Re: [TV orNotTV] DJT's name turns up in Elton's song lyrics during Disney+ concert special

[Mark Jeffries]

I didn't have the captioning on, so I never noticed it.  What I'm curious
about is why Corden's buddy the producer had laugh track guy Christian
Schrader sweetening the concert.  You've got 100,000 Elton John fans in
Dodger Stadium making approving noise throughout the show (although staying
quiet on the ballads).  It's not a comedy show, so you don't have to worry
about the audience not laughing.  I don't think there was going to be any
booing during the show (which Schrader covered up on the Oscars when Will
Smith went up to accept his award after bitch-slapping Chris Rock--but they
should've left it alone).  This show didn't need to be sweetened, as if the
process of sweetening needs to be done at all, since no one-camera sitcom
or cartoon uses laugh tracks anymore except as a gag.  So why?

Mark Jeffries
spotligh...@gmail.com


On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 7:09 PM Jim Ellwanger  wrote:

> I wasn't watching (and can't tell from the screenshots), but based on the
> review of the first show in the run that I read in Saturday's L.A. Times,
> it's extremely likely that Elton John was not sticking to the exact song
> lyrics as available on genius.com (or wherever), necessitating the
> captioner doing the captions live rather than just sending out a file of
> the lyrics at that exact moment.
>
> Disney may well have put the fear of God into the captioning company,
> telling them that if the official lyrics say "and he shall be Levon" and
> Elton John sings "he shall be Levon," they better not see that "and" in the
> captions.
>
> Based on my concertgoing experiences, I can't imagine that anything Elton
> John said between songs was scripted enough that they could have provided
> the text to the captioning company in advance.
>
>
> On Nov 21, 2022, at 4:37 PM, Adam Bowie  wrote:
>
> I suspect that using a stenographer is exactly what they did. But I've got
> to question why.
>
> The entire concert's setlist will have been known up front, so they could
> have pre-loaded all the lyrics to all the songs in advance.
>
> Then the captioner just needs to do the equivalent of "copy and paste" as
> the songs progress. In fact, a good system just probably needs a press of
> the space bar or something to "paste" in the next line. Indeed, I've seen
> this happen on multiple occasions in the past. E.g. The Eurovision song
> contest.
>
> You might still need to live caption anything spontaneous, but even most
> of the between-song dialogue is likely to follow a formula and be heavily
> scripted.
>
> I could understand the mistakes for something largely unscripted like a
> chat show, but a heavily produced concert makes no sense.
>
>
> Adam
>
> On Tue, Nov 22, 2022 at 12:07 AM Jim Ellwanger 
> wrote:
>
>> Since I used to be involved with this kind of stuff, many years ago...
>>
>> For a high-profile live event like this, they almost certainly had the
>> captioning done by a stenocaptioner, who was using a court reporter's
>> machine with its special keyboard. They're going syllable by syllable,
>> phoneme by phoneme, pressing several keys at once to create stenographic
>> text -- it looks like gobbledygook to the naked eye, but they've previously
>> programmed a computer to translate the raw output into actual English.
>>
>> When it's a phrase that might come up repeatedly, they can also create a
>> short form of that phrase - for example, instead of doing the keystrokes
>> for "DON-ALD-[space]-TRUMP" every time, they might program their computer
>> so that they can just keystroke "DT" and have it come out as "DONALD TRUMP."
>>
>> Therefore, when a stenocaptioner makes a typo (presses one wrong key), it
>> usually doesn't just come out as one letter being incorrect, it comes out
>> as a few letters of gibberish... or a completely wrong word or phrase,
>> which appears to be what happened here.
>>
>> Incidentally, the best stenocaptioners have a 99.8% accuracy rate, which
>> basically means they're incorrect on 2 words out of every 1,000 -- but
>> since people speak about 150 words per minute, even the best stenocaptioner
>> will have an error every 3 or 4 minutes.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Nov 21, 2022, at 3:18 PM, 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV <
>> tvornottv@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>
>> Might be the most bizarre autocorrect story I've ever read. The errors
>> were corrected for nonlive streams.
>>
>> https://deadline.com/2022/11/disney-removes-donald-trump-references-elton-john-concert-technical-error-1235179462/
>>  (link)
>> B
>>
>> --
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>> "TVorNotTV" group.
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>> 

Re: [TV orNotTV] DJT's name turns up in Elton's song lyrics during Disney+ concert special

[Jim Ellwanger]

I wasn't watching (and can't tell from the screenshots), but based on the 
review of the first show in the run that I read in Saturday's L.A. Times, it's 
extremely likely that Elton John was not sticking to the exact song lyrics as 
available on genius.com  (or wherever), necessitating the 
captioner doing the captions live rather than just sending out a file of the 
lyrics at that exact moment.

