Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (brickkiln)

2014-10-26 Thread Megha Shrestha
We collected the list of the brick kilns from Brick kiln association for
Kathmandu Valley and even mapped the kilns from the satellite image as they
are distinct features. We went to the field where the brick kilns are
located, asked the authorized person for the information and permission to
upload the data in openstreetmap. While uploading the data to the
openstreetmap the necessary tags were not available, which is the reason
for proposing the additional tags.

On Tue, Oct 21, 2014 at 9:58 AM, Philip Barnes p...@trigpoint.me.uk wrote:

 On Tue, 2014-10-21 at 02:21 -0700, Megha Shrestha wrote:
  We collected the data from field survey.

 By field survey what do you mean?

 You can obviously collect data from what you can see, from signs.

 But my concern is much of this information could be seen as commercially
 sensitive, where does this information come from?
 Have you the necessary permissions to use that information?
 Was the person giving it authorised to do so?
 Did the person giving it understand how you intend to use the
 information?

 Phil (trigpoint)


 
  On Tue, Oct 21, 2014 at 1:39 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer
  dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  2014-10-21 10:27 GMT+02:00 Megha Shrestha
  meghashrest...@gmail.com:
  We are not about to import any dataset instead we will
  manually upload the data to osm.
 
 
 
  how did you collect the data, e.g. about landownership, the
  numbers of male and female workers, etc.?
 
 
  Cheers,
  Martin
 
 
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Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (brickkiln)

2014-10-21 Thread Megha Shrestha
We are not about to import any dataset instead we will manually upload the
data to osm.

Cheers,
Megha

On Mon, Oct 20, 2014 at 3:00 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com
 wrote:


 2014-10-19 7:10 GMT+02:00 Megha Shrestha meghashrest...@gmail.com:

 Thank you for the suggestion. These are the details that are already
 available to us and I think they can be huge help if made open which is the
 reason for me to suggest this tag. I have gone through your suggestions and
 will make the required edits. Use of existing tag can be a help. I will add
 the additional information you said will be relevant to the proposal page.
 There is no such community that keeps these data updated but we are the
 representatives of OSM in Nepal and we are trying to get data updated
 regularly in OSM and this is also a part of our project.



 As you are probably going to import data into OSM you should be aware that
 there are guidelines which you are required to follow, which contain
 besides other things the requirement of writing to the import mailing list
 and documenting everything in the wiki:
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Import/Guidelines

 cheers,
 Martin

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Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (brickkiln)

2014-10-21 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
2014-10-21 10:27 GMT+02:00 Megha Shrestha meghashrest...@gmail.com:

 We are not about to import any dataset instead we will manually upload the
 data to osm.



how did you collect the data, e.g. about landownership, the numbers of male
and female workers, etc.?

Cheers,
Martin
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Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (brickkiln)

2014-10-21 Thread Megha Shrestha
We collected the data from field survey.

On Tue, Oct 21, 2014 at 1:39 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com
 wrote:


 2014-10-21 10:27 GMT+02:00 Megha Shrestha meghashrest...@gmail.com:

 We are not about to import any dataset instead we will manually upload
 the data to osm.



 how did you collect the data, e.g. about landownership, the numbers of
 male and female workers, etc.?

 Cheers,
 Martin

 ___
 Tagging mailing list
 Tagging@openstreetmap.org
 https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging


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Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (brickkiln)

2014-10-21 Thread Philip Barnes
On Tue, 2014-10-21 at 02:21 -0700, Megha Shrestha wrote:
 We collected the data from field survey.

By field survey what do you mean?

You can obviously collect data from what you can see, from signs. 

But my concern is much of this information could be seen as commercially
sensitive, where does this information come from? 
Have you the necessary permissions to use that information? 
Was the person giving it authorised to do so?
Did the person giving it understand how you intend to use the
information?

Phil (trigpoint)


 
 On Tue, Oct 21, 2014 at 1:39 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer
 dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 2014-10-21 10:27 GMT+02:00 Megha Shrestha
 meghashrest...@gmail.com:
 We are not about to import any dataset instead we will
 manually upload the data to osm.
 
 
 
 how did you collect the data, e.g. about landownership, the
 numbers of male and female workers, etc.?
 
