Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-11-04 Thread stevea
From someone in the USA, I also see "chilled" water fountains / drinking 
fountains.  Invariably these are indoors, for example in a dentist's office, so 
they can be connected to both a drinking water supply (usually "simply" the 
municipal supply of potable water, though I've seen filtered versions as well) 
AND a source of electricity to power a small refrigeration unit that chills the 
drinking water.  Often, this is a wall-mounted unit that has a drain where the 
water flows, after allowing the light jet of chilled water at just below 
head-height for you to drink, while bowed slightly if you are an average-height 
adult — this means most children can use such a drinking fountain, too.

There is always a manual "tap" (button, lever, knob...) on these which 
"actuates" this style of drinking fountain; these never seem to be 
"free-flowing (always-flowing), chilled drinking water."
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-29 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging

On 28/10/22 23:38, Matija Nalis wrote:

This stands, however in many places on this planet (and growing by the day) 
there is now limited amount of drinking
water, and we often simply cannot afford to waste it - however much we might 
prefer such luxuruios carelessness are
constantly flowing water...


Agreed, though we are talking about how to tag things that do exist and 
what their uses are; not about the advantages and disadvantages of 
fountain typologies.


Fountains with continuous flow exist and are quite common in many 
places, some people such as Martin prefer these fountains because the 
water does not warm up and thus having a tag letting them know where to 
find these may be useful.


We shouldn't, for example, refrain from tagging such things because we 
think they're dangerous or harmful for the environment or the economy.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-29 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging

Most of the outdoor fountains I have seen are not chilled.

You get water at a temperature lower than the external one because the 
pipes are underground, sometimes the water is very cold; especially in 
the mountains where it could come from a spring.



Having a tap which prevents the water from flowing lets the water stop 
within the fountain; if the fountain is under direct sunlight it may 
warm up, especially if the fountain is made out of metal.


Thus, when you use this kind of fountains you often let the water flow 
for a while in order to discard the warm water and to get the cold one 
from the underground pipes.


On 29/10/22 00:38, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:




On Fri, 28 Oct 2022 at 18:23, Martin Koppenhoefer 
 wrote:


you’ll have to wait a long time until the water becomes cold and
can be drunken.


That one is a comment that stood out to me?

Is the water in your "drinking fountains" chilled, or is it just the 
natural temperature of the water coming out?


Yes, we do have cooled (very rarely chilled!) water dispensers, 
usually indoors where power is available, but for drinking fountains 
in parks etc, what comes out is what you get to drink!


Thanks

Graeme


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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-29 Thread Warin



On 29/10/22 07:57, Matija Nalis wrote:

On Fri, 28 Oct 2022 16:43:07 +1100, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:

On 28/10/22 06:24, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:

there was a discussion about this, tap was seen as a distinguishing property 
that is yet missing. Handle is similar but not the same (handle is the thing 
you touch, if it is there, e.g. it could also be sensor based)

Sensors are not handles .. I'm thinking about it having raised the issue
on the handle discussion wiki page. I take my time with 'new' ideas
trying to get them somewhat right. I think the actuator is more
important than the 'tap'/'valve' and would give more information than
'tap=yes/no'.

there is also already existing/documented
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:actuator as well as
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:valve

and others (use taginfo link from wiki, and click on "combinations" to find 
them)



Sorry .. wrong word!

Actuator in OSM is it the thing that operates it - an electric motor for 
instance.



Not that interested in that .. more of what initiates it's operation.. a 
light beam being broken can open a door using an electric motor as the 
actuator.


A handle that operates a toggle switch can do the same, as can a 
pressure mat, an RFID card, finger print reader, retina scan ...


The electric motor says nothing about what makes it turn on/off.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-29 Thread Warin


On 29/10/22 10:23, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:


sent from a phone


On 29 Oct 2022, at 00:42, Graeme Fitzpatrick  wrote:

Is the water in your "drinking fountains" chilled, or is it just the natural 
temperature of the water coming out?


there are a few “machines” that distribute chilled and carbon dioxide enriched 
water for a few pennies and where you fill bottles you bring, but these are 
relatively rare and are not considered drinking fountains, they’re an 
alternative. Speaking of drinking fountains, these are either fed by a spring 
or from the public water network.
Particularly in the summer, and if the fountain hasn’t been used for some time, 
you’ll have to let it flow until it gets to the network temperature, because 
the first water would be quite warm and unsafe to drink.



Best practice is to first operate the bubbler to let some water out 
unimpeded so;


the flow rate and trajectory can be judged

any dirt/bugs are cleaned out

the temperature can start to stabilize



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer


sent from a phone

> On 29 Oct 2022, at 00:42, Graeme Fitzpatrick  wrote:
> 
> Is the water in your "drinking fountains" chilled, or is it just the natural 
> temperature of the water coming out?


there are a few “machines” that distribute chilled and carbon dioxide enriched 
water for a few pennies and where you fill bottles you bring, but these are 
relatively rare and are not considered drinking fountains, they’re an 
alternative. Speaking of drinking fountains, these are either fed by a spring 
or from the public water network. 
Particularly in the summer, and if the fountain hasn’t been used for some time, 
you’ll have to let it flow until it gets to the network temperature, because 
the first water would be quite warm and unsafe to drink.

Cheers Martin 
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread Graeme Fitzpatrick
On Fri, 28 Oct 2022 at 18:23, Martin Koppenhoefer 
wrote:

> you’ll have to wait a long time until the water becomes cold and can be
> drunken.
>

That one is a comment that stood out to me?

