Re: [U2] Does anybody have a hot backup server?
All This is SUCH an important topic, and there have been so many good answers given here that it really deserves to be collated. Can I please ask/request/importune/plead/beg those who have contributed to this thread to write this up on the U2UG wiki? It's exactly the sort of rich real-world experience we all need. Thanks!! Brian --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] IDE
snip brains post (Most of .Net was modelled on Delphi anyway grin) /snip Ha Ha i have heard that many a time - actually Delphi was an influence on .net, a big one maybe, but so was j2ee and c++ amongst other things. --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] IDE
1. Rudy is in search of a technology religion. How about, Use the right tool for the right job? Seriously, if you choose the technology platforms carefully, you should be able to interoperate between them. Right now I'm working on a new product with Delphi as the engine (for sheer performance), C#/Net services as the link (better at talking to the outside world), and front ends in .Net WinForms and Silverlight. I may also be adding some PHP into the mix, depending on time. All backed by Basic subroutines, of course. Often there is no single answer: learning to mix and match requires a steeper learning curve, but it can open up more opportunities and hey, it keeps things interesting. PS: On the subject of technology religions, is Scott Guthrie the subject of an official religion yet? If not, he should be. Sign me up as a confirmed Guthrite. 2. Religions have tradeoffs, evangelists, collection baskets, and long-term implications. If I had a dollar for everyone who said I would go for Delphi but I'm going for VB because it will always be there I would be a rich man. Sadly, I have to be content with just being right instead of being rich. Maybe that goes along with being an MV consultant anyway. Delphi is still here, VB isn't. (No VB.Net is not VB, it's a completely different technology with the some of the same keywords. Most of .Net was modelled on Delphi anyway grin) 3. Rudy probably does not want surprises. So I'll put in a very very small [ad] for mvScript. It builds dynamic web pages with a scripting language modelled after UniVerse Basic. So he can feel at home. It's fast, cheap and it works. And designed to be very easy to use. 4. Will it take Rudy longer to get to technology heaven if he is surrounded by agnostics? Or if people keep putting words into his mouth.? Brian --Bill Subject: RE: [U2] IDE From: Tony G IE has had issues for years with stability and standards. But technical or political aversion (or --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] IDE
Delphi is still here, VB isn't. (No VB.Net is not VB, it's a completely different technology with the some of the same keywords. Most of .Net was modelled on Delphi anyway grin) VB.NET was for people familiar with VB or Basic, C#, J# for people familiar with Java. There is a Cobol .NET. For people familiar with Delphi, Pascal, Modula2, Oberon, Ada and there are versions of those for .NET also: http://www.dotnetpowered.com/languages.aspx Having these languages available helps lessen the learning curve. The .NET framework is also being cloned for Linux as a open-source project so the platform may be less important in the future. --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Does anybody have a hot backup server?
In message 36de7cd3e51d93408bad9eb5fe56a477ae2...@sbsprod.infodata.lu, Manu Fernandes e...@infodata.lu writes Hi, Under Universe/Linux we use Data Replication Block Device. www.drbd.com (open source linux product) A low level software called between logical partition and hdd partition. Cluster over LAN. We define it on partitions where Universe db is installed (including universe himself). On the hot-standby server, the same partition is created and not mounted (universe is not started ~ for this raison, we don't need IBM's license) On fail-over, we switch the ip adress to the hot-standby server, we mount the partition, we boot uv and users can work ... 2 minutes. One restriction, we don't use DYNAMIC files because the headers are not permanently flushed when write occurs files. I believe (iirc) IBM have confirmed that, as of the latest versions of UV, the headers are flushed when they are updated so dynamic files are now safe ... Coupled with Universe Transaction Logger set on strategic files to ensure record update integrity. My two pence. Manu Cheers, Wol -- Anthony W. Youngman pi...@thewolery.demon.co.uk 'Yings, yow graley yin! Suz ae rikt dheu,' said the blue man, taking the thimble. 'What *is* he?' said Magrat. 'They're gnomes,' said Nanny. The man lowered the thimble. 'Pictsies!' Carpe Jugulum, Terry Pratchett 1998 Visit the MaVerick web-site - http://www.maverick-dbms.org Open Source Pick --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
[U2] U2.NET question
Hi, all. Is U2.NET included with (in this case) UniVerse like UniObjects.NET is, or is it a separate priced product like U2 Web DE (aka Redback)? Thanks. Regards, Clif -- W. Clifton Oliver, CCP CLIFTON OLIVER ASSOCIATES Tel: +1 619 460 5678Web: www.oliver.com --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Does anybody have a hot backup server?
