Re: [time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-09-01 Thread Mark Goldberg
On Sat, Sep 1, 2018 at 3:49 AM, Dana Whitlow wrote: > > Question for Mark re metal foil under the antenna: > > What's the nature of the improvement? Between the large tilt angle and the > shape of the > foil piece, I'd certainly not expect any material improvement in the > multi-path department.

Re: [time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread Mark Goldberg
On Fri, Aug 31, 2018 at 12:41 PM, Gerhard Hoffmann wrote: > > >> So you can test your hold over behavior with aluminum foil (or your hand) >> over your antenna >> >> OMG, I first read "with aluminium foil hat over your head" > Now, foil under the antenna on the other hand, big improvement!

Re: [time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread Bob kb8tq
Hi Time is not (ultimately) determined by an atomic clock. It’s determined by astronomical observations that evaluate the rotation of the planet. Those observations are what drive things like leap seconds. In the event that a flare takes out 99% of all life on earth and every electrical

Re: [time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread Scott McGrath
That’s the scenario i’m most concerned with not war or terrorism but a natural event which has occurred before and will occur again. Rebooting technology will be a heck of a lot easier with a variety of precision time/frequency distribution methods. After a Carrington type event a working Cs

Re: [time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread Dana Whitlow
I'm thinking about if/when "the big one hits" and takes out most or all of the GPS sats, cell phone systems, etc. Then the time required to reboot up to a reasonable level of technology might turn out to be limited by our ability to determine time and freq somewhat accurately. The better we can

Re: [time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread Bob kb8tq
Hi I think we have a little bit of confusion here. WWVB is not going to help anybody navigate. It’s not going to help track people with ankle bracelets or trucks stopping at bars. Car thieves jamming Lojack still happens. Turn iWWVB on or off, this stuff still goes on. None of this is a

Re: [time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread Gerhard Hoffmann
Am 31.08.2018 um 19:39 schrieb jimlux: On 8/31/18 10:15 AM, Bob kb8tq wrote: Hi Having spent a lot of my life designing GPSDO’s it’s a “that depends” sort of thing. For a simple noise jammer, yes, they pretty much all will go into holdover. When the jammer goes away, they come out of

Re: [time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread Bob kb8tq
Hi Most of them are doing CW signal detection and notch filtering. There are a number of ways for “birdies” to show up in any environment, jamming or no jamming. Some of the details of who’s doing what and how well are under NDA. None of it is 100% effective, it’s just a way to get another 10,

Re: [time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread jimlux
On 8/31/18 10:15 AM, Bob kb8tq wrote: Hi Having spent a lot of my life designing GPSDO’s it’s a “that depends” sort of thing. For a simple noise jammer, yes, they pretty much all will go into holdover. When the jammer goes away, they come out of holdover. There are a few older units that may

[time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread Mark Sims
Several GPS receivers have a setting for enabling jamming detection and/or mitigation. The datasheets don't tend to talk about what it does. But, if the receiver supports it (Trimble and Venus devices), Lady Heather can configure it. ___ time-nuts

Re: [time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread Bob kb8tq
Hi Having spent a lot of my life designing GPSDO’s it’s a “that depends” sort of thing. For a simple noise jammer, yes, they pretty much all will go into holdover. When the jammer goes away, they come out of holdover. There are a few older units that may not do quite as well with various

[time-nuts] Effects of Simple GPS jamming on GPSDO's ?

2018-08-31 Thread Mark Spencer
Hi: I'm curious if anyone knows how typical GPSDO's are likely to respond to simple GPS jammers ? Could the GPSDO be reasonably expected to go into hold over ? The use case I am thinking is along the lines of: -A commercial operation relies on a GPSDO for timing at a remote site. -A