Re: [OSM-talk-be] #equalstreetnames
Just for the fun of speculating: is way 225291488 named politically correct, or not? ;) KA On 2020-03-03 19:30, Marc Gemis wrote: Hello Seppe thanks a lot for sharing this information. I do like the project (despite my comments on obtaining the data before the start) because: - it uses my 2 favourite crowd-sourced open data projects - it really requires both projects to create the map - Open Street Maps (sic) is not only used as background nor for navigation - it brought together 60 people. I do hope they will somehow continue to contribute to OSM and/or Wikidata - It gave OSM and Wikidata some publicity As for the criticism on participating in an event that tries to gather data on gender inequality in street names. I do not see any political statement in that. After all, OSM and Wikidata are very natural sources for such events, as, you might have guessed it, are open data. If one makes a political statement with that, mapping bicycle parking could be seen as supporting anti-car policies as well. I assume mappers are often activists or at least passionate for certain features, be it slow roads, airfields, AEDs, historical buildings, power infrastructure etc. We are often open data and open source activists as well. Recently, on the tagging mailing list, you see requests for tags to map free drinking water, free refills, object sharing, food sharing, etc. All those are somehow driven by activism. Is that wrong? Not in my opinion, it enriches the OSM project. If we would only try to mimic Google Maps by focussing on navigation and shops (for advertising), we could as well stop now. So thank you for setting up the project and let's hope it will hellp OSM grow further in the future. regards m. On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:39 PM Santens Seppe wrote: Hi all, Today, #equalstreetnames was launched, something Open Knowledge / OSM Belgium (among others) can be very proud of if you ask me. The project combines OSM and Wikidata (+ extra data crowdsourced during a workshop) to make this map: https://equalstreetnames.brussels/ (stunning isn’t it?). More info on why an how can be found in this blogpost: https://be.okfn.org/2020/03/03/equalstreetnames-brussels-launch-of-open-data-visualisation/ The project already got some nice media coverage, e.g. https://www.bruzz.be/samenleving/nauwelijks-brusselse-straten-naar-vrouwen-vernoemd-trage-inhaalbeweging-2020-03-03 and https://www.rtbf.be/info/dossier/les-grenades/detail_combattre-le-sexisme-en-rebaptisant-les-rues-de-bruxelles?id=10446433 Of course, you can help spread the word, e.g. by sharing https://www.facebook.com/OpenKnowledgeBE/photos/a.376589912722798/1030439804004469/?type=3&theater https://twitter.com/OpenKnowledgeBE/status/1234754767756386304 https://www.linkedin.com/posts/open-knowledge-belgium_opendata-activity-6640521647684100096-GvRU Best regards, Seppe ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] #equalstreetnames
Marc, In zoverre ga ik wel graag met u mee, en dat schreef ik eigenlijk ook al: Het inzamelen van data doen we sowieso al, en bij het filteren en catalogeren van informatie zijn we graag van dienst. De interpretatie die daar dan aan gegeven wordt is politiek, maar dat gaat ons niet meer aan, inderdaad. Alleen vraag ik me af hoe enige automatisatie ooit gaat kunnen uitmaken of "Guido Gezelleplein" of "Gezusters Lovelingplantsoen" of "Dendermondse Steenweg" of "Zemst-Laar" naar mannen of naar vrouwen verwijzen... Tenzij men een soort "dictionary" opzet die al even veel werk vereist als het manueel uitzoeken van iedere straatnaam. Vr.gr., Karel On 2020-03-03 19:30, Marc Gemis wrote: Hello Seppe thanks a lot for sharing this information. I do like the project (despite my comments on obtaining the data before the start) because: - it uses my 2 favourite crowd-sourced open data projects - it really requires both projects to create the map - Open Street Maps (sic) is not only used as background nor for navigation - it brought together 60 people. I do hope they will somehow continue to contribute to OSM and/or Wikidata - It gave OSM and Wikidata some publicity As for the criticism on participating in an event that tries to gather data on gender inequality in street names. I do not see any political statement in that. After all, OSM and Wikidata are very natural sources for such events, as, you might have guessed it, are open data. If one makes a political statement with that, mapping bicycle parking could be seen as supporting anti-car policies as well. I assume mappers are often activists or at least passionate for certain features, be it slow roads, airfields, AEDs, historical buildings, power infrastructure etc. We