Re: [Tagging] POI data and Addresses on areas - Was: addresses on buildings

2020-01-11 Thread Volker Schmidt
Just to illustrate the problem, try find this address on OSM: 13, Via Aeroporto, Orio al Serio, Italy You get some ten results most of them with the correct address. Then try to find "Bergamo Orio al Serio Airport" and check the address. It's the one above. Than try to route to the Airport, say

Re: [Tagging] POI data and Addresses on areas - Was: addresses on buildings

2020-01-11 Thread Volker Schmidt
Conclusion. SWe need a more flexible solution. An idea. For normal simple cases (small building, one address, placed on the map close and unambigously near the Street of the address), put the number on the building or on a node on the building polygon. For more complex cases (anything from the

Re: [Tagging] Rare route values route=inline_skates and route=running

2020-01-11 Thread marc marc
Le 11.01.20 à 06:21, Joseph Eisenberg a écrit : > The tag route=inline_skates > Are there actually signed, verifiable inline skate routes? yes > Should a rare tag like this be in Map Features? listing all the rare cases on maps feature is like turning it into a wiki search engine or a taginfo

Re: [Tagging] amenity=vending_machine/vending=bottle_return - operator=

2020-01-11 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
sent from a phone > On 11. Jan 2020, at 08:07, Jake Edmonds via Tagging > wrote: > > Is the different between recycling and reusing important for the average > consumer who a) wants to claim their deposit and b) doesn’t want to put the > item into landfill? first of all it is

Re: [Tagging] Correct use of height with kerb

2020-01-11 Thread Volker Schmidt
I do have a related question, regarding the kerb values lowered|raised on a node. Assume you find yourself on a pedestrian crossing across a road that has an adjacent sidewalk and cycleway on the same side. The main carriageway is separated from the (foot-only) sidewalk by a kerb and that is

Re: [Tagging] How to tag oneway restriction applying to pedestrians?

2020-01-11 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
sent from a phone > On 9. Jan 2020, at 22:04, Dave F via Tagging > wrote: > >> oneway=yes|no needs indeed be applicable to vehicles only, > > That tag on footways would apply only to walkers. well, unless someone adds bicycle=yes in which case it would change and only apply to bicycles?

Re: [Tagging] Rare route values route=inline_skates and route=running

2020-01-11 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
sent from a phone > On 11. Jan 2020, at 06:23, Joseph Eisenberg > wrote: > > Are there actually signed, verifiable inline skate routes? yes Cheers Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org

Re: [Tagging] Rare route values route=inline_skates and route=running

2020-01-11 Thread Simon Poole
While the number is "low" some of them are quite long https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Switzerland/InlineNetwork Simon Am 11.01.2020 um 06:21 schrieb Joseph Eisenberg: > The tag route=inline_skates was added to Map features, but it has > only been added a few times in the past 4 years. > >

Re: [Tagging] POI data and Addresses on areas - Was: addresses on buildings

2020-01-11 Thread Volker Schmidt
Sorry, my mail program got impatient and sent off an incomplete message. Here is the continuation: On Sat, 11 Jan 2020 at 12:31, Volker Schmidt wrote: > Just to illustrate the problem, try find this address on OSM: > 13, Via Aeroporto, Orio al Serio, Italy > You get some ten results most of

Re: [Tagging] hiking and foot route relations - is there any consistent difference?

2020-01-11 Thread Peter Elderson
+1 If don't see this as a problem. If more clarity is needed, add tags for specific aspects. E.g "vigour" scale if one exists. Boot type recommendation scale, where 1=flipflop and 10=hoverboots. Mvg Peter Elderson > Op 11 jan. 2020 om 14:59 heeft Joseph Eisenberg > het volgende geschreven:

Re: [Tagging] Rare route=* values - route=power

2020-01-11 Thread Joseph Eisenberg
The taginfo map is misleading, because it doesn't show the location of relations, and almost all route=power features are relations with type=route. Try overpass-turbo instead, for example in Italy: http://overpass-turbo.eu/s/PF9 On 1/11/20, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote: > On 11/1/20 4:19

Re: [Tagging] Rare route values route=inline_skates and route=running

2020-01-11 Thread s8evq
On Sat, 11 Jan 2020 14:21:50 +0900, Joseph Eisenberg wrote: > Similar questions about route=running - are there real, signed running > routes which are separate from walking or hiking routes? Yes, in Belgium, there are quite a lot of these (over 100

Re: [Tagging] How to tag oneway restriction applying to pedestrians?

2020-01-11 Thread Volker Schmidt
The problem with oneway=yes|no, if it were to apply to pedestrians as well, would be on all mixed-use ways. This would exclude highway=pedestrian as this tag excludes all vehicles by definition (careful if it's an "area pedonale" in Italy, which allows bicycles by default and hence requires a

Re: [Tagging] POI data and Addresses on areas - Was: addresses on buildings

2020-01-11 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
Am Sa., 11. Jan. 2020 um 12:35 Uhr schrieb Volker Schmidt : > Just to illustrate the problem, try find this address on OSM: > 13, Via Aeroporto, Orio al Serio, Italy > You get some ten results most of them with the correct address. > > first 11 results seemed all perfectly ok to get there :)

Re: [Tagging] hiking and foot route relations - is there any consistent difference?