Is the water in your "drinking fountains" chilled, or is it just the
natural temperature of the water coming out?

Yes, we do have cooled (very rarely chilled!) water dispensers, usually
indoors where power is available, but for drinking fountains in parks etc,
what comes out is what you get to drink!

Thanks

Graeme
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread Matija Nalis
On Fri, 28 Oct 2022 10:18:01 +0200, Martin Koppenhoefer 
 wrote:
> The push button fountain variant is horrible, you can hardly drink from it, 
> can not wash your hands, particularly the
> hand that you use to push the button, and even filling a bottle is harder 
> than with the continuous flow. 

I agree completely in the case of valve directly-operated by button. 

There are however (much more useful!) variants in which, when you press the 
button, water begins to flow and a button
slowly depresses, so you get dozen or so seconds of a water flow after pushing 
the button, where you can easily use it,
wash both hands etc. before the flow stops.

> In addition if the thing wasn’t used recently, you’ll have to wait a long 
> time until the water becomes cold and can
> be drunken.

This stands, however in many places on this planet (and growing by the day) 
there is now limited amount of drinking
water, and we often simply cannot afford to waste it - however much we might 
prefer such luxuruios carelessness are
constantly flowing water...



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread Matija Nalis
On Fri, 28 Oct 2022 16:43:07 +1100, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 28/10/22 06:24, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
>> there was a discussion about this, tap was seen as a distinguishing property 
>> that is yet missing. Handle is similar but not the same (handle is the thing 
>> you touch, if it is there, e.g. it could also be sensor based)
>
> Sensors are not handles .. I'm thinking about it having raised the issue 
> on the handle discussion wiki page. I take my time with 'new' ideas 
> trying to get them somewhat right. I think the actuator is more 
> important than the 'tap'/'valve' and would give more information than 
> 'tap=yes/no'.

there is also already existing/documented
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:actuator as well as
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:valve

and others (use taginfo link from wiki, and click on "combinations" to find 
them)

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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging

Thank you Martin!

Do not worry, I have met you before and remember you as a very good person.

I have no hard feelings about that.

On 28/10/22 11:24, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:


sent from a phone


On 28 Oct 2022, at 10:46, Davidoskky via Tagging  
wrote:
I do not like the aggressiveness in this comment of yours;


I am sorry I wrote it like this, and agree it was not nice. Please accept  my 
apologies.

Cheers Martin


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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread stevea
Oops, that went to the list!

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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread stevea
Hi Martin:  (Off-list) Thank you; a very public apology isn't always easy, but 
when warranted and sincere, it puts you into the light of "a very good person," 
at least in my eyes!

Steve

> On Oct 28, 2022, at 2:24 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> sent from a phone
> 
>> On 28 Oct 2022, at 10:46, Davidoskky via Tagging  
>> wrote:
>> I do not like the aggressiveness in this comment of yours;
> 
> 
> I am sorry I wrote it like this, and agree it was not nice. Please accept  my 
> apologies.
> 
> Cheers Martin 
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer



sent from a phone

> On 28 Oct 2022, at 10:46, Davidoskky via Tagging  
> wrote:
> I do not like the aggressiveness in this comment of yours;


I am sorry I wrote it like this, and agree it was not nice. Please accept  my 
apologies.

Cheers Martin 
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging

On 28/10/22 10:18, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:

How is such a statement helpful in a tagging discussion? It can be said about 
everything, I don’t tag it because I can go there to find out. If you are not 
interested in tagging details, don’t engage in the discussion about these 
things.


What I said is that I believe it is more important to tag whether the 
flow of water can be stopped or not than tagging specifically how it can 
be stopped or regulated.


You are misinterpreting what I wrote: I didn't state that such features 
shouldn't be tagged, just that I don't personally find it useful. I also 
provided an example of some people who might actually find it useful.


I do not like the aggressiveness in this comment of yours; I feel that 
prioritizing things is an important aspect when deciding what to do and 
discouraging people from intervening because they don't feel every 
single detail should be tagged is not a positive way to do this.


As an example: I might propose to tag the position of every single brick 
of every single building. This might be useful, but if someone 
intervenes by saying that adding the position of the buildings should be 
more important than specifying the position of the bricks I should not 
get mad at them. Their input is useful and will highlight the lack of 
buildings in the map; some people will prefer having all the buildings 
mapped even if the single bricks are not mapped.


I will not tell them their opinion is useless because they're not open 
to tagging every single detail that exists.



If I reflect on what I wrote "I can just go to the fountain and observe 
what I find." I then realize that the current tagging situation is even 
much less detailed than this. Prevalently it is currently (at least in 
this topic): here is drinking water, you can go there and see how it is 
provided to you. I barely can know there's a fountain there because of 
the overly fragmented tagging scheme.


Please let's not be ridiculous by assuming we have infinite resources 
and that whatever gets approved here will actually become a widespread 
and useful tag.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread stevea
On Oct 28, 2022, at 1:18 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer  wrote:
>> On 28 Oct 2022, at 09:58, Davidoskky via Tagging  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> While I could be interested in whether the flow of a fountain might be 
>> stopped or not, I'm not really interested in how I'd have to do that: I can 
>> just go to the fountain and observe what I find.
> 
> 
> I couldn’t agree less. The push button fountain variant is horrible, you can 
> hardly drink from it, can not wash your hands, particularly the hand that you 
> use to push the button, and even filling a bottle is harder than with the 
> continuous flow.
> In addition if the thing wasn’t used recently, you’ll have to wait a long 
> time until the water becomes cold and can be drunken.
> Lever operated taps will provide more comfort but for drinking, tapless 
> continuous flow is definitely the best.
> 
> Please also reflect about what you wrote: “ I can just go to the fountain and 
> observe what I find.” 
> How is such a statement helpful in a tagging discussion? It can be said about 
> everything, I don’t tag it because I can go there to find out. If you are not 
> interested in tagging details, don’t engage in the discussion about these 
> things.