are often open data and open source activists as well. Recently, on the tagging mailing list, you see requests for tags to map free drinking water, free refills, object sharing, food sharing, etc. All those are somehow driven by activism. Is that wrong? Not in my opinion, it enriches the OSM project. If we would only try to mimic Google Maps by focussing on navigation and shops (for advertising), we could as well stop now. So thank you for setting up the project and let's hope it will hellp OSM grow further in the future. regards m. On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:39 PM Santens Seppe wrote: Hi all, Today, #equalstreetnames was launched, something Open Knowledge / OSM Belgium (among others) can be very proud of if you ask me. The project combines OSM and Wikidata (+ extra data crowdsourced during a workshop) to make this map: https://equalstreetnames.brussels/ (stunning isn’t it?). More info on why an how can be found in this blogpost: https://be.okfn.org/2020/03/03/equalstreetnames-brussels-launch-of-open-data-visualisation/ The project already got some nice media coverage, e.g. https://www.bruzz.be/samenleving/nauwelijks-brusselse-straten-naar-vrouwen-vernoemd-trage-inhaalbeweging-2020-03-03 and https://www.rtbf.be/info/dossier/les-grenades/detail_combattre-le-sexisme-en-rebaptisant-les-rues-de-bruxelles?id=10446433 Of course, you can help spread the word, e.g. by sharing https://www.facebook.com/OpenKnowledgeBE/photos/a.376589912722798/1030439804004469/?type=3&theater https://twitter.com/OpenKnowledgeBE/status/1234754767756386304 https://www.linkedin.com/posts/open-knowledge-belgium_opendata-activity-6640521647684100096-GvRU Best regards, Seppe ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] #equalstreetnames
Hello Seppe thanks a lot for sharing this information. I do like the project (despite my comments on obtaining the data before the start) because: - it uses my 2 favourite crowd-sourced open data projects - it really requires both projects to create the map - Open Street Maps (sic) is not only used as background nor for navigation - it brought together 60 people. I do hope they will somehow continue to contribute to OSM and/or Wikidata - It gave OSM and Wikidata some publicity As for the criticism on participating in an event that tries to gather data on gender inequality in street names. I do not see any political statement in that. After all, OSM and Wikidata are very natural sources for such events, as, you might have guessed it, are open data. If one makes a political statement with that, mapping bicycle parking could be seen as supporting anti-car policies as well. I assume mappers are often activists or at least passionate for certain features, be it slow roads, airfields, AEDs, historical buildings, power infrastructure etc. We are often open data and open source activists as well. Recently, on the tagging mailing list, you see requests for tags to map free drinking water, free refills, object sharing, food sharing, etc. All those are somehow driven by activism. Is that wrong? Not in my opinion, it enriches the OSM project. If we would only try to mimic Google Maps by focussing on navigation and shops (for advertising), we could as well stop now. So thank you for setting up the project and let's hope it will hellp OSM grow further in the future. regards m. On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:39 PM Santens Seppe wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > Today, #equalstreetnames was launched, something Open Knowledge / OSM Belgium > (among others) can be very proud of if you ask me. The project combines OSM > and Wikidata (+ extra data crowdsourced during a workshop) to make this map: > https://equalstreetnames.brussels/ (stunning isn’t it?). More info on why an > how can be found in this blogpost: > https://be.okfn.org/2020/03/03/equalstreetnames-brussels-launch-of-open-data-visualisation/ > > > > The project already got some nice media coverage, e.g. > https://www.bruzz.be/samenleving/nauwelijks-brusselse-straten-naar-vrouwen-vernoemd-trage-inhaalbeweging-2020-03-03 > and > https://www.rtbf.be/info/dossier/les-grenades/detail_combattre-le-sexisme-en-rebaptisant-les-rues-de-bruxelles?id=10446433 > > > > Of course, you can help spread the word, e.g. by sharing > > https://www.facebook.com/OpenKnowledgeBE/photos/a.376589912722798/1030439804004469/?type=3&theater > > https://twitter.com/OpenKnowledgeBE/status/1234754767756386304 > > https://www.linkedin.com/posts/open-knowledge-belgium_opendata-activity-6640521647684100096-GvRU > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > Seppe > > > > ___ > Talk-be mailing list > Talk-be@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk-be] #equalstreetnames
