Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-28 Thread pablo alvarez
Hi, The AD9850 has a 10bit DAC. If the AD9850 does not dither the 10bit ADC output the zero crossings for a 1MHz signal will have an aprox resolution of 2^-10*1us~1ns on average. If the lookup table feeding values to the dac has 10 address lines (just guessing, I do not see any anything on it on

Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-28 Thread pablo alvarez
I will answer to myself, as my previous email was unclear and buggy. Actually I was just doing some order of magnitude calculations which seem quite correct, but it is always better to dig bit more in the details. The whole idea is to find the waveform paths that will generate a zero crossing the

Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-26 Thread Brian Davis
I posted a link to some plots of phase and amplitude truncation/quantization spurious pileups here a while back: http://febo.com/pipermail/time-nuts/2009-October/041545.html Even when not multiplied, the normal close in phase noise floor of the DDS can be masked by spurs and intermods near

[time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-25 Thread Ulrich Bangert
Gentlemen, the pros and cons of DDS chips and how to improve them have been discussed here from time to time. Most of the improvements have the aim to remove spurs out of the power spectrum or to reduce the noise level. Yesterday I run into a thing that may make it very qestionable whether DDS

Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-25 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message E34BA9BA1D7340AD88EF19CDD971F3D8@athlon, Ulrich Bangert writes: However for very precise timing a DDS may simply be unsuited. No, it just has to be correctly designed. For integral Hz resolution output, you want to feed it a frequency with us 2^N(*10^M) where N is equal to the width

Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-25 Thread dk4xp
Don't forget that your HP3325 is DDS-based, too, so it adds its own phase error sawtooth. 73, Gerhard dk4xp ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the

Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-25 Thread dk4xp
Don't forget that your HP3325 is DDS-based, too, so it adds its own phase error sawtooth. 73, Gerhard dk4xp ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the

Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-25 Thread paul swed
Very good read. Thank you for the effort and detail. You confirmed something I have thought about but never really dove into. Regards Paul WB8TSL On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 9:14 AM, dk...@arcor.de wrote: Don't forget that your HP3325 is DDS-based, too, so it adds its own phase error sawtooth.

Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-25 Thread Ulrich Bangert
Betreff: Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications Don't forget that your HP3325 is DDS-based, too, so it adds its own phase error sawtooth. 73, Gerhard dk4xp ___ time-nuts mailing list

Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-25 Thread Gerhard Hoffmann
Am 25.01.2011 15:35, schrieb Ulrich Bangert: see page 8.6ff of the service manual to see that the HP3325 is not DDS based but uses a Fractional N Synthesizer scheme which is something completely different and is not prone to the described effects. Yes, it's f-N, I must have stored that in the

Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-25 Thread Rex
On 1/25/2011 1:26 PM, Gerhard Hoffmann wrote: Am 25.01.2011 15:35, schrieb Ulrich Bangert: see page 8.6ff of the service manual to see that the HP3325 is not DDS based but uses a Fractional N Synthesizer scheme which is something completely different and is not prone to the described effects.

Re: [time-nuts] An (unknown?) nasty feature of the DDS principle for time nuts applications

2011-01-25 Thread Bruce Griffiths
Another description of such artifacts occurs in the tutorial: http://www.analog.com/static/imported-files/tutorials/450968421DDS_Tutorial_rev12-2-99.pdf Bruce Gerhard Hoffmann wrote: Am 25.01.2011 15:35, schrieb Ulrich Bangert: see page 8.6ff of the service manual to see that the HP3325 is not