I'm not usually one to scold or sound like I'm wagging my finger at naught 
behavior, unless my son gets kind of lazy at practicing his viola or so (which 
was many years ago) so I'm not going to do it here.  But I will say that we can 
take a generous attitude towards how difficult it can be for not only all of us 
to understand how vast such cultural differences are (I'm thinking a master's 
thesis could be done on "the differences of what is meant by tagging fountains, 
drinking and otherwise...in OSM"), but in how others don't always appreciate 
these cultural differences, either.

In this "fountain, bubbler, how we drink from water-source places around the 
world and tag these things in OSM," I've learned a lot, been deeply humbled at 
my ignorance (and I've been to three continents on this Earth, but by no means 
am I "fully world cultured," like I think most humans are not) and watch with 
full bewilderment at how the semantics continue to unfold about this subject:  
it is fascinating.  Let's be gentle and generous with each other and continue 
to find out how much we can learn about this and continue to have a good 
attitude that "if we can describe these things, and come to even a rough 
agreement about them, we can tag them."  We might not get that fully correct 
the first go-around, but we can be respectful (and awed and bewildered) without 
being insulting or insensitive.  Thank you.

BTW, I yet again and even now newly recall a sort of "drinking fountain" (what 
I call them) which has a little round push-button about the size of one's 
thumb-tip, and these sorts almost always produced a disappointing jet-arc of 
water that could only be described as "a dribble," so sad.  Couldn't wash hands 
(easily), couldn't fill a hydration bottle (easily), likely installed to be a 
drought-tolerant / water-saving way to be very frugal with water but with their 
ridiculous low flow, fell below the threshold of "user-friendly" to simply "wet 
one's whistle" with a drink of water.

And yes, all of the "laser-beam method to initiate flow" (implies tap=yes) and 
"what about disabled access...?" kinds of information continues to contribute 
to the incredible richness of this topic.  "Fountain" (bubbler, drinking 
fountain, amenity=drinking_water) are a ready-made poster-child subject for 
the sometimes truly-difficult subject of tagging in a worldwide map.  The more 
we keep an open mind about this, the better will become our tagging.
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer


sent from a phone

> On 28 Oct 2022, at 09:58, Davidoskky via Tagging  
> wrote:
> 
> While I could be interested in whether the flow of a fountain might be 
> stopped or not, I'm not really interested in how I'd have to do that: I can 
> just go to the fountain and observe what I find.


I couldn’t agree less. The push button fountain variant is horrible, you can 
hardly drink from it, can not wash your hands, particularly the hand that you 
use to push the button, and even filling a bottle is harder than with the 
continuous flow.
In addition if the thing wasn’t used recently, you’ll have to wait a long time 
until the water becomes cold and can be drunken.
Lever operated taps will provide more comfort but for drinking, tapless 
continuous flow is definitely the best.

Please also reflect about what you wrote: “ I can just go to the fountain and 
observe what I find.” 
How is such a statement helpful in a tagging discussion? It can be said about 
everything, I don’t tag it because I can go there to find out. If you are not 
interested in tagging details, don’t engage in the discussion about these 
things.


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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer


sent from a phone

> On 28 Oct 2022, at 09:58, Davidoskky via Tagging  
> wrote:
> Actuator definitely provides more information and implicitly defines tap=yes.


actuator was not proposed so far, handle was, and while it is documented, it 
doesn’t seem particularly helpful looking at the provided pictures and 
suggested values, nor is it actually used (only around 300 uses).

Cheers Martin 


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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-28 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging

On 28/10/22 07:43, Warin wrote:

I think the actuator is more important than the 'tap'/'valve' and 
would give more information than 'tap=yes/no'. 


Actuator definitely provides more information and implicitly defines 
tap=yes.


This said, I don't know whether it's more important. While I could be 
interested in whether the flow of a fountain might be stopped or not, 
I'm not really interested in how I'd have to do that: I can just go to 
the fountain and observe what I find.


I guess tagging the actuator may be useful for people with physical 
disabilities, who might be searching for a fountain that is easy to use 
for them, thus either a fountain without a tap or a fountain with an 
actuator that can be used easily.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-27 Thread Warin



On 28/10/22 06:24, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:


sent from a phone


On 27 Oct 2022, at 18:50, Matija Nalis  
wrote:

instead of ad-hoc inventing
new undocumented key without discussion...


there was a discussion about this, tap was seen as a distinguishing property 
that is yet missing. Handle is similar but not the same (handle is the thing 
you touch, if it is there, e.g. it could also be sensor based)



Sensors are not handles .. I'm thinking about it having raised the issue 
on the handle discussion wiki page. I take my time with 'new' ideas 
trying to get them somewhat right. I think the actuator is more 
important than the 'tap'/'valve' and would give more information than 
'tap=yes/no'.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-27 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer



sent from a phone

> On 27 Oct 2022, at 18:50, Matija Nalis  
> wrote:
> 
> instead of ad-hoc inventing
> new undocumented key without discussion...


there was a discussion about this, tap was seen as a distinguishing property 
that is yet missing. Handle is similar but not the same (handle is the thing 
you touch, if it is there, e.g. it could also be sensor based)
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-27 Thread Matija Nalis
On Wed, 26 Oct 2022 23:45:34 +0200, Martin Koppenhoefer 
 wrote:
>> On 26 Oct 2022, at 21:29, Paul Johnson  wrote:
>> Drinking fountains are switch or knob operated and shoot at an angle.
>
> these are assumptions based on your experiences that don’t hold true around 
> here, most drinking fountains have continuous flow.
>
> By the way, I started to add “tap”=yes/no to record whether there is a tap to 
> control the flow 

I think it would be much better to use already existing "handle=*" which is its 
purpose, instead of ad-hoc inventing
new undocumented key without discussion...