Seppe, en collega-mappers, Neem me mijn scepsis niet kwalijk, maar ik vraag me toch af we hier als mappers wel aan de kar moeten trekken. Voorzover ik zie is het onze taak om onze database te onderhouden, en aan te passen aan de permanente stroom van wijzigende informatie; en om uit te kijken naar mechanismes om de kwaliteit van ons aanbod te verbeteren, en om de kwantiteit uit te breiden. We kunnen en willen uiteraard graag ten dienste staan van eenieder die onze database wil raadplegen! Bv. voor het opzetten van Overpass-queries. Maar ik word een beetje schuw bij het entoesiasme voor een dergelijke "politiek correcte" actie. Naar mijn (niet altijd even bescheiden) mening is het de essentie van OSM om de feiten en de werkelijkheid op te volgen, niet om ze aan te sturen. Van op afstand bekeken, eventjes ruimer dan OSM: straten werden en worden (soms) vernoemd naar beroemde personen, en het is een historisch gegeven dat beroemde personen overwegend mannelijk zijn. Men kan dat betreuren, maar het is niet anders. Er is terzake een inhaalbeweging aan de gang, dat werd wel tijd, en mettertijd zal zich dat automatisch ook weerspiegelen in de straatnamen. Als we al wel willen zo'n namen invoeren, ik vind dat eigenlijk maar een 19de-eeuwse mode; misschien kunnen we ze beter helemaal afvoeren. Maar als het dan toch aan de orde is, dan wil ik graag aan de vroede moederen en vaderen van de stad Mechelen voorstellen om een straat te vernoemen naar mevrouw Adèle Colson. (English version, freely translated, for the sake of continuity - but reactions in any Belgian language much preferred, for the sake of Belgium!) Seppe, and all, Excuse my scepticism, but I am unsure if this is a project where we, the OSM mappers, should be on the forefront of action. Our vocation, as I see it, is to keep our database up to date, adapting to the permanent stream of change. And of course we should, and do, find novel ways to improve the database, both in quantity and in quality. We are of course gladly available to assist anybody in consulting our database; through Overpass queries, for only one example. I am however wary of our involvement in actions "politically correct" like this one seems to be; I much prefer we limit ourselves to following facts, and their endless changes; we should not seek to steer them. My 0.02 € :) Karel On 2020-03-03 11:37, Santens Seppe wrote: Hi all, Today, #equalstreetnames was launched, something Open Knowledge / OSM Belgium (among others) can be very proud of if you ask me. The project combines OSM and Wikidata (+ extra data crowdsourced during a workshop) to make this map: https://equalstreetnames.brussels/ (stunning isn’t it?). More info on why an how can be found in this blogpost: https://be.okfn.org/2020/03/03/equalstreetnames-brussels-launch-of-open-data-visualisation/ The project already got some nice media coverage, e.g. https://www.bruzz.be/samenleving/nauwelijks-brusselse-straten-naar-vrouwen-vernoemd-trage-inhaalbeweging-2020-03-03 and https://www.rtbf.be/info/dossier/les-grenades/detail_combattre-le-sexisme-en-rebaptisant-les-rues-de-bruxelles?id=10446433 Of course, you can help spread the word, e.g. by sharing https://www.facebook.com/OpenKnowledgeBE/photos/a.376589912722798/1030439804004469/?type=3&theater https://twitter.com/OpenKnowledgeBE/status/1234754767756386304 https://www.linkedin.com/posts/open-knowledge-belgium_opendata-activity-6640521647684100096-GvRU Best regards, Seppe ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
[OSM-talk-be] #equalstreetnames
Hi all, Today, #equalstreetnames was launched, something Open Knowledge / OSM Belgium (among others) can be very proud of if you ask me. The project combines OSM and Wikidata (+ extra data crowdsourced during a workshop) to make this map: https://equalstreetnames.brussels/ (stunning isn't it?). More info on why an how can be found in this blogpost: https://be.okfn.org/2020/03/03/equalstreetnames-brussels-launch-of-open-data-visualisation/ The project already got some nice media coverage, e.g. https://www.bruzz.be/samenleving/nauwelijks-brusselse-straten-naar-vrouwen-vernoemd-trage-inhaalbeweging-2020-03-03 and https://www.rtbf.be/info/dossier/les-grenades/detail_combattre-le-sexisme-en-rebaptisant-les-rues-de-bruxelles?id=10446433 Of course, you can help spread the word, e.g. by sharing https://www.facebook.com/OpenKnowledgeBE/photos/a.376589912722798/1030439804004469/?type=3&theater https://twitter.com/OpenKnowledgeBE/status/1234754767756386304 https://www.linkedin.com/posts/open-knowledge-belgium_opendata-activity-6640521647684100096-GvRU Best regards, Seppe ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
