Re: [OSM-talk] Can somebody give me a hint please?
Hi Jeroen, when it was taken on a mobile, then you have a high likelihood that the picture has exif geo tags... Do you think that this is the case? Best Tim -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: Jeroen Baten Gesendet: Dienstag, 19. Juni 2018 10:35 An: talk@openstreetmap.org Betreff: [OSM-talk] Can somebody give me a hint please? Hi, This is a newbie question: so I have an aerial photo of a part of central France but I don't know the exact location. I know it is max 10 minutes from a city. I want to find the place on the map. My photo shows two roads in an angle. Is there a way I can use to locate where this is? Some sort of low level GIS query maybe? Looking forward to your answers. Kind regards, Jeroen Baten -- Jeroen Baten | EMAIL : jba...@i2rs.nl _ __ | web : www.i2rs.nl | )|_)(_ | tel : +31 (0)345 - 75 26 28 _|_/_| \__) | Molenwindsingel 46, 4105 HK, Culemborg, the Netherlands ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Open sourcing of POI pictures for OSM App/STAPPZ - Feedback and ideas wanted
Hi Tobias, thanks a lot - I'll give it a try and see what comes out. Best Tim -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: Tobias Knerr <o...@tobias-knerr.de> Gesendet: Samstag, 19. Mai 2018 14:09 An: Tim Frey <tim.f...@iunera.com> Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Betreff: Re: AW: [OSM-talk] Open sourcing of POI pictures for OSM App/STAPPZ - Feedback and ideas wanted Hi Tim, On 16.05.2018 10:16, Tim Frey wrote: > I like the Wikipedia and in special the Wikivoyage direction also. > Does somebody know the best touchpoints to get in contact with the > community there? I'm not familiar enough with their communities to give a recommendation. However, Commons does "partnerships" with owners/maintainers of media collections: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Partnerships You could give the contact listed there a try. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Open sourcing of POI pictures for OSM App/STAPPZ - Feedback and ideas wanted
Hi All, short sum up: We are discussing about “open sourcing/open contenting” our STAPPZ POI picture mapping APP for the OSM community and what prerequisites we need to fulfill to make this a success. @Kathleen Thanks a lot for your insights Kathleen, those helped a lot in our internal discussions. I appreciate that a lot! @Milo Thank you so much Milo. Yes, please do! We discussed in our company about the next steps that we would need to take to contribute to OSM. At the end, our discussions boil down to the acceptance and contributions of OSM mappers to the picture POI database. Logically, it only makes sense for us to take the effort to open source in a step by step way, when we have enough support from the community. In order to make it a sustainable success, we’d like to have a group of people or fellow companies who would contribute and help to spread the word. Therefore, I’d like to ask who would we open minded to support our efforts and contribute? If someone has additional thoughts or ideas, please add. Best Tim Von: Milo van der Linden <m...@dogodigi.net> Gesendet: Freitag, 18. Mai 2018 15:13 An: Kathleen Lu <kathleen...@mapbox.com> Cc: Tim Frey <tim.f...@iunera.com>; OSM Talk <talk@openstreetmap.org> Betreff: Re: [OSM-talk] Open sourcing of POI pictures for OSM App/STAPPZ - Feedback and ideas wanted @Tim, I can get you in touch with the people at <http://healthsites.io> healthsites.io, they have a model that is complimentary to OSM to maintain a lot of information about healthcare around the world where not all attributes can be added to OpenStreetMap. 2018-05-17 1:17 GMT+02:00 Kathleen Lu <kathleen...@mapbox.com <mailto:kathleen...@mapbox.com> >: Tim - For GDPR, there's not a lot of clarity yet because the regulation is only going into effect next week. I suspect in practice, the answer with be that the processing is legal because it is to fulfill the contractual terms (of the creative commons license requiring attribution, which is a contract with the data subject that basically anyone can accept), and then if removal is later requested, then you can remove the image in question (or just the attribution, if that's what the person prefers) from your site/app (this is polite anyway). The person will have to ask each place for removal, since each place is using the image is issuing it for their own purposes. (Generally, with an open dataset, you're not going to have a list of everyone who got the dataset so you can't send them an update.) I'm not sure if a photograph catching someone in the background would be a problem or not, since they are inadvertently captured and there's no other info about them, but I suppose it would be polite to remove or blur the photo if someone objected. -Kathleen On Wed, May 16, 2018, 1:16 AM Tim Frey < <mailto:tim.f...@iunera.com> tim.f...