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:handle

handle=* has several advantages:
- it is already defined on wiki
- it is already used in the wild
- it has capability not only do define if the flow-control device exists or not 
(i.e. yes/no) 
  as does your suggested "tap=*", but also a specific type of it (i.e. 
activated by button or lever or wheel or ...)


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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-27 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
sent from a phone

> On 27 Oct 2022, at 08:33, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Water is usually scarce in Australia, all blubbers/drinking_fountains are 
> controlled.


sure, I did understand this, that’s why we should not generalize, the situation 
is different in different places.

There are “bubblers” with buttons/taps and other drinking fountains without 
taps. Just map it and possibly the details, and do not assume too much, because 
it might lead to wrong assumptions by others 

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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-27 Thread Warin


On 27/10/22 08:45, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:

sent from a phone


On 26 Oct 2022, at 21:29, Paul Johnson  wrote:

Drinking fountains are switch or knob operated and shoot at an angle.


these are assumptions based on your experiences that don’t hold true around 
here, most drinking fountains have continuous flow.

By the way, I started to add “tap”=yes/no to record whether there is a tap to 
control the flow


Water is usually scarce in Australia, all blubbers/drinking_fountains 
are controlled.




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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-26 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
sent from a phone

> On 26 Oct 2022, at 21:29, Paul Johnson  wrote:
> 
> Drinking fountains are switch or knob operated and shoot at an angle.


these are assumptions based on your experiences that don’t hold true around 
here, most drinking fountains have continuous flow.

By the way, I started to add “tap”=yes/no to record whether there is a tap to 
control the flow 
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-26 Thread Paul Johnson
On Thu, Oct 13, 2022 at 8:07 AM Davidoskky via Tagging <
tagging@openstreetmap.org> wrote:

> On 13/10/22 10:15, Warin wrote:
> > I see no point in depreciating anything at the moment .. 'we' need a
> > solution first before even thinking of depreciation.
>
> I do agree and appreciate this approach. A solution for tagging
> man_made=drinking_fountain already exists, that is fountain=bubbler.
>

Though, and I'm not entirely sure if the post made it to the list or not
since it had a picture attached to it, as previously mentioned, this isn't
ideal by a long stretch. Bubblers run continuously by design, and shoot
straight up, so they're also continuously washing themselves.  Drinking
fountains are switch or knob operated and shoot at an angle.
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-16 Thread Warin



On 16/10/22 02:49, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:

sent from a phone


On 15 Oct 2022, at 10:08, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:

The flow of water is downwards making them difficult to drink from without an 
aid e.g. a cup.


while it may be true, you have to acknowledge that there are many places in the 
world that are providing drinking fountains for a long time, sometimes for a 
very long time, and many of them have downward flow, so this should not be a 
criterion.

For some examples have a look at the drinking water article in wp.



I acknowledge the supply of 'drinking water' ... but not a 'drinking 
fountain' /'bubbler'.



I would not ascribe the word 'fountain' to it in OSM. I do note that the 
word 'fountain' has many meanings .. some ~7 in my dictionary.




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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-15 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer


sent from a phone

> On 15 Oct 2022, at 10:08, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> The flow of water is downwards making them difficult to drink from without an 
> aid e.g. a cup.


while it may be true, you have to acknowledge that there are many places in the 
world that are providing drinking fountains for a long time, sometimes for a 
very long time, and many of them have downward flow, so this should not be a 
criterion. 

For some examples have a look at the drinking water article in wp.

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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-15 Thread Warin


On 15/10/22 19:57, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging wrote:




Oct 15, 2022, 10:05 by 61sundow...@gmail.com:


On 14/10/22 22:53, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging wrote:




Oct 13, 2022, 10:15 by 61sundow...@gmail.com:

I see no point in depreciating anything at the moment .. 'we'
need a solution first before even thinking of depreciation.

I described what I found/considered at

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Deprecate_man_made%3Ddrinking_fountain/alternatives
but nothing seems viable and superior.

Have I missed something?


To me, fundamentally, the objects presently shown on that proposal
page are taps .. not drinking fountains.

The flow of water is downwards making them difficult to drink from
without an aid e.g. a cup.

Does it mean you want to deprecate tagging them as "generic drinking 
water fountain"

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:fountain%3Ddrinking ?