 
 Cheers,
 Martin
 
 
 ___
 Tagging mailing list
 Tagging@openstreetmap.org
 https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
 
 
 
 ___
 Tagging mailing list
 Tagging@openstreetmap.org
 https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging



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Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (brickkiln)

2014-10-20 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
2014-10-19 7:10 GMT+02:00 Megha Shrestha meghashrest...@gmail.com:

 Thank you for the suggestion. These are the details that are already
 available to us and I think they can be huge help if made open which is the
 reason for me to suggest this tag. I have gone through your suggestions and
 will make the required edits. Use of existing tag can be a help. I will add
 the additional information you said will be relevant to the proposal page.
 There is no such community that keeps these data updated but we are the
 representatives of OSM in Nepal and we are trying to get data updated
 regularly in OSM and this is also a part of our project.



As you are probably going to import data into OSM you should be aware that
there are guidelines which you are required to follow, which contain
besides other things the requirement of writing to the import mailing list
and documenting everything in the wiki:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Import/Guidelines

cheers,
Martin
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Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (brickkiln)

2014-10-18 Thread Megha Shrestha
Thank you for the suggestion. These are the details that are already
available to us and I think they can be huge help if made open which is the
reason for me to suggest this tag. I have gone through your suggestions and
will make the required edits. Use of existing tag can be a help. I will add
the additional information you said will be relevant to the proposal page.
There is no such community that keeps these data updated but we are the
representatives of OSM in Nepal and we are trying to get data updated
regularly in OSM and this is also a part of our project. I find these data
relevant especially in the environment aspect and people should have access
to these data as I found that brick kilns are not much mapped in OSM. About
the operating season and the market they are quite stable in case of Nepal
for other countries I do not have much idea. I think landownership can be
added as a tag as brick kiln are mapped as an area.

I hope my explanation works and I will make edits to the page.

On Fri, Oct 17, 2014 at 4:50 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com
 wrote:


 2014-10-15 6:31 GMT+02:00 Megha Shrestha meghashrest...@gmail.com:

 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/brickkiln




 I have seen on your proposal page that you are aware of the introduced
 man_made=kiln
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dkiln

 My suggestion is to use this established tagging scheme. If the only
 problem you see is that there are no size connotations on a node, then
 please use that tag on an area. There is also a suggestion to add
 product=bricks on the kiln page, so rather then proposing a new tag
 brickkiln you could use
 man_made=kiln
 and
 product=bricks

 You are also proposing a long list of additional tags, some of which are
 very detailed and I am not sure if these details are available to anyone
 besides the operator of the kiln (but that's not a problem, time will show
 which tags get adopted by the mappers and which aren't). If you are
 interesting in evaluating these tags I'd propose you add a list of possible
 values to these tags.

 In particular:

 firing
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:firingaction=editredlink=1
 =* Type of firing used. eg: continuous


 what are the other firing types?


  chimney
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:chimneyaction=editredlink=1
 =yes/no To denote the existence of the chimney  chimney
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:chimneyaction=editredlink=1
 :number
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:numberaction=editredlink=1
 =* Number of the chimney in the brick kiln area


 maybe chimney:amount would be easier to understand? or chimney_count
 (similar to step_count for steps)?


  chimney
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:chimneyaction=editredlink=1
 :height http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:height=height in meters 
 Height
 of the top of the chimney from ground-level in meters. (like Tag:man
 made=tower http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dtower)
 chimney
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:chimneyaction=editredlink=1
 :category
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:categoryaction=editredlink=1
 =* Type of chimney existing in the brick kiln area


 My suggestion would be to map the chimneys individually with their own
 objects. You could then omit the related chimney tags on the kiln area and
 use simple and well established general tags like height on the
 individual chimney. Also the chimney number would be mapped implicitly by
 mapping the single chimneys.


  fuel http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:fuel=* Fuel used to heat
 the kiln  quantity_fuel
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:quantity_fuelaction=editredlink=1
 =* Quantity of the fuel required


 required for what? In what time? In what unit should it be entered (if at
 all)? Maybe this is a detail that is hard to get.


  moulding_process
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:moulding_processaction=editredlink=1
 =* The moulding process used to produce bricks


 what are the possibilities/suggested values?