@iunera.com> wrote: Thank you Kathleen and Tobias, This is some very valuable insight. >From our terms of use, we could likely open the content, but you are right – >it is about what users think. Hence, we will and can ask them. Thanks a lot >for rising this point. One rising concern, when I read your text, Kathleen, is the GDPR – what happens if a user wants content deleted and it is already copied all over the web by an open license. Or even worse, a user uploads a picture of a scenery and there are human faces in the scenery .. and this picture is distributed. I see potential problems here for us and the organizations using the pictures. Additional thoughts please? I like the Wikipedia and in special the Wikivoyage direction also. Does somebody know the best touchpoints to get in contact with the community there? In general, I agree to what you said that manual work for content filtering and legal issues would be needed – what is also one point for us to discuss with the community first: We can provide the software and open source the stuff, but to create valuable content for the specific use cases, we’ll need the community and partners who share common goals to get this successfully going. So all ideas in this direction are welcome, too. Best Tim Von: Kathleen Lu <kathleen...@mapbox.com <mailto:kathleen...@mapbox.com> > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 16. Mai 2018 00:25 An: Tobias Knerr <o...@tobias-knerr.de <mailto:o...@tobias-knerr.de> > Cc: Tim Frey <tim.f...@iunera.com <mailto:tim.f...@iunera.com> >; talk@openstreetmap.org <mailto:talk@openstreetmap.org> Betreff: Re: [OSM-talk] Open sourcing of POI pictures for OSM App/STAPPZ - Feedback and ideas wanted Hi Tim, Your app and what you hope to do with it both sound interesting. I hope you are successful. Here's some more information on the open licensing front to consider: - In order to have the legal rights necessary to "open" the mat
Re: [OSM-talk] Open sourcing of POI pictures for OSM App/STAPPZ - Feedback and ideas wanted
Thank you Kathleen and Tobias, This is some very valuable insight. >From our terms of use, we could likely open the content, but you are right – >it is about what users think. Hence, we will and can ask them. Thanks a lot >for rising this point. One rising concern, when I read your text, Kathleen, is the GDPR – what happens if a user wants content deleted and it is already copied all over the web by an open license. Or even worse, a user uploads a picture of a scenery and there are human faces in the scenery .. and this picture is distributed. I see potential problems here for us and the organizations using the pictures. Additional thoughts please? I like the Wikipedia and in special the Wikivoyage direction also. Does somebody know the best touchpoints to get in contact with the community there? In general, I agree to what you said that manual work for content filtering and legal issues would be needed – what is also one point for us to discuss with the community first: We can provide the software and open source the stuff, but to create valuable content for the specific use cases, we’ll need the community and partners who share common goals to get this successfully going. So all ideas in this direction are welcome, too. Best Tim Von: Kathleen Lu <kathleen...@mapbox.com> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 16. Mai 2018 00:25 An: Tobias Knerr <o...@tobias-knerr.de> Cc: Tim Frey <tim.f...@iunera.com>; talk@openstreetmap.org Betreff: Re: [OSM-talk] Open sourcing of POI pictures for OSM App/STAPPZ - Feedback and ideas wanted Hi Tim, Your app and what you hope to do with it both sound interesting. I hope you are successful. Here's some more information on the open licensing front to consider: - In order to have the legal rights necessary to "open" the material your users contributed, you would likely needed to have gotten a perpetual irrevocable royalty-free license with an unlimited right to sublicense (not limited to only your affiliates, etc), or an assignment, though the latter is far more than needed. - But would use of the photos/text outside of the STAPPZ app be consistent with your users' expectations for their photos/text? If no, then even if you can legally do it you may be passing an unwelcome burden to an open community. - What open license would you provide the photos/text under? CC-BY is a common one for photos, though it is not inherently compatible with ODbL (the license for OSM). There is however a waiver template that makes CC-BY it compatible with ODbL: https://blog.openstreetmap.org/2017/03/17/use-of-cc-by-data/ There is the separate issue with CC-BY that users are supposed to attribute the author. Do your users expect/want their names to be attributed to the photos if they are used outside the App? This may raise data privacy issues a well (especially with GDPR coming into enforcement). - As for open source of the code, you'll have a choice between a permissive license (e.g. MIT, BSD, ISC, DWTFYW) or a copyleft license (e.g. GPL, LGPL) or something in between (MPL, Apache). Permissive licenses make it easier for someone else to take over the project, though there is the possibility that they will take it in a direction you do not like (e.g., build a new version but not open the code to the new version). Copyleft licenses are intended to guard against this, but most companies do not like working with copyleft code and many ban it, so there would be a smaller pool of potential interest. You can see OSMF's current open source projects here: https://github.com/openstreetmap. The licenses currently used are ISC, BSD, DWTFYW, Apache 2.0, and GPL. Best of luck! -Kathleen On Tue, May 15, 2018 at 2:45 PM Tobias Knerr <o...