Re: [Tagging] Toll road sections

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

sent from a phone

> On 28. Aug 2017, at 16:35, Dömötör Ákos  wrote:
> 
> Naturally, I was already planning to add the "toll:hgv=yes" for each road in 
> question.


what about toll:hgv:ref=* ?


cheers,
Martin 
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Re: [Tagging] Toll road sections

[André Pirard]

On 2017-08-28 18:42, marc marc wrote:
> Please avoid creating a new key like toll_ref
> All references refer to something, but we don't create road_ref, 
> shop_ref, hydrant_ref, building_ref, we just use "ref" key
> sometimes with a subname HU for the country (in capital)
> sometimes with another subname for the source name
>
> If you really want to add the word "toll",
> maybe something like ref:HU:toll:edid=123456
>
> Regards,
> Marc
It would obviously be  toll:ref:HU:edid=123456  then.
It's the ref of the toll, and not the toll of the ref.
ref is an attribute of toll and not toll an attribute of ref.
Qualifiers come to the right of qualified terms when using name spaces.

Strangely enough, when I advocate using name spaces like Marc does,
someone pops up and says: "you again? it's not the way we do it".
But he never said who "we" is.

Please use HTML when replying to HTML to avoid messes like below.

Cheers

André.



> Le 28. 08. 17 à 18:22, Jo a écrit :
>> I would use the following:
>>
>> toll=no
>> toll:hgv=yes
>> toll_ref:HU:edid=123456
>>
>> That's the easiest to query for later on.
>>
>> You can add contents to existing wiki pages.
>>
>> Polyglot
>>
>> 2017-08-28 16:35 GMT+02:00 Dömötör Ákos :
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I won't mess with the generic "toll" tag because some of the roads
>> are highways with tolls for all vehicle types so I'd leave them as
>> they are.
>> Naturally, I was already planning to add the "toll:hgv=yes" for each
>> road in question.
>>
>> Of the two proposed tags, "toll_ref=HU_edid_123456" seems to be more
>> specific than "ref:hu:edid=123456" so I'd prefer the first one.
>> However, creating an OSM Wiki page for a new tag (like "hu:edid") is
>> a clean issue. But where to put this information in case of "toll_ref"?
>>
>> Greets
>>
>>
>> Hi Ákos,
>>
>> I would do this : "toll=hgv_only" and "toll_ref=edid_123456" or
>> "toll_ref=HU_edid_123456"
>> (according to the wiki, it should not be toll=hgv_only but :
>> *toll*=no, *toll*:hgv
>> <http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:hgv
>> <http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:hgv>>=yes)
>>
>> 2017-08-28 12:30 GMT+02:00 Topographe Fou
>> <letopographe...@gmail.com <mailto:letopographe...@gmail.com>
>> <mailto:letopographe...@gmail.com
>> <mailto:letopographe...@gmail.com>>>:
>>
>>  I'm not aware of other toll systems but official country
>>  references are tagged using the prefix ref:XX where XX is the
>>  country code. Note that HU represent the country and hu the
>>  language (see ISO codes). So your prefix would be ref:HU.
>>
>>  LeTopographeFou
>>
>>Message original
>>  De: domotor.a...@itineris.hu
>> <mailto:domotor.a...@itineris.hu>
>>     <mailto:domotor.a...@itineris.hu <mailto:domotor.a...@itineris.hu>>
>>  Envoyé: 28 août 2017 11:51 AM
>>  À: tagging@openstreetmap.org
>> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>
>> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org
>> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>>
>>  Répondre à: tagging@openstreetmap.org
>> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>
>>  <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org
>> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>>
>>  Objet: [Tagging] Toll road sections
>>
>>  Hi,
>>
>>  The road toll system for HGVs has sections in Hungary.
>> There are appr.
>>  2400 of such sections in a varying length from 100 metres
>> to 13 kms.
>>  We'd like to tag roads with the corresponding toll ID. The
>> base tag
>>  would be "edid" as the official files use this field name.
>>  The question is how we should use it. As it's only Hungarian, a
>>  "hu:" or
>>  "hu:ref:" namespace prefix may be appropriate.
>>  Furthermore, it's only for HGVs so inserting "hgv:" might be
>>  sensible as
>>  well.
>>
>>  Are there any other local toll systems that already u