I would never map those as a drinking fountain. I would map them as 
water taps.
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-15 Thread Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging



Oct 15, 2022, 10:05 by 61sundow...@gmail.com:

>
>
>
> On 14/10/22 22:53, Mateusz Konieczny  via Tagging wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> Oct 13, 2022, 10:15 by >> 61sundow...@gmail.com>> :
>>
>>> I see no point in depreciating anything at the moment ..  'we' need 
>>> a solution first before even thinking of  depreciation.
>>>
>> I described what I found/considered at
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Deprecate_man_made%3Ddrinking_fountain/alternatives
>> but nothing seems viable and superior.
>>
>> Have I missed something?
>>
>
> To me, fundamentally, the objects presently shown on that  proposal page 
> are taps .. not drinking fountains. 
>
>
> The flow of water is downwards making them difficult to drink  from 
> without an aid e.g. a cup.
>
>
Does it mean you want to deprecate tagging them as "generic drinking water 
fountain"https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:fountain%3Ddrinking ?

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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-15 Thread Warin


On 14/10/22 22:53, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging wrote:




Oct 13, 2022, 10:15 by 61sundow...@gmail.com:

I see no point in depreciating anything at the moment .. 'we' need
a solution first before even thinking of depreciation.

I described what I found/considered at
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Deprecate_man_made%3Ddrinking_fountain/alternatives
but nothing seems viable and superior.

Have I missed something?

To me, fundamentally, the objects presently shown on that proposal page 
are taps .. not drinking fountains.


The flow of water is downwards making them difficult to drink from 
without an aid e.g. a cup.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-14 Thread Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging



Oct 13, 2022, 10:15 by 61sundow...@gmail.com:

> I see no point in depreciating anything at the moment .. 'we' need a solution 
> first before even thinking of depreciation.
>
I described what I found/considered at
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Deprecate_man_made%3Ddrinking_fountain/alternatives
but nothing seems viable and superior.

Have I missed something?
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-14 Thread Warin



On 14/10/22 00:03, Davidoskky via Tagging wrote:

On 13/10/22 10:15, Warin wrote:
I see no point in depreciating anything at the moment .. 'we' need a 
solution first before even thinking of depreciation. 


I do agree and appreciate this approach. A solution for tagging 
man_made=drinking_fountain already exists, that is fountain=bubbler.


I see no problem in deprecating that since a good and valid solution 
that does not present the same amount of problems does already exist, 
I believe this is well explained in the deprecation proposal.



I am trying to propose some solutions, but I'm rather inexperienced at 
doing that and thus I'm trying to follow advice of people who know 
more than me.


I have made a proposal which clearly has some problems and I will try 
to fix those problems as soon as I get time to do so.



OT: to all the threads I left unreplied up to now, sorry guys I'll get 
back to you as soon as I can.



Yek. There are too many of them for me to cope with. I need to take a 
photo of a tap and then upload 2 photos and add them to 
man_made=water_tap.. that may help answer some of the posts.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-13 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging

On 13/10/22 10:15, Warin wrote:
I see no point in depreciating anything at the moment .. 'we' need a 
solution first before even thinking of depreciation. 


I do agree and appreciate this approach. A solution for tagging 
man_made=drinking_fountain already exists, that is fountain=bubbler.


I see no problem in deprecating that since a good and valid solution 
that does not present the same amount of problems does already exist, I 
believe this is well explained in the deprecation proposal.



I am trying to propose some solutions, but I'm rather inexperienced at 
doing that and thus I'm trying to follow advice of people who know more 
than me.


I have made a proposal which clearly has some problems and I will try to 
fix those problems as soon as I get time to do so.



OT: to all the threads I left unreplied up to now, sorry guys I'll get 
back to you as soon as I can.




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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-13 Thread Warin



On 11/10/22 05:39, Davidoskky via Tagging wrote:



I feel that writing on this mailing list is not such a good way to 
find good solutions to problems, while it appears a wonderful place to 
find problems.





Yes, a wonderful way to find problems. Few suggest ways to fix them... I 
do try to suggest things, most ignore them.



I do support man_made=water_tap and man_made=drinking_fountain as 
standalone features, not necessarily attached to a building, a water 
tank etc...


If they are attached .. then a node on the other thing .. but the node 
only has the man_made=* tag.



-


I see no point in depreciating anything at the moment .. 'we' need a 
solution first before even thinking of depreciation.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-12 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer



sent from a phone

> On 10 Oct 2022, at 19:58, Davidoskky via Tagging  
> wrote:
> 
> tap=* and water_tap=* are currently being used to tag the presence of a water 
> tap in a building.
> 
> tap=* is used in Dominican Republic and the values used are "yes", "no" or 
> the number of water taps in the building.
> 
> water_tap=* is used in Venezuela to indicate if a fuel station has a water 
> tap available.
> 
> 
> Writing a proposal for tap=* becomes even more difficult if I have to keep 
> these uses in mind.


tap=* could mean the feature is equipped with a tap. If you deem this is 
incompatible with the usage on buildings (which it somehow is, or also not), 
maybe these could be retagged to water_tap=* or something even better, in 
accordance/cooperation  with the people who put them?

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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging


Do you know if a tag already exist to describe the presence   of a 
tap in a building ?


a tap like the one used in man_made=water_tap ?


I'm not exactly sure what it is describing, I should contact the people 
who added those tags...


I assume in the case of fuel stations it means there is water available, 
maybe for cleaning a car or something like this.


In the case of other buildings they tag it together with 
drinking_water=yes, so I guess in this case it means there are sinks or 
something like that in the building.



I was think about a proposal about water_tap 
If you wish, you can contact me privately and we can discuss on the 
points I'm unsure about the proposal I'm writing and find better 
solutions together.


