Re: [Tagging] How does an end user use camp site data ?
On Sat, Mar 28, 2015 at 4:54 AM, Bryce Nesbitt wrote: > I might use OSM to identify camping sites nearby, but would never stop > there. > The next step is a web search. Thus the website= link is the most > important > tag, after camp_site. > +1, if you want to go to a campsite in France in July or August ,most of the time you have to made reservations (in our case we had to check whether dogs were welcome [1]). Long beforehand, especially along the coast. I could have used OSM to create a short list based on location, further selection based upon website: detailed description + pictures + up to date price information. That's how we used the existing campsite listing websites. There are also classifications/organisations for campsites like "castle campings" in France, typically 4 or 5-stars, or "Vacation at a farm", for small campsites run by active farmers in The Netherlands. That would be nice to know as well. regards m [1] I would never rely on this fact for a third party site, we always wanted confirmation by the owner ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How does an end user use camp site data ?
David Bannon, a great approach to rendering information on the OpenStreetMap which should be adopted for deciding all symbols... HOW DOES AN END USER USE THE DATA. If the overall area rendering for a campsite remains the same and a node symbol within the campsite is rendered in the colour depicting the type of campsite and or it's amenities (private, public, communal ablutions, swimming pool, etc) then it would solve many problems. The information could be tagged on the reception desk node with additional tags for available amenities and the link to a website. As Bryce mentioned, he would do a web search so getting the correct name for the campsite would also be paramount to helping in that. On 28 March 2015 at 02:37, David Bannon wrote: > Folks, we have been discussing this camp_site= issue for a long time. > And I don't think we are making any progress. How about we apply a > design approach ? Agree on how the "average" end user would use the > data ? > > In my opinion, a camper is likely look on a map hoping to see a camp > site near where he/she is heading. They will have an idea of the type of > sites they like. Some people won't camp without a toilet, others must > have a swimming pool. Another person will only go somewhere they are > unlikely to meet other people. > > When they identify the type they like, they may decide that is all they > need to know or they may investigate a short list further. > > Now, lets imagine an OSM map that shows camp site icons, maybe five or > six different colours depending on a simple set of characteristics. The > user knows they camp at only green and blue ones. Easy so far. If they > are after more info, the map may give them a name or locality to google > for. Or maybe its a specialised camping map that will pop up a flag with > more OSM date when the icon is clicked. > > That "more data" is made up with info from the associated tags > including, perhaps, the description= key. > > Please identify what is wrong with this story ? > > In localities where special ad hoc data is important, it needs to be in > the description tag. General data that may influence a search, should be > tagged. We cannot expect to show all important data right there on the > freshly rendered map. > > David > > > ___ > Tagging mailing list > Tagging@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging > ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How does an end user use camp site data ?
I don't agree that we don't make progress, but we have different agendas. I put a proposal how to solve this in the original mailing list. If I am in a country with abundant campsite (France) I start looking for a campsite one hour before I want to stop and I base my choice on location and facilities. I'have a hardcopy book with all 10,000 campsites in France to choose from. If it is in OSM OsmAnd helps me to navigate to it easily. If I am in a country with few campsites (Oman, Tanzania) I plan in the morning where I want to be in the evening with fallback options if something goes wrong on the way. Questions I'll ask: (1) any "normal" campsites available, (2) if no, any "opportunistic campsites" (hotels offering camping) available, (3) if no, any non-designates sites (police station, public park) available. Depending on the location I may skip all of this and go for wild camping at a quiet, beautiful place instead. I have no internet, so my information sources are: (1) previously downloaded OSM data (OsmAnd, Overpass), (2) extracts of blogs and camping listings from other overlanders (partly in text summarized per country, partly lists converted to gpx that I can show on the map), (3) travel guides (Lonely Planet etc.) On Sat, Mar 28, 2015 at 5:59 AM Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote: > On 28/03/2015 2:54 PM, Bryce Nesbitt wrote: > > I might use OSM to identify camping sites nearby, but would never stop > > there. > > The next step is a web search. Thus the website= link is the most > > important > > tag, after camp_site. > > > > Assumes web access.. as most of Australia has no cell phone access? > Satellite phone! > Sorry my budget does not stretch to running a web search through a > satellite phone for info on a camp site.. > > Think you'll find a website search is ok for highly populated countries > that have lots of high capacity cell phone coverage. Might cover most of > the users most of the time? > > -- > Me? I look for a camp site somewhere ahead after lunch time. Usually > basic will do me for an overnight. For more than one night .. cloths > washing would be good. > If there is nothing on the map .. I'll look for a wild camp - small back > road away from houses (note to self - mark out houses on OSM along the > ways I travel so I can see them on the map!). I'll usually start looking > for wild sites after say 15:30. > > ___ > Tagging mailing list > Tagging@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging > ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How does an end user use camp site data ?
On Sat, 2015-03-28 at 15:57 +1100, Warin wrote: > > The next step is a web search. Thus the website= link is the most > > important > Assumes web access.. as most of Australia has no cell phone access? > Satellite phone! I carry one but save its expensive quota for desperate stuff ! > Me? I look for a camp site somewhere ahead after lunch time. Yep, and don't keep telling your self there will be a better one further on ! But we are discussing here how someone would use the OSM based map to find a site. > basic will do me for an overnight. For more than one night .. cloths > washing would be good. Yep, you would see you need on, eg, OSMand. Assuming we have made a decision here and have been out populating the map David ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How does an end user use camp site data ?
On 28/03/2015 2:54 PM, Bryce Nesbitt wrote: I might use OSM to identify camping sites nearby, but would never stop there. The next step is a web search. Thus the website= link is the most important tag, after camp_site. Assumes web access.. as most of Australia has no cell phone access? Satellite phone! Sorry my budget does not stretch to running a web search through a satellite phone for info on a camp site.. Think you'll find a website search is ok for highly populated countries that have lots of high capacity cell phone coverage. Might cover most of the users most of the time? -- Me? I look for a camp site somewhere ahead after lunch time. Usually basic will do me for an overnight. For more than one night .. cloths washing would be good. If there is nothing on the map .. I'll look for a wild camp - small back road away from houses (note to self - mark out houses on OSM along the ways I travel so I can see them on the map!). I'll usually start looking for wild sites after say 15:30. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How does an end user use camp site data ?
I might use OSM to identify camping sites nearby, but would never stop there. The next step is a web search. Thus the website= link is the most important tag, after camp_site. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
[Tagging] How does an end user use camp site data ?
Folks, we have been discussing this camp_site= issue for a long time. And I don't think we are making any progress. How about we apply a design approach ? Agree on how the "average" end user would use the data ? In my opinion, a camper is likely look on a map hoping to see a camp site near where he/she is heading. They will have an idea of the type of sites they like. Some people won't camp without a toilet, others must have a swimming pool. Another person will only go somewhere they are unlikely to meet other people. When they identify the type they like, they may decide that is all they need to know or they may investigate a short list further. Now, lets imagine an OSM map that shows camp site icons, maybe five or six different colours depending on a simple set of characteristics. The user knows they camp at only green and blue ones. Easy so far. If they are after more info, the map may give them a name or locality to google for. Or maybe its a specialised camping map that will pop up a flag with more OSM date when the icon is clicked. That "more data" is made up with info from the associated tags including, perhaps, the description= key. Please identify what is wrong with this story ? In localities where special ad hoc data is important, it needs to be in the description tag. General data that may influence a search, should be tagged. We cannot expect to show all important data right there on the freshly rendered map. David ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