Ah, the transaction logger. Here's the problem (unless it got fixed somehow) with that: When you're running uvrolf to roll forward the logs on the DR box, you have the last transaction problem. The last update in the transaction log can span over to the next transaction log. If this happens (and it effectively always does), when you go to roll forward, if you don't have the next log, that last update is seen as a failed transaction, and is dropped. You can do a workaround, but if you're just shipping tlogs across using uvrolf to update, you're 99.% sure to be losing one transaction per tlog. When you do the fail over, unless you can recover that in-process tlog to the DR box, you'll lose whatever's in there, as well. -Original Message- From: owner-u2-us...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:owner-u2-us...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Manu Fernandes Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 5:39 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: RE: [U2] Does anybody have a hot backup server? Hi, Under Universe/Linux we use Data Replication Block Device. www.drbd.com (open source linux product) A low level software called between logical partition and hdd partition. Cluster over LAN. We define it on partitions where Universe db is installed (including universe himself). On the hot-standby server, the same partition is created and not mounted (universe is not started ~ for this raison, we don't need IBM's license) On fail-over, we switch the ip adress to the hot-standby server, we mount the partition, we boot uv and users can work ... 2 minutes. One restriction, we don't use DYNAMIC files because the headers are not permanently flushed when write occurs files. Coupled with Universe Transaction Logger set on strategic files to ensure record update integrity. My two pence. Manu -Message d'origine- De : owner-u2-us...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:owner-u2- us...@listserver.u2ug.org] De la part de Jeff Powell Envoyi : mercredi 18 mars 2009 20:07 @ : u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Objet : [U2] Does anybody have a hot backup server? I am trying to put together a backup strategy that involves keeping a standby server within two data hours of the primary. The idea is to be able to have users log into the backup server and keep the business running in the event of a crash. I'd like to hear what solutions others have found for this. I've been trying to contact IBM for the last 6 months but they haven't answered and my ERP vendor doesn't know how to do this. Any ideas are appreciated. TIA --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Does anybody have a hot backup server? {Unclassified}
Wol / Wally T / Anyone Can you please specify what was the earliest version of UV that includes the dynamic files headers are flushed when they are updated feature? For a site with lots lots of dynamic files and planning a UV platform upgrade anyway, this would be a big pointer in determining the release to move onto. Regards Mike -Original Message- From: owner-u2-us...@listserver.u2ug.org On Behalf Of Anthony W. Youngman Sent: Friday, 20 March 2009 5:43 a.m. To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] Does anybody have a hot backup server? Manu Fernandes e...@infodata.lu writes [snip] One restriction, we don't use DYNAMIC files because the headers are not permanently flushed when write occurs files. I believe (iirc) IBM have confirmed that, as of the latest versions of UV, the headers are flushed when they are updated so dynamic files are now safe ... Cheers, Wol -- Anthony W. Youngman pi...@thewolery.demon.co.uk The information contained in this Internet Email message is intended for the addressee only and may contain privileged information, but not necessarily the official views or opinions of the New Zealand Defence Force. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, copy or distribute this message or the information in it. If you have received this message in error, please Email or telephone the sender immediately. --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] U2.NET question
Cliff - U2.Net is a separately licenced product with developer and runtime licences. Ken Hall Ken R. Hall Consultants. Portland, Oregon At 11:50 AM 3/19/2009, you wrote: Hi, all. Is U2.NET included with (in this case) UniVerse like UniObjects.NET is, or is it a separate priced product like U2 Web DE (aka Redback)? Thanks. Regards, Clif --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] U2.NET question
One thing I've noticed is that the names for the various products are very convoluted. They have U2.Net, Mv.Net, Uniobjects.Net, yada yada yada. The free tool is the .Net Data Provider. I'm using that to link U2 to the .Net apps. Mike Randall, MCP -Original Message- From: owner-u2-us...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:owner-u2-us...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Clifton Oliver Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2009 2:50 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: [U2] U2.NET question Hi, all. Is U2.NET included with (in this case) UniVerse like UniObjects.NET is, or is it a separate priced product like U2 Web DE (aka Redback)? Thanks. Regards, Clif -- W. Clifton Oliver, CCP CLIFTON OLIVER ASSOCIATES Tel: +1 619 460 5678Web: www.oliver.com --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Does anybody have a hot backup server?