I feel that writing on this mailing list is not such a good way to find 
good solutions to problems, while it appears a wonderful place to find 
problems.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Marc_marc

Le 10.10.22 à 19:55, Davidoskky via Tagging a écrit :


(BTW, I want to document existing tagging here and tap=yes has 347 
uses while

man_made=water_tap 23 711 uses - though if someone wants to make proposal
they are welcome, tagging scheme is quite rotten here)


I have been looking at the current uses of tap=* and water_tap=* as I'm 
planning to make a proposal for tap=*.


I was think about a proposal about water_tap
because if you want to map the feature of a man_man=water_tap
when it'sn't the main feature, well keeping the same string
is a batter idea than "man_made=A but B=yes/no

Do you know if a tag already exist to describe the presence   
of a tap in a building ?


a tap like the one used in man_made=water_tap ?



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging

On 10/10/22 18:25, Marc_marc wrote:


of course, I share your opinion since it breaks the tag chain system :
a sub-tag rafines the "upper" tag which must therefore be present.

it is the expression that at least one tag is missing to describe
the common characteristic between these amenity=fountain and these 
amenity=driking_water


Do you have any alternative idea on how to deal with this?

I already proposed the two ideas I got: either having amenity=fountain 
also describe non decorative fountains and thus deprecate fountain=* as 
subtag of amenity=drinking_water or introducing a new key for all those 
values of fountain=* that are not decorative fountains, so that 
fountain=* doesn't have to be a subtag of amenity=drinking_water.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging


(BTW, I want to document existing tagging here and tap=yes has 347 
uses while

man_made=water_tap 23 711 uses - though if someone wants to make proposal
they are welcome, tagging scheme is quite rotten here)


I have been looking at the current uses of tap=* and water_tap=* as I'm 
planning to make a proposal for tap=*.


tap=* and water_tap=* are currently being used to tag the presence of a 
water tap in a building.


tap=* is used in Dominican Republic and the values used are "yes", "no" 
or the number of water taps in the building.


water_tap=* is used in Venezuela to indicate if a fuel station has a 
water tap available.



Writing a proposal for tap=* becomes even more difficult if I have to 
keep these uses in mind.


Do you know if a tag already exist to describe the presence of a tap in 
a building? I think tap=* is appropriate, but maybe something else is 
already available.



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Marc_marc

Le 10.10.22 à 18:07, Davidoskky via Tagging a écrit :
having fountain=* as subtag of amenity=drinking_water does  
not look like a good solution to me


of course, I share your opinion since it breaks the tag chain system :
a sub-tag rafines the "upper" tag which must therefore be present.

it is the expression that at least one tag is missing to describe
the common characteristic between these amenity=fountain and these 
amenity=driking_water




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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging
It is true that OpenStreetMap allows for any tag you like, but this 
isn’t meant to encourage you to devalue established tags by using them 
differently from how they are typically used. What would be the 
benefit you expect from such retagging? 


This is not something I am suggesting; this is the current state of things.

fountain=drinking is currently a subtag of amenity=fountain and it is 
documented in the wiki. fountain=* is unfortunately also a subtag of 
amenity=drinking_water, I just noticed this and I think that this makes 
it even more confusing.


Anyway, I have proposed another solution: the introduction of a new key 
to cover all these features; a proposal for it was made but it was 
withdrawn due to fierce criticism, among which was yours since you 
disliked the fact that it deprecated some tags you're using.



I do see the problems in both approaches; but also having fountain=* as 
subtag of amenity=drinking_water does not look like a good solution to 
me. Moreover, what is the point of having values of fountain=* that do 
not apply to the amenity=fountain main key?


For example, this approach does not allow tagging fountains which are 
not decorative and that do not provide drinking water.


You can tag them as man_made=water_tap if they have a tap, if a tap is 
not present these cannot be tagged according to this scheme, because:


- No tap, thus no man_made=water_tap

- Not a decorative fountain, thus no amenity=fountain

- No drinking water, thus no amenity=drinking_water


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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging

Oct 10, 2022, 15:45 by marc_m...@mailo.com:

 I started this thread to confirm/reject listing
 https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Bubbler.jpg as
 man_made=water_tap
 fountain=bubbler
 drinking_water=yes
 amenity=drinking_water

>
> how can you have a sub-tag fountain=* without a main tag *=fountain ?
>
I have not designed this tagging scheme, and apparently depending
on situation it is 
- subtag of amenity=fountain
- subtag of amenity=drinking_water
- primary tag

¯\_ (ツ)_/¯
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Peter Neale via Tagging
>So "water tap" is referring only to control mechanism that enables user to 
>start water flow?>(and sometimes also stop water flow)
>Not to entire water delivery apparatus?
Yes!, Just like my house HAS a door (which controls entry and leaving), but my 
house IS_NOT a door.
So a water-delivery device (whtever you call it) can HAVE a tap (to contol flow 
of water leaving), but that does NOT mean that the whole thing IS a tap.
Regards,Peter
 PeterPan99
 

On Sunday, 9 October 2022 at 22:18:50 BST, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging 
 wrote:  
 
 


Oct 9, 2022, 23:08 by dieterdre...@gmail.com:



sent from a phone

On 9 Oct 2022, at 22:56, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging 
 wrote:

Let me know if this edit was right or wrong (I am quite confused here,
and this is why I want to document this to make situation less confusing).



IMHO saying it _is_ a water tap is confusing, I’d say it _has_ a water tap, 
i.e. tap=yes

wait.

So "water tap" is referring only to control mechanism that enables user to 
start water flow?
(and sometimes also stop water flow)

Not to entire water delivery apparatus?