  drying_system
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:drying_systemaction=editredlink=1
 =* Drying system used to dry the bricks


 what are the possibilities/suggested values?


  material http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:material=* Type of
 material used to produce bricks

 if this refers to the bricks and not to the kiln, the tag should be
 different, e.g. brick:material or brick:type

 what are the possibilities/suggested values?


  production
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:productionaction=editredlink=1
 =* Actual production of the brick kiln


 what does this mean? Whether the kiln is active? The type of bricks it
 produces?


  production_capacity
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:production_capacityaction=editredlink=1
 =* The 

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (brickkiln)

2014-10-17 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
2014-10-15 6:31 GMT+02:00 Megha Shrestha meghashrest...@gmail.com:

 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/brickkiln




I have seen on your proposal page that you are aware of the introduced
man_made=kiln
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dkiln

My suggestion is to use this established tagging scheme. If the only
problem you see is that there are no size connotations on a node, then
please use that tag on an area. There is also a suggestion to add
product=bricks on the kiln page, so rather then proposing a new tag
brickkiln you could use
man_made=kiln
and
product=bricks

You are also proposing a long list of additional tags, some of which are
very detailed and I am not sure if these details are available to anyone
besides the operator of the kiln (but that's not a problem, time will show
which tags get adopted by the mappers and which aren't). If you are
interesting in evaluating these tags I'd propose you add a list of possible
values to these tags.

In particular:

firing
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:firingaction=editredlink=1
=* Type of firing used. eg: continuous


what are the other firing types?


 chimney
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:chimneyaction=editredlink=1
=yes/no To denote the existence of the chimney  chimney
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:chimneyaction=editredlink=1
:number
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:numberaction=editredlink=1
=* Number of the chimney in the brick kiln area


maybe chimney:amount would be easier to understand? or chimney_count
(similar to step_count for steps)?


 chimney
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:chimneyaction=editredlink=1
:height http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:height=height in
meters Height
of the top of the chimney from ground-level in meters. (like Tag:man
made=tower http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dtower)
chimney
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:chimneyaction=editredlink=1
:category
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:categoryaction=editredlink=1
=* Type of chimney existing in the brick kiln area


My suggestion would be to map the chimneys individually with their own
objects. You could then omit the related chimney tags on the kiln area and
use simple and well established general tags like height on the
individual chimney. Also the chimney number would be mapped implicitly by
mapping the single chimneys.


 fuel http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:fuel=* Fuel used to heat the
kiln  quantity_fuel
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:quantity_fuelaction=editredlink=1
=* Quantity of the fuel required


required for what? In what time? In what unit should it be entered (if at
all)? Maybe this is a detail that is hard to get.


 moulding_process
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:moulding_processaction=editredlink=1
=* The moulding process used to produce bricks


what are the possibilities/suggested values?



 drying_system
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:drying_systemaction=editredlink=1
=* Drying system used to dry the bricks


what are the possibilities/suggested values?


 material http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:material=* Type of
material used to produce bricks

if this refers to the bricks and not to the kiln, the tag should be
different, e.g. brick:material or brick:type

what are the possibilities/suggested values?


 production
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:productionaction=editredlink=1
=* Actual production of the brick kiln


what does this mean? Whether the kiln is active? The type of bricks it
produces?


 production_capacity
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:production_capacityaction=editredlink=1
=* The production capacity of the brick kiln

measured in which unit? I'd suggest to use capacity like it is suggested
in the klin reference.


 quality_brick
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:quality_brickaction=editredlink=1
=* Amount of quality bricks


is this a QA thing? Should it be a percentage of capacity? I think I'd do
it the other way round if significant and varying a lot between different
kilns. Something like discard=65%



 brick_kind
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:brick_kindaction=editredlink=1
=* Kind of bricks produced


what are the possibilities/suggested values?


 workers
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:workersaction=editredlink=1
=* Number of workers  workers
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:workersaction=editredlink=1
:male http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:male=* Number of male
workers  workers
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:workersaction=editredlink=1
:female http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:female=* Number of female
workers

could be ok to tag, but how are you going to get these numbers? How much do
they vary? Is there a 

[Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (brickkiln)

2014-10-14 Thread Megha Shrestha
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/brickkiln
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