Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal?

2021-02-18 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
Bob kb8tq writes: > Turning an “idea” into a production capable part involves making many > batches of test samples. Think in the thousands of batches and hundreds > of parts in each batch. You have a “search” process at the blank chopping > level. You also have a search at the

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal?

2021-02-18 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
Magnus Danielson writes: > Exactly which double-angle cut's they did before SC remains to be found. If somebody knows a crystallographer and is willing to sacrifice a unit, that is something which could be found out... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20

Re: [time-nuts] build your own crystals.

2021-02-18 Thread Bob kb8tq
HI > On Feb 18, 2021, at 8:06 PM, Lux, Jim wrote: > > On 2/18/21 4:38 PM, Bob kb8tq wrote: >> Hi >> >> Ok >> >>> On Feb 18, 2021, at 6:40 PM, Magnus Danielson wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> A lot of fascinating steps. It would be real fun if one would do a >>> coarse in which one would

[time-nuts] making crystals

2021-02-18 Thread Mark Sims
I built a 405 nm laser head for my mini-mill. It could cut features with a resolution of around 4 microns. I mainly used it to cut solder paste stencils. A friend used it to expose photolithography masks on quartz plates and silicon wafers. Also to tune some vibrating reed like thingies by

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal?

2021-02-18 Thread Bob kb8tq
Hi > On Feb 18, 2021, at 9:17 AM, Lux, Jim wrote: > > On 2/18/21 3:53 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: >> >> Bob kb8tq writes: >> >>> Turning an “idea” into a production capable part involves making many >>> batches of test samples. Think in the thousands of batches and hundreds >>> of

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal?

2021-02-18 Thread Bob kb8tq
Hi Ok > On Feb 18, 2021, at 6:40 PM, Magnus Danielson wrote: > > Hi, > > A lot of fascinating steps. It would be real fun if one would do a > coarse in which one would actually build a handful of crystals oneself, > to learn the basics, and measure them up. It would be a fun > summer-coarse

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal?

2021-02-18 Thread paul swed
The conversation may have strayed a bit. Do need to address one comment that the crystal is a junk box unit. Its sealed and is a FE crystal. Granted as is, it just may be junk. But it originally most likely wasn't. Well a good/bad test last night. Manually controlled the oven temp and strange

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal? ==> Crystal Robot

2021-02-18 Thread Bob kb8tq
Hi > On Feb 18, 2021, at 6:53 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > > Bob kb8tq writes: > >> Turning an “idea” into a production capable part involves making many >> batches of test samples. Think in the thousands of batches and hundreds >> of parts in each batch. You have a “search”

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal?

2021-02-18 Thread Lux, Jim
On 2/18/21 3:53 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: Bob kb8tq writes: Turning an “idea” into a production capable part involves making many batches of test samples. Think in the thousands of batches and hundreds of parts in each batch. You have a “search” process at the blank chopping level.

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal?

2021-02-18 Thread Magnus Danielson
Hi, On 2021-02-18 12:53, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > Bob kb8tq writes: > >> Turning an “idea” into a production capable part involves making many >> batches of test samples. Think in the thousands of batches and hundreds >> of parts in each batch. You have a “search” process at the

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal?

2021-02-18 Thread Bob kb8tq
Hi > On Feb 18, 2021, at 9:39 AM, paul swed wrote: > > The conversation may have strayed a bit. > > Do need to address one comment that the crystal is a junk box unit. Its > sealed and is a FE crystal. Granted as is, it just may be junk. But it > originally most likely wasn't. > Well a

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal? ==> Crystal Robot

2021-02-18 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
Bob kb8tq writes: > > What properties would you program a quartz-crystal-prototyping robot > > to search for ? > > You very much want to (eventually) know about perturbations over > temperature for a given resonator design at a specific frequency. That > tends to be the 'gotcha' on a

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal?

2021-02-18 Thread paul swed
Bob Oh this unit is a alpha or maybe not even that. So it would have been NRL direction to FE from what very little I can find. I honestly looked at the curves and did not see AT as a U shape. Hm. Thats a concern. Will look far far more carefully. The charts I looked at had many xtal types SC

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal? ==> Crystal Robot

2021-02-18 Thread Bob kb8tq
> On Feb 18, 2021, at 9:57 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > > Bob kb8tq writes: > >>> What properties would you program a quartz-crystal-prototyping robot >>> to search for ? >> >> You very much want to (eventually) know about perturbations over >> temperature for a given resonator

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal? ==> Crystal Robot

2021-02-18 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
Bob kb8tq writes: > Even if you went with a different material, moving any of the specs listed > above by 10X would be pretty amazing. That was the answer I expected :-) What about geometry ? Would things like whispering gallery improve things if we found a reasonable way to produce

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal? ==> Crystal Robot

2021-02-18 Thread Bob kb8tq
Hi One thing with quartz is that the acoustic Q gets better as the frequency gets lower. If a 5 MHz 5th overtone has a Q of 3M (say), A 1 MHz 5th *could* have a Q of 15M. That assumes you fully scale the package to keep the blank at the same relative size. It also assumes some other effect

[time-nuts] build your own crystals.

2021-02-18 Thread Lux, Jim
On 2/18/21 4:38 PM, Bob kb8tq wrote: Hi Ok On Feb 18, 2021, at 6:40 PM, Magnus Danielson wrote: Hi, A lot of fascinating steps. It would be real fun if one would do a coarse in which one would actually build a handful of crystals oneself, to learn the basics, and measure them up. It would

[time-nuts] Exhaustive searches

2021-02-18 Thread Lux, Jim
On 2/18/21 7:40 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: Bob kb8tq writes: Even if you went with a different material, moving any of the specs listed above by 10X would be pretty amazing. That was the answer I expected :-) What about geometry ? Would things like whispering gallery improve

Re: [time-nuts] AN/URQ13 reference AT cut crystal?

2021-02-18 Thread Magnus Danielson
Hi, A lot of fascinating steps. It would be real fun if one would do a coarse in which one would actually build a handful of crystals oneself, to learn the basics, and measure them up. It would be a fun summer-coarse to do. I have no expectance that it would be spectacular performance, just