Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Oliver Schad
On Sat, 28 Dec 2019 15:37:35 +0200 Alex Suykov wrote: > The reason I think it's mostly useless is because the only use case > for cgroup supervision is supervising double-forking daemons, which > is not a very smart thing to do. A much better approach is to get rid > of double-forking and then

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Guillermo
El sáb., 28 dic. 2019 a las 11:06, Alex Suykov escribió: > > Minor note on this. Resource limiting with cgroups does not require > any explicit support from s6, or any external tools for that matter. > Literally just `echo $$ > $cg/cgroup.procs` in the startup script > is enough, assuming the

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Oliver Schad
On Sat, 28 Dec 2019 12:19:30 -0300 Guillermo wrote: > El vie., 27 dic. 2019 a las 20:56, Oliver Schad escribió: > > > > Sorry, I have to correct that a bit: you can use the freezer cgroup > > as I did, but there is no guarantee, that you can successfully kill > > a freezed process. > > You

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Serge E. Hallyn
On Sat, Dec 28, 2019 at 06:41:56PM +0100, Oliver Schad wrote: > On Sat, 28 Dec 2019 15:37:35 +0200 > Alex Suykov wrote: > > > The reason I think it's mostly useless is because the only use case > > for cgroup supervision is supervising double-forking daemons, which > > is not a very smart thing

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Oliver Schad
On Sat, 28 Dec 2019 16:04:53 +0200 Alex Suykov wrote: > Sat, Dec 28, 2019 at 01:57:25PM +1100, eric vidal wrote: > > > Well, for me, cgroups is clearly a lack to s6. Using it for every > > process like systemd do have no sense, but in some case it can be > > useful to protect e.g an "over-eat"

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Guillermo
El vie., 27 dic. 2019 a las 20:56, Oliver Schad escribió: > > Sorry, I have to correct that a bit: you can use the freezer cgroup as > I did, but there is no guarantee, that you can successfully kill a > freezed process. You can't? So the 'kill -9' command in your script might not work while the

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Alex Suykov
Sat, Dec 28, 2019 at 01:46:08AM -0500, Steve Litt wrote: > * No if any code within the s6 stack must be changed. So much good > software has gone bad trying to incorporate features for only the > purpose of getting new users. It does not require any changes to s6. That's a major point I'd

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Casper Ti. Vector
On Sat, Dec 28, 2019 at 03:37:35PM +0200, Alex Suykov wrote: > The reason I think it's mostly useless is because the only use case > for cgroup supervision is supervising double-forking daemons, which > is not a very smart thing to do. A much better approach is to get rid > of double-forking and

Re: Mailing list archives?

2019-12-28 Thread Laurent Bercot
See ? Please be aware that due to a bug in the HTML displayer (which I still haven't delved into), some messages will be printed incorrectly. In that case, the messages are also available at https://www.mail-archive.com/supervision@list.skarnet.org/ --

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Alex Suykov
Sat, Dec 28, 2019 at 01:57:25PM +1100, eric vidal wrote: > Well, for me, cgroups is clearly a lack to s6. Using it for every > process like systemd do have no sense, but in some case it can be > useful to protect e.g an "over-eat" allocation memory by a program > (in particular over a server).

Mailing list archives?

2019-12-28 Thread Carl Winbäck
Hi folks! Are there any archives of the supervision list available online? The links over at http://smarden.org/runit/ are unfortunately broken. (http://skarnet.org/lists/archive.cgi?2 resp. http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.sysutils.supervision.general) Best regards, Carl

Re: Mailing list archives?

2019-12-28 Thread Carl Winbäck
On Sat, 28 Dec 2019 at 12:02, Casper Ti. Vector wrote: > See ? Thank you Casper!

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Casper Ti. Vector
On Sat, Dec 28, 2019 at 04:24:40AM +0200, Alex Suykov wrote: > I don't think a tool like this has any actual uses, other than in > arguments with systemd fans, but I guess that alone could justify > its existance. Thanks. It's brilliant! -- My current OpenPGP key: RSA4096/0x227E8CAAB7AA186C

Re: Mailing list archives?

2019-12-28 Thread Casper Ti. Vector
On Sat, Dec 28, 2019 at 11:55:31AM +0100, Carl Winbäck wrote: > Are there any archives of the supervision list available online? See ? -- My current OpenPGP key: RSA4096/0x227E8CAAB7AA186C (expires: 2020.10.19) 7077 7781 B859 5166 AE07 0286 227E 8CAA B7AA 186C

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Casper Ti. Vector
On Fri, Dec 27, 2019 at 04:29:13PM -0500, Steve Litt wrote: > What is slew? >From the Gentoo Forums post: "[the example] also uses slew, a flexible framework that thinly (~500 core SLOC, including ~200 for core service definitions) wraps around s6/s6-rc to offer some features commonly requested

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Laurent Bercot
If there's important pressure to have cgroups support, I will probably end up applying some version or another of jlyo's patch to s6-supervise Duh, no, I spaced out big time there. jlyo's patch is about namespaces support, not cgroups support. No modification to the supervisor is necessary to

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread eric vidal
> I definitly have to correct you: cgroups are *NOT* designed to catch > wild forking processes. This is just a side-effect ot them. I'm totally agreed. Systemd use it in the wrong way. It should not be used to track processes. > The purpose is to control resource limits, like CPU, RAM, Disk

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread eric vidal
On Sat, 28 Dec 2019 16:04:53 +0200 Alex Suykov wrote: > Sat, Dec 28, 2019 at 01:57:25PM +1100, eric vidal wrote: > > > Well, for me, cgroups is clearly a lack to s6. Using it for every > > process like systemd do have no sense, but in some case it can be > > useful to protect e.g an "over-eat"

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Oliver Schad
On Sat, 28 Dec 2019 15:05:59 -0300 Guillermo wrote: > Exactly. And that's what nosh's move-to-control-group(1) and > set-control-group-knob(1) do. They are convenience tools invoked by > nosh scripts generated by conversion of unit files (with > 'system-control convert-systemd-units'). Nosh's

Re: The "Unix Philosophy 2020" document

2019-12-28 Thread Oliver Schad
On Sat, 28 Dec 2019 12:29:59 -0600 "Serge E. Hallyn" wrote: > Note that with a few simple scripts, users (and daemons) can do this > all themselves. That is true, but the interface to setup and kill the stuff is a bit ugly or long to write. It makes sense to have an elegant/short way to express