David wrote
Just a quick note that my understanding is those figures are generated
based on v1 history, none of the bot edits would have been v1 unless
they created a new entity, not just a new/modified tag.
David, you may be right although I took Richard's nodes last edited to
mean the latest
I'm speaking strictly personally here, posting to talk@ and opengeodata.
OSM often crosses bridges in it's growth. Mostly they're technical, like
introducing color maps, rendering new things or speeding up the system. We have
a much more ugly bridge to cross in front of us.
Would you want to
Maybe you have a better option?
Yes.
It already happened.
Liz
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On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 9:00 AM, Steve Coast st...@asklater.com wrote:
So - what do we do now?
Ignore the trolls (meaning troll-like messages, not troll-like people).
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Is it just me, or is there a certain amount of irony in Nearmap not
allowing OSM to use their aerials to trace from, but being quite happy
to use OSM as their street layer?
(Don't get me wrong - I think Nearmap have a very tidy product, but it's
just a pity that a compromise couldn't be
David Murn wrote:
I think the biggest problem people in .au had was that there were some
issues which were specific to the Australian usage of OSM (imports of
gov data, etc). Those who sought to change the licence claimed to be
listening to people, but when Australian mappers raised issues, we
On 11 July 2011 19:04, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote:
they don't have to be the same licence. That unambiguously works with ODbL
(4.5a): whether it works with CC is a moot point because CC is unclear for
data licensing, but it's likely that it does (after all, there are
Well if
On 11/07/2011 10:13, John Smith wrote:
On 11 July 2011 19:04, Richard Fairhurstrich...@systemed.net wrote:
they don't have to be the same licence. That unambiguously works with ODbL
(4.5a): whether it works with CC is a moot point because CC is unclear for
data licensing, but it's likely that
They do allow OSM to trace their imagery, or anyone else for that
matter. So long as traced data is licensed under CC-BY-SA. It is the
OSMF/OSM whom chooses that this license isn't suitable and whom won't
accept the data.
As for this choice, i.e. why nearmap insists over CC-BY-SA rather that
CC0
On 11 July 2011 19:29, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote:
It's not using it under a licence other than CC-BY-SA. A Collective
Database or Collective Work means that the ODbL part of it is under ODbL
and the CC-BY-SA part is under CC-BY-SA. This is the very first clause (1a)
of
It is my understanding that Bing essentially said to OSM yes you can
upload to OSM.
We as a community can't verify this.
http://www.microsoft.com/maps/product/terms.html mentions nothing, all
we have is http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Bing_license.pdf
which we can't verify as authentic.
On 11/07/2011 10:52, John Smith wrote:
On 11 July 2011 19:29, Richard Fairhurstrich...@systemed.net wrote:
It's not using it under a licence other than CC-BY-SA. A Collective
Database or Collective Work means that the ODbL part of it is under ODbL
and the CC-BY-SA part is under CC-BY-SA. This
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 7:52 PM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote:
On 11 July 2011 19:29, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote:
It's not using it under a licence other than CC-BY-SA. A Collective
Database or Collective Work means that the ODbL part of it is under ODbL
and the
On 11 July 2011 19:55, Andrew Harvey andrew.harv...@gmail.com wrote:
It is my understanding that Bing essentially said to OSM yes you can
upload to OSM.
All we have is SteveC's word that this is what happened, to the best
of my knowledge Bing themselves near released anything definitive on
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 12:02 AM, Richard Fairhurst
rich...@systemed.net wrote:
I think it's reasonably obvious by now that the two sides in this debate
aren't ever going to be reconciled.
It's not exclusively an .au problem, but it is mostly. If you look at any of
the analysis done recently,
On 11 July 2011 10:55, Andrew Harvey andrew.harv...@gmail.com wrote:
It is my understanding that Bing essentially said to OSM yes you can
upload to OSM.
We as a community can't verify this.
http://www.microsoft.com/maps/product/terms.html mentions nothing, all
we have is
Matt,
I hope Nearmap continue to use OSM data. I only wish that they updated it a
bit more often.
That Way (for areas they cover that I don't get to regularly) I can spot new
roads that need a visit to survey properly.
Cheers
Nick
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On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 8:10 PM, Grant Slater
openstreet...@firefishy.com wrote:
The official Bing blog:
http://www.bing.com/community/site_blogs/b/maps/archive/2010/12/01/bing-maps-aerial-imagery-in-openstreetmap.aspx
published by Brian Hendricks - Bing Maps Product Manager
Oh, yes. That's
- Original Message -
From: Steve Coast st...@asklater.com
To: t...@openstreetmap.org; talk-au@openstreetmap.org
Cc: p...@opengeodata.posterous.com
Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 8:00 AM
Subject: [OSM-talk] Hitting reset on talk-au
[snip]
Maybe you have a better option?
Yes. Do
On 11 July 2011 20:05, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir maxi...@gmail.com wrote:
What he's saying is there is no requirement under Australian Copyright
law (or CC licence) for a whole compilation/database/document to have
the same licence. It's the same way the Government can use Creative
Commons for
On 11/07/2011, at 8:47 PM, John Smith wrote:
Then why was there such a big fuss made over Haiti edits should be PD
so that the UN could mix the data with other datasets...
Because they were mixing the datasets. If you do something like render tiles
within the .au boundaries from one database,
On 11 July 2011 20:53, James Livingston li...@sunsetutopia.com wrote:
On 11/07/2011, at 8:47 PM, John Smith wrote:
Then why was there such a big fuss made over Haiti edits should be PD
so that the UN could mix the data with other datasets...
Because they were mixing the datasets. If you do
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 5:00 PM, Steve Coast st...@asklater.com wrote:
I'm speaking strictly personally here, posting to talk@ and opengeodata.
