Re: OpenBSD/NTRU policy mismatch [Was: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era]
thanks for the comments! Luckily there are still a few algorithms if NTRU is not good yet: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-quantum_cryptography As time goes, maybe this will be a more and more relevant thing. Original Message From: Okembe Mbwambo Apparently from: owner-tech+m42...@openbsd.org To: tech@openbsd.org Subject: OpenBSD/NTRU policy mismatch [Was: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era] Date: Tue, 26 May 2015 20:50:29 +0200 > On 25/05/15 02:50:50 PM, Douglas Ray wrote: > > > 2. The "FOSS exception" clause above won't help with existing > > OpenBSD policy, insofar as I understand it here: > > http://www.openbsd.org/policy.html > > [note section towards end on GPL under "Specific Cases"] > > FWIW, a BSD-licensed NTRU implementation exists at > https://github.com/tbuktu/libntru and while it is patent encumbered, it > offers a compile switch that causes it to become patent free in 2017 as > opposed to the GPL implementation which will be patent encumbered until 2020. > > Okembe
Re: OpenBSD/NTRU policy mismatch [Was: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era]
26.05.2015, 23:08, "Chris Cappuccio" : >> FWIW, a BSD-licensed NTRU implementation exists at >> https://github.com/tbuktu/libntru and while it is patent encumbered, it >> offers a compile switch that causes it to become patent free in 2017 as >> opposed to the GPL implementation which will be patent encumbered until 2020. > > Are the patents held by the copyright authors? If the copyright is not held > by the patent holder, I imagine this becomes much less important. >From the description on the GitHub page, it looks to me like the BSD-licensed >implementation was written by somebody not affiliated with the patent holder. >But I guess the only way to know for sure is to ask. Okembe
Re: OpenBSD/NTRU policy mismatch [Was: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era]
Okembe Mbwambo [okembe.mbwa...@yandex.com] wrote: > On 25/05/15 02:50:50 PM, Douglas Ray wrote: > > > 2. The "FOSS exception" clause above won't help with existing > > OpenBSD policy, insofar as I understand it here: > > http://www.openbsd.org/policy.html > > [note section towards end on GPL under "Specific Cases"] > > FWIW, a BSD-licensed NTRU implementation exists at > https://github.com/tbuktu/libntru and while it is patent encumbered, it > offers a compile switch that causes it to become patent free in 2017 as > opposed to the GPL implementation which will be patent encumbered until 2020. > Are the patents held by the copyright authors? If the copyright is not held by the patent holder, I imagine this becomes much less important.
OpenBSD/NTRU policy mismatch [Was: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era]
On 25/05/15 02:50:50 PM, Douglas Ray wrote: > 2. The "FOSS exception" clause above won't help with existing > OpenBSD policy, insofar as I understand it here: > http://www.openbsd.org/policy.html > [note section towards end on GPL under "Specific Cases"] FWIW, a BSD-licensed NTRU implementation exists at https://github.com/tbuktu/libntru and while it is patent encumbered, it offers a compile switch that causes it to become patent free in 2017 as opposed to the GPL implementation which will be patent encumbered until 2020. Okembe
Re: OpenBSD/NTRU policy mismatch [Was: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era]
> No clarification needed: NTRU is patented, with no "free for all" patent > grant. It is a complete non-starter for OpenBSD or OpenSSH. Damien is right. It is patented, meaning they want money. They are willing to allow GPL projects to play along, because this creates a base to extract money from in the future as knowledge of it spreads. Nothing new here. Seen this play before. Get outa here.
Re: OpenBSD/NTRU policy mismatch [Was: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era]
No clarification needed: NTRU is patented, with no "free for all" patent grant. It is a complete non-starter for OpenBSD or OpenSSH. On Tue, 26 May 2015, Douglas Ray wrote: > Thanks William and Ertetlen for clarifying: > > > On 25/05/15 10:09 PM, William Whyte wrote: > > Hi Ertetlen, > > > > The base license for NTRU is GPL v2 or higher. However, there's a > > license to distribute NTRU under GPL alongside open source projects that > > exist under other licenses: see details at > > > > https://github.com/NTRUOpenSourceProject/ntru-crypto/blob/master/FOSS%20Exception.md > > 1. I can't speak for the real developers of OpenBSD. > (and I'm not advocating anything here, just trying to > keep the issues clear). > > 2. The "FOSS exception" clause above won't help with existing > OpenBSD policy, insofar as I understand it here: > http://www.openbsd.org/policy.html > [note section towards end on GPL under "Specific Cases"] > > So NTRU doesn't seem likely. It would require the project > leaders / developers to find some irresistable attraction in > NTRU, so great that they wanted to modify the licence policy. > > 3. I am so out-of-touch I didn't realise new OpenBSD code is > under a re-wording of an ISC licence - not the two-clause BSD - > so OpenBSD may no longer comply with NTRU's "FOSS exception" > clause. > http://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/src/share/misc/license.template?rev=HEAD > > cheers, > Douglas > > > Which NTRU ciphersuite were you implementing? We're in the process of > > specifying a new "hybrid" ciphersuite that allows an NTRU key exchange > > to be run in parallel to a selected "classical" ciphersuite, allowing > > users to use a currently trusted algorithm with NTRU as an additional > > layer of security; I attach the relevant (not yet distributed) Internet > > Draft, we'd value your feedback. > > > > Cheers, > > > > William > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, May 24, 2015 at 8:12 AM, ertetlen barmok > > mailto:ertetlenbar...