Re: [Talk-GB] Anyone in South-West London?

[Colin Smale]

I have commented on a major change to the admin boundary between
Richmond and Hounslow, but there are a number of other changes in the
same area including a rather suspicious "kink" in the Chertsey Road.

https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/51.44262/-0.36386 

The "Lincoln Arena" seems to have disappeared (still visible on old
tiles) - no idea if this is part of the same edit, or whether it's
correct. 

On 2020-03-30 19:58, Andy Townsend wrote:

> I've sent another "message to be read before continuing to edit" 
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3592 . 
> 
> It'd be good if everyone could have a look at 
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995 and comment there if there 
> are further problems (I've added the first obvious question).  I've 
> explicitly said at the current block that they should answer questions that 
> have been asked before any more editing. 
> 
> Best Regards, 
> 
> Andy
> 
> On 30/03/2020 18:35, Colin Smale wrote: 
> 
> He's back, and he's unimpressed... 
> 
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995 
> 
> "Reverted edits as many of mine were falsely removed"
> 
> On 2020-03-25 21:54, Andy Townsend wrote: 
> On 25/03/2020 16:02, Jez Nicholson wrote: 
> Heh, none of the references on the Wikipedia page link to anything mentioning 
> that it exists. I call bullsh/t 
> 
> Indeed - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Tfondie does not look 
> promising. 
> 
> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 2:34 PM Andrew Hain  
> wrote: 
> 
> I wonder if Tfondie who created the Wikipedia page may be the same person.

I've "sent them a message that they have to read before continuing to
edit" at https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3585 . 

We'll see what happens next; if there's no reply after a week or so I'll
revert their remaining edits that haven't since been edited by other
users; most have been reverted already but some (such as
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/783299940 ) remain and look somewhat
implausible. 

Best Regards, 

Andy (from the DWG) 

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Re: [Talk-GB] Anyone in South-West London?

[Mark Goodge]

On 30/03/2020 19:08, Steve Doerr wrote:
Is this relevant/ 
https://ecoworldlondon.com/places-to-live/current/verdo-kew-bridge


Yes; that's also the subject of a Wikipedia page that appears to have 
been created by the same person. It's the promotional name of a new 
housing development, not a real place name, and as such is neither 
notable enough for Wikipedia nor relevant to OSM.


Of course, names of new developments may, over time, enter common use as 
the name of the place, and as and when that does happen there's no 
reason why they shouldn't be mapped. But the mapping has to follow real 
world usage, not precede it.


Mark

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Re: [Talk-GB] Anyone in South-West London?

[Andy Townsend]

That was the only non-OSM link I could find too.  It just looks like 
estate agents' guff, not an actual suburb (or indeed a town, which it 
was added as at one point I believe).


Best Regards,

Andy

On 30/03/2020 19:08, Steve Doerr wrote:
Is this relevant/ 
https://ecoworldlondon.com/places-to-live/current/verdo-kew-bridge


Steve


On 30/03/2020 18:58, Andy Townsend wrote:


I've sent another "message to be read before continuing to edit" 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3592 .


It'd be good if everyone could have a look at 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995 and comment there if 
there are further problems (I've added the first obvious question).  
I've explicitly said at the current block that they should answer 
questions that have been asked before any more editing.


Best Regards,

Andy

On 30/03/2020 18:35, Colin Smale wrote:


He's back, and he's unimpressed...

https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995

"Reverted edits as many of mine were falsely removed"


On 2020-03-25 21:54, Andy Townsend wrote:


On 25/03/2020 16:02, Jez Nicholson wrote:
Heh, none of the references on the Wikipedia page link to anything 
mentioning that it exists. I call bullsh/t


Indeed - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Tfondie does not 
look promising.





On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 2:34 PM Andrew Hain 
mailto:andrewhain...@hotmail.co.uk>> 
wrote:


I wonder if Tfondie who created the Wikipedia page may be the
same person.

I've "sent them a message that they have to read before continuing 
to edit" at https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3585 .


We'll see what happens next; if there's no reply after a week or so 
I'll revert their remaining edits that haven't since been edited by 
other users; most have been reverted already but some (such as 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/783299940 ) remain and look 
somewhat implausible.


Best Regards,

Andy (from the DWG)




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Re: [Talk-GB] Anyone in South-West London?

[SK53]

The update of the former Wickes to Lidl in Fulwell (next to the bus garage)
looks OK. Stadium Village is, of course, complete nonsense (I lived in the
immediate area for 7 years, worked in it for an additional 4).