Disney may well have put the fear of God into the captioning company, telling 
them that if the official lyrics say "and he shall be Levon" and Elton John 
sings "he shall be Levon," they better not see that "and" in the captions.

Based on my concertgoing experiences, I can't imagine that anything Elton John 
said between songs was scripted enough that they could have provided the text 
to the captioning company in advance.


> On Nov 21, 2022, at 4:37 PM, Adam Bowie  wrote:
> 
> I suspect that using a stenographer is exactly what they did. But I've got to 
> question why.
> 
> The entire concert's setlist will have been known up front, so they could 
> have pre-loaded all the lyrics to all the songs in advance. 
> 
> Then the captioner just needs to do the equivalent of "copy and paste" as the 
> songs progress. In fact, a good system just probably needs a press of the 
> space bar or something to "paste" in the next line. Indeed, I've seen this 
> happen on multiple occasions in the past. E.g. The Eurovision song contest. 
> 
> You might still need to live caption anything spontaneous, but even most of 
> the between-song dialogue is likely to follow a formula and be heavily 
> scripted.
> 
> I could understand the mistakes for something largely unscripted like a chat 
> show, but a heavily produced concert makes no sense.
> 
> 
> Adam
> 
> On Tue, Nov 22, 2022 at 12:07 AM Jim Ellwanger  > wrote:
>> Since I used to be involved with this kind of stuff, many years ago...
>> 
>> For a high-profile live event like this, they almost certainly had the 
>> captioning done by a stenocaptioner, who was using a court reporter's 
>> machine with its special keyboard. They're going syllable by syllable, 
>> phoneme by phoneme, pressing several keys at once to create stenographic 
>> text -- it looks like gobbledygook to the naked eye, but they've previously 
>> programmed a computer to translate the raw output into actual English.
>> 
>> When it's a phrase that might come up repeatedly, they can also create a 
>> short form of that phrase - for example, instead of doing the keystrokes for 
>> "DON-ALD-[space]-TRUMP" every time, they might program their computer so 
>> that they can just keystroke "DT" and have it come out as "DONALD TRUMP."
>> 
>> Therefore, when a stenocaptioner makes a typo (presses one wrong key), it 
>> usually doesn't just come out as one letter being incorrect, it comes out as 
>> a few letters of gibberish... or a completely wrong word or phrase, which 
>> appears to be what happened here.
>> 
>> Incidentally, the best stenocaptioners have a 99.8% accuracy rate, which 
>> basically means they're incorrect on 2 words out of every 1,000 -- but since 
>> people speak about 150 words per minute, even the best stenocaptioner will 
>> have an error every 3 or 4 minutes.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Nov 21, 2022, at 3:18 PM, 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV 
>>> mailto:tvornottv@googlegroups.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Might be the most bizarre autocorrect story I've ever read. The errors were 
>>> corrected for nonlive streams.
>>> https://deadline.com/2022/11/disney-removes-donald-trump-references-elton-john-concert-technical-error-1235179462/
>>>  (link)
>>> B
>>> 
>>> -- 
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>>> "TVorNotTV" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>> email to tvornottv+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
>>> .
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/6ba7a882-cff2-4819-abbe-397dcae9a199n%40googlegroups.com
>>>  
>>> .
>> 
>> 
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>>  
>> .
> 
> 
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Re: [TV orNotTV] DJT's name turns up in Elton's song lyrics during Disney+ concert special

[Adam Bowie]

I suspect that using a stenographer is exactly what they did. But I've got
to question why.

The entire concert's setlist will have been known up front, so they could
have pre-loaded all the lyrics to all the songs in advance.