OSM often crosses bridges in it's growth. Mostly they're technical, like
introducing color maps, rendering new things or speeding up the system. We
On 11 July 2011 11:30, Andrew Harvey andrew.harv...@gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 8:10 PM, Grant Slater
openstreet...@firefishy.com wrote:
The traced data is a new work and therefore untainted by the Bing
license. (NearMap doesn't see using aerial imagery this way.)
The license is
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 4:59 AM, Matt White mattwh...@iinet.com.au wrote:
Is it just me, or is there a certain amount of irony in Nearmap not allowing
OSM to use their aerials to trace from, but being quite happy to use OSM as
their street layer?
(Don't get me wrong - I think Nearmap have a
- Original Message -
From: Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net
To: David Murn da...@incanberra.com.au
Cc: talk-au@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Going separate ways
David Murn wrote:
I think the biggest problem people in .au had
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 5:04 AM, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote:
You're both a whole continent and
an island. There is therefore no reason why data users can't use FOSM for
Australia and OSM for the rest of the world - and even combine the two into
one dataset.
CC-BY-SA doesn't
David Groom wrote:
Are you sure? ODbL defines 'Collective Database Means this Database
in unmodified form as part of a collection of independent
databases ..'. Therefore if you cut out Australia it cant be part
of a collective database, because it is not the whole database in an
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 6:53 AM, James Livingston
li...@sunsetutopia.com wrote:
On 11/07/2011, at 8:47 PM, John Smith wrote:
Then why was there such a big fuss made over Haiti edits should be PD
so that the UN could mix the data with other datasets...
Because they were mixing the datasets. If
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 9:00 AM, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote:
David Groom wrote:
Are you sure? ODbL defines 'Collective Database Means this Database
in unmodified form as part of a collection of independent
databases ..'. Therefore if you cut out Australia it cant be part
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 9:03 AM, Anthony o...@inbox.org wrote:
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 9:00 AM, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net
wrote:
David Groom wrote:
Are you sure? ODbL defines 'Collective Database Means this Database
in unmodified form as part of a collection of independent
- Original Message -
From: Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net
To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Going separate ways
David Groom wrote:
Are you sure? ODbL defines 'Collective Database Means this Database
in unmodified form
Andrew Harvey andrew.harv...@gmail.com wrote:
That is, if OSM were as rigorous as Debian we wouldn't allow this as
it is in violation of point 8 of the DFSG
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debian_Free_Software_Guidelines
I'm glad somebody has mentioned Debian. You want to see information freedom
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 9:11 AM, David Groom revi...@pacific-rim.net wrote:
- Original Message - From: Richard Fairhurst
rich...@systemed.net
To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Going separate ways
David Groom wrote:
Are you
Anyway, I think what Richard is trying to say is this:
1) Create osm-without-australia.osm by removing australia from the
OSMF database.
2) Create fosm-australia-only.osm by removing everything but australia
from the FOSM database (for both of these extracts, use a boundary
definition that's PD.
David Groom wrote:
Which seems to me to that you are agreeing with my point, that these
are derivative databases, not collective databases as you first argued.
No: one is a Derivative Database (ODbL) and the other a Derivative Work
(CC-BY-SA), but the combination of the two is a Collective
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 9:49 AM, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote:
No: one is a Derivative Database (ODbL) and the other a Derivative Work
(CC-BY-SA), but the combination of the two is a Collective Database or Work.
Depends on how you combine them. If you just put the files next to
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 10:06 AM, Anthony o...@inbox.org wrote:
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 9:49 AM, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net
wrote:
No: one is a Derivative Database (ODbL) and the other a Derivative Work
(CC-BY-SA), but the combination of the two is a Collective Database or Work.
- Original Message -
From: Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net
To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 2:49 PM
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Going separate ways
David Groom wrote:
Which seems to me to that you are agreeing with my point, that these
are derivative
- Original Message -
From: Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net
To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 5:19 PM
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Going separate ways
David Groom wrote:
But as I said earlier, the ODbL seems quite clear that you cant make
a Collective
On 7/11/2011 6:13 AM, Sam Couter wrote:
Andrew Harveyandrew.harv...@gmail.com wrote:
That is, if OSM were as rigorous as Debian we wouldn't allow this as
it is in violation of point 8 of the DFSG
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debian_Free_Software_Guidelines
I'm glad somebody has mentioned
David Groom wrote:
Well for a start 4.8 only comes into play when you communicate a
derivative database
Which you are doing, as part of a Collective Database. Incorporating a
Derivative Database into a Collective Database does not absolve you of
ODbL's requirements, or remove its freedoms, for
Hi talk-au,
In an effort to cool some heads this list will be on full moderation
for a bit. This is not an ideal way to run a mailing list for an open
project and it is unlikely to be a permanent change. For the next
while[1], all posts will have to be explicitly released by a moderator
to get
Hi
The OpenStreetMap conference, State of the Map, is offering scholarships.
Details below. Note that nominations close on Sunday, June 25th.
We are also fundraising to help more mappers than our current minimum of 8. If
you'd like to help, get in touch with scholars...@stateofthemap.org
...
There is also a large backlog of messages held for moderation (spam,
fishing and non-subscribed), I'm going through that now. Apologies if
I take a while to get to your messages.
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It would be wonderful if people from talk-au were able to apply for
this, and come to SOTM. It's a super fun event.
Steve
On 6/19/2011 2:35 PM, Mikel Maron wrote:
Hi
The OpenStreetMap conference, State of the Map, is offering
scholarships. Details below. Note that nominations close on
Hi Steve,
Yes, I've got my tickets to SOTM and I hope you bring all your hats with
you.
In my spare time I develop some specialised applications for various
sports/pastimes and I think OSM can be useful for some of these.
I develop in Basic4PPC but the creators of this product can't make it work
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