Jerry

On Mon, 30 Mar 2020 at 18:59, Andy Townsend  wrote:

> I've sent another "message to be read before continuing to edit"
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3592 .
>
> It'd be good if everyone could have a look at
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995 and comment there if
> there are further problems (I've added the first obvious question).  I've
> explicitly said at the current block that they should answer questions that
> have been asked before any more editing.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Andy
> On 30/03/2020 18:35, Colin Smale wrote:
>
> He's back, and he's unimpressed...
>
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995
>
> "Reverted edits as many of mine were falsely removed"
>
>
>
> On 2020-03-25 21:54, Andy Townsend wrote:
>
> On 25/03/2020 16:02, Jez Nicholson wrote:
>
> Heh, none of the references on the Wikipedia page link to anything
> mentioning that it exists. I call bullsh/t
>
> Indeed - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Tfondie does not look
> promising.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 2:34 PM Andrew Hain 
> wrote:
>
>> I wonder if Tfondie who created the Wikipedia page may be the same person.
>>
> I've "sent them a message that they have to read before continuing to
> edit" at https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3585 .
>
> We'll see what happens next; if there's no reply after a week or so I'll
> revert their remaining edits that haven't since been edited by other users;
> most have been reverted already but some (such as
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/783299940 ) remain and look somewhat
> implausible.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Andy (from the DWG)
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Anyone in South-West London?

[Steve Doerr]

Is this relevant/ 
https://ecoworldlondon.com/places-to-live/current/verdo-kew-bridge


Steve


On 30/03/2020 18:58, Andy Townsend wrote:


I've sent another "message to be read before continuing to edit" 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3592 .


It'd be good if everyone could have a look at 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995 and comment there if 
there are further problems (I've added the first obvious question).  
I've explicitly said at the current block that they should answer 
questions that have been asked before any more editing.


Best Regards,

Andy

On 30/03/2020 18:35, Colin Smale wrote:


He's back, and he's unimpressed...

https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995

"Reverted edits as many of mine were falsely removed"


On 2020-03-25 21:54, Andy Townsend wrote:


On 25/03/2020 16:02, Jez Nicholson wrote:
Heh, none of the references on the Wikipedia page link to anything 
mentioning that it exists. I call bullsh/t


Indeed - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Tfondie does not 
look promising.





On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 2:34 PM Andrew Hain 
mailto:andrewhain...@hotmail.co.uk>> 
wrote:


I wonder if Tfondie who created the Wikipedia page may be the
same person.

I've "sent them a message that they have to read before continuing 
to edit" at https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3585 .


We'll see what happens next; if there's no reply after a week or so 
I'll revert their remaining edits that haven't since been edited by 
other users; most have been reverted already but some (such as 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/783299940 ) remain and look 
somewhat implausible.


Best Regards,

Andy (from the DWG)




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Re: [Talk-GB] Anyone in South-West London?

[Andy Townsend]

I've sent another "message to be read before continuing to edit" 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3592 .


It'd be good if everyone could have a look at 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995 and comment there if 
there are further problems (I've added the first obvious question).  
I've explicitly said at the current block that they should answer 
questions that have been asked before any more editing.


Best Regards,

Andy

On 30/03/2020 18:35, Colin Smale wrote:


He's back, and he's unimpressed...

https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995

"Reverted edits as many of mine were falsely removed"


On 2020-03-25 21:54, Andy Townsend wrote:


On 25/03/2020 16:02, Jez Nicholson wrote:
Heh, none of the references on the Wikipedia page link to anything 
mentioning that it exists. I call bullsh/t


Indeed - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Tfondie does not 
look promising.





On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 2:34 PM Andrew Hain 
mailto:andrewhain...@hotmail.co.uk>> 
wrote:


I wonder if Tfondie who created the Wikipedia page may be the
same person.

I've "sent them a message that they have to read before continuing to 
edit" at https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3585 .


We'll see what happens next; if there's no reply after a week or so 
I'll revert their remaining edits that haven't since been edited by 
other users; most have been reverted already but some (such as 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/783299940 ) remain and look 
somewhat implausible.


Best Regards,

Andy (from the DWG)




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Re: [Talk-GB] Anyone in South-West London?

[Colin Smale]

He's back, and he's unimpressed... 

https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/82834995 

"Reverted edits as many of mine were falsely removed"

On 2020-03-25 21:54, Andy Townsend wrote:

> On 25/03/2020 16:02, Jez Nicholson wrote: 
> 
>> Heh, none of the references on the Wikipedia page link to anything 
>> mentioning that it exists. I call bullsh/t
> 
> Indeed - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Tfondie does not look 
> promising. 
> 
> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 2:34 PM Andrew Hain  
> wrote: 
> 
> I wonder if Tfondie who created the Wikipedia page may be the same person.

I've "sent them a message that they have to read before continuing to
edit" at https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/3585 . 

We'll see what happens next; if there's no reply after a week or so I'll
revert their remaining edits that haven't since been edited by other
users; most have been reverted already but some (such as
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/783299940 ) remain and look somewhat
implausible. 

Best Regards, 

Andy (from the DWG) 

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[Talk-GB] Suspension of Nottingham/East Midlands pub meetings until further notice

[SK53]

Dear All,

I'm finally finding a little bit of time to catch up on things.