@safe-mail.net>> wrote: > > > > Hello, > > > > Is the NTRU source available via BSD licence? > > > > Thank you. > > > > Original Message > > From: Douglas Ray mailto:doug...@cpan.org>> > > To: ertetlen barmok > > Subject: Re: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era > > Date: Sun, 24 May 2015 20:32:29 +1000 > > > > > to clarify > > > > > > On 24/05/15 1:57 AM, Mike Burns wrote: > > > > On 2015-05-23 05.24.30 -0400, ertetlen barmok wrote: > > > >> https://github.com/NTRUOpenSourceProject > > > > > > > > > > > > https://github.com/NTRUOpenSourceProject/ntru-crypto/blob/master/LICENSE.md > > > > > > > > "NTRU cryptographic IP and reference software may be used and > > modified > > > > to the needs of the user as long as the user adheres to version > > two (2) > > > > or higher of the GPL License" > > > > > > > >> When will LibreSSL have ciphers for the Post-quantum era? > > > > > > > > When you submit the patch -- with the correct license. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > OpenBSD excludes GPL - it uses a BSD licence. > > > > > > Wikipedia claims NTRU is available under GPL or BSD licence. > > > This seems to be contradicted by the NTRU source quoted above. > > > > > > Is there another tree using BSD licencing? > > > > > >
OpenBSD/NTRU policy mismatch [Was: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era]
Thanks William and Ertetlen for clarifying: On 25/05/15 10:09 PM, William Whyte wrote: Hi Ertetlen, The base license for NTRU is GPL v2 or higher. However, there's a license to distribute NTRU under GPL alongside open source projects that exist under other licenses: see details at https://github.com/NTRUOpenSourceProject/ntru-crypto/blob/master/FOSS%20Exception.md 1. I can't speak for the real developers of OpenBSD. (and I'm not advocating anything here, just trying to keep the issues clear). 2. The "FOSS exception" clause above won't help with existing OpenBSD policy, insofar as I understand it here: http://www.openbsd.org/policy.html [note section towards end on GPL under "Specific Cases"] So NTRU doesn't seem likely. It would require the project leaders / developers to find some irresistable attraction in NTRU, so great that they wanted to modify the licence policy. 3. I am so out-of-touch I didn't realise new OpenBSD code is under a re-wording of an ISC licence - not the two-clause BSD - so OpenBSD may no longer comply with NTRU's "FOSS exception" clause. http://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/src/share/misc/license.template?rev=HEAD cheers, Douglas Which NTRU ciphersuite were you implementing? We're in the process of specifying a new "hybrid" ciphersuite that allows an NTRU key exchange to be run in parallel to a selected "classical" ciphersuite, allowing users to use a currently trusted algorithm with NTRU as an additional layer of security; I attach the relevant (not yet distributed) Internet Draft, we'd value your feedback. Cheers, William On Sun, May 24, 2015 at 8:12 AM, ertetlen barmok mailto:ertetlenbar...@safe-mail.net>> wrote: Hello, Is the NTRU source available via BSD licence? Thank you. Original Message ---- From: Douglas Ray mailto:doug...@cpan.org>> To: ertetlen barmok Subject: Re: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era Date: Sun, 24 May 2015 20:32:29 +1000 > to clarify > > On 24/05/15 1:57 AM, Mike Burns wrote: > > On 2015-05-23 05.24.30 -0400, ertetlen barmok wrote: > >> https://github.com/NTRUOpenSourceProject > > > > https://github.com/NTRUOpenSourceProject/ntru-crypto/blob/master/LICENSE.md > > > > "NTRU cryptographic IP and reference software may be used and modified > > to the needs of the user as long as the user adheres to version two (2) > > or higher of the GPL License" > > > >> When will LibreSSL have ciphers for the Post-quantum era? > > > > When you submit the patch -- with the correct license. > > > > > > OpenBSD excludes GPL - it uses a BSD licence. > > Wikipedia claims NTRU is available under GPL or BSD licence. > This seems to be contradicted by the NTRU source quoted above. > > Is there another tree using BSD licencing?
Re: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era
On Sat, 23 May 2015, ertetlen barmok wrote: > Hello, > > https://github.com/NTRUOpenSourceProject > > When will LibreSSL have ciphers for the Post-quantum era? > > http://tech.slashdot.org/story/15/05/15/007248/are-we-entering-a-golden-age-of-quantum-computing-research >From wikipedia: "NTRU is a patented and ..." oh, I stopped reading there.
Re: NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era
On 2015-05-23 05.24.30 -0400, ertetlen barmok wrote: > https://github.com/NTRUOpenSourceProject https://github.com/NTRUOpenSourceProject/ntru-crypto/blob/master/LICENSE.md "NTRU cryptographic IP and reference software may be used and modified to the needs of the user as long as the user adheres to version two (2) or higher of the GPL License" > When will LibreSSL have ciphers for the Post-quantum era? When you submit the patch -- with the correct license.
NTRU Open Source Project / Post-quantum era
Hello, https://github.com/NTRUOpenSourceProject When will LibreSSL have ciphers for the Post-quantum era? http://tech.slashdot.org/story/15/05/15/007248/are-we-entering-a-golden-age-of-quantum-computing-research