(BTW, I want to document existing tagging here and tap=yes has 347 uses while
man_made=water_tap 23 711 uses - though if someone wants to make proposal
they are welcome, tagging scheme is quite rotten here)
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer



sent from a phone

> On 10 Oct 2022, at 15:34, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Do we tag
> 
> the waste receptacle
> 
> or
> 
> the tap
> 
> or
> 
> the drinking fountain
> 
> ?? Which is the feature primarily there for? To me that is the drinking 
> fountain. I'd leave out the tap and the waste receptacle


if you want to tag it all in one node, you could add tap=yes and bin=yes, the 
latter is often used for bus stops with a waste bin.
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer


sent from a phone

> On 10 Oct 2022, at 09:12, Davidoskky via Tagging  
> wrote:
> 
> I like this, but I'd remove amenity=drinking_water rather than 
> drinking_water=yes, because you _should_ add the tag amenity=fountain.


this would be completely inconsistent with the usage of the amenity=fountain 
tag in OpenStreetMap as far as I have seen it in multiple countries. It is true 
that OpenStreetMap allows for any tag you like, but this isn’t meant to 
encourage you to devalue established tags by using them differently from how 
they are typically used. What would be the benefit you expect from such 
retagging?

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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Marc_marc

I started this thread to confirm/reject listing
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Bubbler.jpg as
man_made=water_tap
fountain=bubbler
drinking_water=yes
amenity=drinking_water


how can you have a sub-tag fountain=* without a main tag *=fountain ?

next time I map one, I 'll use
amenity=drinking_water
tap=yes
flow_direction=up

this doesn't prevent to have drinking_water for amenity=fountain



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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Warin



On 10/10/22 08:20, stevea wrote:


I continue to call "bubblers" (although I personally call them "drinking fountains") emitting a jot of water 
on button press "water taps," as it is that button press that makes them a "tap."  Yes, they are both 
drinking fountains / bubblers, too, as well as amenity=drinking_water, I hope it is all clear (how I see things).  And, I 
continue to listen, this is sort of fascinating, in an "oh, my gosh, look how we have had to drag this out" kind of way.
___


To me a drinking fountain provides water for easy immediate human 
consumption of water without any aids. Here they usually have a control 
device, a tap' and a waste receptacle.


Do we tag

the waste receptacle

or

the tap

or

the drinking fountain

?? Which is the feature primarily there for? To me that is the drinking 
fountain. I'd leave out the tap and the waste receptacle.





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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-10 Thread Davidoskky via Tagging




I started this thread to confirm/reject listing
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Bubbler.jpg as
man_made=water_tap
fountain=bubbler
drinking_water=yes
amenity=drinking_water



replace man_made=water_tap with tap=yes and I subscribe. Also remove 
the redundant drinking_water=yes, it is implied by amenity=drinking_water


I like this, but I'd remove amenity=drinking_water rather than 
drinking_water=yes, because you _should_ add the tag amenity=fountain.


+1 for tap=yes.


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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-09 Thread Graeme Fitzpatrick
On Mon, 10 Oct 2022 at 10:13, stevea  wrote:

>
> > replace man_made=water_tap with tap=yes and I subscribe. Also remove the
> redundant drinking_water=yes, it is implied by amenity=drinking_water
>
> This makes a lot of sense; +1.
>

Yep!

Thanks

Graeme
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-09 Thread stevea
On Oct 9, 2022, at 5:06 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer  wrote:
>> On 9 Oct 2022, at 23:21, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I started this thread to confirm/reject listing
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Bubbler.jpg as
>> man_made=water_tap
>> fountain=bubbler
>> drinking_water=yes
>> amenity=drinking_water
> 
> replace man_made=water_tap with tap=yes and I subscribe. Also remove the 
> redundant drinking_water=yes, it is implied by amenity=drinking_water

This makes a lot of sense; +1.

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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-09 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer


sent from a phone

> On 9 Oct 2022, at 23:21, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging 
>  wrote:
> 
> I started this thread to confirm/reject listing
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Bubbler.jpg as
> man_made=water_tap
> fountain=bubbler
> drinking_water=yes
> amenity=drinking_water


replace man_made=water_tap with tap=yes and I subscribe. Also remove the 
redundant drinking_water=yes, it is implied by amenity=drinking_water

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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-09 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer


sent from a phone

> On 9 Oct 2022, at 23:21, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging 
>  wrote:
> 
> Which one?
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Water_flowing_from_drinking_water_tap.jpg
>  ?


yes, this one is not very clear, although the sticker they added makes it clear 
it is fine for drinking, apparently you have to bring a glass or bottle in 
order to drink without too much hazzle (you could drink there if it was without 
alternatives, for sure, but with alternatives you’d probably avoid it, because 
push buttons are generally uncomfortable and in this instance there is also too 
few distance to the support). The picture is not clear because we do not get to 
see the whole thing, just the tap



> Then I have not added in edit mentioned in this thread and I am still 
> confused about it
> and asked some question that I hope will clarify situation (I am confused how 
> it
> differs from https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Fontanella_Bolsena.jpg -

the Bolsena one is clearly a drinking fountain made for people and animals, and 
is also styled like one so it can be identified from a distance (if you know 
local habits), the other one is not so clear but I wouldn’t complain if it was 
tagged as fountain=drinking

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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-09 Thread stevea
On Oct 9, 2022, at 1:53 PM, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging 
 wrote:
> As the next part of drinking water linguistic journey I documented at
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dwater_tap#Examples
> (bottom example) that bubblers are mostly water taps, despite that
> it may be highly confusing for some people which are not native
> speakers. 
> 
> Like me.
> 
> Let me know if this edit was right or wrong (I am quite confused here,
> and this is why I want to document this to make situation less confusing).