Re: [Tagging] Toll road sections

[marc marc]

Please avoid creating a new key like toll_ref
All references refer to something, but we don't create road_ref, 
shop_ref, hydrant_ref, building_ref, we just use "ref" key
sometimes with a subname HU for the country (in capital)
sometimes with another subname for the source name

If you really want to add the word "toll",
maybe something like ref:HU:toll:edid=123456

Regards,
Marc

Le 28. 08. 17 à 18:22, Jo a écrit :
> I would use the following:
> 
> toll=no
> toll:hgv=yes
> toll_ref:HU:edid=123456
> 
> That's the easiest to query for later on.
> 
> You can add contents to existing wiki pages.
> 
> Polyglot
> 
> 2017-08-28 16:35 GMT+02:00 Dömötör Ákos :
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I won't mess with the generic "toll" tag because some of the roads
> are highways with tolls for all vehicle types so I'd leave them as
> they are.
> Naturally, I was already planning to add the "toll:hgv=yes" for each
> road in question.
> 
> Of the two proposed tags, "toll_ref=HU_edid_123456" seems to be more
> specific than "ref:hu:edid=123456" so I'd prefer the first one.
> However, creating an OSM Wiki page for a new tag (like "hu:edid") is
> a clean issue. But where to put this information in case of "toll_ref"?
> 
> Greets
> 
> 
> Hi Ákos,
> 
> I would do this : "toll=hgv_only" and "toll_ref=edid_123456" or
> "toll_ref=HU_edid_123456"
> (according to the wiki, it should not be toll=hgv_only but :
> *toll*=no, *toll*:hgv
> <http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:hgv
> <http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:hgv>>=yes)
> 
> 2017-08-28 12:30 GMT+02:00 Topographe Fou
> <letopographe...@gmail.com <mailto:letopographe...@gmail.com>
> <mailto:letopographe...@gmail.com
> <mailto:letopographe...@gmail.com>>>:
> 
>  I'm not aware of other toll systems but official country
>  references are tagged using the prefix ref:XX where XX is the
>  country code. Note that HU represent the country and hu the
>  language (see ISO codes). So your prefix would be ref:HU.
> 
>  LeTopographeFou
> 
>Message original
>  De: domotor.a...@itineris.hu
> <mailto:domotor.a...@itineris.hu>
> <mailto:domotor.a...@itineris.hu <mailto:domotor.a...@itineris.hu>>
>  Envoyé: 28 août 2017 11:51 AM
>  À: tagging@openstreetmap.org
> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>
> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org
> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>>
>  Répondre à: tagging@openstreetmap.org
> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>
>  <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org
> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>>
>  Objet: [Tagging] Toll road sections
> 
>  Hi,
> 
>  The road toll system for HGVs has sections in Hungary.
> There are appr.
>  2400 of such sections in a varying length from 100 metres
> to 13 kms.
>  We'd like to tag roads with the corresponding toll ID. The
> base tag
>  would be "edid" as the official files use this field name.
>  The question is how we should use it. As it's only Hungarian, a
>  "hu:" or
>  "hu:ref:" namespace prefix may be appropriate.
>  Furthermore, it's only for HGVs so inserting "hgv:" might be
>  sensible as
>  well.
> 
>  Are there any other local toll systems that already use some
>  tagging? We
>  could use the same format/logic then.
> 
>  Greets,
>  Ákos
> 
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Re: [Tagging] Toll road sections

[Jo]

I would use the following:

toll=no
toll:hgv=yes
toll_ref:HU:edid=123456

That's the easiest to query for later on.

You can add contents to existing wiki pages.

