Re: [Talk-GB] New user renaming highway=cycleway with NCN references

[Andy Townsend]

On 12/05/2016 23:13, David Woolley wrote:


They started their life being purely for private profit, got 
nationalised, then handed to a charity, but never got made public 
rights of way.


It depends where you are, I think.  Certainly the canal towpath nearest 
to me (Cromford Canal) is mostly public footpath. It's all been 
surveyed, and the designation has been added fairly conservatively, i.e. 
only where there's signage, and even on that basis most is still public 
footpath.


Cheers,

Andy


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Re: [Talk-GB] New user renaming highway=cycleway with NCN references

[David Woolley]

On 12/05/16 12:30, Eric Grosso wrote:


At the moment, the different tags (in link with this discussion) used
for these ways are:highway=path, surface=paved, bicycle=designated,
segregated=no, width=1.75, ncn_ref=754 (Tobi added yesterday a ncn_ref
in addition to the associated relation).


For canal towpaths, bicycle=designated is misleading, as it tends to 
imply a public right of way, whereas these are normally 
access=permissive, and privately owned by the Canal and River Trust.


They started their life being purely for private profit, got 
nationalised, then handed to a charity, but never got made public rights 
of way.


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[Talk-GB] Interesting article: Strava data used by Bath city

[Rob Nickerson]

May be of interest to some:
http://www.bathhacked.org/projects/bath-cycling/strava-metro-interacting-data/

*Rob*
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[Talk-GB] OSMF looking for a part-time administrative assistant

[Frederik Ramm]

Hi,

   the OSMF would like to hire someone for part-time (max 2 days/week)
work, helping with administrative tasks. Please see the detailed job
posting here on the Wiki:

http://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Administrative_Assistant

Since we're an UK organisation, having someone in the UK would probably
be useful in many regards although we haven't made that a condition.
Needless to say, prior OSM involvement is also a plus.

If you are interested, or know someone who is, please apply (or tell
them to apply) until June 03, to the address given in the above wiki post.

Bye
Frederik

-- 
Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"

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Re: [Talk-GB] New user renaming highway=cycleway with NCN references

[Richard Fairhurst]

Craig Wallace wrote:
> Maybe the consensus in England.
> In Scotland, where paths can be used on foot, bicycle, horse etc, 
> then highway=path makes sense. And that is how they are 
> generally tagged in OSM.

Yes, access laws are indeed different in Scotland to England & Wales.

However, the point remains that highway=path, alone, does not tell you
anything about the character of a path, nor provide any way for you to
deduce it with a >50% certainty. So if you must use highway=path, then
surface and access tags are absolute essentials, and width tags etc. are
helpful. Or, alternatively, use a meaningful tag like =cycleway, which is
simpler for mappers and safer for consumers.

Richard



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Re: [Talk-GB] New user renaming highway=cycleway with NCN references

[Craig Wallace]

On 2016-05-11 06:44, Richard Fairhurst wrote:

On 10/05/2016 20:59, Eric Grosso wrote:

What do you think? Do we, OSM contributors, tag all the highways part of
a NCN as cycleways? What to do when in some cases, a highway is both
part of a NCN route and a hiking route (e.g the John Muir Way)?


Please don't use highway=path:
http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/Richard/diary/20333

For a towpath I'd use (and I believe the general UK consensus is)
highway=cycleway if it's been improved (widened, resurfaced) to
shared-use standard; or highway=footway, bicycle=yes if it's still
largely unimproved. And, as ever, add a surface tag.


Maybe the consensus in England.
In Scotland, where paths can be used on foot, bicycle, horse etc, then 
highway=path makes sense. And that is how they are generally tagged in OSM.



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Re: [Talk-GB] New user renaming highway=cycleway with NCN references

[Eric Grosso]

Thanks Chris, thanks Richard.

If we take the example of the Union Canal Towpath (e.g.
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/222362355), it was originally a footway,
upgraded (i.e. resurfaced) at several points in time (but a lot have been
done in 2005-2006), so it became easier and easier for cyclists to use it.
Then it became recently a NCN route. But as Chris mentioned, it's not wide
at all so cyclists have to slow down when they meet with pedestrians. Thus
it's really a mix between a footway and a cycleway now, so it seems
difficult (at least for me) to think about it in term of footway or
cycleway as it's both.

If we tag this kind of way as a footway, the meaning would be, according to
the OSM specifications ((http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:highway), a
way which is "for designated footpaths; i.e., mainly/exclusively for
pedestrians". Is it the best option here as this way became a shared space.

At the moment, the different tags (in link with this discussion) used for
these ways are: highway=path, surface=paved, bicycle=designated, segregated=
no, width=1.75, ncn_ref=754 (Tobi added yesterday a ncn_ref in addition to
the associated relation). These ways are also linked to this relation (
https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/51479) with type=route and
route=bicycle. All these tags and association seem to reflect what this way
is in reality and it means that it stays quite neutral (or let's say
objective) for both communities (walkers/hikers and cyclists).

I read your diary entry about it Richard. I easily understand that it's
easier for data consumers (especially software developers but also GIS
users when they create a legend -- as many many cases have to be considered
) to deal with a tag which appears quite high in the OSM hierarchy, i.e. at
the highway level.

So is there still somewhere and sometimes a place to use highway=path (in a
similar context to the one described above) in a general context of "Please
don't use highway=path"?

Thanks
Eric



On 11 May 2016 at 06:44, Richard Fairhurst  wrote:

> On 10/05/2016 20:59, Eric Grosso wrote:
>
>> What do you think? Do we, OSM contributors, tag all the highways part of
>> a NCN as cycleways? What to do when in some cases, a highway is both
>> part of a NCN route and a hiking route (e.g the John Muir Way)?
>>
>
> Please don't use highway=path:
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/Richard/diary/20333
>
> For a towpath I'd use (and I believe the general UK consensus is)
> highway=cycleway if it's been improved (widened, resurfaced) to shared-use
> standard; or highway=footway, bicycle=yes if it's still largely unimproved.
> And, as ever, add a surface tag.
>
> Richard
>
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