-Original Message- From: owner-u2-us...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:owner-u2-us...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Dan Fitzgerald Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 7:59 PM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: RE: [U2] Does anybody have a hot backup server? I'd be worried about a particular vulnerability in this scenario. If the system goes down while you are updating overflow or oversized data frames, you could get file corruption. A single U2 logical write can take multiple os writes, and at any given moment on a busy system, you probably will have this condition. You can minimize this risk by minimizing overflow, but it's probably impossible to eliminate it. Outside of uv replication, I don't think that there's a working solution to this in-flight transaction problem. With Unidata, RFS handles it nicely. You're right. Stephen O'Neal from IBM also brought that issue to my attention. Fortunately all of our important files are hashed and oversized to the point of fairly small overflow, but we're not 100% protected against file breakage in a failover. -John --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] U2.NET question
[AD], information, and an inquiry below. From: Mike Randall One thing I've noticed is that the names for the various products are very convoluted. They have U2.Net, Mv.Net, Uniobjects.Net, yada yada yada. The free tool is the .Net Data Provider. I'm using that to link U2 to the .Net apps. Mike, based on your notes in this posting: http://www.mail-archive.com/u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org/msg26408 .html I believe you're using the product described here: http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/data/library/techarticle/dm-071 1kumar/ Looking for those links I found this interesting 3-part blog by someone coming at U2 from a relational perspective: http://gigamegatech.com/2008/11/25/visual-studio-and-ibm-univers e-playing-the-matchmaker/ I haven't read it yet, but from what I see I think it's a shame this guy had to beat his head against a wall to do something so simple. Let's quickly separate out the products and raise a little hell while we're at it. I hope someone will correct me if any this isn't accurate: - UniObjects: A non-.NET library providing basic connectivity for file open, read, write, and execute of server-side code. - UO.NET: A managed .NET implementation of UO, not just a wrapper, providing basically the same functions. - U2 .NET Data Provider: Library for those more familiar with relational databases. - mv.NET: Non-IBM product from BlueFinity International ([ad] sold and supported worldwide by Nebula RD) that provides three libraries: -- one which is a superset of UO.NET, -- another which is similar to the the U2 Data Provider for a relational perspective -- and another one that provides direct binding of DBMS data to visual components. As an example of how mv.NET is a superset of UO.NET, mv.NET uses UO.NET as the basic (but very capable) connectivity pipe into U2. If you just need basic functionality then as I've told a couple prospects recently, just stick with UO.NET. - U2.NET: This is an old version of mv.NET for which IBM purchased the source, limited some of the features, and then rebranded for distribution to U2 developers. They took out the cross-platform compatibility and made changes to the connection pooling capabilities. While based on mv.NET, to my knowledge there is no agreement to get the new features which have already been added to mv.NET or those planned for mv.NET future releases. I thought IBM was going to give U2.NET to everyone like UO.NET. If so, OK, less features but one package for most uses - that's probably a good deal. If they're going to charge for it as Ken says, then I guess I should put together a table that compares the features and pricing of these products. Does anyone have a good source for this data? Is there a roadmap of future enhancements for U2.NET anywhere? HTH Tony Gravagno Nebula Research and Development TG@ remove.pleaseNebula-RnD.com Nebula RD sells mv.NET and other Pick/MultiValue products worldwide, and provides related development services --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Does anybody have a hot backup server?
From: Brian Leach This is SUCH an important topic, and there have been so many good answers given here that it really deserves to be collated. Can I please ask/request/importune/plead/beg those who have contributed to this thread to write this up on the U2UG wiki? It's exactly the sort of rich real-world experience we all need. Here's a start: http://www.pickwiki.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?HotBackup The cmswiki page at U2UG seems to be unavailable. Maybe I just didn't login, but anyone should be able to create a page there that for now just links back to PickWiki.com. Wiki is about collaboration: Anyone can plant a seed, anyone can water the sprouts, anyone can pick out weeds, anyone can pick the fruit. HTH Tony Gravagno Nebula Research and Development TG@ remove.pleaseNebula-RnD.com --- u2-users mailing list u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