Polyglot

2017-08-28 16:35 GMT+02:00 Dömötör Ákos <domotor.a...@itineris.hu>:

> Hi,
>
> I won't mess with the generic "toll" tag because some of the roads are
> highways with tolls for all vehicle types so I'd leave them as they are.
> Naturally, I was already planning to add the "toll:hgv=yes" for each road
> in question.
>
> Of the two proposed tags, "toll_ref=HU_edid_123456" seems to be more
> specific than "ref:hu:edid=123456" so I'd prefer the first one.
> However, creating an OSM Wiki page for a new tag (like "hu:edid") is a
> clean issue. But where to put this information in case of "toll_ref"?
>
> Greets
>
>
> Hi Ákos,
>>
>> I would do this : "toll=hgv_only" and "toll_ref=edid_123456" or
>> "toll_ref=HU_edid_123456"
>> (according to the wiki, it should not be toll=hgv_only but : *toll*=no,
>> *toll*:hgv <http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:hgv>=yes)
>>
>> 2017-08-28 12:30 GMT+02:00 Topographe Fou <letopographe...@gmail.com
>> <mailto:letopographe...@gmail.com>>:
>>
>> I'm not aware of other toll systems but official country
>> references are tagged using the prefix ref:XX where XX is the
>> country code. Note that HU represent the country and hu the
>> language (see ISO codes). So your prefix would be ref:HU.
>>
>> LeTopographeFou
>>
>>   Message original
>> De: domotor.a...@itineris.hu <mailto:domotor.a...@itineris.hu>
>> Envoyé: 28 août 2017 11:51 AM
>> À: tagging@openstreetmap.org <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>
>> Répondre à: tagging@openstreetmap.org
>> <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>
>> Objet: [Tagging] Toll road sections
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> The road toll system for HGVs has sections in Hungary. There are appr.
>> 2400 of such sections in a varying length from 100 metres to 13 kms.
>> We'd like to tag roads with the corresponding toll ID. The base tag
>> would be "edid" as the official files use this field name.
>> The question is how we should use it. As it's only Hungarian, a
>> "hu:" or
>> "hu:ref:" namespace prefix may be appropriate.
>> Furthermore, it's only for HGVs so inserting "hgv:" might be
>> sensible as
>> well.
>>
>> Are there any other local toll systems that already use some
>> tagging? We
>> could use the same format/logic then.
>>
>> Greets,
>> Ákos
>>
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Re: [Tagging] Toll road sections

[Dömötör Ákos]

Hi,

I won't mess with the generic "toll" tag because some of the roads are 
highways with tolls for all vehicle types so I'd leave them as they are.
Naturally, I was already planning to add the "toll:hgv=yes" for each 
road in question.


Of the two proposed tags, "toll_ref=HU_edid_123456" seems to be more 
specific than "ref:hu:edid=123456" so I'd prefer the first one.
However, creating an OSM Wiki page for a new tag (like "hu:edid") is a 
clean issue. But where to put this information in case of "toll_ref"?


Greets



Hi Ákos,

I would do this : "toll=hgv_only" and "toll_ref=edid_123456" or 
"toll_ref=HU_edid_123456"
(according to the wiki, it should not be toll=hgv_only but : 
*toll*=no, *toll*:hgv <http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:hgv>=yes)


2017-08-28 12:30 GMT+02:00 Topographe Fou <letopographe...@gmail.com 
<mailto:letopographe...@gmail.com>>:


I'm not aware of other toll systems but official country
references are tagged using the prefix ref:XX where XX is the
country code. Note that HU represent the country and hu the
language (see ISO codes). So your prefix would be ref:HU.

LeTopographeFou

  Message original
De: domotor.a...@itineris.hu <mailto:domotor.a...@itineris.hu>
Envoyé: 28 août 2017 11:51 AM
À: tagging@openstreetmap.org <mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>
Répondre à: tagging@openstreetmap.org
<mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org>
Objet: [Tagging] Toll road sections

Hi,

The road toll system for HGVs has sections in Hungary. There are appr.
2400 of such sections in a varying length from 100 metres to 13 kms.
We'd like to tag roads with the corresponding toll ID. The base tag
would be "edid" as the official files use this field name.
The question is how we should use it. As it's only Hungarian, a
"hu:" or
"hu:ref:" namespace prefix may be appropriate.
Furthermore, it's only for HGVs so inserting "hgv:" might be
sensible as
well.