@tobias-knerr.de <mailto:o...@tobias-knerr.de> > wrote: Hi Tim, On 11.05.2018 17:19, Tim Frey wrote: > Out of this, we consider, heavily, to “open source” the licensing of the > user created STAPPZ content for the OSM community. In addition, we also > consider to open source the backend of STAPPZ and the IOS and Android > app to make a community project out of it. I'm going to split this reply into two parts: About the content, and about the software itself. As for the content, a lot depends on if you can publish the images under the terms of an open license.¹ That's a legal question, but probably also a bit of a social one (i.e. would this be in line with what the creators expected when they shared their images on your app, or would they be unpleasantly surprised/unhappy about this). Assuming the answer is that yes, you can publish them, the next question is what to do with the images. OSM does not currently have an image hosting platform, so if we're only talking about contributing the images, they would need to be donated to a separate platform. The obvious recipient for such an image donation would be Wikimedia Commons, as they're the most
Re: [OSM-talk] Open sourcing of POI pictures for OSM App/STAPPZ - Feedback and ideas wanted
Hello Milo, thanks a lot for your long and detailed feedback. I appreciate that a lot. The use cases you described with waste, hazards and so on are interesting – for such cases, we implemented a first version to tag posts… so in theory it would be possible with the current API. My key thought is: How and where do we get more users who tell the stories and get started with this? Someone has suggestions? The POI database – my original key thought was to link the OSM POIs like fountains, restaurants – barely everything to descriptions and pictures to provide the most value added to the community. I’m not certain if this is what you meant by sustainable development goals. Therefore, please elaborate if I got this right? Best Tim Von: Milo van der Linden <m...@dogodigi.net> Gesendet: Sonntag, 13. Mai 2018 13:43 An: Tim Frey <tim.f...@iunera.com> Cc: OSM Talk <talk@openstreetmap.org> Betreff: Re: [OSM-talk] Open sourcing of POI pictures for OSM App/STAPPZ - Feedback and ideas wanted Hello Tim, thank you for the broad explanation of your product! I like the concept and me have some particular use cases for which we now use Flickr. I would love to have an alternative to that which could be maintained by a community that is closely related to OpenStreetMap. My usecases are particular for non-google-dominated areas; where users not only enter travel pictures; but also pictures related to particular causes; for instance waste, standing water, hazards and more. They are users which are not so tech-savvy but have an urgent need to tell "a story" to government, officials, police or other matters of public interest. So a POI database with the possibility to enter pictures and information that relate to the Sustainable Development Goals would be awesome. I would love to collaborate on such a project. Kind regards Milo 2018-05-11 17:19 GMT+02:00 Tim Frey < <mailto:tim.f...@iunera.com> tim.f...@iunera.com>: Greetings OSM community, my name is Tim and I’m one of the creators of the STAPPZ app. We want feedback from the community about our open sourcing plan of the STAPPZ app content. What is STAPPZ: STAPPZ is in short an app and a server backend application. The original idea was to create crowdsourced version of an insider travel guide, where each user can contribute content. That means, you open the app and you post some pictures and a text at a geolocation and when you are online, then the content is uploaded to the server and is available on a webmap. This way, you can create a personal travel diary map. Our original plan was to extend STAPPZ step by step to create not only travel guides, but to also add pictures of POIs Example: <https://maps.stappz.com/region/sicilia> https://maps.stappz.com/region/sicilia Android App demo video: <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDBh-VrU2Ig> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDBh-VrU2Ig Explanation slides: <https://de.slideshare.net/TimFrey2/travel-guides-are-old-news-being-a-local-insider-everywhere-is-today> https://de.slideshare.net/TimFrey2/travel-guides-are-old-news-being-a-local-insider-everywhere-is-today Background: We managed to get featured with the app at conferences and in a lot of magazines (e.g. Computer Bild, Chip) and got over 10k downloads for Android, but, frankly speaking, we did not get mass