Firstly, thanks to those of you who responded to me personally when I
cancelled this months meeting. It meant a lot.

I'm now housebound (as a 'shielding' 'extremely vulnerable' person) for a
minimum of the next 12 weeks, so I'm no longer in a position to co-ordinate
OSM pub meetings in the East Midlands area.

I am therefore cancelling (i.e., removing from the OSM calendar) all
meetings for the rest of the year. (I anticipate the 12 week isolation will
be extended for a considerable time beyond late June). I'll revisit this in
late June.

In the meantime if anyone fancies a virtual drinking at home meet sometime
via one of the video chat packages drop me a line.

Best wishes,

Jerry
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Re: [Talk-GB] Adding missing roads using Facebook detections

[SK53]

Dear All,

Coming late to this as I have little time for any email at present.

I would suggest in the current circumstances that this activity should be
halted:


   1.  As others have said the vast majority of public roads in Great
   Britain (and most likely Northern Ireland too) are already mapped.
   2.  The latest release of OS OpenData Roads has good quality geometries
   and it is relatively simple to find missing roads with it (see below).
   3.  Missing roads available from the Facebook project via the special ID
   editors have such a high rate of false positives (I haven't found the time
   to precisely quantify it but I would estimate 90-95% for the Rushcliffe
   District in Nottinghamshire). This in itself ought to be sufficient reason
   to halt/delay on its own.
   4.  Imagery used for the identifications may well be less up-to-date
   than OS OpenData
   5.  Classification of roads often requires good local knowledge. The
   ability to improve a very small number of areas in comparison is not
   outweighed by the potential to introduce many incorrect routes across rural
   areas which, in particular, may impact some logistics planning.
   6.  Active OSM contributors have much less time to check any data added
   and flag up issues. Accordingly incorrect data may stay on OSM for a
   considerable period of time.

In order to identify and add missing urban roads I suggest one or more of
the following:


   -  Use CodePoint Open to identify postcodes more than a certain distance
   from the OSM road network. Probably needs OSM road network (e.g., for a
   Local Authority or larger area) and CPO either in a PostGIS database or as
   layers in QGIS. The relevant query is st_shortestline(cpo_point, osm_road)
   > n metres. It needs optimisation to get good performance, but is probably
   fine for a single LA.
   - Download a OpenRoads. I think it comes packaged as 100 km sq tiles
   (e.g., SK). This is a reasonable volume of data to work with in QGIS. It
   can be clipped to a given LA, although you may need two or more squares for
   some. Download OSM highways (minus tracks, bridleways, steps, footways &
   cycleways, or filter them out after download), either using Overpass (best)
   or a full pbf file from Geofabrik. Re-project to OSGB 27700, buffer by
   anywhere between 10 and 20 metres and then use the Vector difference tool
   in QGIS to find all roads in the OpenRoad dataset which are not overlaid by
   the buffered OSM data (this latter step is not absolutely necessary because
   overlaying the buffered OSM roads allows a quick visualisation of the
   missing data. OpenRoads data can be read by JOSM directly using the
   OpenData plugin which will perform a correct reprojection for OSM purposes.
   Roads to be added can be selected and added to a new layer. The default
   fields, other than name and ref, from OpenRoads are largely not useful for
   OSM, nor do they map cleanly onto OSM tags, so tags need to be added,
   original fields deleted etc., before data is added to OSM. (The OpenRoads
   data is also very good for missing road names).

Regards,

Jerry

On Fri, 27 Mar 2020 at 12:18, Richard Fairhurst 
wrote:

> Jothirnadh Guthula wrote:
> > With a team of mappers @Amazon we are planning to improve
> > missing roads in UK using Facebook detections as a source. Please
> > let us know if you have any ongoing projects using this data source.
> > While adding missing roads, we will be adding all the associated
> > access tags as per available on-ground resources.
>
> I'd urge extreme caution on this, particularly in rural areas, for two
> reasons.
>
> Firstly, as Martin says, there are virtually no public roads unmapped in
> the
> UK. New construction aside, I think in the last five years, I've spotted
> two, both in Powys.
>
> Secondly, UK access rights are unique and complex, and can only be
> discerned
> either by survey or by consulting Definitive Statements where these exist.
> You should not be adding access tags, nor adding highway types that imply
> access rights (for example, highway=unclassified implies general public
> access to all vehicle types), unless you've surveyed the location or
> consulted a Definitive Statement.
>
> For an example of the issues, please see this changeset discussion:
>
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/71668172
>
> In this case an Amazon Logistics mapper added motor_vehicle=yes which was
> inaccurate. In this particular case I was lucky to find an openly licensed
> photo to demonstrate the real access rights on that way.
>
> If you're exclusively mapping new housing estates in urban areas, though,
> go
> for it. :)
>
> Richard
>
>
>
> --
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