"Drinking water linguistic journey" is both accurate and nearly hilarious 
(well, mirthful to me, at least)!

I think your edit is accurate, Mateusz, especially as you clarify a water tap 
has the feature that it is "activated by its user."

Martin, "tap=yes" is sort of mathematically (boolean-ly?) unambiguous and I'm 
glad OSM as a database can strip it down like this.  Whether the correct verb 
for this noun is "is" or "has" might be confusing for the former (but not the 
latter), but both verbs work just fine for me (a native English speaker).  When 
one says "is" (a water tap) one means "the entire fixture acts as one" and when 
one says "has" one means "the spigot feature (smaller than the entirety of the 
whole device) is the thing the device has that acts as a water tap."

Whew, English!  Journeys through it.  I hope that this (what a long, strange 
trip it's been...) can add some clarity to however we finally document the 
various flavors of tap, drinking water, et cetera.  It's work, but it's worth 
it, as there MUST be a finish line in our future!

I continue to call "bubblers" (although I personally call them "drinking 
fountains") emitting a jot of water on button press "water taps," as it is that 
button press that makes them a "tap."  Yes, they are both drinking fountains / 
bubblers, too, as well as amenity=drinking_water, I hope it is all clear (how I 
see things).  And, I continue to listen, this is sort of fascinating, in an 
"oh, my gosh, look how we have had to drag this out" kind of way.
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-09 Thread Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging



Oct 9, 2022, 23:06 by dieterdre...@gmail.com:

>
>
> sent from a phone
>
>
>> On 9 Oct 2022, at 22:56, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging 
>>  wrote:
>>
>> As the next part of drinking water linguistic journey I documented at
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dwater_tap#Examples
>> (bottom example) that bubblers are mostly water taps, despite that
>> it may be highly confusing for some people which are not native
>> speakers.
>>
>
>
> the cylinder shaped drinking water fountain/water tap you set as example for 
> water tap, if I counted right, was seen by 2 people as not a drinking 
> fountain (Warin and stevea), while I said it was one or could be seen as one 
> and you and marcmarc haven‘t been explicit. Maybe I missed someone in the 
> count? I wouldn’t use such “survey results” to back anything in the wiki, and 
> would not make suggestions in the wiki for the tagging of such edge cases.
>
Which one?
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Water_flowing_from_drinking_water_tap.jpg
 ?
Then I have not added in edit mentioned in this thread and I am still confused 
about it
and asked some question that I hope will clarify situation (I am confused how it
differs from https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Fontanella_Bolsena.jpg - 
or
is https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:fountain also requiring changes or 
maybe
entire fountain=drinking value is also broken).
I started this thread to confirm/reject listing
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Bubbler.jpg as
man_made=water_tap
fountain=bubbler
drinking_water=yes
amenity=drinking_water
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-09 Thread Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging



Oct 9, 2022, 23:08 by dieterdre...@gmail.com:

>
>
> sent from a phone
>
>> On 9 Oct 2022, at 22:56, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging 
>>  wrote:
>>
>> Let me know if this edit was right or wrong (I am quite confused here,
>> and this is why I want to document this to make situation less confusing).
>>
>
>
> IMHO saying it _is_ a water tap is confusing, I’d say it _has_ a water tap, 
> i.e. tap=yes
>
wait.

So "water tap" is referring only to control mechanism that enables user to 
start water flow?
(and sometimes also stop water flow)

Not to entire water delivery apparatus?

(BTW, I want to document existing tagging here and tap=yes has 347 uses while
man_made=water_tap 23 711 uses - though if someone wants to make proposal
they are welcome, tagging scheme is quite rotten here)
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-09 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer


sent from a phone

> On 9 Oct 2022, at 22:56, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging 
>  wrote:
> 
> Let me know if this edit was right or wrong (I am quite confused here,
> and this is why I want to document this to make situation less confusing).


IMHO saying it _is_ a water tap is confusing, I’d say it _has_ a water tap, 
i.e. tap=yes

Cheers Martin 
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Re: [Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-09 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer


sent from a phone

> On 9 Oct 2022, at 22:56, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging 
>  wrote:
> 
> As the next part of drinking water linguistic journey I documented at
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dwater_tap#Examples
> (bottom example) that bubblers are mostly water taps, despite that
> it may be highly confusing for some people which are not native
> speakers.


the cylinder shaped drinking water fountain/water tap you set as example for 
water tap, if I counted right, was seen by 2 people as not a drinking fountain 
(Warin and stevea), while I said it was one or could be seen as one and you and 
marcmarc haven‘t been explicit. Maybe I missed someone in the count? I wouldn’t 
use such “survey results” to back anything in the wiki, and would not make 
suggestions in the wiki for the tagging of such edge cases.

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[Tagging] Apparently bubblers emitting jet of water on buton press are water taps

2022-10-09 Thread Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging
As the next part of drinking water linguistic journey I documented at
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dwater_tap#Examples
(bottom example) that bubblers are mostly water taps, despite that
it may be highly confusing for some people which are not native
speakers. 

Like me.

Let me know if this edit was right or wrong (I am quite confused here,
and this is why I want to document this to make situation less confusing).

Edit was done in
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:man_made%3Dwater_tap=2417001=2416998
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