adaption to create a sustainable ecosystem. Therefore, we as company had to focus on other projects to earn money for living ☹ . Feedback wanted: We poured a lot of our personal tears and sweat in coding and marketing STAPPZ and today we think that STAPPZ could be used to create picture POI content for OSM. We see that need in special, because google maps is offering more and more picture POI content from users, and I, personally, do not know such an open datapod for open streetmap. Out of this, we consider, heavily, to “open source” the licensing of the user created STAPPZ content for the OSM community. In addition, we also consider to open source the backend of STAPPZ and the IOS and Android app to make a community project out of it. However, we are a very small company and we cannot do that completely alone, we will need help and advice from the community. Technical details: Internally, in the app and the backend, we use only OSM data and maps to ensure not being bound to legal contracts to google. The Android version is far more developed than the IOS version and has complete offline and caching functionality to allow posting of pictures form the gallery and to position the pictures on a map. Currently, the maps part of the app does not work for Android, but we want to enable it as soon as we have time. STAPPZ supports gallery uploads with exif data, cached content and many more things – if you got questions please ask. Questions to the community: What do you think about open sourcing
[OSM-talk] Open sourcing of POI pictures for OSM App/STAPPZ - Feedback and ideas wanted
Greetings OSM community, my name is Tim and I’m one of the creators of the STAPPZ app. We want feedback from the community about our open sourcing plan of the STAPPZ app content. What is STAPPZ: STAPPZ is in short an app and a server backend application. The original idea was to create crowdsourced version of an insider travel guide, where each user can contribute content. That means, you open the app and you post some pictures and a text at a geolocation and when you are online, then the content is uploaded to the server and is available on a webmap. This way, you can create a personal travel diary map. Our original plan was to extend STAPPZ step by step to create not only travel guides, but to also add pictures of POIs Example: https://maps.stappz.com/region/sicilia Android App demo video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDBh-VrU2Ig Explanation slides: https://de.slideshare.net/TimFrey2/travel-guides-are-old-news-being-a-local-insider-everywhere-is-today Background: We managed to get featured with the app at conferences and in a lot of magazines (e.g. Computer Bild, Chip) and got over 10k downloads for Android, but, frankly speaking, we did not get mass adaption to create a sustainable ecosystem. Therefore, we as company had to focus on other projects to earn money for living ☹ . Feedback wanted: We poured a lot of our personal tears and sweat in coding and marketing STAPPZ and today we think that STAPPZ could be used to create picture POI content for OSM. We see that need in special, because google maps is offering more and more picture POI content from users, and I, personally, do not know such an open datapod for open streetmap. Out of this, we consider, heavily, to “open source” the licensing of the user created STAPPZ content for the OSM community. In addition, we also consider to open source the backend of STAPPZ and the IOS and Android app to make a community project out of it. However, we are a very small company and we cannot do that completely alone, we will need help and advice from the community. Technical details: Internally, in the app and the backend, we use only OSM data and maps to ensure not being bound to legal contracts to google. The Android version is far more developed than the IOS version and has complete offline and caching functionality to allow posting of pictures form the gallery and to position the pictures on a map. Currently, the maps part of the app does not work for Android, but we want to enable it as soon as we have time. STAPPZ supports gallery uploads with exif data, cached content and many more things – if you got questions please ask. Questions to the community: What do you think about open sourcing the content, the app and so on? Do you see a value added for the OSM community? Would you support the project to open source it? Do you know companies who would be interested in participating? We are open for collaborations here. Do you have own thoughts and points about it? I’d really like to learn more here. STAPPZ is a really personal baby for us, and we’d like that it continues to live. Thanks a lot for everyone in advance who reads that – and even more thanks to the ones who are going to reply with feedback and thoughts. Even if you just think the idea is good or bad – please tell us that we get a picture how the whole community sees it. Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Kind regards Tim Frey ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
