text, we can simply
  extract the strings from there. btw, I've mailed Shaun so that we can
 have
  his inputs to this discussion as well.

 I think most of our builds use fairly plain vanilla gettext tools.  I
 have a sense that Mallard would introduce a dependency on intltool,
 which I have not used.  Hopefully Shaun can give us an idea of what is
 involved.


We actually use intltool already in glucose.
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Kalpa Welivitigoda
On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 11:01 PM, Daniel Narvaez dwnarv...@gmail.comwrote:

 On 11 April 2013 19:02, Chris Leonard cjlhomeaddr...@gmail.com wrote:

 On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 11:30 AM, Kalpa Welivitigoda
 callka...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  Since the initial form of the help file is in plain text, we can simply
  extract the strings from there. btw, I've mailed Shaun so that we can
 have
  his inputs to this discussion as well.

 I think most of our builds use fairly plain vanilla gettext tools.  I
 have a sense that Mallard would introduce a dependency on intltool,
 which I have not used.  Hopefully Shaun can give us an idea of what is
 involved.



Here is Shaun's reply

We use ITS Tool to extract strings from XML into PO files, then merge
translated strings back to new XML files:

http://itstool.org/

ITS Tool works with any type of XML, and uses the Internationalization
Tag Set from the W3C to define how to segment the text.



 We actually use intltool already in glucose.




-- 
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Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
University of Moratuwa
Sri Lanka
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Chris Leonard
On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 2:55 PM, Kalpa Welivitigoda callka...@gmail.com wrote:


 Here is Shaun's reply

 We use ITS Tool to extract strings from XML into PO files, then merge
 translated strings back to new XML files:

 http://itstool.org/

 ITS Tool works with any type of XML, and uses the Internationalization
 Tag Set from the W3C to define how to segment the text.



 We actually use intltool already in glucose.


My bad for confusing ITStool and intltool. :-(

So there is something new we'd have to incorporate into the build process.

cjl
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Bastien
Hi all,

translation comes after the docs have been written.

The main barrier is not dependancies for translation tools,
it's about *writing* documentation.

Hence the idea of using a plain text light markup language.

Maybe we could run an informal poll about this in the Sugar
community to get a sense of what current devs are comfortable
with?  If they are comfortable with using MarkDown, I'd favor
using this.

Such feedback would be interesting anyway.

-- 
 Bastien
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Gonzalo Odiard
+10

We need use the easier possible way to write (and translate) the docs.
I don't know if there are wysiwyg tools to write the XML files for Mallard,
if not, is a big step backward.

Gonzalo


On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 5:19 PM, Bastien b...@laptop.org wrote:

 Hi all,

 translation comes after the docs have been written.

 The main barrier is not dependancies for translation tools,
 it's about *writing* documentation.

 Hence the idea of using a plain text light markup language.

 Maybe we could run an informal poll about this in the Sugar
 community to get a sense of what current devs are comfortable
 with?  If they are comfortable with using MarkDown, I'd favor
 using this.

 Such feedback would be interesting anyway.

 --
  Bastien
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [GSoC 2013] Interested in Implement help mechanism for activities using Mallard

2013-04-11 Thread Kalpa Welivitigoda
On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 1:53 AM, Gonzalo Odiard gonz...@laptop.org wrote:

 +10


Many thanks to Bastein for focusing us all on the topic again.



 We need use the easier possible way to write (and translate) the docs.
 I don't know if there are wysiwyg tools to write the XML files for Mallard,
 if not, is a big step backward.


There is FoieGras [1] which wa also a GSoC project from GNOME in 2008. I
have mailed Buddhika [2] who was the GSoC student for that project and he
is also from the same university as mine, University of Moratuwa. I'll
update with the status of FoieGras once Buddhika replies.

If I may summaries up to now,

Although the project idea says to implement a help system using Mallard, we
can extend it, write help files in plain text and convert them to desired
forms (Mallard, html etc) so that we can present them in several possible
ways.

Should we output only in Mallard format? I don't see any advantage right
now, since we have the capability to expand.

Since it is plain text, I think it's better to use MarkDown as the markup
language. Anyway once I hear from Buddhika, I'll drop a mail to sugar-devel
asking developers for their preference in markup language to be used.

[1] https://live.gnome.org/ProjectMallard/FoieGras
[2] http://mytechgossips.com/2007/08/24/end-of-a-great-three-months/

Gonzalo


 On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 5:19 PM, Bastien b...@laptop.org wrote:

 Hi all,

 translation comes after the docs have been written.

 The main barrier is not dependancies for translation tools,
 it's about *writing* documentation.

 Hence the idea of using a plain text light markup language.

 Maybe we could run an informal poll about this in the Sugar
 community to get a sense of what current devs are comfortable
 with?  If they are comfortable with using MarkDown, I'd favor
 using this.

 Such feedback would be interesting anyway.

 --
  Bastien
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-- 
Best Regards,

Kalpa Welivitigoda
Junior Treasurer | Electrical Engineering Society
Undergraduate | Department of Electrical Engineering
University of Moratuwa
Sri Lanka
http://about.me/callkalpa
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