Then the captioner just needs to do the equivalent of "copy and paste" as
the songs progress. In fact, a good system just probably needs a press of
the space bar or something to "paste" in the next line. Indeed, I've seen
this happen on multiple occasions in the past. E.g. The Eurovision song
contest.

You might still need to live caption anything spontaneous, but even most of
the between-song dialogue is likely to follow a formula and be heavily
scripted.

I could understand the mistakes for something largely unscripted like a
chat show, but a heavily produced concert makes no sense.


Adam

On Tue, Nov 22, 2022 at 12:07 AM Jim Ellwanger 
wrote:

> Since I used to be involved with this kind of stuff, many years ago...
>
> For a high-profile live event like this, they almost certainly had the
> captioning done by a stenocaptioner, who was using a court reporter's
> machine with its special keyboard. They're going syllable by syllable,
> phoneme by phoneme, pressing several keys at once to create stenographic
> text -- it looks like gobbledygook to the naked eye, but they've previously
> programmed a computer to translate the raw output into actual English.
>
> When it's a phrase that might come up repeatedly, they can also create a
> short form of that phrase - for example, instead of doing the keystrokes
> for "DON-ALD-[space]-TRUMP" every time, they might program their computer
> so that they can just keystroke "DT" and have it come out as "DONALD TRUMP."
>
> Therefore, when a stenocaptioner makes a typo (presses one wrong key), it
> usually doesn't just come out as one letter being incorrect, it comes out
> as a few letters of gibberish... or a completely wrong word or phrase,
> which appears to be what happened here.
>
> Incidentally, the best stenocaptioners have a 99.8% accuracy rate, which
> basically means they're incorrect on 2 words out of every 1,000 -- but
> since people speak about 150 words per minute, even the best stenocaptioner
> will have an error every 3 or 4 minutes.
>
>
>
> On Nov 21, 2022, at 3:18 PM, 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV <
> tvornottv@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
> Might be the most bizarre autocorrect story I've ever read. The errors
> were corrected for nonlive streams.
>
> https://deadline.com/2022/11/disney-removes-donald-trump-references-elton-john-concert-technical-error-1235179462/
>  (link)
> B
>
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> 
> .
>
>
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> 
> .
>

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Re: [TV orNotTV] DJT's name turns up in Elton's song lyrics during Disney+ concert special

[Jim Ellwanger]

Since I used to be involved with this kind of stuff, many years ago...

For a high-profile live event like this, they almost certainly had the 
captioning done by a stenocaptioner, who was using a court reporter's machine 
with its special keyboard. They're going syllable by syllable, phoneme by 
phoneme, pressing several keys at once to create stenographic text -- it looks 
like gobbledygook to the naked eye, but they've previously programmed a 
computer to translate the raw output into actual English.

When it's a phrase that might come up repeatedly, they can also create a short 
form of that phrase - for example, instead of doing the keystrokes for 
"DON-ALD-[space]-TRUMP" every time, they might program their computer so that 
they can just keystroke "DT" and have it come out as "DONALD TRUMP."

Therefore, when a stenocaptioner makes a typo (presses one wrong key), it 
usually doesn't just come out as one letter being incorrect, it comes out as a 
few letters of gibberish... or a completely wrong word or phrase, which appears 
to be what happened here.

Incidentally, the best stenocaptioners have a 99.8% accuracy rate, which 
basically means they're incorrect on 2 words out of every 1,000 -- but since 
people speak about 150 words per minute, even the best stenocaptioner will have 
an error every 3 or 4 minutes.



> On Nov 21, 2022, at 3:18 PM, 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV 
>  wrote:
> 
> Might be the most bizarre autocorrect story I've ever read. The errors were 
> corrected for nonlive streams.
> https://deadline.com/2022/11/disney-removes-donald-trump-references-elton-john-concert-technical-error-1235179462/
>  (link)
> B
> 
> -- 
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> "TVorNotTV" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
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> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/6ba7a882-cff2-4819-abbe-397dcae9a199n%40googlegroups.com
>  
> .

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[TV orNotTV] DJT's name turns up in Elton's song lyrics during Disney+ concert special

['Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV]

Might be the most bizarre autocorrect story I've ever read. The errors were 
corrected for nonlive streams.
https://deadline.com/2022/11/disney-removes-donald-trump-references-elton-john-concert-technical-error-1235179462/
 (link)
B

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