Re: [time-nuts] Low SNR GPS reception and cheap LNAs

2014-04-26 Thread nuts
On Fri, 25 Apr 2014 20:19:42 +0200 Björn Gabrielsson b...@lysator.liu.se wrote: On Fri, 25 Apr 2014 12:21:04 -0400 (EDT) gandal...@aol.com wrote: Coincidentally, I came across this earlier today when looking for some MMIC data, perhaps it might be worth a look?...

Re: [time-nuts] Low SNR GPS reception and cheap LNAs

2014-04-26 Thread Magnus Danielson
On 04/25/2014 06:04 PM, Attila Kinali wrote: On Fri, 25 Apr 2014 08:42:16 -0700 Chris Albertson albertson.ch...@gmail.com wrote: You best bet is to change out the antenna. You can buy them with a higher built-in gain up to about 40dB. Buying a better antenna is also on the list. But i

Re: [time-nuts] Low SNR GPS reception and cheap LNAs

2014-04-26 Thread Magnus Danielson
On 04/25/2014 06:21 PM, gandal...@aol.com wrote: Coincidentally, I came across this earlier today when looking for some MMIC data, perhaps it might be worth a look?... http://lna4all.blogspot.co.uk/ This is the 0,5 dB NF amplifier from Minicircuits and I think it is an interesting

Re: [time-nuts] Low SNR GPS reception and cheap LNAs

2014-04-26 Thread Magnus Danielson
On 04/25/2014 08:19 PM, Björn Gabrielsson wrote: On Fri, 25 Apr 2014 12:21:04 -0400 (EDT) gandal...@aol.com wrote: Coincidentally, I came across this earlier today when looking for some MMIC data, perhaps it might be worth a look?... http://lna4all.blogspot.co.uk/ Now that's

Re: [time-nuts] Low SNR GPS reception and cheap LNAs

2014-04-26 Thread Attila Kinali
On Sat, 26 Apr 2014 12:25:11 +0200 Magnus Danielson mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org wrote: If you have a passive antenna, put a LNA right at the antenna, since any cable damping will cause the S/N to go down. Also, if you put an aditional amplifier in line, your want that too up at the antenna.

Re: [time-nuts] Low SNR GPS reception and cheap LNAs

2014-04-26 Thread Bob Camp
Hi The ability of these receivers to handle noisy signals depends on a lot of things. The good stuff seems to have a massive number of correlators. Going from a 1.3 to a 0.3 db nf amp likely only helps you by 1 db. The low correlateor GPS’s are / were 10 to 20 db less sensitive than the newer

Re: [time-nuts] Low SNR GPS reception and cheap LNAs

2014-04-26 Thread Attila Kinali
On Sat, 26 Apr 2014 08:20:47 -0400 Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: The ability of these receivers to handle noisy signals depends on a lot of things. The good stuff seems to have a massive number of correlators. Going from a 1.3 to a 0.3 db nf amp likely only helps you by 1 db. The low

Re: [time-nuts] Low SNR GPS reception and cheap LNAs

2014-04-26 Thread Magnus Danielson
Attila, On 04/26/2014 12:52 PM, Attila Kinali wrote: On Sat, 26 Apr 2014 12:25:11 +0200 Magnus Danielson mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org wrote: If you have a passive antenna, put a LNA right at the antenna, since any cable damping will cause the S/N to go down. Also, if you put an aditional

Re: [time-nuts] Low SNR GPS reception and cheap LNAs

2014-04-26 Thread Magnus Danielson
On 04/26/2014 02:59 PM, Attila Kinali wrote: On Sat, 26 Apr 2014 08:20:47 -0400 Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: The ability of these receivers to handle noisy signals depends on a lot of things. The good stuff seems to have a massive number of correlators. Going from a 1.3 to a 0.3 db nf amp

Re: [time-nuts] Rb vs.Crystal OCXO

2014-04-26 Thread Said Jackson
Shane, The trade off for most applications is as follows: Rb has much faster stabilization time after power on. Ocxos suffer from retrace, that can take hours to days to get rid off. Retrace could cause a frequency shift of several ppb or more from say 15 minutes after power on compared to 10

Re: [time-nuts] Rb vs.Crystal OCXO

2014-04-26 Thread Magnus Danielson
On 04/26/2014 06:34 PM, Said Jackson wrote: Shane, The trade off for most applications is as follows: Rb has much faster stabilization time after power on. Ocxos suffer from retrace, that can take hours to days to get rid off. Retrace could cause a frequency shift of several ppb or more

Re: [time-nuts] Low SNR GPS reception and cheap LNAs

2014-04-26 Thread nuts
On Sat, 26 Apr 2014 12:28:20 +0200 Magnus Danielson mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org wrote: On 04/25/2014 06:21 PM, gandal...@aol.com wrote: Coincidentally, I came across this earlier today when looking for some MMIC data, perhaps it might be worth a look?...