Are there any other local toll systems that already use some
tagging? We
could use the same format/logic then.

Greets,
Ákos

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Re: [Tagging] Toll road sections

[djakk djakk]

Hi Ákos,

I would do this : "toll=hgv_only" and "toll_ref=edid_123456" or
"toll_ref=HU_edid_123456"
(according to the wiki, it should not be toll=hgv_only but : *toll*=no,
*toll*:hgv <http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:hgv>=yes)

2017-08-28 12:30 GMT+02:00 Topographe Fou <letopographe...@gmail.com>:

> I'm not aware of other toll systems but official country references are
> tagged using the prefix ref:XX where XX is the country code. Note that HU
> represent the country and hu the language (see ISO codes). So your prefix
> would be ref:HU.
>
> LeTopographeFou
>
>   Message original
> De: domotor.a...@itineris.hu
> Envoyé: 28 août 2017 11:51 AM
> À: tagging@openstreetmap.org
> Répondre à: tagging@openstreetmap.org
> Objet: [Tagging] Toll road sections
>
> Hi,
>
> The road toll system for HGVs has sections in Hungary. There are appr.
> 2400 of such sections in a varying length from 100 metres to 13 kms.
> We'd like to tag roads with the corresponding toll ID. The base tag
> would be "edid" as the official files use this field name.
> The question is how we should use it. As it's only Hungarian, a "hu:" or
> "hu:ref:" namespace prefix may be appropriate.
> Furthermore, it's only for HGVs so inserting "hgv:" might be sensible as
> well.
>
> Are there any other local toll systems that already use some tagging? We
> could use the same format/logic then.
>
> Greets,
> Ákos
>
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Re: [Tagging] Toll road sections

[Topographe Fou]

I'm not aware of other toll systems but official country references are tagged 
using the prefix ref:XX where XX is the country code. Note that HU represent 
the country and hu the language (see ISO codes). So your prefix would be ref:HU.

LeTopographeFou 

  Message original  
De: domotor.a...@itineris.hu
Envoyé: 28 août 2017 11:51 AM
À: tagging@openstreetmap.org
Répondre à: tagging@openstreetmap.org
Objet: [Tagging] Toll road sections

Hi,

The road toll system for HGVs has sections in Hungary. There are appr. 
2400 of such sections in a varying length from 100 metres to 13 kms.
We'd like to tag roads with the corresponding toll ID. The base tag 
would be "edid" as the official files use this field name.
The question is how we should use it. As it's only Hungarian, a "hu:" or 
"hu:ref:" namespace prefix may be appropriate.
Furthermore, it's only for HGVs so inserting "hgv:" might be sensible as 
well.

Are there any other local toll systems that already use some tagging? We 
could use the same format/logic then.

Greets,
Ákos

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Re: [Tagging] Toll road sections

[marc marc]

If it is a ref, ref:HU:edid

Le 28. 08. 17 à 11:50, Dömötör Ákos a écrit :
> it's only for HGVs so inserting "hgv:" might be sensible  
> as well.

Is there another ref for cars on the same object ?
If yes it would be useful to add hgv

But if there is a single reference, only use by trucks users,
I will not put a hgv tag.

Once the name of the tag is chosen, it would be useful to create
a wiki page to inform the meaning of the tag, a photo and/or
a link to the source, ...
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[Tagging] Toll road sections

[Dömötör Ákos]

Hi,

The road toll system for HGVs has sections in Hungary. There are appr. 
2400 of such sections in a varying length from 100 metres to 13 kms.
We'd like to tag roads with the corresponding toll ID. The base tag 
would be "edid" as the official files use this field name.
The question is how we should use it. As it's only Hungarian, a "hu:" or 
"hu:ref:" namespace prefix may be appropriate.
Furthermore, it's only for HGVs so inserting "hgv:" might be sensible as 
well.


Are there any other local toll systems that already use some tagging? We 
could use the same format/logic then.


Greets,
Ákos

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