Re: [Tagging] Canopy radius for natural=tree

2015-02-25 Thread Friedrich Volkmann
On 25.02.2015 11:47, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
 it is using the natural language notation with space (underscore)
 rather than diameter:crown.

I feel that this differentiation became blurry due to the random use of :
and _ for _type and :type suffixes.

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Re: [Tagging] Canopy radius for natural=tree

2015-02-25 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
2015-02-25 14:23 GMT+01:00 Friedrich Volkmann b...@volki.at:

 On 25.02.2015 11:47, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
  it is using the natural language notation with space (underscore)
  rather than diameter:crown.

 I feel that this differentiation became blurry due to the random use of :
 and _ for _type and :type suffixes.




there are other indications that diameter_crown is the odd one in our
tagging systems: search for diameter in taginfo
http://taginfo.osm.org/search?q=diameter
and you'll find
168K fire_hydrant:diameter
145K diameter_crown
3,5 K hole:diameter
2 K rotor:diameter
and a lot of not so much used other diameters, including 2 trunk:diameter
but 0 trunk_diameter.

cheers,
Martin
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Re: [Tagging] Canopy radius for natural=tree

2015-02-25 Thread Friedrich Volkmann
This construct does not come from a natural language. It's rather computer
programming style, like class::subclass (see maxwidth:physical=*, name:en=*
etc.), and it's also in spirit of mathematical notation (functions,
subscripts), like diameter(crown).

On 23.02.2015 23:48, Colin Smale wrote:
 No adjectives here... Crown diameter is a compound noun composed of two 
 nouns.
 
 More likely a germanic language where the juxtaposition implies a genitive -
 diameter crown -- diameter of the crown. Could certainly be Dutch or
 German - it's a very common construct.
 
  
 
 On 2015-02-23 23:22, John F. Eldredge wrote:
 
 True. English usually has an adjective followed by a noun. I would guess
 that diameter crown was probably written by someone more familiar with a
 language where adjectives follow nouns.

 -- 
 John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com
 Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot
 drive out hate; only love can do that. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

 On February 23, 2015 3:17:33 PM Brad Neuhauser brad.neuhau...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 diameter crown also doesn't appear to be vernacular English,
 unfortunately. Crown diameter or crown spread seem to be more
 widely used.  For example, see
 http://www.treeterms.co.uk/definitions/crown-diameter, and
 
 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_crown_measurement#Crown_Spread_Methodologies

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Adr.: Davidgasse 76-80/14/10, 1100 Wien, Austria

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Re: [Tagging] Canopy radius for natural=tree

2015-02-25 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
2015-02-25 11:41 GMT+01:00 Friedrich Volkmann b...@volki.at:

 This construct does not come from a natural language. It's rather computer
 programming style, like class::subclass (see maxwidth:physical=*, name:en=*
 etc.), and it's also in spirit of mathematical notation (functions,
 subscripts), like diameter(crown).


yes. But it is using the natural language notation with space (underscore)
rather than diameter:crown.

cheers,
Martin
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[Tagging] Canopy radius for natural=tree

2015-02-23 Thread Bryce Nesbitt
Having seen a tiny rendered dot for a large tree, I went to add a canopy radius.
Despite the rather comprehensive
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:natural%3Dtree
there did not seem to be a tag.

What would people use?  radius=valueunit ?

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Re: [Tagging] Canopy radius for natural=tree

2015-02-23 Thread Brad Neuhauser
diameter crown also doesn't appear to be vernacular English,
unfortunately. Crown diameter or crown spread seem to be more widely
used.  For example, see
http://www.treeterms.co.uk/definitions/crown-diameter, and
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_crown_measurement#Crown_Spread_Methodologies

On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 2:55 PM, Warin 61sundow...@gmail.com wrote:

  On 24/02/2015 5:09 AM, althio wrote:

 From usage at
 http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/natural=tree#combinations

 I will suggest you look into:
 145 135 diameter_crown
 http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/diameter_crown=*


 Missing documentation in the wiki?

 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:natural%3Dtree#Size

 The suggestion there is tree_spread .. also undocumented.

 diameter_crown looks to be used by JOSM ... pity they did not document it.

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Re: [Tagging] Canopy radius for natural=tree

2015-02-23 Thread Colin Smale
 

No adjectives here... Crown diameter is a compound noun composed of
two nouns. 

More likely a germanic language where the juxtaposition implies a
genitive - diameter crown -- diameter of the crown. Could certainly
be Dutch or German - it's a very common construct. 

On 2015-02-23 23:22, John F. Eldredge wrote: 

 True. English usually has an adjective followed by a noun. I would guess that 
 diameter crown was probably written by someone more familiar with a 
 language where adjectives follow nouns. 
 
 -- 
 John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com
 Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot 
 drive out hate; only love can do that. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. 
 
 On February 23, 2015 3:17:33 PM Brad Neuhauser brad.neuhau...@gmail.com 
 wrote: 
 diameter crown also doesn't appear to be vernacular English, unfortunately. 
 Crown diameter or crown spread seem to be more widely used. For example, 
 see http://www.treeterms.co.uk/definitions/crown-diameter [1], and 
 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_crown_measurement#Crown_Spread_Methodologies
  [2] 
 
 On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 2:55 PM, Warin 61sundow...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 On 24/02/2015 5:09 AM, althio wrote: 
 
 From usage at http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/natural=tree#combinations 
 [3] 
 
 I will suggest you look into:
 145 135 diameter_crown [4]=* 
 Missing documentation in the wiki? 
 
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:natural%3Dtree#Size [5]
 
 The suggestion there is tree_spread .. also undocumented. 
 
 diameter_crown looks to be used by JOSM ... pity they did not document it. 
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Links:
--
[1] http://www.treeterms.co.uk/definitions/crown-diameter
[2]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_crown_measurement#Crown_Spread_Methodologies
[3] http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/natural=tree#combinations
[4] http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/diameter_crown
[5] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:natural%3Dtree#Size
[6] https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
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Re: [Tagging] Canopy radius for natural=tree

2015-02-23 Thread John F. Eldredge
True. English usually has an adjective followed by a noun. I would guess 
that diameter crown was probably written by someone more familiar with a 
language where adjectives follow nouns.


--
John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot 
drive out hate; only love can do that. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.




On February 23, 2015 3:17:33 PM Brad Neuhauser brad.neuhau...@gmail.com 
wrote:



diameter crown also doesn't appear to be vernacular English,
unfortunately. Crown diameter or crown spread seem to be more widely
used.  For example, see
http://www.treeterms.co.uk/definitions/crown-diameter, and
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_crown_measurement#Crown_Spread_Methodologies

On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 2:55 PM, Warin 61sundow...@gmail.com wrote:

  On 24/02/2015 5:09 AM, althio wrote:

 From usage at
 http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/natural=tree#combinations

 I will suggest you look into:
 145 135 diameter_crown
 http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/diameter_crown=*


 Missing documentation in the wiki?

 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:natural%3Dtree#Size

 The suggestion there is tree_spread .. also undocumented.

 diameter_crown looks to be used by JOSM ... pity they did not document it.

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Re: [Tagging] Canopy radius for natural=tree

2015-02-23 Thread Tobias Knerr
On 23.02.2015 19:09, althio wrote:
 I will suggest you look into:
 145 135 diameter_crown
 http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/diameter_crown=*

With only 30 users, that's almost certainly an import. So we should not
let this dictate our tag choice if there are reasons to choose a
different option.

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