[time-nuts] SatStat on Windows 7

2014-04-26 Thread Larry McDavid
I just tried to run SatStat for the HP Z3801A on my new Windows 7 64-bit computer and it reported it would not run under that OS. What are folks using? -- Best wishes, Larry McDavid W6FUB Anaheim, California (SE of Los Angeles, near Disneyland) ___

Re: [time-nuts] SatStat on Windows 7

2014-04-26 Thread Tommy phone
Old W98 or W2k machines work for me. From Tom Holmes On Apr 26, 2014, at 1:29 PM, Larry McDavid lmcda...@lmceng.com wrote: I just tried to run SatStat for the HP Z3801A on my new Windows 7 64-bit computer and it reported it would not run under that OS. What are folks using? --

Re: [time-nuts] SatStat on Windows 7

2014-04-26 Thread paul swed
winxp On Sat, Apr 26, 2014 at 1:35 PM, Tommy phone thol...@woh.rr.com wrote: Old W98 or W2k machines work for me. From Tom Holmes On Apr 26, 2014, at 1:29 PM, Larry McDavid lmcda...@lmceng.com wrote: I just tried to run SatStat for the HP Z3801A on my new Windows 7 64-bit computer

Re: [time-nuts] Rb vs.Crystal OCXO

2014-04-26 Thread Charles Steinmetz
Magnus wrote: The PRS-10 have a nice little trick in it, it stores the previous OCXO steering value, so on power-up it sets the OCXO to this The PRS-10 has quite a number of nice tricks, in addition to particularly good engineering and high-quality construction of the basic physics package

Re: [time-nuts] SatStat on Windows 7

2014-04-26 Thread Bob Camp
Hi Upgrade to a Win 7 version that has XP support in it. Bob On Apr 26, 2014, at 1:29 PM, Larry McDavid lmcda...@lmceng.com wrote: I just tried to run SatStat for the HP Z3801A on my new Windows 7 64-bit computer and it reported it would not run under that OS. What are folks using?

Re: [time-nuts] GPSDO and holdover

2014-04-26 Thread Bob Stewart
I mentioned to Tom that I had seen the xgps program duplicate a lot of its satellites when I missed a PPS.  I noticed my GPSDO go into holdover so I quickly brought up xgsp and noticed it happening again.  This screen showed a few times intermixed with a normal screen.  I have no idea whether

Re: [time-nuts] SatStat on Windows 7

2014-04-26 Thread nuts
On Sat, 26 Apr 2014 13:52:47 -0400 Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi Upgrade to a Win 7 version that has XP support in it. Bob There is some confusion about XP support in win7. One way is to set the property of the file to be more XP compatible. The other means is to download a virtual

Re: [time-nuts] SatStat on Windows 7

2014-04-26 Thread J. L. Trantham
WinXP. Joe -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Larry McDavid Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2014 12:29 PM To: Time-Nuts Mail List Subject: [time-nuts] SatStat on Windows 7 I just tried to run SatStat for the HP Z3801A on my new

[time-nuts] Linux TSC clocksource on multi-core systems

2014-04-26 Thread Laszlo Hanyecz
Hi time-nuts, I've been reading the list for a while and I realize most of the discussion is a lot lower level than this, but I'm not sure where else to ask. I probably don't have a complete understanding of the problem, and maybe I just need a nudge in the right direction. My goal is

Re: [time-nuts] SatStat on Windows 7

2014-04-26 Thread Said Jackson
Take a look at Ulrich's Z38xx application, run it in Windows XP compatibility mode.. Sent From iPhone On Apr 26, 2014, at 10:35, Tommy phone thol...@woh.rr.com wrote: Old W98 or W2k machines work for me. From Tom Holmes On Apr 26, 2014, at 1:29 PM, Larry McDavid lmcda...@lmceng.com

Re: [time-nuts] GPSDO and holdover

2014-04-26 Thread Tom Van Baak
I have noticed skipped 1PPS on the Adafruit GPS also. I've always assumed this could happen but as a result of RF signal loss not a glitch in the gps. So I've started recording event timestamp deltas To be clear, we are not talking about a system-wide GPS problem here; the satellites are