2020-01-11 Thread Joseph Eisenberg
To clarify, I don't see any problem with the existence of multiple tags with similar meanings. But I plan to edit the wiki page to describe how they are actually used, mentioning that there is a wide amoun of overlap in meaning. On 1/11/20, Peter Elderson wrote: > +1 > If don't see this as a

Re: [Tagging] hiking and foot route relations - is there any consistent difference?

2020-01-11 Thread Kevin Kenny
On Sat, Jan 11, 2020 at 10:03 AM Joseph Eisenberg wrote: > > To clarify, I don't see any problem with the existence of multiple > tags with similar meanings. > > But I plan to edit the wiki page to describe how they are actually > used, mentioning that there is a wide amoun of overlap in meaning.

Re: [Tagging] hiking and foot route relations - is there any consistent difference?

2020-01-11 Thread Jo
If I remember well, there is also route=walking... You are right that it doesn't make very much sense to make the distinction. But now to get all mappers to choose for either hiking or foot will prove to be an impossible task. As usual it will be status quo that wins, like you saw in the result

Re: [Tagging] How to tag oneway restriction applying to pedestrians?

2020-01-11 Thread Jarek Piórkowski
On Sat, 11 Jan 2020 at 04:48, Volker Schmidt wrote: > On Sat, 11 Jan 2020 at 10:20, Martin Koppenhoefer > wrote: >> > On 9. Jan 2020, at 22:04, Dave F via Tagging >> > wrote: >> >> oneway=yes|no needs indeed be applicable to vehicles only, >> > >> > That tag on footways would apply only to

Re: [Tagging] recreational vs functional routes

2020-01-11 Thread Volker Schmidt
I would like to return to the initial question of this thread, and looking at it from the end users point of view. When in a car, I use my navigation device in real time to get as comfortably as possible from A to B to C and so on. I may select to avoid motorways, and may give preference to minor

Re: [Tagging] hiking and foot route relations - is there any consistent difference?

2020-01-11 Thread Warin
Most locals on the Kokoda Trail have no footware, that goes better in mud and river crossings. All tourists ware footwear and think/know that this is a hiking route. To give an idea of 'hardness' there is one part where most are on hands and knees.

[Tagging] hiking and foot route relations - is there any consistent difference?

2020-01-11 Thread Joseph Eisenberg
Back in August there was a thread titled "Merging tagging scheme on wiki pages of Hiking, route=hiking, route=foot and Walking routes" which led to a new template https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Template:Tagging_scheme_for_hiking_and_foot_route_relations - used on route=hiking and route=foot

Re: [Tagging] How to tag oneway restriction applying to pedestrians?

2020-01-11 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
Am Sa., 11. Jan. 2020 um 17:17 Uhr schrieb Jarek Piórkowski < ja...@piorkowski.ca>: > I imagine that virtually all real-world pedestrian ways that are > one-way for pedestrians would be on dedicated pedestrian ways - that > is, highway=footway. If that's correct, oneway=yes can be interpreted >

Re: [Tagging] Correct use of height with kerb

2020-01-11 Thread Alessandro Sarretta
Hi Volker, the values raised and lowered for a kerb (node) are related to the vertical gap between sidewalk/crossing and not really to the direction. Raised means that there is a (more or less) big transition (in the kerb page [1] it says >3 cm), while lowered means a smaller transition, and

Re: [Tagging] recreational vs functional routes

2020-01-11 Thread marc marc
Le 11.01.20 à 21:05, Florimond Berthoux a écrit : > What do you think ? avoid the word "type" in a key as it as no additional meaning. type can be everything (type of operator, difficulty, use, length, ...) ___ Tagging mailing list

Re: [Tagging] recreational vs functional routes

2020-01-11 Thread Peter Elderson
Peter Elderson : > Florimond Berthoux : > >> So I propose to use for bicycle route >> bicycle:type=trekking/road_bike/commute/mtb >> >> > I don't think commute is a type of bicycle? Trekking maybe, but here in > Nederland they call a lot of bicycles "trekking" when they are really just > city

Re: [Tagging] How to tag oneway restriction applying to pedestrians?

2020-01-11 Thread Joseph Eisenberg
>> oneway=yes can be interpreted as referring to pedestrians on footways (it >> looks like osm-carto already does this? The Openstreetmap-carto style shows one-way arrows on highway=footway and highway=path because these features can also be used by bicycles in many places. - Joseph Eisenberg

Re: [Tagging] POI data and Addresses on areas - Was: addresses on buildings

2020-01-11 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
sent from a phone > On 11. Jan 2020, at 23:05, Volker Schmidt wrote: > >>> 13, Via Aeroporto, Orio al Serio, Italy >>> You get some ten results most of them with the correct address. > You replied >> first 11 results seemed all perfectly ok to get there :) > > But you missed the point. If

Re: [Tagging] recreational vs functional routes

2020-01-11 Thread Peter Elderson
Ok let's look at Berlin. I see bicycle routes in and around Berlin: https://cycling.waymarkedtrails.org/#route?id=6162=12.597273579561199!52.5315!13.4447 Are those routes touristic or commuter routes? How can you tell? I assume these have been mapped because they are waymarked/signposted. Or are

Re: [Tagging] recreational vs functional routes

2020-01-11 Thread Florimond Berthoux
I found that this problem has a solution for relation route=piste (snow sports) with the key piste:type=* https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:piste:type Three of you have proposed to use like for piste relation a single new key to precise the subtype of the a route Joost Schouppe with:

Re: [Tagging] POI data and Addresses on areas - Was: addresses on buildings

2020-01-11 Thread Volker Schmidt
Martin, I wrote > Just to illustrate the problem, try find this address on OSM: >> 13, Via Aeroporto, Orio al Serio, Italy >> You get some ten results most of them with the correct address. >> > You replied > first 11 results seemed all perfectly ok to get there :) > But you missed the point.

Re: [Tagging] recreational vs functional routes

2020-01-11 Thread Joseph Eisenberg
> I am not against distinguishing more types of cycling routes, I am all for > it, as long as it's verifyable, mappable with clear tagging, and manageable. +1 I started using Openstreetmap because I wanted to add touring routes and recreational bike routes in RideWithGPS and then found out

Re: [Tagging] Rare route=* values - route=power

2020-01-11 Thread Warin
Arr .. thanks.. found one 'near' to me. After more info from a user, if they respond, see https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/78020394 Arr On 12/1/20 1:45 am, Joseph Eisenberg wrote: The taginfo map is misleading, because it doesn't show the location of relations, and almost all

Re: [Tagging] hiking and foot route relations - is there any consistent difference?

2020-01-11 Thread brad
Great story Kevin.   I hope they learned something from their experience.   +1 on the boots,   things change, back in the old days when I could still  backpack it was pretty much a given that you should have sturdy boots.   Now most of the long distance hikers, like you, have gotten wiser and

Re: [Tagging] Rare route=* values - route=power

2020-01-11 Thread Joseph Eisenberg
I opened an issue at the Taginfo repository requesting that relations be included on the map, or the title of the map changed to "Geographical distribution of ways and nodes with this tag" - https://github.com/taginfo/taginfo/issues/274; On 1/12/20, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote: > Arr ..

Re: [Tagging] How to tag oneway restriction applying to pedestrians?

2020-01-11 Thread Jarek Piórkowski
On Sat, 11 Jan 2020 at 18:18, Jmapb via Tagging wrote: > On 1/11/2020 11:16 AM, Jarek Piórkowski wrote: > > I imagine that virtually all real-world pedestrian ways that are > > one-way for pedestrians would be on dedicated pedestrian ways - that > > is, highway=footway. If that's correct,

Re: [Tagging] How to tag oneway restriction applying to pedestrians?

2020-01-11 Thread Jmapb via Tagging
On 1/11/2020 11:16 AM, Jarek Piórkowski wrote: I imagine that virtually all real-world pedestrian ways that are one-way for pedestrians would be on dedicated pedestrian ways - that is, highway=footway. If that's correct, oneway=yes can be interpreted as referring to pedestrians on footways (it

Re: [Tagging] How to tag oneway restriction applying to pedestrians?

2020-01-11 Thread Jarek Piórkowski
On Sat, 11 Jan 2020 at 11:57, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: > Am Sa., 11. Jan. 2020 um 17:17 Uhr schrieb Jarek Piórkowski > : >> I imagine that virtually all real-world pedestrian ways that are >> one-way for pedestrians would be on dedicated pedestrian ways - that >> is, highway=footway. If that's

Re: [Tagging] recreational vs functional routes

2020-01-11 Thread Peter Elderson
Florimond Berthoux : > So I propose to use for bicycle route > bicycle:type=trekking/road_bike/commute/mtb > > I don't think commute is a type of bicycle? Trekking maybe, but here in Nederland they call a lot of bicycles "trekking" when they are really just city bikes with a few extra gears and

Re: [Tagging] How to tag oneway restriction applying to pedestrians?

2020-01-11 Thread Mateusz Konieczny
12 Jan 2020, 00:28 by ja...@piorkowski.ca: > On Sat, 11 Jan 2020 at 11:57, Martin Koppenhoefer > wrote: > >> Am Sa., 11. Jan. 2020 um 17:17 Uhr schrieb Jarek Piórkowski >> : >> >>> I imagine that virtually all real-world pedestrian ways that are >>> one-way for pedestrians would be on