Re: [time-nuts] Linux TSC clocksource on multi-core systems

2014-04-26 Thread Michael Tharp
On 04/26/2014 02:27 PM, Laszlo Hanyecz wrote: It's fine to disable the additional cores/cpus on a dedicated NTP machine, but I wonder if there is a solution that allows both the TSC and all the cores to be used at the same time. Is it even possible to completely sync the counters across CPUs

[time-nuts] Fwd: Red Pitaya

2014-04-26 Thread Don Latham
An interesting piece of hardware. Reasonable for its capabilities/ Don Begin forwarded message: From: The Red Pitaya Team sa...@redpitaya.com Subject: Red Pitaya pre order notification Date: April 24, 2014 9:10:14 AM MDT To: d...@montana.com d...@montana.com Reply-To: The Red Pitaya Team

[time-nuts] New timing receivers?

2014-04-26 Thread Jim Miller
I'm reading though the manual for my recently acquired M12+T which I'm looking forward to using. I notice that the manual is dated 09FEB05. So the M12+T has been around for about a decade. Are there more recent timing receivers available now or has the ubiquity of the consumer GPS market

Re: [time-nuts] New timing receivers?

2014-04-26 Thread Bob Camp
Hi There are a number of timing receivers on the market. They still are a very small percentage of the total units sold. A lot of people play with the uBlox parts. Bob On Apr 26, 2014, at 7:59 PM, Jim Miller j...@jtmiller.com wrote: I'm reading though the manual for my recently acquired

Re: [time-nuts] New timing receivers?

2014-04-26 Thread Shane Morris
Have a look for Navsync CW12-TIM. We'll be using these for various timing applications including a simulcast radio repeater system over IP. They're about US$89 from SemiconductorStore.com. Many thanks! On Sun, Apr 27, 2014 at 9:59 AM, Jim Miller j...@jtmiller.com wrote: I'm reading though the

Re: [time-nuts] New timing receivers?

2014-04-26 Thread Bob Stewart
Given the state of the GPS chip, would it really take that big an investment to just add in the firmware to do timing?  Or have the manufacturers just made a marketing decision to keep that a high end market as long as they can? Bob From: Bob Camp

Re: [time-nuts] New timing receivers?

2014-04-26 Thread Bob Camp
Hi The ratios are pretty staggering. The timing market is 1% of the total chip market. Any mass market is *always* about price. If timing adds a few percent to the mass market parts, there’s no way anybody will do it. Bob On Apr 26, 2014, at 8:37 PM, Bob Stewart b...@evoria.net wrote:

Re: [time-nuts] Rb vs.Crystal OCXO

2014-04-26 Thread EWKehren
The thunderbolt is one of the best timing devices but not for frequency, if you want high resolution. Over time it is ok but high resolution short gate times and you see the frequency changes. They use the OCXO to correct for timing error and if you have a Tracor 527E you can see it. Also

Re: [time-nuts] New timing receivers?

2014-04-26 Thread EWKehren
And quite a few companies use them. In a message dated 4/26/2014 8:27:57 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, li...@rtty.us writes: Hi There are a number of timing receivers on the market. They still are a very small percentage of the total units sold. A lot of people play with the uBlox parts.

Re: [time-nuts] Rb vs.Crystal OCXO

2014-04-26 Thread Tom Van Baak
The thunderbolt is one of the best timing devices but not for frequency, if you want high resolution. Over time it is ok but high resolution short gate times and you see the frequency changes. They use the OCXO to correct for timing error and if you have a Tracor 527E you can see it.

Re: [time-nuts] New timing receivers?

2014-04-26 Thread Paul
On Sat, Apr 26, 2014 at 7:59 PM, Jim Miller j...@jtmiller.com wrote: Are there more recent timing receivers available now Yes. Google gps timing receiver for a start. Sawtooth (quantization) correction is probably the defining characteristic. So even though u-Blox makes 'T' versions (e.g.

Re: [time-nuts] New timing receivers?

2014-04-26 Thread Chris Albertson
How does the u-bloc's performance compare to the M12+T?One of these is on my list of things to buy someday. I thought the M12+T had a 1-sigma error in the single digit nanoseconds.The u-bloc is newer it is even better? On Sat, Apr 26, 2014 at 6:02 PM, Paul tic-...@bodosom.net wrote: